Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 12:26 AM - What Listers Have Been Saying (Matt Dralle)
1. 08:10 AM - Re: Radio tray (LarryMcFarland)
2. 09:07 AM - Re: Radio tray (Bill Naumuk)
3. 11:49 AM - Desperation is the mother of invention (Bill Naumuk)
4. 11:58 AM - Re: Desperation is the mother of invention (T. Graziano)
5. 12:02 PM - Re: Radio tray (LarryMcFarland)
6. 01:38 PM - Re: Desperation is the mother of invention (LarryMcFarland)
7. 02:01 PM - Re: Radio tray (Bill Naumuk)
8. 02:07 PM - Re: Desperation is the mother of invention (Bill Naumuk)
9. 02:45 PM - Aircraft Control Cable (to stretch or not) (Ron Lendon)
10. 02:51 PM - Battery cable run (Bill Naumuk)
11. 04:11 PM - Re: Aircraft Control Cable (to stretch or not) (Sabrina)
12. 06:25 PM - Re: Re: Aircraft Control Cable (to stretch or not) (JohnDRead@aol.com)
13. 06:34 PM - Re: Aircraft Control Cable (to stretch or not) (Ron Lendon)
14. 09:42 PM - Re: Aircraft Control Cable (to stretch or not) (Sabrina)
Message 0
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| Subject: | What Listers Have Been Saying |
Wow! Many of the members making a List Support Contribution this year have been
using the Comments field to leave a personal message about the Lists. Thank
you! I have included a number of them below. Please read over a few and see
if you perhaps can echo some of the same sentiments regarding the value of the
Lists to you...
There is only a couple more days left for this year's List Fund Raiser and we're
still way behind previous years. If you've been waiting until the last minute
to show your support, Now is the Time! Please make your Contribution and pick
up a great gift at the same time!
By Credit Card or Paypal:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
or By Personal Check:
Matronics / Matt Dralle
PO Box 347
Livermore, CA 94550-7227
Thank you in advance!!
Matt Dralle
Email List and Forums Administrator
Here is some of the great feedback members have been including along with their
personal Contributions this year...
Over the years, the info I have received from the RV-List has
saved me thousands of dollars, and dozens of hours of time by
helping me avoid bad purchases, pointing me at vendors with
low prices and excellent support, and providing solutions to
the typical head scratchers that you run into.
Kevin H
Valuable service. Best List(s) on the Internet!
George A
Please accept this token not as an indicator of what
this list has been worth to me this past year.
Lew G
Great information and entertainment.
Tim V
Thanks again for another great year of service. This
project would be beyond me if it were not for the list.
Moreover, the friendships I have found are worth their
weight in GOLD!
Robert B
Great support you provide to all the subscribers!
Freddie H
Read it every day.
PF B
Thanks for your excellent management of the Matronics
Lists! Your services are head and shoulders above the
rest.
James M
Without the "List", there would be no Kolb "community".
Bill T
Thanks, Matt, for a great service! I've been monitoring
and using the lists since 1999.
Richard D
Thanks for such a terrific site and for all the work and
effort you put into it.
John R
A great service year after year.
John D
..another year of fantastic service.
Jerry B
This list is a great resource.
Arden A
Great list.
James M
Lists were a great help while building HRII N561FS.
John S
Great resources for both the beginner and experienced.
George R
Good service.
Gary G
The List is an invaluable resource!
William C
AeroElectric list is a great source of info and learning!
Janice J
Thank you, Matt for being there for us making it all happen
on the List for so many years - Great JOB!
Sam S
Thank you for providing a great venue. You definitely hit
the nail on the head with your solicitation asking if
readers look forward to receiving the email digests. I
certainly do and when I move from a dreamer to a builder, I
expect the anticipation will only increase.
Joe S
Thanks for a Perfect working list.
Hans-Peter R
Great List
Bryan K
Such a great selection of valuable forums!
David G
Nice job!
Walt E
Good resource...
Robert P
Thank you for another great year!
Scott S
I could not do this without you...
Robert D
I believe I've been a list member for over a decade
now. Thanks for the service!
Tim L
Great List
Hendrik W
Message 1
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Hi Bill,
The link below will guide you on size and install requirements for the
ICom A200
http://rv8.ch/files/Icom%20IC-A200%20Installation%20Instructions.pdf
http://www.macsmachine.com/images/electrical/full/encoder.gif
http://www.macsmachine.com/images/controllinkages/full/instpanelassy.gif
The second links are my tray and install for the radio and remote ACK
encoder mount for the transponder.
Hope that helps,
Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
Bill Naumuk wrote:
All-
> I'm getting ready to fabricate a radio tray for my HDS (Which
> doesn't come with one stock) and figure 12" long before I run into my
> header tank. How wide are the ones that come with XLs?
