---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 01/05/08: 31 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:35 AM - Re: Oil-canning (Larry H) 2. 05:38 AM - Re: Adding extra rib to rudder (Martin Pohl) 3. 05:44 AM - Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit (Martin Pohl) 4. 05:56 AM - Fw: Re: Re: Wing or Flap or Aileron Flutter (Scott Thatcher) (Juan Vega) 5. 05:57 AM - Re: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit (Juan Vega) 6. 06:35 AM - Please read last chapter (ZodieRocket) 7. 07:35 AM - new subscriber (Gary Thomas) 8. 07:37 AM - Re: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit (steve) 9. 07:42 AM - Re: Oil-canning (steve) 10. 08:27 AM - Re: Wing Stand Plans (jonaburns) 11. 09:08 AM - Re: Re: Wing Stand Plans (Larry Winger) 12. 10:53 AM - Access Hole Covers (Dave VanLanen) 13. 10:59 AM - Re: Re: Any one fishing from floats in a Zenith? 701 vs 601? () 14. 11:32 AM - Re: new subscriber (robert stone) 15. 11:34 AM - Re: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit (Craig Payne) 16. 11:41 AM - Re: Oil-canning (John Reinking) 17. 11:50 AM - Re: new subscriber (IFLYSMODEL@aol.com) 18. 12:25 PM - Re: Access Hole Covers (Tim Juhl) 19. 12:34 PM - Re: Access Hole Covers (LarryMcFarland) 20. 01:04 PM - Re: new subscriber (Bryan Martin) 21. 01:11 PM - Re: Throttle Controls CH701 (Cannon, Walt) 22. 01:12 PM - Re: new subscriber (Kevin L. Rupert) 23. 01:34 PM - Re: new subscriber (David Downey) 24. 02:00 PM - Re: new subscriber (robert stone) 25. 02:51 PM - Re: Wing Stand Plans (jonaburns) 26. 02:54 PM - Re: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit (steve) 27. 05:18 PM - Re: Nose Gear Bearing Material (N601RT) 28. 05:52 PM - Re: Re: Wing Stand Plans (ZodieRocket) 29. 07:19 PM - Welded Fuel Tanks Update (ashontz) 30. 08:54 PM - Re: Welded Fuel Tanks Update (Ron Lendon) 31. 11:03 PM - Starting my 701 project () ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:35:53 AM PST US From: Larry H Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Oil-canning Dink-Donk....Dink-Donk........ --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:38:55 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Adding extra rib to rudder From: "Martin Pohl" I will also fabricate an end rib for the rudder leading edge bottom. As Dred said, do that only when you have installed both rudder and "plastic"-fairing to the horizontal tail. In my case there is a 1/2 inch gap between fairing and rudder which I will adjust with this additional rib. Cheers Martin -------- Martin Pohl Zodiac XL QBK 8645 Jona, Switzerland www.pohltec.ch/ZodiacXL Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156109#156109 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:44:56 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit From: "Martin Pohl" Craig, how about installing the wings with the normal AN5-bolts, then check wing dihedral, then ream and install one by one of the bolts to the larger AN6? What do others think about this procedure? I have a CZAW-QBK, but did not check the bolt holes yet (although I am somewhat scared now to do that :? ). Cheers Martin -------- Martin Pohl Zodiac XL QBK 8645 Jona, Switzerland www.pohltec.ch/ZodiacXL Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156111#156111 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:56:32 AM PST US From: Juan Vega Subject: Zenith-List: Fw: Re: Re: Wing or Flap or Aileron Flutter (Scott Thatcher) -----Forwarded Message----- >From: Juan Vega >Sent: Jan 5, 2008 8:54 AM >To: MaxNr@aol.com >Subject: Re: Re: Wing or Flap or Aileron Flutter (Scott Thatcher) > >The rudder is a great design! it is so strong, that i landed with a true 15 knot cross wind! winds were 330 @ 26 knot on a 360 degree runway. 70 mph with no flaps. Full left rudder crabbing down the appraoch pickle, then straighten out and full left aileron, Whew Hew! It is a hoot! air and space magazine has a great article this month on foil design and it goes into the design of all flying rudders, which were big in WWI. > >Juan > >-----Original Message----- >>From: MaxNr@aol.com >>Sent: Jan 5, 2008 1:07 AM >>To: amyvega2005@earthlink.net >>Subject: Re: Re: Wing or Flap or Aileron Flutter (Scott Thatcher) >> >>Thanks Juan, one can assume that it would have good recovery characteristics >>with that powerful rudder. I'm not surprised. How about those videos? >>Bob >> >> >>************** >>Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape. >> >>http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:57:18 AM PST US From: Juan Vega Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit i think it is a great idea. Juan -----Original Message----- >From: Martin Pohl >Sent: Jan 5, 2008 8:44 AM >To: zenith-list@matronics.com >Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit > > >Craig, how about installing the wings with the normal