Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:40 AM - Re: Zenith Response time (Paul Mulwitz)
2. 03:21 AM - Re: Re: Dynon's OAT sensor (David Downey)
3. 04:58 AM - Re: Accident (ashontz)
4. 05:28 AM - Re: Re: Accident (Iberplanes IGL)
5. 05:44 AM - Re: Re: Accident (Jay Maynard)
6. 06:34 AM - Re: Re: Accident (Dave Austin)
7. 06:37 AM - Re: Re: Accident (William Dominguez)
8. 06:39 AM - Re: Fish Eyes (steve)
9. 06:59 AM - Hesitation (george.mueller@aurora.org)
10. 07:04 AM - Monday Evening Chat Room (George Race)
11. 07:12 AM - Re: Re: Accident (John Bolding)
12. 07:15 AM - Re: Re: Fish Eyes..... (LarryMcFarland)
13. 07:16 AM - brs install (Tracy)
14. 07:25 AM - Re: Accident (ashontz)
15. 07:35 AM - Re: Re: Accident (Larry H)
16. 07:45 AM - Re: Accident (ashontz)
17. 08:00 AM - Re: Re: Accident in Spain (William Dominguez)
18. 08:49 AM - Re: Accident (Roger Lee)
19. 09:11 AM - Re: A/C Insurance when flying as Sport PilotA/C Insurance when flying as Sport PilotA/C (Paul Tipton)
20. 09:13 AM - Re: Re: Accident (nyterminat@aol.com)
21. 09:42 AM - Re: Fuel thread sealant ()
22. 09:54 AM - Re: Accident (Gig Giacona)
23. 10:00 AM - Re: brs install (Les Goldner)
24. 10:29 AM - Re: Re: Accident (Jeyoung65@aol.com)
25. 10:56 AM - Re: Re: Dynon's OAT sensor (Leo Gates)
26. 11:20 AM - Tricycle vs Taildragger Weight (Andrew Hinsdale)
27. 11:33 AM - Re: Re: Accident in Spain (ernie)
28. 12:04 PM - Re: Tricycle vs Taildragger Weight (Juan Vega)
29. 12:25 PM - Re: Re: Accident in Spain (Gary Gower)
30. 12:31 PM - Off Topic: Sun-N-Fun Questions (DaveG601XL)
31. 12:45 PM - Re: Re: Accident in Spain (William Dominguez)
32. 01:12 PM - Re: Off Topic: Sun-N-Fun Questions (ella)
33. 01:47 PM - Re: Re: Accident in Spain was a Zodiac 601XL and there is a picture. (William Dominguez)
34. 01:47 PM - Re: Fuel thread sealant (ronlee)
35. 02:00 PM - Re: Off Topic: Sun-N-Fun Questions (Bryan Martin)
36. 03:46 PM - Fuel Pump & Gascolator For Sale (Dr. Andrew Elliott)
37. 04:00 PM - Re: Re: Accident (Graeme)
38. 04:48 PM - Re: Re: Accident (n801bh@netzero.com)
39. 07:05 PM - XL - success stories (Tim Juhl)
40. 08:37 PM - Re: XL - success stories (pavel569)
41. 09:55 PM - Accident (Joe Scheibinger)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Zenith Response time |
Hi guys,
I hope I understand this issue correctly.
First, Zenith and Zenair are two completely different companies that
reside in two different countries. Zenith is in Mexico, MO in the
USA, while Zenair is in Canada.
Second, Zenith has several different email addresses. If you send
your mail to info@zenithair.com (I think) then Shirley is the first
one to see the message. She will respond directly and quickly if it
involves a quote for parts or other things in her domain. If it is a
request for technical support she forwards it to one of the
engineers. That could cause a variable delay in response depending
on which engineer is targeted.
Paul
XL fuselage
do not archive
At 09:39 AM 3/8/2008, you wrote:
>
>Zen Guys:
>
>Larry said: "Whenever I send any email to Zenith, it usually takes
>them at least a week to answer it. If you want better service, I
>suggest you pick up the phone and give them a call. You'll have your
>answer much quicker that way."
>
>My experience is the opposite. Three times recently I have sent
>Emails to Zenair and have gotten answers within 12 hours on each
>occasion. Of course, I could be asking easier questions.
>
>Stan
>N701VG
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Dynon's OAT sensor |
we discovered that the hottest surface on a 737 was the underside of the polished
horizontal stabilizer when the aircraft was parked at a particular orientation
on blacktop.
If you are sitting on hot pavement, seems to me the heat coming off
the pavement going to affect reading too. You could have a little
oven between the skin and the pavement. I'm not saying this is worse
than the sun, just that like everything else about flying, it's a
compromise.
Ron
On Mar 9, 2008, at 5:45 PM, Robin Bellach wrote:
> <601zv@ritternet.com>
>
> What does it read in the sun in a 100mph airstream?
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From:
> To:
> Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2008 1:36 PM
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Dynon's OAT sensor
>
>
>>
>> Out of curiosity, I just took my electronic temp probe out into
>> the sunlight. In the shade it read 45.3 degF; in the sun, 73.9
>> degF after about 4 minutes.
>>
>> Jay in Dallas
>> do not archive
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> David Downey
wrote:
>>
>>> ...could be - but the purpose is to give a reading while flying -
>>> and it would take a very black probe and flying very near the sun
>>> to have more than a very very small influence after the first
>>> several minutes of flight.
>>>
>>> Jaybannist@cs.com
>>>
>>> Dave,
>>>
>>> If I'm not mistaken, those probes were shielded so that the probe
>>> was not exposed to direct sunlight. The Dynon probe is not
>>> shielded.
>>>
>>> Jay in Dallas
>>> Do not archive
>>>
>>>
>>> David Downey
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I would have thought that the OAT was intended to read OAT - in
>>>> flight. In the past the probes were direct reading dial
>>>> thermometers and on many aircraft stuck right through the canopy
>>>> bow.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I mounted mine in the fuselage bottom in the access hole of the
>>>> co-pilot's seat just aft of the main carry thru spar. This
>>>> keeps it out the sun (very important) and away from the exhaust
>>>> gas. It works very good.
>>>> Dave Nixon
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>>
>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168400#168400
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dave Downey
>>>> Harleysville (SE) PA
>>>> 100 HP Corvair
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ---------------------------------
>>>> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo!
