---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 11/14/09: 16 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:42 AM - EAA info to Tech Counselors Re: XL (Bill Pagan) 2. 08:13 AM - EAA info to Tech Counselors Re: XL (leinad) 3. 08:57 AM - Re: EAA info to Tech Counselors Re: XL (Jim Belcher) 4. 08:57 AM - Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions (lwhitlow) 5. 09:19 AM - Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions (Paul Mulwitz) 6. 10:30 AM - Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions (Carlos Sa) 7. 10:33 AM - Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions (lwhitlow) 8. 12:40 PM - Re: Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions (Paul Mulwitz) 9. 01:45 PM - Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions (chris Sinfield) 10. 01:47 PM - Icom A210/iPod (Peter W Johnson) 11. 02:10 PM - Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions (Gig Giacona) 12. 02:54 PM - Re: Icom A210/iPod (Terry Phillips) 13. 03:36 PM - Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions (lwhitlow) 14. 03:37 PM - Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions (lwhitlow) 15. 03:41 PM - Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions (lwhitlow) 16. 05:42 PM - Re: Icom A210/iPod (Peter W Johnson) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:42:22 AM PST US From: Bill Pagan Subject: Zenith-List: EAA info to Tech Counselors Re: XL Received the below from EAA regarding the XL.=C2- Answers some questions being asked about who can perform the upgrades. =C2- Dear EAA Technical Counselor; =C2- I=99m sure you are all aware that there have been a number of acciden ts involving Zenith CH 601XL and related aircraft in which the aircraft suf fered an in-flight structural failure or breakup.=C2-=C2- This situatio n has resulted in the FAA=99s issuance of Special Airworthiness Infor mation Bulletin (SAIB) CE-10-08 and the release by Aircraft Manufacturing & Design LLC (AMD) of a safety alert dated November 7th, 2009. =C2- Chris Heinz, designer of the CH 601XL and CH 650 aircraft issued a Question and Answer document addressing the issue in which he urges all owners/oper ators of these aircraft to comply with the AMD service directive even if th ey are not required by regulation to do so.=C2- The following is a quote from the Q&A document; =C2- =9COwners of an SLSA (AMD-built) Zodiac must comply with the factory- issued Safety Alert. Owners of a self-built =9CExperimental=9D Zodiac are officially the manufacturer of their aircraft and are therefore technically free to install (or not) the upgrades. As the designer of the a ircraft, I am strongly urging all owners who operate their CH 601 XL/CH 650 to install the upgrades now being proposed before the next flight. You, mo re than anyone, know how damaging and demoralizing the doubts and questions regarding the aircraft have been; how they have affected the confidence th at many have in the design. Stronger airplanes and better prepared pilots s hould help us all restore the reputation and desirability of these airplane s you have put so much of yourself into. If for no other reason, install th e =9CUpgrade Package=9D to maximize resale value of your projec t: I anticipate that the cost of the Upgrade will be much lower that the in crease in resale value=9D. =C2- EAA urges you to share this info with builders and owners/operators of Zeni th CH 601XL and CH 650 in your area.=C2- You may also wish to make them a ware of the independent analysis of the design, as well as the drawings out lining the upgrade outlined in the AMD safety alert.=C2- Be sure to remin d owners of the SLSA aircraft that they are required to comply with the saf ety directive.=C2- While owners of ELSA and amateur-built versions of the design are not specifically required to comply with the safety directive, you should remind them that they are required to maintain and operate their aircraft in a condition for safe operation and the safety of flight issues pointed out in the safety directive must be addressed in some fashion.=C2 - Note that Chris Heinz strongly urges owners of experimental versions of the aircraft to install the upgrades.=C2- EAA concurs with this recommen dation. =C2- You may wish to remind owners of the experimental-certificated aircraft tha t the safety directive=99s requirement for an A&P mechanic make the m odifications only applies to the SLSA versions of the aircraft.=C2- Owner s of the experimental aircraft are not bound by this requirement and are fr ee to perform the upgrade themselves. =C2- EAA will continue to post updates on this issue on our website, www.eaa.org .=C2- Encourage builders, owners and operators of these aircraft to visit the website often for new developments.