Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 10:11 AM - Re: Germany First to Lift Grounding order! (Rhino)
2. 12:37 PM - Re: Change of tailwheel on 601XL (Juan Vega)
3. 12:38 PM - Re: Re: Germany First to Lift Grounding order! (Juan Vega)
4. 01:14 PM - Re: Re: Germany First to Lift Grounding order! (John Davis)
5. 02:09 PM - Grinding off part of a bolt head in tight spot? (PatrickW)
6. 02:28 PM - Re: Grinding off part of a bolt head in tight spot? (Dave Austin)
7. 02:41 PM - Re: CH750 - Is this Normal? (Stefan)
8. 02:42 PM - Re: Grinding off part of a bolt head in tight spot? (George Swinford)
9. 02:59 PM - Re: CH750 - Is this Normal? (Gig Giacona)
10. 03:05 PM - Re: CH750 - Is this Normal? (Brady)
11. 03:28 PM - Re: Re: CH750 - Is this Normal? (Craig Payne)
12. 03:52 PM - Re: Re: posting on matronics about corrosion (Ken Lilja)
13. 04:06 PM - Re: Re: Germany First to Lift Grounding order! (Jay Maynard)
14. 06:06 PM - Re: posting on matronics about corrosion (bcchurch)
15. 08:24 PM - Re: Grinding off part of a bolt head in tight spot? (JohnDRead@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Germany First to Lift Grounding order! |
I figured as much. There just wasn't enough evidence to justify the grounding.
--------
Bob Simmons
CH 750!!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219635#219635
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Change of tailwheel on 601XL |
how about we swap planes for the day! I would love to fly your tail dragger version!
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: "Dr. Andrew Elliott" <a.s.elliott@cox.net>
>Sent: Dec 15, 2008 2:22 PM
>To: Zenith-List Digest Server <zenith-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Zenith-List: Change of tailwheel on 601XL
>
>Folks:
>
>I had been much less than pleased with the 8" Matco T8 tailwheel that came with
my 601XL/TD kit. I found it very unresponsive, usually requiring full pedal
deflection and braking to get any turn going and then it was quite difficult
to control. This might have been due to the way I connected the steering springs
to the rudder horn? I even paid Zenith to bend me a new tail spring to a
40 angle, so that the pivot axis would be nearly exactly vertical. All to no
avail.
>
>So I forked out the ~$350 for a small Maule tailwheel (SFSA) with the solid tire
and new compression-type springs. Much better control now. Easy breakouts
for quick turns. No shimmy problem. Does ride a bit rougher, as you would expect,
compared to the pneumatic one. But I like the slightly lower stance, too,
and am well pleased.
>
>Anyone who might want a barely used Matco T8 tailwheel ($216 from AS&S) for $70
plus shipping, let me know off list. I would probably make you a good deal
on a tail spring, too, as I am thinking of going back to the original spring,
whose angle is closer to right for the Maule tailwheel.
>
>Andy Elliott, Mesa, AZ
>N601GE,601XL/TD,Corvair
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Germany First to Lift Grounding order! |
NTSB report has come back on the crash in California crash as not structurally
directed.
Fingers are pointing to questionable construction (not following plans)
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
>From: Rhino <bsimmons@rainbowdata.com>
>Sent: Dec 16, 2008 1:11 PM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Germany First to Lift Grounding order!
>
>
>I figured as much. There just wasn't enough evidence to justify the grounding.
>
>--------
>Bob Simmons
>CH 750!!!
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219635#219635
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Germany First to Lift Grounding order! |
Hi Juan,
Where did you see this information ? I just checked the NTSB website and
they still dont show the Probable Cause report yet, only the factual
that was updated recently.
Thanks,
John
N601JD - 601XL & Jab 3300
Finally ready for first flight
Juan Vega wrote:
>
> NTSB report has come back on the crash in California crash as not structurally
directed.
> Fingers are pointing to questionable construction (not following plans)
> Do not archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
>> From: Rhino <bsimmons@rainbowdata.com>
>> Sent: Dec 16, 2008 1:11 PM
>> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Germany First to Lift Grounding order!
