---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 11/27/08: 16 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:05 AM - Re: Spreading fear about the XL (Jeff) 2. 04:57 AM - Re: Radio tray (Bill Naumuk) 3. 05:23 AM - Corvair engine mount for sale (jhines) 4. 06:34 AM - BING 96 / 64 (Roger & Lina Hill) 5. 07:16 AM - Re: Spreading Trust about the XL (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com) 6. 07:20 AM - Re: Radio tray (george may) 7. 07:44 AM - Re: Radio tray (Bill Pagan) 8. 07:59 AM - Re: Re: 601XL Aileron Balance Fairleads (John Smith) 9. 07:59 AM - Re: Radio tray/Battery cable (Bill Naumuk) 10. 08:09 AM - Re: Radio tray/Battery cable (jaybannist@cs.com) 11. 08:32 AM - Re: Spreading Trust about the XL (Sabrina) 12. 12:53 PM - Dual throttle linkage (Bill Naumuk) 13. 02:14 PM - [Probable Spam] Re: Spreading fear about the XL (Gig Giacona) 14. 02:22 PM - Re: Radio tray (george may) 15. 02:32 PM - Re: [Probable Spam] Re: Spreading fear about the XL (jaybannist@cs.com) 16. 04:05 PM - Jabiru 3300A engine mount (steve) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:05:33 AM PST US From: "Jeff " Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Spreading fear about the XL Clyde wrote: "That is all it is, a guess, some of us want to know as much as possible to avoid mistakes and to build a good solid plane. I think there has been some good conversation on the subject of properly tensioning control cables to avoid the "possibility" of flutter. I agree with building it to plans and flying within the design limitations but coming to the conclusion that all of them augured because of exceeding VNE and maneuvering speeds is a little over the top. From Bill's account, he experienced flutter, and he wasn't busting any design limits and later found his cables were not tensioned to spec. This is great information and something we can all learn from, in my opinion, that is exactly what this list is for, knowledge. I know I will buy the tool to check tension and it will be part of my frequent check list until I determine there is no need to check it quite as frequently." My real purpose for this post and the resulting thread was to try to prompt an authority we builders could depend on to make a statement identifying the problem we are experiencing, if a single one actually exists. So far, there has been no response, including from the NTSB whom I know is monitoring this list for now. I guess they are just shy guys and girls afraid to talk out loud, but their silence creates an environment that encourages whisper campaigns. On a practical level as aircraft manufacturers and owners, and since we are without any other input, Clyde has given us a pretty good summary for this thread. So our attention to cable tension has been re-established. As has been said a couple times, let's move on, but only after checking our cables. At least we will make the tool makers happy! Jeff Davidson ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:57:03 AM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Radio tray Thanks, Bill. Happy Thanksgiving. Bill do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Pagan To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2008 10:01 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Radio tray It's 6 5/16ths just right for a 6 1/4" radio stack. Bill Pagan EAA Tech Counselor #4395 --- On Wed, 11/26/08, Bill Naumuk wrote: From: Bill Naumuk Subject: Zenith-List: Radio tray To: "zenith list" Date: Wednesday, November 26, 2008, 8:45 PM All- I'm getting ready to fabricate a radio tray for my HDS (Which doesn't come with one stock) and figure 12" long before I run into my header tank. How wide are the ones that come with XLs? Thanks. Bill Naumuk Townville, Pa. HDS 601MG/Corvair 95% 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:23:57 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Corvair engine mount for sale From: "jhines" I have a Corvair engine mount that I purchased from William Wynne at "Corvair day" at the Zenith factory last year. I will sell it for $500. I also have an engine core but its completely disassembled and not in great shape. I'll take $50 for it but I wont ship it. Email me at johnrhines@gmail.com for more information. Thanks, John -------- John Hines Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=216514#216514 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/pict0454_194.jpg ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:34:54 AM PST US From: "Roger & Lina Hill" Subject: Zenith-List: BING 96 / 64 Howdy all; I am still trying to sell my: BING 94 / 64 AIRCRAFT CARBURETOR which is ALTITUDE COMPENSATING. This is a German Bing model 94 carburetor, it's the NEW big brother of the model 64 and has a throttle valve diameter of 42 mm. This is an altitude compensating, constant depression carburetor for aircraft use. This unit is similar to the ones used on the Rotax 912 engine, only larger. This particular carburetor is sized for engines between 60-120 HP and can be tuned by changing the main jet or needle height (jets are included). I purchased this unit from