=C2- The current story can be see n here. =C2- Thanks for your continued dedication to your fellow EAA members. =C2- Regards, =C2- Joe =C2- Joe Norris EAA 113615 Lifetime Homebuilders Community Manager =C2- EAA=94The Spirit of Aviation Bill Pagan EAA Tech Counselor #4395 601XL QBK/Corvair/N565BW (RES) =0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 08:13:23 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: EAA info to Tech Counselors Re: XL From: "leinad" Paul, I think you're going by old news. The document you are referring to (the one to tech counselors) also says that Experimental builders are free to incorporate the changes or not, as the builder is the "manufacturer". The FAA has since said they will issue no new airworthiness certificates on planes of the 601xl design until the AMD modifications are complied with Experimental or otherwise. It seams clear Zenith is not interperetting these rulings the way I am, or they wouldn't be about to sell kits to all sorts of builders and owners. I just wish the ruling were more explicit that the experimental builder doesn't have to comply with the "must be done by an FAA certified mechanic" and "must be approved" by parts of the AMD safety alert. I don't find vague words like "consistent with" helpful when I'm about to undergo a couple month effort the FAA could use to deny my airworthiness certificate on a technicality. I think I may ask for the EAA's help in getting the FAA to clarify their language. Dan [quote="pdn8r(at)yahoo.com"]Received the below from EAA regarding the XL. Answers some questions being asked about who can perform the upgrades. Dear EAA Technical Counselor; Im sure you are all aware that there have been a number of accidents involving Zenith CH 601XL and related aircraft in which the aircraft suffered an in-flight structural failure or breakup. This situation has resulted in the FAAs issuance of Special Airworthiness Information Bulletin (mhtml:{AFEFE507-23AC-4B51-A138-6B0DECDA139E}mid://00000003/!x-usc:http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgSAIB.nsf/(LookupSAIBs)/CE-10-08?OpenDocument) (SAIB) CE-10-08 and the release by Aircraft Manufacturing & Design LLC (AMD) of a safety alert dated November 7th, 2009 (mhtml:{AFEFE507-23AC-4B51-A138-6B0DECDA139E}mid://00000003/!x-usc:http://www.newplane.com/amd_downloads/SAFETY%20ALERT%20November%207%202009.pdf). Chris Heinz, designer of the CH 601XL and CH 650 aircraft issued a Question and Answer document (mhtml:{AFEFE507-23AC-4B51-A138-6B0DECDA139E}mid://00000003/!x-usc:http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/qa-chris-heintz-1a.pdf) addressing the issue in which he urges all owners/operators of these aircraft to comply with the AMD service directive even if they are not required by regulation to do so. The following is a quote from the Q&A document; Owners of an SLSA (AMD-built) Zodiac must comply with the factory-issued Safety Alert. Owners of a self-built Experimental Zodiac are officially the manufacturer of their aircraft and are therefore technically free to install (or not) the upgrades. As the designer of the aircraft, I am strongly urging all owners who operate their CH 601 XL/CH 650 to install the upgrades now being proposed before the next flight. You, more than anyone, know how damaging and demoralizing the doubts and questions regarding the aircraft have been; how they have affected the confidence that many have in the design. Stronger airplanes and better prepared pilots should help us all restore the reputation and desirability of these airplanes you have put so much of yourself into. If for no other reason, install the Upgrade Package to maximize resale value of your project: I anticipate that the cost of the Upgrade will be much lower that the increase in resale value. EAA urges you to share this info with builders and owners/operators of Zenith CH 601XL and CH 650 in your area. You may also wish to make them aware of the independent analysis (mhtml:{AFEFE507-23AC-4B51-A138-6B0DECDA139E}mid://00000003/!x-usc:http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/doc369.pdf) of the design, as well as the drawings outlining the upgrade (mhtml:{AFEFE507-23AC-4B51-A138-6B0DECDA139E}mid://00000003/!x-usc:http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6-ZU-1-2-3%20NOV%208.pdf) outlined in the AMD safety alert. Be sure to remind owners of the SLSA aircraft that they are required to comply with the safety directive. While owners of ELSA and amateur-built versions of the design are not specifically required to comply with the safety directive, you should remind them that they are required to maintain and operate their aircraft in a condition