Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:22 AM - Re: Re: Flight instructor and examiner wanted (IFLYSMODEL@aol.com)
2. 03:25 AM - Rivet the 601xl plane Flys! (Juan Vega)
3. 03:27 AM - Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (Trainnut01@aol.com)
4. 05:06 AM - Re: Rivet the 601xl plane Flys! (Terry Phillips)
5. 05:50 AM - Re: Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (MacDonald Doug)
6. 06:08 AM - Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (Bob Unternaehrer)
7. 06:10 AM - Re: Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (Bryan Martin)
8. 06:17 AM - Re: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a million (Bryan Martin)
9. 06:27 AM - Wing Tie-Down Attachment (dfmoeller)
10. 06:48 AM - Re: Wing Tie-Down Attachment (Larry Winger)
11. 07:26 AM - Re: Motor mount (Bob Unternaehrer)
12. 07:26 AM - Re: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a million (Bob Unternaehrer)
13. 07:58 AM - Re: Wing Tie-Down Attachment (dfmoeller)
14. 08:36 AM - Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (David Downey)
15. 08:36 AM - Re: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a million (David Downey)
16. 08:43 AM - Re: Flight instructor and examiner wanted (Gig Giacona)
17. 08:57 AM - motor mount dimension for corvair on XL (Bob Unternaehrer)
18. 09:17 AM - Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (Tim Juhl)
19. 09:34 AM - Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (Bob Unternaehrer)
20. 09:40 AM - Re: motor mount dimension for corvair on XL (Bob Unternaehrer)
21. 09:52 AM - Re: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a million (Dan Lykowski)
22. 09:54 AM - Re: CH701 Firewall Forward Kit (Stanley Challgren)
23. 10:03 AM - Re: First Flight (Juan Vega)
24. 10:08 AM - some flying pics of N427JV "Rivet" (Juan Vega)
25. 10:25 AM - Re: some flying pics of N427JV "Rivet" (wade jones)
26. 10:41 AM - Re: Zenith-List Digest: 38 Msgs - 10/12/07 (Bill Roberts)
27. 11:47 AM - Re: some flying pics of N427JV "Rivet" (Southern Reflections)
28. 12:02 PM - Re: motor mount dimension for corvair on XL (Robin Bellach)
29. 12:29 PM - locking latch (flyingmike9)
30. 12:59 PM - [ Dave Miller ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares)
31. 04:40 PM - Cloverdale Fly-In ()
32. 07:17 PM - Jab Cowling issue (Ron Ellis)
33. 07:37 PM - Jab dual throttle (Ron Ellis)
34. 09:29 PM - Re: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a million (jetboy)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Flight instructor and examiner wanted |
Hey Don: I took my first ride in a 601 XL at Lantana Florida. That is what
made up my mind to buy my 601 HD. No problems with the cold weather there.
Lynn Nelsen
Message 2
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| Subject: | Rivet the 601xl plane Flys! |
after putting on the cowling and setting up yhe dynon system on Rivet the wonder
plane ,so named by ,my wife , I started her up for the first time and planned
to do taxi tests. so much for the taxi tests, she took off on me at 40 knots!.
427JV took off and went up to 1500 feet, wrong place to burn in the breaks!
Flys hands off. Temps were CHT-340, EGT was average 1300 to 1300. after about
2 hours they were down to 345 and 1290. did high speed taxi upon landing, and
breaks work fine. took cwl off and only issue was oil comingloose oil filter,
screws fell off tail light, and prop needs to be pitched less.
Juan Vega, 601xl, J 3300.
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? |
Patrick
That's how I did the servo wires on my previous project. In addition I
covered the entire splice with another, larger piece of cheap (read stiff) heat
shrink and made sure that section was well anchored. I sold the plane but it is
flying regularly and the new owner has not reported any wiring problems. (And
believe me he does report problems.)
Carroll
do not archive
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Rivet the 601xl plane Flys! |
Congratulations on a successful 1st flight,Juan!
Keep us posted on your flight test results.
Terry
At 06:24 AM 10/13/2007 -0400, you wrote:
>after putting on the cowling and setting up yhe dynon system on Rivet the
>wonder plane ,so named by ,my wife , I started her up for the first time
>and planned to do taxi tests. so much for the taxi tests, she took off on
>me at 40 knots!. 427JV took off and went up to 1500 feet, wrong place to
>burn in the breaks!
>Flys hands off. Temps were CHT-340, EGT was average 1300 to 1300. after
>about 2 hours they were down to 345 and 1290. did high speed taxi upon
>landing, and breaks work fine. took cwl off and only issue was oil
>comingloose oil filter, screws fell off tail light, and prop needs to be
>pitched less.
>
>Juan Vega, 601xl, J 3300.
Terry Phillips
ttp44~at~rkymtn.net
Corvallis MT
601XL/Jab 3300 slow build kit - Rudder done--finally; working on the stab
http://www.mykitlog.com/N47TP/
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? |
Guys, all this talk of crimp connectors is making me a
little nervious. The best way to joun two wires
together is to solder them. Next step is to rinse the
flux off with water or rubbing alcohol. Then to
finish them up, apply heat shrink (preferably the
internally glued type). This is what the professional
avionics shops are supposed to do.
Yes, it might be overkill in some instances but it
will always work. No guessing if the crimp is going
to fail.
Doug MacDonald
CH-701 Scratch Builder
NW Ontario, Canada
--- Paul Mulwitz <psm@ATT.NET> wrote:
> <psm@att.net>
>
> At 08:49 PM 10/12/2007, you wrote:
> >Same here. I have been using d-sub computer style
> connectors from
> >Radio Shack. Get your magnifying glass out!
>
> I wonder how well miniature connectors like the
> D-sub work for 16 AWG
> wires. They are usually used for 22 AWG and smaller
> wires.
>
> I have been using automotive spade connectors
> crimped onto the Tefzel
> aircraft wires. I like the ones that come with full
> plastic covers
> and tend to tie them together with lacing tape.
>
> Paul
> XL Fuselage
Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase.
http://farechase.yahoo.com/
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? |
<<I'm guessing that twisting them together, soldering, and then covering
with heat-shrink tubing is the way to go.>>
for the example you give, "non critical" i like the molex connectors.
I'd probably use molex connectors or Terminal boards for any wiring you
"might" have to remove. Other than those I like the "crimp style butt
connectors" using the proper crimp tool (wide hammer and anvil type).
This discussion went on and on ,,,on another list I believe, or maybe it
was this list several months ago and it will NEVER be resolved. Those
who feel soldering is still necessary are die hards and will always
solder. 30 or 40 years ago when large crimp connectors first became
available and popular in the large wire ( 3 and 4 ought) on High Voltage
connectors, I was involved in testing the crimps. We would test the
connectors for resistance drop at high currents, then cut and polish the
crimps, looking for voids. The "properly crimped" joint was always
superior to other methods, such as lugs bolted together, split bolts
etc. A proper crimp of stranded wire, when cut and polished looks like
one "Solid wire", that is the strands are not visible and have become
one wire. Solderings major detract is the damaging of the insullation
AND "cold solder joints and some corrosion possibilities. I suspect,
this debate will get long and won't be resolved here either. In
summary, Get yourself a GOOD Klein or other commercial brand wide anvil
crimper made for insulated and non-insulated lugs and use it.
Bob U.
----- Original Message -----
From: PatrickW
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 9:10 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Splicing Tiny Wires...?
How are you guys splicing thin wires together...?
For example, where the 5 wires that come out of the aileron servo are
spliced to another bundle of 5 wires.
I'm guessing that twisting them together, soldering, and then covering
with heat-shrink tubing is the way to go.
Anybody doing anything different/better/easier...?
Thanks,
Patrick
XL/Corvair
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139669#139669
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? |
This is the only place I used the Radio Shack splices. I staggered
the splices and covered the whole lot with a piece of heat shrink and
supported the splice near the servo. I have had no trouble in three
years and 220 hours of flight time.
I would not use this type of connector for general wiring purposes in
an airplane. Every where else I used AMP PIDG connectors or similar
except for some Molex multi-pin connectors for the wire bundles at
the wing roots and firewall. Some of the Radio Shack stuff is
suitable for use, the connectors they sell for single wire
connections (butt splices and ring terminals) are generally not
suitable.
On Oct 13, 2007, at 1:39 AM, mosquito56 wrote:
> <mosquito-56@hotmail.com>
>
> I am curious about using Radio Shack in an airplane. While I am not
> suggesting the quality is bad, I have to question the quality of
> Radio Shack in general?
> I highly recommend this page, I go alot of nice info and sites
> for electrical work.
> http://mybearhawk.com/finish/electrical1.html, page 5 had the
> connectors your talking about.
> Don
> 601xl fuse
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
do not archive.
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a million |
For question 2. B and C Specialty Products ( http://www.bandc.biz/
parts.html ) sells a double pole oil pressure switch for this. One
contact grounds the oil light circuit when no pressure is present and
the other can provide a ground to the Hobbs when the pressure is up.
It's only available with 1/8 NPT so I don't know if its suitable for
the Jabiru.
On Oct 13, 2007, at 1:32 AM, mosquito56 wrote:
> <mosquito-56@hotmail.com>
>
> I am just getting to the interesting parts of the plane, Instrument
> Panel and fwf. I will shoot out a couple of the questions I wrote
> down from today. These are in no logical, if I were logical I would
> be building a bar, not an airplane, order.
>
> 1. Ags ingtiions system. Do the locks work on the 601xl? What is a
> good Ignition switch? Does the ignition switch come with the
> jab3300 fwf?
> 2. How can I make it so the hobbs meter only runs when the engine
> is running? If you've ever left your ignition on you'll understand
> this one.
> 3. Dynon ems120, do you need a seperate fuel sender or is the
> resistance all that is needed. What do you think of Dynon in general?
> 4. Any thoughts on Grand Rapids efis?
> Thanx much
>
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
do not archive.
Message 9
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| Subject: | Wing Tie-Down Attachment |
Here's what should be a quick question.
The plans for the XL show the wing tie-down rings to be mounted in what looks like
a notch cut into the outboard spar tip lower flange. This seems to be supported
by the dimensions listed in the drawings.
Is that really how people are mounting these? I can't image cutting that notch
in the spar tip flange when it really doesn't look necessary. Wouldn't that
impact the integrity of the spar tip?
Just asking what others have done here. A picture would really help.
Doug
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139726#139726
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Wing Tie-Down Attachment |
Don't notch the flange. If you look at page 7 of the photo guide (Section
6-W-8B, Revision 3.3), you'll see that they show the aft edge of the tiedown
only touching the flange, not intersecting it.
In the plans themselves, they only specify the distance for the narrow end
of the ring to be 30mm. You don't maintain the 30mm for the rest of the
rivet line. That is covered in a column note on the photo guide that says,
"Note: the rivet line is not parallel to the front edge of the rib."
Larry Winger
601XL/Corvair
Scratchbuilding wings
Tustin, CA
On 10/13/07, dfmoeller <dfmoeller@austin.rr.com> wrote:
>
>
> Here's what should be a quick question.
>
> The plans for the XL show the wing tie-down rings to be mounted in what
> looks like a notch cut into the outboard spar tip lower flange. This seems
> to be supported by the dimensions listed in the drawings.
>
> Is that really how people are mounting these? I can't image cutting that
> notch in the spar tip flange when it really doesn't look
> necessary. Wouldn't that impact the integrity of the spar tip?
>
> Just asking what others have done here. A picture would really help.
>
>
> Doug
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139726#139726
>
>
Message 11
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Bob, What did you use to cowl your corvair. Did you use the WW nose
bowl? Anyhow could you give me the dimension from the Prop centerline,
horizontally to the top firewall mount. Also the distance vertically
from the top firewall mount to the prop centerline and to the Bed mount
where it bolts to the motor.
Bob U.
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Duns
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 12:47 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Motor mount
Blue Skies
Bob U
When I built a motor mount for 601HD (Corvair), WW advised that the
tray is angled down 1 degree at the nose. The tail of the motor is
offset 1/2 degree to the right. I presume these angles were based on
his 601XL which is similar tot he 061HD firewall. I have not flown yet
so can't confirm whether these numbers work for me but WW has many
hours on his 601XL with similar motor mount. I also have other numbers
for location of motor mount tray from in front of the firewall if you
need them.
Bob D
601HD Corvair
Melfort, SK
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Unternaehrer
To: Zenith List
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 9:44 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Motor mount
I'm building my motor mount for the corvair engine. I have Zenith
drawing #6-YE-1 which seems a little confusing as to which way the
engine should be offset. Their note says "offset to the left for
lycoming engine" and the drawing shows the thrust line offset to the
RIGHT. I'm planning on building a square motor mount,,,,except I will
put a 1" spacer between the left hand 2 support arms when located in the
fixture. Then when mounted on the airplane WITHOUT the spacers the
motor mount will swing ,,,or offset to the Left. Can anyone confirm
this is the corect way to offset the motor mount and also does the
corvair rotate counter clockwise when setting in the pilots
seat,,,,opposite of the Lycomings.
Blue Skies
Bob Unternaehrer
shilocom@mcmsys.com
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a million |
<<2. How can I make it so the hobbs meter only runs when the engine is
running? If you've ever left your ignition on you'll understand this
one.>>
Oil pressure switch.
Bob U.
----- Original Message -----
From: mosquito56
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 12:32 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: General Instrument and engine questions. first
of a million
<mosquito-56@hotmail.com>
I am just getting to the interesting parts of the plane, Instrument
Panel and fwf. I will shoot out a couple of the questions I wrote down
from today. These are in no logical, if I were logical I would be
building a bar, not an airplane, order.
1. Ags ingtiions system. Do the locks work on the 601xl? What is a
good Ignition switch? Does the ignition switch come with the jab3300
fwf?
2. How can I make it so the hobbs meter only runs when the engine is
running? If you've ever left your ignition on you'll understand this
one.
3. Dynon ems120, do you need a seperate fuel sender or is the
resistance all that is needed. What do you think of Dynon in general?
4. Any thoughts on Grand Rapids efis?
Thanx much
Don
N601NV reserved
Starting fuse
Laredo, Tx
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139694#139694
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Wing Tie-Down Attachment |
Thanks, Larry. That was the part I was missing. The rivet line isn't parallel
to the spar!
Doug
[quote="lwinger"]Don't notch the flange. If you look at page 7 of the photo guide
(Section 6-W-8B, Revision 3.3), you'll see that they show the aft edge of
the tiedown only touching the flange, not intersecting it.
In the plans themselves, they only specify the distance for the narrow end of
the ring to be 30mm. You don't maintain the 30mm for the rest of the rivet line.
That is covered in a column note on the photo guide that says, "Note: the
rivet line is not parallel to the front edge of the rib."
Larry Winger
601XL/Corvair
Scratchbuilding wings
Tustin, CA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139742#139742
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? |
The other reason that crimping has largely replaced soldered connections is
that the major cause of unreliability on soldered joints is the eventual f
atigue failures in the wiring due to the transition from a flexible bunch o
f strands into a fused rod at the boudary of the solder joint.=0A =0ADave D
owney=0AHarleysville (SE) PA=0A100 HP Corvair=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Original Mes
sage ----=0AFrom: Bob Unternaehrer <shilocom@mcmsys.com>=0ATo: zenith-list@
matronics.com=0ASent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 9:07:04 AM=0ASubject: Re:
Zenith-List: Splicing Tiny Wires...?=0A=0A=0A<<I'm guessing that twisting t
hem together, soldering, and then covering with heat-shrink tubing is the w
ay to go.>>=0A=0A =0Afor the example you give, "non critical" i like the mo
lex connectors. I'd probably use molex connectors or Terminal boards for a
ny wiring you "might" have to remove. Other than those I like the "crimp s
tyle butt connectors" using the proper crimp tool (wide hammer and anvil ty
pe). This discussion went on and on ,,,on another list I believe, or maybe
it was this list several months ago and it will NEVER be resolved. Those
who feel soldering is still necessary are die hards and will always solder.
30 or 40 years ago when large crimp connectors first became available and
popular in the large wire ( 3 and 4 ought) on High Voltage connectors, I w
as involved in testing the crimps. We would test the connectors for resist
ance drop at high currents, then cut and polish the crimps, looking for voi
ds. The "properly crimped" joint was always superior to other methods, suc
h as lugs bolted together, split bolts etc. A proper crimp of stranded wire
, when cut and
polished looks like one "Solid wire", that is the strands are not visible
and have become one wire. Solderings major detract is the damaging of the
insullation AND "cold solder joints and some corrosion possibilities. I s
uspect, this debate will get long and won't be resolved here either. In s
ummary, Get yourself a GOOD Klein or other commercial brand wide anvil crim
per made for insulated and non-insulated lugs and use it. =0A =0ABob U.
=0A----- Original Message ----- =0AFrom: PatrickW =0ATo: zenith-list@matron
ics.com =0ASent: Friday, October 12, 2007 9:10 PM=0ASubject: Zenith-List: S
" <pwhoyt@yahoo.com>=0A=0AHow are you guys splicing thin wires together...?
=0A=0AFor example, where the 5 wires that come out of the aileron servo are
spliced to another bundle of 5 wires.=0A=0AI'm guessing that twisting them
together, soldering, and then covering with heat-shrink tubing is the way
to go.=0A=0AAnybody doing anything different/better/easier...?=0A=0AThanks,
=0A=0APatrick=0AXL/Corvair=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0A
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139669#139669=0A=0A=0Ahttp://
www.matron=====================
===0Absp; available via href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://fo
========================0A=0A
=0A =0A______________________________________________________________
______________________=0ABe a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship an
ers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545433
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a million |
I always thought that the Hobbs was powered through an oil pressure switch.
