---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 06/22/09: 34 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:40 AM - Re: ZBAG, a respectful question: a modest answer (steveadams) 2. 06:13 AM - Finally fixed my static problem (John Davis) 3. 06:35 AM - Chat Reminder (George Race) 4. 06:51 AM - Re: Finally fixed my static problem (T. Graziano) 5. 07:09 AM - Re: Fantastic Flying on Father's Day (Bill Pagan) 6. 07:11 AM - Re: Finally fixed my static problem (John Davis) 7. 07:35 AM - Re: Re: Must Sell My 75% Done 601XL (victor verdev) 8. 09:17 AM - Re: Re: Instrument panel (Craig Payne) 9. 10:02 AM - Re: Instrument panel (annken100) 10. 10:22 AM - Re: Re: Instrument panel (Craig Payne) 11. 10:28 AM - Re: Re: Instrument panel (John Davis) 12. 11:13 AM - Re: Re: Instrument panel (Craig Payne) 13. 11:14 AM - Re: POH -pilot operating handbook (Gig Giacona) 14. 11:19 AM - Re: Re: Instrument panel (John Davis) 15. 11:26 AM - Re: Re: Instrument panel (Craig Payne) 16. 11:32 AM - Re: Re: POH -pilot operating handbook (Craig Payne) 17. 11:41 AM - Re: Re: Instrument panel (John Davis) 18. 11:57 AM - Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair (Fly with Gus) 19. 12:08 PM - Re: Re: POH -pilot operating handbook (jaybannist@cs.com) 20. 12:39 PM - Re: Instrument panel (annken100) 21. 01:13 PM - Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair (Juan Vega) 22. 01:24 PM - Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair (Phil Maxson) 23. 01:40 PM - Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair (cookwithgas) 24. 02:34 PM - Re: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair (Davcoberly@wmconnect.com) 25. 05:04 PM - Re: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair (Rick Lindstrom) 26. 05:43 PM - DFW Builders get together (jaybannist@cs.com) 27. 05:56 PM - Re: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair (Davcoberly@wmconnect.com) 28. 06:19 PM - Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair (Gig Giacona) 29. 06:20 PM - Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair (leinad) 30. 06:25 PM - Re: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair (Cory Emberson) 31. 06:55 PM - Re: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair (Larry Winger) 32. 08:19 PM - Re: DFW Builders get together (MHerder) 33. 10:14 PM - Re: What did you do today? (Sabrina) 34. 11:08 PM - Re: Re: What did you do today? (J.T. Machin) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:40:45 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: ZBAG, a respectful question: a modest answer From: "steveadams" Gig Giacona wrote: > I can't think of a simple or cost effective way to modify the design that would address this issue. I have no doubt that someone could design a complex system of weights and/or pulleys that would do it but complex isn't why I decided to build a 601XL and I'm not that hot for a complex change for a problem that shouldn't even show itself except at the edges of the flight envelope and can be trained around. > > As far as changing the length of the upper and lower elevator horns you then get into the issue that there isn't enough room in the cockpit for the stick to move all the way. > > > > d.goddard(at)ns.sympatico wrote: > > No the stops do not affect the forces, they stop a pilot from inadvertantly > > applying too much elevator as a consequence of the decreasing force. That's > > certainly one way to go, and by far the easiest and least expensive. Do you > > have an objection to an optional change that addresses the issue in a > > different way? I have no idea what it would cost as the option doesn't > > exist, I'm not sure we could simply assume it would be expensive or > > complicated, we could likely assume it would not be required as a retrofit. > > > > --- > An antiservo trim tab would provide progressively increasing forces with increasing elevator deflection. While not all that simple, the design is in use in many certified aircraft as well as the CH640. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249488#249488 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:13:26 AM PST US From: John Davis Subject: Zenith-List: Finally fixed my static problem Hi All, Just wanted to post this to help others in the future. I've had a problem with static in my radio at high RPMS that I've been trying to fix since my first flight. It was driving me nuts!!! I've got a Jabiru 3300 and an ICOM A-200 radio. At RPMS over 2400 or so I would get terrible static in the radio. I installed a power filter on the radio, installed resistor plugs, checked all my RG-400 to the antenna and still had the problem. Turns out it it was the ground strap running from my engine to the battery, it was routed close to one of the coils on the engine and it was picking up interference at high RPMS. I rerouted the ground strap this weekend and the noise is finally gone. Hopefully this may help someone else to preserve their sanity and hair :-) John Davis N601JD - 601XL & Jab 3300 Burnsville, NC ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:35:25 AM PST US From: "George Race" Subject: Zenith-List: Chat Reminder Live Chat Room every Monday evening around 8:00 EDT www.mykitairplane.com Click on the Chat Room link on the page. George Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:51:08 AM PST US From: "T. Graziano" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Finally