>>>> Mobile. Try it now.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Dave Downey
>>> Harleysville (SE) PA
>>> 100 HP Corvair
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------
>>> Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
100 HP Corvair
---------------------------------
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
Message 3
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Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks instead of the
15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that limits control
surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
Kevin Bonds wrote:
> Andy,
>
> Let's not jump to any conclusions here. Sounds more like there may have
> been a problem with the canopy, if I had to guess--which we shouldn't. I
> know an eyewitness stated that a wing /may/ have come off, but I doubt
> many eyewitnesses would know a wing from a rudder or any other part in
> that instance. Hopefully they will recover the plane. The wings could,
> very well, still be intact. Sounds like the canopy will not be since
> they found 3 pieces of it scattered on shore. The plane was supposed to
> have gone-in 700 meters from shore.
>
> Kevin Bonds
>
> ashontz wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Thoe extra wings ribs are looking better and better all the time.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168739#168739
Message 4
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We had an 601 XL down in Barcelona 2 month ago. Aparently, wing fold.
2008/3/10, Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com>:
>
> Si es por un ala, me comienza a preocupar. Voy a investigar y te cuento.
>
> saludos
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: ashontz <ashontz@nbme.org>
> Date: 10-mar-2008 12:55
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Accident
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>
>
> Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks instead
> of the 15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that limits
> control surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
>
>
> Kevin Bonds wrote:
> > Andy,
> >
> > Let's not jump to any conclusions here. Sounds more like there may have
> > been a problem with the canopy, if I had to guess--which we shouldn't. I
> > know an eyewitness stated that a wing /may/ have come off, but I doubt
> > many eyewitnesses would know a wing from a rudder or any other part in
> > that instance. Hopefully they will recover the plane. The wings could,
> > very well, still be intact. Sounds like the canopy will not be since
> > they found 3 pieces of it scattered on shore. The plane was supposed to
> > have gone-in 700 meters from shore.
> >
> > Kevin Bonds
> >
> > ashontz wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks.
> > >
> > > Thoe extra wings ribs are looking better and better all the time.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
> --------
> Andy Shontz
> CH601XL - Corvair
> www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168739#168739
>
>
Message 5
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On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 01:25:43PM +0100, Iberplanes IGL wrote:
> >
> > Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks instead
> > of the 15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that limits
> > control surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
> We had an 601 XL down in Barcelona 2 month ago. Aparently, wing fold.
Now I'm curious. How does ths square with the pictures on AMD's site of
load-testing the wings to +6G? I'm sure there's something I'm missing, but I
can't figure out what it is. Since I'm buying instead of building, I can't
add extra ribs or the like...
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (getting ready to order)
Message 6
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IMHO, it could well have been a bird strike - bits of the canopy spread
wide.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912, Spitfire Mk VIII
Message 7
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If you find a link to that accident in Barcelona please post it. I'm fluent in
Spanish so I can translate it, if it is in Catalan I can still get it translated
with the help some of my wife's family.
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami Florida
http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com> wrote: We had an 601 XL down in Barcelona
2 month ago. Aparently, wing fold.
2008/3/10, Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com>: Si es por un ala, me comienza
a preocupar. Voy a investigar y te cuento.
saludos
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: ashontz <ashontz@nbme.org>
Date: 10-mar-2008 12:55
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Accident
Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks instead of the
15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that limits control
surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
Kevin Bonds wrote:
> Andy,
>
> Let's not jump to any conclusions here. Sounds more like there may have
> been a problem with the canopy, if I had to guess--which we shouldn't. I
> know an eyewitness stated that a wing /may/ have come off, but I doubt
> many eyewitnesses would know a wing from a rudder or any other part in
> that instance. Hopefully they will recover the plane. The wings could,
> very well, still be intact. Sounds like the canopy will not be since
> they found 3 pieces of it scattered on shore. The plane was supposed to
> have gone-in 700 meters from shore.
>
> Kevin Bonds
>
> ashontz wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Thoe extra wings ribs are looking better and better all the time.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168739#168739
Message 8
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Thanks Gary.
Im at the Sun Valley Airpark. Located near Bullhead City / Laughlin.
I woke up last night in a sweat. My nightmare which is fact is this:::
My compressor is very old. Sometimes I use an oil / water separator and
sometimes I dont. I bet I sprayed the primer on without a filter .....
Today I m going out and see if I can purchase an oil seperator locally. I
ll also buy a new hose....
These small pin holes are a pain...
I think (know) that the finishing of airplanes is the most difficult task of
the whole project..
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: <gary@telleenpiano.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2008 9:36 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Fish Eyes
>
> Hi Steve,
>
> Where in Arizona are you located? I am located in Queen Creek and own a
> piano restoration shop where we do a lot of high end finish work. One
> overlooked place for contamination is your spray gun itself. Not only do
> you need perfectly clean, dry air and a clean surface on which you are
> applying your finish but the inside of the gun and hoses must be clean.
> Don't use any hoses or fittings that have been hooked up to a pre-oiler.
> If your gun has ever had fish eye eliminator added to any material sprayed
> through the gun you must always use the stuff for all paint jobs for the
> rest of eternity as your gun in now contaminated. The eliminator is
> actually a contaminate that helps to cover over another contaminate and
> will screw up subsequent finishes in the gun unless you add it to every
> paint batch. I have one gun that we use if we feel we have a need to use
> eliminator. My good gun has never had the stuff in it and never will. My
> advise is to use the eliminator as a last resort.
>
> I have completed my rudder and will soon be ordering the tail kit. Let me
> know if I can help you with your finish work in any way.
>
> Gary T.
>
>
>
Message 9
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I am having a hesitation when I put the throttle in on my 912UL powered
Zenith 701. The RPMs come up smoothly as I put the throttle in, but when
I get close to full power, I get a hesitation for about 1 or 2 seconds at
around 4800 RPM. Then, after this hesitation, the RPM continues on to
5200, which is what I am currently getting at wide open throttle on
takeoff. I am thinking there is something about the geometry of my
throttle cables that might be causing this but when I take the cowl off
and watch the cables move the throttle it seems pretty smooth all the way
to full power. Does anyone have any idea what might be causing this?
