Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 09:41 AM - Re: Panel questions (Gig Giacona)
2. 11:37 AM - Re: Re: Panel questions (steve)
3. 03:09 PM - Re: Re: Panel questions (Bill Naumuk)
4. 03:14 PM - Fw: Members Only Question- Whiskey compass (Bill Naumuk)
5. 04:52 PM - Instrument panel marking (wade jones)
6. 04:59 PM - Altitude encoder (Bill Naumuk)
7. 05:03 PM - Re: Instrument panel marking (Dirk Zahtilla)
8. 05:04 PM - Re: Instrument panel marking (Craig Payne)
9. 05:20 PM - Re: Instrument panel marking (jaybannist@cs.com)
10. 05:25 PM - Re: Instrument panel marking (Craig Payne)
11. 05:35 PM - Re: Altitude encoder (Tim Shankland)
12. 05:36 PM - Re: Altitude encoder (Craig Payne)
13. 05:36 PM - Re: Altitude encoder (Paul Mulwitz)
14. 05:37 PM - Re: Altitude encoder (Dirk Zahtilla)
15. 05:46 PM - Re: Instrument panel marking (LarryMcFarland)
16. 05:46 PM - Re: Altitude encoder (Bryan Martin)
17. 05:48 PM - Re: Altitude encoder (Bill Naumuk)
18. 06:03 PM - Re: Altitude encoder (Dirk Zahtilla)
19. 06:44 PM - Re: Altitude encoder (Craig Payne)
20. 08:10 PM - Re: Altitude encoder (Craig Payne)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Panel questions |
> I asked EAA as well, here's the answer.
>
> "An experimental aircraft that is operated day-VFR
> only does not have to comply with FAR 91.205. Only when flying at night or IFR
does the experimental aircraft need to meet 91.205. (This is required by the
aircraft's operating limitations, issued as a part of its airworthiness certificate,
rather than by the regulation itself.)
>
> Hope this helps!
>
> Joe
>
> Joe Norris
> EAA 113615 Lifetime
> Homebuilders Community Manager
"
So that should answer that.
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 6930#206930
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Panel questions |
Got that same answer from Joe when I asked if my GPS would satisfy the
compass rule. Joe told me that I really didnt need a compass anyway. Then
I mentioned that fact to the local People ( IA FAA DAR).
They said that YES I needed a Magnetic Direction Device.......The GPS was
NOT a MDD.
So with my tail between my legs I went out and purchased an Airpath ($169)
and it makes em happy. Rules or not, I do what "they" say...
SW
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gig Giacona" <wrgiacona@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 9:40 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Panel questions
>
>
>> I asked EAA as well, here's the answer.
>>
>> "An experimental aircraft that is operated day-VFR
>> only does not have to comply with FAR 91.205. Only when flying at night
>> or IFR does the experimental aircraft need to meet 91.205. (This is
>> required by the aircraft's operating limitations, issued as a part of its
>> airworthiness certificate, rather than by the regulation itself.)
>>
>> Hope this helps!
>>
>> Joe
>>
>> Joe Norris
>> EAA 113615 Lifetime
>> Homebuilders Community Manager
> "
>
>
> So that should answer that.
>
> --------
> W.R. "Gig" Giacona
> 601XL Under Construction
> See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 6930#206930
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Panel questions |
Unfortunately, it doesn't settle the Dynon/whiskey compass question, which
was the whole point in the first place.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gig Giacona" <wrgiacona@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 12:40 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Panel questions
>
>
>> I asked EAA as well, here's the answer.
>>
>> "An experimental aircraft that is operated day-VFR
>> only does not have to comply with FAR 91.205. Only when flying at night
>> or IFR does the experimental aircraft need to meet 91.205. (This is
>> required by the aircraft's operating limitations, issued as a part of its
>> airworthiness certificate, rather than by the regulation itself.)
>>
>> Hope this helps!
>>
>> Joe
>>
>> Joe Norris
>> EAA 113615 Lifetime
>> Homebuilders Community Manager
> "
>
>
> So that should answer that.