=0A =0ADave Downey=0AHarleysville (SE) PA=0A100 HP Corvair=0A=0A=0A=0A-----
Original Message ----=0AFrom: Bob Unternaehrer <shilocom@mcmsys.com>=0ATo:
zenith-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 9:29:05 AM=0A
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: General Instrument and engine questions. first of
a million=0A=0A=0A<<2. How can I make it so the hobbs meter only runs when
the engine is running? If you've ever left your ignition on you'll underst
and this one.>>=0A =0AOil pressure switch. =0A =0ABob U. =0A =0A----- Orig
inal Message ----- =0AFrom: mosquito56 =0ATo: zenith-list@matronics.com =0A
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 12:32 AM=0ASubject: Zenith-List: General I
nstrument and engine questions. first of a million=0A=0A=0A--> Zenith-List
message posted by: "mosquito56" <mosquito-56@hotmail.com>=0A=0AI am just ge
tting to the interesting parts of the plane, Instrument Panel and fwf. I wi
ll shoot out a couple of the questions I wrote down from today. These are i
n no logical, if I were logical I would be building a bar, not an airplane,
order.=0A=0A1. Ags ingtiions system. Do the locks work on the 601xl? What
is a good Ignition switch? Does the ignition switch come with the jab3300 f
wf?=0A2. How can I make it so the hobbs meter only runs when the engine is
running? If you've ever left your ignition on you'll understand this one.
=0A3. Dynon ems120, do you need a seperate fuel sender or is the resistance
all that is needed. What do you think of Dynon in general?=0A4. Any though
ts on Grand Rapids efis?=0AThanx much=0A=0ADon=0AN601NV reserved=0AStarting
fuse=0ALaredo, Tx=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://f
orums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139694#139694=0A=0A=0Ahttp://www.matr
on========================0Ab
sp; available via href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matro
======================0A=0A=0A
=0A____________________________________________________________________
________________=0AMoody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their li
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Flight instructor and examiner wanted |
These folks have one.
Silver Sky Aviation
4151 W. Lindbergh Way
Chandler, AZ
866-498-8276
peggy@silverskyaviation.com
www.silverskyaviation.com
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139753#139753
Message 17
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| Subject: | motor mount dimension for corvair on XL |
Could anybody give me a dimension from either the prop hub flange or
either motor mount hole to the TOP Firewall mount. I have the motor
here and can get the following dimensions but it anyone already has them
the "height of the Crankshaft centerline" above the bed mount
vertically and the distance from the prop hub horizoontallty to the
front motor mount hole in the bed mount. I'll want to be sure the
fiberglass nosebowl and cowling kit will fit. Is it a good assumption
that the cowling kit will have a few inches of metal to trim so that
there is a little wiggle room for that fit, but what seems more
important is that the motor be in the correct "front to back" position
for the correct CG on the XL
Blue Skies
Bob Unternaehrer
shilocom@mcmsys.com
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? |
I'm an old time radio guy and my preference is for soldering when there is no need
to take the connection apart again. I also use heat shrink and follow by
either wrapping the whole bundle with tape or a bigger piece of heat shrink.
When I was our school's tech guy I used crimpers for everything.... that said,
those connections were not be exposed to weather or vibrated by a bouncing airframe.
Tim
--------
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Working on wings
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Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? |
<<<major cause of unreliability on soldered joints is the eventual
fatigue failures in the wiring due to the transition from a flexible
bunch of strands into a fused rod at the boudary of the solder joint.>>
Absolutely,,,,I'd forgot about that. bob U.
----- Original Message -----
From: David Downey
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Splicing Tiny Wires...?
The other reason that crimping has largely replaced soldered
connections is that the major cause of unreliability on soldered joints
is the eventual fatigue failures in the wiring due to the transition
from a flexible bunch of strands into a fused rod at the boudary of the
solder joint.
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
100 HP Corvair
----- Original Message ----
From: Bob Unternaehrer <shilocom@mcmsys.com>
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 9:07:04 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Splicing Tiny Wires...?
<<I'm guessing that twisting them together, soldering, and then
covering with heat-shrink tubing is the way to go.>>
for the example you give, "non critical" i like the molex connectors.
I'd probably use molex connectors or Terminal boards for any wiring you
"might" have to remove. Other than those I like the "crimp style butt
connectors" using the proper crimp tool (wide hammer and anvil type).
This discussion went on and on ,,,on another list I believe, or maybe it
was this list several months ago and it will NEVER be resolved. Those
who feel soldering is still necessary are die hards and will always
solder. 30 or 40 years ago when large crimp connectors first became
available and popular in the large wire ( 3 and 4 ought) on High Voltage
connectors, I was involved in testing the crimps. We would test the
connectors for resistance drop at high currents, then cut and polish the
crimps, looking for voids. The "properly crimped" joint was always
superior to other methods, such as lugs bolted together, split bolts
etc. A proper crimp of stranded wire, when cut and polished looks like
one "Solid wire", that is the strands are not visible and have become
one wire. Solderings major detract is the damaging of the insullation
AND "cold solder joints and some corrosion possibilities. I suspect,
this debate will get long and won't be resolved here either. In
summary, Get yourself a GOOD Klein or other commercial brand wide anvil
crimper made for insulated and non-insulated lugs and use it.
Bob U.
----- Original Message -----
From: PatrickW
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 9:10 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Splicing Tiny Wires...?
How are you guys splicing thin wires together...?
For example, where the 5 wires that come out of the aileron servo
are spliced to another bundle of 5 wires.
I'm guessing that twisting them together, soldering, and then
covering with heat-shrink tubing is the way to go.
Anybody doing anything different/better/easier...?
Thanks,
Patrick
XL/Corvair
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Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: motor mount dimension for corvair on XL |
<<<Could anybody give me a dimension from either the prop hub flange or
either motor mount hole to the TOP Firewall mount>>
I wasn't clear that the dimension I need is the "horizontal" dimension.
bob U.
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Unternaehrer
To: Zenith List
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 10:53 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: motor mount dimension for corvair on XL
Could anybody give me a dimension from either the prop hub flange or
either motor mount hole to the TOP Firewall mount. I have the motor
here and can get the following dimensions but it anyone already has them
the "height of the Crankshaft centerline" above the bed mount
vertically and the distance from the prop hub horizoontallty to the
front motor mount hole in the bed mount. I'll want to be sure the
fiberglass nosebowl and cowling kit will fit. Is it a good assumption
that the cowling kit will have a few inches of metal to trim so that
there is a little wiggle room for that fit, but what seems more
important is that the motor be in the correct "front to back" position
for the correct CG on the XL
Blue Skies
Bob Unternaehrer
shilocom@mcmsys.com
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a million |
3. The resistance is all that is needed to calculate fuel level. If you want fuel
flow, you need to buy a separate sensor.
I think Dynon is a great company, but I am biased.
-Dan Lykowski
Dynon Avionics
----- Original Message ----
From: mosquito56 <mosquito-56@hotmail.com>
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 10:32:43 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a million
<mosquito-56@hotmail.com>
I am just getting to the interesting parts of the plane, Instrument
Panel and fwf. I will shoot out a couple of the questions I wrote down
from today. These are in no logical, if I were logical I would be building
a bar, not an airplane, order.
1. Ags ingtiions system. Do the locks work on the 601xl? What is a good
Ignition switch? Does the ignition switch come with the jab3300 fwf?
2. How can I make it so the hobbs meter only runs when the engine is
running? If you've ever left your ignition on you'll understand this one.
3. Dynon ems120, do you need a seperate fuel sender or is the
resistance all that is needed. What do you think of Dynon in general?
4. Any thoughts on Grand Rapids efis?
Thanx much
Don
N601NV reserved
Starting fuse
Laredo, Tx
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139694#139694
Don't let your dream ride pass you by. Make it a reality with Yahoo! Autos.
http://autos.yahoo.com/index.html
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: CH701 Firewall Forward Kit |
On Apr 9, 2007, at 2:11 PM, Pete Krotje wrote:
> Jabiru USA Sport Aircraft announces the release of a complete firewall
> forward installation kit for the CH701. Kit includes cowls, mount,
> all
> systems, prop and spinner.
Pete:
I had a Jabiru 3300 (Serial #33A67) on our Zenith 601 HDS and you
were very helpful as we were ironing out our various cooling and fuel
burn problems. We were very pleased with the 3300 and it is my
first choice for the 701 I am building now.
I notice that the pictures in your April 9 Email have been replaced
by "CH 701 Series, Coming soon". I am wondering what progress has
been made on the Jab 3300 for the Zenith 701?
I am at that point in the 701 building process where the Jon's 701
video and Zenair's graphic instructions suggest I put the engine
mount on. Before I order the engine mount I need to make an engine
choice, Jabiru 3300 or Rotax 912S.
I have previously queried the Zenith list last December on these two
choices and received one thoughtful and disquieting responses which I
quote below in part:
"Hi Stan, I spent an hour on the phone with Jabiru and talked to a
owner there. The discussion was to confirm my personal feelings of
the Jab 3300 in a 701. Funny enough the owner holds the same belief
and concerns that I share. The Jab is a great engine and I have
absolutely no problems with it in a 601XL. But your 701 is a
different story.
Jabiru USA is trying to build a FWF for the 701 right now and they
are having major problems. The new arrangement of the hydraulic heads
means that the engine must be lowered yet again. What does this mean?
It means that you will have to swing an even smaller prop then before
and the 701 truly needs a large prop for its airframe.
SO some of the negatives involved in choosing a 3300
Engine is truly to heavy
FWF is not available yet
Direct drive means a smaller less efficient prop for the
701 design, wich benefits greatly from a large prop.
Too much power for the airframe
Prop placement is below the longerons and throws off the
proper placement, handeling may be affected, Jabiru is unsure of this
at the moment.
Engine is too wide and makes the nose look funny.
Cooling is going to be an issue even with the new FWF
(possibly)
Nose of your plane is longer, possible C or G issues and
weight added to tail.
Uses more gas then the Rotax for comparable speeds.
Single carb, not as efficient as dual at attitude.
So truly with the smaller prop, even though the Jabiru 3300
has a better power to weight ratio then the Rotax 912S, it will have
less power over all in your 701 and burn a lot more fuel.
There is not a very big difference in cost between the
Jabiru 3300 and the Rotax 912S after you add the price of the FWF to
either engine package.
The Jabiru 3300 is all air- cooled in its right it has
many benefits but the liquid cooled heads on a plane in Canada is a
lot less prone to cooling shock on approach especially if you are
flying in Altitudes.
Dont get me wrong, I really love the Jabiru 3300, Im not crazy
about the 2200 and in a 601 XL I would do my best to help any builder
consider the Jab over the Rotax in a flash. But hands down the Rotax
is truly the best fit in my opinion for the 701."
Notwithstanding the quotes above, I favor the Jab 3300 because of the
superior service you provided us even though we had purchased the
engine from the unsatisfactory dealer in California. Also, the
3300's beauty, reliability and lack of problems in service is far
superior to the 912S.
So, the bottom line. Is the 701 compatible with the 3300 and, if so,
what is the expected date of the firewall forward package?
Stan Challgren
N701VG (reserved)
303-674-6910
24754 Chris Drive
Evergreen, Co 80439
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: First Flight |
Randy,
thanks, the thought on the prop is the bite is too much, the RPM is not reaching
3300. only bout 2950 at max level rpm. If the prop works too hard dialing
it to a less bite will rev the engine little bit more but create less work on
the torque strain.
Worst that can happen is to just change it back.
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: "Stout, Randy" <Randy.Stout@bowebellhowell.com>
>Sent: Oct 13, 2007 10:02 AM
>To: amyvega2005@earthlink.net
>Subject: First Flight
>
>Juan
>
>Congratulations on the first flight! I didn't realize you were so close.
>
>You might want to rethink changing pitch on the prop. I'm assuming you have a
new 3300 and it has the Bing carb. If you change the pitch, it will have a large
effect on the engine temps. What you posted doesn't look too bad for a brand
new engine.
>
>Randy Stout
Message 24
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| Subject: | some flying pics of N427JV "Rivet" |
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| Subject: | Re: some flying pics of N427JV "Rivet" |
Hey Juan ,congrats on your first flight .Another reason to have your plane
in flying condition prior to high speed taxi .You have a beautify plane and
a great accomplishment.
Wade Jones South Texas
601XL plans building
Cont. 0200
----- Original Message -----
From: "Juan Vega" <amyvega2005@earthlink.net>
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 12:08 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: some flying pics of N427JV "Rivet"
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 38 Msgs - 10/12/07 |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Zenith-List Digest Server" <zenith-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 1:58 AM
Subject: Zenith-List Digest: 38 Msgs - 10/12/07
> *
>
> =================================================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> =================================================
>
> Today's complete Zenith-List Digest can also be found in either of the
> two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
> in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
> and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
> of the Zenith-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
> such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>
> HTML Version:
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 07-10-12&Archive=Zenith
>
> Text Version:
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 07-10-12&Archive=Zenith
>
>
> ===============================================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> ===============================================
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Zenith-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Fri 10/12/07: 38
> ----------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 12:13 AM - Re: Zenith-List Digest: 49 Msgs - 10/10/07 (Alvin Rose)
> 2. 01:03 AM - 601xl plans (Mike Bauman)
> 3. 01:44 AM - Re: Hirth Engine (secatur)
> 4. 02:37 AM - Re: 701 with Jab 3300 (Eric Tiethoff)
> 5. 03:48 AM - Re: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (MacDonald Doug)
> 6. 04:00 AM - Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (Mike Hoffman)
> 7. 04:39 AM - Re: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
> (Trainnut01@aol.com)
> 8. 05:46 AM - Re: 601xl plans (Southern Reflections)
> 9. 05:50 AM - Re: 701 welded kit parts (Ken Arnold)
> 10. 06:37 AM - Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (n85ae)
> 11. 07:07 AM - Re: 701 with Jab 3300 (LRM)
> 12. 07:10 AM - Re: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (LRM)
> 13. 07:19 AM - Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (Gig Giacona)
> 14. 07:40 AM - Re: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (Jeyoung65@aol.com)
> 15. 09:24 AM - Motor mount (Bob Unternaehrer)
> 16. 10:20 AM - ch750 (Terry Fogelson)
> 17. 10:48 AM - Re: Motor mount (Bob Duns)
> 18. 12:15 PM - Re: Motor mount (Al Hays)
> 19. 01:14 PM - Re: ch750 (LouB)
> 20. 04:30 PM - Flight instructor and examiner wanted (mosquito56)
> 21. 04:36 PM - Re: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
> (n801bh@netzero.com)
> 22. 04:37 PM - Re: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
> (n801bh@netzero.com)
> 23. 04:42 PM - Re: Flight instructor and examiner wanted
> (xavierzr@HOTMAIL.COM)
> 24. 04:59 PM - CH 701 flying (SockPuppet61)
> 25. 05:23 PM - Re: Flight instructor and examiner wanted (Clyde
> Barcus)
> 26. 05:51 PM - Re: CH 701 flying (river1)
> 27. 06:00 PM - Re: Flight instructor and examiner wanted
> (Jeyoung65@aol.com)
> 28. 07:11 PM - Re: Motor mount (Bob Unternaehrer)
> 29. 07:11 PM - Splicing Tiny Wires...? (PatrickW)
> 30. 07:23 PM - Re: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (William Dominguez)
> 31. 07:43 PM - Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (Bryan Martin)
> 32. 08:50 PM - Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (DaveG601XL)
> 33. 08:56 PM - Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (GLJSOJ1)
> 34. 09:10 PM - Re: Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (Paul Mulwitz)
> 35. 09:51 PM - Re: Flight instructor and examiner wanted
> (craig@craigandjean.com)
> 36. 10:25 PM - Re: Flight instructor and examiner wanted (mosquito56)
> 37. 10:33 PM - General Instrument and engine questions. first of a
> million (mosquito56)
> 38. 10:40 PM - Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...? (mosquito56)
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 1
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 12:13:25 AM PST US
> From: "Alvin Rose" <ajroseca@nf.sympatico.ca>
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 49 Msgs - 10/10/07
>
>
> I have just completed my CH-701 SP aircraft and it is ready to fly
> What is the best tire preasure for the tires...Also best performance
> speed...Best takeoff speed...best climb speed...Best approach speed
> with and without flaps
> Alvin Rose
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Zenith-List Digest Server" <zenith-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 4:28 AM
> Subject: Zenith-List Digest: 49 Msgs - 10/10/07
>
>
>> *
>>
>> ================================================
>> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
>> ================================================
>>
>> Today's complete Zenith-List Digest can also be found in either of the
>> two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
>> in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
>> and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
>> of the Zenith-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
>> such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>>
>> HTML Version:
>>
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter
>> 07-10-10&Archive=Zenith
>>
>> Text Version:
>>
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter
>> 07-10-10&Archive=Zenith
>>
>>
>> ==============================================
>> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
>> ==============================================
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------
>> Zenith-List Digest Archive
>> ---
>> Total Messages Posted Wed 10/10/07: 49
>> ----------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>> Today's Message Index:
>> ----------------------
>>
>> 1. 01:17 AM - Re: Hirth Engine (chrisoz@bmail.com.au)
>> 2. 02:07 AM - Re: Re: Open Hangar day Zenith Factory (Paul Mulwitz)
>> 3. 03:05 AM - Re: Re: Open Hangar day Zenith Factory (Jonathan
>> Starke)
>> 4. 03:52 AM - Re: Re: XL Landing Gear (Debo Cox)
>> 5. 04:22 AM - Safety wire twister (Geoff Heap)
>> 6. 04:32 AM - Like to see a 601 HD or XL (Woody sulloway)
>> 7. 05:13 AM - Re: Like to see a 601 HD or XL (Craig Payne)
>> 8. 06:14 AM - Re: Contact Magazine (ashontz)
>> 9. 06:35 AM - Re: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (MacDonald Doug)
>> 10. 06:45 AM - Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (n85ae)
>> 11. 06:47 AM - Re: Hirth aircraft engines (MacDonald Doug)
>> 12. 06:49 AM - Re: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. ()
>> 13. 08:20 AM - Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (Gig Giacona)
>> 14. 08:42 AM - Re: Re: Sorry Guys it is another long winded response
>> (William Dominguez)
>> 15. 09:30 AM - ZINC CHROMATE:UPDATE (GLJSOJ1)
>> 16. 09:32 AM - Re: Like to see a 601 HD or XL (GLJSOJ1)
>> 17. 09:50 AM - Re: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (MacDonald Doug)
>> 18. 10:02 AM - access panels (Carlos Sa)
>> 19. 10:30 AM - Instrument Panel Access (John Davis)
>> 20. 11:15 AM - Re: Vixen file with holder ()
>> 21. 11:58 AM - Re: access panels (DaveG601XL)
>> 22. 12:02 PM - Bending the main gear (and the nose gear fork)
>> (tigermiller)
>> 23. 12:23 PM - Re: Instrument Panel Access (Jaybannist@cs.com)
>> 24. 12:34 PM - Wing Spars Done! Bolts? (Kafka, Jeff)
>> 25. 01:05 PM - Re: Wing Spars Done! Bolts? (Bryan Martin)
>> 26. 01:14 PM - Re: Wing Spars Done! Bolts? (Beckman, Rick)
>> 27. 01:20 PM - Re: CH701 Usable Fuel (milreed)
>> 28. 01:23 PM - Re: Wing Spars Done! Bolts? (MacDonald Doug)
>> 29. 01:45 PM - Fw: Instrument Panel Access (Schloss)
>> 30. 01:58 PM - Re: Bending the main gear (and the nose gear fork)
>> (Gary Boothe)
>> 31. 02:19 PM - Re: Instrument Panel Access (Gig Giacona)
>> 32. 02:42 PM - Re: Instrument Panel Access (VideoFlyer@aol.com)
>> 33. 02:57 PM - Re: Re: XL Landing Gear (David Downey)
>> 34. 03:07 PM - Re: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion. (Bill Naumuk)
>> 35. 03:07 PM - Re: Instrument Panel Access (Graeme)
>> 36. 03:10 PM - Re: Re: Instrument Panel Access (Jaybannist@cs.com)
>> 37. 03:12 PM - Re: Wing Spars Done! Bolts? (Bryan Martin)
>> 38. 03:49 PM - Re: Instrument Panel Access (GLJSOJ1)
>> 39. 04:56 PM - Re: CH701 Usable Fuel (kmccune)
>> 40. 04:59 PM - Re: Bending the main gear (and the nose gear fork)
>> (kmccune)
>> 41. 05:07 PM - Re: Re: Bending the main gear (and the nose gear fork)
>> (Gary Boothe)
>> 42. 05:30 PM - Re: Re: Instrument Panel Access (Gary Ray)
>> 43. 05:43 PM - Re: Instrument Panel Access (Bob Unternaehrer)
>> 44. 06:22 PM - Re: Instrument Panel Access (Jaybannist@cs.com)
>> 45. 07:19 PM - Re: Bending the main gear (and the nose gear fork)
>> (kmccune)
>> 46. 07:29 PM - Re: Re: Instrument Panel Access (Southern Reflections)
>> 47. 07:42 PM - Re: access panels (Ron Lendon)
>> 48. 07:56 PM - Re: Wing Spars Done! Bolts? (Ron Lendon)
>> 49. 08:54 PM - Re: Instrument Panel Access (T. Graziano)
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 1
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 01:17:30 AM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Hirth Engine
>> From: chrisoz@bmail.com.au
>>
>>
>> Hello Martyn,
>>
>> you are right, they are too good to be true. The engines run beatifully
>> when they run, but have a serious reliability issue. A friend of mine
>> had
>> the 100hp 3 cylinder version, and had two engine failures within the
>> first
>> 50 hours. When he tried to contact Hirth after the second one, they just
>> ignored him and never answered back. The customer service is attrocious,
>> and even with the advantage of speakin german you can not get them to
>> talk
>> to you.