for safe operation and the safety of flight issues pointed out in the safety directive must be addressed in some fashion. Note that Chris Heinz strongly urges owners of experimental versions of the aircraft to install the upgrades. EAA concurs with this recommendation. You may wish to remind owners of the experimental-certificated aircraft that the safety directives requirement for an A&P mechanic make the modifications only applies to the SLSA versions of the aircraft. Owners of the experimental aircraft are not bound by this requirement and are free to perform the upgrade themselves. EAA will continue to post updates on this issue on our website, www.eaa.org (mhtml:{AFEFE507-23AC-4B51-A138-6B0DECDA139E}mid://00000003/!x-usc:http://www.eaa.org/). Encourage builders, owners and operators of these aircraft to visit the website often for new developments. The current story can be seen here (mhtml:{AFEFE507-23AC-4B51-A138-6B0DECDA139E}mid://00000003/!x-usc:http://www.eaa.org/news/2009/2009-11-09_Zodica%20Issued%20Alert.asp). Thanks for your continued dedication to your fellow EAA members. Regards, Joe Joe Norris EAA 113615 Lifetime Homebuilders Community Manager EAAThe Spirit of Aviation Bill Pagan EAA Tech Counselor #4395 601XL QBK/Corvair/N565BW (RES) > [b] -------- Scratch building XL with Corvair Engine Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272813#272813 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:57:48 AM PST US From: Jim Belcher Subject: Re: Zenith-List: EAA info to Tech Counselors Re: XL I agree that the wording and situation is confusing. Suggestion: Contact your local FSDO for clarification. They're the ones who are responsible, and the ones who will determine if what you did is acceptable. They are responsible for all general aviation modifiation and repair in their region of authority, and all mechanics and DARs in their region effectively report to them. If the EAA tells us something, we do it, and the FSDO does not agree, we're up the creek. While the EAA can be quite helpful, what they tell us does not have the force of an FAA interpretation. If what the FSDO says still makes no sense, it may be time to seek help from the EAA in resolving the issue so that all FSDOs are in agreement, and are telling us the same thing. But that's different and distinct from asking the EAA what we should do. The FSDOs are supposed to be in agreement, and giving the same guidance. I've found in practice that this is not always the case, and that it is sometimes necessary to elevate the issue to a higher level. FSDOs, like the rest of us, sometimes unintentionally put their own interpretation on things. Therefore, please do not take the following as guidance, but as an opinion: what I would have expected is that, since this is a major modification, the work done to LSAs and ELSAs should be done by a person certificated to perform major modifications to those aircraft. EABs not yet licensed should have the modifications approved at the time of DAR inspection. That is, the builder would do the modifications at the time of construction. I would have expected that experimentals already licensed could be modified by the person building that aircraft, if he/she holds a repairman's certificate for that aircraft. If the FSDO takes a different interpretation, that is a departure from existing FAA rules, and it is time for the bigger guns to step in, and get things resolved. I would also expect that those building from plans could fabricate equivalent parts, and would not need to buy the upgrade kit from Zenith. I don't believe Zenith can police who is doing the modifcation, or to what aircraft. That being the case, I don't find it surprising that they would be willing to sell the "upgrade" kit to anyone. But I emphasize: the FSDO is in charge, and we must either do what they ultimately agree is required, or we won't get are aircraft approved. If someone brings me one of these things for the modifications, the first thing I'm going to do is call the local FSDO for guidance. I, too, find what we have confusing, and I'd be reluctant to sign a log book based on it. -- ============================================ Do not archive. ============================================ Jim B Belcher BS, MS Physics, Math, Computer Science A&P/IA Retired aerospace technical manager Mathematics and alcohol do not mix. Do not drink and derive. ============================================ ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:57:49 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions From: "lwhitlow" The attachment of the new angle to the wing spar is up and now I'm curious. The released drawings show 6-ZU-1-1 being attached by AN3 or AN4 bolts yet the pics on segment 5 show solid rivets being used Questions 1 Are solid rivets the way this is going to be done?? I have never driven a solid rivet and don't have any of the tools. With something as critical as the wing spar I'm not sure this is the correct place to learn this skill. 