Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:36 AM - Re: Re: rudder cam...how big is too big? (Bill Berle)
2. 02:18 AM - 701 Scratch Builder (Bill Berle)
3. 04:18 AM - Re: Holding Nose up (David Downey)
4. 06:21 AM - Re: Rib forming questions (Gary Boothe)
5. 07:18 AM - Marvel Schebler 10-4233 (MA3APA) (Timothy Croy)
6. 08:41 AM - Re: Rib forming questions (LRM)
7. 08:44 AM - Re: Holding Nose up (Juan Vega)
8. 08:47 AM - Re: Holding Nose up (Juan Vega)
9. 08:51 AM - Re: Question (Juan Vega)
10. 09:24 AM - Re: Holding Nose up (Edward Moody II)
11. 11:27 AM - Re: Holding Nose up (T. Graziano)
12. 12:46 PM - Re: Question (John Short)
13. 12:52 PM - Wing tip sheet (james dankovich)
14. 01:18 PM - Re: Holding Nose up (David Downey)
15. 01:48 PM - Re: Question (David Downey)
16. 02:39 PM - cranks update (Afterfxllc@aol.com)
17. 02:54 PM - Re: Marvel Schebler 10-4233 (MA3APA) ()
18. 03:57 PM - 6.4 MM reamer ()
19. 04:49 PM - Re: 6.4 MM reamer (pavel569)
20. 05:15 PM - Re: 6.4 MM reamer (Craig Payne)
21. 08:05 PM - Re: Wing tip sheet (Ron Lendon)
22. 08:19 PM - Re: 6.4 MM reamer (Ron Lendon)
23. 08:32 PM - Re: HDS Wings (THOMAS SMALL)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: rudder cam...how big is too big? |
Guys, pay attention to the guy who warned against adding any significant
weight to the top of the rudder. He's right. If you want to add one of
those one-ounce CCD "lipstick" cameras, that's fine. Anything over 6
ounces accidentally put in the wrong place, in my opinion, is asking
for flutter or some other aeroelastic/structural issue. Anything you do
put up there HAS to be on or forward of the hinge line for flutter
safety. If you want to not have the camera turn when you touch the
rudder pedals, that's easy. Mount it on a bearing or bushing so it can
rotate freely and put a small weathervane fin behind it. It will always
point forward parallel to the flight path.
Use a very tiny camera that weighs an ounce or two, and don't put ten
pounds of coax cable from that little camera to the cockpit. I'm sure a
standard two-wire system using small gauge wire will be fine. If it has
to be shielded, wrap it in half an ounce of aluminum foil not five
pounds of electrical shielding.
Bill The New Guy
Tim Juhl wrote:
>
> I agree that adding even a small camcorder to the rudder is too much.
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | 701 Scratch Builder |
I will be scratch building a 701, yes I DO have a serial number, plans,
etc. Looking for a set of form blocks and flanging dies. Will trade you
something useful in return for the loan/rental of a good set of form
blocks and flange dies.
Bill the New Guy
Los Angeles
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Holding Nose up |
do not forget that the stabilizer's primary job is balancing the pitching moment
of the airfoil. This why trim changes occur with loading and speed.
Stan
Thank you very much for your post. No flames here. I think you're onto something
good.
It really got me to thinking about the aerodynamics of the horizontal stabilizer.
Please indulge me while I ramble about this.
ZAC told me that the stabilizer airfoil is symetrical. Since the stabilizer exerts
a downward force to balance the moment of the engine around the aircraft cg,
the symetrical airfoil must be angled slightly downward to generate a downward
force with neutral trim. After touchdown, with the nose up, the stabilizer
would be angled upward, generating an upward force that would rotate the A/C
around the mains, pushing the nose down. So, to hold the nose up after touchdown,
you would need to pull the stick aft, forcing the elevator up. And, what
Stan is saying, is that VGs on the underside of the stabilizer will increase up-elevator
effectiveness (apparently) by reducing boundary layer separation on
the bottom of the elevator. That all makes sense to me now.
So, I would like to ask Stan the usual questions, how many VG's? Where are they
on the stab? Do you have any photos? Thank you for posting your experience.
This is a very interesting subject.
Terry
-----Original message-----
From: Stanley Challgren challgren@mac.com
Subject: Zenith-List: Holding Nose up
>
> Andy Shontz:
>
> You asked;
>
> "One thing, it appears as though on landing the nose comes down pretty
> quick. I think other people have noted this one their XLs as well. Is
> it fairly difficult to hold the nose up once the mains hit?"