> Thanks.
> Bill Naumuk
> Townville, Pa.
> HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
Message 2
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Larry-
Although I still have to figure out where to put the remote compass and
altitude encoder, first things first. I'm fishing the battery cables and
tail section wiring up front. Incidentally, can you explain the (what seem
to be) three solenoids in your site pictures? Two behind the seat and one on
the front firewall?
Many thanks to Jay Bannister for his assistance in routing the battery
cables under the upper longerons. He went via the passenger side, I'm trying
to go from the pilot side. 8 hours of research for every 10 minutes of
actual work, but I'm it's sure worth it in the long run. I'll post pictures
of the finished product if I don't shoot myself in frustration en route!
Thanks.
Bill
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "LarryMcFarland" <larry@macsmachine.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 11:06 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Radio tray
>
> Hi Bill,
> The link below will guide you on size and install requirements for the
> ICom A200
> http://rv8.ch/files/Icom%20IC-A200%20Installation%20Instructions.pdf
> http://www.macsmachine.com/images/electrical/full/encoder.gif
> http://www.macsmachine.com/images/controllinkages/full/instpanelassy.gif
> The second links are my tray and install for the radio and remote ACK
> encoder mount for the transponder.
> Hope that helps,
>
> Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
>
> Bill Naumuk wrote:
> All-
>> I'm getting ready to fabricate a radio tray for my HDS (Which doesn't
>> come with one stock) and figure 12" long before I run into my header
>> tank. How wide are the ones that come with XLs?
>> Thanks.
>> Bill Naumuk
>> Townville, Pa.
>> HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Desperation is the mother of invention |
All-
The pictures are self explanitory. Now I'll solder the joint just to
be on the safe side. After insulating boots come in from ACS, I'll
install them over the terminals using silicone grease, then seal the
boot/cable insulation juncture with shrink wrap.
You know what? Take a close look at my vise in "After crimp". If I
took the regular jaws out to allow further closing travel, I probably
could have made the crimp using the vise pipe holders!
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Desperation is the mother of invention |
FWIW: I used my nicropress crimper (the handheld one used for swaging
nicropress cable sleeves) to swage on my battery terminal ends to their
cables. Has been working well for almost 3 1/2 years.
Tony Graziano
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Naumuk
To: zenith list
Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 1:48 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Desperation is the mother of invention
All-
The pictures are self explanitory. Now I'll solder the joint just
to be on the safe side. After insulating boots come in from ACS, I'll
install them over the terminals using silicone grease, then seal the
boot/cable insulation juncture with shrink wrap.
You know what? Take a close look at my vise in "After crimp". If I
took the regular jaws out to allow further closing travel, I probably
could have made the crimp using the vise pipe holders!
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
Message 5
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Each battery connects by way of a separate switch that engages the fuse
blocks. I have hot, main and essential blocks.
The contactor on the firewall is for the alternator should it be
necessary to disconnect it as a runaway.
Larry McFarland
do not archive
Bill Naumuk wrote:
>
> Larry-
> Although I still have to figure out where to put the remote compass
> and altitude encoder, first things first. I'm fishing the battery
> cables and tail section wiring up front. Incidentally, can you explain
> the (what seem to be) three solenoids in your site pictures? Two
> behind the seat and one on the front firewall?
> Many thanks to Jay Bannister for his assistance in routing the
> battery cables under the upper longerons. He went via the passenger
> side, I'm trying to go from the pilot side. 8 hours of research for
> every 10 minutes of actual work, but I'm it's sure worth it in the
> long run. I'll post pictures of the finished product if I don't shoot
> myself in frustration en route!
> Thanks.
>
> Bill
> do not archive
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "LarryMcFarland"
> <larry@macsmachine.com>
> To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 11:06 AM
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Radio tray
>
>
>> <larry@macsmachine.com>
>>
>> Hi Bill,
>> The link below will guide you on size and install requirements for
>> the ICom A200
>> http://rv8.ch/files/Icom%20IC-A200%20Installation%20Instructions.pdf
>> http://www.macsmachine.com/images/electrical/full/encoder.gif
>> http://www.macsmachine.com/images/controllinkages/full/instpanelassy.gif
>> The second links are my tray and install for the radio and remote ACK
>> encoder mount for the transponder.
>> Hope that helps,
>>
>> Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
>>
>> Bill Naumuk wrote:
>> All-
>>> I'm getting ready to fabricate a radio tray for my HDS (Which
>>> doesn't come with one stock) and figure 12" long before I run into
>>> my header tank. How wide are the ones that come with XLs?
>>> Thanks.
>>> Bill Naumuk
>>> Townville, Pa.