George in Milwaukee
CH 701 912UL
Message 10
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| Subject: | Monday Evening Chat Room |
Please join us for our Monday evening chat room starting around
8:00 PM Eastern (Daylight Savings Time now in effect)
http://www.mykitairplane.com/chat/
George
CH-701 N73EX (Reserved)
Message 11
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>
> , and some sort of overridable system that limits control surface/stick
> travel at and above manuevering speed.
CAREFUL THERE !!! think that thru before you limit (even with
override)control travel.
John
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Fish Eyes..... |
Steve,
To preclude the compressor feeding oil into your
paint, a Motor Guard M30 Filter is a good product. It will keep water,
oil and everything
else out. Not expensive, but really good product. Very large dense
filter downstream from a water and oil
separator on a compressor is about the size of a roll of toilet paper,
but very dense. Filters are replaceable and
not expensive. It's as good as it gets.
Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
steve wrote:
>
> I have an oil water seperator ( filter ) at the spray gun...
>
> To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2008 7:16 PM
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Fish Eyes.....
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
Message 13
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has anybody installed the brs chute canister in the extended bagage copartment
on a 701? how big do you make the plastic cover openin gin the skin and how deep
do you score the plastic so that it will break open when deployed?
thanks
Message 14
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I've already discussed this with Dave Downey and he likes my design.
John Bolding wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > , and some sort of overridable system that limits control surface/stick
> > travel at and above manuevering speed.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> CAREFUL THERE !!! think that thru before you limit (even with
> override)control travel.
> John
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168779#168779
Message 15
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No matter what the cause was, I personally feel the BRS would be a great investment
for "just in case you ever need it". You can't put a price tag on a system
that could potentially save your life.
---------------------------------
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
Message 16
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I'm installing one for sure.
[quote="skyridersbn"]No matter what the cause was, I personally feel the BRS would
be a great investment for "just in case you ever need it". You can't put
a price tag on a system that could potentially save your life.
> [b]
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168785#168785
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Accident in Spain |
Are you refering to this accident?:
http://www.elpais.com/articulo/cataluna/muertos/estrellarse/avioneta/vinedo/Subirats/elpepiespcat/20080206elpcat_28/Tes
The news doesn't mention make and model but it is about an 2 place aircraft that
apparently lost a wing in flight.
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami, Florida
http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com> wrote: We had an 601 XL down in Barcelona
2 month ago. Aparently, wing fold.
2008/3/10, Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com>: Si es por un ala, me comienza
a preocupar. Voy a investigar y te cuento.
saludos
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: ashontz <ashontz@nbme.org>
Date: 10-mar-2008 12:55
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Accident
Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks instead of the
15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that limits control
surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
Kevin Bonds wrote:
> Andy,
>
> Let's not jump to any conclusions here. Sounds more like there may have
> been a problem with the canopy, if I had to guess--which we shouldn't. I
> know an eyewitness stated that a wing /may/ have come off, but I doubt
> many eyewitnesses would know a wing from a rudder or any other part in
> that instance. Hopefully they will recover the plane. The wings could,
> very well, still be intact. Sounds like the canopy will not be since
> they found 3 pieces of it scattered on shore. The plane was supposed to
> have gone-in 700 meters from shore.
>
> Kevin Bonds
>
> ashontz wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Thoe extra wings ribs are looking better and better all the time.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168739#168739
Message 18
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Hi Guys,
Question:
If you were the pilot falling out of the sky, hurtling to the ground in total fear
to die what would you give at that moment in your life to get back on the
ground in one piece? If the answer is anything or everything then it sounds like
a BRS is cheap insurance and piece of mind!
This is the question that was ask of me in the early 1980's when flying ultralights
and the parachute for them first appeared. I have had a chute ever since
then.
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168808#168808
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: A/C Insurance when flying as Sport PilotA/C Insurance |
when flying as Sport PilotA/C
I am insured through Falcon, who is using AIG for my insurer. My
insurance went down 30% this year. I insure My 701 for Liability and
Hull insurance (not in motion). I am mostly concerned about the things
I have no control over in regard to the hull (windstorm, etc). Sure
makes me a little more conservative in the way I fly when the buck stops
with me.
You insure what you cannot afford to lose and assume what loss you can
afford to lose (so to speak). Insurance is not all the same even from
the same insurer. The cost and coverage of insurance can also depend
upon how the broker presents your "case" to the insurer. Experienced
brokers know what the insurance underwriter wants to hear and how he
wants to hear it. Underwriters knows the brokers he trusts and the ones
he doesn't. Anything an underwriter is not familiar with or is unsure
about will cost more. It is not about sticking it to anyone, it is
about risk, what they feel is acceptable, and what amount of money makes
the risk acceptable. Find a broker who knows their business and the
class of planes you are flying and try to stick with them. It pays in
the long-run.
CH701SP
321PT
170 hours
Message 20
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Andy, What no BRS chute????????????????
Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks instead of the
15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that limits control
surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
Kevin Bonds wrote:
-----Original Message-----
From: ashontz <ashontz@nbme.org>
Sent: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 7:55 am
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Accident
Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks instead of the
15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that limits control
surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
Kevin Bonds wrote:
> Andy,
>
> Let's not jump to any conclusions here. Sounds more like there may have
> been a problem with the canopy, if I had to guess--which we shouldn't. I
> know an eyewitness stated that a wing /may/ have come off, but I doubt
> many eyewitnesses would know a wing from a rudder or any other part in
> that instance. Hopefully they will recover the plane. The wings could,
> very well, still be intact. Sounds like the canopy will not be since
> they found 3 pieces of it scattered on shore. The plane was supposed to
> have gone-in 700 meters from shore.
>
> Kevin Bonds
>
> ashontz wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Thoe extra wings ribs are looking better and better all the time.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168739#168739
Message 21
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| Subject: | Fuel thread sealant |
But use the yellow Teflon tape, it is recommended as it is resistant
to gasoline. Also, snug plus a bit more may be applicable to flare
fittings but pipe fittings should be wrench tight.
Craig S.
N601XS, 601xl 0-235 lyc
I followed George's advice and used tape, but adhered to all the
caveats, especially the one about starting the tape a couple of threads
back from the end of the fitting. All have held since, and the bird
ticked over 315 hours last week. Maybe I torqued 'em a bit more or
maybe Teflon tape works better; all I can say is that it's nice not to
have to stand on my head and swap out fittings at the bottom of a header
tank more than once. No Teflon flecks or threads have shown up in the
gascolator screen.