2. Can these rivets be set using a squeezer?? I could rent one of those and would feel better about the quality of my work here. 3. What happened to the bolt idea?? Why was it changed?? Just curious I'm not thinking anything bad is going on here. I think the Zenith boys are making things a good as they can right now. I'm very happy with the flow of info and whats going on so far. It could have happened sooner but at least were moving now. It appears that my decision NOT to rivet the top wing skins on was spot on, but I'm concerned about the seats. The bottom edge of my seats is riveted in from the bottom, through the landing gear channel. Are we gonna have to drop the gear to remove the seat pan to work on the center section or will there be enough room to do the work with these still riveted at the back? I got more but lets let these simmer for a bit Larry Whitlow 601XL Jabiru 3300 It will fly the only question is when Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272817#272817 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:19:11 AM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions Hi Larry, I think it is premature to worry about installing the changes on home built planes now. I understand ZAC is working very hard to put together a kit and instructions for us to use when installing the changes. I also understand the information released so far as the AMD update is not complete. It covers a number of changes but the stuff I have seen doesn't cover control system and aileron mass balance changes. I don't know what else in the "Package" has been left out of the AMD package. Remember the primary plan is for AMD owners to return their planes to the factory for upgrade. For those who don't, there is still the requirement for licensed mechanics to do the changes. The AMD package just isn't designed for home builder use. Shirley (the gal in charge of nearly everything at ZAC including sales and answering the phone) informed me it would be several weeks before the upgrade kit was ready for distribution. For my money and time, I think I will continue to build my next plane until the kit is in hand. Paul XL ready to order upgrade kit P.S. On the solid rivet question, I suspect several RV builders in your local EAA chapter will be happy to help with the few rivets we need on the spars. They have to install about 30,000 of those little things on an RV. Failing that, the bolt option might work out better if you don't have equipment and experience with bucking rivets. The obvious problem with bolts is the question someone raised a few days ago about inspecting the nuts to see they are still tight after the wing is closed up. At 08:57 AM 11/14/2009, you wrote: > >The attachment of the new angle to the wing spar is up and now I'm curious. > >The released drawings show 6-ZU-1-1 being attached by AN3 or AN4 >bolts yet the pics on segment 5 show solid rivets being used > >Questions > >1 Are solid rivets the way this is going to be done?? I have never >driven a solid rivet and don't have any of the tools. With something >as critical as the wing spar I'm not sure this is the correct place >to learn this skill. > >2. Can these rivets be set using a squeezer?? I could rent one of >those and would feel better about the quality of my work here. > >3. What happened to the bolt idea?? Why was it changed?? Just >curious I'm not thinking anything bad is going on here. > >I think the Zenith boys are making things a good as they can right >now. I'm very happy with the flow of info and whats going on so far. > >It could have happened sooner but at least were moving now. > >It appears that my decision NOT to rivet the top wing skins on was >spot on, but I'm concerned about the seats. The bottom edge of my >seats is riveted in from the bottom, through the landing gear >channel. Are we gonna have to drop the gear to remove the seat pan >to work on the center section or will there be enough room to do the >work with these still riveted at the back? > >I got more but lets let these simmer for a bit > >Larry Whitlow >601XL Jabiru 3300 >It will fly the only question is when > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:30:28 AM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions From: Carlos Sa As Paul suggested, RV builders can help. I built my (HD) spar with the help of two local RV builders. We did squeeze the rivets we could reach with the squeezer we had available and did the rest