AN5-bolts, then check wing dihedral, then ream and install one by one of the bolts to the larger AN6? > >What do others think about this procedure? > >I have a CZAW-QBK, but did not check the bolt holes yet (although I am somewhat scared now to do that :? ). > >Cheers Martin > >-------- >Martin Pohl >Zodiac XL QBK >8645 Jona, Switzerland >www.pohltec.ch/ZodiacXL > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156111#156111 > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:35:01 AM PST US From: "ZodieRocket" Subject: Zenith-List: Please read last chapter We have heard about the 701 fatality before Christmas. However, please read the last chapter. There is nothing to learn here, but I wish to ask each of you to please, take a second to talk to people like this. If a simple talk does not stop them then please report their actions. I have little use for induced stupidity, I myself have been guilty of it and though I hate hearing it, I realize the depth of my miss-judgment when others have responded. BUT for the sake of the family report these people when you see shit like this if they will not listen the first time. Mark NTSB Identification: DEN08LA040 14 CFR Part 91: General Aviation Accident occurred Saturday, December 15, 2007 in Las Cruces, NM Aircraft: Garniss STOL 701, registration: N45500 Injuries: 1 Fatal. This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors. Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been completed. On December 15, 2007, at 1641 mountain standard time, a Garniss STOL 701, N45500, piloted by a sport pilot, was destroyed when the it struck terrain while maneuvering on the outskirts of Las Cruces, New Mexico. Visual meteorological conditions prevailed at the time of the accident. The personal flight was being conducted under the provisions of Title 14 CFR Part 91 without a flight plan. The pilot was fatally injured. The local flight originating at an undetermined time from Las Cruces (LRU), New Mexico. According to an FAA inspector, the pilot purchased the airplane approximately 2 months ago. His daughters told the inspector that every time he flew, he would "buzz" his house and "wig wag" his wings. He was wig wagging his wings when the left wing tip struck the ground and the airplane cartwheeled. Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario Zodiac 601XL C-GOXL, CH701 just started www.ch601.org / www.ch701.com / www.Osprey2.com 1/5/2008 11:46 AM ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:35:38 AM PST US From: Gary Thomas Subject: Zenith-List: new subscriber Hi everyone. I've been lurking for about 18 months now and only just got around to subscribing. In that period I've completed the airframe on a 601XL and finished my instrument panel with "just" the electrics and firewall forward to go. The members on this list have been a huge help to me and this is my thank-you. Those of you that deal with Caleb at Zenith know too what a huge help he can be. I've also put together a Corvair engine with the help of William Wynne and his compadres (they generously started me off with a ride in their plane when I first visited). Those who have gone this route know what a rewarding experience this can be too. I've gone from being an idiot about all things mechanical to now feeling that I can pretty much do anything with the right tools, preparation and information. It's a great feeling. I'm especially good at drilling out rivets. The members of this list have been invaluable whenever I reached a hiccup (use of fuel-lube on leaky fuel sender, edge distance problems, fixing of canopy cracks). I've also picked up many useful tips - painting of the instruments panel, polishing (it's gonna be silver), and fixing an extrusion to the longeron to allow for a padlock. I've also seen some speculation by the occasional member too lazy to do some simple fact checking before posting their speculation. Much of this relates to the Corvair; William gets understandably prickly about this, although his website certainly provides enough information for people to conduct their own research and see through the myths. Since there are now 17 of these powering 601's and Zenith has displayed one at every recent airshow. I urge you visit it, ask questions and then decide for yourself. I will say that it takes a long time to do for the first-timer because of the learning curve, but that's what we're in it for. Now I think I am ready to start taking flying lessons :-) Best wishes to all. I think we're all trying to do something pretty special. Gary Thomas Weston FL 601XL/Corvair ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:37:20 AM PST US From: "steve" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit I also "think" this is the way out of my problem. I bet Zenith suggests this very method for a cure. But,,, getting a drill motor along the two bolts that are next