-----------------------------------------
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delete the original and any copy of this e-mail and any printout.
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Message 22
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The biggest cost of BRS is the loss of baggage carrying ability. That's 30 lbs
back at the rear of the CG envelope.
I picked the 601 because it is a pretty good X-C aircraft. If adding a BRS negates
the ability of the aircraft to do the mission that I need it to do that is
to high a price to pay for what should never be used in the first place.
I've seen nothing to make me believe that any of the wing failure accidents have
been caused by anything other than the aircraft being stressed beyond the design
specs. And those wing failure accidents are the only failure mode that has
shown up in the 601 that the BRS would be the best option. In fact in at least
one or two of those accident I seem to remember that the BRS probably wouldn't
have helped because the aircraft was at low altitude when the failure took
place.
I have no problem with someone choosing to install a BRS but I personally think
that the a lot more lives would be saved if the $3K+ was spent on training instead
of the chute.
All aircraft ever built have been a collection of design compromises.
For those of you that seem to think there is a design issue I have to ask. What
the hell are you doing building one or more to the point flying one? If I thought
there was a design failure I'd sell mine for scrap.
Roger Lee wrote:
> Hi Guys,
>
> Question:
>
> If you were the pilot falling out of the sky, hurtling to the ground in total
fear to die what would you give at that moment in your life to get back on the
ground in one piece? If the answer is anything or everything then it sounds
like a BRS is cheap insurance and piece of mind!
>
> This is the question that was ask of me in the early 1980's when flying ultralights
and the parachute for them first appeared. I have had a chute ever since
then.
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168825#168825
Message 23
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Tracy
I installed a BRS soft-pack behind the baggage compartment rather than
following BRS's suggested installation forward of this bulkhead. I did this
because a deployment so close to my head would probably blow out my eardrums
and because I didn't want to loose a lot of baggage space. In my opinion,
the the BRS design for 701 installation is inadequate so I made some mods.
Regardless or whether you install the chute forward or behind the baggage
bulkhead you will need to add extra supports gussets to top and bottom the
bulkhead. I also added a 1/8th inch "L" horizontally side-to-side. The force
exerted by the rocket on the the tube (and subsequently to the bulkhead
would probably distort an unsupported bulkhead. This could prevent the chute
from deploying. BRS approved my mods based upon information I sent them and
should include these mods with their installation instructions for 701s.
One concern I had was that placing the 35-pound chute so far back would push
the CG too far aft. However, my empty CG (with 912 ULS power plant) came out
373mm aft of the front of the slats. (the allowed loaded range is 280 to
500mm). Even fully loaded, I can add up to 50# of baggage without exceeding
500mm. If I carefully keep the baggage CG forward (using a cargo net) with
my strengthened baggage compartment, I can have over 50# of cargo without
going over 500mm.
I can send you pictures of my installation if you email me;
<mailto:lgold@quantum-associates.com> lgold@quantum-associates.com
Les
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tracy
> Sent: Monday, March 10, 2008 7:14 AM
> To: zenith-list: matronics.com
> Subject: Zenith-List: brs install
>
>
> has anybody installed the brs chute canister in the extended
> bagage copartment on a 701? how big do you make the plastic
> cover openin gin the skin and how deep do you score the
> plastic so that it will break open when deployed?
> thanks
>
> Photoshare, and much much more:
>
>
Message 24
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Just my $0.02. In so far as there is a big difference between the 601HD(S)
and the 601XL wing has anyone looked as which type is being reported(?) as
having wing failure? Is there any report that has confirmed a wing failure on
any 601? Jerry of Ga. DO NOT ARCHIVE
In a message dated 3/10/2008 12:14:18 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
nyterminat@aol.com writes:
Andy, What no BRS chute????????????????
(mailto:ashontz@nbme.org) >
Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks instead of
the
15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that limits control
surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
.
**************It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms, and advice on AOL Money &
Finance. (http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolprf00030000000001)
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Dynon's OAT sensor |
45 years ago when I was a navigator in C-124s, I had to deduct 1 degree
centigrade from the in-flight OAT reading due to air friction on the
probe at our TAS (200K).
Jeyoung65@aol.com wrote:
> I think you are correct. The wind will transfer the heat from radiated
> heat and bring your reading down to air temp. Jerry of Ga.DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
Message 26
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| Subject: | Tricycle vs Taildragger Weight |
Hello Listers
Does anybody have a good estimate of the empty weight
difference between the 601XL Tri-Gear and Taildragger
versions? It seems like the TD should be lighter, but
how much?
Thank You
Andy Hinsdale
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Accident in Spain |
using http://babelfish.altavista.com/ to translate. I got this. Not much
more information in it, with out reading spainish.
do not archive
Two died when crashing a small plane in vi?o of
Subirats<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>The
neighbors saw c? the apparatus cay?ras to break one of its wings
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
*PERE LOBATO* *- Sant d'Ordal Pau - *06/02/2008
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>It
votes<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fdiario%2fcatalunya%2f>
Result [image: Without Inter?title =][image: Little interesting][image: Of
Inter?title =][image: Very interesting][image: Essential] 0 votes
[image: To print]<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2farticulo%2fcataluna%2fmuertos%2festrellarse%2favioneta%2fvinedo%2fSubirats%2felpepiespcat%2f20080206elpcat_28%2fTes%3fprint%3d1>
[image:
To send]<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2fenvios%2fenviar_noticia%2findex.html%3fxref%3d20080206elpcat_28.Tes%26type%3d%26anchor%3delpepiespcat%26d_date%3d%26aP%3dmodulo%253DEnviar%2526params%253Dxref%25253D20080206elpcat_28.Tes%252526type%25253D%252526d_date%25253D%252526anchor%25253D>
Two people were killed in Subirats (Alt Pened yesterday, when the small
plane that piloted desplom?n a zone agr?la of poblaci? The two v?imas?cos
occupants of the two-seater, were experienced pilots and all the indications
point at that the accident debi? a failure mec?co.
The news in others webs
- webs in Spanish<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2farchivo%2fbuscando.html%3fquery%3dDos%2520muertos%2520al%2520estrellarse%2520una%2520avioneta%2520en%2520un%2520vi%3fo%2520de%2520Subirats%26donde%3denotros%26idioma%3des>
- in other languages<http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.elpais.com%2farchivo%2fbuscando.html%3fquery%3dDos%2520muertos%2520al%2520estrellarse%2520una%2520avioneta%2520en%2520un%2520vi%3fo%2520de%2520Subirats%26donde%3denotros%26idioma%3dnes>
The small plane cay? the six of afternoon, to hardly 40 meters of the
field of f?ol of Sant d'Ordal Pau, main the urban n?eo of the municipality.
