Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:51 AM - Re: Jabiru starter SOLENOID) (Juan Vega)
2. 06:54 AM - Gascolator Wierdness ?? (Jeff)
3. 09:15 AM - Re: Gascolator Wierdness ?? (Clive Richards)
4. 10:15 AM - wing bolts (roger lambert)
5. 01:37 PM - Re: Gascolator Wierdness ?? (Juan Vega)
6. 07:41 PM - Zenith Zip 2009 (Alain Ouellet)
7. 11:41 PM - Re: Jabiru starter SOLENOID) (Craig Payne)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Jabiru starter SOLENOID) |
Craig and Gang
How does one know when the solenoid is going bad and it is time to replace it?
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: Craig Payne <craig@craigandjean.com>
>Sent: Jun 4, 2009 7:54 PM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Jabiru starter
>
>The Jabiru starter whats-it is a separate relay. It is supposed to be in the crate
with the engine (at least mine was). This document contains a picture:
>
>
>
> <http://www.usjabiru.com/images/pdf/StarterSolenoidRegulator.PDF> http://www.usjabiru.com/images/pdf/StarterSolenoidRegulator.PDF
>
>
>
>What is the name of the diagram in appendix Z that you are looking at? You cant
go by the diagram number as those change from edition to addition.
>
>
>
>Im looking at figure Z-20 in revision 12: Small Jabiru System. The part labeled
Starter contactor is the external relay that is only good for intermittent
use. The small circle labeled SOL. on top of the larger starter circle is the
electromagnet that mechanically engages the gears. It is integral to the starter
>
>
>
>In some automotive starter motors the electromagnet on the starter performs both
functions: moving contacts to switch the heavy cranking current and mechanically
moving the fork to engage the gears. There will have two terminals: a big
stud for the heavy lead from the battery and a smaller stud for the lead from
the ignition key. The Jabiru starter is not like this, it has a single heavy
lead. So you need an external relay. You can call it a contactor or a solenoid
but it is still external. Here is a doc with a picture of the Jabiru starter:
>
>
>
> <http://www.jabiru.net.au/Service%20Bulletins/Engine%20files/Starter%20Motor%20earth%20Cable_JSL005-1.pdf> http://www.jabiru.net.au/Service%20Bulletins/Engine%20files/Starter%20Motor%20earth%20Cable_JSL005-1.pdf
>
>
>
>I dont know what the starter on your Corvair looks like but Williams current documentation
shows a heavy stud and a flat push=on connector. So the electrical
switching of the heavy lead is integral to the starter and no external relay
is needed. See here:
>
>
>
> <http://www.flycorvair.com/starterkit.html> http://www.flycorvair.com/starterkit.html
>
>
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>
>
>-- Craig
>
>
>
>From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jaybannist@cs.com
>Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 5:28 PM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Jabiru starter
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Craig,
>
>On the wiring schematic, I only see a starter solenoid and no starter contactor.
Is the starter solenoid on the starter or is it a totally separate piece of
equipment. ?
>
>The sample diagrams I am looking at are in the Aeroelectric Connection manual.
>
>Jay
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Craig Payne <craig@craigandjean.com>
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>
>
>The Jabiru engine installation manual doesnt require this. In fact their sample
wiring diagram doesnt even show a master contactor that I can see. See page
15 of this manual:
>
>
>
> <http://www.usjabiru.com/images/pdf/manuals/new%20stuff/3300%20Install.pdf> http://www.usjabiru.com/images/pdf/manuals/new%20stuff/3300%20Install.pdf
>
>
>
>The diagrams you are looking at may be showing the large electromagnet on the
starter that moves the fork to engage the small drive gear with the ring gear.
That is a solenoid too.
>
>
>
>Do you have a link to what you are looking at?
>
>
>
>-- Craig
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
>Email message sent from CompuServe - visit us today at <http://www.cs.com> http://www.cs.com
>
>
>
>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List
>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Gascolator Wierdness ?? |
Hi John,
I have a similar problem, but the fuel was turning greenish. At first
I thought the FBO might have simply pumped the wrong avgas, but the airport
only handles 100LL and Jet A. It ain't Jet A. The plane hasn't been off
the airport yet so I didn't get the wrong gas anywhere else. Beautiful blue
comes out of both wing tanks, but it is green coming out of the gascolator.
I have check valves, facet pumps, aluminum fuel lines, 30R7 rubber fuel
lines, the Andair selector, and a Dynon fuel flow sensor in between the
tanks and the gascolator. Both sides are the same with LE tanks in each
wing. Something in there is turning the avgas color from blue to green.