to the fuselage skin will be a pain.... I could just do it! However I think Zenith needs to tell me EXACTLY what they want me to do... "They" drilled the holes. They didnt find the error...... SW ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Pohl" Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 6:44 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit > > Craig, how about installing the wings with the normal AN5-bolts, then > check wing dihedral, then ream and install one by one of the bolts to the > larger AN6? > > What do others think about this procedure? > > I have a CZAW-QBK, but did not check the bolt holes yet (although I am > somewhat scared now to do that :? ). > > Cheers Martin > > -------- > Martin Pohl > Zodiac XL QBK > 8645 Jona, Switzerland > www.pohltec.ch/ZodiacXL > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156111#156111 > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:42:08 AM PST US From: "steve" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Oil-canning I remember when they came out with a new fangled gadget that had a trigger looking thing that you would actually pull and the oil would squirt out like magic but I aint never learned about english and running sentences... ----- Original Message ----- From: Southern Reflections To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, January 04, 2008 9:16 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Oil-canning I'am so old that I remember when you couldn't buy soda in a can .... Joe N101HD do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Terry Turnquist To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, January 04, 2008 10:17 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Oil-canning We used to get a free can opener with every six pack of beer too! Oh, the good old days. do not archive! Hope this useless info doesn't drive Larry over the brink! Joemotis@aol.com wrote: Oil used to be sold in cans. Think a cardboard tube with punched sheet metal ends crimped on. When the can had been punctured and drained, you could take your finger and push on the can end and it would collapse in and make a sound "dink". Then when you released pressure, it would pop back and make the sound 'donk' Zenith (and many other) aircraft are prone to the same thing href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:27:36 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Wing Stand Plans From: "jonaburns" It looks like the leg ends are only 1 foot. Is that correct? Thanks for the update. Jon Burns 601XL -- Still working on the Canopy while waiting on engine parts. Dallas TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156146#156146 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 09:08:06 AM PST US From: "Larry Winger" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Wing Stand Plans Here is what Mark Townsend wrote yesterday on the www.ch601.org website: We have made quite a few of these stands over the last couple of years, I do not have a blueprint but I will describe the construction here. If someone wants to draw it up and send it to me I would appreciate it. First off drop by Home Depot and pick up 4 - 8ft 2 X 4 as straight as possible and 1 - 6ft 2X4, also a 4 X 4 piece of construction grade 1/2 in plywood. Add to that some screws 2" and 3" a couple of tie down straps ( wide) or Berber carpet ( no shag, this is not the 70's) Pick 4 castering 2" or bigger rubber wheels. The top and bottom of the center section are 8 ft. The uprights in the center section are 4 ft The legs that the wheels are attached to are 3 ft The uprights for the wing holders are 2 ft The whole stand is built on the wheel legs, build the center section first, then screw on the legs and add wheels, then add the wing uprights. All corners are to be gusseted with plywood. When you look at the pictures above you will see a 2 X 4 doublers on the bottom of the center section. I have found that this is not needed, the gussets are more then ample for the wing stand. I use Roofing nails to hold the straps onto the stand, 5 in each end and center are more then sufficient for the task. This stand is strong, the longest distance in the back of a pickup has been 500 miles. Construction time is 2 hours in total, including coffee. We can now put one together in 20 minutes, without the Java stop. Mark Townsend. ----------------------------------- Larry Winger Tustin, Ca Scratchbuilding 601XL/Corvair Starting fuselage On Jan 5, 2008 8:26 AM, jonaburns wrote: > > It looks like the leg ends are only 1 foot. Is that correct? > > Thanks for the update. > > Jon Burns > 601XL -- Still working on the Canopy while waiting on engine parts. > Dallas TX > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156146#156146 > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:53:19 AM PST US From: "Dave VanLanen" Subject: Zenith-List: Access Hole Covers Here is a dumb question for the list. I am priming my faying surfaces with zinc chromate. I am planning to have my airplane professionally painted when complete. Do I need to prime the faying surfaces between the removable access hole covers and the skin around the access holes, or do the professional paint shops remove the access covers before painting? Thanks, Dave Van Lanen 601XL - Elevator ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:59:17 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Any one fishing from floats in a Zenith? 