Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:24 AM - Re: Re: Looking for plans (David Downey)
2. 03:53 AM - Re: True Idenity (David Downey)
3. 04:02 AM - We have received your email (response@flight.co.za)
4. 04:03 AM - Re: CH701 Warpdrive (kmccune)
5. 04:11 AM - We have received your email (response@flight.co.za)
6. 04:11 AM - We have received your email (response@flight.co.za)
7. 04:19 AM - We have received your email (response@flight.co.za)
8. 04:19 AM - We have received your email (response@flight.co.za)
9. 04:25 AM - We have received your email (response@flight.co.za)
10. 04:26 AM - We have received your email (response@flight.co.za)
11. 04:34 AM - We have received your email (response@flight.co.za)
12. 04:34 AM - We have received your email (response@flight.co.za)
13. 04:49 AM - Re: True Idenity (ernie)
14. 04:53 AM - Re: True Idenity (ashontz)
15. 05:02 AM - Corvair 5th bearing (ashontz)
16. 05:11 AM - Re: Re: CH701 Warpdrive (Kevin L. Rupert)
17. 05:23 AM - Re: True Idenity (Jay Maynard)
18. 05:32 AM - Bird Strike! (cookwithgas)
19. 05:35 AM - Re: Re: Accident Hysteria (Jay Maynard)
20. 05:39 AM - Re: canopy for 601XL? (ashontz)
21. 05:45 AM - Re: Bird Strike! (Jay Maynard)
22. 05:49 AM - Re: True Idenity (Terry Turnquist)
23. 05:57 AM - Re: Corvair 5th bearing (Larry H)
24. 06:15 AM - Re: True Idenity (ernie)
25. 06:32 AM - Need a whole on plexiglass. (alex trent)
26. 06:41 AM - Re: newbie questions (Jim McBurney)
27. 06:58 AM - Re: Accident Hysteria (Iberplanes IGL)
28. 07:00 AM - Re: Accident Hysteria (William Dominguez)
29. 07:03 AM - Re: Corvair 5th bearing (ashontz)
30. 07:11 AM - Re: True Idenity (Larry H)
31. 07:11 AM - Re: Corvair 5th bearing (John Bolding)
32. 07:11 AM - Re: True Idenity (steve)
33. 07:13 AM - Re: True Idenity (steve)
34. 07:19 AM - Re: We have received your email (Larry H)
35. 07:19 AM - Re: Re: Accident Hysteria (steve)
36. 07:47 AM - Re: Corvair 5th bearing (ashontz)
37. 08:09 AM - Re: Accident Hysteria (Tim Juhl)
38. 08:09 AM - Re: We have received your email (Jaybannist@cs.com)
39. 08:12 AM - Re: Bird Strike! (jeyoung65@aol.com)
40. 08:23 AM - Re: Bird Strike! (steve)
41. 08:42 AM - Re: We have received your email (Aerolitellc@aol.com)
42. 08:50 AM - Re: We have received your email (Bill Steer)
43. 08:52 AM - Re: Corvair 5th bearing (Gig Giacona)
44. 09:07 AM - Corvair Groups (John Bolding)
45. 09:12 AM - Re: We have received your email (Matt Dralle)
46. 09:30 AM - Re: Bird Strike! (ashontz)
47. 10:19 AM - Insurance Rates! (Sabrina)
48. 10:35 AM - Re: Re: Accident Hysteria (Larry H)
49. 10:47 AM - Re: True Idenity (PatrickW)
50. 11:20 AM - Re: True Idenity (Southern Reflections)
51. 11:20 AM - Re: Re: Bird Strike! (Jeyoung65@aol.com)
52. 11:47 AM - Re: Bird Strike! (ashontz)
53. 11:55 AM - Re: Insurance Rates! (ashontz)
54. 12:03 PM - Re: Insurance Rates! (Sabrina)
55. 12:06 PM - Re: Insurance Rates! (ashontz)
56. 12:12 PM - Tube frames (Bob McArdle)
57. 12:18 PM - Re: We have received your email (Larry H)
58. 12:28 PM - Re: Bird Strike! (Larry H)
59. 12:35 PM - Re: 115mm flanging die needed (Terry Phillips)
60. 12:41 PM - Re: Tube frames (Craig Payne)
61. 12:48 PM - Re: Bird Strike! (ashontz)
62. 12:56 PM - Re: Re: It's official (Larry H)
63. 01:11 PM - Re: 115mm flanging die needed (Randy L. Thwing)
64. 01:21 PM - Re: Re: It's official (steve)
65. 01:39 PM - Re: Re: It's official (Keith Ashcraft)
66. 01:43 PM - Re: It's official (swater6)
67. 01:50 PM - Re: Insurance Rates! (Sabrina)
68. 02:16 PM - Re: Bird Strike! (kmccune)
69. 02:21 PM - Re: Bird Strike! (Gig Giacona)
70. 02:26 PM - Re: Tube frames (Gig Giacona)
71. 02:29 PM - Re: Re: Bird Strike! (LarryMcFarland)
72. 02:56 PM - Transponder/Encoder Wiring (Bill Pagan)
73. 02:57 PM - NASON Oil Presssure Switch (Bill Pagan)
74. 03:22 PM - Re: Bird Strike! (mwtucker)
75. 03:28 PM - Re: NASON Oil Presssure Switch (Jaybannist@cs.com)
76. 03:32 PM - Re: Re: Bird Strike! (Jeyoung65@aol.com)
77. 03:52 PM - Re: Re: CH701 Warpdrive (Graeme)
78. 03:52 PM - Re: Re: My figures don't compute (Cleone Markwell)
79. 03:57 PM - 601 XL Airspeed Indicator Markings (CHETKRU@aol.com)
80. 04:05 PM - Primer for semi-exposed steel (bcchurch)
81. 04:05 PM - Re: Re: Bird Strike! (Craig Payne)
82. 04:31 PM - Re: True Identity ()
83. 04:35 PM - Re: 601 XL Airspeed Indicator Markings (Craig Payne)
84. 04:53 PM - Re: True Identity (Dave G.)
85. 05:28 PM - Re: Primer for semi-exposed steel (John Lenhardt)
86. 05:30 PM - Re: Primer for semi-exposed steel (Tim Juhl)
87. 05:35 PM - Re: Re: CH701 Warpdrive (bob)
88. 06:29 PM - Painting XL nose strut (Tim Juhl)
89. 06:42 PM - Re: Painting XL nose strut (Craig Payne)
90. 06:53 PM - Re: Corvair 5th bearing (Ron Lendon)
91. 07:07 PM - Re: Re: Corvair 5th bearing (KEVINBONDS@comcast.net)
92. 07:07 PM - Re: True Idenity (Larry H)
93. 07:35 PM - Re: True Idenity (Southern Reflections)
94. 07:41 PM - Re: Re: CH701 Warpdrive (Graeme)
95. 07:57 PM - Re: NASON Oil Presssure Switch (PatrickW)
96. 09:04 PM - LIGHT AIRCRAFT (Graeme)
97. 10:26 PM - Re: It's official (hansriet)
98. 10:32 PM - Re: Re: My figures don't compute (Terry Phillips)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Looking for plans |
when I bought mine there was no charge to change ownership/registration.
JohnDRead@aol.com wrote: Bob,
I believe what you are suggesting is covered by a phone call and $50.00
to Zenith to officially change the registered owner of a plan set.
John Read
Phone: 303-648-3261
Fax: 303-648-3262
Cell: 719-494-4567
In a message dated 3/18/2008 9:36:33 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, FlyDad57@neo.rr.com
writes:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Robert Taylor" <FlyDad57@neo.rr.com>
Just a question here..... When/if one would buy second-hand plans, would
they not come with their assigned serial number? If so, wouldn't this solve
the problem of which you speak? If not, why not? Could a discussion be had
with Zenith to transfer the serial number to the new owner of the plans?
Would this not be to the benefit of Zenith? After all, they would stand to
gain another flying aircraft of their design instead of having the plans go
unused. In this scenario, Zenith has already received their money from the
original purchase of the plans. So, then, why wouldn't one try to find a
discounted set of plans from a now-disinterested builder? Just some
thoughts.....
Bob Taylor
Wadsworth, Ohio
----- Original Message -----
From: "MHerder" <michaelherder@beckgroup.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2008 10:51 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Looking for plans
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "MHerder" <michaelherder@beckgroup.com>
>
> If you wish to simply view a set I'm sure a local builder would be more
> than willing. Myself included if you are in the Dallas area, however I am
> sure that you will not find any economy in simply buying a set of plans
> from someone else.
>
> Remember this, you are not buying plans.... You are buying a serial # and
> support. You will have questions through the build and the folks at
> Zenith are who you want to talk to to get questions resolved. If you have
> no serial #, I wouldn't blame them for not answering any questions. In
> all fairness why should they. They are a company with a goal to make
> profit, not a charity. When you are all said and done with, you will find
> the 400 or so dollars for the plans isn't even a drop in the bucket.
>
> --------
> One Rivet at a Time!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170632#170632
>
>
> he es y --> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS nbsp;
- List Contribution Web Site ; ========================
---------------------------------
Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home.
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
100 HP Corvair
---------------------------------
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
do not archive
Hi Steve;
I am not going to be one who dumps on you - but I am one who continues to follow
the developments on the XL with great interest because I had started to build
before I was forced to end that effort. I like the XL. Period.
I learned to fly in the late 70s. Due to family pressures and other things I had
to give up flying until now. I still have no current medical and am not flying
actively at this time. When I do start again, I assume that it will be Sport
Pilot.
I have spent 35 years professionally int eh experimental and developmental departments
of Cessna, Lear, and now Boeing for the last 25 years. While I do acknowledge
that this background might increase my proclivity to actually dig deeper
than necessary, you must admit that it has given me exposure to many, many
experiences of test unit failures, flight aircraft failures (many times after
test units of that aircraft did not fail) as well as many aircraft that have flown
for decades without failures (or at least without design related failures).
I bring this up because there are several attitudes pervasive on this list that
are lethal in nature. Some believe religiously in CH being infallible (he is
one of my heroes). MANY others believe that following established (by blood and
grief as well as test) baseline sheet metal procedures has been superseded
by assembling a kit, there is a gross lack of understanding of aerodynamic loading
phenomena. There is a very broad attitude that assembling a highly developed
aircraft like the XL does not mandate a thorough self-education process before
making chips. The ready availability online for FREE download of the 4 bibles
for the A&P mechanic (AC65-9, AC65-12, AC65-15, and AC43.3-1B and 2A) and
the 4 Tony Bingelis books that can be purchased for a 5 minute effort online.
I AM concerned because when I was a pilot, I was not a "natural" - I sometimes
over banked on the turn to final, I fell out of a departure stall and almost pulled
the wings off a Cessna 150, I have done a flyby and pulled and rolled hard
at the exit. The XL is a clean airplane that meets the upper limit of the
LSA only by effort. As such, it is also a plane that will readily accelerate very
rapidly in the event of pilot error or false assumption.
We hear discussion of things like maneuvering speed with completely reversed theory,
we hear about moving weight to allow the nosewheel to touchdown lightly,
we hear about simply trying to stay inside the CG range. We do not hear about
the effects on stick force per G effects of being in the aft portion of th CG
range and other serious characteristics that the Big Boys spend millions of dollars
to make painfully clear.
My plans for my XL were simlpe: I wanted a clean, all metal plane with a blue blood
pedigree that I could prop for an aggressive climb and never worry about
the upper speed limit for LSA. I planned to operate solo other than the occasional
rider. Since I recall the fun of a flyby at flyins and the like, I had assumed
that this was not an issue - AND IT IS NOT. In the XL however, it demands
a very close attention to the character of the plane. This is a plane that goes
aft cg with fuel burn and with added occupant weight (as well as over weight
with ease). This means that I have to conciously remember that my flying technique
will have to be considerably different with a passenger and full fuel
that I would for the bulk of my normal flying. Since the XL has ample wing to
lift the added weight and the control authority to manage that extra weight,
it is very conceivable to me that I could get carried away and forget all those
constraints.
None of all this is any different than for any other plane - just perhaps easier
to get in trouble with.
As to the mods being discussed, I do not have any ax to grind on any of them and
have cautioned any who ask that any changes will shift the failure modes and
locations. Changes are a re-design - and testing done to date are meaningless
once changes have been implemented. Changes I was considering on my plane were
understood to be a redesign and the aircraft would have been registered as other
than an XL for that reason.
And that is why I continue to look closely at the question.
sooo, turn on the propane tank and point the nozzle in my direction!
steve <notsew_evets@frontiernet.net> wrote: I got blasted by one of this
sites members about four months ago. I mentioned to the group that sometimes
people are not who the claim to be. Years ago I belonged to the AvidFlyer
web group and this one member who called himself "Wang Chung" was always giving
out his suggestions on how to build and fly Avids. Then Wang showed up
on the Jabiru site telling everyone his suggestions on the care and feeding
of the 2200 Jabby.
Then off he went to the KitFox website.
Anyway, we members communicated from one site to each other site because of common
interests and similar aircraft.
