---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith601-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 01/13/09: 15 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:31 AM - Re: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller (K Dilks) 2. 03:29 AM - Re: N601JD First Flight (sdthatcher) 3. 03:36 AM - Re: Some videos of us flying (sdthatcher) 4. 04:55 AM - In-flight opening of front hinged canopy (Frank Derfler) 5. 07:55 AM - Re: Re: Some videos of us flying (Afterfxllc@aol.com) 6. 08:23 AM - Re: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller (stepinwolf) 7. 09:52 AM - Re: In-flight opening of front hinged canopy (Gary Gower) 8. 10:49 AM - Re: In-flight opening of front hinged canopy (Jim Belcher) 9. 11:53 AM - Re: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller (chuck_maggart) 10. 12:52 PM - Re: Re: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller (David Downey) 11. 02:13 PM - Re: In-flight opening of front hinged canopy. BRS Comment (PatrickW) 12. 02:46 PM - Re: Canopy and Cold Weather (shipping) ? (PatrickW) 13. 03:43 PM - Re: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller (Bill Naumuk) 14. 05:09 PM - Re: In-flight opening of front hinged canopy. BRS Comment (Gig Giacona) 15. 05:10 PM - Re: Canopy and Cold Weather (shipping) ? (Gig Giacona) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:31:37 AM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller From: "K Dilks" Although I have only done the tail feathers, I am well happy with the ZAC supplied gun , smooth and quiet. Run 2.5 bar for A4 and 3.2 bar for the A5 rivets, through the compressors regulator. Cheers kev :) -------- Austria ............. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=224438#224438 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:29:24 AM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: N601JD First Flight From: "sdthatcher" I really enjoyed the enthusiasm of your family when you landed. It was a great video and that airport at Spruce Pine looks great. I have my plane over in Andrews, NC. Hope to see you some time. And Jay sure is good at noticing the not so obvious (runway departure and approach). He'd be a great detective. I missed that runway thing completely! johnd(at)data-tech.com wrote: > N601JD my 601XL with a Jabiru 3300 took to the air for the first time > last Friday at Avery County Airport (7A8) in Spruce Pine, NC. Its a > quickbuild kit that I started in April 07. > > The obligatory Youtube video is at > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIVt40B5dLc. Its short and a bit shaky so > be careful if you get motion sickness :-) > > The flight went well with only a couple of minor squawks: > 1. Need to add a stop to the throttle @ low RPMS to prevent the engine > from stopping when the throttle is pulled too far back to idle. The US > Jabiru guys recommend a small cable stop added to the throttle cable at > the carb to prevent this. > 2. Aileron trim is wired backwards, Oops, didn't notice a real need for > the aileron trim though > 3. Experiment with my Sensenich Ground adjustable prop and also > re-jetting the Bing carb to maximize performance. CHTs and EGTs looked > good though, perhaps I wont have to spend too much time messing with > cooling issues. > > Woo hoo, now only 38 more hours till the end of Phase 1... > > If only I had remembered to turn on my in cockpit video recorder, I'll > do that next time...once the darned weather clears up again. > > Thanks to all the list members who helped with questions during the > build process. > > Thanks, > John Davis > Burnsville, NC > N601JD - 601XL/Jab 3300 > Now Flying!!!! -------- Scott Thatcher, Palm Beach Gardens, FL 601XL with Corvair, Registered as E-LSA N601EL, EAA203 25 hours and climbing. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=224450#224450 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:36:29 AM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: Some videos of us flying From: "sdthatcher" Enjoyed the videos and specs during flight. I made my flight from West Palm Beach to NC so was about the same distance. How long did you take to complete the trip? The Corvair sounded great, even if it wasn't my friend William's. I noticed that your tach read 2700? Since I flew pretty much at the same tach setting, I was wondering at what speed you were generally flying? Do Not Archive [quote="Afterfxllc(at)aol.com"]After switching from the front starter kit to the Aerolite rear system we flew from Louisville Ky to spend the night with Bill Clapp then on to Englewood Fl. The flight was great. Here are the #'s Voltage was 14 volts steady Oil pressure was steady 40 lbs Cht's were 125-130 steady and 200-225 climb Egt 1050 steady Oil temp 60 degrees OAT were 255 before the cooler and 190-200 after cooler (with my new fiberglass baffles installed but had some air loss so should see 10 degree drop after sealing.) Here are some youtube links http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tyx2nalW9gs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tyx2nalW9gs) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC4fF0uTuxQ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC4fF0uTuxQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEbz-AK3YU0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEbz-AK3YU0) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JPnUcicz7k (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JPnUcicz7k) Jeff Garrett Louisville Ky. 601XL N962T Aerolite Corvair 90% 601XL N524B Aerolite Corvair 155 Hrs 601XL N2257 Aerolite Corvair 225 Hrs www.aeroliteproducts.com (http://www.aeroliteproducts.com/) www.project601xl.com (http://www.project601xl.com/) www.aerolite.camstreams.com (http://www.aerolite.camstreams.com/) Do not archive A Good Credit 15855013x1201028747/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=DecemailfooterNO62"> See yours in just 2 easy steps! > [b] -------- Scott Thatcher, Palm Beach Gardens, FL 601XL with Corvair, Registered as E-LSA N601EL, EAA203 25 hours and climbing. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=224452#224452 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:55:16 AM PST US From: "Frank Derfler" Subject: Zenith601-List: In-flight opening of front hinged canopy Sabrina - Thanks for your observation that the factory demo has flex hinges. That is important to note. Regarding your "easily removable" canopy, I'm surprised no one has injected the idea of its value in a water landing. Since I fly over water 90% of the time it entered my head. At one time my personal POH included popping the latch before attempting an emergency water landing. But, I later re-wrote that when I discussed the noise, the change of attitude, and the distraction with a guy who regularly opened the 601 canopy as a simulated emergency condition. (THAT part of my personal POH says, "As Slow As You Can Go") So now my emergency water landing procedure says get the canopy open first thing. But, depending on the attitude, that could be challenging. I submit that being able to jettison the canopy quickly after an emergency landing could be a good thing. On the other hand, the whole canopy ejection and bailing out with a seatpack chute on strikes me as ummm... less valuable. (Yes, I know the Skycatcher guy did it and I do not know how!) Sabrina, thanks for your great ideas. Quantum physics, eh? Be prepared for lots of Heisenberg jokes. Frank Derfler AMD-made 601XL with 160 hours Marathon in the Florida Keys -- Twitter! Follow me at http://Twitter.com/Fderfler See my new Novel, "A Glint in Time" at http://GreatGuyBooks.com. See my discussion of All the Guy Toys that aren't (clearly) illegal or (blatantly) immoral at http://mostlyflying.com Anybody who READS (anybody out there?) See www.greatguybooks.com ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:55:19 AM PST US From: Afterfxllc@aol.com Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Re: Some videos of us flying Scott We had a 20 knot head wind the whole way but at 2700 we average 132 to 135 MPH prop pitch at 10.5 degrees and timing set at 28 degrees points and 30 degrees electronic we flew for about 6.5 hours but some of the flight was at 2500 rpm's to let the oil cool from the long climb at gross (wanted to play it safe with the new engine). As you know the rear starter is new but we now have over 200 combined hrs on it on 3 different aircraft 1 of which is Bill Clapps KR with almost 100 hrs on it so I still had a bit of a pucker factor for the first leg of the flight but wanted as much distance from the ground as I could get and 7500 is where we cruised. The last leg of the flight was at 2500 and if I did it again today I would have no problem flying at 1500 to have more fun. Jeff Enjoyed the videos and specs during flight. I made my flight from West Palm Beach to NC so was about the same distance. How long did you take to complete the trip? The Corvair sounded great, even if it wasn't my friend William's. I noticed that your tach read 2700? Since I flew pretty much at the same tach setting, I was wondering at what speed you were generally flying? **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! cemailfooterNO62) ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:23:57 AM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller From: "stepinwolf" A big thank you to all who responded to my call for help. Yesterday evening I was able to find, and correct the problem with my rivet gun. As was mentioned in a previous response, the defect was with the large O-ring on the piston at the top of the handle. it has an O-ring at the rear to seal the oil, and both guns had O-rings that were dried out and hardened. This is why the gun was quitting after a dozen or so rivets, because the oil was leaking pass the O-ring into the stem catcher. Now it is working great, with no oil leaks. There was however one casualty in all this and that is my second gun. While I was rebuilding the first one on the bench I casually pulled the trigger to check how far back the piston was pulling, and when it evacuated the air from the lower canister, it blow the spring from my second gun off the bench, and was never to be seen again. Bob the 701 & 750 scratch Three Rivers, Quebec -------- Live each day, as if it was your last Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=224494#224494 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dscf1006_1280x768_154.jpg ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:52:01 AM PST US From: Gary Gower Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: In-flight opening of front hinged canopy Hello Frank, - That is a good point,- I personally avoid flying over the lake(s) or over the sea farther from gliding distance of the shore, or over towns or citie s. - When emergency landing on water there is a big chance to end with the airpl ane wheels up (mainly landing gear drag on the water or other causes),,,- in this case opening the canopy will be almost impossible.