Great Plains, they make VW aircraft engines and it came with my water cooled head type engine. It can be used on experimental aircraft engines like the corvair or VW or other 4 or 6 cylinder engines under 120 HP. Its is also used on the Jabiru engine. I had this unit on my Great Plains VW for about a year, and I got it new. It has about 25 hours of operation on it and it is in perfect operating condition. After I received the unit form Great Plains, I converted it to a standard aircraft "fail-open" type throttle operation, which uses a wire control throttle and a wire control choke. If anyone is interested, email me back for more info and a special matronics only price of only $395 !!!!! Roger Hill Lawrence Kansas 785-550-3977 thx1139@sunflower.com ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:16:42 AM PST US From: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Spreading Trust about the XL Folks, just don't test pull them on your planes. The parts and pieces couldn't take that kind of pull without damage. ************** Life should be easier. icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:20:06 AM PST US From: george may Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Radio tray Bill-- I forget the exact dimensions on the XL consloe but I do know that it is no t wide enough to fit radios and transponders. I ended up fabricating my own panel about 2 inches wider to accommodate an Icom 200 and a Garmin 327 George May 601XL 912s From: naumuk@alltel.net Subject: Zenith-List: Radio tray All- I'm getting ready to fabricate a radio tray for my HDS (Which doesn't come with one stock) and figure 12" long before I run into my header tank. How wide are the ones that come with XLs? Thanks. Bill Naumuk Townville=2C Pa. HDS 601MG/Corvair 95% _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Hotmail now works up to 70% faster. http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_fast er_112008 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:44:31 AM PST US From: Bill Pagan Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Radio tray Hey George, - What year/version is your plane?- Mine is a QBK I picked up in January 20 08 and the transpnder/radio trays fit right in. Bill Pagan EAA Tech Counselor #4395 --- On Thu, 11/27/08, george may wrote: From: george may Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Radio tray #yiv1877291055 .hmmessage P { margin:0px;padding:0px;} #yiv1877291055 { font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana;} Bill-- I forget the exact dimensions on the XL consloe but I do know that it is no t wide enough to fit radios and transponders. I ended up fabricating my own panel about 2 inches wider to accommodate an Icom 200 and a Garmin 327 George May 601XL 912s From: naumuk@alltel.net Subject: Zenith-List: Radio tray All- --- I'm getting ready to fabricate a radio tray for my HDS (Which doe sn't-come with-one stock) and figure 12"-long before I run into my he ader tank. How wide are the ones that come with XLs? --- Thanks. Bill Naumuk Townville, Pa. HDS 601MG/Corvair 95% ww.matronics.com/contribution >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List onics.com Windows Live Hotmail now works up to 70% faster. Sign up today. =0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:59:15 AM PST US From: John Smith Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: 601XL Aileron Balance Fairleads Thanks for all who replied.- Those pictures help quite a bit.- The only questions I have left are where do the cables rub against the fairleads un der normal working tension?- It looks like the aileron balance cables rub the fairleads on the side facing away from the backseat support, and the a ileron cables rub the fairleads at 6-o'clock (bottom) position.- Am I rig ht?=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: DaveG601XL =0ATo: zenith-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Wednesday, No vember 26, 2008 8:20:57 AM=0ASubject: Zenith-List: Re: 601XL Aileron Balanc allagher@ge.com>=0A=0ALike Craig's pictures show, ZAC has changed the way t hey do quick builds, but the plans don't seem to have changed to match.- I talked to Roger about the change and the larger hole on the aileron fairl ead is meant to allow the entire turnbuckle to be passed through.- I don' t know why the balance cable does not mimic it.- I took the large hole id ea and applied it to both cables.- Attached is a picture of my fuselage. - =0A=0AHope this helps,=0A=0A--------=0ADavid Gallagher=0A601 XL/Jabiru 3300=0AFirst flight 7/24/08=0APhase I flight test complete 10/16/08=0A=0A =0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/view topic.php?p=216368#216368=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AAttachments: =0A=0Ahttp://forums. - - - - - - - - - - - - - -Matt Dralle, List Admi =====================0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:59:55 AM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Radio tray/Battery cable George- Tell me about it. I have a couple of spare hours to work on the project and I'm spinning my wheels. My tray has to accomodate an Icom 200, King transponder and a Dynon D100 slaved compass. Figuring out how to route the mixture and carb heat cables is another problem. Just paying my dues, I guess. I took a good, hard look at things and figured I'd better get all those coils of wire coming from the tail threaded up front while I still barely have access. I have a plan for the tail light, elevator trim, ELT and belly strobe, but I'm stuck on the battery cable. It has to go from the passenger side aft of the spar to the pilot's side of the firewall without getting in the way of feet or control cables. I know many builders ran their battery cables through the consoles but can't readily find any pictures. All help appreciated. Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: george may To: zenith list Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2008 10:19 AM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Radio tray Bill-- I forget the exact dimensions on the XL consloe but I do know that it is not wide enough to fit radios and transponders. I ended up fabricating my own panel about 2 inches wider to accommodate an Icom 200 and a Garmin 327 George May 601XL 912s ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: naumuk@alltel.net To: zenith-list@matronics.com Subject: Zenith-List: Radio tray Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2008 20:45:41 -0500 All- I'm getting ready to fabricate a radio tray for my HDS (Which doesn't come with one stock) and figure 12" long before I run into my header tank. How wide are the ones that come with XLs? Thanks. Bill Naumuk Townville, Pa. HDS 601MG/Corvair 95% ww.matronics.com/contribution >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List onics.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Windows Live Hotmail now works up to 70% faster. Sign up today. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:09:54 AM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Radio tray/Battery cable From: jaybannist@cs.com Bill, By the way, I ran my throttle, carb heat and mixture control cables between the radios and the "radio tray."? - Jay -----Original Message----- From: Bill Naumuk Sent: Thu, 27 Nov 2008 9:59 am Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Radio tray/Battery cable George- ??? Tell me about it. I have a couple of spare hours to work on the project and I'm spinning my wheels. My tray has to accomodate an Icom 200, King transponder and a Dynon D100 slaved compass. Figuring out?how to route?the mixture and carb heat cables is another problem. Just paying my dues, I guess. ??? I took a good, hard look at things and figured I'd better get all those coils of wire coming from the tail threaded up front while I still?barely have access. I have a plan for the tail light, elevator trim,?ELT and belly strobe, but I'm stuck on the battery cable. It has to go?from the passenger side aft of the spar to the pilot's side of the firewall without getting in the way of feet or control cables. I?know many builders ran their battery cables through the consoles but can't readily find any pictures. ??? All help appreciated. ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? Bill ??? ----- Original Message ----- From: george may Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2008 10:19 AM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Radio tray Bill-- I forget the exact dimensions on the XL consloe but I do know that it is not wide enough to fit radios and transponders. I ended up fabricating my own panel about 2 inches wider to accommodate an Icom 200 and a Garmin 327 George May 601XL 912s From: naumuk@alltel.net Subject: Zenith-List: Radio tray All- ??? I'm getting ready to fabricate a radio tray for my HDS (Which doesn't?come with?one stock) and figure 12"?long before I run into my header tank. How wide are the ones that come with XLs? ??? Thanks. Bill Naumuk Townville, Pa. HDS 601MG/Corvair 95% ww.matronics.com/contribution >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List onics.com Windows Live Hotmail now works up to 70% faster. Sign up today. href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com ________________________________________________________________________ Email message sent from CompuServe - visit us today at http://www.cs.com ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:32:19 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Spreading Trust about the XL From: "Sabrina" Both an electric winch and flexible parking brake cable tension gauge can be purchased on E-bay for about $100 total. The gauge looks a lot like the one we use for normal cable tensions but has a handle for leverage. Place a short run of nylon shield over the cable before swaging, it will protect it from damage by the gauge. The winch also comes in handy for loading and unloading the airplane from a trailer. If you have a full face motorcycle helmet, I would wear that, heavy clothes and welding gloves during testing. It goes without saying that you use a jeep or your garage for mounting the winch/"other end" NOT your aircraft and have someone supervise who has done this before. P.S. For those of you who have written off line about the passing of my grandfather (he would have been 88 yesterday) I thank you for your concern. He bought me my C150 for my 10th birthday present. He was a great guy and served this country well in WWII. I delete my posts routinely. It is my habit. No offense intended. I post for you guys and the FAA now, not for curious people 10 years from now. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=216539#216539 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/winch_138.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/gauge_187.jpg ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:53:04 PM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Zenith-List: Dual throttle linkage All- Is there anyone out there who went with dual sticks and has the dual throttle linkage for sale? If not, how about a part number-Zenith online parts doesn't show anything. HDS numbers don't work, so I guess it's up to you XL people. Thanks. Bill do not archive Bill Naumuk Townville, Pa. HDS 601MG/Corvair 95% ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:14:00 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: [Probable Spam] Re: Spreading fear about the XL From: "Gig Giacona" Ron Lendon wrote: > Gig, > > I haven't found anything written either, but I will test the theory and report the results. My plan is to make up some cables, tension them above the requirements and see what happens when I apply a little more pressure, think plucking a guitar string, then check the tension again. If it doesn't change we will know then. Well get to work on that Ron. I'll be mounting wings shortly. :) -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=216569#216569 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:22:10 PM PST US From: george may Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Radio tray Bill- Finished mine in 2006 and have 240 hours on it. Sounds like maybe they acte d on some feedback. George From: pdn8r@yahoo.com Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Radio tray Hey George=2C What year/version is your plane? Mine is a QBK I picked up in January 2008 and the transpnder/radio trays fit right in. Bill PaganEAA Tech Counselor #4395 --- On Thu=2C 11/27/08=2C george may wrote: From: george may Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Radio tray Bill-- I forget the exact dimensions on the XL consloe but I do know that it is no t wide enough to fit radios and transponders. I ended up fabricating my own panel about 2 inches wider to accommodate an Icom 200 and a Garmin 327 George May 601XL 912s From: naumuk@alltel.net Subject: Zenith-List: Radio tray All- I'm getting ready to fabricate a radio tray for my HDS (Which doesn't c ome with one stock) and figure 12" long before I run into my header tank. H ow wide are the ones that come with XLs? Thanks. Bill Naumuk Townville=2C Pa. HDS 601MG/Corvair 95% ww.matronics.com/contribution >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List onics.com Windows Live Hotmail now works up to 70% faster. Sign up today. 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D _________________________________________________________________ Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious emai l. http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_safe ty_112008 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:32:35 PM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: [Probable Spam] Re: Spreading fear about the XL From: jaybannist@cs.com Gig, F.Y.I. - The breaking strength of 1/8" 7x19 galvanized aircraft cable is 2,000 pounds.? We are putting a max of 40 pounds on it. It doesn't sound like we are overstressing it much, with a safety factor of 50, now does it?? I'm guessing that the weak link is the nicopress sleeves WE install. If any testing is to be done, it probably should be on a made up cable with both ends complete. Jay in Dallas Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: Gig Giacona Sent: Thu, 27 Nov 2008 4:13 pm Subject: Zenith-List: [Probable Spam] Re: Spreading fear about the XL Ron Lendon wrote: > Gig, > > I haven't found anything written either, but I will test the theory and report the results. My plan is to make up some cables, tension them above the requirements and see what happens when I apply a little more pressure, think plucking a guitar string, then check the tension again. If it doesn't change we will know then. Well get to work on that Ron. I'll be mounting wings shortly. :) -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=216569#216569 Gig ________________________________________________________________________ Email message sent from CompuServe - visit us today at http://www.cs.com ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 04:05:56 PM PST US From: "steve" Subject: Zenith-List: Jabiru 3300A engine mount Today I ran my 3300 for the first time. Only thing I didnt like was the flexing of the engine mount. It really flexes from side to side. Do you other 3300 owners have the same situation?? Steve ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.