fixed my static problem John, Good info. I do not really have a static problem, but I can hear slight rpm "buzz" with my ICOM A-200 under certain conditions. Just curious, about how close the ground wire was to the coil and how far away is it now? Thanks, Tony Graziano 601XL/Jab3300; N493TG; 503 hrs ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Davis" Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 8:08 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Finally fixed my static problem > > Hi All, > Just wanted to post this to help others in the future. I've had a problem > with static in my radio at high RPMS that I've been trying to fix since my > first flight. It was driving me nuts!!! > > I've got a Jabiru 3300 and an ICOM A-200 radio. At RPMS over 2400 or so I > would get terrible static in the radio. I installed a power filter on the > radio, installed resistor plugs, checked all my RG-400 to the antenna and > still had the problem. Turns out it it was the ground strap running from > my engine to the battery, it was routed close to one of the coils on the > engine and it was picking up interference at high RPMS. I rerouted the > ground strap this weekend and the noise is finally gone. > > Hopefully this may help someone else to preserve their sanity and hair :-) > > John Davis > N601JD - 601XL & Jab 3300 > Burnsville, NC > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:09:06 AM PST US From: Bill Pagan Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Fantastic Flying on Father's Day Great post Scott!!- Keep sending me/us the inspiration to keep working. - 90 degrees plus in my shop today with heat index at over 100-but I'm spending the day there now.- - Bill Pagan EAA Tech Counselor #4395 601XL QBK/Corvair/N565BW (RES) --- On Sun, 6/21/09, cookwithgas wrote: From: cookwithgas Subject: Zenith-List: Fantastic Flying on Father's Day I had just about the best father's day ever today.- Last week I was out o f town and my wife sent my kids off to Baton Rouge, Louisiana to spend a fe w weeks with my sister and her husband and their kids.- They have lots of animals and a few dogs and when I returned from out of town, I found out t hey even took our dog so it was just me and my wonderful wife at home.- S he asked me "Why don't we fly somewhere?"- We talked about different places to go and settled on Baton Rouge for Fathe r's Day.- My sister lives about 10 minutes from KBTR but I would have to fly into a Class C airport and land.- Being a new Sport Pilot, that seeme d a little daunting since it has been a while since I received my Class C e ndorsement. On the way from DFW I stopped by my hangar and gassed up the airplane and w ashed all the dust off of the wings and readied it for a Saturday morning a dventure.- Early on Saturday we flew to Nacogdoches, Texas.---We us ed the airport courtesy car to get breakfast, I topped off the tanks then I prepared myself for a class C encounter and landing. The Baton Rouge approach guy was nice enough and I verified for the first t ime that my transponder AND encoder actually works.---I recently had it certified but the technician just put a little radio on the ground, turn ed on my transponder and said I was "good-to-go."- I paid him $75 and he gave me a sticker for my log book and he went on his way. Not very comforti ng.- After being handed off to Baton Rouge tower, I received some rapid fire ins tructions - something about Runway 22R and a citation departing and somethi ng about a right base and downwind.- I was completely baffled and didn't have a clear picture of exactly where runway 22 right was anyway, all the t ime getting closer to the field.- Then I saw the jet lifting off the runw ay in the distance and I figured I would be landing in the same direction. - I still wasn't clear on what to do so I asked the tower to repeat the l anding instructions.- He seemed a little miffed with me and emphasized DO WNWIND for 22 right.- I had zoomed my GPS all the way in and I noticed fo r the first time that it actually labels the runways on the screen and ther e they were right on front of me.- Downwind - OK I got it.- I turned le ft and flew along 22R, then entered a right base.- During this process my wife wiped my forehead which had a large amount of sweat forming.- Then I said with my outside voice (sho! uld- have kept it inside) "I don't do these right patterns very well."- My wife told me not to say things like that when we are landing and I real ized it made her very nervous too.---She was cool as a cucumber prior to this statement.- I turned right for final and nailed the landing on the widest, longest runw ay I could ever imagine and slowed way before the first taxiway - Taxiway F oxtrot.- I got handed over to ground control and asked if I could just go the the first place with 100LL and he gave me progressive taxi instruction s after figuring- out I was not very savvy in this environment.- We parked at Executive aviation next to some HUGE private jet and called it a day.- The best part was that I have not heard my sister laugh with a c ompletely honest-to-goodness, laugh so hard you are about to cry laugh in a long time.- After they picked us up in the lobby of the Executive Aviati on lounge, they had not seen my airplane yet.- We jumped in the car and d rove around to the road where you could see the airplane parking and she wa s looking at all the not-so-small airplanes in the parking lot, then saw mi ne and just lost it!