To shorten this up I ll tell you that Wang was busted. We knew he was full of
bad advice and didnt have a clue.... Wang was not a pilot. Was not an aircraft
owner and had absolutely no experience. He was a wanna bee....
Again I m probably going to upset a few or maybe just one of you. I read things
that just dont make sense at times and I wonder.
In addition: if an aircraft company is having problems and not selling the product
they offer, yet Zenith is very successful, you might join a group like
Zenith Matronics and start bullshit rumors and keep bringing up how dangerous
the wings are etc......over and over again....
Sure we are all interested in having safe aircraft but the same people keep bring
up the dangerous problems the Zenith 601XL has.
Are you really interested or are you an undercover competitor trying to stir
up more B.S.
OK, time to dump on me....
Steve Weston
Im in the FAA registry and Landings.com
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
100 HP Corvair
---------------------------------
Message 3
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| Subject: | We have received your email |
Thank you. We havw received your email and will attend to it within 24 hours
Kind Regards
Flight.co.za
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: CH701 Warpdrive |
http://www.warpdriveprops.com/
Give them a call, others may be able to help with the starting point for the pitch,
but you really should get torque specs from the factory.
do not archive
--------
Mark Twain: Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that
you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream.
Discover.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170852#170852
Message 5
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| Subject: | We have received your email |
Thank you. We havw received your email and will attend to it within 24 hours
Kind Regards
Flight.co.za
Message 6
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| Subject: | We have received your email |
Thank you. We havw received your email and will attend to it within 24 hours
Kind Regards
Flight.co.za
Message 7
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| Subject: | We have received your email |
Thank you. We havw received your email and will attend to it within 24 hours
Kind Regards
Flight.co.za
Message 8
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| Subject: | We have received your email |
Thank you. We havw received your email and will attend to it within 24 hours
Kind Regards
Flight.co.za
Message 9
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| Subject: | We have received your email |
Thank you. We havw received your email and will attend to it within 24 hours
Kind Regards
Flight.co.za
Message 10
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| Subject: | We have received your email |
Thank you. We havw received your email and will attend to it within 24 hours
Kind Regards
Flight.co.za
Message 11
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| Subject: | We have received your email |
Thank you. We havw received your email and will attend to it within 24 hours
Kind Regards
Flight.co.za
Message 12
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| Subject: | We have received your email |
Thank you. We havw received your email and will attend to it within 24 hours
Kind Regards
Flight.co.za
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
Steve,
You have a good point.
On a building note, how hard is it to get the bushing 6W10-5 into the
aileron bellcrank? Do I need a press or
freeze it and tap it in?
Do not Archive.
On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 11:03 PM, steve <notsew_evets@frontiernet.net>
wrote:
> I got blasted by one of this sites members about four months ago. I
> mentioned to the group that sometimes people are not who the claim to be.
> Years ago I belonged to the AvidFlyer web group and this one member who
> called himself "Wang Chung" was always giving out his suggestions on how to
> build and fly Avids. Then Wang showed up on the Jabiru site telling
> everyone his suggestions on the care and feeding of the 2200 Jabby.
> Then off he went to the KitFox website.
> Anyway, we members communicated from one site to each other site because
> of common interests and similar aircraft.
> To shorten this up I ll tell you that Wang was busted. We knew he was full
> of bad advice and didnt have a clue.... Wang was not a pilot. Was not an
> aircraft owner and had absolutely no experience. He was a wanna bee....
> Again I m probably going to upset a few or maybe just one of you. I
> read things that just dont make sense at times and I wonder.
> In addition: if an aircraft company is having problems and not selling
> the product they offer, yet Zenith is very successful, you might join a
> group like Zenith Matronics and start bullshit rumors and keep bringing up
> how dangerous the wings are etc......over and over again....
> Sure we are all interested in having safe aircraft but the same people
> keep bring up the dangerous problems the Zenith 601XL has.
> Are you really interested or are you an undercover competitor trying to
> stir up more B.S.
>
> OK, time to dump on me....
>
> Steve Weston
> Im in the FAA registry and Landings.com
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
Yeah, I only have 500 hours in on my plans built project with a website with entries
and pictures at mykitlog.com and several thousand dollars invested in the
project, engines and tools, not to mention the time spent making the more expensive
tools, and a registered set of fairly expensive plans from Zenith, all
because I'm a troll. LOL
Then again, I could be exploring the issue with others here because I'm concerned
about what I have a considerable amount of work in and want to see the project
to completion and know it's reasonably safe and well built. You decide.
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170869#170869
Message 15
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| Subject: | Corvair 5th bearing |
Has anyone already made a 5th bearing for their Corvair conversion similar to what
WW is developing. I was thinking about this a few weeks ago before I even
knew he was trying to develop a 5th bearing. My concern at the time was more on
the lines of adding a true thrust bearing, but taking up some of the gyroscopic
forces isn't a bad idea either.
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170870#170870
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: CH701 Warpdrive |
This was taken right from the Warp Drive web page
> *Propeller Torque Values*
>
> *Propeller Bolt Torque Values--*All Standard, HP and HPL hubs that use
> 1/4" bolts to clamp the blades in the hub should be tightened to *120
> inch pounds*. All Rotax bolt patterns that use 8 mm bolts to clamp
> the blades in the hub should be tightened to *175 inch pounds*. All
> Standard, HP and HPL hubs that use 3/8" bolts to clamp the blades or
> mount the prop should be tightened to *35 foot pounds*. Warp Drive
> propeller installations on direct-drive aircraft engines and other
> engines used on airboats must tighten the 5/16" clamping bolts to *200
> inch pounds* and tighten the 1/2" flange mounting bolts to *60 foot
> pounds*. Torque 8mm bolts which attach the propeller hub to the
> engine flange to *175 inch pounds*. Adherence to these torque values
> is imperative for reasons of safety.
>
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 11:03 PM, steve <notsew_evets@frontiernet.net>
wrote:
> Sure we are all interested in having safe aircraft but the same people
> keep bring up the dangerous problems the Zenith 601XL has.
> Are you really interested or are you an undercover competitor trying to
> stir up more B.S.
I can't speak to anyone else, but I'm definitely me, and easy to find: my
address is posted on my home page, and you can look up the reserved N-number
or the ham callsign and get the same data.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)
Message 18
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This is amazing - This was on CNN.com this morning. Watch this video:
http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2008/03/18/dnt.ca.buzzard.smashes.into.plane.kovr
Scott Laughlin
601XL/Corvair
Finished & Flying
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170877#170877
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Accident Hysteria |
On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 10:28:03PM -0700, Sabrina wrote:
> Check out the S-LSA's fuel and exhaust system. The factory built had an
> exhaust system with 5 times the length of exhaust pipe, 10 times the
> amount of exposed (non-heat muffed and much hotter) surface and fuel lines
> running down both sides of the engine. The amount of leverage or stress
> on the exhaust ports for cylinders 1 and 2 are much greater on the S-LSA
> version.
now you've got me curious, because when I looked at the factory version
during my visit to the factory, it didn't strike me as being unusual as far
as GA exhaust systems go. Are there pictures of yours somewhere we can see
for comparison?
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: canopy for 601XL? |
Dave, to what extent can the canopy be changed and still be registered as a 601XL?
I'd love to have a Piper Cherokee style canopy, actual hardtop with doors.
Or even like the CH2000. The roofline on that basically extends all the way back
to the tail instead of a bubble canopy. Otherwise, the fuselage looks a lot
like the 601XL.
[quote="planecrazydld(at)yahoo.co"]I posted this question a while back and got
a few very vague responses but no leads I could follow up on. Does anyone know
of someone trying to match a RV6/7 canopy to the 601XL fuse?
The planview fuselage width distributions between the two planes, while similar
in overall width, have substantial differences in terms of wherer the maximum
girth point occurs and also in the direction of taper.
I bought the RV study plans so that I could develop CAD models of both installations
and see what the specific sticking points would be but have not done that
yet.
I realize that the after fuselage upper frames and skins will be reshaped and
raised a couple of inches to execute this change. I called Zenith and they told
me that the XL has, if anything, more than adequate directional stability/control
and that the increased height and more squared shoulders should not affect
the flight behavior in any detectable way.
Any comments? All comments please? Since I am scratch building the bulk of the
plane it is not an issue to develop and fabe the adaptation - if it is doable.
Thank you all.
Dave Downey
Harleysville (SE) PA
Zodiac 601XL/Corvair?
TV dinner still cooling?
> [b]
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170879#170879
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/ch2000h_190.jpg
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 05:29:47AM -0700, cookwithgas wrote:
> This is amazing - This was on CNN.com this morning. Watch this video:
> http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2008/03/18/dnt.ca.buzzard.smashes.into.plane.kovr
I saw that last night. If that's what happened to the guys in Australia, I
have no trouble believing that it caused the crash: what does having a
jagged hole in the canopy do ththe Zodiac's aerodynamics, not to mention the
utter distraction involved? That's if nobody got injured in the strike to
begin with.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
The aileron bellcrank bushing should slide in smoothly without slop and allow the
bellcrank to rotate freely around it. The bushing is held in place by the throughbolt
because it's slightly longer than the thickness of the bellcrank.
Terry
ernie <ernieth@gmail.com> wrote: Steve,
You have a good point.
On a building note, how hard is it to get the bushing 6W10-5 into the aileron bellcrank?
Do I need a press or
freeze it and tap it in?
Do not Archive.
On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 11:03 PM, steve <notsew_evets@frontiernet.net> wrote:
I got blasted by one of this sites members about four months ago. I
mentioned to the group that sometimes people are not who the claim to be.
Years ago I belonged to the AvidFlyer web group and this one member who called
himself "Wang Chung" was always giving out his suggestions on how to build
and fly Avids. Then Wang showed up on the Jabiru site telling everyone his
suggestions on the care and feeding of the 2200 Jabby.
Then off he went to the KitFox website.
Anyway, we members communicated from one site to each other site because of common
interests and similar aircraft.
To shorten this up I ll tell you that Wang was busted. We knew he was full of
bad advice and didnt have a clue.... Wang was not a pilot. Was not an aircraft
owner and had absolutely no experience. He was a wanna bee....
Again I m probably going to upset a few or maybe just one of you. I read things
that just dont make sense at times and I wonder.
In addition: if an aircraft company is having problems and not selling the product
they offer, yet Zenith is very successful, you might join a group like
Zenith Matronics and start bullshit rumors and keep bringing up how dangerous
the wings are etc......over and over again....
Sure we are all interested in having safe aircraft but the same people keep bring
up the dangerous problems the Zenith 601XL has.
Are you really interested or are you an undercover competitor trying to stir
up more B.S.
OK, time to dump on me....
Steve Weston
Im in the FAA registry and Landings.com
---------------------------------
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair 5th bearing |
In a conversation with Ron Lendon, he told me he is going with Roy Szarafinski's
5th bearing design. Roy's 5th bearing is still in the prototype stage but I'm
sure he will need a few good pilots to test his theory for him. From what
I can tell (which isn't much) his 5th bearing looks beefy and very impressive.
Here is his website:
http://roysgarage.com/Roys_Garage/Welcome.html
Hope this help you in your quest to find the "right one".
Larry H
ashontz <ashontz@nbme.org> wrote:
Has anyone already made a 5th bearing for their Corvair conversion similar to what
WW is developing. I was thinking about this a few weeks ago before I even
knew he was trying to develop a 5th bearing. My concern at the time was more on
the lines of adding a true thrust bearing, but taking up some of the gyroscopic
forces isn't a bad idea either.
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170870#170870
---------------------------------
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
The bellcrank bushing is too tight to slide in so there is no slop. Is this
normal? Do you have to ream out the factory part at all?
Ernie
On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 5:46 AM, Terry Turnquist <ter_turn@yahoo.com> wrote:
> The aileron bellcrank bushing should slide in smoothly without slop and
> allow the bellcrank to rotate freely around it. The bushing is held in place
> by the throughbolt because it's slightly longer than the thickness of the
> bellcrank.
>
> Terry
>
> *ernie <ernieth@gmail.com>* wrote:
>
> Steve,
>
> You have a good point.
>
> On a building note, how hard is it to get the bushing 6W10-5 into the
> aileron bellcrank? Do I need a press or
> freeze it and tap it in?
>
>
> Do not Archive.
>
> On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 11:03 PM, steve <notsew_evets@frontiernet.net>
> wrote:
>
> > I got blasted by one of this sites members about four months ago. I
> > mentioned to the group that sometimes people are not who the claim to be.
> > Years ago I belonged to the AvidFlyer web group and this one member who
> > called himself "Wang Chung" was always giving out his suggestions on how to
> > build and fly Avids. Then Wang showed up on the Jabiru site telling
> > everyone his suggestions on the care and feeding of the 2200 Jabby.
> > Then off he went to the KitFox website.
> > Anyway, we members communicated from one site to each other site because
> > of common interests and similar aircraft.
> > To shorten this up I ll tell you that Wang was busted. We knew he was
> > full of bad advice and didnt have a clue.... Wang was not a pilot. Was not
> > an aircraft owner and had absolutely no experience. He was a wanna
> > bee....
> > Again I m probably going to upset a few or maybe just one of you. I
> > read things that just dont make sense at times and I wonder.
