Today's Message Index:
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1. 07:20 AM - Re: Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible (n801bh@netzero.com)
2. 10:33 AM - Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible (Viking)
3. 11:00 AM - Re: Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible (Steve Freeman)
4. 11:31 AM - Re: Viking (skyjeep701)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible |
Jan wrote "
Anyone not supporting a 50% cheaper, yet more powerful and better runnin
g engine, by
being able to wait for some time for delivery, either think we are liars
, want to spend a
lot more or do not believe in our mission of making aviation less expens
ive for EVERYONE.
This kind of thinking occurring, even with substantial information on t
he company web
site, as well as on a Yahoo forum, that engines are going out the door,
that customers
are getting engines and that specific installations are being documented
, etc. I have
understanding for not being happy about being the last to receive the en
gine, however,
someone has to be first, someone last. If we had 200 engines in stock,
this would be no
issue, but for now, we do not. "
The Viking is was / is advertised as a bolt on firewall forward package.
Failing to deliver a product after the customer has paid in full is not
the best business model to hang your hat on. Now, if you want to get up
front seed money for R&D, your rent, payroll and a lump of ohter expens
es then you should treat the "cumtomers" as INVESTORS because that is cl
early what they are. They should expect better pricing, some form of sto
ck option, dividend checks when you dream pans out, etc. If the 5 engine
order was really promised to the shipped 8 months ago and failed to del
iver then in my opinion, they have every right to complain and warn othe
r potential buyers of that extended delay.
I am in the same business altho in an entirely different horsepower rang
e and I am doing all of my R&D on my dime. When the product is ready onl
y then will I offer it for sale. But thats just my personal outlook on b
usiness and I can sleep damn good at night by not working off other peop
les money...... Just look at the recent demise of Bud Warren... The pote
ntial of all those buyers waiting for engines are probably pretty slim g
iven the set of circumstances surrounding that tragic accident. Just
my .02 cents worth....
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Viking" <Eaainc@aol.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible
I am not sure why some in aviation want to dig their own grave. To answ
er the "return" of 5 engine question bluntly - it is impossible.
We are NOT GM. We are a small company that for this first batch of engi
nes put every dime into production. Believing in ourselves, right smack
amids of the worst economic downturn in late history. And we are succe
eding.
Anyone not supporting a 50% cheaper, yet more powerful and better runnin
g engine, by being able to wait for some time for delivery, either think
we are liars, want to spend a lot more or do not believe in our mission
of making aviation less expensive for EVERYONE. This kind of thinking
occurring, even with substantial information on the company web site, as
well as on a Yahoo forum, that engines are going out the door, that cus
tomers are getting engines and that specific installations are being doc
umented, etc. I have understanding for not being happy about being the
last to receive the engine, however, someone has to be first, someone la
st. If we had 200 engines in stock, this would be no issue, but for now
, we do not.
You have no right to be selfish. You have an obligation to support our
efforts. Our efforts are for all of you, not for me. With the stress I
have associated with delivery, safety, financial, flight testing, etc.,
I should just go work for Wall Mart and be happy :)
Our efforts are 100% based on bringing aviation back on track, using the
most powerful tool I can think of: An engine, made to be affordable, s
o the 100+ different light sport aircraft designed in the last few years
have a fighting chance to sell a few copies. Don't you see what is hap
pening? Aviation is dying due the cost of getting, or staying involved.
You are all responsible for assisting in this. Or be happy with $18-28,
000 100hp engine packages. The positive side of this is that we do have
these kinds of customers. Some will call or write, making sure we have
what we need to continue. Some will pay ahead, with a note "I have bee
n in business for myself and know what it is like to keep cash flow goin
g, especially during times of prototyping and early production". This d
oes not go unnoticed. Others will provide their airplanes for the first
installations, etc.
About promises for delivery: I am a very optimistic individual. If I b
elieve we can get engines out in May, I say we can get engines out in Ma
y. Unfortunately, for me, we live in the real world. Parts are delaye
d, we learn something that we would like to implement onto the engines,
etc. If those waiting only knew the benefits of doing so. I have learn
ed a long time ago, I will take the flack for being late, over deliverin
g prior to being ready. If engines all went out on time, the business
plan could work and I could pay myself a salary. Wouldn't that be nice.
Negativity: Stop the negativity and be exited. If you have no idea of
what you are talking about, then don't. If you want to be a forum "expe
rt" on all issues, then visit and fly the Viking. Or see one for yourse
lf at Oshkosh. It is an incredible engine package. I am sure you will
have a lot to write about, and it will be constructive. Throwing out st
uff like "I don't think it is any good because I saw some computer gener
ated pictures" does not help aviation. Nor does it reflect on the curre
ncy of your information. If someone has missed the last year, the Vikin
g is now flying in several aircraft and is scheduled to fly in several m
ore.
The Viking movement need positive thinkers. It needs people that have s
ome guts and faith. Two times now, we have had such pioneering individu
als drop their planes at the factory, remove the existing engines and ha
ve faith in flying home with a lesser expensive, more powerful and overa
ll better engine, and two times it has successfully happened. Next is a
Sonex.
Jan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=345837#345837
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Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible |
I am happy for you that you have the money to do so. We also had a flying aircraft
prior to selling anything.
Jan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=345927#345927
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible |
Will you folks please take this off list?
It is pretty apparent to anyone watching what is going. But the petty
bickering is of no value to anyone.
Steve
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Viking
Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 10:28 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible
I am happy for you that you have the money to do so. We also had a flying
aircraft prior to selling anything.
Jan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=345927#345927
Message 4
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I feel I must hop in and add my experience with Viking Aircraft Engines to this
discussion. I am a very satisfied Viking engine owner powering my 701. It should
soon be on its way to OSH. for examination by anyone interested. Jan explained
in his online communications several times that his priority was to make
this engine as fully developed as possible before they made their way all
over the country. He has answered and returned my calls ( though I try to keep
them to a minimum ) and answered any emails I have sent. I have been to his
shop and I am impressed with his operation, capabilities, and low overhead which
is what we should appreciate as it keeps our costs lower.
I have owned my own businesses for nearly 40 years and I see nothing with Viking
engine which causes me concern. I saw many engines in process very near to
being shipped out.
I am already thinking of my next project which will have a Viking Aircraft engine
on it and wondering if I should put a deposit on it to lock up a very good
price.
Just my 2 cents worth,
Skyjeep701
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=345940#345940
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