>>
>>
>> I figured as much. There just wasn't enough evidence to justify the grounding.
>>
>> --------
>> Bob Simmons
>> CH 750!!!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219635#219635
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Grinding off part of a bolt head in tight spot? |
In order to meet edge distance on 6T2-3 (rear horizontal stabilizer attach bracket),
the bolt hole is close to the bend radius.
The hole itself is not in the radius, but the edge of the head of the bolt would
bear down on the curvature of the radius if tightened.
It does not appear to be possible to both have proper edge distance for the hole
AND for the bold head to not hit the radius.
Is it ok to grind off some of the bolt head so that it doesn't interfere with the
adjacent radius...? Does the head of a bolt contribute to the strength of
the bolt?
I looked for guidance in AC43, and in the Construction Standards, and I searched
this forum, but didn't find anything.
There's got to be a lot of fellow builders who've run into this exact same thing.
What did you do...?
Thanks,
- Pat
pwhoyt@yahoo.com
--------
Patrick
601XL/Corvair
N63PZ (reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219674#219674
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Grinding off part of a bolt head in tight spot? |
You could grind off enough of a washer under the bolt head so that there is
no interference.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: CH750 - Is this Normal? |
I don't know if it is normal and I will not comment on that. The fact is (since
I took the pictures) it was the current flying CH750 factory airplane (as of
September 2008). Unfortunately, as you may have read in the CH750 list, the photos
are all we have in addition to some plans. Construction manuals are still
months away and having so called pre-drilled parts don't save much time at all
if the alignment is off and you have to improvise and still make you own parts
to make it fit. I guess it is a "try as you go" approach until the kit, plans
and manuals are through a significant number of revisions.
That's what I signed up for when I ordered the parts. ZAC is trying their best
and customer service is exceptional! Let's call it temporary pain.
Merry Christmas everybody.
Stefan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219687#219687
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Grinding off part of a bolt head in tight spot? |
Patrick:
How about a washer or two under the bolt head? If necessary, you could
grind off one edge of the washer. You might have to go to the next bolt
length.
George Swinford
Do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "PatrickW" <pwhoyt@yahoo.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 2:08 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Grinding off part of a bolt head in tight spot?
>
> In order to meet edge distance on 6T2-3 (rear horizontal stabilizer attach
> bracket), the bolt hole is close to the bend radius.
>
> The hole itself is not in the radius, but the edge of the head of the bolt
> would bear down on the curvature of the radius if tightened.
>
> It does not appear to be possible to both have proper edge distance for
> the hole AND for the bold head to not hit the radius.
>
> Is it ok to grind off some of the bolt head so that it doesn't interfere
> with the adjacent radius...? Does the head of a bolt contribute to the
> strength of the bolt?
>
> I looked for guidance in AC43, and in the Construction Standards, and I
> searched this forum, but didn't find anything.
>
> There's got to be a lot of fellow builders who've run into this exact same
> thing. What did you do...?
>
> Thanks,
>
> - Pat
>
> pwhoyt@yahoo.com
>
> --------
> Patrick
> 601XL/Corvair
> N63PZ (reserved)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219674#219674
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: CH750 - Is this Normal? |
Stefan,
Think of it this way. There are kits that have been on the market for 10 years
that a few photos is all the build manual there is or ever will be.
--------
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219692#219692
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: CH750 - Is this Normal? |
I like that!
Temporarily over looked to be decided later. :)
Stefan,
how come they aren't giving you guys the 701 stuff to get you started and then
update you as they become available?
You guys could be building wings right?
the only difference is the 750s are longer right?
you could be building wing ribs and stuff.
Rudders, slats, flaperons, tail feathers.
How is all that working?
all you 750 builders are basically plans builders without plans?
So what did you pay for a kit?