>
> I assume the XL is similar to the HDS and it was impossible to hold
> the nose up on ours after touchdown. We solved that problem by
> placing VG's on the bottom side of the horizontal stabilizer. With
> the VG's there, you could aerodynamic brake down to about 20 mph.
>
> Your other question:
>
> " I was thinking a tail skid of some sort might be a good idea when I
> get around to building the fuselage, to not only protect the fuselage
> but also the rudder."
>
> The HDS had a very effective tail skid in the tie down ring. I
> discovered how effective it was when I failed to ask my BFR check
> pilot how much he weighed. I had planned on 170# and after grinding
> down the tail skid on takeoff I found he weighed 240#.
>
> Stan
>
> p.s. Let the flames began.
>
Terry Phillips
ttp44~at~rkymtn.net
Corvallis MT
601XL/Jab 3300 slow build kit - Tail is finished; working on the wings
http://www.mykitlog.com/N47TP/
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
100 HP Corvair
---------------------------------
Message 4
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| Subject: | Rib forming questions |
Glenn,
The roll-out at your joggle doesn't appear to be bad at all. In the future,
you might consider a tighter clamp at that exact area when you form the
joggle.
The length of the joggle is not critical if it does not interfere with the
placement of a rivet. If it does interfere with a rivet, there may be
options, but re-bending the aluminum is not preferred. Too much bending
'work hardens' the aluminum, creating a possible crack.
The clearance referred to should be good at 1-2mm. The important thing is
that the rib flange does not touch the spar flange, and there is not so much
gap that you lose your edge clearance on your last rivet.
If the ends are high on your ribs, just put a large dowel under the rib
(like a closet hanger rod) and roll the rib back and forth with gentle
pressure. The rib will flatten out very easily.
Gary Boothe
Cool, CA
601 HDSTD, WW Conversion 90% done,
Tail done, wings done, working on c-section
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jugle
Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2008 10:34 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Rib forming questions
Hope you scratch builders out there can help.
Firstly, those joggles again... I have cutouts in the form blocks for them,
but if I hammer them down while in the form blocks, the step created by the
joggle tends to push material outwards, thus flattening and reducing the
radius of the flange in that area. Please see attached images.
The Construction Standards say no radius smaller than 1.5mm, so I may be
okay here, what do you think?
Also, one joggle I made was too long. Is it acceptable to flatten it out and
re-do it, or is this too much panel beating for 6061-T6? Do I need to make
the rib again?
Next, on the Scratchbuilding Basics DVD, David demonstrates trimming some
metal off the ends of the flanges where they touch in the corners... how
much clearance should there be in those corners?
And lastly, I've watched the Homebuilt Help DVDs umpteen times... very good
by the way... the method Mark uses for removing bows in the ribs, by
tweaking the crimps works well when the middle of the rib is high when
placed on a flat surface, but what about when the ends are high? I have been
putting them back in the form blocks and running along the flange again with
a mallet, but it is a bit time consuming. Is there another way?
Thanks for any suggestions,
Glenn
--------
Glenn Andressen
601XL- just started.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=159334#159334
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/joggle_detail_3_103.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/joggle_detail_2_982.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/joggle_detail_833.jpg
Message 5
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| Subject: | Marvel Schebler 10-4233 (MA3APA) |
All,
Looking for a marvel schebler carb, 10-4233, for a Continental A75-8F.
Original stromberg is icing up. Thanks in advance for any tips or
comments.
Blue skies,
Tim
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Rib forming questions |
I am sorta scratch building my second 701. Wings and tail are kit, the rest
I will scratch build. I did have to build a few ribs to make my long wing
extension. I used a friends forming blocks and found the same problem you
are having. I don't think it really mattered but I didn't like it. Then I
remembered that on the PegaStol ribs, they had drilled a hole where the bend
would be at every dimple. I did it on my new ribs and it fixed the problem.
You can sorta see the holes on one of the pictures on this page on my site.
http://www.skyhawg.com/ribs.html It might be worth trying.
LRM www.skyhawg.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jugle" <glenn@eastcoastit.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2008 12:34 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Rib forming questions
>
> Hope you scratch builders out there can help.