- She had tears in her eyes saying she didn't realize my airplane was so small.- In her defense, it did look ridiculously smal l parked between Citations and King-airs. We had a great afternoon with the kids and their cousins that they don't se e often enough and stayed up late visiting.- This morning they gave us a ride out to the airport and walked out on the ramp with us and watched us s tart up, taxi, then take off.- Conversations with ground and tower went m uch better but I still asked the ground guy to stay with me to make sure I didn't make a wrong turn.- He was glad to do it and completely courteous. - Overall it was a perfect weekend as the flight back was faster with a littl e tail wind.- Gas in Nacogdoches again, then an hour and a half back to G rand Prairie and we were home.- My wife slept most of the last leg which is a testimony on how smooth the airplane can be.- She is a very light sl eeper.- I reached over to the intercom and selected "ISO" so the radio wo uldn't wake her and she didn't move for about an hour.- Father's days don't get any better than that at least for me.- Happy building, Scott Laughlin 601XL/Corvair 148 hours now! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249452#249452 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/fast_asleep_162.jpg le, List Admin. =0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:11:38 AM PST US From: John Davis Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Finally fixed my static problem Hi Tony, The ground strap was literally right next to the coil. Now I have it routed several inches away. My issue was way more than a buzz, its was loud... John T. Graziano wrote: > > > John, > > Good info. I do not really have a static problem, but I can hear > slight rpm "buzz" with my ICOM A-200 under certain conditions. Just > curious, about how close the ground wire was to the coil and how far > away is it now? > > Thanks, > > Tony Graziano > 601XL/Jab3300; N493TG; 503 hrs > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Davis" > To: > Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 8:08 AM > Subject: Zenith-List: Finally fixed my static problem > > >> >> Hi All, >> Just wanted to post this to help others in the future. I've had a >> problem with static in my radio at high RPMS that I've been trying to >> fix since my first flight. It was driving me nuts!!! >> >> I've got a Jabiru 3300 and an ICOM A-200 radio. At RPMS over 2400 or >> so I would get terrible static in the radio. I installed a power >> filter on the radio, installed resistor plugs, checked all my RG-400 >> to the antenna and still had the problem. Turns out it it was the >> ground strap running from my engine to the battery, it was routed >> close to one of the coils on the engine and it was picking up >> interference at high RPMS. I rerouted the ground strap this weekend >> and the noise is finally gone. >> >> Hopefully this may help someone else to preserve their sanity and >> hair :-) >> >> John Davis >> N601JD - 601XL & Jab 3300 >> Burnsville, NC >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:35:21 AM PST US From: victor verdev Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Must Sell My 75% Done 601XL I worked for GM 26 years, then got spun off and became Delphi. I was A skilled tradesmen and UAW member for the first 2 years and was offered A PROMOTION??? to salary as A supervisor. I was A salaried supervisor till I retired with 28 years service. On April 1 2009, Delphi took away our health, vision, dental, extended care and life insurance completely. They are now going to court to take away SALARIED PENSIONS ONLY. All of the union retirees from Delphi are still receiving their health benifits and pensions, because GM had to take them over because of union contracts. When Delphi turns the salaried pensions over to the government pension gauantee system our pensions will be reduced by up to 50%. The reason I posted my intent to sell my project on this list was in hope of finding A buyer, not sympathy for my situation. --- On Mon, 6/22/09, d.shrader wrote: > From: d.shrader > Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Must Sell My 75% Done 601XL > To: zenith-list@matronics.com > Date: Monday, June 22, 2009, 1:26 AM > "d.shrader" > > [I recently lost ALL my retirement benefits from GM/Delphi > > > ALL your retirement benefits? Are u retired or > working to retirement because all blue collar workers will > get there retirement ..... white collar and management will > get a reduction but no one looses there payed in retirement > under federal law. > > i myself have also suffered a company gone bankrupt and > thats the way it went in federal court.......upper > management and higher salaried employs got there benefits > reduced to hourly employees benefits. > > Please correct me if im wrong i want to understand. > > Dave > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249470#249470 > > > > > > > > Email Forum - > FAQ, > - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - > List Contribution Web Site - > -Matt > Dralle, List Admin. > > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:17:23 AM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Ken, was the $90 "starter" kit from pulsarprofx.com sufficient to do your whole panel or did you