> > In addition: if an aircraft company is having problems and not selling
> > the product they offer, yet Zenith is very successful, you might join a
> > group like Zenith Matronics and start bullshit rumors and keep bringing up
> > how dangerous the wings are etc......over and over again....
> > Sure we are all interested in having safe aircraft but the same people
> > keep bring up the dangerous problems the Zenith 601XL has.
> > Are you really interested or are you an undercover competitor trying to
> > stir up more B.S.
> >
> >
> > *
> >
> >
> > *
> >
> >
Message 25
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| Subject: | Need a whole on plexiglass. |
A lot of people may not know what a brace is. Not a very common drvice in these
days of batt. powered portable tools.
I think I sold my last one in a garage sale several years ago. It was a mistake.
alex t.
Time: 11:49:07 AM PST US
From: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net> <mailto:bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Need a whole on plexiglass.
I didn't use a power drill, I used a brace.
My fly cutter only has one cutting but, a two bit cutter would probably
be better, but mine worked, You just have to patient and use a light touch.
japhillipsga@aol.com <mailto:japhillipsga@aol.com> wrote:
> Bryan, you, of course, can do what ever you want, but I would not use a
> fly cutter and any power drill. If I was going to use a fly cutter I
> would use one with two cutting bits and an hand auger. Never touch plex
> with any kind of saw. You might survive, but chances are it will crack.
> Have you contacted the folks that make the canopy for their suggestion?
> Good luck, Bill of Georgia
> do not archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net> <mailto:bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com <mailto:zenith-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Mon, 17 Mar 2008 5:12 pm
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Need a whole on plexiglass.
>
> <bryanmmartin@comcast.net <mailto:bryanmmartin@comcast.net> <mailto:bryanmmartin@comcast.net>>
>
> I used a fly cutter mounted in a brace. Make sure the canopy is warm,
> start on one side and finish off on the other and then smooth off any
> sharp edges.
>
--
Bryan Martin
Zenith 601XL N61BM
Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive
Do Not Archive
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: newbie questions |
Hi, David,
Welcome to the "club"! What plane are you going to build? How old is your
son? I applaud you for embarking on such a project with him. I also envy
you that opportunity -- my son was 36 years old with a family of his own
when I started building. He visits me on occasion, but it's not the same.
Check out Countrysidewalk for used Clecoes, drill bits, and other tools.
http://www.countrysidewalk.com/. Go to the "Tool Shed" page. Most of your
Cleco needs will be for 1/4" reach, but I found a few 3/16", 1/2" reach,
were helpful. Harbor Freight has some good tools, some junk, but their
rivet pullers are good. The Zenith rivet puller is VERY susceptible to
over-pressure (don't ask why I know!) and won't reach some of the tight
places as well as the HF unit does. Zenith will sell you machined
nosepieces or will machine yours if you send them to Mexico, MO., or you can
anneal them and form them yourself. There was a post here some time ago
about that. Check archives.
Blue skies and tailwinds
Jim
CH-801
DeltaHawk diesel
Augusta GA
90% done, 90% left
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Accident Hysteria |
Hello Dave,
Take into account the 601 crashed in Barcelona was an XL.
Bye,
Alberto Martin
Iberplanes IGL
http://www.iberplanes.es
Igualada - Barcelona - Espa=F1a
----- Original Message -----
From: Dave Nixon
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 12:38 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Accident Hysteria
I have been reading about the nahsayers regarding the safety of
the Zodiac CH601XL for over a week now. And frankly, I was starting to
get worried about my recently completed project that just passed the
Airworthiness inspection Friday last.
So I started investigating the Accidents everyone was referring
to. Here is a recap.
NTSB ID: DFW07LA102 - CH601 XL - 9 month sport Pilot flew into
weather at 12:45PM 05/02/07, destroying the airplane in flight. He flew
into heavy IMC. Now what would a 9 month sport Pilot Operator being
doing in IMC? I just can't fathom it. And while doing so, torn the
wings off. I do not feel that this is a design flaw but a 'Stupid Pilot
Trick'. Unfortunately, he probably didn't have enough hours to know
that.
NTSB ID: LAX07LA218 - CH601 HDS- VFR - pulled power on base and
needed power on final - couldn't get his 912 S to respond. He hit a
house, flipped over. Upon examination, NTSB found that both carb bowls
were varnished and empty. Throttle cable was severely frayed. Owner
stated that he ran the engine about 11 times during the 6 year build
process. He ran it most during the recent taxi tests. This was his
first flight.
And that, my friends is it for CH601s in America.
And then we have the CH601XL Australian accident of an apparent
canopy-bird collision (NO wing detachment) and CH601HDS in Spain which,
at this time appears to be pilot error (Stupid Pilot trick).
It is good to be cautious but to call for a massive
investigation due to a 'chicken little' mentality is absolutely not
called for. Our time would be better spent learning all we can about the
airplane and its powerplant by following AC90-89 to the letter and being
safety conscious.
You all can do what you want, but I am taking myself out of the
"I'm In" gang. What I built is safe and well designed. Watch the NTSB
reports for my first flight if you wish.
Dave Nixon
CH601XL 3300 tail No: N107R
Airworthiness Inspected and ready for testing.
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Accident Hysteria |
Every now and then I see posts from people who don't seem to be clear as to what
accidents/incidents are the ones causing concern. For the benefit of these peoples,
here are the incidents in question:
LAX06LA105 Oakdale, CA. Wing folded up. A witness stated that he saw the wings
"visibly vibrate" and then "left wing collapsed and folded rearward against the
fuselage"
DFW07LA102 Canadian, TX. This is the guy that flew into IMC and his plane broke
up in flight. No witnesses.
LAX07FA026 Yuba City, CA. A factory build AMD that broke up in flight. One witness
sated that he heard an explosion and "observed the center section of the airplane
falling straight down"
Then you have the Australian and Spanish incidents.
In the Australian incident, a bird strike is suspected.
In the Spanish incident, a wing folding up in flight is suspected.
Another 2 incidents that have fueled concerns are the 2 cases of wing flutter,
one by a member of this list when he overflew a power plant and a the other one
that affected an AMD Zodiac in South Florida.
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami Florida
http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair 5th bearing |
Thanks for the info. I think it's a good idea. All of this talk of nitriding the
crank really means that the prop needs it's own real support. The Corvair is
a great engine, but it wasn't designed as an aircraft engine, even though it's
90% there. Something like a fifth bearing is mandatory in my mind. Then it really
is an aircraft engine. I'd still nitride the crank, but with a 5th bearing,
it probably wouldn't need it. From what I've read, the nitriding is really
only adding a 15/1000th hard skin so to speak over a still more flexible shaft.
Yeah, it'll make it stronger, but it's still a crust over a softer center.
The 5th bearing makes more sense.
You wouldn't just hook a car engine up to a wheel, the wheel is supported by it's
own housing. Same with this deal.
[quote="skyridersbn"]In a conversation with Ron Lendon, he told me he is going
with Roy Szarafinski's 5th bearing design. Roy's 5th bearing is still in the prototype
stage but I'm sure he will need a few good pilots to test his theory
for him. From what I can tell (which isn't much) his 5th bearing looks beefy
and very impressive. Here is his website:
http://roysgarage.com/Roys_Garage/Welcome.html (http://roysgarage.com/Roys_Garage/Welcome.html)
Hope this help you in your quest to find the "right one".
Larry H
ashontz wrote:
Has anyone already made a 5th bearing for their Corvair conversion similar to what
WW is developing. I was thinking about this a few Be a better friend,
newshound, and
> [b]
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170907#170907
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
I for one have said it before, if my wife EVER read any of this "GLOOM AND DOOM"
about aircraft failures, she would NEVER set foot in my Zodiac and she would
HOUND ME until the ends of the Earth to STOP BUILDING THIS DEATH TRAP......I
was HOPING we could change the subject matter also, but it seems "we" feel the
NEED to beat it to death (literally) some more.......I too am very well aware
of the risks involved and I promise I will do my level best to build my aircraft
according to the print. I will fly it as I safely know how to do and I will
NOT do any erratic maneuvers with it. I'm positive everyone on this forum
are going to be doing the same. Now with all that being said, I will ask again....can
we change the subject matter and get on to something more enlightening
and helpful, PLEASE?????
Thank you!
Larry Hursh
Edwardsburg, Mi (N601LL Reserved)
CH 601 XL
Jay Maynard <jmaynard@conmicro.com> wrote:
On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 11:03 PM, steve
wrote:
> Sure we are all interested in having safe aircraft but the same people
> keep bring up the dangerous problems the Zenith 601XL has.
> Are you really interested or are you an undercover competitor trying to
> stir up more B.S.
I can't speak to anyone else, but I'm definitely me, and easy to find: my
address is posted on my home page, and you can look up the reserved N-number
or the ham callsign and get the same data.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)
---------------------------------
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair 5th bearing |
do not archive,
Yes, several.
As Larry pointed out Roy's is in the first phase of production, it's the one
I'm going to use, I've seen his work during the last 2 yrs and he has a
thorough understanding of the challenges of this installation. The Corvair
group might be a better place to ask as this subject is discussed almost
daily.
John
----- Original Message -----
From: "ashontz" <ashontz@nbme.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 6:58 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Corvair 5th bearing
>
> Has anyone already made a 5th bearing for their Corvair conversion similar
> to what WW is developing. I was thinking about this a few weeks ago before
> I even knew he was trying to develop a 5th bearing. My concern at the time
> was more on the lines of adding a true thrust bearing, but taking up some
> of the gyroscopic forces isn't a bad idea either.
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
Terry
Mine is a Quick build kit and the bushing was installed when I received
it from Zenith. Sorry I cant help you on this..
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: Terry Turnquist
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 5:46 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: True Idenity
The aileron bellcrank bushing should slide in smoothly without slop
and allow the bellcrank to rotate freely around it. The bushing is held
in place by the throughbolt because it's slightly longer than the
thickness of the bellcrank.
Terry
ernie <ernieth@gmail.com> wrote:
Steve,
You have a good point.
On a building note, how hard is it to get the bushing 6W10-5 into
the aileron bellcrank? Do I need a press or
freeze it and tap it in?
Do not Archive.
On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 11:03 PM, steve
<notsew_evets@frontiernet.net> wrote:
I got blasted by one of this sites members about four months ago.
I mentioned to the group that sometimes people are not who the claim to
be. Years ago I belonged to the AvidFlyer web group and this one
member who called himself "Wang Chung" was always giving out his
suggestions on how to build and fly Avids. Then Wang showed up on the
Jabiru site telling everyone his suggestions on the care and feeding of
the 2200 Jabby.
Then off he went to the KitFox website.
Anyway, we members communicated from one site to each other site
because of common interests and similar aircraft.
To shorten this up I ll tell you that Wang was busted. We knew he
was full of bad advice and didnt have a clue.... Wang was not a pilot.
Was not an aircraft owner and had absolutely no experience. He was a
wanna bee....
Again I m probably going to upset a few or maybe just one of you.
I read things that just dont make sense at times and I wonder.
In addition: if an aircraft company is having problems and not
selling the product they offer, yet Zenith is very successful, you might
join a group like Zenith Matronics and start bullshit rumors and keep
bringing up how dangerous the wings are etc......over and over again....
Sure we are all interested in having safe aircraft but the same
people keep bring up the dangerous problems the Zenith 601XL has.
Are you really interested or are you an undercover competitor
trying to stir up more B.S.
Message 33
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|
| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
Some of us did..................................
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jay Maynard" <jmaynard@conmicro.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 5:20 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: True Idenity
>
> On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 11:03 PM, steve <notsew_evets@frontiernet.net>
> wrote:
>> Sure we are all interested in having safe aircraft but the same people
>> keep bring up the dangerous problems the Zenith 601XL has.
>> Are you really interested or are you an undercover competitor trying to
>> stir up more B.S.
>
> I can't speak to anyone else, but I'm definitely me, and easy to find: my
> address is posted on my home page, and you can look up the reserved
> N-number
> or the ham callsign and get the same data.
> --
> Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
> http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
> Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
> AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)
>
>
>
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: We have received your email |
Is anyone else getting this message?? What is it referring to? I'm wondering if
someone has infiltrated our forum with something bad....I've had two of these
messages this morning now.
Larry H
"response@flight.co.za" <martyn@flight.co.za> wrote:
Thank you. We havw received your email and will attend to it within 24 hours
Kind Regards
Flight.co.za
---------------------------------
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Accident Hysteria |
And with the Aussie crash the "witness" first interviewed said " The
PROP STALLED". Go figure....SW
----- Original Message -----
From: William Dominguez
To: Matronics List
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 6:57 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Accident Hysteria
Every now and then I see posts from people who don't seem to be clear
as to what accidents/incidents are the ones causing concern. For the
benefit of these peoples, here are the incidents in question:
LAX06LA105 Oakdale, CA. Wing folded up. A witness stated that he saw
the wings "visibly vibrate" and then "left wing collapsed and folded
rearward against the fuselage"
DFW07LA102 Canadian, TX. This is the guy that flew into IMC and his
plane broke up in flight. No witnesses.
LAX07FA026 Yuba City, CA. A factory build AMD that broke up in flight.