>>
>> It is a shame as Hirth is one of the oldest aircraft engine manufacturers
>> in the world, dating back to the 1920s. But the current Hirth is not
>> comparable to those reliable engines from Klemm and Luftwaffe days.
>>
>> I would take a Subaru any day over a Hirth, but that is a bit heavy for
>> the 701. By far the best choice for the 701 remains the 912, there were a
>> few on ebay a short time ago, new for $10,000 each, the price of a
>> Hirth...
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Chris from Perth, Australia
>>
>>> Good Day all,
>>>
>>> I have gone through the archives and I have not found anything really
>>> conclusive regarding Hirth powerplants as a viable alternative.
>>>
>>> The 3 cylinder 100 HP fuel injected 2 stroke, weighing in at 45kg's
>>> (99lb's) seems too good to be true.
>>>
>>> Anybody out there that runs a Hirth or knows of someone who has one. I'd
>>> really like to get their feedback regarding these engines.
>>>
>>> Blue Skies everyone,
>>>
>>> Martyn Ward
>>> CH701 ZU-DPL
>>>
>>> Do Not Archive
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 2
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 02:07:24 AM PST US
>> From: Paul Mulwitz <psm@ATT.NET>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Open Hangar day Zenith Factory
>>
>>
>> Hi Martyn,
>>
>> That HIrth engine does sound too good to be true.
>>
>> This is the first I've heard of it, so I can't add to the information
>> pool. I would like to ask you to relay any information you get back
>> to this group, though. The weight and horsepower sound ideal for the
>> 601 and perhaps even a little on the high power side for the 701.
>>
>> It would be great if we had another engine to add to the fray.
>>
>> Paul
>> XL, fuselage, Jabiru 3300
>> do not archive
>>
>>
>> At 10:37 PM 10/9/2007, you wrote:
>>>
>>>Good Day all,
>>>
>>>I have gone through the archives and I have not found anything really
>>>conclusive regarding Hirth powerplants as a viable alternative.
>>>
>>>The 3 cylinder 100 HP fuel injected 2 stroke, weighing in at 45kg's
>>>(99lb's) seems too good to be true.
>>>
>>>Anybody out there that runs a Hirth or knows of someone who has one. I'd
>>>really like to get their feedback regarding these engines.
>>>
>>>Blue Skies everyone,
>>>
>>>Martyn Ward
>>>CH701 ZU-DPL
>>>
>>>Do Not Archive
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 3
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 03:05:01 AM PST US
>> From: "Jonathan Starke" <jonathan@entry.co.za>
>> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Open Hangar day Zenith Factory
>>
>>
>> Martyn,
>>
>> You should get hold of Donald Williamson, in Cape Town..
>>
>> I don't have his number, but his website is: www.produx.co.za
>>
>> He has a Hirth installed in his RANS S10.
>>
>> Cheers
>> Jonathan Starke
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 4
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 03:52:01 AM PST US
>> From: Debo Cox <sky_ranger161@yahoo.com>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: XL Landing Gear
>>
>> Hey Dave,
>>
>> That sounds like exactly what I was thinking would work. I'm still a
>> long
>> way
>> from bending mine, but would love to see the pics and read the details of
>> your
>> method when you make it happen. Good luck with it!
>>
>> Debo Cox
>> Scratch-built XL/Corvair
>> Nags Head, NC
>>
>> do not archive
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 5
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 04:22:47 AM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Safety wire twister
>> From: "Geoff Heap" <stol10@comcast.net>
>>
>>
>> Can anyone recommend one of the cheap wire twisters from Assco.
>> Thanks...Geoff
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139136#139136
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 6
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 04:32:12 AM PST US
>> From: "Woody sulloway" <sulloway@clis.com>
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Like to see a 601 HD or XL
>>
>> Hi folks,
>> I'm based in coastal North Carolina, Morehead City and interested in
>> buying A Zenith 601. If anyone has one that I could visit to see and sit
>> in, I'd appreciate it.
>>
>> I'm going to be in Atlanta next week from the 17th through the 21st if
>> any one has one I could visit in the Atlanta area feel free to contact
>> me here or off list.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Woody Sulloway
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 7
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 05:13:46 AM PST US
>> From: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
>> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Like to see a 601 HD or XL
>>
>>
>> You could visit AMD in Eastman, Georgia (outside of Macon) and sit in one
>> of
>> their factory-built 601XL's. But it looks like it is about two hours from
>> Atlanta:
>>
>> "Directions from Atlanta to AMD in Eastman GA.
>>
>> Take I-75 South to Macon (one hour). Stay on I-75. Do not take the
>> by-pass
>> at Macon.
>> Take I-16 to highway 23 (10 min.). Exit #6
>> Take 23 South/East to Eastman (50 min.) "
>>
>> www.newplane.com
>>
>> -- Craig
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 8
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 06:14:30 AM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Contact Magazine
>> From: "ashontz" <ashontz@nbme.org>
>>
>>
>> Good for you. And other people actually enjoy building experimental
>> aircraft, hence
>> the seperate certification.
>>
>> [quote="j.e.tiethoff(at)hccnet.nl"]Well I'm NOT ! I believe in aircraft
>> engines,
>> NOT the middele age stuff (lycoming, big is not beautifull !) or
>> automotive
>> use. Rotax is my favourite. Designed for aircraft use, well built, mean
>> and
>> lean.
>>
>>
>> Met vriendelijke groet,
>>
>> Eric Tiethoff
>>
>> j.e.tiethoff@hccnet.nl (j.e.tiethoff@hccnet.nl)
>>
>> tel: 0031 35 6247726
>> fax: 0031 84 7208379
>> gsm: 0031 61 2365880
>>
>>>
>>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
>>> Van: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
>>> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] Namens
>>> n801bh@netzero.com
>>> Verzonden: dinsdag 9 oktober 2007 0:44
>>> Aan: zenith-list@matronics.com
>>> Onderwerp: Re: Contact Magazine
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I have received that magazine for a few years now. Good articles and
>>> pretty
>> honest in all the reviews they do on various auto engine conversions. I
>> am
>> a
>> BIG auto engine conversion believer YMMV.
>>>
>>> do not archive
>>>
>>>
>>> Ben Haas
>>> N801BH
>>> www.haaspowerair.com
>>>
>>> -- "ashontz" wrote:
>>>
>>> http://www.contactmagazine.com/contact1.html
>>>
>>> Does anyone receive this? This looks like what the old EAA
>>> Experimenter magazine
>> used to be before they stopped publishing it and instead started putting
>> on the new glossy ad filled rag.
>>>
>>> --------
>>> Andy Shontz
>>> CH601XL - Corvair
>>> www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=138813#138813
>>>
>>> ========================bsp; - The Zenith-List
>>> Em============================================
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>
>> Mijn Postvak In wordt beschermd door SPAMfighter
>> 1632 spam-mails zijn er tot op heden geblokkeerd.
>> Download de gratis SPAMfighter (http://www.spamfighter.com/lnl) vandaag
>> nog!
>>> [b]
>>
>>
>> --------
>> Andy Shontz
>> CH601XL - Corvair
>> www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139153#139153
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 9
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 06:35:30 AM PST US
>> From: MacDonald Doug <dougsnash@yahoo.com>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>>
>>
>> NASA is running some kind of Personal Aerial Vehicle
>> competition kind of like an X-Prize. The idea is that
>> it will be a first step toward a "Jettson's" world
>> where we have Aerial Vehicles instead of cars.
>>
>> Doug MacDonald
>> CH-701 Scratch Builder
>> NW Ontario, Canada
>>
>> --- Bob Unternaehrer <shilocom@mcmsys.com> wrote:
>>
>>> What is PAV, Bob U.
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: MacDonald Doug
>>> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>>> Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 8:28 AM
>>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion
>>> Discussion.
>>>
>>>
>>> <dougsnash@yahoo.com>
>>>
>>> One of the PAV competitors is finding this issue
>>> with
>>> GM. They initially got very good support from GM
>>> with
>>> the idea of using the LS series V8 but after a
>>> "Changing of the Guard" at GM, suddenly GM pulled
>>> their support. The PAV manufacturer says he is in
>>> discussions with Toyota now.
>>>
>>> Oh well, GM's loss on this high profile project.
>>>
>>> Doug MacDonald
>>> CH-701 Scratch builder
>>> NW Ontario
>>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 10
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 06:45:22 AM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>> From: "n85ae" <n85ae@yahoo.com>
>>
>>
>> Sounds like time to buy a heavy duty Kevlar Umbrella .... That plus
>> all the car parts flying around up there ...
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139161#139161
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 11
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 06:47:43 AM PST US
>> From: MacDonald Doug <dougsnash@yahoo.com>
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Hirth aircraft engines
>>
>>
>> If you want to start a really good "Scotchbrite" type
>> debate on another group, go to:
>>
>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/engines-ul/
>>
>> and ask some Hirth questions. There is quite an
>> active Rotax vs Hirth debate on that group.
>>
>> Doug MacDonald
>> CH-701 Scratch Builder
>> NW Ontario, Canada
>>
>>
>> --- Paul Mulwitz <psm@att.net> wrote:
>>
>>> <psm@att.net>
>>>
>>> Hi Martyn,
>>>
>>> That HIrth engine does sound too good to be true.
>>>
>>> This is the first I've heard of it, so I can't add
>>> to the information
>>> pool. I would like to ask you to relay any
>>> information you get back
>>> to this group, though. The weight and horsepower
>>> sound ideal for the
>>> 601 and perhaps even a little on the high power side
>>> for the 701.
>>>
>>> It would be great if we had another engine to add to
>>> the fray.
>>>
>>> Paul
>>> XL, fuselage, Jabiru 3300
>>> do not archive
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 12
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 06:49:35 AM PST US
>> From: <dredmoody@cox.net>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>>
>>
>> You mean that there are people out there who actually don't have their
>> own
>> airplanes
>> yet????
>>
>> Dred
>>
>> ---- MacDonald Doug <dougsnash@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> NASA is running some kind of Personal Aerial Vehicle
>>> competition kind of like an X-Prize. The idea is that
>>> it will be a first step toward a "Jettson's" world
>>> where we have Aerial Vehicles instead of cars.
>>>
>>> Doug MacDonald
>>> CH-701 Scratch Builder
>>> NW Ontario, Canada
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 13
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 08:20:10 AM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>> From: "Gig Giacona" <wr.giacona@suddenlink.net>
>>
>>
>> Welcome Joe, to the land of the groundless law suit, otherwise known as
>> the USA.
>> BUT, I never said they would would be found liable for the use of one of
>> their
>> engines in a homebuilt.
>>
>> There are vendors of parts out there that will not ship you their auto
>> parts if
>> they have reason to think you are putting them in an aircraft.
>>
>>
>> Joemotis(at)aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>> Come out of your shell man.
>>> On what farthest stretch of the imagination of liability do you think
>>> that
>> GM or whomever could sue you for using a device in an situation of your
>> own risk
>> and peril?I.E. way the heck out of their published design parameters??
>>> You had better not ever look at another fan belt because it might come
>>> off
>> and smite you.
>>> Jesus H. Farkin Christ.
>>>
>>> Joe Motis
>>> Do not archive
>>>
>>
>>
>> --------
>> W.R. "Gig" Giacona
>> 601XL Under Construction
>> See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139174#139174
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 14
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 08:42:22 AM PST US
>> From: William Dominguez <bill_dom@yahoo.com>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Sorry Guys it is another long winded
>> response
>>
>> The 582 is too weak for a 601. The failures in questions are from the 912
>> family
>> and some could have been caused by fuel starvation. It seems like the
>> Rotax
>> was the most common engine used in earlier Zodiacs so this could be the
>> reason
>> why there are more failures of Rotax in the NTSB accident database.
>>
>> William Dominguez
>> Zodiac 601XL Plans
>> Miami, Florida
>>
>> Graeme <graeme@coletoolcentre.com.au> wrote: I would be surprised
>> that the
>> majority of engine failures would be behind Rotax engines.
>> Do people use 582 two strokes in 601 I would assume so as they have
>> about
>> the
>> same performance as the old 2200 Jabiru.
>> The two strokes are definatly not as reliable as the 912 four stroke .
>> If they are 912 failures are fuel starvation problems classed as an
>> engine failure???
>>
>> Graeme Cairns
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: William Dominguez
>> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 5:05 AM
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Sorry Guys it is another long winded
>> response
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> I did what you described but only for engines flying in Zodiac 601
>> airframes.
>> The majority of Zodiacs accidents where engine failure was the cause
>> happened
>> with Rotax engines. However, this is not valid statistic since Rotax
>> could
>> be the most common engine used in Zodiacs. There where a couple of
>> Lycoming,
>> a couple of Subarus but not Corvairs or Jabirus. But then again,
>> without
>> knowing how many of them have been flying, this is inconclusive.
>>
>> If I get some time one of these days I'll get this as failures as
>> percentage
>> of engine flying in Zodiacs.
>>
>> William Dominguez
>> Zodiac 601XL Plans
>> Miami Florida.
>>
>> steveadams <dr_steve_adams@yahoo.com> wrote: --> Zenith-List
>> message
>> posted by: "steveadams"
>>
>>
>> bill_dom(at)yahoo.com wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Can you show me
>>
>> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------
>> Free Release Date: 9/10/2007 4:43 PM
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 15
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 09:30:01 AM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: ZINC CHROMATE:UPDATE
>> From: "GLJSOJ1" <gljno10@HOTMAIL.COM>
>>
>>
>> HI GUYS
>> JUST CAME BACK FROM GETTING MY "LAST" CAN OF ZINC CHROMATE FROM THE
>> LOCAL
>> BOAT
>> REPAIR SHOP AND WAS TOLD THAT THE MANUFACTURE (TEMPO) IS NO LONGER MAKING
>> IT.