have to order more supplies? -- Craig -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of annken100 Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 2:50 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Larry, I did the labels using a system called decalpro FX. Here is the link: http://www.pulsarprofx.com/ I highly recommend it. The system does have a steep learning curve, but the results are worth it. Also, the guy who created the system is very helpful over the phone. Craig, you are correct, that is a 9 pin connector next to the serial switch. I made a serial cable that goes from the panel to my laptop which has a usb-serial converter. I simply connect the laptop and select which unit I want to update. I can also use it to download the ems and efis data. The main instrument is a Dynon D180 and the backup is a D100. The D100 normally boots up in to the EMS screen. The D180 boots up to a full EFIS screen. The rest of the equipment are a Dynon HS34 and AP74 and a Garmin SL30 Nav/Com and GTX327 transponder. The GPS is an Avmap EKP IV and the intercom is a flightcom 401. Thank you all for the kind words. Ken Pavlou -------- 601 XL / Corvair Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248770#248770 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:02:02 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel From: "annken100" Craig, I used all the white film during the learning process. I ended up ordering some more white. Now that I'm more proficient with the process I could do the whole panel with just the starter pack. Ken -------- 601 XL / Corvair Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249543#249543 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 10:22:02 AM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Thanks! I'll be using the black on my white panel. So I think I could use one of the other colors for practice and have all the black left for the real panel. Any other tips that you learned or is it just a matter of getting a feel for it? -- Craig -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of annken100 Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 11:01 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Craig, I used all the white film during the learning process. I ended up ordering some more white. Now that I'm more proficient with the process I could do the whole panel with just the starter pack. Ken -------- 601 XL / Corvair Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249543#249543 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:28:24 AM PST US From: John Davis Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Hi Craig, I used the same system for my panel, the one key thing I learned is that having the thick border around the text you are printing is very important. If you don't have it the text wont transfer over properly to the mylar material and your labels will be toast. You mention your planning to use the black, I initially tried the white material and found it more difficult to use than the light brown than I eventually used for my panel. I've read elsewhere that others have had more troubles with the white material as well. John Davis N601JD - Jab 3300 Burnsville, NC Craig Payne wrote: > > Thanks! I'll be using the black on my white panel. So I think I could use > one of the other colors for practice and have all the black left for the > real panel. > > Any other tips that you learned or is it just a matter of getting a feel for > it? > > -- Craig > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of annken100 > Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 11:01 AM > To: zenith-list@matronics.com > Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel > > > Craig, > > I used all the white film during the learning process. I ended up ordering > some more white. Now that I'm more proficient with the process I could do > the whole panel with just the starter pack. > > Ken > > -------- > 601 XL / Corvair > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249543#249543 > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 11:13:10 AM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Thanks. When you say "thick", how thick is enough? -- Craig -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Davis Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 11:24 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Hi Craig, I used the same system for my panel, the one key thing I learned is that having the thick border around the text you are printing is very important. If you don't have it the text wont transfer over properly to the mylar material and your labels will be toast. You mention your planning to use the black, I initially tried the white material and found it more difficult to use than the light brown than I eventually used for my panel. I've read elsewhere that others have had more troubles with the white material as well. John Davis N601JD - Jab 3300 Burnsville, NC Craig Payne wrote: > > Thanks! I'll be using the black on my white panel. So I think I could use > one of the other colors for practice and have all the black left for the > real panel. > > Any other tips that you learned or is it just a matter of getting a feel for > it? > > -- Craig > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of annken100 > Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 11:01 AM > To: zenith-list@matronics.com > Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel > > > Craig, > > I used all the white film during the learning process. I ended up ordering > some more white. Now that I'm more proficient with the process I could do > the whole panel with just the starter pack. > > Ken > > -------- > 601 XL / Corvair > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249543#249543 > > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 11:14:55 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: POH -pilot operating handbook From: "Gig Giacona" jaybannist(at)cs.com wrote: > Elden, > > Here it is.? I've noticed that I have changed some of the checklists and not updated the POH.? That is something you will want to customize for your airplane anyway.? Use at your own discretion and all that stuff.? Let me know if you have any suggestions that could improve it or if you have any questions. > > Jay > -- It isn't attached Jay. -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249553#249553 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:19:36 AM PST US From: John Davis Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Hi Craig, I ended up using a line about 1/10 of an inch, I started with a really thin line and had problems till I moved to a thicker line. Good Luck, its a great labeling system once you get the hang of it... John Craig Payne wrote: > > Thanks. When you say "thick", how thick is enough? > > -- Craig > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Davis > Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 11:24 AM > To: zenith-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel > > > Hi Craig, > > I used the same system for my panel, the one key thing I learned is that > having the thick border around the text you are printing is very > important. If you don't have it the text wont transfer over properly to > the mylar material and your labels will be toast. > > You mention your planning to use the black, I initially tried the white > material and found it more difficult to use than the light brown than I > eventually used for my panel. I've read elsewhere that others have had > more troubles with the white material as well. > > John Davis > N601JD - Jab 3300 > Burnsville, NC > > Craig Payne wrote: > >> >> Thanks! I'll be using the black on my white panel. So I think I could use >> one of the other colors for practice and have all the black left for the >> real panel. >> >> Any other tips that you learned or is it just a matter of getting a feel >> > for > >> it? >> >> -- Craig >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com >> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of annken100 >> Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 11:01 AM >> To: zenith-list@matronics.com >> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel >> >> >> Craig, >> >> I used all the white film during the learning process. I ended up ordering >> some more white. Now that I'm more proficient with the process I could do >> the whole panel with just the starter pack. >> >> Ken >> >> -------- >> 601 XL / Corvair >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249543#249543 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 11:26:09 AM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Thanks, any problem with text with no border? -- Craig From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Davis Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 12:15 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Hi Craig, I ended up using a line about 1/10 of an inch, I started with a really thin line and had problems till I moved to a thicker line. Good Luck, its a great labeling system once you get the hang of it... John Craig Payne wrote: Thanks. When you say "thick", how thick is enough? -- Craig -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Davis Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 11:24 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Hi Craig, I used the same system for my panel, the one key thing I learned is that having the thick border around the text you are printing is very important. If you don't have it the text wont transfer over properly to the mylar material and your labels will be toast. You mention your planning to use the black, I initially tried the white material and found it more difficult to use than the light brown than I eventually used for my panel. I've read elsewhere that others have had more troubles with the white material as well. John Davis N601JD - Jab 3300 Burnsville, NC Craig Payne wrote: Thanks! I'll be using the black on my white panel. So I think I could use one of the other colors for practice and have all the black left for the real panel. Any other tips that you learned or is it just a matter of getting a feel for it? -- Craig -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of annken100 Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 11:01 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Craig, I used all the white film during the learning process. I ended up ordering some more white. Now that I'm more proficient with the process I could do the whole panel with just the starter pack. Ken -------- 601 XL / Corvair Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249543#249543 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 11:32:06 AM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: POH -pilot operating handbook It came through to me (as an actual attachment, not a link at the bottom of the page). I'll send it to you direct. -- Craig -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gig Giacona Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 12:15 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: POH -pilot operating handbook jaybannist(at)cs.com wrote: > Elden, > > Here it is.? I've noticed that I have changed some of the checklists and not updated the POH.? That is something you will want to customize for your airplane anyway.? Use at your own discretion and all that stuff.? Let me know if you have any suggestions that could improve it or if you have any questions. > > Jay > -- It isn't attached Jay. -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249553#249553 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 11:41:18 AM PST US From: John Davis Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel Hi Craig, You must use a border around each label to do the transfer process but you can remove the border after you've done that so your final text doesnt have to have a border. The think border just helps in the process to transfer the labels from the paper to the mylar material. Then you can trim it off. John Craig Payne wrote: > > Thanks, any problem with text with no border? > > > > -- Craig > > > > *From:* owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Davis > *Sent:* Monday, June 22, 2009 12:15 PM > *To:* zenith-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel > > > > Hi Craig, > > I ended up using a line about 1/10 of an inch, I started with a really > thin line and had problems till I moved to a thicker line. > > Good Luck, its a great labeling system once you get the hang of it... > > John > > Craig Payne wrote: > > > Thanks. When you say "thick", how thick is enough? > > -- Craig > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Davis > Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 11:24 AM > To: zenith-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel > > > Hi Craig, > > I used the same system for my panel, the one key thing I learned is that > having the thick border around the text you are printing is very > important. If you don't have it the text wont transfer over properly to > the mylar material and your labels will be toast. > > You mention your planning to use the black, I initially tried the white > material and found it more difficult to use than the light brown than I > eventually used for my panel. I've read elsewhere that others have had > more troubles with the white material as well. > > John Davis > N601JD - Jab 3300 > Burnsville, NC > > Craig Payne wrote: > > > > > > Thanks! I'll be using the black on my white panel. So I think I could use > > one of the other colors for practice and have all the black left for the > > real panel. > > > > Any other tips that you learned or is it just a matter of getting a feel > > > > for > > > it? > > > > -- Craig > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of annken100 > > Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 11:01 AM > > To: zenith-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel > > > > > > > Craig, > > > > I used all the white film during the learning process. I ended up ordering > > some more white. Now that I'm more proficient with the process I could do > > the whole panel with just the starter pack. > > > > Ken > > > > -------- > > 601 XL / Corvair > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249543#249543 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > * * > * *http://www.matron=================== http://forums.matronics.com - List Contribution Web generous nbsp; --> http://www.matronics.com/c= > * * > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 11:57:56 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair From: "Fly with Gus" My experience shows the UL260i to be even a little lighter than the Rotax 912S. My page http://flywithgus.net/html/performance.html shows the same exact airplane with both the corvair and the UL260i. The weight for the corvair was with no paint and only seat cushions. The UL numbers include paint and full interior. With the UL was 695 lbs. without paint and only seat cushions. So same airplane with both engines, and this also probably a bit heavier than a standard 601 as it has 650 canopy and tail mods. Gus www.flywithgus.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249565#249565 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 12:08:41 PM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: POH -pilot operating handbook From: jaybannist@cs.com Gig, Give it another try. Jay Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: Gig Giacona Sent: Mon, Jun 22, 2009 1:14 pm Subject: Zenith-List: Re: POH -pilot operating handbook jaybannist(at)cs.com wrote: > Elden, > > Here it is.? I've noticed that I have changed some of the checklists and not updated the POH.? That is something you will want to customize for your airplane anyway.? Use at your own discretion and all that stuff.? Let me know if you have any suggestions that could improve it or if you have any questions. > > Jay > -- It isn't attached Jay. -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249553#249553 ________________________________________________________________________ Email message