>
> Firstly, those joggles again... I have cutouts in the form blocks for
> them, but if I hammer them down while in the form blocks, the step created
> by the joggle tends to push material outwards, thus flattening and
> reducing the radius of the flange in that area. Please see attached
> images.
>
> The Construction Standards say no radius smaller than 1.5mm, so I may be
> okay here, what do you think?
>
> Also, one joggle I made was too long. Is it acceptable to flatten it out
> and re-do it, or is this too much panel beating for 6061-T6? Do I need to
> make the rib again?
>
> Next, on the Scratchbuilding Basics DVD, David demonstrates trimming some
> metal off the ends of the flanges where they touch in the corners... how
> much clearance should there be in those corners?
>
> And lastly, I've watched the Homebuilt Help DVDs umpteen times... very
> good by the way... the method Mark uses for removing bows in the ribs, by
> tweaking the crimps works well when the middle of the rib is high when
> placed on a flat surface, but what about when the ends are high? I have
> been putting them back in the form blocks and running along the flange
> again with a mallet, but it is a bit time consuming. Is there another way?
>
> Thanks for any suggestions,
> Glenn
>
> --------
> Glenn Andressen
> 601XL- just started.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=159334#159334
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/joggle_detail_3_103.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/joggle_detail_2_982.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/joggle_detail_833.jpg
>
>
> --
> 7:32 PM
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Holding Nose up |
Dave,
the VGs may be all well and good, i dont know much bout the effects of the VG in
back to comment on that , however the hold of nose is mostly a CG effect.
not just the weight but where the main wheels are. There are two ways the mains
can go on an XL mians forward or back. if the mains are on and fix in position,
just put some weight in tail. Does not have to be much.
I suggest trying that first. put a small 2 lb weight to the rear, first, then
cruise down the runway, and adjust the weight until front nose wheel comes off
at 25 mph plus.
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: David Downey <planecrazydld@yahoo.com>
>Sent: Jan 20, 2008 7:14 AM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Holding Nose up
>
>do not forget that the stabilizer's primary job is balancing the pitching moment
of the airfoil. This why trim changes occur with loading and speed.
>
>
>Stan
>
>Thank you very much for your post. No flames here. I think you're onto something
good.
>
>It really got me to thinking about the aerodynamics of the horizontal stabilizer.
Please indulge me while I ramble about this.
>
>ZAC told me that the stabilizer airfoil is symetrical. Since the stabilizer exerts
a downward force to balance the moment of the engine around the aircraft
cg, the symetrical airfoil must be angled slightly downward to generate a downward
force with neutral trim. After touchdown, with the nose up, the stabilizer
would be angled upward, generating an upward force that would rotate the A/C
around the mains, pushing the nose down. So, to hold the nose up after touchdown,
you would need to pull the stick aft, forcing the elevator up. And, what
Stan is saying, is that VGs on the underside of the stabilizer will increase
up-elevator effectiveness (apparently) by reducing boundary layer separation on
the bottom of the elevator. That all makes sense to me now.
>
>So, I would like to ask Stan the usual questions, how many VG's? Where are they
on the stab? Do you have any photos? Thank you for posting your experience.
>
>This is a very interesting subject.
>
>Terry
>
>
>-----Original message-----
>From: Stanley Challgren challgren@mac.com
>Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 10:33:29 -0700
>To: Zenith List zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Zenith-List: Holding Nose up
>
>>
>> Andy Shontz:
>>
>> You asked;
>>
>> "One thing, it appears as though on landing the nose comes down pretty
>> quick. I think other people have noted this one their XLs as well. Is
>> it fairly difficult to hold the nose up once the mains hit?"
>>
>> I assume the XL is similar to the HDS and it was impossible to hold
>> the nose up on ours after touchdown. We solved that problem by
>> placing VG's on the bottom side of the horizontal stabilizer. With
>> the VG's there, you could aerodynamic brake down to about 20 mph.
>>
>> Your other question:
>>
>> " I was thinking a tail skid of some sort might be a good idea when I
>> get around to building the fuselage, to not only protect the fuselage
>> but also the rudder."
>>
>> The HDS had a very effective tail skid in the tie down ring. I
>> discovered how effective it was when I failed to ask my BFR check
>> pilot how much he weighed. I had planned on 170# and after grinding
>> down the tail skid on takeoff I found he weighed 240#.
>>
>> Stan
>>
>> p.s. Let the flames began.