>> THERE IS ANOTHER COMPANY (MOLLER) (MS) THAT WILL BE PICKING IT UP. ANY
>> WAY
>> MY NEXT PROJECT WON'T USE ZINC CHROMATE.
>>
>> GLENN
>>
>> --------
>> 601XL BUILDER
>> ALMOST DONE
>> CHESAPEAKE VA
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139185#139185
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 16
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 09:32:48 AM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Like to see a 601 HD or XL
>> From: "GLJSOJ1" <gljno10@HOTMAIL.COM>
>>
>>
>> HI WOODY
>>
>> IF YOU ARE EVER CLOSE TO CHESAPEAKE MY 601 IS WHERE YOU CAN SIT IN IT,
>> AND
>> I HAVE
>> A FRIEND JORDAN THAT HAS A ZODIAC FLYING. AT THE AIRPORT.
>>
>> GLENN
>>
>> --------
>> 601XL BUILDER
>> ALMOST DONE
>> CHESAPEAKE VA
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139186#139186
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 17
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 09:50:52 AM PST US
>> From: MacDonald Doug <dougsnash@yahoo.com>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>>
>>
>> An example of this is when I went to the local Ski-Doo
>> dealer to by some recoil parts for my 503 Rotax
>> ultrlight engine. He said "These aren't going on an
>> aircraft, are they?" Wink Wink.
>>
>> He explained that Ski-Doo forbade them to sell Ski-Doo
>> parts for ultralight aircraft engines. Makes no sense
>> to me but those are the rules.
>>
>> Doug MacDonald
>> NW Ontario, Canada
>>
>> --- Gig Giacona <wr.giacona@suddenlink.net> wrote:
>>
>>> <wr.giacona@suddenlink.net>
>>>
>>> Welcome Joe, to the land of the groundless law suit,
>>> otherwise known as the USA. BUT, I never said they
>>> would would be found liable for the use of one of
>>> their engines in a homebuilt.
>>>
>>> There are vendors of parts out there that will not
>>> ship you their auto parts if they have reason to
>>> think you are putting them in an aircraft.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 18
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 10:02:31 AM PST US
>> From: "Carlos Sa" <carlossa52@gmail.com>
>> Subject: Zenith-List: access panels
>>
>> Hello, all
>>
>>
>> I want to install access panels on the (CH601-HD) wing tip, forward of
>> the
>> spar.
>>
>> I would like these to be fairly large (diameter of about 25 cm / 10
>> inches),
>> so I can install and service the strobe later.
>> I would like to use nut plates and flat had screws, so it has a nice
>> appearance.
>>
>> Can someone recommend parts (part number, source) and tools for the job?
>> It seems such a simle thing to make, but I stared at the AS&S catalog
>> last
>> night and couldn't figure which parts / tools to use.
>> I figure dimpling will be necessary, but have no such tools at this time.
>>
>>
>> Thanks in advance for any suggestions.
>>
>>
>> Carlos
>> CH601-HD, plans
>> Montreal, Canada
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 19
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 10:30:36 AM PST US
>> From: John Davis <johnd@data-tech.com>
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> I'm just wrapping up my electrical work and am getting close to putting
>> on the front skin over the panel area. Riveting it per the factory seems
>> to be a poor choice since I wont have any easy access to the rear of the
>> panel.
>>
>> So it seems like the options are:
>>
>> A) Install nutplates or similar and make the entire skin removable. As I
>> have a QB kit their are already 90+ rivet holes that would have to be
>> fitted, so thats a lot of work.
>>
>> B) Install the skin permanently but add a couple of access panels on the
>> top. Seems like several folks on the list are doing this. My only
>> concern with this approach would be water leaking under the access
>> panel. Any ideas as to how to prevent/avoid this issue ?
>>
>> Your thoughts/Ideas ?
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>> John Davis
>> Burnsville, NC
>> 601XL QB - Jab 3300
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 20
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 11:15:11 AM PST US
>> From: <paulrod36@msn.com>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Vixen file with holder
>>
>> I got one of Airparts's vixen files back when they were carrying the
>> conversions (shortened to about 2" and with a large washer for a handle
>> epoxied on top), and I like it. Works very well. One other thing to do
>> with it, though, if you're making one, is to hone down the sharp edges
>> of the teeth a little bit, to keep it from trying to bit the sheet
>> metal. A session with some valve grinding compound on a sheet of glass
>> would reduce the biting ability, and polish the (now) sliding surface.
>>
>> Paul Rodriguez
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Larry Winger<mailto:larrywinger@gmail.com>
>> To: zenith-list@matronics.com<mailto:zenith-list@matronics.com>
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 9:14 AM
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Vixen file with holder
>>
>>
>> I put my 10" vixen file in the vise and snapped it off to the length I
>> needed. I then hot glued it to a piece of wood. It has worked great
>> for 700 hours of building.
>>
>> Larry Winger
>> 601XL/Corvair scratchbuilding
>>
>>
>> On 10/9/07, Robert Schoenberger
>> <hrs1@frontiernet.net<mailto:hrs1@frontiernet.net>> wrote:
>> <hrs1@frontiernet.net <mailto:hrs1@frontiernet.net>>
>>
>> List . . . there was a post a while back by someone who had obtained
>> a
>> short (1.5") Vixen file with a handle attached. The name of the
>> supplying company indicated in the e-mail was Airparts, but they
>> don't
>> carry this item. Can anyone supply me with info on where one can
>> buy a
>> fairly short Vixen file with handle attached.to<http://attached.to/>
>> the top side? One
>> catalog listed Vixen files that were flexible - what is that all
>> about.
>>
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List<http://www.matronics.com/N
>> avigator?Zenith-List>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 21
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 11:58:37 AM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: access panels
>> From: "DaveG601XL" <david.m.gallagher@ge.com>
>>
>>
>> Carlos,
>>
>> The only supplies you will need are MS21075L3 nut plates, MS20426AD3-2
>> rivets (2
>> per nut plate) and a screw AN525-10R7 per nut plate. Tools will be a
>> drill
>> and snips to cut the holes needed. You do not need to dimple the rivet
>> heads
>> if you do not want. I have countersunk mine. You can use a hammer and
>> flat punch
>> to set the rivets if you do not have a rivet gun. Here is a picture of
>> the
>> hole in my XL wing tip showing the strobe pack inside. It also makes a
>> good
>> inspection hole.
>>
>> Good Luck,
>>
>> --------
>> David Gallagher
>> 601 XL, tail and wings completed,
>> fueslage almost done, engine next.
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139223#139223
>>
>>
>> Attachments:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com//files/leftwing_33_204.jpg
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 22
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 12:02:53 PM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Bending the main gear (and the nose gear fork)
>> From: "tigermiller" <tigermiller1595@msn.com>
>>
>>
>> I'll get a write up and pics of the jig I'm using and get it on the
>> fileshare thing
>> for this group. Can't get it done right away, so give me a few days.
>> Dave
>>
>> --------
>> Dave Miller
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139224#139224
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 23
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 12:23:29 PM PST US
>> From: Jaybannist@cs.com
>> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>> John,
>>
>> I have posted drawings of my access panel. Let me know if you would like
>> me to
>> e-mail them to you. I set the doubler in silicone sealant. When I
>> install
>> the
>> cover plate, I will run a bead of silicone around the exposed part of the
>> doubler
>> and cover that with Saran before temporarily fastening the cover. When
>> the silicone has cured, I will remove the cover and Saran and have a
>> "permanent"
>> gasket.
>>
>> Jay in Dallas 601XL N2630J
>> Do not archive
>>
>>
>> John Davis <johnd@data-tech.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>Hi All,
>>>
>>>I'm just wrapping up my electrical work and am getting close to putting
>>>on the front skin over the panel area. Riveting it per the factory seems
>>>to be a poor choice since I wont have any easy access to the rear of the
>>>panel.
>>>
>>>So it seems like the options are:
>>>
>>>A) Install nutplates or similar and make the entire skin removable. As I
>>>have a QB kit their are already 90+ rivet holes that would have to be
>>>fitted, so thats a lot of work.
>>>
>>>B) Install the skin permanently but add a couple of access panels on the
>>>top. Seems like several folks on the list are doing this. My only
>>>concern with this approach would be water leaking under the access
>>>panel. Any ideas as to how to prevent/avoid this issue ?
>>>
>>>Your thoughts/Ideas ?
>>>
>>>Thanks in advance,
>>>John Davis
>>>Burnsville, NC
>>>601XL QB - Jab 3300
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 24
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 12:34:47 PM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Wing Spars Done! Bolts?
>> From: "Kafka, Jeff" <jkafka@trojanuv.com>
>>
>> More than 3 years after starting them (there was a long break), my
>> plans-built wing spars are done. For me this was a big deal because
>> dealing with all those solid rivets (without a rivet gun) appeared to be
>> one of the bigger hurdles in the way of eventual completion.
>>
>> To celebrate my minor success, I decide to get a photo of me posing
>> behind the assembled structural "guts" of my 601XL-to-be. While
>> assembling, I was unable to find direction in the plans or manual about
>> the way the twelve bolts connecting the outboard spars to the center
>> spar should face. Does it matter if the bolt heads are on the forward or
>> aft side of the spars? Should one alternate them? What about the bolt at
>> the root of the outboard spars and the ones in the center spar (in the
>> plans the latter appear to have the bolt heads on the forward side).
>>
>> On to finish the remaining rear ribs!
>>
>> Jeff Kafka
>> 601XL Plans
>> Tail, Flaps, Ailerons, Spars Done
>> Working on Ribs & Assembling Wings
>> Do Not Archive
>>
>>
>> This message (including any attachments) contains confidential
>> and/or proprietary information intended only for the addressee.
>> Any unauthorized disclosure, copying, distribution or reliance on
>> the contents of this information is strictly prohibited and may
>> constitute a violation of law. If you are not the intended
>> recipient, please notify the sender immediately by responding to
>> this e-mail, and delete the message from your system. If you
>> have any questions about this e-mail please notify the sender
>> immediately.
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 25
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 01:05:27 PM PST US
>> From: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Wing Spars Done! Bolts?
>>
>>
>> I put my bolts in with the nuts exposed on the front of the spar for
>> easy inspection.
>>
>> Kafka, Jeff wrote:
>>>
>>> To celebrate my minor success, I decide to get a photo of me posing
>>> behind the assembled structural guts of my 601XL-to-be. While
>>> assembling, I was unable to find direction in the plans or manual about
>>> the way the twelve bolts connecting the outboard spars to the center
>>> spar should face. Does it matter if the bolt heads are on the forward or
>>> aft side of the spars? Should one alternate them? What about the bolt at
>>> the root of the outboard spars and the ones in the center spar (in the
>>> plans the latter appear to have the bolt heads on the forward side).
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Bryan Martin
>> Zenith 601XL N61BM
>> Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive
>> Do Not Archive
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 26
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 01:14:37 PM PST US
>> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Wing Spars Done! Bolts?
>> From: "Beckman, Rick" <Rick.Beckman@atk.com>
>>
>>
>> More than 3 years after starting them (there was a long break), my
>> plans-built wing spars are done. For me this was a big deal because
>> dealing with all those solid rivets (without a rivet gun) appeared to be
>> one of the bigger hurdles in the way of eventual completion.
>>
>> To celebrate my minor success, I decide to get a photo of me posing
>> behind the assembled structural "guts" of my 601XL-to-be. While
>> assembling, I was unable to find direction in the plans or manual about
>> the way the twelve bolts connecting the outboard spars to the center
>> spar should face. Does it matter if the bolt heads are on the forward or
>> aft side of the spars? Should one alternate them? What about the bolt at
>> the root of the outboard spars and the ones in the center spar (in the
>> plans the latter appear to have the bolt heads on the forward side).
>>
>> On to finish the remaining rear ribs!
>>
>> Jeff Kafka
>>
>>
>> My tech counselor told me that bolts go back, in, and down.
>>
>> Happy
>> Building!!!!!
>>
>>
>> Rick Beckman
>>
>>
>> Do not archive
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 27
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 01:20:45 PM PST US
>> From: "milreed" <milreed@wildblue.net>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: CH701 Usable Fuel
>>
>> Kevin
>> Gordon Poer has a small tank behind the seat on the right side of his
>> 701. He runs a 85 HP Continental for power.
>> When he first flew the craft he did so with gravity feed only from the
>> wing tanks down behind the seat to the floor. During some moderate
>> maneuvers he got an air lock in the line and resultant engine failure. I
>> was just looking at his new setup at the Placerville airport last week.
>> Now he has a mechanical and electric fuel pumps as well as that small
>> aux tank which is supplied by the right wing tank only. No more fuel
>> problemos !
>> Mil
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 28
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 01:23:08 PM PST US
>> From: MacDonald Doug <dougsnash@yahoo.com>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Wing Spars Done! Bolts?
>>
>>
>> Hey Jeff, sounds like a major milestone, congrats.
>>
>> Keep in mind that I am a 701 builder and have no
>> actual data to base this advice on but standard
>> aircraft procedure dictates that the heads of the
>> bolts will be forward. That way if the nut came off,
>> the slipstream would help hold things together.
>>
>> Hope this helps in this application.
>>
>> Doug MacDonald
>> CH-701 Scratch Builder
>>
>> NW Ontario, Canada
>>
>> DO not archive
>> --- "Kafka, Jeff" <jkafka@trojanuv.com> wrote:
>>
>>> More than 3 years after starting them (there was a
>>> long break), my
>>> plans-built wing spars are done. For me this was a
>>> big deal because
>>> dealing with all those solid rivets (without a rivet
>>> gun) appeared to be
>>> one of the bigger hurdles in the way of eventual
>>> completion.
>>>
>>> To celebrate my minor success, I decide to get a
>>> photo of me posing
>>> behind the assembled structural "guts" of my
>>> 601XL-to-be. While
>>> assembling, I was unable to find direction in the
>>> plans or manual about
>>> the way the twelve bolts connecting the outboard
>>> spars to the center
>>> spar should face. Does it matter if the bolt heads
>>> are on the forward or
>>> aft side of the spars? Should one alternate them?
>>> What about the bolt at
>>> the root of the outboard spars and the ones in the
>>> center spar (in the
>>> plans the latter appear to have the bolt heads on
>>> the forward side).
>>>
>>> On to finish the remaining rear ribs!
>>>
>>> Jeff Kafka
>>> 601XL Plans
>>> Tail, Flaps, Ailerons, Spars Done
>>> Working on Ribs & Assembling Wings
>>> Do Not Archive
>>
>>
>> Don't let your dream ride pass you by. Make it a reality with Yahoo!
>> Autos.
>> http://autos.yahoo.com/index.html
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 29
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 01:45:55 PM PST US
>> From: "Schloss" <Bluebird@Townsqr.com>
>> Subject: Fw: Zenith-List: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>> I have seen sheet metal screws used instead of rivets.
>>
>> phil
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "John Davis" <johnd@data-tech.com>
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 12:14 PM
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> I'm just wrapping up my electrical work and am getting close to putting
>>> on the front skin over the panel area. Riveting it per the factory seems
>>> to be a poor choice since I wont have any easy access to the rear of the
>>> panel.
>>>
>>> So it seems like the options are:
>>>
>>> A) Install nutplates or similar and make the entire skin removable. As I
>>> have a QB kit their are already 90+ rivet holes that would have to be
>>> fitted, so thats a lot of work.
>>>
>>> B) Install the skin permanently but add a couple of access panels on the
>>> top. Seems like several folks on the list are doing this. My only
>>> concern with this approach would be water leaking under the access
>>> panel. Any ideas as to how to prevent/avoid this issue ?
>>>
>>> Your thoughts/Ideas ?
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance,
>>> John Davis
>>> Burnsville, NC
>>> 601XL QB - Jab 3300
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 30
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 01:58:12 PM PST US
>> From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com>
>> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Bending the main gear (and the nose gear fork)
>>
>>
>> Brandon Tucker used to be a regular contributor, but only lingers from
>> time
>> to time as he is now enjoying his plane. He did many posts on bending
>> your
>> own gear. In sum up, he felt it was fairly simple with just a hydraulic
>> pipe
>> bender from Harbor Freight.
>>
>>
>> You can read more at the ch601 websight. I am also sure he would be happy
>> to
>> discuss his process with anyone who emailed him directly
>> (btucke73@yahoo.com).
>>
>> Gary Boothe
>> Cool, CA
>> 601 HDSTD, WW Conversion 90% done,
>> Tail done, wings done, working on c-section
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 31
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 02:19:02 PM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument Panel Access
>> From: "Gig Giacona" <wr.giacona@suddenlink.net>
>>
>>
>> I'm using J-Nuts and screws all the way around the top skin.
>>
>> http://www.mcmaster.com/nav/enter.asp?pagetype=ships&visitorinput=wr.giacona%40suddenlink.net&retrieveoutcome=FAILED_TO_IDENTIFY&inputtype=&search=&resultsContext=ORDNAV&resultsQueryStr=loademailform%3Dtrue
>>
>>
>> SkipperClyde wrote:
>>> I have seen sheet metal screws used instead of rivets.
>>>
>>> phil
>>>
>>>
>>> ---
>>
>>
>> --------
>> W.R. "Gig" Giacona
>> 601XL Under Construction
>> See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139260#139260
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 32
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 02:42:21 PM PST US
>> From: VideoFlyer@aol.com
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>> In a message dated 10/10/2007 , wr.giacona@suddenlink.net writes:
>>
>> <<<<I'm using J-Nuts and screws all the way around the top skin>>>
>>
>> I did the same thing.