sent from CompuServe - visit us today at http://www.cs.com ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 12:39:47 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Instrument panel From: "annken100" Craig, Like John said, a thick border around your graphics is important. It helps your graphics survive the shock of being dunked in water to release the carrier mylar. I used 1/8" borders because the white foil seems to be a bit more sensitive to the water dunk. If you are using black lettering you should be able to skip the film step and transfer the toner directly. The only thing you need to experiment with is whether the toner alone is opaque enough over the color of your panel. Let me know if you have more questions. Good luck, Ken -------- 601 XL / Corvair Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249572#249572 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 01:13:58 PM PST US From: Juan Vega Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair phil, they are not, Jabiru is 178 lbs wet. my craft is 760 lbs, with 3300 engine. -----Original Message----- >From: Phil Maxson >Sent: Jun 21, 2009 8:33 AM >To: "zenith-list@matronics.com " >Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair > > >My 601XL/Corvair weighs 777 pounds, starter and all. The battery is behind the passenger's seat. > >I don't know Jabirus were so much heavier than Corvairs. > >Phil Maxson >Northwest New Jersey > > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 01:24:34 PM PST US From: "Phil Maxson " Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair Juan, That puts us at 17 pounds as the difference, not the 40 or 50 someone reported. Of course it really depends on how the planes are equipped. Phil Maxson 601XL/Corvair ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 01:40:35 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair From: "cookwithgas" David: 820 is a good weight. Mine is around 850 and flies great with the Corvair engine, Y-stick, BRS and the battery on the firewall. It's great to hear that another Corvair/601XL will be in the air soon. Scott Laughlin 601XL/Corvair Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249585#249585 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 02:34:57 PM PST US From: Davcoberly@wmconnect.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair Thanks Scott I'm mostly just down to getting the details worked out for the DAR inspection. I sure look forward to meeting you at some Fly-In someday soon! David Coberly 601XL / Corvair ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 05:04:37 PM PST US From: Rick Lindstrom Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair Hey, Kids! We JUST got Rich Vetterli's Zenvair 601XL off of the scales, and it came in at: Left Main: 281.6 Right Main: 281.4 Nose Gear: 230.0 For a grand total of 793.0 pounds. His airplane is lightly equipped with minimal instrumentation for flight test, has a chopped down center stick, a single set of brakes, but has been painted and features soundproofing throughout. Warp Drive prop, no wheelpants (yet), just wingtip strobes without exterior nav lighting. Three photos attached. Phase 1, here he comes...! Rick Lindstrom First Light Aviation Group Livermore, CA www.flaglvk.com -----Original Message----- >From: cookwithgas >Sent: Jun 22, 2009 4:39 PM >To: zenith-list@matronics.com >Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair > > >David: > >820 is a good weight. Mine is around 850 and flies great with the Corvair engine, Y-stick, BRS and the battery on the firewall. > >It's great to hear that another Corvair/601XL will be in the air soon. > >Scott Laughlin >601XL/Corvair > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249585#249585 > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 05:43:56 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: DFW Builders get together From: jaybannist@cs.com Attention Zenith builders and flyers in the DFW (Texas) area. If there is enough interest, we plan to have a breakfast meeting on July 18 at Hicks Airfield (T67), fly in or drive in. There are a whole bunch of us in various stages of building 601s, 650s, 701s, 750s and 801s in this area and it would be great for all of us to meet one another and talk about our passions (and our perils). If interested, please let me know, on line or off. Thanks - Jay Bannister 601XL "Lil Bruiser" ________________________________________________________________________ Email message sent from CompuServe - visit us today at http://www.cs.com ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 05:56:16 PM PST US From: Davcoberly@wmconnect.