the conventional RV way (bucking bar and riveting gun). I suggest you post your questions on Matt's blog, he has been answering them. Carlos CH601-HD, plans 2009/11/14 lwhitlow > > The attachment of the new angle to the wing spar is up and now I'm curious. > > The released drawings show 6-ZU-1-1 being attached by AN3 or AN4 bolts yet > the pics on segment 5 show solid rivets being used > > Questions > > 1 Are solid rivets the way this is going to be done?? I have never driven > a solid rivet and don't have any of the tools. With something as critical as > the wing spar I'm not sure this is the correct place to learn this skill. > > 2. Can these rivets be set using a squeezer?? I could rent one of those > and would feel better about the quality of my work here. > > 3. What happened to the bolt idea?? Why was it changed?? Just curious I'm > not thinking anything bad is going on here. > > I think the Zenith boys are making things a good as they can right now. > I'm very happy with the flow of info and whats going on so far. > > It could have happened sooner but at least were moving now. > > It appears that my decision NOT to rivet the top wing skins on was spot on, > but I'm concerned about the seats. The bottom edge of my seats is riveted > in from the bottom, through the landing gear channel. Are we gonna have to > drop the gear to remove the seat pan to work on the center section or will > there be enough room to do the work with these still riveted at the back? > > I got more but lets let these simmer for a bit > > Larry Whitlow > 601XL Jabiru 3300 > It will fly the only question is when > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:33:12 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions From: "lwhitlow" Hi Paul By the way thanks for all the useful info you have passed along in the past couple of weeks!! I'm gonna have to disagree that its premature to be concerned about the home built planes now. I've been avoiding closing up areas that were likely to need changes (wings) and now that center section work is needed I have to stop in the cabin area and remove some parts to gain access. My time is important to me and without a timely delivery of the mod kit parts, I'm stopped from making progress. I can get useful work done, in prepping the areas that will be affected by the mods. I just want to make sure I'm working off of the best information available. Paul, I don't think you are saying that Zenith is more concerned about the AMD planes. The AMD planes are no more important than mine or yours or anyone elses, and they will all require the same mods, so all of the how and why and changes will apply to everyone. I don't think the guys at Zenith are worried about AMD and how it will get done. We should be all equal here. It would be a terrible move on Zenith's part to get parts and procedures to AMD ahead of getting them to the home builders. Home builders are the basis for Zenith to make the kits for the AMD planes. It's the same plane, we are all in the same boat, First come first serve. I've got a Credit card ready as soon as Shirley will take it to get the mod parts here. Besides I think the kit of mod parts is soon to come. Search You-Tube there's a video put up by Zenith of the mod parts, they just haven't linked it to the blog yet. I'm happy with their pace here, but notes as they go along with the prototype mods would be great. It helps those of us who want to keep moving understand the issues we are going to face and to make arrangements to get this mandatory work done. My goal has always been to get this bird to Oshkosh in 2010 and that is still within reach easily, I just want to keep making progress. And the rivet question, My EAA chapter here is oddly absent RV builders. There might be one I think but..... ITs mostly the Rag and tube or Rag and wood crowd (Purists :D ) around here There's a glass or two and a few Zenith guys ( HD and HDS all flying! ) I'm the only metal and Zenith builder here. The guys are great and have been a great help but the metal crowd is not large here!! I still cannot call this an upgrade. While I welcome the changes and expect a stronger airframe, Its not an upgrade if its required. Its a safety of flight modification, but no one wants to call it that. I don't care if they call it cosmetic changes, just bend and cut some metal, make me some drawings and get it in a box with my name on it Larry Whitlow 601XL Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272826#272826 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:40:36 PM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions Hi Larry Thanks for the kind words. I try to be helpful as much as I can. I think there is a little confusion