>>
>> Dave
>> N618PZ
>> 601XL/Corvair
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 33
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 02:57:30 PM PST US
>> From: David Downey <planecrazydld@yahoo.com>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: XL Landing Gear
>>
>> In case anyone was referring to my comments about bending the Zodiac
>> gear,
>> I am not building anymore due to a family crisis. I have bent heavy plate
>> b
>> efore in the past though and it is not to be feared. Make sure that the
>> edg
>> es of the blank are perfectly smooth (and preferrably radiused), and that
>> t
>> he part is located repeatably and you will be fine. =0A=0AI do not have
>> any
>> photos of previous setups - I apologize.=0A =0ADave Downey=0AHarleysville
>> (SE) PA=0A100 HP Corvair=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom:
>> Deb
>> o Cox <sky_ranger161@yahoo.com>=0ATo: zenith-list@matronics.com=0ASent:
>> Wed
>> nesday, October 10, 2007 5:50:59 AM=0ASubject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: XL
>> Land
>> ing Gear=0A=0A=0AHey Dave,=0A =0AThat sounds like exactly what I was
>> thinki
>> ng would work. I'm still a long way from bending mine, but would love to
>> se
>> e the pics and read the details of your method when you make it happen.
>> Goo
>> d luck with it!=0A =0ADebo Cox=0AScratch-built XL/Corvair=0ANags Head, NC
>> -======================
>> ============0A=0A=0A =0A_______________________
>> _____________________________________________________________=0ALooking
>> for
>> a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo!
>> FareChase.=0Ah
>> ttp://farechase.yahoo.com/
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 34
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 03:07:14 PM PST US
>> From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk@alltel.net>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>>
>>
>> At the rate I'm going, I might live to see one!!!
>> do not archive
>> Bill Naumuk
>> HDS Fuse/Corvair
>> Townville, Pa
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: <dredmoody@cox.net>
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 9:49 AM
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>>
>>
>>>
>>> You mean that there are people out there who actually don't have their
>>> own
>>> airplanes yet????
>>>
>>> Dred
>>>
>>> ---- MacDonald Doug <dougsnash@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> NASA is running some kind of Personal Aerial Vehicle
>>>> competition kind of like an X-Prize. The idea is that
>>>> it will be a first step toward a "Jettson's" world
>>>> where we have Aerial Vehicles instead of cars.
>>>>
>>>> Doug MacDonald
>>>> CH-701 Scratch Builder
>>>> NW Ontario, Canada
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 35
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 03:07:50 PM PST US
>> From: "Graeme" <graeme@coletoolcentre.com.au>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>> I think the savanna has a good idea for instrument panel.
>> The hole instrument panel panel is a removable, screwed (probably with
>> rubber insulation for vibration) to
>> a riveted in frame for easy access.
>>
>> Graeme Cairns
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "John Davis" <johnd@data-tech.com>
>> Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 3:14 AM
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> I'm just wrapping up my electrical work and am getting close to putting
>>> on
>>> the front skin over the panel area. Riveting it per the factory seems to
>>> be a poor choice since I wont have any easy access to the rear of the
>>> panel.
>>>
>>> So it seems like the options are:
>>>
>>> A) Install nutplates or similar and make the entire skin removable. As I
>>> have a QB kit their are already 90+ rivet holes that would have to be
>>> fitted, so thats a lot of work.
>>>
>>> B) Install the skin permanently but add a couple of access panels on the
>>> top. Seems like several folks on the list are doing this. My only
>>> concern
>>> with this approach would be water leaking under the access panel. Any
>>> ideas as to how to prevent/avoid this issue ?
>>>
>>> Your thoughts/Ideas ?
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance,
>>> John Davis
>>> Burnsville, NC
>>> 601XL QB - Jab 3300
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> 269.14.7/1062 - Release Date: 10/10/2007 5:11 PM
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 36
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 03:10:15 PM PST US
>> From: Jaybannist@cs.com
>> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>> Are you guys aware that the cowling overlaps the forward top skin?
>> Therefore,
>> you will have to remove the cowling to remove that skin for access. At
>> least for
>> the WW cowling, there is a tapered channel that fastens to the nose bowl
>> and
>> the top skin to support and locate the nose bowl. Seems like having to
>> remove
>> the cowling kinda' defeats the purpose, or at least makes access a pretty
>> involved
>> process. Hopefully, you will never have to access it and then difficulty
>> becomes a moot point.
>>
>> Jay in Dallas 601XL N2630J
>> Do not archive
>>
>>
>> VideoFlyer@aol.com wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>In a message dated 10/10/2007 , wr.giacona@suddenlink.net writes:
>>>
>>><<<<I'm using J-Nuts and screws all the way around the top skin>>>
>>>
>>>I did the same thing.
>>>
>>>Dave
>>>N618PZ
>>>601XL/Corvair
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 37
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 03:12:13 PM PST US
>> From: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Wing Spars Done! Bolts?
>>
>>
>> There are two guidelines for installing bolts. A. Install the bolt such
>> that gravity or aerodynamic forces will tend to keep the bolt in place
>> in case the nut falls off. B: Install the bolt such that the nut can be
>> easily inspected for security.
>>
>> Since the spar bolts are mounted horizontally inside the fuselage, I
>> chose to make the nuts easy to inspect. I also did this with the bolts
>> through the rear spar. I installed these bolts with the nuts visible
>> from the rear when the flaps are lowered.
>> --
>> Bryan Martin
>> Zenith 601XL N61BM
>> Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive
>> Do Not Archive
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 38
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 03:49:51 PM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument Panel Access
>> From: "GLJSOJ1" <gljno10@HOTMAIL.COM>
>>
>>
>> HI JOHN
>> WHAT I DID WAS MARK WHERE THE CANOPY TOUCHED THE FORWARD TOP SKIN AND
>> MADE
>> A SET
>> OF ACCESS HOLES ON BOTH SIDES JUST SMALLER SO I COULD PUT ANCHOR NUTS AND
>> SCREWS
>> TO HOLD IT IN PLACE. THEN I MADE A LARGE COVER TO COVER BOTH SIDES.
>> IT'S
>> NOT TOTAL ACCESS, BUT I CAN AT LEAST GET BEHIND THE PANEL
>>
>> GLENN
>>
>> --------
>> 601XL BUILDER
>> ALMOST DONE
>> CHESAPEAKE VA
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139283#139283
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 39
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 04:56:16 PM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: CH701 Usable Fuel
>> From: "kmccune" <kmccune@somtel.net>
>>
>>
>> I like the shut off vale idea, makes take off a little less exciting!
>>
>> I knew that I needed a fuel pump as the outlet would have to be almost
>> level with
>> the engine. Why doe it feed off of only one of the wing tanks?
>>
>> I also have learned that the guy with the Hawg-Air site (Hog-Air?) has 14
>> gallon
>> wing tanks for sale. Now I still like the stock aluminum ones... but
>> they
>> could
>> be larger, say 12 gallons each.
>>
>> Kevin
>>
>> --------
>> Kevin
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139292#139292
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 40
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 04:59:55 PM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Bending the main gear (and the nose gear fork)
>> From: "kmccune" <kmccune@somtel.net>
>>
>>
>> Ch 601 website? :D
>>
>> Kevin
>>
>> --------
>> Kevin
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139293#139293
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 41
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 05:07:08 PM PST US
>> From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com>
>> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Bending the main gear (and the nose gear
>> fork)
>>
>>
>> www.ch601.org
>>
>> Gary Boothe
>> Cool, CA
>> 601 HDSTD, WW Conversion 90% done,
>> Tail done, wings done, working on c-section
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kmccune
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 5:00 PM
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Bending the main gear (and the nose gear fork)
>>
>>
>> Ch 601 website? :D
>>
>> Kevin
>>
>> --------
>> Kevin
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139293#139293
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 42
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 05:30:42 PM PST US
>> From: "Gary Ray" <davgray@sbcglobal.net>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>> The tapered top center section of the cowl for the WW nose bowl has
>> hinges
>> that allow access to the engine compartment from the top. There are only
>> about four screws in the center that hold this to the top forward skin
>> and
>> about 6 to 8 screws that hold it to the center top section of the nose
>> bowl.
>> This part can be removed in under 1 minute.
>>
>> When you remove the top center section of the cowl you expose the
>> firewall
>> forward to the nose bowl while the top forward skin covers the firewall
>> backward to the instrument panel. With a nutplated system I can open my
>> aircraft from the instrument panel to the nosebowl in less than 3 minutes
>> and replace it in under 5 minutes in two pieces.
>>
>> Total work to dimple and rivet nutplates was about 2 to 3 hours extra
>> work
>> and it makes it easy access when wiring, troubleshooting, repair,
>> inspections or modifications. I have removed it at least 15 times during
>> construction and during the first year. I did mine with # 8 floating
>> nutplates, #8 machine screws made flush with a dimple die in my rivet
>> squeezer.
>> The only problem I had was setting rivets in curved sections of the
>> firewall
>> flange. Pulling the nutplate down with a screw to make the nutplate
>> conform
>> to the curve prior to setting the rivets made it accurate and easy. Also
>> avoid crimped sections of the firewall when placing the nutplates.
>>
>> Gary Ray
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: <Jaybannist@cs.com>
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 6:09 PM
>> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Are you guys aware that the cowling overlaps the forward top skin?
>> Therefore, you will have to remove the cowling to remove that skin for
>> access. At least for the WW cowling, there is a tapered channel that
>> fastens
>> to the nose bowl and the top skin to support and locate the nose bowl.
>> Seems like having to remove the cowling kinda' defeats the purpose, or at
>> least makes access a pretty involved process. Hopefully, you will never
>> have
>> to access it and then difficulty becomes a moot point.
>>>
>>> Jay in Dallas 601XL N2630J
>>> Do not archive
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 43
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 05:43:48 PM PST US
>> From: "Bob Unternaehrer" <shilocom@mcmsys.com>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>> Caution here Jay. I did the silicone thing on a Cessna once and never
>> could get them to quite sticking. Tried powder, which worked the best,
>> but every annual they were stuck tight. Bob U.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Jaybannist@cs.com
>> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 2:22 PM
>> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>> John,
>>
>> I have posted drawings of my access panel. Let me know if you would
>> like me to e-mail them to you. I set the doubler in silicone sealant.
>> When I install the cover plate, I will run a bead of silicone around the
>> exposed part of the doubler and cover that with Saran before
>> temporarily fastening the cover. When the silicone has cured, I will
>> remove the cover and Saran and have a "permanent" gasket.
>>
>> Jay in Dallas 601XL N2630J
>> Do not archive
>>
>>
>> John Davis <johnd@data-tech.com> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >Hi All,
>> >
>> >I'm just wrapping up my electrical work and am getting close to
>> putting
>> >on the front skin over the panel area. Riveting it per the factory
>> seems
>> >to be a poor choice since I wont have any easy access to the rear of
>> the
>> >panel.
>> >
>> >So it seems like the options are:
>> >
>> >A) Install nutplates or similar and make the entire skin removable.
>> As I
>> >have a QB kit their are already 90+ rivet holes that would have to be
>>
>> >fitted, so thats a lot of work.
>> >
>> >B) Install the skin permanently but add a couple of access panels on
>> the
>> >top. Seems like several folks on the list are doing this. My only
>> >concern with this approach would be water leaking under the access
>> >panel. Any ideas as to how to prevent/avoid this issue ?
>> >
>> >Your thoughts/Ideas ?
>> >
>> >Thanks in advance,
>> >John Davis
>> >Burnsville, NC
>> >601XL QB - Jab 3300
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 44
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 06:22:58 PM PST US
>> From: Jaybannist@cs.com
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>> Bob, Thanks for the heads up. I just might have to rethink my sealing
>> method.
>> Maybe a thin foam tape? - Jay
>>
>> do not archive
>>
>> "Bob Unternaehrer" <shilocom@mcmsys.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Caution here Jay. I did the silicone thing on a Cessna once and never
>>>could get
>> them to quite sticking. Tried powder, which worked the best, but every
>> annual
>> they were stuck tight. Bob U.
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: Jaybannist@cs.com
>>> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>>> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 2:22 PM
>>> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Instrument Panel Access
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> John,
>>>
>>> I have posted drawings of my access panel. Let me know if you would
>>> like me
>> to e-mail them to you. I set the doubler in silicone sealant. When I
>> install
>> the cover plate, I will run a bead of silicone around the exposed part of
>> the
>> doubler and cover that with Saran before temporarily fastening the
>> cover.
>> When
>> the silicone has cured, I will remove the cover and Saran and have a
>> "permanent"
>> gasket.
>>>
>>> Jay in Dallas 601XL N2630J
>>> Do not archive
>>>
>>>
>>> John Davis <johnd@data-tech.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> >
>>> >Hi All,
>>> >
>>> >I'm just wrapping up my electrical work and am getting close to
>>> putting
>>> >on the front skin over the panel area. Riveting it per the factory
>>> seems
>>> >to be a poor choice since I wont have any easy access to the rear of
>>> the
>>> >panel.
>>> >
>>> >So it seems like the options are:
>>> >
>>> >A) Install nutplates or similar and make the entire skin removable. As
>>> I
>>> >have a QB kit their are already 90+ rivet holes that would have to be
>>> >fitted, so thats a lot of work.
>>> >
>>> >B) Install the skin permanently but add a couple of access panels on
>>> the
>>> >top. Seems like several folks on the list are doing this. My only
>>> >concern with this approach would be water leaking under the access
>>> >panel. Any ideas as to how to prevent/avoid this issue ?
>>> >
>>> >Your thoughts/Ideas ?
>>> >
>>> >Thanks in advance,
>>> >John Davis
>>> >Burnsville, NC
>>> >601XL QB - Jab 3300
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 45
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 07:19:43 PM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Bending the main gear (and the nose gear fork)
>> From: "kmccune" <kmccune@somtel.net>
>>
>>
>> Thanks..should have guessed!
>>
>>
>> Kevin
>>
>> --------
>> Kevin
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139319#139319
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 46
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 07:29:09 PM PST US
>> From: "Southern Reflections" <purplemoon99@bellsouth.net>
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>> Any chance of getting a couple picts? I'am doing a lot on the panel,and
>> have to take the whole dash top off every time It's a real pain. I was
>> thinking of a over lap where the cowl would be atached to a short section
>> that was pop riveted to the top of the fire wall and could ovre lap
>> inside
>> the plane with screws etc. Joe N101HD 601XL/RAM
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Gary Ray" <davgray@sbcglobal.net>
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 8:19 PM
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>>
>>>
>>> The tapered top center section of the cowl for the WW nose bowl has
>>> hinges
>>> that allow access to the engine compartment from the top. There are
>>> only
>>> about four screws in the center that hold this to the top forward skin
>>> and
>>> about 6 to 8 screws that hold it to the center top section of the nose
>>> bowl.
>>> This part can be removed in under 1 minute.
>>>
>>> When you remove the top center section of the cowl you expose the
>>> firewall
>>> forward to the nose bowl while the top forward skin covers the firewall
>>> backward to the instrument panel. With a nutplated system I can open my
>>> aircraft from the instrument panel to the nosebowl in less than 3
>>> minutes
>>> and replace it in under 5 minutes in two pieces.
>>>
>>> Total work to dimple and rivet nutplates was about 2 to 3 hours extra
>>> work
>>> and it makes it easy access when wiring, troubleshooting, repair,
>>> inspections or modifications. I have removed it at least 15 times
>>> during
>>> construction and during the first year. I did mine with # 8 floating
>>> nutplates, #8 machine screws made flush with a dimple die in my rivet
>>> squeezer.
>>> The only problem I had was setting rivets in curved sections of the
>>> firewall
>>> flange. Pulling the nutplate down with a screw to make the nutplate
>>> conform
>>> to the curve prior to setting the rivets made it accurate and easy.
>>> Also
>>> avoid crimped sections of the firewall when placing the nutplates.
>>>
>>> Gary Ray
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: <Jaybannist@cs.com>
>>> To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 6:09 PM
>>> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument Panel Access
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Are you guys aware that the cowling overlaps the forward top skin?
>>> Therefore, you will have to remove the cowling to remove that skin for
>>> access. At least for the WW cowling, there is a tapered channel that
>>> fastens
>>> to the nose bowl and the top skin to support and locate the nose bowl.
>>> Seems like having to remove the cowling kinda' defeats the purpose, or
>>> at
>>> least makes access a pretty involved process. Hopefully, you will never
>>> have
>>> to access it and then difficulty becomes a moot point.
>>>>
>>>> Jay in Dallas 601XL N2630J
>>>> Do not archive
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 47
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 07:42:37 PM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: access panels
>> From: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon@comcast.net>
>>
>>
>> Carlos,
>>
>> I just capped the wing tips but did not add any access holes. I figure
>> the inspections
>> can be made through the lights on the left wing and drilling out the
>> rivets and re-riveting every so often will save weight. YMMV
>>
>> --------
>> Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI
>> Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-)
>> http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139326#139326
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 48
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 07:56:41 PM PST US
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Wing Spars Done! Bolts?
>> From: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon@comcast.net>
>>
>>
>> Congratulations on reaching that milestone. Here is a picture of my
>> solid
>> riveting
>> machine.
>>
>> --------
>> Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI
>> Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-)
>> http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139327#139327
>>
>>
>> Attachments:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com//files/fp01122006a0001k_151.jpg
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 49
>> ____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 08:54:39 PM PST US
>> From: "T. Graziano" <tonyplane@bellsouth.net>
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument Panel Access
>>
>> John,
>>
>> One of the BEST decisions I made was to make the fwd top skin removable.
>> I used rivnuts and 6-32 SS screws. Others have used nutplates and J
>> clips?? etc.
>>
>> With the skin removed, you have access not only to the instrument panel,
>> but to the inside fwd firewall, rudder peddles and cables, steering
>> rods, brakes, etc.
>>
>> Also, I have removal of the top skin part of my annual condition
>> inspection to check wiring, and other areas under the instrument panel
>> that would be a real problem to inspect with the skin in place.
>>
>> I also have a removable panel aft of the canopy "line" on the top skin.
