Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:38 AM - Re: Web cam up of 601xl build (Afterfxllc@aol.com)
2. 02:38 AM - Re: Web cam up of 601xl build (Afterfxllc@aol.com)
3. 06:51 AM - Re: Web cam up of 601xl build (Carlos Sa)
4. 07:00 AM - Merry Christmas (pavel569)
5. 07:05 AM - Re: Web cam up of 601xl build (Ronald Steele)
6. 07:14 AM - Re: Web cam up of 601xl build (Afterfxllc@aol.com)
7. 08:03 AM - Happy Holidays (Leo Gates)
8. 08:53 AM - Re: Zodiac CH601XL "Problems" (Clive Richards)
9. 09:40 AM - Re: Zodiac CH601XL "Problems" (steve)
10. 10:32 AM - Re: RiteAngle AOA (EMAproducts@aol.com)
11. 10:34 AM - Twas the night before Christmas (steveadams)
12. 11:46 AM - Re: Re: RiteAngle AOA (steve)
13. 01:46 PM - Re: Zodiac CH601XL "Problems" (jetboy)
14. 03:53 PM - Re: Re: RiteAngle AOA (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Web cam up of 601xl build |
They say I can't stream from a Mac so I'm not sure if it can be viewed from
one? I don't use a Mac so I'm not sure if Fire fox might work.
Jeff
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| Subject: | Re: Web cam up of 601xl build |
Also check _www.camstreams.com_ (http://www.camstreams.com) and see if they
have a work around.
Jeff
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| Subject: | Re: Web cam up of 601xl build |
I am using an iMac with OS X 10.5.5 and Firefox 3.0.5
I can see the workshop - it's always empty, but I don't think it is a
technology problem... ;-)
Merry Christmas
Carlos
do not archive
2008/12/24 John Reinking <reinkings@comcast.net>
>
> I am running on a Mac w/OSX10.4.11, using Safari v3.2.1. I've tried about
> four or five times to get 'into' your link (the second one)(the first one
> says it cannot connect to the server.
>
> PROBLEM: On my system clicking on the second link opens your AeroCam site
> but then goes into a closed loop and freezes up the browser. Was
> wondering if anyone else was experiencing anything like this.
>
> I'm hoping to find a fix for this 'cause I'd really like to see your
> progress and maybe ask a few questions as you go along.
>
> Merry Christmas to all you folks
>
> John R Reinking/Woodinville, WA (presently snowbound 3 days.)
>
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Let's leave the wing failure behind for a while and have a great holiday time.
My wings are done and I'll start on fuse this Xmas Holiday.
Once again, Merry Christmas to everyone, let's have a fun building and flying
our planes.
--------
Pavel
CA
Zodiac XL N581PM (Reserved)
Stratus Subaru EA-81
Tail, flaps, ailerons, wings done, fuselage is on the table ....
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=220919#220919
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| Subject: | Re: Web cam up of 601xl build |
I'm using a Mac with OSX 10-5-6 and the free version of Flip-for-Mac
to play windows media. This seems to working OK.
The first time I tried it, when it was first announced, it didn't
work, now it does. It does take a while to load over my DSL connection.
Ron
On Dec 24, 2008, at 5:35 AM, Afterfxllc@aol.com wrote:
> They say I can't stream from a Mac so I'm not sure if it can be
> viewed from one? I don't use a Mac so I'm not sure if Fire fox might
> work.
>
> Jeff
>
>
> One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and
> Yahoo Mail. Try it now.
>
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| Subject: | Re: Web cam up of 601xl build |
I was there from 11:00 till 8:00 this morning .... I get more work done at
night because everyone else is asleep and don't call me.
Jeff
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Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now.
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*HAPPY HOLIDAYS Y'ALL! FROM TEXAS 8-) *
--
Leo Gates
N601Z - CH601HDS TDO
Rotax 912UL
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| Subject: | Re: Zodiac CH601XL "Problems" |
Steve
What is the web address of this Zenith site in UK you
refer to I am in the UK & no of no such site there is a Zenair Europe
site http://www.zenairulm.com/Home/index.htm & lists outstanding
European ADs but refers back to US site for technical details. For the
601 HD our LAA have reduced the rear limit we can use.
Clive
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: steve
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 5:47 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Zodiac CH601XL "Problems"
All sounds reasonable to me..
As many of you know, I ve been wrestling with my Weight and Balance.
My rear CG is right at 450mm.
Yet I read from the UK ( its on the UK Zenith website) that the CG in
that country for the 601XL, is from 300 to 520mm.
Same configuration as I have, same kit, same engine.....
I ve forwarded the info to Zenith and they dont belive it. Said they
will get back to me...
One would think, Zenith knows..........
The reason I keep bringing this subject up is that I dont get it
either...