-- How to pu sh the area of the cabin against the resistance of the water?. - Where do you fly?-Why so much- time over water? - in normal flying-person with-no ocean or gulf crossing, -the chances of flying over water (outside gliding distance), and that the engine will f ail in that precise time, are very low statitically,- This to justify-t o have a cabin eject mechanism that can accidentally be pulled by a passeng er.- We all give Young Eagles flights, and kids are kids... - Saludos Gary Gower Flying from Chapala Lake, Mexico. (over the dry side :-) "What is not installed, will not fail" --- On Tue, 1/13/09, Frank Derfler wrote: From: Frank Derfler Subject: Zenith601-List: In-flight opening of front hinged canopy Sabrina -- Thanks for your observation that the factory demo has flex hinges. -That is important to note. - Regarding your "easily removable" canopy, I'm surprised no one has injected the idea of its value in a water landing. -Since I fly over water 90% of the time it entered my head. -At one time my personal POH included poppi ng the latch before attempting an emergency water landing. - But, I later re-wrote that when I discussed the noise, the change of attitude, and the distraction with a guy who regularly opened the 601 canopy as a simulated e mergency condition. -(THAT part of my personal POH says, "As Slow As You Can Go") - So now my emergency water landing procedure says get the canop y open first thing. -But, depending on the attitude, that could be challe nging. - -I submit that being able to jettison the canopy quickly after an emergen cy landing could be a good thing. -On the other hand, the whole canopy ej ection and bailing out with a seatpack chute on strikes me as ummm... less valuable. -(Yes, I know the Skycatcher guy did it and I do not know how!) - Sabrina, thanks for your great ideas. -Quantum physics, eh? -Be prepare d for lots of Heisenberg jokes. - Frank Derfler- AMD-made 601XL with 160 hours- Marathon in the Florida Keys- -- Twitter! Follow me at http://Twitter.com/Fderfler See my new Novel, "A Glint in Time" at http://GreatGuyBooks.com. See my discussion of -All the Guy Toys that aren't (clearly) illegal or ( blatantly) immoral at http://mostlyflying.com - Anybody who READS (anybody out there?) See www.greatguybooks.com =0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:49:20 AM PST US From: Jim Belcher Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: In-flight opening of front hinged canopy On Tuesday 13 January 2009 06:54, Frank Derfler wrote: > Sabrina - > Sabrina, thanks for your great ideas. Quantum physics, eh? Be prepared > for lots of Heisenberg jokes. Being a man of principle, I am uncertain about this. :-) -- ============================================ Do not archive. ============================================ Jim B Belcher BS, MS Physics, Math, Computer Science A&P/IA Retired aerospace technical manager ============================================ ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:53:17 AM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller From: "chuck_maggart" Bob, I used the Zenith supplied rivet puller without any problems at all. They warn you that the case may crack if you use too high of an air pressure. I ended up using a few pounds higher (at the compressor) than they recommended to get the 5/32 stems to snap. Chuck finished and ready to fly -------- Chuck Maggart Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=224544#224544 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 12:52:37 PM PST US From: David Downey Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Re: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller you can sweep with a magnetic "broom".- You can also get down on the floo r and look obliquely across the floor: everything else is "taller" than you r eye so they stand out. David L. Downey Harleysville-(SE) PA, USA --- On Tue, 1/13/09, stepinwolf wrote: From: stepinwolf Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller A big thank you to all who responded to my call for help. Yesterday evening I was able to find, and correct the problem with my rivet gun. As was mentioned in a previous response, the defect was with the larg e O-ring on the piston at the top of the handle. it has an O-ring at the rea r to seal the oil, and both guns had O-rings that were dried out and hardened. This is why the gun was quitting after a dozen or so rivets, because the oi l was leaking pass the O-ring into the stem catcher. Now it is working great , with no oil leaks. There was however one casualty in all this and that is my second gun. Whil e I was rebuilding the first one on the bench I casually