>>> HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
>>
>>
>>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Desperation is the mother of invention |
Bill,
Before you get the other end done, perhaps a short length of shrink wrap
would be advisable to minimize the exposed copper and insulating end.
Larry McFarland
do not archive
Bill Naumuk wrote:
> All-
> The pictures are self explanitory. Now I'll solder the joint just
> to be on the safe side. After insulating boots come in from ACS, I'll
> install them over the terminals using silicone grease, then seal the
> boot/cable insulation juncture with shrink wrap.
> You know what? Take a close look at my vise in "After crimp". If I
> took the regular jaws out to allow further closing travel, I probably
> could have made the crimp using the vise pipe holders!
> Bill Naumuk
> Townville, Pa.
> HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
Message 7
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Larry-
Stupid me, redundant batteries.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "LarryMcFarland" <larry@macsmachine.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 2:44 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Radio tray
>
> Each battery connects by way of a separate switch that engages the fuse
> blocks. I have hot, main and essential blocks.
> The contactor on the firewall is for the alternator should it be necessary
> to disconnect it as a runaway.
>
> Larry McFarland
> do not archive
>
>
> Bill Naumuk wrote:
>>
>> Larry-
>> Although I still have to figure out where to put the remote compass
>> and altitude encoder, first things first. I'm fishing the battery cables
>> and tail section wiring up front. Incidentally, can you explain the (what
>> seem to be) three solenoids in your site pictures? Two behind the seat
>> and one on the front firewall?
>> Many thanks to Jay Bannister for his assistance in routing the battery
>> cables under the upper longerons. He went via the passenger side, I'm
>> trying to go from the pilot side. 8 hours of research for every 10
>> minutes of actual work, but I'm it's sure worth it in the long run. I'll
>> post pictures of the finished product if I don't shoot myself in
>> frustration en route!
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Bill
>> do not archive
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "LarryMcFarland"
>> <larry@macsmachine.com>
>> To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
>> Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 11:06 AM
>> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Radio tray
>>
>>
>>> <larry@macsmachine.com>
>>>
>>> Hi Bill,
>>> The link below will guide you on size and install requirements for the
>>> ICom A200
>>> http://rv8.ch/files/Icom%20IC-A200%20Installation%20Instructions.pdf
>>> http://www.macsmachine.com/images/electrical/full/encoder.gif
>>> http://www.macsmachine.com/images/controllinkages/full/instpanelassy.gif
>>> The second links are my tray and install for the radio and remote ACK
>>> encoder mount for the transponder.
>>> Hope that helps,
>>>
>>> Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com
>>>
>>> Bill Naumuk wrote:
>>> All-
>>>> I'm getting ready to fabricate a radio tray for my HDS (Which
>>>> doesn't come with one stock) and figure 12" long before I run into my
>>>> header tank. How wide are the ones that come with XLs?
>>>> Thanks.
>>>> Bill Naumuk
>>>> Townville, Pa.
>>>> HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Desperation is the mother of invention |
Tony-
Never thought of it. Very good idea, because the tool can go to the
wire rather than the wire going to a vise.
Little hints like this are what deserve to be archived. Too bad we
couldn't filter out all the negative crap in the database. Thanks.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: T. Graziano
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 2:58 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Desperation is the mother of invention
FWIW: I used my nicropress crimper (the handheld one used for swaging
nicropress cable sleeves) to swage on my battery terminal ends to their
cables. Has been working well for almost 3 1/2 years.
Tony Graziano
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Naumuk
To: zenith list
Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 1:48 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Desperation is the mother of invention
All-
The pictures are self explanitory. Now I'll solder the joint
just to be on the safe side. After insulating boots come in from ACS,
I'll install them over the terminals using silicone grease, then seal
the boot/cable insulation juncture with shrink wrap.
You know what? Take a close look at my vise in "After crimp". If
I took the regular jaws out to allow further closing travel, I probably
could have made the crimp using the vise pipe holders!
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
Message 9
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| Subject: | Aircraft Control Cable (to stretch or not) |
FYI
Today I called my mentor and asked about stretch in the cables. After much listening
I came away with the realization that I won't be conducting a pre-stretch
because that has already happened in the manufacturing process.
He did however maintain that checking the tension periodically is necessary. The
major factors effecting the tension are temperature variation from the last
check and wear of the fair leads/pulleys.
Comparing the expansion coefficients of both:
Aluminum 12.3
Steel 7.3
You can see Aluminum expands and contracts 5 times that of Steel. So if you tension
your cables on an 80 degree day you can bet they will need it again on a
0 degree day in the winter. Just some thoughts.
I checked the cable I got from ACS and it is MIL-DTL-83420 with a red and gold
filament.