One witness sated that he heard an explosion and "observed the center
section of the airplane falling straight down"
Then you have the Australian and Spanish incidents.
In the Australian incident, a bird strike is suspected.
In the Spanish incident, a wing folding up in flight is suspected.
Another 2 incidents that have fueled concerns are the 2 cases of wing
flutter, one by a member of this list when he overflew a power plant and
a the other one that affected an AMD Zodiac in South Florida.
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami Florida
http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair 5th bearing |
Who's the Corvair group? Got a link?
John Bolding wrote:
> do not archive,
>
> Yes, several.
>
> As Larry pointed out Roy's is in the first phase of production, it's the one
> I'm going to use, I've seen his work during the last 2 yrs and he has a
> thorough understanding of the challenges of this installation. The Corvair
> group might be a better place to ask as this subject is discussed almost
> daily.
> John
>
>
> ---
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170933#170933
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| Subject: | Re: Accident Hysteria |
While not commenting on the design of the XL I do want to make a comment on pilot
skills. I have been a pilot over thirty years and CFII for 23. I also used
to go to a lot of airshows as crew of a WWII B25. I met a lot of very experienced
and sometimes "famous" pilots, that have since killed themselves in airplanes.
What I have learned from all this and what I remind myself each time I fly is that
anyone can use poor judgement and anyone can make a mistake. Not enough fuel,
too short a runway, weather worse than forecast, etc. All these are traps
waiting for the unwary. Some pilots just don't know any better, while others
know better but think that their superior skills will carry them thru. Regardless
of your ratings or flight hours, when you start getting too comfortable
in an airplane the alarm bells should be going off.
I have no plans to quit building my XL. I intend to build it to the plans, fly
it within the design envelope and keep my eyes open for anything that might lead
to trouble. I'll also continue to follow the comments expressed on this list
but will put my faith in facts, not conjecture. Discussion is healthy and
can help lead to solutions, but so much of what I've read recently seems to
have little substance backing it up. I know it is hard to be patient but I think
the answers we're all waiting for will soon be forthcoming and that we should
try to take a calm and reasoned approach to the issue.
Tim
Do not archive
--------
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Working on fuselage
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170938#170938
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| Subject: | Re: We have received your email |
I received six or seven of those.
Jay in Dallas
Do not archive
Larry H <skyridersbn@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Is anyone else getting this message?? What is it referring to? I'm wondering
if someone has infiltrated our forum with something bad....I've had two of these
messages this morning now.
>
> Larry H
>
>"response@flight.co.za" <martyn@flight.co.za> wrote:
>
>Thank you. We havw received your email and will attend to it within 24 hours
>Kind Regards
>
>Flight.co.za
>
>
>
>---------------------------------
>Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
>
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
Looking at the aircraft makes me a believer of a windshield. The right side of
his windshield is gone. I would think that the fact that the top of the wind
shield is attached to the wing and the side is attached to the fuse. saved the
pilots life. The pilot is lucky because had hit in front of him, as he said it
could have been over for him. Jerry of GA
-----Original Message-----
From: Jay Maynard <jmaynard@conmicro.com>
Sent: Wed, 19 Mar 2008 8:39 am
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Bird Strike!
On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 05:29:47AM -0700, cookwithgas wrote:
> This is amazing - This was on CNN.com this morning. Watch this video:
> http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2008/03/18/dnt.ca.buzzard.smashes.into.plane.kovr
I saw that last night. If that's what happened to the guys in Australia, I
have no trouble believing that it caused the crash: what does having a
jagged hole in the canopy do ththe Zodiac's aerodynamics, not to mention the
utter distraction involved? That's if nobody got injured in the strike to
begin with.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
And to add,,,, Cessna windshields are extreamly tough....
SW
----- Original Message -----
From: jeyoung65@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 8:09 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Bird Strike!
Looking at the aircraft makes me a believer of a windshield. The right
side of his windshield is gone. I would think that the fact that the top
of the wind shield is attached to the wing and the side is attached to
the fuse. saved the pilots life. The pilot is lucky because had hit in
front of him, as he said it could have been over for him. Jerry of GA
-----Original Message-----
From: Jay Maynard <jmaynard@conmicro.com>
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wed, 19 Mar 2008 8:39 am
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Bird Strike!
On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 05:29:47AM -0700, cookwithgas wrote:
> This is amazing - This was on CNN.com this morning. Watch this video:
>
http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2008/03/18/dnt.ca.buzzard.smashes.int
o.plane.kovr
I saw that last night. If that's what happened to the guys in Australia,
I
have no trouble believing that it caused the crash: what does having a
jagged hole in the canopy do ththe Zodiac's aerodynamics, not to mention
the
utter distraction involved? That's if nobody got injured in the strike
to
begin with.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Supercharge your AIM. Get the AIM toolbar for your browser.
Message 41
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| Subject: | Re: We have received your email |
It's a auto reply.
**************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
Home.
(http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
Message 42
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| Subject: | Re: We have received your email |
Yeah, me too. More like eight or ten.
Bill
Do not archive
Jaybannist@cs.com wrote:
>
> I received six or seven of those.
>
> Jay in Dallas
> Do not archive
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair 5th bearing |
http://mylist.net/listinfo/corvaircraft
ashontz wrote:
> Who's the Corvair group? Got a link?
>
>
>
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170955#170955
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Start with Corvaircraft.com and wander around there awhile, join the mail
list, pretty active group, sometimes as acidic as this one. There are a
BUNCH of guys in the group that UNDERSTAND what's going on in an engine and
a few that (just like here) that shoot just to hear the gun go off.
Also there is a couple of Yahoo groups , Vairplanes and CorvAircraft,
they are a little better behaved.
LO&SLO John
>
> Who's the Corvair group? Got a link?
>
>
Message 45
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| Subject: | Re: We have received your email |
At 08:38 AM 3/19/2008 Wednesday, you wrote:
>It's a auto reply.
>
I have unsubscribed them for now.
Matt Dralle
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
Message 46
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
You mean as opposed to a bubble canopy?
jeyoung65(at)aol.com wrote:
> Looking at the aircraft makes me a believer of a windshield. The right side of
his windshield is gone. I would think that the fact that the top of the wind
shield is attached to the wing and the side is attached to the fuse. saved the
pilots life. The pilot is lucky because had hit in front of him, as he said
it could have been over for him. Jerry of GA
>
>
>
>
>
> --
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170965#170965
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| Subject: | Insurance Rates! |
Great Lunch Time News...
I have been quoted $331 for 1M liability insurance on my 150.
I have been quoted $389 for 1M liability insurance on my Sabrina (XL).
I have been quoted $1 for each 50 of hull in motion coverage for my 150.
I have been quoted $1 for each 25 of hull in motion coverage for my Sabrina (XL).
Two caveats as to the Sabrina E-LSA only:
No coverage for any occurrence with a PIC who has less than 2 hours PIC in the
Sabrina prior to the flight in question.
All maintenance, repairs and modifications MUST be signed off by an IA, AP or E-LSA
Repairman with Inspection rating. All Service Bulletins issued by Sabrina
Aircraft Manufacturing (not Zenith) must be complied with.
The quote before the maiden flight was around $2400--just before New Years' eve--they
would not break out hull/liability at that point.
The agent finds humor in the fact that I can manufacture an aircraft at age 14
but I can't sign off a repair it until I am 18.
off to classes...
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170978#170978
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| Subject: | Re: Accident Hysteria |
Well said Tim - my sentiments exactly!
Larry H
Tim Juhl <juhl@avci.net> wrote:
While not commenting on the design of the XL I do want to make a comment on pilot
skills. I have been a pilot over thirty years and CFII for 23. I also used
to go to a lot of airshows as crew of a WWII B25. I met a lot of very experienced
and sometimes "famous" pilots, that have since killed themselves in airplanes.
What I have learned from all this and what I remind myself each time I fly is that
anyone can use poor judgement and anyone can make a mistake. Not enough fuel,
too short a runway, weather worse than forecast, etc. All these are traps
waiting for the unwary. Some pilots just don't know any better, while others know
better but think that their superior skills will carry them thru. Regardless
of your ratings or flight hours, when you start getting too comfortable in
an airplane the alarm bells should be going off.
I have no plans to quit building my XL. I intend to build it to the plans, fly
it within the design envelope and keep my eyes open for anything that might lead
to trouble. I'll also continue to follow the comments expressed on this list
but will put my faith in facts, not conjecture. Discussion is healthy and can
help lead to solutions, but so much of what I've read recently seems to have
little substance backing it up. I know it is hard to be patient but I think the
answers we're all waiting for will soon be forthcoming and that we should try
to take a calm and reasoned approach to the issue.
Tim
Do not archive
--------
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Working on fuselage
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170938#170938
---------------------------------
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
Message 49
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
skyridersbn wrote:
> if my wife EVER read any of this "GLOOM AND DOOM" about aircraft failures, she
would NEVER
Oh, man, don't even get me started on this one. [Evil or Very Mad]
I'm the guy who's neighbors came over to talk to my wife about my airplane project
while I was away at Oshkosh last year. Turns out that one of the guys in
the N105RH crash (Oakdale, CA) was the best man at my neighbor's wedding, so of
course they have an opinion regarding the XL that is set in stone.
But I'm happy to say I'm still chugging away on my project. Over 400 hours into
it.... :D
Patrick
XL/Corvair
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170986#170986
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
Not to worry. Like most things, it's probably a right wing
conspiracy.
Joe N101HD
----- Original Message -----
From: steve
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 2:03 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: True Idenity
I got blasted by one of this sites members about four months ago. I
mentioned to the group that sometimes people are not who the claim to
be. Years ago I belonged to the AvidFlyer web group and this one
member who called himself "Wang Chung" was always giving out his
suggestions on how to build and fly Avids. Then Wang showed up on the
Jabiru site telling everyone his suggestions on the care and feeding of
the 2200 Jabby.
Then off he went to the KitFox website.
Anyway, we members communicated from one site to each other site
because of common interests and similar aircraft.
To shorten this up I ll tell you that Wang was busted. We knew he was
full of bad advice and didnt have a clue.... Wang was not a pilot. Was
not an aircraft owner and had absolutely no experience. He was a
wanna bee....
Again I m probably going to upset a few or maybe just one of you. I
read things that just dont make sense at times and I wonder.
In addition: if an aircraft company is having problems and not
selling the product they offer, yet Zenith is very successful, you might
join a group like Zenith Matronics and start bullshit rumors and keep
bringing up how dangerous the wings are etc......over and over again....
Sure we are all interested in having safe aircraft but the same people
keep bring up the dangerous problems the Zenith 601XL has.
Are you really interested or are you an undercover competitor trying
to stir up more B.S.
OK, time to dump on me....
Steve Weston
Im in the FAA registry and Landings.com
Message 51
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
YES, if a bubble canopy it broken in the front I believe the wind will rip
the remaining parts off. Jerry of GA
In a message dated 3/19/2008 12:31:47 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
ashontz@nbme.org writes:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "ashontz" <ashontz@nbme.org>
You mean as opposed to a bubble canopy?
jeyoung65(at)aol.com wrote:
> Looking at the aircraft makes me a believer of a windshield. The right
side of his windshield is gone. I would think that the fact that the top of the
wind shield is attached to the wing and the side is attached to the fuse.
saved the pilots life. The pilot is lucky because had hit in front of him, as
he
said it could have been over for him. Jerry of GA
>
>
>
>
>
> --
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170965#170965
**************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
Home.
(http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
Message 52
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
Do you have a design for a solid roof? I'm interested in using a windshield and
doors myself instead of the bubble.
[quote="Jeyoung65(at)aol.com"]YES, if a bubble canopy it broken in the front I
believe the wind will rip the remaining parts off. Jerry of GA
In a message dated 3/19/2008 12:31:47 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, ashontz@nbme.org
writes:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "ashontz"
>
> You mean as opposed to a bubble canopy?
>
>
> jeyoung65(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> > Looking at the aircraft makes me a believer of a windshield. The right
side of his windshield is gone. I would think that the fact that the top of
the wind shield is attached to the wing and the side is attached to the fuse.
saved the pilots life. The pilot is lucky because had hit in front of him,
as he said it could have been over for him. Jerry of GA
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> >
>
>
> --------
> Andy Shontz
> CH601XL - Corvair
> www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170965#170965
>
>
>
Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001).
> [b]
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171012#171012
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| Subject: | Re: Insurance Rates! |
I didn't think it would be much. Who's the insurer?
I figure I'll just be getting liability, maybe $5,000 or $10,000 in hull insurance
to cover materials in case someone plows into it why it's on the ground. Figure
I'd do all the repairs myself if something happened.
$400/yr is about what I pay for my old '85 Nissan pickup truck for liability only,
about $35/month. That's reasonable. Get an outdoor tie-down at a grass strip
somewhere nearby and I'd be looking at $85/month to have it just sit there.
That's about what most people would pay for one hour of rental time. Use it maybe
200hrs/year (16hrs/month or 4 hours each saturday) at $16/hr in fuel, that's
like $3,600/yr for the joy of flight with insurance and tie down. I'll take
it. People pay that much a season to keep a boat docked they can't afford to
put gas in.
