---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 09/10/07: 25 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:04 AM - Re: 701 evolution (jetboy) 2. 05:22 AM - Re: Use of Gascolator with auto fuel? (Geoff Heap) 3. 05:39 AM - Transition training Y to center No Big Deal (Brett Hanley) 4. 06:48 AM - Re: 701 evolution (river1) 5. 08:01 AM - Re: wing top skins (Ron Lendon) 6. 08:06 AM - Re: 701 Rear Rudder Skin (Ron Lendon) 7. 08:26 AM - Plans wanted - CH200 () 8. 08:43 AM - Re: Re: wing top skins (Terry Turnquist) 9. 09:03 AM - Re: Transition Training: Dual Sticks vs Y Stick a problem...? (Bryan Martin) 10. 09:12 AM - Re: Re: wing top skins (Bryan Martin) 11. 11:01 AM - Re: Plans wanted - CH100!! () 12. 11:24 AM - Re: wing top skins (Ron Lendon) 13. 12:28 PM - Transition training Dual sticks to center sticks Not A Big Deal (Brett Hanley) 14. 01:12 PM - Re: Transition training Y to center No Big Deal (Phil Maxson) 15. 01:30 PM - Re: wing top skins (Gig Giacona) 16. 03:07 PM - Re: Re: Plans wanted - CH100!! (Woody sulloway) 17. 04:54 PM - Re: Plans wanted - CH200 (ZodieRocket) 18. 05:35 PM - Re: Use of Gascolator with auto fuel? (ashontz) 19. 05:36 PM - Drilling Zodiac Nose Ribs (dfmoeller) 20. 06:00 PM - Chat (MacDonald Doug) 21. 06:02 PM - Re: Drilling Zodiac Nose Ribs (Jaybannist@cs.com) 22. 08:36 PM - New Builder (Shane Norwood) 23. 08:50 PM - 701 Builders Announcement: Wings Construction (Jon Croke) 24. 08:57 PM - Re: chat (Falcon) 25. 09:28 PM - Re: 701 Builders Announcement: Wings Construction (Stanley Challgren) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:04:54 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 701 evolution From: "jetboy" In 1986 it flew with 52 hp, MAUW 880 lbs and was designed for engines 45 - 85 hp up to 130 lbs. 1990 - MAUW 960 lbs engines 50 - 100 hp / 130 lbs max. to serial 7-4511 July 2001, serials 7-4512 and later, MAUW 1100 lbs powerplant to 100 hp and installed weight 200 lbs max. I dont know the latest Europe lightweight version there was a little info on the Zenair europe site, seems you could leave off the SP options like the perspex screen, wing tanks and tundra wheels to get your weight lower, but honestly if you are using a low weight high output 2 stroke it will be fine - I admit the earlier airframe will probably balance better. I think its better to include the slightly heavier spars and structural brackets, even if you dont 'need' them. Perhaps dont paint the aircraft. I found the jabiru so light that even with a 26 AH battery in the engine bay I'm sitting on the aft CG limit with std wingtanks full. 912 needs the battery moved aft to compensate. Ralph / CH701SPJ / 2200A started dreaming 1993 started building 2004 -------- Ralph - CH701 / 2200a Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133708#133708 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:22:17 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Use of Gascolator with auto fuel? From: "Geoff Heap" Thanks for the further info. I just checked the on line catalog and I see clearly, the auto fuel gasket listed. The 2005 catalog I have here at work looks similar. However, my newer catalog at home seems to read different. I'll have to re-check it. thanks for straightening me out...Geoff reproduced from on line catalog "All-metal gascolator with S.S. screen, 1-7/8" dia. cadmium plated steel bowl w/quick drain. Top is CNC machined from 6061-T6 aluminum. Top casting has 1/4" pipe ports for 3/8" fuel line and one 1/8" pipe port for primer fitting. Wt: 8 oz. May be used with aviation and/ or auto fuel. Replacement gasket for auto fuel is p/n 06-00441." do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133722#133722 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:39:35 AM PST US From: Brett Hanley Subject: Zenith-List: Transition training Y to center No Big Deal Transition training is a piece of cake. Fly a few hours on a dual stick using only the right hand. Then sit in the center stick aircraft and move the right hand about five or six inches right and put it on the center stick. The simply pretend it is between your legs. You will find it responds exactly the same. Not an issue. Good luck and fair skies. Brett Has anyone here done transition training on a dual stick 601XL and then moved on to a 601XL with the Y stick...? Do any of you who have flown 601XL's see this as an issue...? Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:48:41 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 701 evolution From: "river1" I just got off the phone with zac (Roger) and he said that the weight increase with all the new revisions should be around 10# to 15# .That if I use the 582, header tank only ,old style windscreen and refrain from adding to much electronics and build to plan spec, I should be able to be at or below 500# .Thanks to all that ansered my post. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133735#133735 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:01:31 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: wing top skins From: "Ron Lendon" I am planning to rivet my skins on now then building up the other wing. I see no need to not rivet them. I may eat those words also, but that is the risk I take. All of the wiring and plumbing will be in and tested before closure and I will be able to check the wing one final time fixtured to the table before placing the final rivets. If there is any shape changing required I would rather do that on a known good surface (my build table). YMMV -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133744#133744 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:06:28 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 701 Rear Rudder Skin From: "Ron Lendon" Welcome to the world of fear. I am scratch building a 601 but the principles are the same. Take a look at mykitlog site around 1-29-2006, it might give you some ideas or how to proceed. -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133747#133747 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:26:00 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Plans wanted - CH200 From: As part of a museum project I'm heading up the restoration of a 1970s vintage Zenith CH200. Would any body know where I can get a set of plans for this aircraft? Thanks in advance, Steve J. Hurlbut hurlbut.sj@forces.gc.ca ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:43:46 AM PST US From: Terry Turnquist Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: wing top skins You might check with a couple of DAR'S in your area..some of them require access to the inside of the wing before signing off an inspection. At least so I've heard. Not there yet! do not archive Terry Turnquist I am planning to rivet my skins on now then building up the other wing. I see no need to not rivet them. I may eat those words also, but that is the risk I take. All of the wiring and plumbing will be in and tested before closure and I will be able to check the wing one final time fixtured to the table before placing the final rivets. If there is any shape changing required I would rather do that on a known good surface (my build table). YMMV -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133744#133744 --------------------------------- Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:03:16 AM PST US From: Bryan Martin Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Transition Training: Dual Sticks vs Y Stick a problem...? Before I first flew my Zodiac, nearly all of my flight time was in aircraft with a control yoke. I flew these with my left hand on the yoke and used my left hand for engine controls. But I noticed that every time I flew a flight simulator type program on a computer, I used my right hand on the joystick. I had no problem at all adapting to the Y stick in my Zodiac. Even with all that time in Cessnas, the Zodiac Y stick seemed perfectly natural to me. PatrickW wrote: > > Friends - I'll soon have the opportunity to fly a Zodiac 601XL in a training situation, and as my own XL approaches completion I plan on becoming current in a 601XL prior to my own aircraft's first flight. > > My 601XL is configured with the Y stick, whereas the training 601XL is configured with dual sticks. > > Has anyone here done transition training on a dual stick 601XL and then moved on to a 601XL with the Y stick...? > > Do any of you who have flown 601XL's see this as an issue...? > > I am a PPSEL, and will have about 200 hours in several aircraft by the time I make my first flight (Warrior, J3, CT, Evector, & 601XL). > > Patrick > 601XL/Corvair > > -- Bryan Martin Zenith 601XL N61BM Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:12:14 AM PST US From: Bryan Martin Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: wing top skins If you get a visit by an EAA technical counselor before you close the wing and document it, you shouldn't have any such trouble. The FAA recommends that you have a tech counselor look over major assemblies before closing them. I had three visits, before closing up the tail feathers, before closing up the first wing and before closing up the fuselage. Terry Turnquist wrote: Terry Turnquist wrote: > You might check with a couple of DAR'S in your area..some of them > require