>> On it, I have provisions to mount 1 or 2 Garmin GPSs (One for the pilots
>> side and one for my spouse's side) and have also mounted a vertical
>> compass card.. Coming through this panel I have compass lighting wiring
>> and hard wiring for the GPS's through grommeted holes that have a
>> slots leading to the holes from the edge of the panel.. When I remove
>> the top skin, I remove this panel first and can leave the wiring intact
>> by passing it through the slot.
>>
>> You can see my instrument panel at
>> http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/6-photo79.html (Zenith Photo Library
>> #79) as originally finished, but since I have added some "Stuff" , such
>> as a switch and a blinking light to show "Wig-wag" taxi/landing lights,
>> another switch to use either Garmin GPS to drive my AP, a light to show
>> when I have the aux fuel pump on, a Tru-Track T&B, and ...
>>
>> I really like what you can easily do with your airplane when it is
>> "Experimental". If I had to drill out the top skin rivets to gain
>> access to the instrument panel aft areas, it would not be as much fun
>> and also I believe would result in a real mess to clean up.
>>
>> Tony Graziano
>> XL/Jab3300; N493TG; 304 hrs
>> ---------------
>> Subject: Instrument Panel Access
>> From: John Davis (johnd@data-tech.com)
>> Date: Wed Oct 10 - 10:30 AM
>>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> I'm just wrapping up my electrical work and am getting close to putting
>> on the front skin over the panel area. Riveting it per the factory seems
>>
>> to be a poor choice since I wont have any easy access to the rear of the
>>
>> panel.
>>
>> So it seems like the options are:
>>
>> A) Install nutplates or similar and make the entire skin removable. As I
>>
>> have a QB kit their are already 90+ rivet holes that would have to be
>> fitted, so thats a lot of work.
>>
>> B) Install the skin permanently but add a couple of access panels on the
>>
>> top. Seems like several folks on the list are doing this. My only
>> concern with this approach would be water leaking under the access
>> panel. Any ideas as to how to prevent/avoid this issue ?
>>
>> Your thoughts/Ideas ?
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>> John Davis
>> Burnsville, NC
>> 601XL QB - Jab 3300
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 2
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:03:46 AM PST US
> From: Mike Bauman <squidtpd@HOTMAIL.COM>
> Subject: Zenith-List: 601xl plans
>
>
> Does anyone have a set of zodiac 601xl plans they would like to sell? Thx,
> Mike
> _________________________________________________________________
> Climb to the top of the charts!- Play Star Shuffle:- the word scramble
> challenge with star power.
> http://club.live.com/star_shuffle.aspx?icid=starshuffle_wlmailtextlink_oc
> t
>
> ________________________________ Message 3
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:44:06 AM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Hirth Engine
> From: "secatur" <appraise1@bigpond.com>
>
>
> Thanks...By the time you convert to $Aud,pay freight, and GST..you're
> looking at
> $16,000 ++++
> Cheapest old Bert had when I checked 6 months ago was $14 2nd hand
> All reinforcing my point!
> I'm happy with my 0 hours" EA-81T" FI, Cam, Mod Intake manifold, RFI
> Redrive, Warp
> 72" 3 blade (New),All up 84 kg Total cost to date $8200
> I did look at Hirth, they really look nice and I know of one operational
> one which
> has not given much trouble to date...but it seems to be the exception
> rather
> than the rule!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139523#139523
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 4
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 02:37:11 AM PST US
> From: "Eric Tiethoff" <j.e.tiethoff@hccnet.nl>
> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 701 with Jab 3300
>
>
> What's wrong with the proven 912 in a 701 ? (Exept for low weight, good
> fuel
> economy, well documented, reliable).
>
>
> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
> Van: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] Namens Stanley Challgren
> Verzonden: vrijdag 12 oktober 2007 0:47
> Aan: Zenith List
> Onderwerp: Zenith-List: 701 with Jab 3300
>
>
> List:
>
> I am at the stage where I need to make a decision on the engine to
> use in my 701. I had the Jab 3300 (A very early one) in my 601 and
> did have cooling problems below 95 mph. That is the upper limit of
> the envelope for the 701 so I am wondering if anyone has a Jab 3300
> (current version) in a flying 701 and, if so, are you having any
> cooling problems?
>
> Stan
> N701VG (Reserved)
>
>
> --
> Mijn Postvak In wordt beschermd door SPAMfighter.
> 1632 spam-mails zijn er tot op heden geblokkeerd.
> Download de gratis SPAMfighter via deze link:
> http://www.spamfighter.com/lnl
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 5
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 03:48:36 AM PST US
> From: MacDonald Doug <dougsnash@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>
>
> Yes but bt be very careful with that one. There is
> "Aircraft Cable" and then there is cable that meets a
> Mil spec and is designed for use in an aircraft. BIG
> difference in quality.
>
> Doug MacDonald
> CH-701 Scratch Builder
> NW Ontario, Canada
>
> --- Dan <dwilde@clearwire.net> wrote:
>
>> <dwilde@clearwire.net>
>>
>> Orchards Supply has aircraft cable for sale by the
>> foot. They also have
>> a sign that says "not for aircraft use".
>>
>> Dan Wilde
>
>
> Catch up on fall's hot new shows on Yahoo! TV. Watch previews, get
> listings, and
> more!
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 6
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 04:00:25 AM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
> From: "Mike Hoffman" <mhoffman9@tampabay.rr.com>
>
>
> Several years ago I tried to buy wheel bearings for my PA 28R200 from
> Detroit Ball
> Bearing Company and was refused. They told me they would not sell to the
> aviation
> community because of liability issues. I came back the next day and when
> they asked what they were for, I told them they were for a home made go
> cart
> and they sold them to me.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139534#139534
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 7
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 04:39:35 AM PST US
> From: Trainnut01@aol.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>
> Joe
>
> Problem is if you do run over someone the ensuing law suit will probably
> include you, the car manufacturer, the dealer that sold you the car, the
> salesman, the contractor that painted the crosswalk, the traffic light
> installer,
>
> ect,ect,ect.
>
> My company was a co-defendant with Chrysler Corp and a local Jeep dealer a
> few years ago when a Wrangler on which I had installed an air conditioner
> was
>
> hit from behind at a traffic light. The argument was that with the air
> conditioner on the vehicle it would not accelerate as fast as it did
> before. DUH!
>
> The court finally ruled the lawsuit was "without merit" mostly thanks to
> some heavyweight lawyers and
> expert witnesses provided by Chrysler.
>
> So see the system works. I got justice. Price for my defense $8,000.00.
> Initial profit on the air conditioner $187.00.
>
> Chrysler lost money. Dealer lost money. I lost money. Plaintiff lost
> money.
> Guess who made money:Chrysler's attorneys, Dealer's attorneys' My
> attorneys,
> Plaintiff's attorney.
>
> In addition that dealer will no longer sell a new Wrangler with
> aftermarket
> air. They now include the air in the price of the vehicle and issue you a
> refund check for the air conditioner which just happens to be the exact
> amount
>
> that I charge to install the air. This takes them out of the loop they
> hope.
> Chrysler no longer sells aftermarket air conditions for their vehicles.
> The
> Chrysler air conditioner is still available from aftermarket suppliers
> (re-packagers) but the price has doubled.
>
> Sorry seems my quick comment has turned into a rant about something that
> American's understand anyway. For our friends around the world who do not
> understand this lawsuit stupidity, I hope you never do! But if you would
> really
>
> would like to try we can look into exporting some attorneys for you.
>
> Carroll
>
> do not archive
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 8
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 05:46:44 AM PST US
> From: "Southern Reflections" <purplemoon99@bellsouth.net>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601xl plans
>
> I have a set ,Joe N101HD
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Mike Bauman
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 4:00 AM
> Subject: Zenith-List: 601xl plans
>
>
> Does anyone have a set of zodiac 601xl plans they would like to sell?
> Thx, Mike
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -----
> Climb to the top of the charts! Play Star Shuffle: the word scramble
> challenge with star power. Play Now!
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 9
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 05:50:08 AM PST US
> From: "Ken Arnold" <arno7452@bellsouth.net>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 welded kit parts
>
> The tanks are also pressure tested for leaks in the weld before
> releasing to the builders. They are as good as one can get.
> Ken
>
> CH701 91%
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: RClaggf4u@aol.com
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 9:13 PM
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 welded kit parts
>
>
> Kevin,
> The parts come welded from Zenith. Just clean, paint and install. The
> Tanks are welded aluminum, they have a couple of welders that do a
> remarkable job. I watched them both at the open house and to say I was
> impressed is an understatemet. Truly outstanding work.
> Wayne
> 701 plans building.
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> --> http://forums.matronics.com
> ==========
>
> ________________________________ Message 10
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 06:37:32 AM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
> From: "n85ae" <n85ae@yahoo.com>
>
>
> Ben,
>
> When I call Summit Racing, I say - "Yes, I'd like to order part numbers
> this, that and the other. My credit card number is ..." They ship me the
> part. I have NEVER had them refuse anything, and everything I have
> ever bought from them went into my plane.
>
> Is it. possibly that you do it like this? ""Yes, I'd like to order part
> numbers
> this, that and the other. My credit card number is ... OH, AND BY THE
> IT IS TO BE USED IN AN EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT."
>
> Because if you are, that might be the reason. :) Anyway, how does it
> come up, what it's for anyway??? You would almost have to go out of
> your way to get the order taking folks to ask. Especially from Summit
> because they have a set of cubicals with order takers, who answer a
> bank of phones ...
>
> Jeff
>
>
> [quote="n801bh(at)netzero.com"]I can say for fact that Summit Racing
> supply will
> not sell me anything if I even mention " experimental aircraft". I have
> got
> that response from several of their order takers so it is a protocol they
> must
> stress on their employees. I called one day to order about 1000.00 bucks
> worth
> of MSD ignition stuff for my toy and they refused to sell it to me. I then
> called
> Jegs high performance and they not only were hip on the idea of an auto
> engine in a plane the guy actually went to my website while I was on the
> phone
> with him and he came back with a "GEEZ" that is KOOL..... Both vendors
> were
> within a few cents of each other on price and from then on Jegs got all my
> business,
> and still does.? Just my two cents worth...
> do not archive
>
> Ben Haas
> N801BH
> www.haaspowerair.com
>
> -- "n85ae" wrote:
>
> This sounds like myth to me, I worked in auto parts all through high
> school, and briefly after the military. I can say for sure, anybody I ever
> met in the auto parts business would have said just one thing if they
> thought something was going on a plane, and that would be - COOL!
>
> Not only that, but auto parts people are for the most part very very
> disconnected from aviation, I can't imagine anybody worrying about
> being sued. It is possible you could find a couple who were possibly
> worried ?about being sued, but they would indeed be the rare exception.
>
> The only company I have ever come across that had any concern about
> anything remotely close to this is Supertrapp who put a "Not for Aviation
> Use" note on some of their muffler's.
>
> I suppose you could conceivably, walk into the local auto parts and
> verbalize your aviation intents, in just such a way that they might decide
> to not sell the parts to you ... But after you leave they might be
> calling
> 911 as well ...
>
> Jeff
>
>
> Gig Giacona wrote:
>
>> Welcome Joe, to the land of the groundless law suit, otherwise known as
>> the
> USA. BUT, I never said they would would be found liable for the use of one
> of
> their engines in a homebuilt.
>>
>> There are vendors of parts out there that will not ship you their auto
>> parts
> if they have reason to think you are putting them in an aircraft.
>>
>>
>>
>> Joemotis(at)aol.com wrote:
>> >
>> > ?Come out of your shell man.
>> > On what farthest stretch of the imagination of liability do you think
>> that
> GM or whomever could sue you for using a device in an situation of your
> own
> risk and peril?I.E. way the heck out of their published design
> parameters??
>> > You had better not ever look at another fan belt because it might
>> come off
> and smite you.
>> > Jesus H. Farkin Christ.
>> >
>> > Joe Motis
>> > Do not archive
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/view================================================================================================bsp;
> - NEW MATRONICS WEB
> =======================================================
>
>> [b]
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139557#139557
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 11
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:07:17 AM PST US
> From: "LRM" <lrm@skyhawg.com>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 with Jab 3300
>
>
> That's easy, Price!!!!!!! It and the Jab are greatly over priced.
> Weight's
> good on both. I do agree with well documented. The 912 has more ADs than
> any other engine out there. That's documentation. Larry
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Eric Tiethoff" <j.e.tiethoff@hccnet.nl>
> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 4:35 AM
> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 701 with Jab 3300
>
>
>> <j.e.tiethoff@hccnet.nl>
>>
>>
>> What's wrong with the proven 912 in a 701 ? (Exept for low weight, good
>> fuel
>> economy, well documented, reliable).
>>
>>
>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
>> Van: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] Namens Stanley Challgren
>> Verzonden: vrijdag 12 oktober 2007 0:47
>> Aan: Zenith List
>> Onderwerp: Zenith-List: 701 with Jab 3300
>>
>>
>>
>> List:
>>
>> I am at the stage where I need to make a decision on the engine to
>> use in my 701. I had the Jab 3300 (A very early one) in my 601 and
>> did have cooling problems below 95 mph. That is the upper limit of
>> the envelope for the 701 so I am wondering if anyone has a Jab 3300
>> (current version) in a flying 701 and, if so, are you having any
>> cooling problems?
>>
>> Stan
>> N701VG (Reserved)
>>
>>
>> --
>> Mijn Postvak In wordt beschermd door SPAMfighter.
>> 1632 spam-mails zijn er tot op heden geblokkeerd.
>> Download de gratis SPAMfighter via deze link:
>> http://www.spamfighter.com/lnl
>>
>>
>> --
>> 10/11/2007 3:09 PM
>>
>>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 12
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:10:49 AM PST US
> From: "LRM" <lrm@skyhawg.com>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>
>
> Just order what ever you want on-line. I've done it many times and yet
> have
> had the computer ask if it's going on airplane. Just remember this,
> "Don't
> ask a question you don't want answered."
>
> Larry
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "n85ae" <n85ae@yahoo.com>
> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 8:36 AM
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>
>
>>
>> Ben,
>>
>> When I call Summit Racing, I say - "Yes, I'd like to order part numbers
>> this, that and the other. My credit card number is ..." They ship me the
>> part. I have NEVER had them refuse anything, and everything I have
>> ever bought from them went into my plane.
>>
>> Is it. possibly that you do it like this? ""Yes, I'd like to order part
>> numbers
>> this, that and the other. My credit card number is ... OH, AND BY THE
>> IT IS TO BE USED IN AN EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT."
>>
>> Because if you are, that might be the reason. :) Anyway, how does it
>> come up, what it's for anyway??? You would almost have to go out of
>> your way to get the order taking folks to ask. Especially from Summit
>> because they have a set of cubicals with order takers, who answer a
>> bank of phones ...
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>
>> [quote="n801bh(at)netzero.com"]I can say for fact that Summit Racing
>> supply will not sell me anything if I even mention " experimental
>> aircraft". I have got that response from several of their order takers so
>> it is a protocol they must stress on their employees. I called one day to
>> order about 1000.00 bucks worth of MSD ignition stuff for my toy and they
>> refused to sell it to me. I then called Jegs high performance and they
>> not
>> only were hip on the idea of an auto engine in a plane the guy actually
>> went to my website while I was on the phone with him and he came back
>> with a "GEEZ" that is KOOL..... Both vendors were within a few cents of
>> each other on price and from then on Jegs got all my business, and still
>> does.? Just my two cents worth...
>> do not archive
>>
>> Ben Haas
>> N801BH
>> www.haaspowerair.com
>>
>> -- "n85ae" wrote:
>>
>> This sounds like myth to me, I worked in auto parts all through high
>> school, and briefly after the military. I can say for sure, anybody I
>> ever
>> met in the auto parts business would have said just one thing if they
>> thought something was going on a plane, and that would be - COOL!
>>
>> Not only that, but auto parts people are for the most part very very
>> disconnected from aviation, I can't imagine anybody worrying about
>> being sued. It is possible you could find a couple who were possibly
>> worried ?about being sued, but they would indeed be the rare exception.
>>
>> The only company I have ever come across that had any concern about
>> anything remotely close to this is Supertrapp who put a "Not for Aviation
>> Use" note on some of their muffler's.
>>
>> I suppose you could conceivably, walk into the local auto parts and
>> verbalize your aviation intents, in just such a way that they might
>> decide
>> to not sell the parts to you ... But after you leave they might be
>> calling
>> 911 as well ...
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>
>> Gig Giacona wrote:
>>
>>> Welcome Joe, to the land of the groundless law suit, otherwise known as
>>> the USA. BUT, I never said they would would be found liable for the use
>>> of one of their engines in a homebuilt.
>>>
>>> There are vendors of parts out there that will not ship you their auto
>>> parts if they have reason to think you are putting them in an aircraft.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Joemotis(at)aol.com wrote:
>>> >
>>> > ?Come out of your shell man.
>>> > On what farthest stretch of the imagination of liability do you
>>> think
>>> that GM or whomever could sue you for using a device in an situation of
>>> your own risk and peril?I.E. way the heck out of their published design
>>> parameters??
>>> > You had better not ever look at another fan belt because it might
>>> come off and smite you.
>>> > Jesus H. Farkin Christ.
>>> >
>>> > Joe Motis
>>> > Do not archive
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/view================================================================================================bsp;
>> - NEW MATRONICS WEB
>> =======================================================
>>
>>> [b]
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139557#139557
>>
>>
>> --
>> 10/11/2007 3:09 PM
>>
>>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 13
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:19:00 AM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
> From: "Gig Giacona" <wr.giacona@suddenlink.net>
>
>
> See there's the problem. You are under the mistaken belief that
> discrimination
> is against the law in the USA. It isn't. Only certain types of
> discrimination
> are illegal and those are based on age, sex, race, religion, disability
> and national
> origin.