>
> --------
> W.R. "Gig" Giacona
> 601XL Under Construction
> See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 6930#206930
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Fw: Members Only Question- Whiskey compass |
All-
OK, here's the answer in it's entirety. Looks like the Dynon is a
go.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: Joe Norris
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 12:37 PM
Subject: RE: Members Only Question- Whiskey compass
Hello Bill,
An experimental aircraft that is operated day-VFR only is not required
to have a compass at all. Only if operated at night or under IFR is the
aircraft required to have a compass (along with all other equipment
called out in FAR 91.205). In any event, any "magnetic direction
indicator" that is capable of finding north on its own will meet the
requirement. There is no specific requirement for any particular type
of indicator/compass.
Joe
Joe Norris
EAA 113615 Lifetime
Homebuilders Community Manager
EAA-The Spirit of Aviation
Phone: 888.322.4636 Extension 6806
Fax: 920.426.6560
www.eaa.org
See you at EAA AirVenture Oshkosh-July 27 - August 2, 2009
From: Bill Naumuk [mailto:naumuk@alltel.net]
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 5:33 PM
Subject: Members Only Question- Whiskey compass
EAA-
Big fight going on the Zenith builder's website that I started.
I thought I had to equip my panel with a whiskey compass by
regulations and just bought a Dynon D-100 with slaved magnetic compass.
Do I still need the whiskey compass to pass regs? I have the Dynon
LithIon backup and a handheld GPS, so it's not like I'm without
redundant systems.I really don't want the extra weight and panel space
of the whiskey compass if I don't have to use it.
Thanks.
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
Message 5
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| Subject: | Instrument panel marking |
Hello group ,I am about ready to start marking my panel .Items like fuel
pumps ,flaps ,trim ect. What have the members been having the best luck
with . Thanks
Wade Jones South Texas
601XL Franklin 0-235
Message 6
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| Subject: | Altitude encoder |
All-
Do I need an altitude encoder with a mode C transponder, or is that
an option?
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Instrument panel marking |
I used a Dymo labeler (printer type) not expensive and they have a foil
type tape that holds up well.
Dirk
----- Original Message -----
From: wade jones
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 4:50 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Instrument panel marking
Hello group ,I am about ready to start marking my panel .Items like
fuel pumps ,flaps ,trim ect. What have the members been having the best
luck with . Thanks
Wade Jones South Texas
601XL Franklin 0-235
Message 8
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| Subject: | Instrument panel marking |
In the current (Nov) issue of Kitplanes Stein Bruch (of Stein Air) has a
good article summarizing his experience with all the options. But you need a
subscription:
http://www.kitplanes.com
I'm not building a pretty plane so I'm just using labels created on a
Brother pTouch thermal label maker.
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of wade jones
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:51 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Instrument panel marking
Hello group ,I am about ready to start marking my panel .Items like fuel
pumps ,flaps ,trim ect. What have the members been having the best luck with
. Thanks
Wade Jones South Texas
601XL Franklin 0-235
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Instrument panel marking |
Wade,
I used a Brother P-Touch label maker.? Since my panel is a medium gray, I used
clear tape with white lettering.? For a lighter panel, I would have used clear
tape with black lettering.? I can send photos if you want.
Jay
-----Original Message-----
From: wade jones <wjones@brazoriainet.com>
Sent: Tue, 30 Sep 2008 6:50 pm
Subject: Zenith-List: Instrument panel marking
Hello group ,I am about ready to start marking my
panel .Items like fuel pumps ,flaps ,trim ect. What have the members been having
the best luck with . Thanks
Wade? Jones? South Texas
601XL
Franklin 0-235
________________________________________________________________________
Email message sent from CompuServe - visit us today at http://www.cs.com
Message 10
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| Subject: | Instrument panel marking |
The pTouch labels hold up well too. I printed a black-on-white test label,
stuck it to a piece of aluminum and nailed it to the south-facing wall of my
house. After two Utah summers and winters at 7000 feet it looks unchanged.
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dirk Zahtilla
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 6:03 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Instrument panel marking
I used a Dymo labeler (printer type) not expensive and they have a foil type
tape that holds up well.
Dirk
----- Original Message -----
From: wade jones <mailto:wjones@brazoriainet.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 4:50 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Instrument panel marking
Hello group ,I am about ready to start marking my panel .Items like fuel
pumps ,flaps ,trim ect. What have the members been having the best luck with
. Thanks
Wade Jones South Texas
601XL Franklin 0-235
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matronhref
"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Altitude encoder |
Bill,
If you want your mode C transponder to provide altitude information you
will need some type of alttitude encoder.