>>
>
>
>Terry Phillips
>ttp44~at~rkymtn.net
>Corvallis MT
>601XL/Jab 3300 slow build kit - Tail is finished; working on the wings
>http://www.mykitlog.com/N47TP/
>
>
> Dave Downey
> Harleysville (SE) PA
> 100 HP Corvair
>
>
>
>---------------------------------
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Holding Nose up |
to clarify, I do not have the nose sticking issue on my XL. Mine comes off at
20 mph approx. It is a weight issue. you need to adjust weight to the rear or
adjust the main wheels forward.
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: Terry Phillips <ttp44@rkymtn.net>
>Sent: Jan 19, 2008 11:48 PM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Holding Nose up
>
>
>Stan
>
>Thank you very much for your post. No flames here. I think you're onto something
good.
>
>It really got me to thinking about the aerodynamics of the horizontal stabilizer.
Please indulge me while I ramble about this.
>
>ZAC told me that the stabilizer airfoil is symetrical. Since the stabilizer exerts
a downward force to balance the moment of the engine around the aircraft
cg, the symetrical airfoil must be angled slightly downward to generate a downward
force with neutral trim. After touchdown, with the nose up, the stabilizer
would be angled upward, generating an upward force that would rotate the A/C
around the mains, pushing the nose down. So, to hold the nose up after touchdown,
you would need to pull the stick aft, forcing the elevator up. And, what
Stan is saying, is that VGs on the underside of the stabilizer will increase
up-elevator effectiveness (apparently) by reducing boundary layer separation on
the bottom of the elevator. That all makes sense to me now.
>
>So, I would like to ask Stan the usual questions, how many VG's? Where are they
on the stab? Do you have any photos? Thank you for posting your experience.
>
>This is a very interesting subject.
>
>Terry
>
>
>-----Original message-----
>From: Stanley Challgren challgren@mac.com
>Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 10:33:29 -0700
>To: Zenith List zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Zenith-List: Holding Nose up
>
>>
>> Andy Shontz:
>>
>> You asked;
>>
>> "One thing, it appears as though on landing the nose comes down pretty
>> quick. I think other people have noted this one their XLs as well. Is
>> it fairly difficult to hold the nose up once the mains hit?"
>>
>> I assume the XL is similar to the HDS and it was impossible to hold
>> the nose up on ours after touchdown. We solved that problem by
>> placing VG's on the bottom side of the horizontal stabilizer. With
>> the VG's there, you could aerodynamic brake down to about 20 mph.
>>
>> Your other question:
>>
>> " I was thinking a tail skid of some sort might be a good idea when I
>> get around to building the fuselage, to not only protect the fuselage
>> but also the rudder."
>>
>> The HDS had a very effective tail skid in the tie down ring. I
>> discovered how effective it was when I failed to ask my BFR check
>> pilot how much he weighed. I had planned on 170# and after grinding
>> down the tail skid on takeoff I found he weighed 240#.
>>
>> Stan
>>
>> p.s. Let the flames began.
>>
>
>
>Terry Phillips
>ttp44~at~rkymtn.net
>Corvallis MT
>601XL/Jab 3300 slow build kit - Tail is finished; working on the wings
>http://www.mykitlog.com/N47TP/
>
>
Message 9
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|
it is 1/8 Nylon you order in 12"X12" SHEETS FROM Aircraft Spruce. part No. 03-51100
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: John Short <creativesigns@embarqmail.com>
>Sent: Jan 19, 2008 7:18 PM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Zenith-List: Question
>
>On the Horz. Stab. the plans call for a fairlead to go in the cutout of top skin.
My question is what is this fairlead 7C5-1 and what do you make it out of.
>
>
>Scratch building 701
>
>
>CREATIVE SIGNWORKS
>1168 Byron Rd.
>Kaufman, Tx 75142
>John & Mindy Short
>972-962-7464
>Cell: 214-240-3815
>www.creative-sign-works.com
>creativesigns@embarqmail.com
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Holding Nose up |
Your idea of adding a bit of weight far aft to help un-stick the nose
wheel needs to be factored into weight and balance to see how much you
are moving the CG. However, if it makes the plane un-stick more
appropriately the chances are that the CG will be well inside the
envelope since the mains are still in the design location.
A second thought is that if someone needs to add any weight that far
back, it would be useful to do so in the form of a more robust tail
skid, particularly since the operational affect would be to make a
tailstrike more likely.