about the organization of the various Heintz related companies. As I understand it (now, as opposed to my first impressions) there is no relationship at all between AMD and Zenith. AMD manufactures S-LSA Zodiacs along with several other models. Most of their models aren't even offered by Zenith. There is a third company, Zenair, that is tied to both Zenith and AMD. They are responsible for the design work and produce spars for Zenith as well as an unknown (by me) quantity of other parts for Zenith and AMD. Zenair is a Canadian company currently run by Matt Heintz. Zenith is an American company run by Sebastian Heintz. The other two Heintz brothers are involved in Europe (Nick) and California (Michael). Of course, they all have a common father, Chris, and I'm sure they work together to make the world right. Chris is retired and living in France. I think we all owe him a great debt for all the work he did on this problem several years after he retired. There was nobody else in the world even remotely as well qualified as him to be responsible for this work. I understand your rush to complete your plane. I wish you luck. Unfortunately, I'm afraid making Oshkosh next year is overly optimistic. After finishing the airframe you still need to deal with engine, instruments, upholstery, exterior finish, and a bunch of other things. Also, before going to Oshkosh you will need to complete phase I flight testing - a process that will surely take many months and most people I have queried respond it takes about a year. Good luck, Paul XL ready to order upgrade kit. At 10:32 AM 11/14/2009, you wrote: >Paul, I don't think you are saying that Zenith is more concerned >about the AMD planes. The AMD planes are no more important than mine >or yours or anyone elses, and they will all require the same mods, >so all of the how and why and changes will apply to everyone. I >don't think the guys at Zenith are worried about AMD and how it will >get done. We should be all equal here. It would be a terrible move >on Zenith's part to get parts and procedures to AMD ahead of getting >them to the home builders. Home builders are the basis for Zenith to >make the kits for the AMD planes. It's the same plane, we are all in >the same boat, First come first serve. I've got a Credit card ready >as soon as Shirley will take it to get the mod parts here. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 01:45:13 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions From: "chris Sinfield" ALL Well as someone who is past the wings and fuse stage, I can tell you thee is still plenty to do whilst waiting Spend a couple of weeks doing your Electrical / wiring diagrams , start running wires, start making the seats and covers. That will take a few weeks Chris Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272840#272840 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 01:47:08 PM PST US From: "Peter W Johnson" Subject: Zenith-List: Icom A210/iPod Hi Guys, While waiting for my upgrade bits, I have been thinking of incorporating an iPod socket to work with the Icom A210. Anybody know of a suitable wiring diagram? Cheers Peter Wonthaggi Australia http://zodiac.cpc-world.com ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 02:10:23 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions From: "Gig Giacona" I was told (on the phone with Zenith Friday) that there are some errors in the current drawings and the I would not have to drive any solid rivets to do the modifications. -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272849#272849 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 02:54:23 PM PST US From: Terry Phillips Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Icom A210/iPod At 08:45 AM 11/15/2009 +1100, Peter wrote: > >Hi Guys, > >While waiting for my upgrade bits, I have been thinking of incorporating an >iPod socket to work with the Icom A210. Anybody know of a suitable wiring >diagram? > >Cheers > >Peter >Wonthaggi Australia >http://zodiac.cpc-world.com Good question, Peter. I'd like to know if the A210 has this capability. The cable connection diagram, step 6, shows 3 pins to auxilliary audio 1, 2, & 3 from an "audio control panel", but I cannot find anything in the documentation or even in the sales brochure that mentions this capability. I suspect that you'll need to go to the manufacturer to find out just what can be connected. I looked at the PS Engineering PMA9000EX control panel, but at $1900 USD, it's too pricey for me. More reasonable is the Sigtronics 200S, which allows the connection to the A210 for "only" $199, or $279 for stereo. I've attached an installation doc. Let us know what you decide to do. I've got an A210 in the garage that I'm