Sabrina wrote:
> Great Lunch Time News...
>
> I have been quoted $331 for 1M liability insurance on my 150.
> I have been quoted $389 for 1M liability insurance on my Sabrina (XL).
> I have been quoted $1 for each 50 of hull in motion coverage for my 150.
> I have been quoted $1 for each 25 of hull in motion coverage for my Sabrina (XL).
>
> Two caveats as to the Sabrina E-LSA only:
>
> No coverage for any occurrence with a PIC who has less than 2 hours PIC in the
Sabrina prior to the flight in question.
>
> All maintenance, repairs and modifications MUST be signed off by an IA, AP or
E-LSA Repairman with Inspection rating. All Service Bulletins issued by Sabrina
Aircraft Manufacturing (not Zenith) must be complied with.
>
> The quote before the maiden flight was around $2400--just before New Years' eve--they
would not break out hull/liability at that point.
>
> The agent finds humor in the fact that I can manufacture an aircraft at age 14
but I can't sign off a repair on it until I am 18.
>
> off to classes...
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171015#171015
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| Subject: | Re: Insurance Rates! |
I did not ask the agent who actually insures it, I have been dealing with Falcon,
AOPA and Avemco. Once one quote came in, the other two fell in line within
a few dollars.
I burn 6 gallons an hour at 4.99/gal so $30/hour here! I would love $16/hour
fuel costs. Pull through tie-down, concrete is $45/mo. In Canada it costs
me $50/hour just for fuel.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171018#171018
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| Subject: | Re: Insurance Rates! |
What's your engine, a Lycoming. I'm guessing the average fuel burn on my corvair
will be 4gal/hr at $4/gal if I cart auto-fuel down to the airport.
Sabrina wrote:
> I did not ask the agent who actually insures it, I have been dealing with Falcon,
AOPA and Avemco. Once one quote came in, the other two fell in line within
a few dollars.
>
> I burn 6 gallons an hour at 4.99/gal so $30/hour here! I would love $16/hour
fuel costs. Pull through tie-down, concrete is $45/mo. In Canada it costs
me $50/hour just for fuel.
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171019#171019
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|
Will someone tell me the cutoff distance on 6B-21-1 and -2?
Message 57
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| Subject: | Re: We have received your email |
I realize that......but to WHAT and to WHOM??
Aerolitellc@aol.com wrote: It's a auto reply.
---------------------------------
Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home.
---------------------------------
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
Message 58
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
My obvious question would be, what is the windshield made out of on the Zenith
Aircraft's CH601XL?? Is there such a thing as an "upgrade" we can buy to get
the very best protection for the money we've spent (or spending in my case - I'm
working on the tail section now)??? If not, WHY not??
Larry H
steve <notsew_evets@frontiernet.net> wrote:
And to add,,,, Cessna windshields are extreamly tough....
SW
----- Original Message -----
From: jeyoung65@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 8:09 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Bird Strike!
Looking at the aircraft makes me a believer of a windshield. The right side of
his windshield is gone. I would think that the fact that the top of the wind
shield is attached to the wing and the side is attached to the fuse. saved the
pilots life. The pilot is lucky because had hit in front of him, as he said
it could have been over for him. Jerry of GA
-----Original Message-----
From: Jay Maynard <jmaynard@conmicro.com>
Sent: Wed, 19 Mar 2008 8:39 am
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Bird Strike!
On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 05:29:47AM -0700, cookwithgas wrote:
> This is amazing - This was on CNN.com this morning. Watch this video:
> http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2008/03/18/dnt.ca.buzzard.smashes.into.plane.kovr
I saw that last night. If that's what happened to the guys in Australia, I
have no trouble believing that it caused the crash: what does having a
jagged hole in the canopy do ththe Zodiac's aerodynamics, not to mention the
utter distraction involved? That's if nobody got injured in the strike to
begin with.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)
---------------------------------
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Message 59
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| Subject: | Re: 115mm flanging die needed |
Hi Randy
I am done using your flanging dies. They are beautifully made, and worked
great. I also used your auto-press idea. It was quick and easy. Thanks for
the idea. You can check the 3/18 entry in my builder's log to see the
auto-press in action.
I can hold the dies and ship whenever another builder needs them or I can
ship them back to you. Let me know your preference.
Thanks so much for letting me use them.
Terry
At 10:43 AM 2/3/2008 -0800, you wrote:
>Hi Randy,
>
>I haven't seen or heard much from you recently on the Zenith list. I hope
>you are doing well.
>
>Unless I mess up a part (which could always happen!), I think I'm done
>using your flanging dies. They have been a great help, and worked so
>well. Thanks for the extended use.
>
>I'll be glad to ship them back to you, or I can also hold on to them until
>another builder contacts you for their use. Then I could ship them
>direct, saving you the postage. It is your call.
>
>Just let me know.
>
>Thank you, again.
>
>Larry Winger
>
>
>On Jul 26, 2007 11:24 AM, Randy L. Thwing
><<mailto:n4546v@mindspring.com>n4546v@mindspring.com> wrote:
>Hey Larry:
>
>If you don't get a better offer, my "iron" dies are available. They are
>currently in the "custody" of Builder John Bolding in Texas who is finished
>with them and awaiting shipping instructions. It is the three die set that
>needs to stay together, but it is my understanding that the three dies will
>fit in a postal flat rate box and ship for under ten bucks.
>
>Let me know if you want them.
>
>Best Regards,
>
>Randy L. Thwing, Las Vegas do not archive
>
>
>Subject: Zenith-List: 115mm flanging die needed
>
>
> <<mailto:larrywinger@gmail.com>larrywinger@gmail.com>
> >
> > Thanks to a good building buddy, I already have two sets of flanging dies
>(65mm and 95mm). I'm missing the larger 115mm dies for my wing ribs.
> >
> > Is there anyone on the list with a 115mm set that I could use for a few
>weeks? I'll be glad to pay shipping both ways. Thanks.
> >
> > Feel free to contact me off list.
> >
> > Do not archive.
> >
> > --------
> > Larry Winger
> > Tustin, CA
> > 601XL/Corvair from scratch
> > Control surfaces and wing spars complete
> > Making wing ribs
Terry Phillips
ttp44~at~rkymtn.net
Corvallis MT
601XL/Jab 3300 s .. l .. o .. o .. w build kit - Tail, flaps, & ailerons
are done; working on the wings
http://www.mykitlog.com/N47TP/
Message 60
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I don't know of one. I clamped an 8 foot piece of square aluminum tubing
across the top bulkheads, located where the two tubes meet at the top and
trimmed my tubes in small increments until they fit. The 6-B-21A.pdf photo
guide gives some guidance but I suspect you have already been studying that
closely.
http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6-b-21a.pdf
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob McArdle
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 1:09 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Tube frames
Will someone tell me the cutoff distance on 6B-21-1 and -2?
Message 61
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
How far out of left field are these birds coming? I had a duck in my way once about
12 years ago, even so, he was like 250 feet ahead of me when he put the brakes
on and got out of the way. Looked like something out of a Daffy Duck cartoon
"Feets (or in this case wings), do your duty!" In a brief second he went
from flying along to striking a pose that looked like the eagle on the back of
an old quarter. Just one lone duck up at like 4500 feet. If it was a flock, you'd
think you'd definitely see that way ahead of time.
do not archive
[quote="skyridersbn"]My obvious question would be, what is the windshield made
out of on the Zenith Aircraft's CH601XL?? Is there such a thing as an "upgrade"
we can buy to get the very best protection for the money we've spent (or spending
in my case - I'm working on the tail section now)??? If not, WHY not??
Larry H
steve wrote:
[quote] And to add,,,, Cessna windshields are extreamly tough....
SW
> ---
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171030#171030
Message 62
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| Subject: | Re: It's official |
Well I plan on putting my 4 ton hydraulic jack, tie downs, tie down stakes, extra
quarts of oil, a set of chains if I need them, a couple of bungee cords, extra
grease (in case my wheels stop going around and around), a couple of cases
of Diet Coke, some ice for our "in-flight" lunch to keep the pop cold and lunch
meat cold, probably a couple of bags of groceries, our luggage (I'd hate to
overload the baggage area behind the seat yah know) and our pillows. That should
about round out everything we'll need for our over night trips. I just wished
I would have put on the extra fuel tanks so I can fly further without having
to stop and refueling too.......
(NOT!)
LH
Do Not Archive
---------------------------------
Message 63
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| Subject: | Re: 115mm flanging die needed |
Hey Terry:
I'm glad they worked out for you. My "gravity" powered lightning hole
press is always good for a lot of "yuks" on the forum, but it does work!
For right now, please hang onto the dies, I'll try to determine what the
next move will be.
I'd like to check your builder's log, how about a link steering me
there?
Regards,
Randy
----- Original Message -----
From: Terry Phillips
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:27 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 115mm flanging die needed
Hi Randy
I am done using your flanging dies. They are beautifully made, and
worked great. I also used your auto-press idea. It was quick and easy.
Thanks for the idea. You can check the 3/18 entry in my builder's log to
see the auto-press in action.
I can hold the dies and ship whenever another builder needs them or I
can ship them back to you. Let me know your preference.
Thanks so much for letting me use them.
Terry
At 10:43 AM 2/3/2008 -0800, you wrote:
Hi Randy,
I haven't seen or heard much from you recently on the Zenith list.
I hope you are doing well.
Unless I mess up a part (which could always happen!), I think I'm
done using your flanging dies. They have been a great help, and worked
so well. Thanks for the extended use.
I'll be glad to ship them back to you, or I can also hold on to them
until another builder contacts you for their use. Then I could ship
them direct, saving you the postage. It is your call.
Just let me know.
Thank you, again.
Larry Winger
On Jul 26, 2007 11:24 AM, Randy L. Thwing <n4546v@mindspring.com>
wrote:
Hey Larry:
If you don't get a better offer, my "iron" dies are available.
They are
currently in the "custody" of Builder John Bolding in Texas who
is finished
with them and awaiting shipping instructions. It is the three die
set that
needs to stay together, but it is my understanding that the three
dies will
fit in a postal flat rate box and ship for under ten bucks.
Let me know if you want them.
Best Regards,
Randy L. Thwing, Las Vegas do not archive
Subject: Zenith-List: 115mm flanging die needed
<larrywinger@gmail.com>
>
> Thanks to a good building buddy, I already have two sets of
flanging dies
(65mm and 95mm). I'm missing the larger 115mm dies for my wing
ribs.
>
> Is there anyone on the list with a 115mm set that I could use
for a few
weeks? I'll be glad to pay shipping both ways. Thanks.
>
> Feel free to contact me off list.
>
> Do not archive.
>
> --------
> Larry Winger
> Tustin, CA
> 601XL/Corvair from scratch
> Control surfaces and wing spars complete
> Making wing ribs
Terry Phillips
ttp44~at~rkymtn.net
Corvallis MT
601XL/Jab 3300 s .. l .. o .. o .. w build kit - Tail, flaps, &
ailerons are done; working on the wings
http://www.mykitlog.com/N47TP/
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
1/9/08 10:16 AM
Message 64
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| Subject: | Re: It's official |
You ARE kidding, yes.???
A four ton jack ? I dont think so, Larry...
Maybe a one half ton but shirley not a four ton...
SW
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry H
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 12:54 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: It's official
Well I plan on putting my 4 ton hydraulic jack, tie downs, tie down
stakes, extra quarts of oil, a set of chains if I need them, a couple of
bungee cords, extra grease (in case my wheels stop going around and
around), a couple of cases of Diet Coke, some ice for our "in-flight"
lunch to keep the pop cold and lunch meat cold, probably a couple of
bags of groceries, our luggage (I'd hate to overload the baggage area
behind the seat yah know) and our pillows. That should about round out
everything we'll need for our over night trips. I just wished I would
have put on the extra fuel tanks so I can fly further without having to
stop and refueling too.......
(NOT!)
LH
Do Not Archive
Message 65
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| Subject: | Re: It's official |
Also, a case of Diet Coke weighs less than a case of Coke (less calories) a
nd if you fly high enough, you don't need ice!!! Only need chains over high
mountain passes in the Winter. (not really needed in the Summer) so plan y
our trips accordingly.
Do Not Archive
KA
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry H<mailto:skyridersbn@yahoo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 12:54 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: It's official
Well I plan on putting my 4 ton hydraulic jack, tie downs, tie down stakes,
extra quarts of oil, a set of chains if I need them, a couple of bungee co
rds, extra grease (in case my wheels stop going around and around), a coupl
e of cases of Diet Coke, some ice for our "in-flight" lunch to keep the pop
cold and lunch meat cold, probably a couple of bags of groceries, our lugg
age (I'd hate to overload the baggage area behind the seat yah know) and ou
r pillows. That should about round out everything we'll need for our over
night trips. I just wished I would have put on the extra fuel tanks so I c
an fly further without having to stop and refueling too.......
________________________________
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Please note that any views or opinions presented in this e-mail are solely
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ence of viruses. ITT accepts no liability for any damage caused by any viru
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Message 66
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| Subject: | Re: It's official |
> Maybe a one half ton but shirley not a four ton...
Don't call me Shirley........