Just thinking out loud,
Dred
----- Original Message -----
From: Juan Vega
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2008 10:37 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Holding Nose up
<amyvega2005@earthlink.net>
to clarify, I do not have the nose sticking issue on my XL. Mine
comes off at 20 mph approx. It is a weight issue. you need to adjust
weight to the rear or adjust the main wheels forward.
Juan
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Holding Nose up |
Speaking ONLY for my XL; N493TG. (Serial Number 6-5342) - I can not hold the
nose up after landing.
1. Particulars:
A. Empty weight :799; empty CG 290 mm (My XL is probably one of the
heaviest empty - It has aux tanks, lighting/strobes all around, 6x600
tires/wheels/brakes with an 801 nose fork; dual sticks, and a lot of "stuff"
on the panel (EFIS, EIS, AP, T&B,Comm,Xpndr, AS/Atl steam gauges etc).. It
has a
purring Jab3300 and a ground adjustable Sensenich.
B. To "slightly" exceed aft cg (without baggage) would require zero
fuel and crew weight of about 540 lbs. To exceed fwd CG would require about
a 110 lb
pilot with full fuel (48 gal) at take-off. To exceed the CG limits, I would
have
to be extremely negligent. ((I did refuse to fly a 280# teen age "Young
Eagle". I weigh about 200/210 and still had a lot of fuel on board (over
gross) and an OAT of 94F
- We got him a ride in a twin that day)).
C. Trim required during cruise - a little nose up with one SOB, no
wing heaviness, roll trim slight to either side depending on fuel state,
passenger wt.
D. My landing gear was installed with the then build instructions,
which put the wheels further aft than the current build instructions, which
reverses the landing gear relative to mine, and places the wheels closer to
the CG. (GOOD!)
E. My elevator trim tab is the smaller one, not the current almost
full elevator span one. My full flaps can go to around 27/28 deg - I
believe I
read that the current flap actuator only provides 20 deg. I can not hold
approach speed with trim (I like to use 65 kts on final until over the
fence/trees) with flaps (flaps result in a significant nose down pitching
moment).
F. Total flight hours on 3TG to date: 343. Total: TO/LDG: 672
2. On 3TG's first flight at zero trim, full fuel,.zero flaps, I was going
to just let the airplane lift off, but when I was still stuck to the ground
at 70 kts, I applied back pressure and was airborne. I believe that 3TG
could possible use all the runway and not lift off without some "up"
elevator.
First landing was zero flaps -3TG flew like.... an airplane- no surprises.
3. As soon as 3TG touches, the nose comes down even with full aft stick.
As the nose is coming down, I release back pressure. If I do not release
back pressure, the nose will sometimes bounce- height of bounce depends on
sink rate.
If my speed is a "little" high at touch down and if I keep full up stick,
the nose
will bounce up higher and come down again and bounce again.
I usually use partial to mainly full flaps (depending on
cross wind/soft field), but landing without flaps is easier, in my opinion.
4. In my experience, with my XL, with its gear arrangement: THING TO
AVOID DURING LANDING!!
AVOID a high sink rate landing - low or high airspeed. The nose will bounce
you up dratimatically.
GO AROUND is recommended or the second bounce will be nasty.
If you get too slow close in, you increase your sink rate and pitch
authority will not help much in the flare -
recommend squeeze in some power to arrest sink and also so you have some
energy to flare
Tony Graziano
N493TG
--------------------------
Subject: Re: Holding Nose up
From: Edward Moody II (dredmoody@cox.net)
Date: Sun Jan 20 - 9:24 AM
Your idea of adding a bit of weight far aft to help un-stick the nose
wheel needs to be factored into weight and balance to see how much you
are moving the CG. However, if it makes the plane un-stick more
appropriately the chances are that the CG will be well inside the
envelope since the mains are still in the design location.
A second thought is that if someone needs to add any weight that far
back, it would be useful to do so in the form of a more robust tail
skid, particularly since the operational affect would be to make a
tailstrike more likely.
Just thinking out loud,
Dred
----- Original Message -----
From: Juan Vega
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2008 10:37 AM
Subject: Re: Holding Nose up
<amyvega2005@earthlink.net>
to clarify, I do not have the nose sticking issue on my XL. Mine
comes off at 20 mph approx. It is a weight issue. you need to adjust
weight to the rear or adjust the main wheels forward.