I'm still taxi testing and haven't resolved this either. The gascolator is
an ACS part. I'll pull my gascolator apart and take a look. It seems to
take some time to turn the fuel color. If I sump the gascolator right after
running the engine, the fuel is blue.
Jeff Davidson
CH 601-HD w/3300A
Hi All,
I'm using the gascolator that came with my quickbuild on my 601XL. It looks
like an Aircraft Spruce part.
The last two times I've sumped fuel from the gascolator the 100LL has been
yellow in color, looks like a urine sample almost. The tanks sump fine ie
100LL blue and once I clear out the yellow fluid the engine runs fine. I've
only run 100LL and no mogas.
In talking with my A&P/Tech Counselor we've come to the conclusion that the
color must be coming from the gascolator finish. I've removed the bowl and
it does appear the finish (alodine) is dissolving ?
Has anyone else seen this ? My A&P hasnt ever seen this before and he's a
pretty experienced guy.
Thanks,
John Davis
N601JD @ 7A8
601XL - Jab 3300
Burnsville, NC
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Gascolator Wierdness ?? |
Ditto
Seem to recall we had a few samples of AVGAS turning to green
unexplained during initial testing.
Clive
G CBDG 300 Hrs
Do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Jeff
To: zenith-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, June 06, 2009 2:53 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Gascolator Wierdness ??
Hi John,
I have a similar problem, but the fuel was turning greenish. At
first I thought the FBO might have simply pumped the wrong avgas, but
the airport only handles 100LL and Jet A. It ain't Jet A. The plane
hasn't been off the airport yet so I didn't get the wrong gas anywhere
else. Beautiful blue comes out of both wing tanks, but it is green
coming out of the gascolator. I have check valves, facet pumps,
aluminum fuel lines, 30R7 rubber fuel lines, the Andair selector, and a
Dynon fuel flow sensor in between the tanks and the gascolator. Both
sides are the same with LE tanks in each wing. Something in there is
turning the avgas color from blue to green. I'm still taxi testing and
haven't resolved this either. The gascolator is an ACS part. I'll pull
my gascolator apart and take a look. It seems to take some time to turn
the fuel color. If I sump the gascolator right after running the
engine, the fuel is blue.
Jeff Davidson
CH 601-HD w/3300A
Hi All,
I'm using the gascolator that came with my quickbuild on my 601XL. It
looks like an Aircraft Spruce part.
The last two times I've sumped fuel from the gascolator the 100LL has
been yellow in color, looks like a urine sample almost. The tanks sump
fine ie 100LL blue and once I clear out the yellow fluid the engine runs
fine. I've only run 100LL and no mogas.
In talking with my A&P/Tech Counselor we've come to the conclusion
that the color must be coming from the gascolator finish. I've removed
the bowl and it does appear the finish (alodine) is dissolving ?
Has anyone else seen this ? My A&P hasnt ever seen this before and
he's a pretty experienced guy.
Thanks,
John Davis
N601JD @ 7A8
601XL - Jab 3300
Burnsville, NC
Message 4
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|
Torques specifications and methods are contained in Construction Standards
for Zenair Light Airplanes, 2007 edition as well as AC 43.13-1B. If the
holes are drilled correctly, these are close tolerance bolts and should be
handled accordingly.
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Gascolator Wierdness ?? |
it nay not be the gascolator. If your lines are black Goodyear lines, there may
be some ware of the fuel lines and it collects in the gascolator.
-----Original Message-----
>From: Jeff <jeffrey_davidson@earthlink.net>
>Sent: Jun 6, 2009 9:53 AM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Zenith-List: Gascolator Wierdness ??
>
>Hi John,
>
> I have a similar problem, but the fuel was turning greenish. At first
>I thought the FBO might have simply pumped the wrong avgas, but the airport
>only handles 100LL and Jet A. It ain't Jet A. The plane hasn't been off
>the airport yet so I didn't get the wrong gas anywhere else. Beautiful blue
>comes out of both wing tanks, but it is green coming out of the gascolator.
>I have check valves, facet pumps, aluminum fuel lines, 30R7 rubber fuel
>lines, the Andair selector, and a Dynon fuel flow sensor in between the
>tanks and the gascolator. Both sides are the same with LE tanks in each
>wing. Something in there is turning the avgas color from blue to green.
>I'm still taxi testing and haven't resolved this either. The gascolator is
>an ACS part. I'll pull my gascolator apart and take a look. It seems to
>take some time to turn the fuel color. If I sump the gascolator right after
>running the engine, the fuel is blue.
>
> Jeff Davidson
>
> CH 601-HD w/3300A
>
>
>
>Hi All,
>
>
>
>I'm using the gascolator that came with my quickbuild on my 601XL. It looks
>like an Aircraft Spruce part.