I'm confused. :)
--------
Brady McCormick
Poulsbo, WA
www.magnificentmachine.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219694#219694
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: CH750 - Is this Normal? |
I believe one big difference between the 701 and 750 wings is that the rear
spar on the 701 is in small segments between the ribs while the one on the
750 is one continuous piece with the ribs stopping at the rear spar.
http://www.zenithair.com/stolch750/prototype/wink-skeleton-550.jpg
http://www.zenithair.com/stolch701/pic2000/701-wing-exploded-view.gif
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brady
Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 4:05 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: CH750 - Is this Normal?
I like that!
Temporarily over looked to be decided later. :)
Stefan,
how come they aren't giving you guys the 701 stuff to get you started and
then update you as they become available?
You guys could be building wings right?
the only difference is the 750s are longer right?
you could be building wing ribs and stuff.
Rudders, slats, flaperons, tail feathers.
How is all that working?
all you 750 builders are basically plans builders without plans?
So what did you pay for a kit?
I'm confused. :)
--------
Brady McCormick
Poulsbo, WA
www.magnificentmachine.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219694#219694
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: posting on matronics about corrosion |
Excellent report!
The only thing that I would like to seen would have been a SEM image of
a non-corroded section and surface. BTW Alclad layers are about 5% of
the total thickness.
Ken Lilja
bcchurch wrote:
>
> Here is a copy of the report I sent to Bill. Sorry about the large file size
- for some reason the PDF didn't reduce the file size all that much.
>
> Regards,
> Ben
>
> --------
> Ben Church
> CH801
> Racine, WI
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=217965#217965
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/naumuk_6061_t6_corrosion_problem_b_127.pdf
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Germany First to Lift Grounding order! |
On Tue, Dec 16, 2008 at 03:36:53PM -0500, Juan Vega wrote:
> NTSB report has come back on the crash in California crash as not
> structurally directed.
> Fingers are pointing to questionable construction (not following plans)
Uhm...Juan, where did you see or hear this? Since that crash was ofan AMD
Zodiac, which (like all of them) was built from a Zenair quick-build kit,
this is a rather remarkable statement.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC, PP-ASEL http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (KFRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC http://www.tronguy.net/N55ZC.shtml
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: posting on matronics about corrosion |
Thanks, Ken. Glad you liked it.
There were a few areas on the corroded surface where the base alloy was relatively
clean. Areas like that are generally rather feature-less and so taking a
picture of it with the SEM doesn't really show anything. You can see some fine
surface texture from rolling, dust, etc but that's about it. Similarly, in
the cross sectional views if there is no corrosion product layer then all you
can see is the edge of the alloy - again it's a rather plain sight.
Regards,
Ben
do not archive
--------
Ben Church
CH801
Racine, WI
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219717#219717
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Grinding off part of a bolt head in tight spot? |
It is not a good idea to grind off any part of the bolt head as it all
contributes to the tensile strength of the bolt and the joint. Use a washer under
the bolt head and file it away to clear the radius. A washer is only a load
spreader used this way. It does not contribute to the tensile strength of the
joint.
John Read
Phone: 303-648-3261
Fax: 303-648-3262
Cell: 719-494-4567
In a message dated 12/16/2008 3:10:33 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,
pwhoyt@yahoo.com writes:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "PatrickW" <pwhoyt@yahoo.com>
In order to meet edge distance on 6T2-3 (rear horizontal stabilizer attach
bracket), the bolt hole is close to the bend radius.
The hole itself is not in the radius, but the edge of the head of the bolt
would bear down on the curvature of the radius if tightened.
It does not appear to be possible to both have proper edge distance for the
hole AND for the bold head to not hit the radius.
Is it ok to grind off some of the bolt head so that it doesn't interfere
with the adjacent radius...? Does the head of a bolt contribute to the
strength of the bolt?
I looked for guidance in AC43, and in the Construction Standards, and I
searched this forum, but didn't find anything.
There's got to be a lot of fellow builders who've run into this exact same
thing. What did you do...?
Thanks,
- Pat
pwhoyt@yahoo.com
--------
Patrick
601XL/Corvair
N63PZ (reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=219674#219674
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