access to the inside of the wing before signing off an > inspection. At least so I've heard. Not there yet! > > >> >> I am planning to rivet my skins on now then building up the other >> wing. I see no need to not rivet them. I may eat those words also, >> but that is the risk I take. >> -- Bryan Martin Zenith 601XL N61BM Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:01:28 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Plans wanted - CH100!! From: Actually the aircraft is the rarer CH100 single seat. Anybody know where I can get some more information on this aircraft including some plans. An internet search turned up very little. Only 2 references found about the airplane. Thank you Steve J. Hurlbut hurlbut.sj@forces.gc.ca > _____________________________________________ > From: Hurlbut Capt SJ@MP&EU@Greenwood > Sent: Monday, 10, September, 2007 12:24 PM > To: 'zenith-list@matronics.com' > Subject: Plans wanted - CH200 > > As part of a museum project I'm heading up the restoration of a 1970s > vintage Zenith CH200. > > Would any body know where I can get a set of plans for this aircraft? > > Thanks in advance, > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 11:24:12 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: wing top skins From: "Ron Lendon" Thanks Bryan, I did forget to mention the Tech Counselor has seen and written documentation about what he has seen. I actually called him last night and asked if he wanted to see it again before final closure, he said "no, button it up". -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133775#133775 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 12:28:38 PM PST US From: Brett Hanley Subject: Zenith-List: Transition training Dual sticks to center sticks Not A Big Deal Transition training is a piece of cake. Fly a few hours on a dual stick using only the right hand. Then sit in the center stick aircraft and move the right hand about five or six inches right and put it on the center stick. The simply pretend it is between your legs. You will find it responds exactly the same. Not an issue. Good luck and fair skies. Brett Has anyone here done transition training on a dual stick 601XL and then moved on to a 601XL with the Y stick...? Do any of you who have flown 601XL's see this as an issue...? Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:12:43 PM PST US From: Phil Maxson Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Transition training Y to center No Big Deal I've written this many times before. I believe that transition to the cent er Y stick is not an issue. It is only something that exists in the pilot' s mind as he/she sits on the ground. Once you're flying you won't even not ice that the stick isn't a yoke or that the stick isn't between your legs. Unless you have severely limited mobility in your left arm, you won't even notice which hand you use for flying. My radio is in the middle of my pan el and I flew 7.5 hours over labor day weekend, and I couldn't tell you whi ch hand I use to change frequencies. (I flew through Allentown, Reading, H arrisburg, and Charleston WV airspace with all the frequency changes you wo uld expect)Phil Maxson 601XL/Corvair Northwest New Jersey Has anyone here done transition training on a dual stick 601XL and thenmove d onto a 601XL with the Y stick...?Do any of you who have flown 601XL's see this as an issue...? Do Not Archive _________________________________________________________________ Kick back and relax with hot games and cool activities at the Messenger Caf =E9. http://www.cafemessenger.com?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_SeptWLtagline ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 01:30:00 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: wing top skins From: "Gig Giacona" Not in the US they don't. Now an EAA tech adviser might want to see. Mine didn't ter_turn(at)yahoo.com wrote: > You might check with a couple of DAR'S in your area..some of them require access to the inside of the wing before signing off an inspection. At least so I've heard. Not there yet! > > do not archive > > Terry Turnquist > -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133792#133792 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 03:07:39 PM PST US From: "Woody sulloway" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: RE: Plans wanted - CH100!! Hi, I think some body had a CH100 for sale in Georga, (USA) 5 or 6 months ago. it was advertised on Barnstormers. why notr do a search on the USA FAA Web site using the Key Words zenith and see how many you get. Maybe you will luck out and find some plans! Regards