701 vs 601? Got to throw my two cents in:----- Seaplane flying is an absolute hoot ! I took my training at Jack Brown's, in Winter Haven Florida. (They'r e at Gilbert Field, which was an auxiliary field when I was in flight school at Bartow.) The most fun you can have sitting down. But, Norcal ? Yeech! Phooey! Blaaagh! At Jack Brown's, you get to learn landings a t the same lake that is home to Cypress Gardens, with all the bikinied honeys waterskiing right in your peripheral vision. Gives you great t raining in divided attention, and maintaining concentration in the, er , face of distractions. One of the coolest things you will ever do is a circular takeoff and climbout.=0A=0APaul Rodriguez=0ADO NO T ARCHIVE=0A ----- Original Message ----- =0A From: hansriet =0A To: zenith-list@matronics.com =0A Sent: Thursday, January 03, 2008 10: 41 PM=0A Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Any one fishing from floats in a Zenith? 701 vs 601?=0A=0A=0A --> Zenith-List message poste d by: "hansriet" >=0A =0A The seaplane rating is by far the most fun rating to get. I got m y training from Norcal aviation and the subsequent mountain flying add on was a treat that no pilot should be without. Low and slow is the w ay to go. I'm building my XL on wheels now but will definitely look in to Mark's floats when the time is right and the floats are available. =0A=0A Hans van Riet=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A Read this t opic online here:=0A=0A http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p hp?p=155873#155873 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List http://forums.matronics.com ======================= ======================= ======================= ========0A=0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:32:31 AM PST US From: "robert stone" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: new subscriber Gary, I'm sure you saw my post about installing new fuel tank sump drains because of the originals leaking and requiring frequent change of the little O-ring seal. The Curtis sump drain valves I ordered from Acft Spruce are scheduled to arrive here on the 8th and I am wondering what to use for a thread sealant when I install them. Someone told me that Teflon is OK for any system other than a system where gas or oil comes in contact with the Teflon because it will melt it. If you know of a fuel resistant sealant, please advise. Bob Stone Harker Heights, Tx ZodiacXL w/Jabiru 3300 ----- Original Message ----- From: Gary Thomas To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 9:34 AM Subject: Zenith-List: new subscriber Hi everyone. I've been lurking for about 18 months now and only just got around to subscribing. In that period I've completed the airframe on a 601XL and finished my instrument panel with "just" the electrics and firewall forward to go. The members on this list have been a huge help to me and this is my thank-you. Those of you that deal with Caleb at Zenith know too what a huge help he can be. I've also put together a Corvair engine with the help of William Wynne and his compadres (they generously started me off with a ride in their plane when I first visited). Those who have gone this route know what a rewarding experience this can be too. I've gone from being an idiot about all things mechanical to now feeling that I can pretty much do anything with the right tools, preparation and information. It's a great feeling. I'm especially good at drilling out rivets. The members of this list have been invaluable whenever I reached a hiccup (use of fuel-lube on leaky fuel sender, edge distance problems, fixing of canopy cracks). I've also picked up many useful tips - painting of the instruments panel, polishing (it's gonna be silver), and fixing an extrusion to the longeron to allow for a padlock. I've also seen some speculation by the occasional member too lazy to do some simple fact checking before posting their speculation. Much of this relates to the Corvair; William gets understandably prickly about this, although his website certainly provides enough information for people to conduct their own research and see through the myths. Since there are now 17 of these powering 601's and Zenith has displayed one at every recent airshow. I urge you visit it, ask questions and