--------
601 XL kit N596SW reserved
Tail, control surfaces and both wings complete. Now working on fuselage
www.scottwaters.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171046#171046
Message 67
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| Subject: | Re: Insurance Rates! |
WOW, AOPA (probably AIG) just came down from 331 + 480 (811) to $544 total for
24,000 hull in motion and 1M liability to keep my business as to the C150L!
My Cessna 150L burns 4g/hr in the pattern, 6g/hr cruising at 3000', 5g/hr leaned
at altitude. The E-LSA has the same engine and prop combo, so I expect similar
numbers. Both O-200As, both flying at around 1300 pounds. The prop on
the E-LSA was clipped to 67 inches to keep it under the LSA speed limit at cruise
RPMs, and to give the required ground clearance in case of a bungee failure
and flat nose tire.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171049#171049
Message 68
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
Kinda make me think about polycarbonate instead of plex.
--------
Mark Twain: Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that
you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream.
Discover.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171056#171056
Message 69
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
To answer your question, Plexiglas. And there is another guy that makes one but
I don't know if it is also Plexiglas or Lexan.
http://www.toddscanopies.com/
And his website doesn't say it but he has made 601 canopies.
skyridersbn wrote:
> My obvious question would be, what is the windshield made out of on the Zenith
Aircraft's CH601XL?? Is there such a thing as an "upgrade" we can buy to get
the very best protection for the money we've spent (or spending in my case -
I'm working on the tail section now)??? If not, WHY not??
> Larry H
>
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171059#171059
Message 70
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That's what I did as well. Let me emphasize SMALL increments. Because you can screw
up a tube.
I know.
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171062#171062
Message 71
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
Hi guys,
Geese will scatter and run right into you without trying. Eagles and
the soaring types are curious. If you see one of them out front, try to
climb over them if you can.
I nearly hit one that followed my veering left and right to get past
him. I climbed above him at the last minute, but he was just trying to
get a better look.
We had a twin last summer with damaged cowls, wings and leading edges
setting on the runway after hitting a dense group of birds on takeoff,
so there's no
good answer, but keeping an eye focused way in front of your aircraft.
Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
ashontz wrote:
>
> How far out of left field are these birds coming? I had a duck in my way once
about 12 years ago, even so, he was like 250 feet ahead of me when he put the
brakes on and got out of the way. Looked like something out of a Daffy Duck cartoon
"Feets (or in this case wings), do your duty!" In a brief second he went
from flying along to striking a pose that looked like the eagle on the back
of an old quarter. Just one lone duck up at like 4500 feet. If it was a flock,
you'd think you'd definitely see that way ahead of time.
>
>
>
>
Message 72
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| Subject: | Transponder/Encoder Wiring |
Hello All,
Wiring the Ak350 Encoder to the AT50A transponder. Got the pinouts all figured
out except for the bare wire (no color). Anybody know where this one goes?
Does it go with the black wire to ground maybe?
Thanks
Bill Pagan
EAA Tech Counselor #4395
---------------------------------
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
Message 73
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| Subject: | NASON Oil Presssure Switch |
Asked before and only got one response and neither he or I can find the NASON
oil pressure switch called out in the WW 601XL corvair installation. Anybody
know where to get these?
Bill Pagan
EAA Tech Counselor #4395
---------------------------------
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
Message 74
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
Has anyone seen the RANS S-19 canopy? http://www.rans.com/S-19.htm It looks like it is reinforced and might be stronger than the existing XL bubble; plus it slides... I wish the XL had something like that.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171075#171075
Message 75
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| Subject: | NASON Oil Presssure Switch |
Bill,
I got mine at a place in Dallas called Burns Controls. As I recall, they had to
order it and it took about two weeks to get it.
Jay in Dallas
Bill Pagan <pdn8r@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Asked before and only got one response and neither he or I can find the
NASON oil pressure switch called out in the WW 601XL corvair installation. Anybody
know where to get these?
>
>
>Bill Pagan
>EAA Tech Counselor #4395
>
>
>
>---------------------------------
>Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
>
Message 76
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
I do not have a design for a windshield canopy. I am going to build one but
my aircraft has several changes to it so my parts will not fix any other
aircraft. I will extend the turtleback so it will come up to the gull doors. The
top will have about four inch of sheet metal between the doors. The
windshield will start at the instrumental panel. Using 3/4" tubes to support the
windshield and turtleback. Still not happy with the door stiffness. so may change
then again. I used 1/2 by 3/4" angles to form the doors last time. Jerry of
GA
In a message dated 3/19/2008 2:47:48 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
ashontz@nbme.org writes:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "ashontz" <ashontz@nbme.org>
Do you have a design for a solid roof? I'm interested in using a windshield
and doors myself instead of the bubble.
[quote="Jeyoung65(at)aol.com"]YES, if a bubble canopy it broken in the front
I believe the wind will rip the remaining parts off. Jerry of GA
In a message dated 3/19/2008 12:31:47 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
ashontz@nbme.org writes:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "ashontz"
>
> You mean as opposed to a bubble canopy?
>
>
> jeyoung65(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> > Looking at the aircraft makes me a believer of a windshield. The
right side of his windshield is gone. I would think that the fact that the
top of the wind shield is attached to the wing and the side is attached to the
fuse. saved the pilots life. The pilot is lucky because had hit in front
of him, as he said it could have been over for him. Jerry of GA
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> >
>
>
> --------
> Andy Shontz
> CH601XL - Corvair
> www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=170965#170965
>
>
>
Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home
(http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001
).
> [b]
--------
Andy Shontz
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171012#171012
**************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
Home.
(http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
Message 77
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| Subject: | Re: CH701 Warpdrive |
Thanks for the values I have read more closly and am ok with torque for
my prop now.
I am going to try 17 derees to start and check it static and adjust
Graemecns
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Kevin L. Rupert
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:07 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CH701 Warpdrive
This was taken right from the Warp Drive web page
Propeller Torque Values
Propeller Bolt Torque Values--All Standard, HP and HPL hubs that use
1/4" bolts to clamp the blades in the hub should be tightened to 120
inch pounds. All Rotax bolt patterns that use 8 mm bolts to clamp the
blades in the hub should be tightened to 175 inch pounds. All Standard,
HP and HPL hubs that use 3/8" bolts to clamp the blades or mount the
prop should be tightened to 35 foot pounds. Warp Drive propeller
installations on direct-drive aircraft engines and other engines used on
airboats must tighten the 5/16" clamping bolts to 200 inch pounds and
tighten the 1/2" flange mounting bolts to 60 foot pounds. Torque 8mm
bolts which attach the propeller hub to the engine flange to 175 inch
pounds. Adherence to these torque values is imperative for reasons of
safety.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Checked by AVG.
19/03/2008 9:54 AM
Message 78
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| Subject: | Re: My figures don't compute |
At 07:21 PM 3/17/2008, you wrote:
>Joe
>
>Some time ago you posted on CH601.org your design for installing
>fuel pumps in 601 wings. I am doing something similar. I would like
>to know if your 601 is flying yet? If so, how have the wing pump(s) worked out?
>
>Terry
Terry, I do not know you but wish to offer a thought for you. Eight
years ago I put fuel pumps in the wing lockers and they worked
fine. At the time it was my desire to keep from having a tank in the
cockpit. Then later I became acquainted with William Wynne and now
don't even have pressured fuel lines in the cabin. The object is to
prevent fire in case of an accident. I haven't done it yet but will
use an oil pressure switch to disable the fuel pumps anytime there is
no oil pressure. An extra switch may be used for starting the
engine. Think it over and do as you like.
Cleone
>At 07:43 PM 3/17/2008 -0400, you wrote:
>>
>>This entire thread is an excellent example of mental masturbation.
>>
>>How many people on this site learned to use computers downloading "ahem"
>>On a 28.8 modem??
>>The DELETE key.
>>Live it.
>>Love it
>>Use it.
>>
>>A cookie for the person who knows what movie that is paraphrased
>>from.. For the love of all things Holy, DO NOT ARCHIVE
>>The truest power is sharing knowledge.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>----------
>>It's Tax Time!
>><http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolprf00030000000001>Get tips, forms
>>and advice on AOL Money & Finance.
>
>
><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List
><http://www.matronics.com/contribution>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>Checked by AVG.
>3/18/2008 8:10 AM
Checked by AVG.
:10 AM
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| Subject: | 601 XL Airspeed Indicator Markings |
Hi Folks,
I am currently waiting for the FAA to come by and inspect my 601 XL for an
airworthiness check, what I don't have at this time are the numbers for the
airspeed indicator markings. I am flying with a Lyc. 0-235-N2C. Thanks in
advance for any information on this subject.
Chet K.
N929RS
Las Vegas, NV
**************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
Home.
(http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
Message 80
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| Subject: | Primer for semi-exposed steel |
Please - remain calm and let's not start a primer war.
With winter in Wisconsin starting to break, I finally got started on my 801 kit
and have the elevator skeleton ready to rivet. I'm using PTI Zinc Oxide for
the aluminum but was unsure about what to do for the elevator outboard hinge pin
8H3-2. This part is steel and will be in direct contact with the outboard
tip rib. I'd like some advice from the group about how to corrosion protect in
this situation. Is a simple self-etching primer for the steel hinge pin sufficient?
Does it need something more? I've read some postings from the archives
but nothing seemed to address this situation.
Thanks,
Ben
--------
Ben Church
CH801
Racine, WI
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171089#171089
Message 81
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| Subject: | Re: Bird Strike! |
In addition to the nice sliding canopy the Rans S-19 also has nice seats.
But it came in overweight. I think these points are connected.
"EMPTY WEIGHT and ENGINE CHOICES
The thinner canopy weight savings has added up to about a 9 pounds ( this
far below the 40 pounds I was hoping for!). The estimated all optioned out,
fully equipped empty weight is 830. That includes a full interior, and glass
cockpit. Other parts have been put on a diet and could result in a slightly
lower empty weight. Keep in mind this is a fully equipped plane, and we are
combing the airframe for weight reductions. The bottom line however is our
hopes of using either the 0-200 or 0-235 and keeping in LSA is fading. In a
way this is a good thing, since those engines are shaky, old tech, and use
much more fuel. The 912ULS despite the price increase is still the best
choice for those wanting a legal LSA that will perform well just about
anywhere you can legally fly an LSA in the USA. The other engine choice we
intend to explore, or at least provide a mounting kit is the Jabiru."
http://www.rans.com/S19progress11-21-07.htm
On the other hand the second RV-12 prototype flew on March 11th and weighs
738 lbs. But it is also a Rotax-only plane. Life is full of trade-offs.
http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/rv-12int.htm
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of mwtucker
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 4:19 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Bird Strike!
Has anyone seen the RANS S-19 canopy? http://www.rans.com/S-19.htm It
looks like it is reinforced and might be stronger than the existing XL
bubble; plus it slides... I wish the XL had something like that.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171075#171075
Message 82
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|
Steve,
After the first confirmed wing failure there was someone hitting blogs on the
net trying to discredit Zenith designs and spewing about what a dangerous plane
the 601 was. Then a letter was printed in Kitplanes after the 601 was featured
on the cover with the same malicious intent and lots of misinformation. It
would not surprise me at all if that were the source of some of the pot stirring
going on this list. For myself, I plan to bolt my wings on this year after
I finish my wiring and go fly. I have met Chris Heintz, read his bios and seen
the record of his numerous designs. I have absolute confidence in the 601XL or
I would have abandoned this project when the doubts were being raised. I cannot
even imagine flying in a plane that I thought might spontaneously explode
or have the wings fall off. There are plenty of other choices if you don't trust
the design.
P.S. I have wing lockers and aux tanks and would build it exactly the same if I
had it to do over.
Craig S.
N601XS, 601xl lyc 0-235
I got blasted by one of this sites members about four months ago. I
mentioned to the group that sometimes people are not who the claim to
be. Years ago I belonged to the AvidFlyer web group and this one
member who called himself "Wang Chung" was always giving out his
suggestions on how to build and fly Avids. Then Wang showed up on the
Jabiru site telling everyone his suggestions on the care and feeding of
the 2200 Jabby.
Then off he went to the KitFox website.
Anyway, we members communicated from one site to each other site because
of common interests and similar aircraft.
To shorten this up I ll tell you that Wang was busted. We knew he was
full of bad advice and didnt have a clue.... Wang was not a pilot. Was
not an aircraft owner and had absolutely no experience. He was a
wanna bee....
Again I m probably going to upset a few or maybe just one of you. I
read things that just dont make sense at times and I wonder.
In addition: if an aircraft company is having problems and not selling
the product they offer, yet Zenith is very successful, you might join a
group like Zenith Matronics and start bullshit rumors and keep bringing
up how dangerous the wings are etc......over and over again....
Sure we are all interested in having safe aircraft but the same people
keep bring up the dangerous problems the Zenith 601XL has.
Are you really interested or are you an undercover competitor trying to
stir up more B.S.
OK, time to dump on me....
Steve Weston
Im in the FAA registry and Landings.com
-----------------------------------------
**************************************************
This e-mail and any of its attachments may contain Exelon
Corporation proprietary information, which is privileged,
confidential, or subject to copyright belonging to the Exelon
Corporation family of Companies.
