---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 03/04/09: 10 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 09:51 AM - recent crash (roger lambert) 2. 10:37 AM - Re: recent crash (jaybannist@cs.com) 3. 10:51 AM - Re: Re: Corv-oil Filler Tube () 4. 10:54 AM - Re: recent crash (mcjon77) 5. 11:08 AM - Re: Re: recent crash (jaybannist@cs.com) 6. 03:12 PM - Re: Y Stick Decision (Bill Naumuk) 7. 04:36 PM - Re: Y Stick Decision (Carlos Sa) 8. 05:57 PM - Re: recent crash (Juan Vega) 9. 06:05 PM - Re: Re: TV news reports 601XL down in Utah (MaxNr@aol.com) 10. 08:40 PM - Re: Y Stick Decision (Gig Giacona) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 09:51:41 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: recent crash From: roger lambert The photos may be low quality, but they do show both ailerons and flaps still attached to the airplane. Has anyone checked to see if the pilot was licensed? ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:37:51 AM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: recent crash From: jaybannist@cs.com I checked the FAA registry.? Kirk Babbit is not listed as being licensed. Jay Bannister Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: roger lambert Sent: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 11:50 am Subject: Zenith-List: recent crash The photos may be low quality, but they do show both ailerons and flaps still attached to the airplane. Has anyone checked to see if the pilot was licensed? ________________________________________________________________________ Email message sent from CompuServe - visit us today at http://www.cs.com ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 10:51:16 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Corv-oil Filler Tube Dan, thanks for the info. If I run into WW at Oshkosh I'll ask him, but it now seems that the puck really isn't needed. Your setup. admittedly unflown, but sure to hold up, seems perfectly straightforward. The starter torque is still going through the prop bolts, which, if they couldn't handle the starter, certainly couldn't handle the prop. And, since nobody seems to be losing props, I'd call it good and move on. My plane won't be beautiful, my rivets won't be laser-true, and I'm not into making parts over and over again because of some cosmetic or perceived flaw. I'm not one of those to whom perfect is the enemy of good. I'll be saving your info in my engine file for later use. As an aside, a friend suggested I name the bird "poor thing". He quoted from Shakespeare, "A poor thing, Sir, but mine own." Thanks. Paul ----- Original Message ----- From: leinad To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 9:28 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Corv-oil Filler Tube > Paul, I've purchased William Wynne's conversion manual from back in 2004. I found the same problem. Certain key pieces of information were missing, like a drawing of the puck, and some of the dimensions. WW was at first very friendly and sounding as if he wanted to help. But when I started asking questions like the ones you asked the communications stopped. He may have just gotten very busy, but I was left feeling like he didn't want to provide all the information needed to do the conversion (which is what I thought I'd purchased). I wound up designing my own prop hub, and decided to mount the alternator on the rear of the engine where the harmonic balancer pulley is located. This made sense to me. The pulley was meant to drive an alternator. It saves weight and moves the weight back a good distance. The draw back is that it'll require opening the "hood" to do a preflight to check the belt tension, but that seamed like a good trade off. For the ring gear the engine fl! ange has a pilot that sticks out and my prop hub has a counter bore on the engine end that fits on that pilot snuggly. The ring gear has been bored to that same pilot diameter and the bolt pattern drilled around it for the same bolt circle as the prop. The pilot on the flange is long enough to go through the gear material (I think it was about .090) and well into the counter bore on the prop hub. The bolts that hold the prop hub on also hold the gear on. The gear being clamped in between the hub and the flange. I am also using a safety shaft. I checked the material the gear is made of for flatness and it was VERY flat. It runs perfectly true when the engine is running. The only possible problem I can see in this design (which has NOT been flight tested) is that the starter delivers its torque through this joint. I don't think most of the corvair builders need ALL the information. They'll purchase his parts and be able to do the conversion, and that may be the best! path. Dan > ="paulrod36(at)msn.com"] Daniel. your site is great! Answered several of my questions. I do have one, however, that I asked WW, and never got a reply. What's with the flywheel? According to the book, it's an 85 or 86 Taurus, looks like it should have come from an automatic transmission, but there isn't anything in the manual addressing what needs to be done with it. I assume you have to re-drill for the bolt battern on the flange, right? Also, he talks about a puck. but doesn't give enough information on it. Like, why, and what it looks like, and where it goes. It's not even on his parts list, as far as I could tell. How did you do your front end between engine and prop hub? > > Paul R > --- -------- Scratch building XL with Corvair Engine Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=232163#232163 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 10:54:12 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: recent crash From: "mcjon77" Jay, you misspelled his name. It is Kirk Babbitt, with 2 t's. He is rated as a commercial pilot with ASEL, AMEL, and Instrument ratings. -------- Jon McDonald Building Sonex #1287 Thinking ahead about a Zenith CH 701 :D Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=233186#233186 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 11:08:10 AM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: recent crash From: jaybannist@cs.com Sorry.? I got the spelling from one of the news articles and took it as fact. My bad.? So much for "news" reporting, huh? Jay Bannister Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: mcjon77 Sent: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 12:53 pm Subject: Zenith-List: Re: recent crash Jay, you misspelled his name. It is Kirk Babbitt, with 2 t's. He is rated as a commercial pilot with ASEL, AMEL, and Instrument ratings. -------- Jon McDonald Building Sonex #1287 Thinking ahead about a Zenith CH 701 :D Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=233186#233186 ________________________________________________________________________ Email message sent from CompuServe - visit us today at http://www.cs.com ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 03:12:05 PM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Y Stick Decision Carlos- Michel T? If so, I ran into him at the Brampford fly-in. Nice guy. Made a point of introducing himself. Things are coming together. Pictures of my "Porker panel" attached. Even with a Dynon the bloody thing weighs 40+ lbs. the entire setup doesn't look like this because I put Naugahyde on the console and umpteen more gauges in the console upright. Keep on keeping on... Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: Carlos Sa To: zenith-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, March 03, 2009 7:22 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Y Stick Decision Bill, you might want to consider a "convertible" setup: http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601/chcontrols2.htm Cheers Carlos 2009/3/3 Bill Naumuk All- Thanks for your input. I think I'm going to go with the cut down stick. Larry, I decided on the Y stick rather than the dual stick option long ago based on your access information. But, if everyone's holding below the Y anyway and you don't have the ears protruding, so much the better. On top of everything else, it's not like you're limiting controllability on either side. In addition, I don't need the space for my GPS- it's in the porker of a panel I finally got ready to wire. I have no illusions- my project is going to make the scales groan. As long as I can outrun a C150... do not archive Bill Naumuk Townville, Pa. HDS 601MG/Corvair 95% ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 04:36:07 PM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Y Stick Decision From: Carlos Sa Yep, Michel T himself. I intend to use the same approach. The grip itself will probably be a game joystick - can you think of something that takes more punishment than that? Some examples: http://www.saitek.com/uk/prod/joysticks.htm http://www.allproducts.com/ee/sanmos/joystick-l.jpg http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/gaming/pc_gaming/joysticks/&cl=ca,en Thanks for the pictures - your project is starting to look like something that could fly... :-) I can't wait to start wok on the fuselage - but I still have to solve my space problem: I can't rivet the fuselage in my workshop (in the basement), or it won't come out. Regards Carlos 2009/3/4 Bill Naumuk > Carlos- > Michel T? If so, I ran into him at the Brampford fly-in. Nice guy. Made > a point of introducing himself. > Things are coming together. Pictures of my "Porker panel" attached. > Even with a Dynon the bloody thing weighs 40+ lbs. the entire setup doesn't > look like this because I put Naugahyde on the console and umpteen more > gauges in the console upright. > Keep on keeping on... > > Bill > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:57:32 PM PST US From: Juan Vega Subject: Re: Zenith-List: recent crash at and what crash? i am missing a stream -----Original Message----- >From: roger lambert >Sent: Mar 4, 2009 12:50 PM >To: "zenith-list@matronics.com" >Subject: Zenith-List: recent crash > >The photos may be low quality, but they do show both ailerons and flaps >still attached to the airplane. >Has anyone checked to see if the pilot was licensed? ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:05:58 PM PST US From: MaxNr@aol.com Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Re: TV news reports 601XL down in Utah It breaks my heart to see that another of ours is lost. I can believe the theory that he was avoiding the SLC Class B by deviating to the North. Its only 25 NM direct from TVY to BTF. A 15 mile deviation to the North seems reasonable. He certainly was in radar contact and the details, including the SLC WX will come out soon. This discussion of the 601XL limitations always seems to come up. The flaps "appear" to be extended. Really? It had just hit the ground! Do you think? And just how do we know that he was exceeding an air speed limit? And just why is it thought that he slammed the flight controls to the stops while at cruising speed? Has anybody actually ever seen any one do this? I have seen it only once 45 years ago when a friend did it in the landing flare in my Champ. Most planes are designed to withstand the 50 foot per second wind gust at Va. That translates to 3,000 ft per minute. This is weather that you only see in squall lines or high winds in mountains. lets get off that full control deflection stuff at cruising speed and recognize that weather breaks more airframes. If the 601XL is so touchy in pitch, lets fix it. How about new control geometry or an antiservo tab? Why do we live with it? Or maybe its just weather. Sorry about the rant. Lets stop blaming the pilot until the facts are in. I so wanted to stay out of this. Bob Dingley 601XL plans building Do Not Archive ************** A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! %2Fdefault.aspx%3Fsc%3D668072%26hmpgID%3D62%26bcd%3DfebemailfooterNO62) ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:40:34 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Y Stick Decision From: "Gig Giacona" I had a both a Saitek and Logitec joystick come apart on me when used as a game joystick. I'd never put one in a plane. -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=233294#233294 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.