definitely planning to use in my 601. Terry Terry Phillips ZBAGer ttp44~at~rkymtn.net Corvallis MT ZU-601XL/Jab 3300 s .. l .. o .. o .. w build kit - Tail & flaps are done; Balancing the ailerons and working on the wings http://www.mykitlog.com/N47TP/ ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 03:36:54 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions From: "lwhitlow" Well I'm a lot farther along than that The panel in in and wired, the engine is mounted, wired hooked up and except for a fuel line and oil in the crankcase ready to run. I've got the interior underway. All of the surfaces are ready to mount. Canopy is done and off to the side waiting for final assembly I really only have the exterior brake lines and that's not a big job. My plan WAS to use the time over the holidays to get everything mounted except the wings, Haul it over to the airport to fit the wings and then be ready to taxi test I really only had 6-8 weeks of part time work to get done. No biggie on time here I still have plenty to get the mods done and get it signed off and fly off the test time before Oshkosh. I'm probably gonna polish it now and paint later. But if I have the time... I just found Matt's Q&A and it looks like a lot of these questions are already asked and answered. I'm just happy the clouds are clearing over the 601 Larry Very Optimistic Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272859#272859 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 03:37:20 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions From: "lwhitlow" Things are looking up!! Thanks Gig!! Larry Gig Giacona wrote: > I was told (on the phone with Zenith Friday) that there are some errors in the current drawings and the I would not have to drive any solid rivets to do the modifications. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272860#272860 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 03:41:18 PM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Part 5 is up on the zenith.aero site and I have questions From: "lwhitlow" Ohh Kind sir All i have left in the interior is the seats Electrical is 99% done I do have to cut install and rig the control cables but they would be in the way right now with the center section mod so I'll hold on those. I'm gonna pull the sticks and the center section console tomorrow to start opening up the area. I was closer to the finish line but now I'm still close its just moved a little farther down the road Larry Very Optimistic chris Sinfield wrote: > ALL > Well as someone who is past the wings and fuse stage, I can tell you thee is still plenty to do whilst waiting > Spend a couple of weeks doing your Electrical / wiring diagrams , start running wires, start making the seats and covers. That will take a few weeks > Chris Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272861#272861 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 05:42:18 PM PST US From: "Peter W Johnson" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Icom A210/iPod Terry, I have left a connection for the "Audio" out of the wiring loom for this. I don't want an extra intercom. Icom have this already. One quick and dirty I've seen is to wire the iPod output to the mike socket. Cheers Peter -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Terry Phillips Sent: Sunday, 15 November 2009 9:45 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Icom A210/iPod At 08:45 AM 11/15/2009 +1100, Peter wrote: >--> > >Hi Guys, > >While waiting for my upgrade bits, I have been thinking of >incorporating an iPod socket to work with the Icom A210. Anybody know >of a suitable wiring diagram? > >Cheers > >Peter >Wonthaggi Australia >http://zodiac.cpc-world.com Good question, Peter. I'd like to know if the A210 has this capability. The cable connection diagram, step 6, shows 3 pins to auxilliary audio 1, 2, & 3 from an "audio control panel", but I cannot find anything in the documentation or even in the sales brochure that mentions this capability. I suspect that you'll need to go to the manufacturer to find out just what can be connected. I looked at the PS Engineering PMA9000EX control panel, but at $1900 USD, it's too pricey for me. More reasonable is the Sigtronics 200S, which allows the connection to the A210 for "only" $199, or $279 for stereo. I've attached an installation doc. Let us know what you decide to do. I've got an A210 in the garage that I'm definitely planning to use in my 601. Terry Terry Phillips ZBAGer ttp44~at~rkymtn.net Corvallis MT ZU-601XL/Jab 3300 s .. l .. o .. o .. w build kit - Tail & flaps are done; Balancing the ailerons and working on the wings http://www.mykitlog.com/N47TP/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.