---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith601-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 11/16/08: 14 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 0. 12:48 AM - What's My Contribution Used For? (Matt Dralle) 1. 01:05 PM - Flap Switch Wiring (Bill Pagan) 2. 02:08 PM - Re: Flap Switch Wiring (Dirk Zahtilla) 3. 02:20 PM - Re: Flap Switch Wiring (jaybannist@cs.com) 4. 02:36 PM - Re: Flap Switch Wiring (Craig Payne) 5. 02:49 PM - Re: Flap Switch Wiring (eddies) 6. 02:59 PM - Re: All 601XL grounded in Netherlands (Jugle) 7. 03:07 PM - Re: Flap Switch Wiring (Craig Payne) 8. 04:10 PM - Re: Re: All 601XL grounded in Netherlands (LarryMcFarland) 9. 05:24 PM - Re: Flap Switch Wiring (Dirk Zahtilla) 10. 06:01 PM - Re: Re: All 601XL grounded in Netherlands (Terry Phillips) 11. 07:26 PM - Gasolator and Fuel pump location (AZFlyer) 12. 07:36 PM - Re: Gasolator and Fuel pump location (Jay Maynard) 13. 07:54 PM - Re: Gasolator and Fuel pump location (Paul Mulwitz) ________________________________ Message 0 _____________________________________ Time: 12:48:22 AM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Zenith601-List: What's My Contribution Used For? Dear Listers, Some have asked, "What's my Contribution used for?" and that's a good question. Here are just a few examples of what your direct List support enables. It provides for the very expensive, commercial-grade T1 Internet connection used on the List insuring maximum performance and minimal contention when accessing List services. It pays for the regular system hardware and software upgrades enabling the highest performance possible for services such as the Archive Search Engine, List Browser, and Forums. It pays for 19+ years worth of online archive data available for instant random search and access. And, it offsets the many hours spent writing, developing, and maintaining the custom applications that power this List Service such as the List Browse, Search Engine, Forums, Wiki and PhotoShare. But most importantly, your List Contribution enables a forum where you and your peers can communicate freely in an environment that is free from moderation, censorship, advertising, commercialism, SPAM, and computer viruses. How many places on the Internet can you make all those statements these days? It is YOUR CONTRIBUTION that directly enables these many aspects of these valuable List services. Please support it today with your List Contribution. Its one of the best investments you can make in your Sport... List Contribution Web Site: http://www.matronics.com/contribution Thank you for your support! Matt Dralle Email List Administrator ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:05:59 PM PST US From: Bill Pagan Subject: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring OK, my stupid factor is in high gear today.- I'm having difficulty with the flap switch wiring as shown on 6B-20.- I've attached a copy.- Somebody help me out, as I can't seem to get it right.- I see that the black wire from the flap motor goes to the #1 lug.- Red goes to number 3 lug.- Ground goes to #2.- Hot wire from the buss goes to 5 Beyond that I get confused.- I've attached the diagram. Bill Pagan =0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:08:03 PM PST US From: "Dirk Zahtilla" Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring Hi Bill, You forgot to ask a question... If you want, call me at 775-671-0852 and I'll talk you through the wiring here. Essentially the ground section of the switch is traded with the power section to reverse the direction of the motor, and the limit switches interupt the power whenever they are used on the power side. I'd like to know why your plans, from 2005 have the limit switches and my plans from 2008 do not? Dirk Z. Carson City ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Pagan To: zenith601-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 1:05 PM Subject: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring OK, my stupid factor is in high gear today. I'm having difficulty with the flap switch wiring as shown on 6B-20. I've attached a copy. Somebody help me out, as I can't seem to get it right. I see that the black wire from the flap motor goes to the #1 lug. Red goes to number 3 lug. Ground goes to #2. Hot wire from the buss goes to 5 Beyond that I get confused. I've attached the diagram. Bill Pagan ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:20:25 PM PST US Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring From: jaybannist@cs.com Dirk, There was a change in the flap actuation system.? The older system has the flap motor drive a screw which extends the actuator tube and the actuator arm.? The tube has a collar at the screw end that actuates the limit switches. I don't know that much about the newer system, but understand that it is called a "linear actuator" and does away with the limit switches. Jay in Dallas Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: Dirk Zahtilla Sent: Sun, 16 Nov 2008 4:07 pm Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring Hi Bill, You forgot to ask a question... If you want, call me at 775-671-0852 and I'll talk you through the wiring here. ? Essentially the ground section of the switch is traded with the power section to reverse the direction of the motor, and the limit switches interupt the power whenever they are used on the power side. ? I'd like to know why your plans, from 2005 have the limit switches and my plans from 2008 do not? Dirk Z. Carson City ? ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Pagan Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 1:05 PM Subject: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring OK, my stupid factor is in high gear today.? I'm having difficulty with the flap switch wiring as shown on 6B-20.? I've attached a copy.? Somebody help me out, as I can't seem to get it right.? I see that the black wire from the flap motor goes to the #1 lug.? Red goes to number 3 lug.? Ground goes to #2.? Hot wire from the buss goes to 5 Beyond that I get confused.? I've attached the diagram. Bill Pagan ________________________________________________________________________ Email message sent from CompuServe - visit us today at http://www.cs.com ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 02:36:45 PM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring > I'd like to know why your plans, from 2005 have the limit switches and my plans from 2008 do not? Because Zenith replaced the "open" flap actuator (with exposed micro-switches that you have to wire yourself) with a "sealed" unit where the limits switches are hidden and pre-wired (picture attached). Also unless there is some adjustment inside the casing on the new style actuator there is no adjustment. Plans page for new style actuator here: http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6b19.pdf Photo guide showing old style actuator here: http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6-b-19.pdf -- Craig ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 02:49:09 PM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: Flap Switch Wiring From: "eddies" Hi Bill, Sorry if this is stating the obvious... Start with your flap switch (the one you will mount in the panel of your aircraft), it can be oriented in any direction, just choose a set of contacts that will be your up and the other to be your down position and stick with this for all the wiring you do. This will all be done looking at the back of the switch. Your limit switches should be labeled to indicate which is the common, normally open (NO) and normally closed (NC) connections. If not use a multi meter set to ohms to determine the orientation. Start your wiring by connecting your Black or negative wires first; 1. Black wire (aircraft ground) to pin 2 of your flap switch (center right hand pin on your flap switch) 2. Black wire from pin 1 of the flap switch (bottom right hand pin) to the normally closed pin of the flap UP limit switch, this will be the switch that is closest to your pilots seat. 3. Run the black wire from the flap motor back to normally closed pin on the same limit switch we just wired in step 2 above. 4. Black wire (aircraft ground) from pin 3 (top right pin of your flap switch) to the common pin of the flap down limit switch (this switch should be the one furthest from your pilots seat). 5. Run the red wire from you flap motor back to the same common pin that was connected in step 4 above. Now we run the 12V positive wiring 1. Red wire (from aircraft 12V buss) to pin 5 of your flap switch (center left hand pin). 2. Run a Red wire from pin 4 (bottom left hand pin on your flap switch) to the normally closed pin of the flap down limit switch farthest from your pilot seat. 3. Run a Red wire from pin 6 (top left pin) of your flap switch to the common pin of the flap up limit switch, this is the switch closest to your pilots seat. Thats it you should be done and have a working set of flaps. Cheers Eddie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=214594#214594 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 02:59:19 PM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: All 601XL grounded in Netherlands From: "Jugle" Can someone please clarify? As I understand it the CZAW 601s have a lower MTOW and are built from lighter material in some areas, correct? So, obviously the cable tensions need to be correct regardless, but does this mean the CZAW versions are more susceptible to the problem? Glenn. -------- Glenn Andressen 601XL- Rudder, Stabiliser partially completed, Wing ribs, nose ribs done, numerous other parts made. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=214595#214595 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 03:07:54 PM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring Here is what is inside the new flap actuator. The position of the limit switch nearest the motor is fixed but the one away from the motor is mounted on a circuit board that is glued into a channel. If you reglued it you could decrease the travel by up to about 0.5 inches. From the factory the travel is 2 and 1/8th inches or 54mm. -- Craig From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Craig Payne Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 3:36 PM Subject: RE: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring > I'd like to know why your plans, from 2005 have the limit switches and my plans from 2008 do not? Because Zenith replaced the "open" flap actuator (with exposed micro-switches that you have to wire yourself) with a "sealed" unit where the limits switches are hidden and pre-wired (picture attached). Also unless there is some adjustment inside the casing on the new style actuator there is no adjustment. Plans page for new style actuator here: http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6b19.pdf Photo guide showing old style actuator here: http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6-b-19.pdf -- Craig ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 04:10:34 PM PST US From: LarryMcFarland Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Re: All 601XL grounded in Netherlands Glenn, You are correct about the materials and MTOW, so would it not be more a risk to those who would load to US standards by mistake or assume the aircraft to be the same after the fact. This would be easier to understand if they used Internet to read Zenith specifications. The casual thought that these aircraft were the same construction might be a dangerous one for the European built and Mfg aircraft. Doubt cable tensions had anything to do with the problems nor a solution for the problems of concern either. Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com Jugle wrote: > > Can someone please clarify? > > As I understand it the CZAW 601s have a lower MTOW and are built from lighter material in some areas, correct? > > So, obviously the cable tensions need to be correct regardless, but does this mean the CZAW versions are more susceptible to the problem? > > Glenn. > > -------- > Glenn Andressen > 601XL- Rudder, Stabiliser partially completed, Wing ribs, nose ribs done, numerous other parts made. > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 05:24:21 PM PST US From: "Dirk Zahtilla" Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring Thanks for the info about the new actuator! Dirk ----- Original Message ----- From: Craig Payne To: zenith601-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 3:07 PM Subject: RE: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring Here is what is inside the new flap actuator. The position of the limit switch nearest the motor is fixed but the one away from the motor is mounted on a circuit board that is glued into a channel. If you reglued it you could decrease the travel by up to about 0.5 inches. From the factory the travel is 2 and 1/8th inches or 54mm. -- Craig From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Craig Payne Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 3:36 PM To: zenith601-list@matronics.com Subject: RE: Zenith601-List: Flap Switch Wiring > I'd like to know why your plans, from 2005 have the limit switches and my plans from 2008 do not? Because Zenith replaced the "open" flap actuator (with exposed micro-switches that you have to wire yourself) with a "sealed" unit where the limits switches are hidden and pre-wired (picture attached). Also unless there is some adjustment inside the casing on the new style actuator there is no adjustment. Plans page for new style actuator here: http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6b19.pdf Photo guide showing old style actuator here: http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6-b-19.pdf -- Craig ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:01:09 PM PST US From: Terry Phillips Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Re: All 601XL grounded in Netherlands Glenn You are right. CZAW 601XL's are lighter. But, they are lighter in only one place: The landing gear. CZAW used the composite gear sold by Aircraft Spruce. The Aircraft Spruce landing gear is limited to 550 kg gross, which is less than the Zenair 600 kg (1320 lb) gross. However, I believe that some of the CZAW 601XL's that made it to the US were registered with 600 kg gross. See: http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/lgpages/compositelg.php Other than that, CZAW 601XL's are identical or even beefed up a bit compared to the standard Zenair 601XL. I believe that all CZAW 601XL's use the piano hinged aileron and incorporate the electric aileron trim option. In fact, I believe that if you check with someone who owns a CZAW 601XL, you'll find that the aileron piano hinge has been beefed up beyond the standard Zenair piano hinge. So, if the cable tension is more critical for the CZAW built 601XL's than for the Zenair 601XL's (personally, I do not believe that it is), the difference would evidently lie in the hinges or the trim option. (Note that not all Zenair 601XL's have piano hinges or aileron trim tabs, while all CZAW 601XL's apparently have those options.) Terry At 02:59 PM 11/16/2008 -0800, you wrote: >Can someone please clarify? > >As I understand it the CZAW 601s have a lower MTOW and are built from >lighter material in some areas, correct? > >So, obviously the cable tensions need to be correct regardless, but does >this mean the CZAW versions are more susceptible to the problem? > >Glenn Terry Phillips ZBAGer ttp44~at~rkymtn.net Corvallis MT 601XL/Jab 3300 s .. l .. o .. o .. w build kit - Tail, flaps, & ailerons are done; working on the wings http://www.mykitlog.com/N47TP/ ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 07:26:45 PM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Gasolator and Fuel pump location From: "AZFlyer" Has anybody installed their gasolator and/or electric fuel pump on fwd side of firewall? In one of Bingelis' how-to books he comments that most often this is where those are installed; but the materials with the 601XL and many builders feel it necessary to put a big hole in floor of the cockpit and plumb the gasolator in there. Would like to hear from some of you with experience in this area... Thanks, Mike -------- Mike Miller @ millrml@aol.com 601 XL, 3300, Dynon Remember, "the second mouse gets the cheese"! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=214626#214626 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:36:22 PM PST US From: Jay Maynard Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Gasolator and Fuel pump location On Sun, Nov 16, 2008 at 07:26:08PM -0800, AZFlyer wrote: > Has anybody installed their gasolator and/or electric fuel pump on fwd > side of firewall? AMD mounts the electric fuel pump on the forward side of the firewall, and the gascolator a little ways aft of it. (I think. It's in the center of the fuselage, and you have to get under and behind the leading edge to get to it.) -- Jay Maynard, K5ZC, PP-ASEL http://www.conmicro.com http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net Fairmont, MN (KFRM) (Yes, that's me!) AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC http://www.tronguy.net/N55ZC.shtml ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:54:45 PM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Gasolator and Fuel pump location I put the fuel pump on the firewall, but the gascolator on the cabin floor as indicated on the drawings. The gascolator needs to be at the lowest point of the fuel system, and I don't think you can do that forward of the firewall. Paul XL getting close At 07:26 PM 11/16/2008, you wrote: >Has anybody installed their gasolator and/or electric fuel pump on >fwd side of firewall? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith601-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith601-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith601-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith601-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.