At that moment they trained in the field the youngest children of the local
equipment. The accident was present at numerous neighbors.
The deceaseds are Jordi Conesa, of 37 a, neighbor of Sant Cugat Sesgarrigues
and proprietor of the ill-fated apparatus, and his acompa?te Santi F. To, of
41 a, that *d'Esquadra *in Vilafranca was *mosso*. Both were experienced
pilots and even Santi ten?el card of private pilot.
The testimony of some neighbors indicates that the breakage of one of the
wings, preceded of one explosi? it was the cause of the accident. "If you
remain without one of the wings, you remain without direcci, it said Josep
Pinyar, manager of aer?omo of Avinyonet of the Pened? where the apparatus
was *hangarado.*
The pilots dispon? to return to aer?omo when seeing that he began to grow
dark. The breakage of the wing took place to three kil?tros of its destiny.
The accident was r?do. V?imas s? they had time to avoid ca? in the field of
f?ol, where one of the children of Jordi played, the neighbors explained. If
the t?ico failure had been of another type, possibly habr? been able to stop
the motor and to glide until aer?omo. The mayor of Subirats, Antoni Soler,
matiz?ue the apparatus to podr?haber had alg?problema with the motor.
Aviaci?Civil determinar?as exact causes of the wreck.
The neighbors who were in the zone approached until the place where cay?l
apparatus, next to the field of f?ol and to few meters of a house. The
firemen arrived 10 minutes despu? Last night, the firemen and *the
mossos*worked a?para to retire the small plane and to locate some of
their rest,
that fell throughout the?imos meters of their passage after explosi? Some of
these rest were in a radius of 300 meters. Brown the Lemuel young person
went in bici when oy?na explosi?y when raising the head saw the small plane
with a wing broken and giving piruetas before falling.
On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 7:56 AM, William Dominguez <bill_dom@yahoo.com>
wrote:
>
> Are you refering to this accident?:
>
>
> http://www.elpais.com/articulo/cataluna/muertos/estrellarse/avioneta/vinedo/Subirats/elpepiespcat/20080206elpcat_28/Tes
>
> The news doesn't mention make and model but it is about an 2 place
> aircraft that apparently lost a wing in flight.
>
> William Dominguez
> Zodiac 601XL Plans
> Miami, Florida
> http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
>
>
> *Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com>* wrote:
>
> We had an 601 XL down in Barcelona 2 month ago. Aparently, wing fold.
>
>
> 2008/3/10, Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com>:
> >
> > Si es por un ala, me comienza a preocupar. Voy a investigar y te cuento.
> >
> > saludos
> >
> >
> > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> > From: ashontz <ashontz@nbme.org>
> > Date: 10-mar-2008 12:55
> > Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Accident
> > To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> >
> >
> > Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks
> > instead of the 15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that
> > limits control surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
> >
> >
> > Kevin Bonds wrote:
> > > Andy,
> > >
> > > Let's not jump to any conclusions here. Sounds more like there may
> > have
> > > been a problem with the canopy, if I had to guess--which we shouldn't.
> > I
> > > know an eyewitness stated that a wing /may/ have come off, but I doubt
> > > many eyewitnesses would know a wing from a rudder or any other part in
> > > that instance. Hopefully they will recover the plane. The wings could,
> > > very well, still be intact. Sounds like the canopy will not be since
> > > they found 3 pieces of it scattered on shore. The plane was supposed
> > to
> > > have gone-in 700 meters from shore.
> > >
> > > Kevin Bonds
> > >
> > > ashontz wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Thanks.
> > > >
> > > > Thoe extra wings ribs are looking better and better all the time.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> >
> >
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Tricycle vs Taildragger Weight |
20 lbs.
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: Andrew Hinsdale <ahinsdale@yahoo.com>
>Sent: Mar 10, 2008 2:17 PM
>To: Zenith List <zenith-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Zenith-List: Tricycle vs Taildragger Weight
>
>
>Hello Listers
>
>Does anybody have a good estimate of the empty weight
>difference between the 601XL Tri-Gear and Taildragger
>versions? It seems like the TD should be lighter, but
>how much?
>
>Thank You
>Andy Hinsdale
>
>
>Be a better friend, newshound, and
>know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
>
>
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Accident in Spain |
Hello William,
A least in a yahoo group from Spain, where they were members, in message 22607
from Feb 08/2008 they post that it was a 601 XL, Is in the only post (in
lots of condolences and questions) that they mention about the possible airplane,
but nothing else.
Hope our friend "Iberplanes" can do a more certain follow up.
I found the post doing a google search of "Jordi Conesa" the owners name (God
Bless Him and his family).
Saludos
Gary Gower.
Flying from Chapala, Mexico.
William Dominguez <bill_dom@yahoo.com> wrote:
Are you refering to this accident?:
http://www.elpais.com/articulo/cataluna/muertos/estrellarse/avioneta/vinedo/Subirats/elpepiespcat/20080206elpcat_28/Tes
The news doesn't mention make and model but it is about an 2 place aircraft that
apparently lost a wing in flight.
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami, Florida
http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com> wrote: We had an 601 XL down in Barcelona
2 month ago. Aparently, wing fold.
2008/3/10, Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com>: Si es por un ala, me comienza
a preocupar. Voy a investigar y te cuento.
saludos
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: ashontz <ashontz@nbme.org>
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Accident
Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks instead of the
15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that limits control
surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
Kevin Bonds wrote:
> Andy,
>
> Let's not jump to any conclusions here. Sounds more like there may have
> been a problem with the canopy, if I had to guess--which we shouldn't. I
> know an eyewitness stated that a wing /may/ have come off, but I doubt
> many eyewitnesses would know a wing from a rudder or any other part in
> that instance. Hopefully they will recover the plane. The wings could,
> very well, still be intact. Sounds like the canopy will not be since
> they found 3 pieces of it scattered on shore. The plane was supposed to
> have gone-in 700 meters from shore.