>
>
>
>The last two times I've sumped fuel from the gascolator the 100LL has been
>yellow in color, looks like a urine sample almost. The tanks sump fine ie
>100LL blue and once I clear out the yellow fluid the engine runs fine. I've
>only run 100LL and no mogas.
>
>
>
>In talking with my A&P/Tech Counselor we've come to the conclusion that the
>color must be coming from the gascolator finish. I've removed the bowl and
>it does appear the finish (alodine) is dissolving ?
>
>
>
>Has anyone else seen this ? My A&P hasnt ever seen this before and he's a
>pretty experienced guy.
>
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>John Davis
>
>N601JD @ 7A8
>
>601XL - Jab 3300
>
>Burnsville, NC
>
Message 6
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Its coming up next week-end in Brampton, Ontario.
Lots of other pilots, builders, etc....
Good time to meet other aviation enthusiasts.
Saturday and Sunday
Alain
Message 7
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| Subject: | Jabiru starter SOLENOID) |
It should last as long as the one in your car - forever. If it fails it fails all
at once with the contacts welded together.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Juan Vega
Sent: Saturday, June 06, 2009 5:48 AM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Jabiru starter SOLENOID)
Craig and Gang
How does one know when the solenoid is going bad and it is time to replace it?
Juan
-----Original Message-----
>From: Craig Payne <craig@craigandjean.com>
>Sent: Jun 4, 2009 7:54 PM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Jabiru starter
>
>The Jabiru starter whats-it is a separate relay. It is supposed to be in the crate
with the engine (at least mine was). This document contains a picture:
>
>
>
> <http://www.usjabiru.com/images/pdf/StarterSolenoidRegulator.PDF> http://www.usjabiru.com/images/pdf/StarterSolenoidRegulator.PDF
>
>
>
>What is the name of the diagram in appendix Z that you are looking at? You cant
go by the diagram number as those change from edition to addition.
>
>
>
>Im looking at figure Z-20 in revision 12: Small Jabiru System. The part labeled
Starter contactor is the external relay that is only good for intermittent
use. The small circle labeled SOL. on top of the larger starter circle is the
electromagnet that mechanically engages the gears. It is integral to the starter
>
>
>
>In some automotive starter motors the electromagnet on the starter performs both
functions: moving contacts to switch the heavy cranking current and mechanically
moving the fork to engage the gears. There will have two terminals: a big
stud for the heavy lead from the battery and a smaller stud for the lead from
the ignition key. The Jabiru starter is not like this, it has a single heavy
lead. So you need an external relay. You can call it a contactor or a solenoid
but it is still external. Here is a doc with a picture of the Jabiru starter:
>
>
>
> <http://www.jabiru.net.au/Service%20Bulletins/Engine%20files/Starter%20Motor%20earth%20Cable_JSL005-1.pdf> http://www.jabiru.net.au/Service%20Bulletins/Engine%20files/Starter%20Motor%20earth%20Cable_JSL005-1.pdf
>
>
>
>I dont know what the starter on your Corvair looks like but Williams current documentation
shows a heavy stud and a flat push=on connector. So the electrical
switching of the heavy lead is integral to the starter and no external relay
is needed. See here:
>
>
>
> <http://www.flycorvair.com/starterkit.html> http://www.flycorvair.com/starterkit.html
>
>
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>
>
>-- Craig
>
>
>
>From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jaybannist@cs.com
>Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 5:28 PM
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Jabiru starter
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Craig,
>
>On the wiring schematic, I only see a starter solenoid and no starter contactor.
Is the starter solenoid on the starter or is it a totally separate piece of
equipment. ?
>
>The sample diagrams I am looking at are in the Aeroelectric Connection manual.
>
>Jay
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Craig Payne <craig@craigandjean.com>
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>
>
>The Jabiru engine installation manual doesnt require this. In fact their sample
wiring diagram doesnt even show a master contactor that I can see. See page
15 of this manual:
>
>
>
> <http://www.usjabiru.com/images/pdf/manuals/new%20stuff/3300%20Install.pdf> http://www.usjabiru.com/images/pdf/manuals/new%20stuff/3300%20Install.pdf
>
>
>
>The diagrams you are looking at may be showing the large electromagnet on the
starter that moves the fork to engage the small drive gear with the ring gear.
That is a solenoid too.
>
>
>
>Do you have a link to what you are looking at?
>
>
>
>-- Craig
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
>Email message sent from CompuServe - visit us today at <http://www.cs.com> http://www.cs.com
>
>
>
>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List
>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
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