> There are two easy identification methods that may help you identify aircraft
control cable:
>
> (1) All MIL-DTL-83420 contains a two-color tracer filament embeded within the
cable that identifies the manufacturer,
> (2) All MIL-DTL-83420 cable sold on a shipping real must contain the identification
number of the manufacturing reel. (All MIL-DTL-83420 cable is lubricated
with a corrosion inhibiter.)
>
So Gig, Don't wait for me to set up a test. Keep building.
--------
Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI
WW Corvair with Roy's Garage 5th bearing
Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-)
http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=216912#216912
Message 10
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| Subject: | Battery cable run |
All-
Tony Graziano just posted an idea that trumped my crimping
technique. People, this is what we need in the archives!!! What follows
from me is proof that an idiot can build a 601...
Start with "Under Header". This is why I have to be so carefull that
everything's insulated properly. My header tank goes over top of the
Moroso fitting. A fuel tank ground is not a good thing.
Longeron run. The cable is temporarily mounted using Adel clamps.
I'll eventually use cable ties for a neater installation.
Solenoid mount. I installed a 5" tray to accomodate the solenoid and
if need be, the D100 slave compass if it isn't happy on the radio tray.
Finally, "Z Channel Run". I plan to secure the cable over top of the
Z Channel to the battery.
Many thanks to Jay Bannister for getting my brain engaged.
Bill Naumuk
Townville, Pa.
HDS 601MG/Corvair 95%
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Control Cable (to stretch or not) |
Correct me if I am wrong
10 of Galvanized Steel Cable will expand 4/64" during a rise of 80F.
10 of Stainless Steel Cable will expand 6/64" during a rise of 80F
10 of 6061 T6 will expand 10/64 during a rise of 80F.
Mil Spec SS has lubricant too. MIL-C-18375 can have red and gold filaments too.
I loose 700 (240 for 83420) pounds of ultimate strength but my tensions dont vary
as much and the SS cables running past the Dynon compass in the tail are not
going to be magnetized, even though a moving cable does create some current.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=216921#216921
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Control Cable (to stretch or not) |
Hi, You are not wrong but you did not include the fact that aluminum expand
s
approximately three time the amount that steel does for the same temperatur
e
rise. So what will happen is that increases in temp will increase the
tension in a cable not decrease it.
John Read
Phone: 303-648-3261
Fax: 303-648-3262
Cell: 719-494-4567
In a message dated 11/29/2008 5:11:54 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,
chicago2paris@msn.com writes:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Sabrina" <chicago2paris@msn.com>
Correct me if I am wrong=C3=A2=82=AC=C2
10=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2 of Galvanized Steel Cable will expand 4/64" duri
ng a rise of 80F.
10=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2 of Stainless Steel Cable will expand 6/64" durin
g a rise of 80F
10=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2 of 6061 T6 will expand 10/64=C3=A2=82=AC=C2
=9D during a rise of 80F.
Mil Spec SS has lubricant too. MIL-C-18375 can have red and gold filament
s
too.
I loose 700 (240 for 83420) pounds of ultimate strength but my tensions don
=C3=A2
=82=AC=84=A2t vary as much and the SS cables running past the Dynon co
mpass in the tail
are not going to be magnetized, even though a moving cable does create some
current.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=216921#216921
**************Finally, one site has it all: your friends, your email, your
favorite sites. Try the NEW AOL.com.
m00000006)
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Control Cable (to stretch or not) |
Sabrina,
I seriously doubt that you are wrong. The two color filament is the manufactures
designation. Guess they make stainless cable also.
The point about the variance relates to the aluminum body of the aircraft and the
steel composition of the cables. The fuselage could shrink 0.1565" but the
cable would shrink only 0.0625" over the 10' you state.
0.0937 slop would be introduced in the hot to cold example. The reverse would be
true if the temperatures are reversed cold to hot. That would not be a very
good thing be cause the cables are very strong and as the aluminum grows it could
tension the cables above spec or perhaps damage the airframe.
--------
Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI
WW Corvair with Roy's Garage 5th bearing
Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-)
http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=216937#216937
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Control Cable (to stretch or not) |
Ron,
Since you were all geared up to stretch some cables for Gig, would you please set
up a cable the same length as an aileron cable, tension it to 30 pounds and
then adjust the turnbuckle 4/64th and 6/64th tighter and tell us the tensions.
Then adjust it back to 30, and then adjust it 4/64th and 6/64th looser and
tell us the tensions. I cannot find any charts/tables even guesstimating the
change in tension. We could all post our guesses and have a little fun with
the issue. Everything on this list is so serious lately. Building is FUN!
Sincerely,
Sabrina
P.S. My guess would be: 34, 36, 26, 24
P.P.S. Does anyone know what the "take up/let out" is for each 180 degree rotation
of the turnbuckle?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=216950#216950
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