>
> Kevin Bonds
>
> ashontz wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Thoe extra wings ribs are looking better and better all the time.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
---------------------------------
Message 30
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| Subject: | Off Topic: Sun-N-Fun Questions |
I am planning on attending Sun-n-fun for the first time. I will be flying commercial
and staying in the campgrounds there. Since I am flying commercial, I
will not be bringing the usual food preparation utensils, coolers or cooking supplies.
I have camped at Oshkosh may years now. Can I expect similar accommodations
as far as showers, port-o-potties, available food, etc.?? How about
local off-site eateries? Is the flight line close enough to the campground that
you can comfortably to walk to it?
Any hints on surviving Sun-N-Fun are appreciated.
Thanks,
do not archive
Dr. Ed, are you going to be there this year?
--------
David Gallagher
601 XL, tail & wings completed and
fueslage pretty well done. Working engine and electrical systems.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168859#168859
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Accident in Spain |
I didn't find much information in this news and I'm fluent in Spanish, the only
relevant info is that there is a 2 seater that broke a wing in mid air after
an explosion. I have found that other news sources that covered this accident
are talking about an engine failure as the cause.
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami Florida
http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
<ernieth@gmail.com> wrote: using http://babelfish.altavista.com/ to translate. I got this. Not much more information in it, with out reading spainish.
do not archive
Two died when crashing a small plane in vi?o of Subirats The neighbors saw c?
the apparatus cay?ras to break one of its wings PERE LOBATO - Sant
d'Ordal Pau - 06/02/2008
It votes
Result 0 votes
Two people were killed in Subirats (Alt
Pened yesterday, when the small plane that piloted desplom?n a zone agr?la of
poblaci? The two v?imas?cos occupants of the two-seater, were experienced pilots
and all the indications point at that the accident debi? a failure mec?co.
The news in others webs
webs in Spanish
in other languages
The small plane cay? the six of afternoon, to hardly 40 meters of the field of
f?ol of Sant d'Ordal Pau, main the urban n?eo of the municipality. At that moment
they trained in the field the youngest children of the local equipment.
The accident was present at numerous neighbors.
The deceaseds are Jordi Conesa, of 37 a, neighbor of Sant Cugat Sesgarrigues and
proprietor of the ill-fated apparatus, and his acompa?te Santi F. To, of 41
a, that d'Esquadra in Vilafranca was mosso. Both were experienced pilots and
even Santi ten?el card of private pilot.
The testimony of some neighbors indicates that the breakage of one of the wings,
preceded of one explosi? it was the cause of the accident. "If you remain
without one of the wings, you remain without direcci, it said Josep Pinyar, manager
of aer?omo of Avinyonet of the Pened? where the apparatus was hangarado.
The pilots dispon? to return to aer?omo when seeing that he began to grow dark.
The breakage of the wing took place to three kil?tros of its destiny. The accident
was r?do. V?imas s? they had time to avoid ca? in the field of f?ol,
where one of the children of Jordi played, the neighbors explained. If the t?ico
failure had been of another type, possibly habr? been able to stop the motor
and to glide until aer?omo. The mayor of Subirats, Antoni Soler, matiz?ue
the apparatus to podr?haber had alg?problema with the motor. Aviaci?Civil determinar?as
exact causes of the wreck.
The neighbors who were in the zone approached until the place where cay?l apparatus,
next to the field of f?ol and to few meters of a house. The firemen arrived
10 minutes despu? Last night, the firemen and the mossos worked a?para
to retire the small plane and to locate some of their rest, that fell throughout
the?imos meters of their passage after explosi? Some of these rest were in
a radius of 300 meters. Brown the Lemuel young person went in bici when oy?na
explosi?y when raising the head saw the small plane with a wing broken and
giving piruetas before falling.
On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 7:56 AM, William Dominguez <bill_dom@yahoo.com> wrote:
Are you refering to this accident?:
http://www.elpais.com/articulo/cataluna/muertos/estrellarse/avioneta/vinedo/Subirats/elpepiespcat/20080206elpcat_28/Tes
The news doesn't mention make and model but it is about an 2 place aircraft that
apparently lost a wing in flight.
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami, Florida
http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com> wrote: We had an 601 XL down in Barcelona
2 month ago. Aparently, wing fold.
2008/3/10, Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com>: Si es por un ala, me comienza
a preocupar. Voy a investigar y te cuento.
saludos
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: ashontz <ashontz@nbme.org>
Date: 10-mar-2008 12:55
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Accident
Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks instead of the
15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that limits control
surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
Kevin Bonds wrote:
> Andy,
>
> Let's not jump to any conclusions here. Sounds more like there may have
> been a problem with the canopy, if I had to guess--which we shouldn't. I
> know an eyewitness stated that a wing /may/ have come off, but I doubt
> many eyewitnesses would know a wing from a rudder or any other part in
> that instance. Hopefully they will recover the plane. The wings could,
> very well, still be intact. Sounds like the canopy will not be since
> they found 3 pieces of it scattered on shore. The plane was supposed to
> have gone-in 700 meters from shore.
>
> Kevin Bonds
>
> ashontz wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Thoe extra wings ribs are looking better and better all the time.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Off Topic: Sun-N-Fun Questions |
Hi
Short walk from campground but they also have shuttle trams that run
about every hour
Thanks don----- Original Message -----
From: "DaveG601XL" <david.m.gallagher@ge.com>
Sent: Monday, March 10, 2008 2:28 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Off Topic: Sun-N-Fun Questions
>
> I am planning on attending Sun-n-fun for the first time. I will be flying
commercial and staying in the campgrounds there. Since I am flying
commercial, I will not be bringing the usual food preparation utensils,
coolers or cooking supplies. I have camped at Oshkosh may years now. Can I
expect similar accommodations as far as showers, port-o-potties, available
food, etc.?? How about local off-site eateries? Is the flight line close
enough to the campground that you can comfortably to walk to it?
>
> Any hints on surviving Sun-N-Fun are appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
> do not archive
>
> Dr. Ed, are you going to be there this year?
>
> --------
> David Gallagher
> 601 XL, tail & wings completed and
> fueslage pretty well done. Working engine and electrical systems.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168859#168859
>
>
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Accident in Spain was a Zodiac 601XL and there is |
a picture.