then decide for yourself. I will say that it takes a long time to do for the first-timer because of the learning curve, but that's what we're in it for. Now I think I am ready to start taking flying lessons :-) Best wishes to all. I think we're all trying to do something pretty special. Gary Thomas Weston FL 601XL/Corvair ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 11:34:23 AM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit My take is that drilling out the many rivets and removing the center spar from the fuselage is a low-risk operation. And I feel it will greatly increase my chances of doing the best job I can at drilling and reaming the offending holes. But before I touch anything I'm going to use precision hole gauges to measure all the holes and measure a sampling of close tolerance bolts. All the needed items should be in my hands by next Wednesday. Stay tuned. -- Craig -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of steve Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 8:37 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit I also "think" this is the way out of my problem. I bet Zenith suggests this very method for a cure. But,,, getting a drill motor along the two bolts that are next to the fuselage skin will be a pain.... I could just do it! However I think Zenith needs to tell me EXACTLY what they want me to do... "They" drilled the holes. They didnt find the error...... SW ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Pohl" Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 6:44 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit > > Craig, how about installing the wings with the normal AN5-bolts, then > check wing dihedral, then ream and install one by one of the bolts to the > larger AN6? > > What do others think about this procedure? > > I have a CZAW-QBK, but did not check the bolt holes yet (although I am > somewhat scared now to do that :? ). > > Cheers Martin > > -------- > Martin Pohl > Zodiac XL QBK > 8645 Jona, Switzerland > www.pohltec.ch/ZodiacXL > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156111#156111 > > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 11:41:13 AM PST US From: John Reinking Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Oil-canning Amen. ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 11:50:03 AM PST US From: IFLYSMODEL@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: new subscriber Hey Gary: Fuel Lube is the best product, but I do not think it is made/sold any more. Aircraft Spruce has some stuff they call EZ turn, which I have not used. Has anyone else used this stuff? Spruce PN 09-00180 EZ TURN ( FUELUBE ) 1 LB CAN A one pound can will last you forever. Lynn Nelsen Frostproof Fl 601 HD **************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape. http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 12:25:50 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Access Hole Covers From: "Tim Juhl" Depends on the paint shop and the wishes of the owner of the aircraft. I would suggest removing the covers and having them painted separately. That way the whole surface of the cover will be painted as well as the area on the skin under the screw heads. You will also avoid the issue of having to break the paint around the cover/skin and screw head/skin interfaces. I prefer stainless steel machine screws rather than painted heads because in use the paint on the heads will chip. I did spray primer around the inside of the inspection holes cut in the skin. Tim -------- ______________ CFII Champ L16A flying Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A Working on fuselage Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156194#156194 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 12:34:35 PM PST US From: LarryMcFarland Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Access Hole Covers It's a good question Dave, It's likely they'd be removed if you've got a good paint shop. I masked behind the inspection hole surfaces and painted wings and covers separately. I think this is the only way a good paint job can be done. Masking behind inspection holes begins by taping behind the edges, then taping the tape to close without touching any metal. It's awkward but doable, see link for painting solutions at www.macsmachine.com/html/Paint.htm Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com Dave VanLanen wrote: > > Here is a dumb question for the list. I am priming my faying surfaces > with zinc chromate. I am planning to have my airplane professionally > painted when complete. Do I need to prime the faying surfaces between > the removable access hole covers and the skin around the access holes, > or do the professional paint shops remove the access covers before > painting? > > Thanks, > > Dave Van Lanen > > 601XL - Elevator > > * > * ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 01:04:46 PM PST US From: Bryan Martin Subject: Re: Zenith-List: new subscriber Teflon tape is not recommended for fuel systems. Not because it will melt in the fuel but because removal and re-installation of the fittings can result in tiny slivers of the tape getting into the lines and causing problems downstream (eg. clogged carburetor jets or fuel injectors). It's very difficult to get all the tape particles out of the female threads. Teflon paste type sealers are fine, used sparingly, as long as it's designed for use with gasoline. Teflon itself is impervious to most solvents, but the paste that it is mixed in with may not be. You can go down to the local auto parts store and get some product designed to seal gasoline fittings. You should use a product that doesn't harden but stays pliable. Permatex makes a good product for this that you can get in a small tube for a reasonable price. In any case, don't overdo it. A little dab will do ya. Keep the paste back from the end of the fitting so it doesn't squeeze out inside the line. You don't want globs of this stuff getting loose inside the lines either. robert stone wrote: > Gary, > I'm sure you saw my post about installing new fuel tank sump drains > because of the originals leaking and requiring frequent change of the > little O-ring seal. The Curtis sump drain valves I ordered from Acft > Spruce are scheduled to arrive here on the 8th and I am wondering what > to use for a thread sealant when I install them. Someone told me that > Teflon is OK for any system other than a system where gas or oil comes > in contact with the Teflon because it will melt it. If you know of a > fuel resistant sealant, please advise. > -- Bryan Martin Zenith 601XL N61BM Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 01:11:20 PM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Throttle Controls CH701 From: "Cannon, Walt" I took a slightly different approach on the throttle cable length issue. Instead of cutting & shortening, I just routed it in a nice gentle 360 degree circle under the panel before it exited the firewall. That way I was left with the threaded factory end and rubber seal boot.........WC ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 01:12:36 PM PST US From: "Kevin L. Rupert" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: new subscriber Give Sealube (P/N 09-25200) or Bakerseal (P/N 09-00346) from Spruce a try. Both are impervious to aviation fuels and have been used for years in that application. Kevin ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 01:34:57 PM PST US From: David Downey Subject: Re: Zenith-List: new subscriber the rule I was taught way back when in A&P school was that all sealers should be kept at least 1 threads away from the entry end of the threads. Also, in the event of flare fittings, there are dead soft aluminum flare washers that forgive a world of minor defects when assembling such systems. Don't over tighten the fittings or re-use the flare washers though... Teflon tape is not recommended for fuel systems. Not because it will melt in the fuel but because removal and re-installation of the fittings can result in tiny slivers of the tape getting into the lines and causing problems downstream (eg. clogged carburetor jets or fuel injectors). It's very difficult to get all the tape particles out of the female threads. Teflon paste type sealers are fine, used sparingly, as long as it's designed for use with gasoline. Teflon itself is impervious to most solvents, but the paste that it is mixed in with may not be. You can go down to the local auto parts store and get some product designed to seal gasoline fittings. You should use a product that doesn't harden but stays pliable. Permatex makes a good product for this that you can get in a small tube for a reasonable price. In any case, don't overdo it. A little dab will do ya. Keep the paste back from the end of the fitting so it doesn't squeeze out inside the line. You don't want globs of this stuff getting loose inside the lines either. robert stone wrote: > Gary, > I'm sure you saw my post about installing new fuel tank sump drains > because of the originals leaking and requiring frequent change of the > little O-ring seal. The Curtis sump drain valves I ordered from Acft > Spruce are scheduled to arrive here on the 8th and I am wondering what > to use for a thread sealant when I install them. Someone told me that > Teflon is OK for any system other than a system where gas or oil comes > in contact with the Teflon because it will melt it. If you know of a > fuel resistant sealant, please advise. > -- Bryan Martin Zenith 601XL N61BM Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive Do Not Archive Dave Downey Harleysville (SE) PA 100 HP Corvair --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 02:00:10 PM PST US From: "robert stone" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: new subscriber Bryan. Thanks much for your lengthy response. I never even thought of going to an auto supply to find something that is designed to use on fuel system connectors. Bob Stone ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bryan Martin" Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 3:06 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: new subscriber > > Teflon tape is not recommended for fuel systems. Not because it will > melt in the fuel but because removal and re-installation of the fittings > can result in tiny slivers of the tape getting into the lines and > causing problems downstream (eg. clogged carburetor jets or fuel > injectors). It's very difficult to get all the tape particles out of the > female threads. Teflon paste type sealers are fine, used sparingly, as > long as it's designed for use with gasoline. Teflon itself is impervious > to most solvents, but the paste that it is mixed in with may not be. You > can go down to the local auto parts store and get some product designed > to seal gasoline fittings. You should use a product that doesn't harden > but stays pliable. Permatex makes a good product for this that you can > get in a small tube for a reasonable price. In any case, don't overdo > it. A little dab will do ya. Keep the paste back from the end of the > fitting so it doesn't squeeze out inside the line. You don't want globs > of this stuff getting loose inside the lines either. > robert stone wrote: >> Gary, >> I'm sure you saw my post about installing new fuel tank sump drains >> because of the originals leaking and requiring frequent change of the >> little O-ring seal. The Curtis sump drain valves I ordered from Acft >> Spruce are scheduled to arrive here on the 8th and I am wondering what to >> use for a thread sealant when I install them. Someone told me that >> Teflon is OK for any system other than a system where gas or oil comes in >> contact with the Teflon because it will melt it. If you know of a fuel >> resistant sealant, please advise. >> > > -- > Bryan Martin > Zenith 601XL N61BM > Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive > Do Not Archive > > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 02:51:06 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Wing Stand Plans From: "jonaburns" I see that the leg end states that it is 2 ft long, but by looking at the picture, it seems to be only 1 foot or so. If it were 2 ft, it would be half as tall as the 4 ft center. This is probably just a typo, or I just cannot judge the scale from the photo. Thanks! Jon Burns Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156218#156218 ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 02:54:35 PM PST US From: "steve" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit Hi Craig. I agree with you. I will also receive the hole gauges from Zenith next week. But, we spent a great amount of money to buy the QBK and I think Zenith owes us a partial refund. SW ----- Original Message ----- From: "Craig Payne" Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 12:28 PM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit > > My take is that drilling out the many rivets and removing the center spar > from the fuselage is a low-risk operation. And I feel it will greatly > increase my chances of doing the best job I can at drilling and reaming > the > offending holes. But before I touch anything I'm going to use precision > hole > gauges to measure all the holes and measure a sampling of close tolerance > bolts. All the needed items should be in my hands by next Wednesday. > > Stay tuned. > > -- Craig > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of steve > Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 8:37 AM > To: zenith-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build > kit > > > I also "think" this is the way out of my problem. I bet Zenith suggests > this very method for a cure. But,,, getting a drill motor along the two > bolts that are next to the fuselage skin will be a pain.... > I could just do it! However I think Zenith needs to tell me EXACTLY what > they want me to do... "They" drilled the holes. They didnt find the > error...... > SW > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Martin Pohl" > To: > Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 6:44 AM > Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Oversized spar bolt holes in a quick-build kit > > >> >> Craig, how about installing the wings with the normal AN5-bolts, then >> check wing dihedral, then ream and install one by one of the bolts to the >> larger AN6? >> >> What do others think about this procedure? >> >> I have a CZAW-QBK, but did not check the bolt holes yet (although I am >> somewhat scared now to do that :? ). >> >> Cheers Martin >> >> -------- >> Martin Pohl >> Zodiac XL QBK >> 8645 Jona, Switzerland >> www.pohltec.ch/ZodiacXL >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156111#156111 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 05:18:43 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Nose Gear Bearing Material From: "N601RT" Wayne, I've installed the lower nose gear bearing that Zenair sells on my HDS (6G2-1 as referenced above). I also installed the upper nose gear bearing (6B8-6) from Zeniar at the top of the nose gear AND at the bottom and top of the main gear legs on my HDS. My gear action is now much smoother than the original HDS implementation on my plane. NOTES: The "center firewall stiffener" on the XL is wider than on the HDS! The outside dimension of the XL part (6B8-7) is 100 while the HDS part (6F9-4) is 93. I had a friend mill 3.5 from each side of the XL lower nose gear bearing to fit in my center firewall stiffener. The XL lower nose gear bearing mounts in holes you drill and tap for four AN4H-5A bolts. The HDS uses six AN3 bolts to hold the lower bearing assembly. I was able to use my original holes. I don't remember if I used four or six bolts, but I think I used four. The Zenair lower nose gear bearing also includes the "ramp" to center the nose gear. This replaces the "nose gear stops", 6F10-1. I found a .pdf document online that described how to drill, tap and install the bearing. I would expect that Zenair would be willing to give you a copy of the document. Let me know if you choose to use the Zenair lower nose gear bearing and would like pictures of my installation. Regards, Roy N601RT: 2002 CH601HDS, nose gear, Rotax 912ULS, All electric, IFR equipped, 895hrs Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156235#156235 ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 05:52:17 PM PST US From: "ZodieRocket" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Wing Stand Plans The wing stand you see in the picture is not one of mine, it was made the same as the one available from Aircraft Spruce. I do make the leg ends at 2 ft. I do this because the stands seldom stay in the shop. They are used widely for transport and the extra length is desirable in this situation. IF your wing stand is just for home use then 1 1/2 would be just fine. Any shorter and you will not have enough strap wrapped around the wing and all pressure would be on the leading edge alone. Mark Townsend Can-Zac Aviation Ltd. president@can-zacaviation.com www.can-zacaviation.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jonaburns Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 5:49 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Wing Stand Plans I see that the leg end states that it is 2 ft long, but by looking at the picture, it seems to be only 1 foot or so. If it were 2 ft, it would be half as tall as the 4 ft center. This is probably just a typo, or I just cannot judge the scale from the photo. Thanks! Jon Burns Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156218#156218 1/5/2008 11:46 AM 1/5/2008 11:46 AM ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 07:19:33 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Welded Fuel Tanks Update From: "ashontz" Well, I've been practicing my aluminum welding skills now for about a month and I can honestly say... this is doable. Having made a bunch of successful edge welds similar to the edge welds called for in the plans with no visible pinholes. The next step will be to fabricate a small test tank and try pressurizing it. Total cost outlay, about $300 for gas welding equipment which can also be put to good use in other welding projects including standard old steel welding. Vastly superior to stick or MIG welding. Kudos to Tinman Tech and Fournier Industries for good instructional videos. -------- Andy Shontz CH601XL - Corvair www.mykitlog.com/ashontz Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156253#156253 ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 08:54:46 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Welded Fuel Tanks Update From: "Ron Lendon" Keep the test pressures low, 2-3 psi if ya go much higher it will deform the tank. -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=156264#156264 ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 11:03:50 PM PST US From: Subject: Zenith-List: Starting my 701 project Ok well I am bitting the bullet and starting a 701 so guys, I will be making wing ribs and horizontal ribs and the like first. So anyone interested in taking a short cut and think you might want to buy some parts instead of making them I will be reasonable on pricing so let me know so I can make ones for you while I make them for myself. David Mikesell 230 Theresa Drive, #6 Cloverdale, CA 95425 209-224-4485 skyguynca@skyguynca.com www.skyguynca.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.