Tim Shankland
601HD N706TS
Bill Naumuk wrote:
> All-
> Do I need an altitude encoder with a mode C transponder, or is
> that an option?
> Bill Naumuk
> Townville, Pa.
> HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Altitude encoder |
Yes you need an encoded but your Dynon D100 can do the job. If your
transponder works with serial encoders then all you need are some wires. If
it only accept parallel the you need to buy a little box from Dynon - still
cheaper than an encoded.
http://www.dynonavionics.com/downloads/Install_Guides/EFIS-D100%20Installati
on%20Guide.pdf, page 18, "Altitude Encoder Wiring"
Which transponder do you have?
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Naumuk
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:58 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Altitude encoder
All-
Do I need an altitude encoder with a mode C transponder, or is that an
option?
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Altitude encoder |
Hi Bill,
The transponder only transmits the altitude information. Altitude
information must be provided by an external device of some sort.
The old fashioned way to get the altitude is with a blind encoder
device. This is not a sensitive altimeter,so there is a dance you
must do with ATC. Each time you talk to a controller for the first
time you must tell him your altitude. That lets him calibrate his
eyeball to adjust your blind encoder report on his radar screen to
your sensitive altimeter report.
For most of us these days, the Dynon or other EFIS device will supply
altitude information to the transponder. In this case the altitude
reported is correct. Still, you must do the dance with ATC. After
all, they don't know you have modern equipment on your plane.
Good luck,
Paul
XL getting close
At 04:58 PM 9/30/2008, you wrote:
>All-
> Do I need an altitude encoder with a mode C transponder, or is
> that an option?
>Bill Naumuk
>Townville, Pa.
>HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Altitude encoder |
Yes, if you want to operate in class B & C? airspace. You can get one
from A.S. for about $150.
Dirk
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Naumuk
To: zenith list
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 4:58 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Altitude encoder
All-
Do I need an altitude encoder with a mode C transponder, or is
that an option?
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Instrument panel marking |
Hi Wade,
I used transparent sheet material from Staples, printed in
Ariel-Bold-Black on a laser printer. Cut them out and placed them. To do
again, I'd think
about putting a blind transparent cover over the laser print. Otherwise
I've been happy with the simple result where I've not had my fingers
touching them.
Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
wade jones wrote:
> Hello group ,I am about ready to start marking my panel .Items like
> fuel pumps ,flaps ,trim ect. What have the members been having the
> best luck with . Thanks
> Wade Jones South Texas
> 601XL Franklin 0-235
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Altitude encoder |
The mode A function should work fine without the encoder, you just
won't have the mode C altitude reporting function available.
On Sep 30, 2008, at 7:58 PM, Bill Naumuk wrote:
> All-
> Do I need an altitude encoder with a mode C transponder, or is
> that an option?
> Bill Naumuk
> Townville, Pa.
> HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.
do not archive.
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Altitude encoder |
Craig-
I'm looking at, but haven't bought a Bendix TR661A w/encoder, but no
tray. The price is reasonable enough, and I figure I could build a tray.
Since Dave Clay turned me on to Used Avionics.com, there are a multitude
of choices.
Decisions, decisions!
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: Craig Payne
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 8:34 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Altitude encoder
Yes you need an encoded but your Dynon D100 can do the job. If your
transponder works with serial encoders then all you need are some wires.
If it only accept parallel the you need to buy a little box from Dynon -
still cheaper than an encoded.
http://www.dynonavionics.com/downloads/Install_Guides/EFIS-D100%20Install
ation%20Guide.pdf, page 18, "Altitude Encoder Wiring"
Which transponder do you have?
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Naumuk
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:58 PM
To: zenith list
Subject: Zenith-List: Altitude encoder
All-
Do I need an altitude encoder with a mode C transponder, or is
that an option?
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Altitude encoder |
If you give ATC your GPS altitude chances are it will be wrong. They
will invariably give you the baro pressure to set your altimiter and
your blind encoder if correct will match with this setting. I found out
the hard (embarassing) way by setting my altimeter to my GPS and found
out it was off by over 500 feet. ATC doesn't care about your actual
altitude, they just want everyone on the same page (their page).
