---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 07/11/11: 4 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:20 AM - Re: Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible (n801bh@netzero.com) 2. 10:33 AM - Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible (Viking) 3. 11:00 AM - Re: Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible (Steve Freeman) 4. 11:31 AM - Re: Viking (skyjeep701) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:20:26 AM PST US From: "n801bh@netzero.com" Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible Jan wrote " Anyone not supporting a 50% cheaper, yet more powerful and better runnin g engine, by being able to wait for some time for delivery, either think we are liars , want to spend a lot more or do not believe in our mission of making aviation less expens ive for EVERYONE. This kind of thinking occurring, even with substantial information on t he company web site, as well as on a Yahoo forum, that engines are going out the door, that customers are getting engines and that specific installations are being documented , etc. I have understanding for not being happy about being the last to receive the en gine, however, someone has to be first, someone last. If we had 200 engines in stock, this would be no issue, but for now, we do not. " The Viking is was / is advertised as a bolt on firewall forward package. Failing to deliver a product after the customer has paid in full is not the best business model to hang your hat on. Now, if you want to get up front seed money for R&D, your rent, payroll and a lump of ohter expens es then you should treat the "cumtomers" as INVESTORS because that is cl early what they are. They should expect better pricing, some form of sto ck option, dividend checks when you dream pans out, etc. If the 5 engine order was really promised to the shipped 8 months ago and failed to del iver then in my opinion, they have every right to complain and warn othe r potential buyers of that extended delay. I am in the same business altho in an entirely different horsepower rang e and I am doing all of my R&D on my dime. When the product is ready onl y then will I offer it for sale. But thats just my personal outlook on b usiness and I can sleep damn good at night by not working off other peop les money...... Just look at the recent demise of Bud Warren... The pote ntial of all those buyers waiting for engines are probably pretty slim g iven the set of circumstances surrounding that tragic accident. Just my .02 cents worth.... Ben Haas N801BH www.haaspowerair.com ---------- Original Message ---------- From: "Viking" Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible I am not sure why some in aviation want to dig their own grave. To answ er the "return" of 5 engine question bluntly - it is impossible. We are NOT GM. We are a small company that for this first batch of engi nes put every dime into production. Believing in ourselves, right smack amids of the worst economic downturn in late history. And we are succe eding. Anyone not supporting a 50% cheaper, yet more powerful and better runnin g engine, by being able to wait for some time for delivery, either think we are liars, want to spend a lot more or do not believe in our mission of making aviation less expensive for EVERYONE. This kind of thinking occurring, even with substantial information on the company web site, as well as on a Yahoo forum, that engines are going out the door, that cus tomers are getting engines and that specific installations are being doc umented, etc. I have understanding for not being happy about being the last to receive the engine, however, someone has to be first, someone la st. If we had 200 engines in stock, this would be no issue, but for now , we do not. You have no right to be selfish. You have an obligation to support our efforts. Our efforts are for all of you, not for me. With the stress I have associated with delivery, safety, financial, flight testing, etc., I should just go work for Wall Mart and be happy :) Our efforts are 100% based on bringing aviation back on track, using the most powerful tool I can think of: An engine, made to be affordable, s o the 100+ different light sport aircraft designed in the last few years have a fighting chance to sell a few copies. Don't you see what is hap pening? Aviation is dying due the cost of getting, or staying involved. You are all responsible for assisting in this. Or be happy with $18-28, 000 100hp engine packages. The positive side of this is that we do have these kinds of customers. Some will call or write, making sure we have what we need to continue. Some will pay ahead, with a note "I have bee n in business for myself and know what it is like to keep cash flow goin g, especially during times of prototyping and early production". This d oes not go unnoticed. Others will provide their airplanes for the first installations, etc. About promises for delivery: I am a very optimistic individual. If I b elieve we can get engines out in May, I say we can get engines out in Ma y. Unfortunately, for me, we live in the real world. Parts are delaye d, we learn something that we would like to implement onto the engines, etc. If those waiting only knew the benefits of doing so. I have learn ed a long time ago, I will take the flack for being late, over deliverin g prior to being ready. If engines all went out on time, the business plan could work and I could pay myself a salary. Wouldn't that be nice. Negativity: Stop the negativity and be exited. If you have no idea of what you are talking about, then don't. If you want to be a forum "expe rt" on all issues, then visit and fly the Viking. Or see one for yourse lf at Oshkosh. It is an incredible engine package. I am sure you will have a lot to write about, and it will be constructive. Throwing out st uff like "I don't think it is any good because I saw some computer gener ated pictures" does not help aviation. Nor does it reflect on the curre ncy of your information. If someone has missed the last year, the Vikin g is now flying in several aircraft and is scheduled to fly in several m ore. The Viking movement need positive thinkers. It needs people that have s ome guts and faith. Two times now, we have had such pioneering individu als drop their planes at the factory, remove the existing engines and ha ve faith in flying home with a lesser expensive, more powerful and overa ll better engine, and two times it has successfully happened. Next is a Sonex. Jan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=345837#345837 ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ____________________________________________________________ Get Free Email with Video Mail & Video Chat! http://www.netzero.net/freeemail?refcd=NZTAGOUT1FREM0210 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:33:07 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible From: "Viking" I am happy for you that you have the money to do so. We also had a flying aircraft prior to selling anything. Jan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=345927#345927 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 11:00:05 AM PST US From: "Steve Freeman" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible Will you folks please take this off list? It is pretty apparent to anyone watching what is going. But the petty bickering is of no value to anyone. Steve Do Not Archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Viking Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 10:28 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Viking - no cancellatio possible I am happy for you that you have the money to do so. We also had a flying aircraft prior to selling anything. Jan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=345927#345927 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 11:31:10 AM PST US Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Viking From: "skyjeep701" I feel I must hop in and add my experience with Viking Aircraft Engines to this discussion. I am a very satisfied Viking engine owner powering my 701. It should soon be on its way to OSH. for examination by anyone interested. Jan explained in his online communications several times that his priority was to make this engine as fully developed as possible before they made their way all over the country. He has answered and returned my calls ( though I try to keep them to a minimum ) and answered any emails I have sent. I have been to his shop and I am impressed with his operation, capabilities, and low overhead which is what we should appreciate as it keeps our costs lower. I have owned my own businesses for nearly 40 years and I see nothing with Viking engine which causes me concern. I saw many engines in process very near to being shipped out. I am already thinking of my next project which will have a Viking Aircraft engine on it and wondering if I should put a deposit on it to lock up a very good price. Just my 2 cents worth, Skyjeep701 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=345940#345940 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.