This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the individual or
entity to which it is addressed. If you are not the intended
recipient of this e-mail, you are hereby notified that any
dissemination, distribution, copying, or action taken in relation
to the contents of and attachments to this e-mail is strictly
prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this e-mail
in error, please notify the sender immediately and permanently
delete the original and any copy of this e-mail and any printout.
Thank You.
**************************************************
Message 83
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| Subject: | 601 XL Airspeed Indicator Markings |
Aren't the V numbers on the page of the plans with the three views of the XL
(6-X-1)? Mine (marked 03/06) say:
Va 103 MPH
Vc 124 MPH
Vfe 80 MPH
Vne 160 MPH
Vs1 51 MPH
Vs0 44 MPH
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of CHETKRU@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 4:54 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: 601 XL Airspeed Indicator Markings
Hi Folks,
I am currently waiting for the FAA to come by and inspect my 601 XL for an
airworthiness check, what I don't have at this time are the numbers for the
airspeed indicator markings. I am flying with a Lyc. 0-235-N2C. Thanks in
advance for any information on this subject.
Chet K.
N929RS
Las Vegas, NV
_____
Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch
<http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom0
0030000000001> the video on AOL Home.
Message 84
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| Subject: | Re: True Identity |
Ditto for me. I do not own a Zenith but I believe the designs are sound. IF
I do build a Zenith I will prefer the HD (not S) but not because I doubt the
design. I do wonder if perhaps there is not a point in the build of the XL
where it is possible to misinterperet the directions, this seems the most
likely flaw if one exists, that is IF one exists. I wish the FAA could do a
better job evaluating failures on experimental aircraft.
----- Original Message -----
From: <Craig.Spainhower@exeloncorp.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 8:27 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: True Identity
>
> Steve,
> After the first confirmed wing failure there was someone hitting blogs on
> the net trying to discredit Zenith designs and spewing about what a
> dangerous plane the 601 was. Then a letter was printed in Kitplanes after
> the 601 was featured on the cover with the same malicious intent and lots
> of misinformation. It would not surprise me at all if that were the source
> of some of the pot stirring going on this list. For myself, I plan to bolt
> my wings on this year after I finish my wiring and go fly. I have met
> Chris Heintz, read his bios and seen the record of his numerous designs. I
> have absolute confidence in the 601XL or I would have abandoned this
> project when the doubts were being raised. I cannot even imagine flying in
> a plane that I thought might spontaneously explode or have the wings fall
> off. There are plenty of other choices if you don't trust the design.
>
> P.S. I have wing lockers and aux tanks and would build it exactly the same
> if I had it to do over.
>
> Craig S.
> N601XS, 601xl lyc 0-235
>
>
> I got blasted by one of this sites members about four months ago. I
> mentioned to the group that sometimes people are not who the claim to
> be. Years ago I belonged to the AvidFlyer web group and this one
> member who called himself "Wang Chung" was always giving out his
> suggestions on how to build and fly Avids. Then Wang showed up on the
> Jabiru site telling everyone his suggestions on the care and feeding of
> the 2200 Jabby.
> Then off he went to the KitFox website.
> Anyway, we members communicated from one site to each other site because
> of common interests and similar aircraft.
> To shorten this up I ll tell you that Wang was busted. We knew he was
> full of bad advice and didnt have a clue.... Wang was not a pilot. Was
> not an aircraft owner and had absolutely no experience. He was a
> wanna bee....
> Again I m probably going to upset a few or maybe just one of you. I
> read things that just dont make sense at times and I wonder.
> In addition: if an aircraft company is having problems and not selling
> the product they offer, yet Zenith is very successful, you might join a
> group like Zenith Matronics and start bullshit rumors and keep bringing
> up how dangerous the wings are etc......over and over again....
> Sure we are all interested in having safe aircraft but the same people
> keep bring up the dangerous problems the Zenith 601XL has.
> Are you really interested or are you an undercover competitor trying to
> stir up more B.S.
>
> OK, time to dump on me....
>
> Steve Weston
> Im in the FAA registry and Landings.com
>
> -----------------------------------------
> **************************************************
> This e-mail and any of its attachments may contain Exelon
> Corporation proprietary information, which is privileged,
> confidential, or subject to copyright belonging to the Exelon
> Corporation family of Companies.
> This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the individual or
> entity to which it is addressed. If you are not the intended
> recipient of this e-mail, you are hereby notified that any
> dissemination, distribution, copying, or action taken in relation
> to the contents of and attachments to this e-mail is strictly
> prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this e-mail
> in error, please notify the sender immediately and permanently
> delete the original and any copy of this e-mail and any printout.
> Thank You.
> **************************************************
>
>
>
Message 85
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| Subject: | Re: Primer for semi-exposed steel |
I prefer powder coating all steel parts. Easy to do (or have done).
Then you can paint to a finish coat color if needed (ie. exposed).
JT
----- Original Message -----
From: bcchurch
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 7:01 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Primer for semi-exposed steel
Please - remain calm and let's not start a primer war.
With winter in Wisconsin starting to break, I finally got started on
my 801 kit and have the elevator skeleton ready to rivet. I'm using PTI
Zinc Oxide for the aluminum but was unsure about what to do for the
elevator outboard hinge pin 8H3-2. This part is steel and will be in
direct contact with the outboard tip rib. I'd like some advice from the
group about how to corrosion protect in this situation. Is a simple
self-etching primer for the steel hinge pin sufficient? Does it need
something more? I've read some postings from the archives but nothing
seemed to address this situation.
Thanks,
Ben
--------
Ben Church
CH801
Racine, WI
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171089#171089
--
Checked by AVG.
3/17/2008 10:48 AM
Message 86
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| Subject: | Re: Primer for semi-exposed steel |
I'm building a XL so I'm not familiar with the hinge you describe. If it is in a moving hinge then pretty much anything you put on it will get scraped off eventually. Self-etching primer typically will not prevent rusting unless topcoated with enamel or the like. It might be a case where something like ACF-50 would be a good choice. It lubricates and protects against corrosion (see http://www.corrosion-control.com/acf50.html)
Tim
Do not archive
--------
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Working on fuselage
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171116#171116
Message 87
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| Subject: | Re: CH701 Warpdrive |
Graemecns,
I fly a 701 with the 100 hp Rotax and have found that 11 to 12 degree is
about right. With 12 degree you will just go to 5800 in full power
cruise and to only about 5400 in a 60 mph climb. I think you will find
that 17 will be far to much.
Bob Kissell N701UB with 47 hour.
----- Original Message -----
From: Graeme
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 6:42 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CH701 Warpdrive
Thanks for the values I have read more closly and am ok with torque
for my prop now.
I am going to try 17 derees to start and check it static and adjust
Graemecns
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Kevin L. Rupert
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:07 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CH701 Warpdrive
This was taken right from the Warp Drive web page
Propeller Torque Values
Propeller Bolt Torque Values--All Standard, HP and HPL hubs that
use 1/4" bolts to clamp the blades in the hub should be tightened to 120
inch pounds. All Rotax bolt patterns that use 8 mm bolts to clamp the
blades in the hub should be tightened to 175 inch pounds. All Standard,
HP and HPL hubs that use 3/8" bolts to clamp the blades or mount the
prop should be tightened to 35 foot pounds. Warp Drive propeller
installations on direct-drive aircraft engines and other engines used on
airboats must tighten the 5/16" clamping bolts to 200 inch pounds and
tighten the 1/2" flange mounting bolts to 60 foot pounds. Torque 8mm
bolts which attach the propeller hub to the engine flange to 175 inch
pounds. Adherence to these torque values is imperative for reasons of
safety.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
19/03/2008 9:54 AM
Message 88
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| Subject: | Painting XL nose strut |
I'm going to want to hang my nose strut before too long and are looking for recommendations
as to a paint / finish. I'll be painting the plane later with a
catalyzed paint of some kind but I need to put something on the strut prior to
installation.
>From checking the archives I found:
Chrome - danger of embrittlement
Powder Coat - too thick, peels, doesn't wear as well a you might expect.
So what did the rest of you go with? I was considering rattle can enamel, perhaps
baking it at low heat in an oven.
Tim
--------
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Working on fuselage
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171129#171129
Message 89
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|
| Subject: | Painting XL nose strut |
I don't have a recommendation on a coating. But I do recommend that you mask
off the top and middle where the tube slides through the upper bearing and V
block. Anything else will scrape off and keeping it clean from the start
makes it slide better.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Juhl
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 7:26 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Painting XL nose strut
I'm going to want to hang my nose strut before too long and are looking for
recommendations as to a paint / finish. I'll be painting the plane later
with a catalyzed paint of some kind but I need to put something on the strut
prior to installation.
>From checking the archives I found:
Chrome - danger of embrittlement
Powder Coat - too thick, peels, doesn't wear as well a you might expect.
So what did the rest of you go with? I was considering rattle can enamel,
perhaps baking it at low heat in an oven.
Tim
--------
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Working on fuselage
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171129#171129
Message 90
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair 5th bearing |
Yeah I'm gonna use the Roy's solution. As a matter of fact I will be dropping
off my case and crankshaft to him this weekend.
It's not the least expensive but it sure looks good to me. Roy has given this
a lot of thought and he is a very meticulous machinist/welder. I still have half
of an airplane to build but things are progressing.
If ya go to SnF this year you can probably touch one of the Roy Szarafinski engines.
do not archive
--------
Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI
Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-)
http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171139#171139
Message 91
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| Subject: | Re: Corvair 5th bearing |
Ashontz
Regarding your comment about the "hard crust". That's not exactly how it works.
It's, actually, really cool how it works. As I understand it, the nitriding process
introduces nitrogen atoms to a certain depth increasing molecular density.
This has the benefit of putting the surface in tension at all times. So that
when the metal is bent the surface unloads towards neutral. This greatly reduces
the likelyhood of cracking, since cracking happens as a result of continuous
tension-to-compression cycles. Basically nitriding breaks this cycle.
Kevin Bonds
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "ashontz" <ashontz@nbme.org>
bly wouldn't need it. From what I've read, the nitriding is really only
> adding a 15/1000th hard skin so to speak over a still more flexible shaft. Yeah,
> it'll make it stronger, but it's still a crust over a softer center. The 5th
> bearing makes more sense.
>
>
Message 92
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
Because we are on the subject of "True Identity", I had this one gentleman directly
email me, questioning me about "which side of the fence I was on". Here
is what he said to me about my posting and about what I had said. He quoted my
statement and then asked me where I stood at on my statements. He wrote:
Hi Larry,
Didn't you write:
I for one have said it before, if my wife EVER read any of this "GLOOM AND DOOM"
about aircraft failures, she would NEVER set foot in my Zodiac and she would
HOUND ME until the ends of the Earth to STOP BUILDING THIS DEATH TRAP......I
was HOPING we could change the subject matter also, but it seems "we" feel the
NEED to beat it to death (literally) some more.......I too am very well aware
of the risks involved and I promise I will do my level best to build my aircraft
according to the print. I will fly it as I safely know how to do and I will
NOT do any erratic maneuvers with it. I'm positive everyone on this forumhttp://www.lpaero.com/
are going to be doing the same. Now with all that being said, I will ask again....can
we change the subject matter and get on to something more enlightening
and helpful, PLEASE?????
...now you ask:
My obvious question would be, what is the windshield made out of on the Zenith
Aircraft's CH601XL?? Is there such a thing as an "upgrade" we can buy to get
the very best protection for the money we've spent (or spending in my case - I'm
working on the tail section now)??? If not, WHY not??
Don't you realize that comments like this lead to what you profess to abhor?
What side of the fence ya gonna sit on?
cheers jeff you could contact the makers of the canopy and find out http://www.lpaero.com/
I had responded to his questions with my answers and I said this back to him:
I am not on both sides of the fence when it comes to a bird strike. That is
extremely EVIDENT and not speculation. A fact - a bird CAN and sometimes DO break
windshields. The evidence is extremely clear about it if you was to watch
the video, see the broken windshield and the carcass of the bird in the back
seat. To SPECULATE what happened to the 601 that they say the wings collapsed,
when the NTSB hasn't been able to piece all the FACTS together, is purely speculation
on our parts. I would rather sit back, open my ears, shut my mouth
and take a "wait and see" attitude, about how this whole accident plays out with
the cause. To ASSUME otherwise, is as I said before, PURELY SPECULATION and
can (and usually does) cause totally UNNECESSARY ALARM, FEAR AND PANIC!! Deal
in only the facts - when you know what they are, THEN make a logical, educated
decision as to how to proceed. I firmly believe that Zenith is on top of
all these issues. If I didn't have faith in the
aircraft, I would NOT be building it.
Now, let me ask you, have I my made my point perfectly clear here or not? (If
not, I'll slow down some for you and let you catch up.......OK?)
As far as what the current material the windshield is made of on the Zodiac,
I have to admit I do not know. Up until this bird coming through the windshield
on the Cessna, it never raised my concerns. I am like everyone else, I ASSUME
Zenith is providing the best material (all materials) to keep us as safe as
possible. Do I assume to much here? Maybe. After physically SEEING the evidence
of what this bird did to a Cessna, DOES cause me to question it. I DO
know how thick the Cessna windshield is and I AM concerned that the windshield
in the Zodiac WILL or WILL NOT withstand a bird strike like this. I live by
many, many lakes here and we have an over abundance of Canadian Geese it seems.