The 1600mm on the W&B is NOT in the "average" baggage area spot. My
"baggage is right smack at 1850mm....
If a pilot put the baggage at the rear of the compartment I m sure the
W&B will be waaaay out......
Any ideas??????
SW
----- Original Message -----
From: jaybannist@cs.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com ; zenith601-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 10:06 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Zodiac CH601XL "Problems"
Here is my take on the Zodiac CH 601XL =9Cproblem=9D:
Chris Heintz designed quite a number of airplanes; for factory
assembly, kit construction and plans building. There are thousands of
airplanes of his designs flying, including CH601XLs registered in the
USA as LSA, E-LSA, EAB and an extremely confusing array of registration
designations in other countries.
There is a lot of discussion about whether the CZAW kits and
airplanes are identical to the ones from the USA. There are those that
claim that they are identical...except blah, blah & blah. They simply
can=99t be identical if there are exceptions. I suspect (another
personal opinion) that there are differences that observers either will
not; or, more likely, can=99t recognize. For instance, can a
builder tell the difference between 6061-T6 aluminum and 6061-Txx?
Absolutely not. Can a builder tell the difference between the Avex
rivets that Zenith supplies and substandard imitators? No. Yet these
differences can be significant and can certainly effect the structural
integrity of the airframe. The same applies to the different angle of
incidence of the wing. Is the angle of the wing spar center section
changed or is the wing twisted to change the angle? (The latter is the
case) Analyzing the weight differences and plain old common sense
tells me that there are more differences yet. In short, all CH601XLs
are NOT identical, and cla iming so is simply engaging in fantasy.
European builders have given the argument that Chris
Heintz=99s name on all the drawings as evidence that Heintz is
totally responsible for their airplanes. However, they assert that the
drawings are the same as those in the USA....except for the added
drawings by CZAW. Drawings supplied by CZAW with Chris Heintz name on
all of them do NOT establish absolute responsibility for the finished
product. That would require certification that the kit materials or the
complete airplane strictly adheres to the requirements stated in those
drawings, either by CZAW or the kit builder. CZAW obviously
can=99t make that certification, and I don=99t know of any
builder that has the technical expertise nor the materials documentation
to make that certification. Therefore, the owner / builder has the final
responsibility for their airplane.
As I recall, CZAW was started by an American in the Czech Republic
as a program to assist builders to quickly assemble Zodiac kits. CZAW
then morphed into a company that manufactured complete Zodiac airplanes
and sold kits. It is unclear where the materials CZAW used actually
originated. The Zenair - CZAW relationship ended for a reason. I
don=99t know what that reason was, but I strongly suspect (my
opinion strictly) that it was because the CZAW organization did not
exercise adequate quality control, especially over the materials they
used and or supplied to kit builders.
So why are CH601XLs cr ashing? Is there a design flaw? The design
has been verified several times over, through analysis and through
testing. You can advance all sorts of convoluted arguments against this
but the design simply does not have a flaw that causes a wing to fold.
The XL design, as ALL aircraft designs, is based on clearly stated
operating limitations. Operating outside the design limitations of ANY
aircraft subjects that aircraft to structural failure; and many of them
have failed and crashed.
So are there problems with the way pilots are operating? We all know
the limitations, but some pilots forget about them, or fly into bad
climate situations, or have untenable equipment malfunctions, or simply
choose to ignore the limitations, because others have =9Cgotten
away with it=9D.
Are there problems with the materials used? I am personally
confident in the materials supplied by Zenith. I do not have the same
confidence in the materials supplied by CZAW.
Summation (Definitely my opinion): The Zodiac CH601XL
=9Cproblem=9D is not design. The =9CProblems=9D
are:
1) The way some pilots choose to fly the airplane, either on purpose
or accidentally,
2) Possible substandard materials and unsound design changes (from
CZAW) and,
3) Construction and maintenance errors on the part of
builders/owners.
These are highly personal opinions and not cold hard facts.
A Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to all !!!
J ay Bannister (alias Jay in Dallas)
Zodiac CH 601XL N2630J =9CLil Bruiser=9D
BTW, I have crashed in a Zodiac CH 601XLi (not mine). It had
nothing to do with the design and the wings did not fall off.
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Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Zodiac CH601XL "Problems" |
Clive
email me direct so I can get it from my docs and upload it to you.
Today I also receive an email from a Mr. Lewis ( I believe from France)
and he states that he has a letter from CH himself which approves the
520mm.