Woody ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 1:59 PM Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Plans wanted - CH100!! Actually the aircraft is the rarer CH100 single seat. Anybody know where I can get some more information on this aircraft including some plans. An internet search turned up very little. Only 2 references found about the airplane. Thank you Steve J. Hurlbut hurlbut.sj@forces.gc.ca > _____________________________________________ > From: Hurlbut Capt SJ@MP&EU@Greenwood > Sent: Monday, 10, September, 2007 12:24 PM > To: 'zenith-list@matronics.com' > Subject: Plans wanted - CH200 > > As part of a museum project I'm heading up the restoration of a 1970s > vintage Zenith CH200. > > Would any body know where I can get a set of plans for this aircraft? > > Thanks in advance, > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 04:54:04 PM PST US From: "ZodieRocket" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Plans wanted - CH200 Try the Zenith 200-300 owners list on yahoogroups. I heard of someone selling his plans not that long ago Mark Townsend Can-Zac Aviation Ltd. president@can-zacaviation.com www.can-zacaviation.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of HURLBUT.SJ@forces.gc.ca Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 11:24 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Plans wanted - CH200 As part of a museum project I'm heading up the restoration of a 1970s vintage Zenith CH200. Would any body know where I can get a set of plans for this aircraft? Thanks in advance, Steve J. Hurlbut hurlbut.sj@forces.gc.ca 9/10/2007 5:43 PM 9/10/2007 5:43 PM ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 05:35:05 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Use of Gascolator with auto fuel? From: "ashontz" If you have the right gasket that sounds good. Unlikely there's a problem but if they list one for auto fuel go with that. Speaking of fuel, on my way home tonight I went down the White Horse Pike to go to the veterinarian to pick up some meds for the dog. Over in Hi-Nella someone had about a 250 gallon tank mounted on a trailer with a fuel pump on it for sale. I wonder if EAA 216 would be interested in purchasing it? do not archive. Geoff Heap wrote: > Thanks for the further info. I just checked the on line catalog and I see clearly, the auto fuel gasket listed. The 2005 catalog I have here at work looks similar. However, my newer catalog at home seems to read different. I'll have to re-check it. thanks for straightening me out...Geoff > > reproduced from on line catalog > > "All-metal gascolator with S.S. screen, 1-7/8" dia. cadmium plated steel bowl w/quick drain. Top is CNC machined from 6061-T6 aluminum. Top casting has 1/4" pipe ports for 3/8" fuel line and one 1/8" pipe port for primer fitting. Wt: 8 oz. May be used with aviation and/ or auto fuel. Replacement gasket for auto fuel is p/n 06-00441." > do not archive -------- Andy Shontz CH601XL - Corvair www.mykitlog.com/ashontz Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133830#133830 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 05:36:40 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Drilling Zodiac Nose Ribs From: "dfmoeller" OK - quick question regarding mounting nose ribs to the spar on the Zodiac XL. When preparing them for pilot drilling/cleco per assy manual chapter 6W7A, pages 10 and 11, the instructions call for placing a .025 strip under the lower spar cap angle to simulate the lower rear skin and a .025 strip on top of the upper spar cap angle to simulate the upper rear skin. I'm clear so far. But at the top of page 11, it shows the upper strip in a different location which might make sense if 2 strips per top and 2 per bottom are used because the nose skin overlaps the upper rear skin (and the lower rear skin). This leads me to believe that to line up the nose rib properly, the overlapped skins should be simulated. I think that kind of makes sense. So, is it just a single strip to be clamped on the top and bottom, or is at actually 2 strips on both top and bottom? Someone that has been there a done that, please clue me in before I screw up my nose ribs. Or if this answer is simply too obvious, point me in the right direction. Doug Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133831#133831 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 06:00:08 PM PST US From: MacDonald Doug Subject: Zenith-List: Chat Remeber, everone, tonight is chat night. ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 06:02:30 PM PST US From: Jaybannist@cs.com Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Drilling Zodiac Nose Ribs Doug, As you suggested, there is some confusion. I used two strips. One was fastened to the rear rib flange and stopped at the forward face of the spar flange, simulating the rear skin. The other one was clamped to the nose rib and overlapped the other strip, simulating the nose skin. I only used one strip on the bottom, because it is less critical and you can't easily stretch or shrink the rib to make both surfaces align perfectly anyway. I think just as important an alignment issue is the "squareness" of the rib flanges. I found that on mine (kit supplied) the rib flanges were not square with the web of the rib. When I clamped the flanges to the spar, it bowed the rib flange. I had to adjust nearly all the ribs flanges because of this. Jay in Dallas "dfmoeller" wrote: > >OK - quick question regarding mounting nose ribs to the spar on the Zodiac XL. > >When preparing them for pilot drilling/cleco per assy manual chapter 6W7A, pages 10 and 11, the instructions call for placing a .025 strip under the lower spar cap angle to simulate the lower rear skin and a .025 strip on top of the upper spar cap angle to simulate the upper rear skin. I'm clear so far. > >But at the top of page 11, it shows the upper strip in a different location which might make sense if 2 strips per top and 2 per bottom are used because the nose skin overlaps the upper rear skin (and the lower rear skin). This leads me to believe that to line up the nose rib properly, the overlapped skins should be simulated. I think that kind of makes sense. > >So, is it just a single strip to be clamped on the top and bottom, or is at actually 2 strips on both top and bottom? > >Someone that has been there a done that, please clue me in before I screw up my nose ribs. Or if this answer is simply too obvious, point me in the right direction. > >Doug > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133831#133831 > > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 08:36:00 PM PST US From: "Shane Norwood" Subject: Zenith-List: New Builder Good Evening All, Just wanted to introduce myself. My name is Shane Norwood, and I will be starting my aircraft building adventure in November by attending a 601XL rudder workshop in Cloverdale, CA. I'm looking forward to joining all of you as a fellow Zenith builder. I'm encouraged by the great communication on this list. It seems like everyone within the building community does what they can to help each other complete their goal. I'll keep everyone posted on my progress. ~Shane Norwood do not archive ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 08:50:25 PM PST US From: "Jon Croke" Subject: Zenith-List: 701 Builders Announcement: Wings Construction HomebuiltHELP is proud to announce the release of the next volume in the series of "Building your Zenith CH701" : WINGS Construction. This is a double volume DVD set with 5 hrs of building demonstrations for the 701 Wing kit. Details at: http://homebuilthelp.com/CH701Wings.htm Thanks for your support! ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 08:57:22 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: chat From: "Falcon" Missed you guys again -- neighbor got a load of concrete, and we're all helping one another build driveways. The concrete calls. Here's what you missed: my redrive is in pieces, with some parts and the new bearings in the freezer. My better half mowed the whole yard while I was at work, and moved everything around in the shed so I could get to the 12 ton hydraulic press (has to do with Stratus parts in the freezer) Did I mentions she rocks? My better half, that is. Really looking forward to chatting next week. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133854#133854 ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 09:28:34 PM PST US From: Stanley Challgren Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 Builders Announcement: Wings Construction Jon: Just finished my forward fuselage and joined it to my rear. I've already built my wings but may just buy new ones from Zenith so I can do it right this time. I really appreciate your exceptional video presentations. I highly recommend them to anyone who has the slightest doubt about what to do after referring to the Zenith building literature. Stan N701VG (reserved) On Sep 10, 2007, at 9:47 PM, Jon Croke wrote: > HomebuiltHELP is proud to announce the release of the next volume > in the series of "Building your Zenith CH701" : WINGS Construction. > This is a double volume DVD set with 5 hrs of building > demonstrations for the 701 Wing kit. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.