Juan
--------------
From: Stanley Challgren <challgren@mac.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Holding Nose up
Andy Shontz:
You asked;
"One thing, it appears as though on landing the nose comes down pretty
quick. I think other people have noted this one their XLs as well. Is
it fairly difficult to hold the nose up once the mains hit?"
I assume the XL is similar to the HDS and it was impossible to hold
the nose up on ours after touchdown. We solved that problem by
placing VG's on the bottom side of the horizontal stabilizer. With
the VG's there, you could aerodynamic brake down to about 20 mph.
Your other question:
" I was thinking a tail skid of some sort might be a good idea when I
get around to building the fuselage, to not only protect the fuselage
but also the rudder."
The HDS had a very effective tail skid in the tie down ring. I
discovered how effective it was when I failed to ask my BFR check
pilot how much he weighed. I had planned on 170# and after grinding
down the tail skid on takeoff I found he weighed 240#.
Stan
p.s. Let the flames began.
Message 12
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Thanks to all.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Juan Vega" <amyvega2005@earthlink.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2008 10:40 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Question
>
> it is 1/8 Nylon you order in 12"X12" SHEETS FROM Aircraft Spruce. part No.
> 03-51100
>
> Juan
>
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: John Short <creativesigns@embarqmail.com>
>>Sent: Jan 19, 2008 7:18 PM
>>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>>Subject: Zenith-List: Question
>>
>>On the Horz. Stab. the plans call for a fairlead to go in the cutout of
>>top skin. My question is what is this fairlead 7C5-1 and what do you make
>>it out of.
>>
>>
>>Scratch building 701
>>
>>
>>
>>CREATIVE SIGNWORKS
>>1168 Byron Rd.
>>Kaufman, Tx 75142
>>John & Mindy Short
>>972-962-7464
>>Cell: 214-240-3815
>>www.creative-sign-works.com
>>creativesigns@embarqmail.com
>
>
>
Message 13
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I am finally getting back to building after a hiatus! Thanks all for keeping me
informed during the last 2 years, if at a distance from the actual building
process. I am on the wing tip sheet rear bracket, 6-W-9 FOR THE WING TIP SHEET,
6w-9-4... The plans and the assembly guide both make the bracket appear to be
riveted to 6w9-6 and 6W9-7 or at least there appears to be 4 rivets and no gaps
between the parts ... what is correct, , 90 mm or flush to the 6w9-6 and -7
pieces? Thanks for all your help and discussion... Jim
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Holding Nose up |
a while back there was a lot of discussion about main gear spring placement. Zenith
advised back then that there are 2 correct placements: straight edge aft
and straight wedge forward, depending on the installed engine weight. If your
CG is correct and the nose falls through after touchdown - and the straight edge
of the gear spring as aft, then reverse it to put the straight edge forward.
If it already is straight edge forward then be very careful in adding weight
aft and be certain to do all the possible W&B trade studies to be absolutely
certain that you are going aft of the limit.
Aft CG (even within the limits) makes it VERY easy to overload ANY aircraft as
they are a lot more responsive in pitch when CG is aft.
All a fwd CG usually does is cause the plane to stall faster - and it makes the
plane "groove" more therefore less likely to respond to enthusiastic pitch control
inputs.
Edward Moody II <dredmoody@cox.net> wrote: Your idea of adding a bit of weight
far aft to help un-stick the nose wheel needs to be factored into weight
and balance to see how much you are moving the CG. However, if it makes the
plane un-stick more appropriately the chances are that the CG will be well inside
the envelope since the mains are still in the design location.
A second thought is that if someone needs to add any weight that far back, it
would be useful to do so in the form of a more robust tail skid, particularly
since the operational affect would be to make a tailstrike more likely.
Just thinking out loud,
Dred
----- Original Message -----
From: Juan Vega
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2008 10:37 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Holding Nose up
to clarify, I do not have the nose sticking issue on my XL. Mine comes off
at 20 mph approx. It is a weight issue. you need to adjust weight to the
rear or adjust the main wheels forward.
Juan
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
100 HP Corvair
---------------------------------
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
Message 15
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and like most commodity items that the aircaft stores sell, this one is also available
from Mcmaster.com:
8539K13Nylon 6/6 Sheet 1/8" Thick, 12" X 12"In stock at $9.95 Each
Just make sure that you are standing well back from the curb as they may deliver
before you get off the phone...and the shipping charge will be reasonable!