>
> While many of our wives and friends might think our aircraft building
> activities
> rise to the level of religion and certainly rise to the level of
> disability
> the law, sadly does not.
>
>
> Joemotis(at)aol.com wrote:
>> I feel that if anyone were not to sell you anything because "they" do not
>> want
> to for whatever reason and then sell it to the next person who walks
> through
> the door is discrimination by the dictionary definition. Where would the
> line be? No sale of anything that could be used on your aircraft would
> start
> at about "alternator and go to at least z clips.
>>
>
>
> --------
> W.R. "Gig" Giacona
> 601XL Under Construction
> See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139565#139565
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 14
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:40:42 AM PST US
> From: Jeyoung65@aol.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>
>
> In a message dated 10/12/2007 10:20:10 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
> wr.giacona@suddenlink.net writes:
>
> Only certain types of discrimination are illegal and those are based on
> age,
> sex, race, religion, disability and national origin.
>
>
> This should be "USA laws REQUIRE discrimination based on age, sex, race,
> religion, disability and national origin" Jerry of GA
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 15
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 09:24:32 AM PST US
> From: "Bob Unternaehrer" <shilocom@mcmsys.com>
> Subject: Zenith-List: Motor mount
>
> I'm building my motor mount for the corvair engine. I have Zenith
> drawing #6-YE-1 which seems a little confusing as to which way the
> engine should be offset. Their note says "offset to the left for
> lycoming engine" and the drawing shows the thrust line offset to the
> RIGHT. I'm planning on building a square motor mount,,,,except I will
> put a 1" spacer between the left hand 2 support arms when located in the
> fixture. Then when mounted on the airplane WITHOUT the spacers the
> motor mount will swing ,,,or offset to the Left. Can anyone confirm
> this is the corect way to offset the motor mount and also does the
> corvair rotate counter clockwise when setting in the pilots
> seat,,,,opposite of the Lycomings.
>
> Blue Skies
> Bob Unternaehrer
> shilocom@mcmsys.com
>
> ________________________________ Message 16
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 10:20:46 AM PST US
> From: Terry Fogelson <t_fogelson@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Zenith-List: ch750
>
>
> Looks as if there is at least one ch750.
>
> Dubbert Roger
> Model: STOL CH 750 Dubbert Roger STOL CH 750
> Year built: 2007
> Serial Number (C/N): 7-6640
> Mode S Code: 52416140
> Aircraft Type: Fixed wing single engine
> Amateur-Built: Yes
> Number of Seats: 2
> Number of Engines: 1
> Engine Type: Reciprocating
> Engine Manufacturer and Model: Cont Motor O-200A
>
> Owner (FAA)
> Registration Type: Individual
> Address: Mexico, MO 65265
> United States
> Region: Central
>
> Top
> Status (FAA)
> Certification Class: Experimental
> Certification Issued: 2007-03-06
> Air Worthiness Test: 2007-08-24
> Last Action Taken: 2007-03-06
> Current Status: Valid
>
>
> Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search
> that gives answers, not web links.
> http://mobile.yahoo.com/mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 17
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 10:48:25 AM PST US
> From: Bob Duns <rduns@sasktel.net>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Motor mount
>
> Blue Skies
> Bob U
>
> When I built a motor mount for 601HD (Corvair), WW advised that the tray
> is angled
> down 1 degree at the nose. The tail of the motor is offset 1/2 degree to
> the right. I presume these angles were based on his 601XL which is
> similar tot
> he 061HD firewall. I have not flown yet so can't confirm whether these
> numbers
> work for me but WW has many hours on his 601XL with similar motor mount.
> I also have other numbers for location of motor mount tray from in front
> of the
> firewall if you need them.
>
> Bob D
> 601HD Corvair
> Melfort, SK
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Bob Unternaehrer
> To: Zenith List
> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 9:44 AM
> Subject: Zenith-List: Motor mount
>
>
> I'm building my motor mount for the corvair engine. I have Zenith
> drawing #6-YE-1
> which seems a little confusing as to which way the engine should be
> offset.
> Their note says "offset to the left for lycoming engine" and the drawing
> shows the thrust line offset to the RIGHT. I'm planning on building a
> square
> motor mount,,,,except I will put a 1" spacer between the left hand 2
> support
> arms when located in the fixture. Then when mounted on the airplane
> WITHOUT the
> spacers the motor mount will swing ,,,or offset to the Left. Can anyone
> confirm
> this is the corect way to offset the motor mount and also does the corvair
> rotate counter clockwise when setting in the pilots seat,,,,opposite of
> the
> Lycomings.
>
> Blue Skies
> Bob Unternaehrer
> shilocom@mcmsys.com
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 18
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 12:15:20 PM PST US
> From: Al Hays <alhays@hickoryhillfarmsheep.com>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Motor mount
>
>
> Bob & Blue Skies,
>
> I believe there will be a difference in offsetting to right or left
> depending on direction of prop rotation. Your info makes sense to me
> because the Corvair will normally rotate the prop counterclockwise (as
> viewed from the cockpit). My experience years ago with Cessnas,
> Pipers, and even T-Craft was needing some right rudder under full
> takeoff power. They were clockwise rotation on the props. It may be
> worth noting that the Corvair can be set up to run clockwise if
> preferred or needed.
>
> I'm still a ways off from the motor mount stage since am just starting
> fuselage now, but interested for future reference as am sure others
> are. I'll probably get my mount from WW unless my welding skills are
> much more practiced and improved by then. Thanks.
>
> Al
> 601XL Corvair
> Gore, VA
>
> On Oct 12, 2007, at 1:47 PM, Bob Duns wrote:
>
>> Blue Skies
>> Bob U
>>
>> When I built a motor mount for 601HD (Corvair), WW advised that the
>> tray is angled down 1 degree at the nose. The tail of the motor is
>> offset 1/2 degree to the right. I presume these angles were based on
>> his 601XL which is similar tot he 061HD firewall. I have not flown
>> yet so can't confirm whether these numbers work for me but WW has
>> many hours on his 601XL with similar motor mount. I also have other
>> numbers for location of motor mount tray from in front of the firewall
>> if you need them.
>>
>> Bob D
>> 601HD Corvair
>> Melfort, SK
>>
>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: Bob Unternaehrer
>>> To: Zenith List
>>> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 9:44 AM
>>> Subject: Zenith-List: Motor mount
>>>
>>> I'm building my motor mount for the corvair engine. I have Zenith
>>> drawing #6-YE-1 which seems a little confusing as to which way the
>>> engine should be offset. Their note says "offset to the left for
>>> lycoming engine" and the drawing shows the thrust line offset to the
>>> RIGHT. I'm planning on building a square motor mount,,,,except I
>>> will put a 1" spacer between the left hand 2 support arms when
>>> located in the fixture. Then when mounted on the airplane WITHOUT
>>> the spacers the motor mount will swing ,,,or offset to the Left.
>>> Can anyone confirm this is the corect way to offset the motor mount
>>> and also does the corvair rotate counter clockwise when setting in
>>> the pilots seat,,,,opposite of the Lycomings.
>>>
>>> Blue Skies
>>> Bob Unternaehrer
>>> shilocom@mcmsys.com
>>>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 19
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:14:53 PM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: ch750
> From: "LouB" <LBuckley122@comcast.net>
>
>
> Roger Dubbert is Zenith's Customer Service Representative and
> demonstration pilot.
> The CH750 in the FAA database is probably Zenith's first CH750. I hope
> progress
> is going well and with the price of Rotax, the continental 100A or 100D
> is welcome.
>
> Looking forward to reports from Zenith and independent reviewers. Hope
> that the
> CH750 will be matched hole construction.
>
> Cheers,
> Lou
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139629#139629
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 20
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 04:30:43 PM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Flight instructor and examiner wanted
> From: "mosquito56" <mosquito-56@HOTMAIL.COM>
>
>
> I am looking for a cfi to train me in a 601xl and help me get my spl
> license.
> I am willing to travel anywhere but remember it will start getting cold
> soon.
>
> mosquito-56@hotmail.com
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139648#139648
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 21
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 04:36:02 PM PST US
> From: "n801bh@netzero.com" <n801bh@netzero.com>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>
> I didn't volunteer any info up front. All I can figure is that they have
> my account flagged as possibly headed to an experimental plane and when
> they ask I don't lie. Life is too short to try to remember different st
> ories for different people..................
>
>
> 5ae" <n85ae@yahoo.com>
>
> Ben,
>
> When I call Summit Racing, I say - "Yes, I'd like to order part numbers
> this, that and the other. My credit card number is ..." They ship me the
>
> part. I have NEVER had them refuse anything, and everything I have
> ever bought from them went into my plane.
>
>
> Is it. possibly that you do it like this? ""Yes, I'd like to order part
> numbers
> this, that and the other. My credit card number is ... OH, AND BY THE
> IT IS TO BE USED IN AN EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT."
>
> Because if you are, that might be the reason. :) Anyway, how does it
>
> come up, what it's for anyway??? You would almost have to go out of
> your way to get the order taking folks to ask. Especially from Summit
> because they have a set of cubicals with order takers, who answer a
>
> bank of phones ...
>
> Jeff
>
>
> [quote="n801bh(at)netzero.com"]I can say for fact that Summit Racing s
> upply will not sell me anything if I even mention " experimental aircraf
> t". I have got that response from several of their order takers so it is
> a protocol they must stress on their employees. I called one day to ord
> er about 1000.00 bucks worth of MSD ignition stuff for my toy and they r
> efused to sell it to me. I then called Jegs high performance and they no
> t only were hip on the idea of an auto engine in a plane the guy actuall
> y went to my website while I was on the phone with him and he came back
> with a "GEEZ" that is KOOL..... Both vendors were within a few cents of
> each other on price and from then on Jegs got all my business, and stil
> l does.? Just my two cents worth...
>
> do not archive
>
> Ben Haas
> N801BH
> www.haaspowerair.com
>
> -- "n85ae" wrote:
>
>
> This sounds like myth to me, I worked in auto parts all through high
> school, and briefly after the military. I can say for sure, anybody I ev
> er
> met in the auto parts business would have said just one thing if they
> thought something was going on a plane, and that would be - COOL!
>
>
> Not only that, but auto parts people are for the most part very very
> disconnected from aviation, I can't imagine anybody worrying about
>
> being sued. It is possible you could find a couple who were possibly
>
> worried ?about being sued, but they would indeed be the rare exception.
>
> The only company I have ever come across that had any concern about
> anything remotely close to this is Supertrapp who put a "Not for Aviatio
> n
> Use" note on some of their muffler's.
>
> I suppose you could conceivably, walk into the local auto parts and
> verbalize your aviation intents, in just such a way that they might deci
> de
>
> to not sell the parts to you ... But after you leave they might be call
> ing
>
> 911 as well ...
>
>
> Jeff
>
>
> Gig Giacona wrote:
>
>> Welcome Joe, to the land of the groundless law suit, otherwise known
> as the USA. BUT, I never said they would would be found liable for the u
> se of one of their engines in a homebuilt.
>
>>
>
>> There are vendors of parts out there that will not ship you their aut
> o parts if they have reason to think you are putting them in an aircraft
> ..
>>
>
>>
>
>>
>
>> Joemotis(at)aol.com wrote:
>> >
>
>> > ?Come out of your shell man.
>> > On what farthest stretch of the imagination of liability do you th
> ink that GM or whomever could sue you for using a device in an situatio
> n of your own risk and peril?I.E. way the heck out of their published d
> esign parameters??
>> > You had better not ever look at another fan belt because it might
> come off and smite you.
>> > Jesus H. Farkin Christ.
>> >
>
>> > Joe Motis
>> > Do not archive
>> >
>
>>
>
>>
>
>>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/view=============
> =======================
> =======================
> =======================
> ==========bsp; - NEW MATRONICS WEB ===
> =======================
> =======================
> ===
>
>
>> [b]
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139557#139557
>
>
> =======================
> ==========
> =======================
> ==========
> =======================
> ==========
>
> ________________________________ Message 22
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 04:37:17 PM PST US
> From: "n801bh@netzero.com" <n801bh@netzero.com>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>
> I Never use my credit card number online....................
>
>
> wrote:
>
> Just order what ever you want on-line. I've done it many times and yet
> have
>
> had the computer ask if it's going on airplane. Just remember this, "Do
> n't
>
> ask a question you don't want answered."
>
> Larry
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: "n85ae" <n85ae@yahoo.com>
> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 8:36 AM
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>
>
>>
>> Ben,
>>
>> When I call Summit Racing, I say - "Yes, I'd like to order part number
> s
>> this, that and the other. My credit card number is ..." They ship me t
> he
>> part. I have NEVER had them refuse anything, and everything I have
>> ever bought from them went into my plane.
>>
>> Is it. possibly that you do it like this? ""Yes, I'd like to order par
> t
>
>> numbers
>> this, that and the other. My credit card number is ... OH, AND BY THE
>> IT IS TO BE USED IN AN EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT."
>>
>> Because if you are, that might be the reason. :) Anyway, how does it
>> come up, what it's for anyway??? You would almost have to go out of
>> your way to get the order taking folks to ask. Especially from Summit
>> because they have a set of cubicals with order takers, who answer a
>> bank of phones ...
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>
>> [quote="n801bh(at)netzero.com"]I can say for fact that Summit Racing
>
>
>> supply will not sell me anything if I even mention " experimental
>
>> aircraft". I have got that response from several of their order takers
> so
>
>> it is a protocol they must stress on their employees. I called one day
> to
>
>> order about 1000.00 bucks worth of MSD ignition stuff for my toy and t
> hey
>
>> refused to sell it to me. I then called Jegs high performance and they
> not
>
>> only were hip on the idea of an auto engine in a plane the guy actuall
> y
>
>> went to my website while I was on the phone with him and he came back
>
>
>> with a "GEEZ" that is KOOL..... Both vendors were within a few cents o
> f
>
>> each other on price and from then on Jegs got all my business, and sti
> ll
>
>> does.? Just my two cents worth...
>> do not archive
>>
>> Ben Haas
>> N801BH
>> www.haaspowerair.com
>>
>> -- "n85ae" wrote:
>>
>> This sounds like myth to me, I worked in auto parts all through high
>> school, and briefly after the military. I can say for sure, anybody I
> ever
>> met in the auto parts business would have said just one thing if they
>> thought something was going on a plane, and that would be - COOL!
>>
>> Not only that, but auto parts people are for the most part very very
>> disconnected from aviation, I can't imagine anybody worrying about
>> being sued. It is possible you could find a couple who were possibly
>> worried ?about being sued, but they would indeed be the rare exception
> ..
>>
>> The only company I have ever come across that had any concern about
>> anything remotely close to this is Supertrapp who put a "Not for Aviat
> ion
>> Use" note on some of their muffler's.
>>
>> I suppose you could conceivably, walk into the local auto parts and
>> verbalize your aviation intents, in just such a way that they might de
> cide
>> to not sell the parts to you ... But after you leave they might be
>
>> calling
>> 911 as well ...
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>
>> Gig Giacona wrote:
>>
>>> Welcome Joe, to the land of the groundless law suit, otherwise known
> as
>
>>> the USA. BUT, I never said they would would be found liable for the u
> se
>
>>> of one of their engines in a homebuilt.
>>>
>>> There are vendors of parts out there that will not ship you their au
> to
>
>>> parts if they have reason to think you are putting them in an aircraf
> t.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Joemotis(at)aol.com wrote:
>>> >
>>> > ?Come out of your shell man.
>>> > On what farthest stretch of the imagination of liability do you t
> hink
>
>>> that GM or whomever could sue you for using a device in an situation
> of
>
>>> your own risk and peril?I.E. way the heck out of their published des
> ign
>
>>> parameters??
>>> > You had better not ever look at another fan belt because it might
>
>
>>> come off and smite you.
>>> > Jesus H. Farkin Christ.
>>> >
>>> > Joe Motis
>>> > Do not archive
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/view============
> =======================
> =======================
> =======================
> ===========bsp;
>
>> - NEW MATRONICS WEB
>
>> =======================
> =======================
> =======
>>
>>> [b]
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139557#139557
>>
>>
>> --
>
>> 10/11/2007 3:09 PM
>>
>>
>
>
> =======================
> ==========
> =======================
> ==========
> =======================
> ==========
>
> ________________________________ Message 23
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 04:42:57 PM PST US
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flight instructor and examiner wanted
> From: xavierzr@HOTMAIL.COM
>
>
> We can help you. www.clubaerodeportivo.com pe my personal mail
> xvrzng@yahoo
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "mosquito56" <mosquito-56@HOTMAIL.COM>
>
> To:zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Zenith-List: Flight instructor and examiner wanted
>
>
> I am looking for a cfi to train me in a 601xl and help me get my spl
> license.
> I am willing to travel anywhere but remember it will start getting cold
> soon.
>
> mosquito-56@hotmail.com
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139648#139648
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 24
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 04:59:43 PM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: CH 701 flying
> From: "SockPuppet61" <sockpuppet61@gmail.com>
>
>
> Hi all,
>
> I've been looking into the 701 for a long time and am curious about pilot
> reports
> for it. Seen only one pretty long report on the Web.
>
> I'm particularly interested to know what its best glide speed is supposed
> to be,
> the glide ratio (other than "it's like a piano"), and if somebody has
> practices
> engine idle landings with it. How does it handle in stalls with various
> configurations?
>
> Also I've seen a couple of pictures on the web of 701s with a VW in it. If
> you've
> got one I'd like to know what kind of performance you get out of it.
>
> Thanks
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139651#139651
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 25
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 05:23:55 PM PST US
> From: "Clyde Barcus" <barcusc@comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flight instructor and examiner wanted
>
>
> Check the EAA web site, they have instructors listed by state and if they
> are willing to instruct in an experimental aircraft.