I found this from from the accident page of ultraligero.net, the entry is at the
bottom:
http://www.ultraligero.net/Accidentes/08.htm
Here is a picture if you can make sense of it:
http://www.ultraligero.net/Accidentes/sant_pau.jpg
I've made a translation, keep in mind that I'm not a professional translator, just
someone fluent in Spanish:
02/05/2008
Subirats (Barcelona)
Zenair 601 XL
Jordi Conesa 37, and Santiago F. A. 41 members of the Penedes club have died. The
ultralight they where piloting crashed in an agricultural zone. The 2 victims
where experimented pilots and all indications point to a mechanical failure.
The aircraft crashed at 40 meters from the football camp at Sant Pau d' Ordal,
the principal urban nucleus of the municipality. At that moment, the benjamines
of the local team where training in the field. The accident was witnessed by
numerous neighbors. The testimony of some of the witnesses indicate that the
breakage of one of the wings, preceded by an explosion, was the cause of the accident.
The pilots where returning the the airfield when they realized that it
was getting dark.
I will keep looking for more info and will post if something new show up.
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami Florida
http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Hello William,
A least in a yahoo group from Spain, where they were members, in message 22607
from Feb 08/2008 they post that it was a 601 XL, Is in the only post (in
lots of condolences and questions) that they mention about the possible airplane,
but nothing else.
Hope our friend "Iberplanes" can do a more certain follow up.
I found the post doing a google search of "Jordi Conesa" the owners name (God
Bless Him and his family).
Saludos
Gary Gower.
Flying from Chapala, Mexico.
William Dominguez <bill_dom@yahoo.com> wrote:
Are you refering to this accident?:
http://www.elpais.com/articulo/cataluna/muertos/estrellarse/avioneta/vinedo/Subirats/elpepiespcat/20080206elpcat_28/Tes
The news doesn't mention make and model but it is about an 2 place aircraft that
apparently lost a wing in flight.
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami, Florida
http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com> wrote: We had an 601 XL down in Barcelona
2 month ago. Aparently, wing fold.
2008/3/10, Iberplanes IGL <iberplanes@gmail.com>: Si es por un ala, me comienza
a preocupar. Voy a investigar y te cuento.
saludos
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: ashontz <ashontz@nbme.org>
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Accident
Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks instead of the
15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that limits control
surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
Kevin Bonds wrote:
> Andy,
>
> Let's not jump to any conclusions here. Sounds more like there may have
> been a problem with the canopy, if I had to guess--which we shouldn't. I
> know an eyewitness stated that a wing /may/ have come off, but I doubt
> many eyewitnesses would know a wing from a rudder or any other part in
> that instance. Hopefully they will recover the plane. The wings could,
> very well, still be intact. Sounds like the canopy will not be since
> they found 3 pieces of it scattered on shore. The plane was supposed to
> have gone-in 700 meters from shore.
>
> Kevin Bonds
>
> ashontz wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Thoe extra wings ribs are looking better and better all the time.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel thread sealant |
My experience has been the same as Jeff's regarding leaks with other dope. I have
never had a leak with Teflon tape. If it is put on properly your fitting will
not leak and it doesn't have to real tight either. I have found that when removing
a fitting that has had Teflon tape the easiest way to clean out the female
threads of the Teflon residue is with a brass gun cleaning brush. Put it
in your drill motor in reverse and it will clean out all residue. I do not use
Teflon beyond the last fuel filter though.
--------
Ron Lee
Tucson, Arizona
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168873#168873
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Off Topic: Sun-N-Fun Questions |
If you have Google Earth, look up KLAL. The main portion of the
campground is just south of the approach end of runway 9 and the
overflow area is in the pastures west of there. Just to the east of the
main campground, two large wooded areas separate the it from the main
display area. The four large hangars in a diagonal row are used for the
indoor vendor displays with the outdoor display areas mostly to the
north and east of them. The homebuilt parking area is along the south
side of runway 9-27 just north of this main display area. From the main
entrance of the campground where most of the tent camping is to the main
display area is about a half mile walk.
The diagonal runway is closed during the show and most of the south side
of the airport is used for aircraft camping, ultralight and helicopter
flight demos, and aircraft displays. The warbirds are usually parked
along the diagonal runway.
The shower facilities and food vendors are similar to what you'd see at
Oshkosh. The main food court is set up south west of the four display
hangars. There is a corn roast run by an EAA chapter set up in the main
campground every evening during the show where you can get roasted sweet
corn, hot dogs and beverages pretty cheap. Another chapter puts on a
barbecue dinner on some evenings. There is also a camp store near the
main entrance to the campground, it was closed the last time I was there
due to hurricane damage but it should be back up and running now. The
forums and workshops are south east of the main display hangars.
Sun'N'Fun is a much smaller venue than Oshkosh with a much slower pace
and a lot less walking involved. Just don't step in any ant mounds,
those fire ants are a bitch. They spray for them every year but the
can't kill them all. The main camping area is usually clear of them but
I have encountered them in aircraft camping and overflow camping. Keep
your tent screens zipped up tight.
>
> I am planning on attending Sun-n-fun for the first time. I will be flying commercial
and staying in the campgrounds there. Since I am flying commercial,
I will not be bringing the usual food preparation utensils, coolers or cooking
supplies. I have camped at Oshkosh may years now. Can I expect similar accommodations
as far as showers, port-o-potties, available food, etc.?? How about
local off-site eateries? Is the flight line close enough to the campground
that you can comfortably to walk to it?
>
> Any hints on surviving Sun-N-Fun are appreciated.
>
--
Bryan Martin
Zenith 601XL N61BM
Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive
Do Not Archive
Message 36
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| Subject: | Fuel Pump & Gascolator For Sale |
Gang:
I have the following unused (new) fuel system parts for sale:
Facet 40105 Fuel Pump - $20 + shipping
($29.75 from AS&S, $42 from Zenith)
Zenith-mod (with tabs) Gascolator - $45 + shipping
($62.75 from AS&S, $81.40 from Zenith)
I modified my fuel system and these are now surplus to my needs.
Save me some time and get both for $60 + shipping!
Please contact me off-list.
Andy Elliott, Mesa, AZ
N601GE (reserved)
601XL/TD, Corvair, building...
Message 37
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Has anyone from the group considered a top wing strut for the ch601. (ag
cat!)
even a light strut would triangate the wing increasing the load bearing by
multiples.
I could be removed if you were sure you went not going to exceed the design
specs.
