---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 09/30/07: 16 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:47 AM - Re: Building as a way......+BRS + Cost, Update, etc... (Scott Laughlin) 2. 01:30 PM - Re: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? (Bryan Martin) 3. 02:37 PM - Re: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? (Al Hays) 4. 03:14 PM - Re: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? (robert stone) 5. 04:19 PM - Re: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? (Bryan Martin) 6. 04:33 PM - Re: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? (Jeff) 7. 04:57 PM - Re: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? (RClaggf4u@aol.com) 8. 05:43 PM - Re: 701 in New England? (NYTerminat@aol.com) 9. 05:59 PM - Re: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? (Bob Unternaehrer) 10. 06:27 PM - uncommanded flap deployment help needed (ken smith) 11. 06:39 PM - Re: uncommanded flap deployment help needed (Craig Payne) 12. 06:51 PM - Re: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? (Jeff) 13. 07:27 PM - Re: New 95hp engine design. (kmccune) 14. 07:49 PM - Re: uncommanded flap deployment help needed (wade jones) 15. 08:36 PM - Re: 701 in New England? (ROBERT SCEPPA) 16. 09:11 PM - Re: New 95hp engine design. (jetboy) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:47:25 AM PST US From: Scott Laughlin Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Building as a way......+BRS + Cost, Update, etc... Bill Naumuk: The truck is mine and I must have a clean driveway because I didn't get a s cratch on it. The ground at the hangar has a lot of pebbles and debris so I did fill the hangar up with a run-up a few months ago and spent an hour s weeping it out. I point the nose differently now. Concerning the street taxi-test, I live in a pretty quiet place (except for me) so nobody really noticed the few times I rambled down the street way back when and I only di d it a few times but the video lives forever. If you click on "more for thi s user" on Youtube you can see some taxis at the airport with the wings on. Nobody complained about that either. Dave Gallagher: I left my camera in a rental car last week in Pittsburgh so I didn't get an y pictures yesterday. I'll try to bring a backup camera today to the hanga r and show you some examples of where I went wrong on my wiring and how I f ixed it. Basically if you can wiggle your wires too much or if they can to uch any metal, you need to secure them. There are several other examples l ike tie-wrapping a metal cable to the engine mount, not securing spark plug wires well, etc. I'll try to put a list of items on my website when I get a minute. I want to thank Dave Miller and Brad Saffron (fellow 601XL builders) for th eir help yesterday. Dave has been a huge help to me in this finishing proc ess so if you get a chance to talk to him, he can tell you as much about my FAA inspection and how we solved the problems as I can. Dave was at the h angar yesterday (and many other days) with me and worked as hard as I did o n making corrections to my safety-wiring and wiring. Go out there and build something today. Scott Laughlin http://www.cooknwithgas.com/ Time: 03:55:35 PM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Building as a way......+BRS + Cost, Update, etc.. .. Scott- You have the best neighbors in the world for a homebuilder. Always wanted to know who the poor guy was who's truck was right in the prop blast during your first engine run. If it was yours, did you add in the cost of a new paint job for the truck? Bill Naumuk _________________________________________________________________ Invite your mail contacts to join your friends list with Windows Live Space s. It's easy! http://spaces.live.com/spacesapi.aspx?wx_action=create&wx_url=/friends. aspx&mkt=en-us ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:30:14 PM PST US From: Bryan Martin Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? As I understand it, the Patriot is not a Zenith design and is not sold by Zenith. It was designed by a South American company and is being built under liscense by AMD in Georgia. Since AMD doesn't build kit aircraft, I doubt the Patriot will be offered as a kit. AMD is not Zenith, it is a separate company run by one of Chris Heintz's sons. On Sep 29, 2007, at 6:31 PM, zedvair wrote: > > I'm just starting to consider building. While I'd think I'd be > happy with a 601xl, the new Patriot high wing, with it's better > STOL characteristics and similar cross-country characteristics, > intrigues me. > > Is anyone aware of plans by Zenith to offer a kit version of the > Patriot? > > It seems like a good candidate for the corvair, since it was > designed for the O-200. > -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive. do not archive. ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:37:18 PM PST US From: Al Hays Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? I'm guessing that there have been folks anticipating the CH750 thinking Zenith brought it out as the Patriot. I am hoping Zenith can offer the CH750 by the time I've finished the 601XL. When I was at a rudder builders workshop in May, I saw what at first looked to me like an O-200 on a CH701 fuselage, but looking closer and talking with a couple other attendees, we concluded it had to be a CH750 in the works. I wonder if anyone who's been there since then has seen it? On Sep 30, 2007, at 4:29 PM, Bryan Martin wrote: > As I understand it, the Patriot is not a Zenith design and is not sold > by Zenith. It was designed by a South American company and is being > built under liscense by AMD in Georgia. Since AMD doesn't build kit > aircraft, I doubt the Patriot will be offered as a kit. AMD is not > Zenith, it is aseparate company run by one of Chris Heintz's sons. > > On Sep 29, 2007, at 6:31 PM, zedvair wrote: > >> >> I'm just starting to consider building. While I'd think I'd be happy >> with a 601xl, the new Patriot high wing, with it's better STOL >> characteristics and similar cross-country characteristics, intrigues >> me. >> >> Is anyone aware of plans by Zenith to offer a kit version of the >> Patriot? >> >> It seems like a good candidate for the corvair, since it was designed >> for the O-200. >> > > > -- > Bryan Martin > N61BM, CH 601 XL, > RAMSubaru, Stratus redrive. > do not archive. > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:14:42 PM PST US From: "robert stone" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? Bryan, You say in your message below that AMD does not build kit aircraft. I think they build the ZodiacXL which is available as a kit so what is it a factory certified aircraft because they build it????? Bob Stone ----- Original Message ----- From: Bryan Martin To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 3:29 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? As I understand it, the Patriot is not a Zenith design and is not sold by Zenith. It was designed by a South American company and is being built under liscense by AMD in Georgia. Since AMD doesn't build kit aircraft, I doubt the Patriot will be offered as a kit. AMD is not Zenith, it is a separate company run by one of Chris Heintz's sons. On Sep 29, 2007, at 6:31 PM, zedvair wrote: I'm just starting to consider building. While I'd think I'd be happy with a 601xl, the new Patriot high wing, with it's better STOL characteristics and similar cross-country characteristics, intrigues me. Is anyone aware of plans by Zenith to offer a kit version of the Patriot? It seems like a good candidate for the corvair, since it was designed for the O-200. -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive. do not archive. ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:19:44 PM PST US From: Bryan Martin Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? AMD builds and sells the CH601XL as a factory built, ready to fly SLSA. They do not sell the airplane as a kit. Zenith Aircraft sells the CH601XL as a amateur built kit. The 601 built by AMD is not exactly the same as the kit sold by Zenith. So yes, it is a factory built, certificated airplane because AMD built it under the SLSA consensus standards. On the other hand, I believe AMD does make some parts for Zenair that are used in the CH640 kit. On Sep 30, 2007, at 6:12 PM, robert stone wrote: > Bryan, > You say in your message below that AMD does not build kit > aircraft. I think they build the ZodiacXL which is available as a > kit so what is it a factory certified aircraft because they build > it????? > > Bob Stone > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Bryan Martin > To: zenith-list@matronics.com > Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 3:29 PM > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the > Patriot? > > As I understand it, the Patriot is not a Zenith design and is not > sold by Zenith. It was designed by a South American company and is > being built under license by AMD in Georgia. Since AMD doesn't > build kit aircraft, I doubt the Patriot will be offered as a kit. > AMD is not Zenith, it is a separate company run by one of Chris > Heintz's sons. > > On Sep 29, 2007, at 6:31 PM, zedvair wrote: > -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive. do not archive. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 04:33:11 PM PST US From: "Jeff " Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? Bob, All the Zenith related businesses are confusing. Aircraft Development and Manufacturing (AMD) is in Georgia and is run by Mathieu Heintz. They manufacture and sell certified aircraft like the Alarus (ie CH2000). They also sell the ready to fly Special LSA version of the 601 XL and the Patriot. They also have a version called 601 Xli which is instrument flight certified. AMD does not sell kits. 601kits are manufactured and sold by Zenith Aircraft Company (ZAC) in Mexico Missouri. Sebastien Heintz is President of ZAC. Nick Heintz is the production manager. ZAC does not sell ready to fly airplanes. Others like CANZAC (Mark Townsend), Flightcrafters, and Quality Sport Planes (Michael Heintz) sell kits and quick build kits. There are several companies selling different, but maybe overlapping, products in the Zenith world. Each has a web site if you want further details. Skyshops and Chip Erwin evidently no longer have business relationships with Zenith. Jeff Davidson You say in your message below that AMD does not build kit aircraft. I think they build the ZodiacXL which is available as a kit so what is it a factory certified aircraft because they build it????? ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 04:57:57 PM PST US From: RClaggf4u@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? Hello all, I just got back home from the Zenith open house where I saw the CH750 fly. I flew with Micheal Heintz in the 701 and of course I asked about the 750. He said it flew really well ( of course) but they still had some tweaking here and there to do. When I asked about a time line he said it would be some time before you see kits. Like he said, you just can't build it and start selling kits. All the tooling has to be built, the drawings developed and proofed, molds for fiberglass parts etc. have to be created. It does have a 0200 on it. Compared to the 701 what I noticed about it just by looking was is has a wider cabin, the struts are larger and the panel forward is a little different. The tail feathers and aft fuselage appear the same. When I drove up I thought it was a 701 until I got closer. We'll just have to wait but it looked like the answer to the 701 shortcomings, if there are any. Wayne Clagg Ch701 coming along ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:43:09 PM PST US From: NYTerminat@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 in New England? Dave, I'd be happy to, live near Cortland NY, N03. Bob Spudis N701ZX/CH701/912S In a message dated 9/29/2007 7:36:45 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, dkbrooks@gmail.com writes: I have been watching all the messages go by where very generous 601 and 701 owners have offered to show off their planes to prospective builders/buyers and I was wondering if there might be someone up in my neck of the woods who would be willing to do the same? I am very interested in the 701 and would love to get up close to one. Fuel and $100 burger are on me. I live in north-central New Hampshire and I can travel as far as Boston, all over New Hampshire and Vermont, even up-state New York if I have to. There is a distinct possibility of a layoff coming my way (a good thing, in my case) so my time may become very free after the first of the year. Thanks Dave Do Not Archive (http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List) ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 05:59:32 PM PST US From: "Bob Unternaehrer" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? There is a low wing "patriot" owned by Don Zank, but I guess you have said this "Patriot" is a high wing design. Where can you see infor on the Patriot that AMD is developing. Bob U. ----- Original Message ----- From: Bryan Martin To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 3:29 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? As I understand it, the Patriot is not a Zenith design and is not sold by Zenith. It was designed by a South American company and is being built under liscense by AMD in Georgia. Since AMD doesn't build kit aircraft, I doubt the Patriot will be offered as a kit. AMD is not Zenith, it is a separate company run by one of Chris Heintz's sons. On Sep 29, 2007, at 6:31 PM, zedvair wrote: I'm just starting to consider building. While I'd think I'd be happy with a 601xl, the new Patriot high wing, with it's better STOL characteristics and similar cross-country characteristics, intrigues me. Is anyone aware of plans by Zenith to offer a kit version of the Patriot? It seems like a good candidate for the corvair, since it was designed for the O-200. -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive. do not archive. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:27:08 PM PST US From: ken smith Subject: Zenith-List: uncommanded flap deployment help needed Sometimes the flaps on my 601Xl deploy when they are not supposed to. They always go to the full flap position. This can occur when I hit the starter switch, and also when I turn on the avionics once the engine is running. I have the 4 inch unit bought from the surplus center. Anyone have any ideas for the fix? Ken ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:39:41 PM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: uncommanded flap deployment help needed Are you using the matching three-button electronic controller also sold by Surplus Center? It is probably picking up electrical noise. Use mechanical switches instead wired like those for the Zenith factory actuator (page 6-B-20 in the plans). With the switch in the center (off) position there will be no power applied to the motor so it can not move. -- Craig ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 06:51:05 PM PST US From: "Jeff " Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? Try http://www.newplane.com/ do not archive _____ From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Unternaehrer Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 8:47 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? There is a low wing "patriot" owned by Don Zank, but I guess you have said this "Patriot" is a high wing design. Where can you see infor on the Patriot that AMD is developing. Bob U. ----- Original Message ----- From: Bryan Martin Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 3:29 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Will there be a Zenith kit version of the Patriot? As I understand it, the Patriot is not a Zenith design and is not sold by Zenith. It was designed by a South American company and is being built under liscense by AMD in Georgia. Since AMD doesn't build kit aircraft, I doubt the Patriot will be offered as a kit. AMD is not Zenith, it is a separate company run by one of Chris Heintz's sons. On Sep 29, 2007, at 6:31 PM, zedvair wrote: I'm just starting to consider building. While I'd think I'd be happy with a 601xl, the new Patriot high wing, with it's better STOL characteristics and similar cross-country characteristics, intrigues me. Is anyone aware of plans by Zenith to offer a kit version of the Patriot? It seems like a good candidate for the corvair, since it was designed for the O-200. -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive. do not archive. href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matronhref "http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:27:33 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: New 95hp engine design. From: "kmccune" At the time I write this ( or type if you prefer) 59 of you have down loaded the file out of the 118 of you that have viewed it. Any comments? Kevin -------- Kevin Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=137352#137352 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 07:49:27 PM PST US From: "wade jones" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: uncommanded flap deployment help needed Hi Ken ,why don't you put in an extra toggle switch to kill the ground on the flaps .This is a cure for run-a-way controls. Wade Jones South Texas 601XL plans building Cont. 0200 ----- Original Message ----- From: "ken smith" Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 8:23 PM Subject: Zenith-List: uncommanded flap deployment help needed > > Sometimes the flaps on my 601Xl deploy when they are > not supposed to. They always go to the full flap > position. This can occur when I hit the starter > switch, and also when I turn on the avionics once the > engine is running. I have the 4 inch unit bought from > the surplus center. > > Anyone have any ideas for the fix? > > Ken > > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 08:36:19 PM PST US From: ROBERT SCEPPA Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 in New England? > Hi Dave, I am in the Boston area. I am working on a > 701 from plans. You can email me anytime, also there > is another 701 builder in my chapter, 106. We could > share any notes you want to or pics...Bob Sceppa --- NYTerminat@aol.com wrote: > > Dave, > > I'd be happy to, live near Cortland NY, N03. > > Bob Spudis > N701ZX/CH701/912S > > > In a message dated 9/29/2007 7:36:45 P.M. Eastern > Daylight Time, > dkbrooks@gmail.com writes: > > I have been watching all the messages go by where > very generous 601 and 701 > owners have offered to show off their planes to > prospective builders/buyers > and I was wondering if there might be someone up in > my neck of the woods who > would be willing to do the same? I am very > interested in the 701 and would > love to get up close to one. Fuel and $100 burger > are on me. > > I live in north-central New Hampshire and I can > travel as far as Boston, all > over New Hampshire and Vermont, even up-state New > York if I have to. There > is a distinct possibility of a layoff coming my way > (a good thing, in my > case) so my time may become very free after the > first of the year. > > Thanks > > Dave > > Do Not Archive > > > (http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List) > > > > > > > > > > Catch up on fall's hot new shows on Yahoo! TV. Watch previews, get listings, and more! ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 09:11:51 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: New 95hp engine design. From: "jetboy" not quite a new engine as its a development of the existing Jabiru which was unsuitable in off the shelf form to power the proposed helicopters. The company later reformed as ULpower and I'm impressed with their tecnical info on the website. there was one sitting in the hangar next to me that hasnt been used yet so unfortunately nothing to report. http://home.comcast.net/~aeroengine/Masquito.html Actually i'm rather interested in the sister engine, masschi 105 but its unlikely to have got into production, from the small info i can find. Ralph -------- Ralph - CH701 / 2200a Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=137362#137362 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.