>
>
> Clyde Barcus
> 601 XL, Continental Powered
> Wings, Tail & Engine Complete
> Working on Fuselage
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "mosquito56" <mosquito-56@HOTMAIL.COM>
> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 6:29 PM
> Subject: Zenith-List: Flight instructor and examiner wanted
>
>
>>
>> I am looking for a cfi to train me in a 601xl and help me get my spl
>> license.
>> I am willing to travel anywhere but remember it will start getting cold
>> soon.
>>
>> mosquito-56@hotmail.com
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139648#139648
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 26
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 05:51:33 PM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: CH 701 flying
> From: "river1" <pedro@mycingular.blackberry.net>
>
>
> Google , Niol lockinton 701 , also look back into the list , Mark Townsend
> wrote
> about it .
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139657#139657
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 27
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 06:00:26 PM PST US
> From: Jeyoung65@aol.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flight instructor and examiner wanted
>
> mosquito-56, where are you located? There are places in Fla. for sure.
> Jerry
> of Ga
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 28
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:11:21 PM PST US
> From: "Bob Unternaehrer" <shilocom@mcmsys.com>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Motor mount
>
> Talked with ZAC and think I have it straight. The prop is on centerline
> as shown on the drawings and the rear of the engine mount is shifted as
> shown on the drawings. The note was confusing me but I think I
> understand now. I may need some dimensions from some of you who have
> built their own motor mount or from the WW mount. Bob U.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Bob Unternaehrer
> To: Zenith List
> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 10:44 AM
> Subject: Zenith-List: Motor mount
>
>
> I'm building my motor mount for the corvair engine. I have Zenith
> drawing #6-YE-1 which seems a little confusing as to which way the
> engine should be offset. Their note says "offset to the left for
> lycoming engine" and the drawing shows the thrust line offset to the
> RIGHT. I'm planning on building a square motor mount,,,,except I will
> put a 1" spacer between the left hand 2 support arms when located in the
> fixture. Then when mounted on the airplane WITHOUT the spacers the
> motor mount will swing ,,,or offset to the Left. Can anyone confirm
> this is the corect way to offset the motor mount and also does the
> corvair rotate counter clockwise when setting in the pilots
> seat,,,,opposite of the Lycomings.
>
> Blue Skies
> Bob Unternaehrer
> shilocom@mcmsys.com
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 29
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:11:21 PM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Splicing Tiny Wires...?
> From: "PatrickW" <pwhoyt@yahoo.com>
>
>
> How are you guys splicing thin wires together...?
>
> For example, where the 5 wires that come out of the aileron servo are
> spliced to
> another bundle of 5 wires.
>
> I'm guessing that twisting them together, soldering, and then covering
> with heat-shrink
> tubing is the way to go.
>
> Anybody doing anything different/better/easier...?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Patrick
> XL/Corvair
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139669#139669
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 30
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:23:13 PM PST US
> From: William Dominguez <bill_dom@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>
> And when you use your credit card in the store, where do you think it
> goes, on
> line. In fact, more credit card numbers are stolen from use at point of
> sale and
> corporate servers than from web site purchases. What you should never use
> is
> a debit card, better yet, don't have one.
>
> William Dominguez
> Zodiac 601XL Plans
> Miami, Florida
>
> do not archive
>
> "n801bh@netzero.com" <n801bh@netzero.com> wrote: I Never use my credit
> card number
> online....................
>
>
> wrote:
>
> Just order what ever you want on-line. I've done it many times and yet
> have
> had the computer ask if it's going on airplane. Just remember this,
> "Don't
> ask a question you don't want answered."
>
> Larry
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "n85ae" <n85ae@yahoo.com>
> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 8:36 AM
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Auto Conversion Discussion.
>
>
>>
>> Ben,
>>
>> When I call Summit Racing, I say - "Yes, I'd like to order part numbers
>> this, that and the other. My credit card number is ..." They ship me the
>> part. I have NEVER had them refuse anything, and everything I have
>> ever bought from them went into my plane.
>>
>> Is it. possibly that you do it like this? ""Yes, I'd like to order part
>> numbers
>> this, that and the other. My credit card number is ... OH, AND BY THE
>> IT IS TO BE USED IN AN EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT."
>>
>> Because if you are, that might be the reason. :) Anyway, how does it
>> come up, what it's for anyway??? You would almost have to go out of
>> your way to get the order taking folks to ask. Especially from Summit
>> because they have a set of cubicals with order takers, who answer a
>> bank of phones ...
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>
>> [quote="n801bh(at)netzero.com"]I can say for fact that Summit Racing
>> supply will not sell me anything if I even mention " experimental
>> aircraft". I have got that response from several of their order takers so
>> it is a protocol they must stress on their employees. I called one day to
>> order about 1000.00 bucks worth of MSD ignition stuff for my toy and they
>> refused to sell it to me. I then called Jegs high performance and they
>> not
>> only were hip on the idea of an auto engine in a plane the guy actually
>> went to my website while I was on the phone with him and he came back
>> with a "GEEZ" that is KOOL..... Both vendors were within a few cents of
>> each other on price and from then on Jegs got all my business, and still
>> does.? Just my two cents worth...
>> do not archive
>>
>> Ben Haas
>> N801BH
>> www.haaspowerair.com
>>
>> -- "n85ae" wrote:
>>
>> This sounds like myth to me, I worked in auto parts all through high
>> school, and briefly after the military. I can say for sure, anybody I
>> ever
>> met in the auto parts business would have said just one thing if they
>> thought something was going on a plane, and that would be - COOL!
>>
>> Not only that, but auto parts people are for the most part very very
>> disconnected from aviation, I can't imagine anybody worrying about
>> being sued. It is possible you could find a couple who were possibly
>> worried ?about being sued, but they would indeed be the rare exception.
>>
>> The only company I have ever come across that had any concern about
>> anything remotely close to this is Supertrapp who put a "Not for Aviation
>> Use" note on some of their muffler's.
>>
>> I suppose you could conceivably, walk into the local auto parts and
>> verbalize your aviation intents, in just such a way that they might
>> decide
>> to not sell the parts to you ... But after you leave they might be
>> calling
>> 911 as well ...
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>
>> Gig Giacona wrote:
>>
>>> Welcome Joe, to the land of the groundless law suit, otherwise known as
>>> the USA. BUT, I never said they would would be found liable for the use
>>> of one of their engines in a homebuilt.
>>>
>>> There are vendors of parts out there that will not ship you their auto
>>> parts if they have reason to think you are putting them in an aircraft.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Joemotis(at)aol.com wrote:
>>> >
>>> > ?Come out of your shell man.
>>> > On what farthest stretch of the imagination of liability do you
>>> think
>>> that GM or whomever could sue you for using a device in an situation of
>>> your own risk and peril?I.E. way the heck out of their published design
>>> parameters??
>>> > You had better not ever look at another fan belt because it might
>>> come off and smite you.
>>> > Jesus H. Farkin Christ.
>>> >
>>> > Joe Motis
>>> > Do not archive
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/view================================================================================================bsp;
>> - NEW MATRONICS WEB
>> =======================================================
>>
>>> [b]
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139557#139557
>>
>>
>> --
>> 10/11/2007
>> 3:===============================================================================================================================================
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 31
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:43:14 PM PST US
> From: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Splicing Tiny Wires...?
>
> I used small gauge crimp style insulated butt connectors from Radio
> Shack. They work fine if you have the right crimper for the job (also
> sold at Radio Shack).
>
> On Oct 12, 2007, at 10:10 PM, PatrickW wrote:
>
>>
>> How are you guys splicing thin wires together...?
>>
>> For example, where the 5 wires that come out of the aileron servo
>> are spliced to another bundle of 5 wires.
>>
>> I'm guessing that twisting them together, soldering, and then
>> covering with heat-shrink tubing is the way to go.
>>
>> Anybody doing anything different/better/easier...?
>>
>
>
> --
> Bryan Martin
> N61BM, CH 601 XL,
> RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
> do not archive.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 32
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 08:50:46 PM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...?
> From: "DaveG601XL" <david.m.gallagher@ge.com>
>
>
> Same here. I have been using d-sub computer style connectors from Radio
> Shack.
> Get your magnifying glass out!
>
> Good luck,
>
> --------
> David Gallagher
> 601 XL, tail and wings completed,
> fueslage almost done, engine next.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139680#139680
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 33
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 08:56:24 PM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...?
> From: "GLJSOJ1" <gljno10@HOTMAIL.COM>
>
>
> HI PATRICK
>
> I ALSO USED CRIMPS TO SPLICE THOSE TINY WIRES. I USED THE RED WHICH I
> BELIEVE
> IS 22-18G WIRE, WHILE I THINK THESE WIRES ARE 24 G. I HAVE HAD SOME OF
> THESE
> RED TERMINALS ON THESE WIRES COME OFF, SO I AM RETHINKING THEM. ALSO
> RADIO SHACK
> SELLS A SMALLER YELLOW BUTT JOINT CONNECTOR FOR WIRES 26 TO 22 G. YOU
> CAN'T
> DISCONNECT THESE ONCE THEY ARE CRIMPED THOUGH.
>
> GLENN
>
> --------
> 601XL BUILDER
> ALMOST DONE
> CHESAPEAKE VA
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139682#139682
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 34
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 09:10:03 PM PST US
> From: Paul Mulwitz <psm@ATT.NET>
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...?
>
>
> At 08:49 PM 10/12/2007, you wrote:
>>Same here. I have been using d-sub computer style connectors from
>>Radio Shack. Get your magnifying glass out!
>
> I wonder how well miniature connectors like the D-sub work for 16 AWG
> wires. They are usually used for 22 AWG and smaller wires.
>
> I have been using automotive spade connectors crimped onto the Tefzel
> aircraft wires. I like the ones that come with full plastic covers
> and tend to tie them together with lacing tape.
>
> Paul
> XL Fuselage
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 35
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 09:51:10 PM PST US
> From: craig@craigandjean.com
> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Flight instructor and examiner wanted
>
>
> Dragonfly Aviation in Santa Rosa, CA (in the wine country north of San
> Francisco) offers Sport Pilot instruction in a 601XL. Just down the
> road from Quality Sport Planes in Cloverdale.
>
> http://www.dragonflyaviation.com/
>
> There is also the League of Extraordinary Aviators in Arizona allthough
> at one point their 601XL was down for a while.
>
> http://www.leaviators.com/
>
> For something 601XL-like consider St Charles Flying Service and
> training in an Evector SportsStar. This is where I soloed.
>
> http://www.stcharlesflyingsvs.com/lightsport.php
>
> -- Craig
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 36
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 10:25:57 PM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Flight instructor and examiner wanted
> From: "mosquito56" <mosquito-56@HOTMAIL.COM>
>
>
> Thanx much for the info. I will start calling Monday. Heading for EAA
> meeting this
> weekend. Eaa site does not list by aircraft and I really need the zodiac
> as
> I am currently building one.
> Don
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139693#139693
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 37
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 10:33:05 PM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a
> million
> From: "mosquito56" <mosquito-56@HOTMAIL.COM>
>
>
> I am just getting to the interesting parts of the plane, Instrument Panel
> and fwf.
> I will shoot out a couple of the questions I wrote down from today. These
> are in no logical, if I were logical I would be building a bar, not an
> airplane,
> order.
>
> 1. Ags ingtiions system. Do the locks work on the 601xl? What is a good
> Ignition
> switch? Does the ignition switch come with the jab3300 fwf?
> 2. How can I make it so the hobbs meter only runs when the engine is
> running? If
> you've ever left your ignition on you'll understand this one.
> 3. Dynon ems120, do you need a seperate fuel sender or is the resistance
> all that
> is needed. What do you think of Dynon in general?
> 4. Any thoughts on Grand Rapids efis?
> Thanx much
>
> Don
> N601NV reserved
> Starting fuse
> Laredo, Tx
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139694#139694
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 38
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 10:40:11 PM PST US
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Splicing Tiny Wires...?
> From: "mosquito56" <mosquito-56@HOTMAIL.COM>
>
>
> I am curious about using Radio Shack in an airplane. While I am not
> suggesting
> the quality is bad, I have to question the quality of Radio Shack in
> general?
> I highly recommend this page, I go alot of nice info and sites for
> electrical
> work.
> http://mybearhawk.com/finish/electrical1.html, page 5 had the connectors
> your talking about.
> Don
> 601xl fuse
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139695#139695
>
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: some flying pics of N427JV "Rivet" |
Look's like you did a great job,Juan Congralations on 'Rivet's frist flight.
Joe N101HD 601XL/RAM
----- Original Message -----
From: "Juan Vega" <amyvega2005@earthlink.net>
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 1:08 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: some flying pics of N427JV "Rivet"
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: motor mount dimension for corvair on XL |
On mine, using the WW XL mount, the crankshaft center line is 6" above
the top of the bed mount.
The front of the black WW prop hub to the center of the fromt mount hole
is 8-3/32".
>From the center of the front mount hole horizontally to the firewall at
the top motor mounts is 25" (actually 25" to the front face of the
flange of the Forward Top Stiffener (6B7-1) at the rivet line, with the
rivet line being in line with the top motor mount centers).
The rear mount holes of the bed are horizontally 14-5/8" from the face
of the firewall at the top of the mount spool washers that are welded on
top of the bed rails. I believe this later measurement is the one WW
recommends for proper fore/aft engine placement, but I forget what
exactly he says that dimension should be (I'm thinking 14-1/2"??).
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Unternaehrer
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 11:32 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: motor mount dimension for corvair on XL
<<<Could anybody give me a dimension from either the prop hub flange
or either motor mount hole to the TOP Firewall mount>>
I wasn't clear that the dimension I need is the "horizontal"
dimension. bob U.
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Unternaehrer
To: Zenith List
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 10:53 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: motor mount dimension for corvair on XL
Could anybody give me a dimension from either the prop hub flange or
either motor mount hole to the TOP Firewall mount. I have the motor
here and can get the following dimensions but it anyone already has them
the "height of the Crankshaft centerline" above the bed mount
vertically and the distance from the prop hub horizoontallty to the
front motor mount hole in the bed mount. I'll want to be sure the
fiberglass nosebowl and cowling kit will fit. Is it a good assumption
that the cowling kit will have a few inches of metal to trim so that
there is a little wiggle room for that fit, but what seems more
important is that the motor be in the correct "front to back" position
for the correct CG on the XL
Blue Skies
Bob Unternaehrer
shilocom@mcmsys.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
Message 29
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hello list
hope you can help
i am building a UK spec XL with locking catch looking at the drawings it tells
me to drill new stopping hole in the handle how can this be done the mounting
plate on the handle is in the way???
and i dont understand how the end stop fits either part no. 6-co-1-6cz does anybody
have any pictures that might help me
czaw dont answer emails any more
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=139788#139788
Message 30
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| Subject: | [ Dave Miller ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Dave Miller <tigermiller1595@msn.com>
Lists: Zenith-List
Subject: Gear Bending Instructions
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/tigermiller1595@msn.com.10.13.2007/index.html
----------------------------------------------------------
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures@matronics.com
----------------------------------------------------------
Message 31
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|
| Subject: | Cloverdale Fly-In |
Great job by Quality Sport Planes at Cloverdale. And there was not one 601 that
I wouldn't be proud to fly. I needed the motivation....
FKeener, N601FK (reserved)
601XL rudder done, stab done, elevator (95%)
Wing Kit in garage...
Message 32
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| Subject: | Jab Cowling issue |
I ran into a small Jab 3300 cowl issue last week.
The cabin heat NACA vent on the cowl, which I thought
was going to be on the left side of the cowl, was on
the right side of the cowl, and was only a 2". The
heat muff that I recieved was a 2" on the side that
goes to the cabin heat box, but was a 2 1/4" on the
side that connects to the NACA vent. USJabiru was
quick to send a new heat muff that has 2" ports on
both sides, along with extra scat tubing because now
the air will enter from the right side of the cowl,
into the right side heat muff, out the left side heat
muff, and then have to be routed back to the right
side firewall where the cabin heat box is mounted.
You may want to check your cowl and heat muff when you
get them so you won't have any surprises when you
start working on that part.
Ron
Haslet, TX
601XL-3300
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/webhosting
Message 33
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| Subject: | Jab dual throttle |
I found a small issue with the Jab 601XL 3300
firewall forward, dual throttle installation. It
looks like the dual throttle from USJabiru was
designed for the pre- 6B8-11 upper angle, and 6B8-10
forward gusset on the 6B7-1 firewall top stiffener. I
believe these items (bb8-11,6b7-1) were added a couple
of years ago on the 601XL. The center arm of the
throttle bell mechanism, won't extend over the upper
angle. I thought about shortening the center arm a
little, and going through the top stiffener, but I'm
afraid I won't have enough throttle travel. I think I
can fix it by just extending the center arm an inch or
so, but I'm waiting to hear back from USJabiru to see
if they have any ideas or how they've dealt with this.
Has anyone else dealt with this?
Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase.
http://farechase.yahoo.com/
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: General Instrument and engine questions. first of a million |
The Jabiru already comes with oil pressure sender that has a spare additional contact
for grounding the idiot light or hobbs meter when pressure is below 7 psi.
This is a good idea because those senders do fail when the wiper inside wears thru
the wire at the normal oil pressure spot and if your hobbs is still running
or the light is off its OK to continue. There is also a spare port on the oil
gallery, the real one that goes to the main bearings, that can be used to mount
a switch ( i used one for a Mazda RX7 they are a lower pressure )
I prefer analog gauges and used the Mitchel range from ACS
Perhaps mechanical gauges would be even better however I dont think the engine
could run for long if the oil line came off you havent got 5 or 6 quarts spare
like on a Continental or Lycoming
Ralph
--------
Ralph - CH701 / 2200a
Read this topic online here:
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