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair What a beautiful 601XL way to go!! My weights of the three wheels were almost equal. With the nose so light must be a lot more weight aft than mine. David Coberly 601XL / Corvair ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 06:19:43 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair From: "Gig Giacona" tigerrick(at)mindspring.c wrote: > For a grand total of 793.0 pounds. -- There are clearly not enough gadgets in that aircraft. Pretty paint though. :) -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249606#249606 ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 06:20:09 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair From: "leinad" That's an inspiration! I've got to get off my duff! Dan 601xl/corvair Dempsey tigerrick(at)mindspring.c wrote: > Hey, Kids! > > We JUST got Rich Vetterli's Zenvair 601XL off of the scales, and it came in at: > > Left Main: 281.6 > Right Main: 281.4 > Nose Gear: 230.0 > > For a grand total of 793.0 pounds. His airplane is lightly equipped with minimal instrumentation for flight test, has a chopped down center stick, a single set of brakes, but has been painted and features soundproofing throughout. Warp Drive prop, no wheelpants (yet), just wingtip strobes without exterior nav lighting. > > Three photos attached. > > Phase 1, here he comes...! > > Rick Lindstrom > First Light Aviation Group > Livermore, CA > www.flaglvk.com > > -- -------- Scratch building XL with Corvair Engine Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249607#249607 ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 06:25:47 PM PST US From: Cory Emberson Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair Way to go, Rich! leinad wrote: > > That's an inspiration! I've got to get off my duff! > Dan 601xl/corvair Dempsey > > > tigerrick(at)mindspring.c wrote: > >> Hey, Kids! >> >> We JUST got Rich Vetterli's Zenvair 601XL off of the scales, and it came in at: >> >> Left Main: 281.6 >> Right Main: 281.4 >> Nose Gear: 230.0 >> >> For a grand total of 793.0 pounds. His airplane is lightly equipped with minimal instrumentation for flight test, has a chopped down center stick, a single set of brakes, but has been painted and features soundproofing throughout. Warp Drive prop, no wheelpants (yet), just wingtip strobes without exterior nav lighting. >> >> Three photos attached. >> >> Phase 1, here he comes...! >> >> Rick Lindstrom >> First Light Aviation Group >> Livermore, CA >> www.flaglvk.com >> >> -- >> > > > -------- > Scratch building XL with Corvair Engine > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249607#249607 > > > ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 06:55:54 PM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair From: Larry Winger Rich, you're the man! Great job. You've come a long way. Larry Winger On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 5:02 PM, Rick Lindstrom wrote: > Hey, Kids! > > We JUST got Rich Vetterli's Zenvair 601XL off of the scales, and it came in > at: > > Left Main: 281.6 > Right Main: 281.4 > Nose Gear: 230.0 > > For a grand total of 793.0 pounds. His airplane is lightly equipped with > minimal instrumentation for flight test, has a chopped down center stick, a > single set of brakes, but has been painted and features soundproofing > throughout. Warp Drive prop, no wheelpants (yet), just wingtip strobes > without exterior nav lighting. > > Three photos attached. > > Phase 1, here he comes...! > > Rick Lindstrom > First Light Aviation Group > Livermore, CA > www.flaglvk.com > > -----Original Message----- > >From: cookwithgas > >Sent: Jun 22, 2009 4:39 PM > >To: zenith-list@matronics.com > >Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Weight and Balance on 601XL / Corvair > > > > > > > >David: > > > >820 is a good weight. Mine is around 850 and flies great with the Corvair > engine, Y-stick, BRS and the battery on the firewall. > > > >It's great to hear that another Corvair/601XL will be in the air soon. > > > >Scott Laughlin > >601XL/Corvair > > > > > > > > > >Read this topic online here: > > > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249585#249585 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 08:19:10 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: DFW Builders get together From: "MHerder" SOUNDS GREAT!! NICE LITTLE AIRFIELD, WITH A GOOD LITTLE CAFE (RIO CONCHO AVIATION). I'M ANXIOUSLY AWAITING! MY 650 HD IS SOON TO HANGAR OUT AT T67 ALONG WITH ANOTHER 601 BUILDER WHO IS NEARLY COMPLETE. REAL NICEFOLKS PLUS AVERY TOOLS IS LOCATED OUT THERE, BUT THEY ARE USUALLY NOT OPEN ON SAT. NEARBY IS 52F WHICH HOSTS THE BLUE HANGAR CAFE (BEST PANCAKES IVE EVER HAD). TOOK DAD THERE FOR FATHERS DAY AND ENJOYED EVERY MINUTE! LET ME KNOW IF THERE IS ANYTHING I CAN DO TO HELP OUT, IM PRETTY FAMILIAR WITH THE AREA. 214.364.3071 -------- One Rivet at a Time! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249623#249623 ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 10:14:54 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: What did you do today? From: "Sabrina" I passed my practical examination for my Harley 883 Low today! :O) Who is going to be in Mexico MO this Saturday? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249631#249631 ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 11:08:39 PM PST US From: "J.T. Machin" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: What did you do today? Congrats girl! I am happy for you! Jim PS. Good to see you on the list again. --- On Mon, 6/22/09, Sabrina wrote: > From: Sabrina > Subject: Zenith-List: Re: What did you do today? > To: zenith-list@matronics.com > Date: Monday, June 22, 2009, 10:12 PM > "Sabrina" > > I passed my practical examination for my Harley 883 Low > today!:O) > > Who is going to be in Mexico MO this Saturday? > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249631#249631 > > > > > > > > Email Forum - > FAQ, > - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - > List Contribution Web Site - > -Matt > Dralle, List Admin. > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.