I ll upload that also. Its still not proof of why the USA version is
at 450mm, but I think its very interesting....
notsew_evets@frontiernet.net
----- Original Message -----
From: Clive Richards
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 9:52 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Zodiac CH601XL "Problems"
Steve
What is the web address of this Zenith site in UK you
refer to I am in the UK & no of no such site there is a Zenair Europe
site http://www.zenairulm.com/Home/index.htm & lists outstanding
European ADs but refers back to US site for technical details. For the
601 HD our LAA have reduced the rear limit we can use.
Clive
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: steve
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 5:47 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Zodiac CH601XL "Problems"
All sounds reasonable to me..
As many of you know, I ve been wrestling with my Weight and Balance.
My rear CG is right at 450mm.
Yet I read from the UK ( its on the UK Zenith website) that the CG
in that country for the 601XL, is from 300 to 520mm.
Same configuration as I have, same kit, same engine.....
I ve forwarded the info to Zenith and they dont belive it. Said
they will get back to me...
One would think, Zenith knows..........
The reason I keep bringing this subject up is that I dont get it
either...
The 1600mm on the W&B is NOT in the "average" baggage area spot. My
"baggage is right smack at 1850mm....
If a pilot put the baggage at the rear of the compartment I m sure
the W&B will be waaaay out......
Any ideas??????
SW
----- Original Message -----
From: jaybannist@cs.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com ; zenith601-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 10:06 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Zodiac CH601XL "Problems"
Here is my take on the Zodiac CH 601XL =9Cproblem=9D:
Chris Heintz designed quite a number of airplanes; for factory
assembly, kit construction and plans building. There are thousands of
airplanes of his designs flying, including CH601XLs registered in the
USA as LSA, E-LSA, EAB and an extremely confusing array of registration
designations in other countries.
There is a lot of discussion about whether the CZAW kits and
airplanes are identical to the ones from the USA. There are those that
claim that they are identical...except blah, blah & blah. They simply
can=99t be identical if there are exceptions. I suspect (another
personal opinion) that there are differences that observers either will
not; or, more likely, can=99t recognize. For instance, can a
builder tell the difference between 6061-T6 aluminum and 6061-Txx?
Absolutely not. Can a builder tell the difference between the Avex
rivets that Zenith supplies and substandard imitators? No. Yet these
differences can be significant and can certainly effect the structural
integrity of the airframe. The same applies to the different angle of
incidence of the wing. Is the angle of the wing spar center section
changed or is the wing twisted to change the angle? (The latter is the
case) Analyzing the weight differences and plain old common sense
tells me that there are more differences yet. In short, all CH601XLs
are NOT identical, and cla iming so is simply engaging in fantasy.
European builders have given the argument that Chris
Heintz=99s name on all the drawings as evidence that Heintz is
totally responsible for their airplanes. However, they assert that the
drawings are the same as those in the USA....except for the added
drawings by CZAW. Drawings supplied by CZAW with Chris Heintz name on
all of them do NOT establish absolute responsibility for the finished
product. That would require certification that the kit materials or the
complete airplane strictly adheres to the requirements stated in those
drawings, either by CZAW or the kit builder. CZAW obviously
can=99t make that certification, and I don=99t know of any
builder that has the technical expertise nor the materials documentation
to make that certification. Therefore, the owner / builder has the final
responsibility for their airplane.
As I recall, CZAW was started by an American in the Czech Republic
as a program to assist builders to quickly assemble Zodiac kits. CZAW
then morphed into a company that manufactured complete Zodiac airplanes
and sold kits. It is unclear where the materials CZAW used actually
originated. The Zenair - CZAW relationship ended for a reason. I
don=99t know what that reason was, but I strongly suspect (my
opinion strictly) that it was because the CZAW organization did not
exercise adequate quality control, especially over the materials they
used and or supplied to kit builders.
So why are CH601XLs cr ashing? Is there a design flaw? The design
has been verified several times over, through analysis and through
testing. You can advance all sorts of convoluted arguments against this
but the design simply does not have a flaw that causes a wing to fold.
The XL design, as ALL aircraft designs, is based on clearly stated
operating limitations. Operating outside the design limitations of ANY
aircraft subjects that aircraft to structural failure; and many of them
have failed and crashed.
So are there problems with the way pilots are operating? We all
know the limitations, but some pilots forget about them, or fly into bad
climate situations, or have untenable equipment malfunctions, or simply
choose to ignore the limitations, because others have =9Cgotten
away with it=9D.
Are there problems with the materials used? I am personally
confident in the materials supplied by Zenith. I do not have the same
confidence in the materials supplied by CZAW.
Summation (Definitely my opinion): The Zodiac CH601XL
=9Cproblem=9D is not design. The =9CProblems=9D
are:
1) The way some pilots choose to fly the airplane, either on
purpose or accidentally,
2) Possible substandard materials and unsound design changes (from
CZAW) and,
3) Construction and maintenance errors on the part of
builders/owners.
These are highly personal opinions and not cold hard facts.
A Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to all !!!
J ay Bannister (alias Jay in Dallas)
Zodiac CH 601XL N2630J =9CLil Bruiser=9D
BTW, I have crashed in a Zodiac CH 601XLi (not mine). It had
nothing to do with the design and the wings did not fall off.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
Email message sent from CompuServe - visit us today at
http://www.cs.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List">http://www.matron
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
Message 10
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| Subject: | RE: RiteAngle AOA |
If Anyone has problems with a RiteAngle AOA, they should contact me, The
systems will work if installed correctly. Customer Service is what I pride
having in my business. I've been making and selling AOA systems since 1995. I'm
sorry Bryan doesn't feel it is needed, No one plans on an accident. The
systems are working on I believe all models except the latest mods of Zenith
aircraft.
Fly the Safe Angle with the RiteAngle
Elbie Mendenhall
EM Aviation, LLC 360-260-0772
_www.riteangle_ (http://www.riteangle.com) .com
or _riteangle3@aol.com_ (mailto:riteangle3@aol.com)
**************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail,
Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now.
Message 11
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| Subject: | Twas the night before Christmas |
This was from my daughters Christmas card a few years ago.......
Twas the night before Christmas and all through the shop,
not a creature was stirring, not even my Pop
All the tools were hung on the wall with care,
In hopes that the new parts would soon be there
my daddy lay snoring upstairs in his bed
while visions of airplanes danced in his head
Out in the yard there arose such a clatter
I ran down the stairs to see what was the matter
Out in the driveway at the back of the van
Was my mother and brother, a big box in their hands
The bottom had opened and layed out in the grass
were pieces of metal and plastic and glass
It didn't look like an airplane, it looked like nothing at all
but daddy had promised it would fly come next fall
Then next christmas we'd hear as he flew into the night
Merry Christmas to all, and to all a good flight!
Merry Christmas
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=220953#220953
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: RE: RiteAngle AOA |
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year Elbie..
Steve W
CFI, Las Vegas class 2006
Zenith 601 XL
N 9554 Z
"Almost flying"
----- Original Message -----
From: EMAproducts@aol.com
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 11:30 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: RE: RiteAngle AOA
If Anyone has problems with a RiteAngle AOA, they should contact me,
The systems will work if installed correctly. Customer Service is what
I pride having in my business. I've been making and selling AOA systems
since 1995. I'm sorry Bryan doesn't feel it is needed, No one plans on
an accident. The systems are working on I believe all models except the
latest mods of Zenith aircraft.
Fly the Safe Angle with the RiteAngle
Elbie Mendenhall
EM Aviation, LLC 360-260-0772
www.riteangle.com or riteangle3@aol.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL
Mad=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025">Try it now.
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Zodiac CH601XL "Problems" |
Hi all, getting the correct figures for the various configurations is a difficult
proposition.
I have a CZAW 701 airframe and as far as I can tell its made from all the usual
USA 49% kit parts, Matco wheels etc. Wherever alterations are made there is an
extra page in the plans detailing the CZAW mod and reason (usually to comply
with the BCAR-S design rules used in Europe) and some of these mods have been
incorporated in subsequent ZAC plans revisions, for example the seatbelt attach
points.
There is however, very little guidance as to any new loading / flight airspeeds
that must arise from some changes. When the CH701 flap travel was reduced to
16 deg. there is no change to the USA vfe 52 Kts however CZAW have it at 55 Kts
which seems more realistic. I wrote to ZAC and dealers about this and got nil
response. Maybe I missed something because I dont get "Zenair news" but it seems
a little odd that there is no updated design information available from source.
This is similar to the situation that exists when owners are upgrading
their CH600 series to the new weights. They get a note saying its OK to operate
with reduced G loading ( in effect cutting out the factor of safety margins
) however there is no guidance or requirement to re-placard the airspeed and
operating limitations. In New Zealand they are just waking up to this sort of
thing with topdressing aircraft that have been breaking up in part due to the
31% overload rules that were applied some years back.
http://www.caa.govt.nz/GA/Ag_Aviation/Ag_Aircraft_Safety_Review.htm
take care out there
ralph
--------
Ralph - CH701 / 2200a
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=220986#220986
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: RE: RiteAngle AOA |
Elbie, I don't have one of your AOA systems. I assembled my own for my XL.
The fellow saying he does not need an AOA is probably a much better pilot than
I
am or most of us, because I will not own a plane without one or the whole
U.S. Navy. We have fire extinguishers, five point harnesses, little hammers to
bust a canopy, ELTs to signal where we crashed, first aid kits and survival
gear, but the best, cheapest safety gear to help you take off, fly and land he
don't need. Oh well, some folks you just can't help. Best regards, Bill of
Georgia
**************
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