As you know, they are NOT a small bird. I HAVE been in a bird strike in a
Cessna 172 once. We hit TWO geese. One struck the propeller (thank God for small
favors) and it splattered all over the windshield and leading edges of both
wings, making it extremely hard to see. The
other goose, hit the left leading edge of the wing, taking out a full bay between
two ribs (4 foot from the pilot's door). Luckily, the metal gave enough to
dent but not break away. We was able to return to the airport and put the plane
down without incident. It took close to 2 months for the plane to be returned
to service again. Its not something I would ever want to go through again.
Larry Hursh
PS - Are you "Thomas Small" or "cheers jeff"? You seemed to be so confused,
you can't remember WHO you are...! Ha, talk about the pot calling the kettle
black, eh?? Have a really PEACHY DAY, will yah - whomever you are!?
His response back to me was this:
Well, excuse me! I am truly, truly sorry not to understand that your sense of
entitlement allows you to have more than one correct opinion. "Oh, stop the
DOOM and GLOOM...if not, WHY not!"
Thank goodness for block sender.
Thomas Jeffrey Small
***************************************
I Must Apologize to All of You.....
I'm sorry if this is boring everyone to tears but I for one am DAMNED TIRED of
having people making accusations like this one, yet wanting to attack without
using one sense of common decency to LISTEN to the answer that is given to them.
If you ever ask me my opinion, I will try to explain my actions as best
I can but for God's sake, try to understand it. It makes my ass TIRED of trying
to speak intelligently with a moronic person such as this one. I honestly
feel his whole agenda was to try to disrupt and abuse this forum. I'm not sure
if anyone else has received this sort of statements coming from Mr Thomas Jeffrey
Small or not. I for one will NOT say a word to anyone personally, that
will not make on an open forum such as this one. I'm sorry for taking up this
(more like wasted) space to justify my actions, but I feel for the betterment
of all on this forum, this hooligan needs to be identified for his disruptive
demeanor and unintelligent conversations.......I
promise to try to NEVER post anything like this ever again.
Best Regards to all!! Happy building and flying!
Larry Hursh
Edwardsburg, MI (N601LL Reserved)
CH601XL building elevator now...
---------------------------------
Message 93
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| Subject: | Re: True Idenity |
Great Letter..... Joe N101HD
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry H
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:05 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: True Idenity
Because we are on the subject of "True Identity", I had this one
gentleman directly email me, questioning me about "which side of the
fence I was on". Here is what he said to me about my posting and about
what I had said. He quoted my statement and then asked me where I stood
at on my statements. He wrote:
Hi Larry,
Didn't you write:
I for one have said it before, if my wife EVER read any of this "GLOOM
AND DOOM"
about aircraft failures, she would NEVER set foot in my Zodiac and she
would
HOUND ME until the ends of the Earth to STOP BUILDING THIS DEATH
TRAP......I
was HOPING we could change the subject matter also, but it seems "we"
feel the
NEED to beat it to death (literally) some more.......I too am very
well aware
of the risks involved and I promise I will do my level best to build
my aircraft
according to the print. I will fly it as I safely know how to do and
I will
NOT do any erratic maneuvers with it. I'm positive everyone on this
forumhttp://www.lpaero.com/
are going to be doing the same. Now with all that being said, I will
ask again....can
we change the subject matter and get on to something more enlightening
and helpful, PLEASE?????
...now you ask:
My obvious question would be, what is the windshield made out of on
the Zenith
Aircraft's CH601XL?? Is there such a thing as an "upgrade" we can buy
to get
the very best protection for the money we've spent (or spending in my
case - I'm
working on the tail section now)??? If not, WHY not??
Don't you realize that comments like this lead to what you profess to
abhor? What side of the fence ya gonna sit on?
cheers jeff you could contact the makers of the canopy and find
out http://www.lpaero.com/
I had responded to his questions with my answers and I said this back
to him:
I am not on both sides of the fence when it comes to a bird strike.
That is extremely EVIDENT and not speculation. A fact - a bird CAN and
sometimes DO break windshields. The evidence is extremely clear about
it if you was to watch the video, see the broken windshield and the
carcass of the bird in the back seat. To SPECULATE what happened to the
601 that they say the wings collapsed, when the NTSB hasn't been able to
piece all the FACTS together, is purely speculation on our parts. I
would rather sit back, open my ears, shut my mouth and take a "wait and
see" attitude, about how this whole accident plays out with the cause.
To ASSUME otherwise, is as I said before, PURELY SPECULATION and can
(and usually does) cause totally UNNECESSARY ALARM, FEAR AND PANIC!!
Deal in only the facts - when you know what they are, THEN make a
logical, educated decision as to how to proceed. I firmly believe that
Zenith is on top of all these issues. If I didn't have faith in the
aircraft, I would NOT be building it.
Now, let me ask you, have I my made my point perfectly clear here or
not? (If not, I'll slow down some for you and let you catch
up.......OK?)
As far as what the current material the windshield is made of on the
Zodiac, I have to admit I do not know. Up until this bird coming
through the windshield on the Cessna, it never raised my concerns. I am
like everyone else, I ASSUME Zenith is providing the best material (all
materials) to keep us as safe as possible. Do I assume to much here?
Maybe. After physically SEEING the evidence of what this bird did to a
Cessna, DOES cause me to question it. I DO know how thick the Cessna
windshield is and I AM concerned that the windshield in the Zodiac WILL
or WILL NOT withstand a bird strike like this. I live by many, many
lakes here and we have an over abundance of Canadian Geese it seems. As
you know, they are NOT a small bird. I HAVE been in a bird strike in a
Cessna 172 once. We hit TWO geese. One struck the propeller (thank God
for small favors) and it splattered all over the windshield and leading
edges of both wings, making it extremely hard to see. The other goose,
hit the left leading edge of the wing, taking out a full bay between two
ribs (4 foot from the pilot's door). Luckily, the metal gave enough to
dent but not break away. We was able to return to the airport and put
the plane down without incident. It took close to 2 months for the
plane to be returned to service again. Its not something I would ever
want to go through again.
Larry Hursh
PS - Are you "Thomas Small" or "cheers jeff"? You seemed to be so
confused, you can't remember WHO you are...! Ha, talk about the pot
calling the kettle black, eh?? Have a really PEACHY DAY, will yah -
whomever you are!?
His response back to me was this:
Well, excuse me! I am truly, truly sorry not to understand that your
sense of entitlement allows you to have more than one correct opinion.
"Oh, stop the DOOM and GLOOM...if not, WHY not!"
Thank goodness for block sender.
Thomas Jeffrey Small
***************************************
I Must Apologize to All of You.....
I'm sorry if this is boring everyone to tears but I for one am DAMNED
TIRED of having people making accusations like this one, yet wanting to
attack without using one sense of common decency to LISTEN to the answer
that is given to them. If you ever ask me my opinion, I will try to
explain my actions as best I can but for God's sake, try to understand
it. It makes my ass TIRED of trying to speak intelligently with a
moronic person such as this one. I honestly feel his whole agenda was
to try to disrupt and abuse this forum. I'm not sure if anyone else has
received this sort of statements coming from Mr Thomas Jeffrey Small or
not. I for one will NOT say a word to anyone personally, that will not
make on an open forum such as this one. I'm sorry for taking up this
(more like wasted) space to justify my actions, but I feel for the
betterment of all on this forum, this hooligan needs to be identified
for his disruptive demeanor and unintelligent conversations.......I
promise to try to NEVER post anything like this ever again.
Best Regards to all!! Happy building and flying!
Larry Hursh
Edwardsburg, MI (N601LL Reserved)
CH601XL building elevator now...
Message 94
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| Subject: | Re: CH701 Warpdrive |
thanks
I will start at 12
Graemecns
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: bob
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 10:32 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CH701 Warpdrive
Graemecns,
I fly a 701 with the 100 hp Rotax and have found that 11 to 12 degree
is about right. With 12 degree you will just go to 5800 in full power
cruise and to only about 5400 in a 60 mph climb. I think you will find
that 17 will be far to much.
Bob Kissell N701UB with 47 hour.
----- Original Message -----
From: Graeme
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 6:42 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CH701 Warpdrive
Thanks for the values I have read more closly and am ok with torque
for my prop now.
I am going to try 17 derees to start and check it static and adjust
Graemecns
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Kevin L. Rupert
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:07 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: CH701 Warpdrive
This was taken right from the Warp Drive web page
Propeller Torque Values
Propeller Bolt Torque Values--All Standard, HP and HPL hubs that
use 1/4" bolts to clamp the blades in the hub should be tightened to 120
inch pounds. All Rotax bolt patterns that use 8 mm bolts to clamp the
blades in the hub should be tightened to 175 inch pounds. All Standard,
HP and HPL hubs that use 3/8" bolts to clamp the blades or mount the
prop should be tightened to 35 foot pounds. Warp Drive propeller
installations on direct-drive aircraft engines and other engines used on
airboats must tighten the 5/16" clamping bolts to 200 inch pounds and
tighten the 1/2" flange mounting bolts to 60 foot pounds. Torque 8mm
bolts which attach the propeller hub to the engine flange to 175 inch
pounds. Adherence to these torque values is imperative for reasons of
safety.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
19/03/2008 9:54 AM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Checked by AVG.
19/03/2008 9:54 AM
Message 95
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| Subject: | Re: NASON Oil Presssure Switch |
Ron Lendon wrote:
> SM-2C-20F
I think that it can be ordered from NAPA.
I've not tried to find one yet, so I'd like to know if - or if not - it's a NAPA
part.
- Pat
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171149#171149
Message 96
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|
I have been watching from the side lines the continuing to and fro about the
safety of the CH601.
I have a CH 701 but may consider building a 601 in future.
These are light air craft they don't have bullet proof glass. (bird strike
protection)
they don't have armour plating around the cockpit area (hillbillies shooting
at you over flying their crop protection)
When you hit the ground they break (and they have no airbags for crash
protection)
They are not designed to crash they are designed to fly.
If you fly within the specifications you should be OK .
All those concerend should fit a G meter to check that you are not
mishandling your aircraft.
If I build a ch601 for my own piece of mind I would consider a strut brace
to trianglate wing.
But only if an answer on the accidents indicated structual failure or are
inconclusive.
If any indication of concern with structure I am sure Zenith would respond
with a fix.
I think the Australian investigators (Recreation Aviation Australia) should
come up with some definitive results on the latest Accident. In time!!
Graemecns
Message 97
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| Subject: | Re: It's official |
Everybody knows the 601 is front wheel drive. So you only need one chain.
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=171168#171168
Message 98
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| Subject: | Re: My figures don't compute |
Cleone
I'm glad to hear that wing pumps are working for you, because I am
committed to that approach. I spent this afternoon making up the channels
to mount the gascolator in the wing. I like your (WW's) idea of not having
pressurized gas in the cockpit, but, I'm curious how you got the fuel lines
from the wing root to the engine compartment w/o going through the cockpit.
Did you run the lines on the outside of the fuselage? Do you still have a
fuel select valve, or do you just select the tank by choosing the pump? If
you still have a fuel select valve, is it mounted in the engine compartment?
Regarding the oil pressure switch--the Facet pump docs recommend the switch
also. But I was wondering about starting the engine. Or, more importantly,
restarting the engine, if, say, I run dry on one tank in the air and the
engine stops. That's just when I would want a boost pump to work. That's
where your suggestion of an over-ride switch comes in. Then question
becomes one of ergonomics plus safety. Using a momentary-contact switch for
the oil pressure switch over-ride would have the advantage that I wouldn't
leave the pump running inadvertently after a failed engine restart. But
having to hold the switch while I was going through the restart sequence
could prove to be a major distraction just when I need to concentrate on
flying the airplane. Have you thought out how to implement the over-ride
switch? I'd appreciate your thoughts (or anyone else's, for that matter).
Terry
At 05:48 PM 3/19/2008 -0500, you wrote:
>>Joe
>>
>>Some time ago you posted on CH601.org your design for installing fuel
>>pumps in 601 wings. I am doing something similar. I would like to know if
>>your 601 is flying yet? If so, how have the wing pump(s) worked out?
>>
>>Terry
>
>Terry, I do not know you but wish to offer a thought for you. Eight
>years ago I put fuel pumps in the wing lockers and they worked fine. At
>the time it was my desire to keep from having a tank in the cockpit. Then
>later I became acquainted with William Wynne and now don't even have
>pressured fuel lines in the cabin. The object is to prevent fire in case
>of an accident. I haven't done it yet but will use an oil pressure switch
>to disable the fuel pumps anytime there is no oil pressure. An extra
>switch may be used for starting the engine. Think it over and do as you like.
>Cleone
Terry Phillips
ttp44~at~rkymtn.net
Corvallis MT
601XL/Jab 3300 s .. l .. o .. o .. w build kit - Tail, flaps, & ailerons
are done; working on the wings
http://www.mykitlog.com/N47TP/
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