Always check them for something that can be defined specifically
it is 1/8 Nylon you order in 12"X12" SHEETS FROM Aircraft Spruce. part No. 03-51100
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: John Short
>Sent: Jan 19, 2008 7:18 PM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Zenith-List: Question
>
>On the Horz. Stab. the plans call for a fairlead to go in the cutout of top skin.
My question is what is this fairlead 7C5-1 and what do you make it out of.
>
>
>Scratch building 701
>
>
>CREATIVE SIGNWORKS
>1168 Byron Rd.
>Kaufman, Tx 75142
>John & Mindy Short
>972-962-7464
>Cell: 214-240-3815
>www.creative-sign-works.com
>creativesigns@embarqmail.com
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
100 HP Corvair
---------------------------------
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
Message 16
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Added a new page as promised.
Jeff
http://aeroliteproducts.com/Crankshafts.html
**************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape.
http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Marvel Schebler 10-4233 (MA3APA) |
You might check with White Industries, in Bates City MO, at 1-800-821-
7733. Ask for Marc Dickensheets. They have tons of engines, accessorie
s, airframe parts, and stuffff.=0A=0APaul Rodriguez=0A -----
Original Message ----- =0A From: Timothy Croy<mailto:twcroy@gmail
com> =0A To: zenith-list@matronics.com<mailto:zenith-list@matroni
cs.com> =0A Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2008 9:02 AM=0A Subject:
Zenith-List: Marvel Schebler 10-4233 (MA3APA)=0A=0A=0A -->
Zenith-List message posted by: "Timothy Croy" <twcroy@gmail.com<mailto
:twcroy@gmail.com>>=0A=0A All,=0A=0A Looking for a marve
l schebler carb, 10-4233, for a Continental A75-8F.=0A Original s
tromberg is icing up. Thanks in advance for any tips or=0A commen
=======================
=======================
//www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List<http://www.matronics.com/Nav
=======================
=======================
=======================
=======================
=======================
=======================
======0A=0A=0A=0A
Message 18
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Can anyone on the list give me a source of supply
for a 6.4 MM ( .252 dia ) reamer used to ream the
holes on the dual stick brackets .
Thanks in advance.
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: 6.4 MM reamer |
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=334-4092&PMPXNO=2614235&PARTPG=INLMK32
--------
Pavel
CA
Zodiac XL N581PM
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=159464#159464
Message 20
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You could try Grizzly Tool. But I don't think that can match that exact
size. Here are all their reamers:
http://www.grizzly.com/products/category.aspx?key=170080
They do have some adjustable reamers but I have no idea how well they work:
http://www.grizzly.com/products/searchresults.aspx?q=Adjustable%20Reamer
What does Zenith recommend?
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of EROC@bright.net
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2008 4:54 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: 6.4 MM reamer
Can anyone on the list give me a source of supply
for a 6.4 MM ( .252 dia ) reamer used to ream the
holes on the dual stick brackets .
Thanks in advance.
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Wing tip sheet |
Jim,
Welcome back. I framed the whole wing tip, top and bottom and used a joggle in
the short piece and fit it behind the top and bottom frame pieces. I also placed
my lights differently, no plastic, all metal.
http://mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=rlendon&project=113&category=1683&log=43427&row=3
--------
Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI
Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-)
http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=159486#159486
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: 6.4 MM reamer |
I picked up a bunch of reamers from these guys.
http://www.wttool.com/
--------
Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI
Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-)
http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=159493#159493
Message 23
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> The HDS wing cuts convective better than the HD wing, but the climb rate
> for the HD wing is something a HDS wing can't compete with.
> If I lived at altitude or in the mountains, I'd be building a set of HD
> wings for certain. It's an interesting question, choosing wings for speed
> or climbing capability.
do not archive
When first firming the decision on "What airplane?" to the 601, I thought
the best choice to be the HD as it "had" to be for lower time pilots like me
who needed a pussycat. This was '98 with the XL just an announcement.
A demo flight in old 63Romeo, a TD/HDS powered with an 80 HP 912 with Roger
in the left seat, told me that the little tapered wings looked mighty cool
and were not going to turn around and bite.
Up until that ride the thought of clipping a foot to a foot and a half off
of the HD wings had crossed my mind. Larry has written about the same
thing. If you have an HD and want a bit less drag and slightly higher wing
loading, ever consider that road?
Just for thought...jeff
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