Dirk
----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Mulwitz
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:35 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Altitude encoder
Hi Bill,
The transponder only transmits the altitude information. Altitude
information must be provided by an external device of some sort.
The old fashioned way to get the altitude is with a blind encoder
device. This is not a sensitive altimeter,so there is a dance you must
do with ATC. Each time you talk to a controller for the first time you
must tell him your altitude. That lets him calibrate his eyeball to
adjust your blind encoder report on his radar screen to your sensitive
altimeter report.
For most of us these days, the Dynon or other EFIS device will supply
altitude information to the transponder. In this case the altitude
reported is correct. Still, you must do the dance with ATC. After all,
they don't know you have modern equipment on your plane.
Good luck,
Paul
XL getting close
At 04:58 PM 9/30/2008, you wrote:
All-
Do I need an altitude encoder with a mode C transponder, or is
that an option?
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
Message 19
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| Subject: | Altitude encoder |
At least for my Garmin 327 transponder the tray is fairly fancy. The tray
contains mating connectors for the power/data and the antenna connectors.
The alignment is good enough that the transponder slides in and the
connectors mate. This would be important in a packed panel where you didn't
have access to the rear of the panel. But I doubt your panel is that
elaborate and you may be building access panels to the rear of the panel
into your glare shield as many builders have. Hopefully you are getting a
discount due to the missing tray.
I can't find any manuals for the Bendix TR661A but I bet it is old enough
that it only offers parallel output. Chief Aircraft lists the Dynon
converter box (Dynon p/n 362-000) at $80 so factor that into your
calculations. But if the one you are looking at includes an encoder then you
could just plumb the included encoder into your static system and have one
more box behind you panel. On the other hand if the price of the encoder is
hidden in the price of the used transponder it may be cheaper to by a
transponder without the encoder and just spend the $80 on the Dynon
converter box.
In older transponders the transmitters are tube-based. With a used
transponder you don't know how much life is left in the tube and
replacements are expensive. The newer ones are solid-state. You get what you
pay for (or at least you don't get what you don't pay for). The cheapest new
solid-state transponder I could find is Narco single-display AT165/VS.
Spruce quotes it at $1335.
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Naumuk
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 6:48 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Altitude encoder
Craig-
I'm looking at, but haven't bought a Bendix TR661A w/encoder, but no
tray. The price is reasonable enough, and I figure I could build a tray.
Since Dave Clay turned me on to Used Avionics.com, there are a multitude of
choices.
Decisions, decisions!
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: Craig Payne <mailto:craig@craigandjean.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 8:34 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Altitude encoder
Yes you need an encoded but your Dynon D100 can do the job. If your
transponder works with serial encoders then all you need are some wires. If
it only accept parallel the you need to buy a little box from Dynon - still
cheaper than an encoded.
http://www.dynonavionics.com/downloads/Install_Guides/EFIS-D100%20Installati
on%20Guide.pdf, page 18, "Altitude Encoder Wiring"
Which transponder do you have?
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Naumuk
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:58 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Altitude encoder
All-
Do I need an altitude encoder with a mode C transponder, or is that an
option?
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matronhref
"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 20
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| Subject: | Altitude encoder |
One other point - if you don't get the tray you may not get the
multi-contact data connector that mates to the back of the transponder. It
may be a hassle tracking down the right connector.
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Naumuk
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 6:48 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Altitude encoder
Craig-
I'm looking at, but haven't bought a Bendix TR661A w/encoder, but no
tray. The price is reasonable enough, and I figure I could build a tray.
Since Dave Clay turned me on to Used Avionics.com, there are a multitude of
choices.
Decisions, decisions!
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: Craig Payne <mailto:craig@craigandjean.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 8:34 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Altitude encoder
Yes you need an encoded but your Dynon D100 can do the job. If your
transponder works with serial encoders then all you need are some wires. If
it only accept parallel the you need to buy a little box from Dynon - still
cheaper than an encoded.
http://www.dynonavionics.com/downloads/Install_Guides/EFIS-D100%20Installati
on%20Guide.pdf, page 18, "Altitude Encoder Wiring"
Which transponder do you have?
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Naumuk
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:58 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Altitude encoder
All-
Do I need an altitude encoder with a mode C transponder, or is that an
option?
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
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