But would instill confidence for those wanting to fly in rough weather.
There may be a small trade off in drag.
I think it would be preferable to a BRS chute.
Graemecns
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jay Maynard" <jmaynard@conmicro.com>
Sent: Monday, March 10, 2008 10:41 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Accident
>
> On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 01:25:43PM +0100, Iberplanes IGL wrote:
>> >
>> > Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks
>> > instead
>> > of the 15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that
>> > limits
>> > control surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
>> We had an 601 XL down in Barcelona 2 month ago. Aparently, wing fold.
>
> Now I'm curious. How does ths square with the pictures on AMD's site of
> load-testing the wings to +6G? I'm sure there's something I'm missing, but
> I
> can't figure out what it is. Since I'm buying instead of building, I can't
> add extra ribs or the like...
> --
> Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
> http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
> Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
> AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (getting ready to order)
>
>
> --
> Checked by AVG.
> 10/03/2008 11:07 AM
>
>
Message 38
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You are going to need to find a very strong location to anchor it to the
fuselage. The only thing that comes to mind is where the instrument pan
el is. Altho it probably isn't strong enough to transfer loads from one
side to the other. If the 601's upper longerons are like the 801's they
will not stand to much of a side load..
IMHO
do not archive
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
-- "Graeme" <graeme@coletoolcentre.com.au> wrote:
u>
Has anyone from the group considered a top wing strut for the ch601. (ag
cat!)
even a light strut would triangate the wing increasing the load bearing
by
multiples.
I could be removed if you were sure you went not going to exceed the des
ign
specs.
But would instill confidence for those wanting to fly in rough weather.
There may be a small trade off in drag.
I think it would be preferable to a BRS chute.
Graemecns
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jay Maynard" <jmaynard@conmicro.com>
Sent: Monday, March 10, 2008 10:41 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Accident
>
> On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 01:25:43PM +0100, Iberplanes IGL wrote:
>> >
>> > Regardless, I'm adding extra ribs, going with the 12 gallon tanks
>> > instead
>> > of the 15, no wing-locker, and some sort of overridable system that
>> > limits
>> > control surface/stick travel at and above manuevering speed.
>> We had an 601 XL down in Barcelona 2 month ago. Aparently, wing fold.
>
> Now I'm curious. How does ths square with the pictures on AMD's site o
f
> load-testing the wings to +6G? I'm sure there's something I'm missing,
but
> I
> can't figure out what it is. Since I'm buying instead of building, I c
an't
> add extra ribs or the like...
> --
> Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
> http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
> Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
> AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (getting ready to order)
>
>
> --
> Checked by AVG.
> 10/03/2008 11:07 AM
>
>
========================
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Message 39
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| Subject: | XL - success stories |
Recent news has raised concerns again concerning the safety of the design of the
XL. It is proper to be concerned but what do we really know? While we are
waiting and wondering I'd like to hear from those of you that are flying your
XL. Perhaps you'd be willing to share with the rest of us how many hours you
have on your plane and a brief comment regarding your overall satisfaction.
Tim Juhl
--------
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Working on fuselage
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168928#168928
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re: XL - success stories |
The problem is - you'll never see an article in a newspaper about a "guy who fly
his Zodiac XL for so many hours without any problem". People just want to see
a debris on the ground that not a long ago use to be an airplane. It just a
nature of ours, I guess. If there is a problem with either an airframe rigidity
or material weakness, there would be hundreds of 601's in scrap metal junkyards
and hundreds of gravestones with pilots names on them. There is a few, of
course. But the reason can be over stressing the airframe by rough pilotage, lack
of craftsmanship or compromising quality when building. If we fly the Zodiac
as it is a Cherokee, not trying to get closer to critical loads, I think we
will be fine. Big words for a guy who will (hopefully) get his private license
next month, right? But I don't think that anyone who builds and/or fly wants
to kill himself. Just be friend to your plane, don't twist her hands, don't bent
her neck and she will be a good friend of yours too.
--------
Pavel
CA
Zodiac XL N581PM (Reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168941#168941
Message 41
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Got this from my friend in Austrailia. Looks like it was a story in the
local news paper.
Tony Wilson
11Mar08
A BIRD strike on some part of Garry Sweetnam's Zenith Zodiac aircraft is
being suggested as a possible cause of the crash which claimed two lives.
While the official investigation into the crash is just beginning,
Australian Wings Academy chief executive officer Phil Sweeney said he had
seen the damage a bird could inflict on an aircraft.
"We'll probably never know but I personally suspect it may have been a bird
strike," he said.
"We had a bird strike on a Cessna on its final coming into the airfield
about a year or 15 months ago.
"We've got Cessna 172s with a high wing on them and it hit about 3ft or 4ft
out from the fuselage on the wing and it left a huge dint.
"There were three instructors on board and they were actually doing
instructor training and it scared them.
"They landed but what really worried them was that if that hit the cockpit
window, it would have ended up in the cockpit and they could have been
completely knocked out or certainly so disoriented they wouldn't have been
able to land the plane.
"If Garry was getting along at 110 knots or 200km/h and a dirty great big
pelican or sea eagle hit them ... if it hit the wing then it could have torn
the wing straight off at the speed they were going.
"Or it might have hit the canopy. You just don't know. It's total
speculation.
"Until they find the remains of the plane and bring it up, you're just not
going to know."
Mr Sweeney said the one thing he was sure about was that whatever happened
in the air that fateful Friday, it would not have been pilot or plane error.
"Garry was just too safe," said Mr Sweeney.
Garry Sweetnam, 48 and Andrew Mitchell, 33, were on a short 20-minute flight
in the home-made kit plane to check it out before an air show, when it
plummeted into the ocean at Narrow Neck just after 4pm on Friday.
Another Gold Coast pilot who did not want to be named also said a bird
strike was the most likely scenario.
"Given Garry's safety record, it's what a lot of pilots have been talking
about," said the pilot.
"It makes the most sense, but obviously we will have to wait until the
wreckage is recovered."
That may not be until late in the week.
Water Police acting Senior Sergeant Mark Kelly said a Water Police boat
searched the area yesterday morning but with a 4m swell running it was
impossible to conduct a proper search.
"It's too rough for divers. We will have a Water Police boat out again this
morning," he said.
"But the forecast is worse than yesterday's, so we don't think we will be
able to put divers and the sonar back in the water until later in the week."
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