pulled the trigger to check how far back the piston was pulling, and when it evacuated the air from the lower canister, it blow the spring from my second gun off the bench, and wa s never to be seen again. Bob the 701 & 750 scratch Three Rivers, Quebec -------- Live each day, as if it was your last Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=224494#224494 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dscf1006_1280x768_154.jpg =0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 02:13:17 PM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: In-flight opening of front hinged canopy. BRS Comment From: "PatrickW" My original - and perhaps too brief - question was pertaining to the actual failure mode of the BRS. We hear all about the BRS "saves". I have not heard much about any BRS failures, and it is those that we who are installing BRS's should examine. I am in the process of installing a BRS in my XL, and am trying to do everything I can up front to stack the odds in my favor in the unlikely event that I or a passenger would ever have to pull that handle. - Patrick -------- Patrick 601XL/Corvair N63PZ (reserved) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=224584#224584 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 02:46:08 PM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: Canopy and Cold Weather (shipping) ? From: "PatrickW" > regarding shipment of that big plastic bubble in the winter? I'll find out soon enough. I ordered my canopy last week, and it shipped today. We're in a cold snap right now, and it isn't going to get above zero for a few days. Was -21 below zero (F) at my house this morning. [Shocked] So if my canopy arrives safely, it should lend confidence to others who are wondering about how well that bubble survives shipping in winter... - Patrick: -------- Patrick 601XL/Corvair N63PZ (reserved) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=224592#224592 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 03:43:25 PM PST US From: "Bill Naumuk" Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller Dirk- No, actually this is a valid topic. Pneumatic riveters set perfect rivets all the time if you can get the buggers to work properly. The operant phrase is "Work Properly". The big advantage is no buck that scratches whatever you're working on. I'd rather use my pneumatic over my hand riveter any day but they are a pain! I think the original post was a cry for help rather than anything else. Give the poster a break. Bill do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dirk Zahtilla" Sent: Monday, January 12, 2009 10:32 PM Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Need help & consuling on Rivet puller > > > God you guys are something else. I have an original "Pop Rivet" brand hand > rivet tool I bought for about 4 bucks in about 1973 and after all those > years of misc. use I've built 2 planes with at least as many rivets as the > 601 and will build my 601 with it as well. > Or maybe I can discuss all the ramifications of the ramistat ad > infinitum... Geez! > > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 05:09:17 PM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: In-flight opening of front hinged canopy. BRS Comment From: "Gig Giacona" PatrickW wrote: > My original - and perhaps too brief - question was pertaining to the actual failure mode of the BRS. > > We hear all about the BRS "saves". I have not heard much about any BRS failures, and it is those that we who are installing BRS's should examine. > > I am in the process of installing a BRS in my XL, and am trying to do everything I can up front to stack the odds in my favor in the unlikely event that I or a passenger would ever have to pull that handle. > > - Patrick Patrick if you are talking about the Skycatcher failure. First the plane was in a flat spin. Second there was some talk that the BRS was not properly mounted. Remember this was a prototype plane not a production version. -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=224631#224631 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 05:10:52 PM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: Canopy and Cold Weather (shipping) ? From: "Gig Giacona" PatrickW wrote: > > > regarding shipment of that big plastic bubble in the winter? > > I'll find out soon enough. I ordered my canopy last week, and it shipped today. > > We're in a cold snap right now, and it isn't going to get above zero for a few days. Was -21 below zero (F) at my house this morning. [Shocked] > > So if my canopy arrives safely, it should lend confidence to others who are wondering about how well that bubble survives shipping in winter... > > - Patrick Really Really Really Really don't try to do any work mounting the canopy until it is about 90 degrees warmer. -------- W.R. "Gig" Giacona 601XL Under Construction See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=224632#224632 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith601-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith601-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith601-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith601-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.