Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:04 AM - Re: Re: Should the Modification Kit Be Free? (Iberplanes IGL)
2. 12:15 AM - Re: Re: Should the Modification Kit Be Free? (Paul Mulwitz)
3. 05:17 AM - Re: Should the Modification Kit Be Free? (mhubel)
4. 05:34 AM - update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (fritz)
5. 05:37 AM - Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (Robert Pelland)
6. 05:47 AM - Warning - Slightly off topic - Yankee vs. Zodiac and specsmanship. (Paul Mulwitz)
7. 06:18 AM - Re: Warning - Slightly off topic - Yankee vs. Zodiac and specs (mhubel)
8. 06:59 AM - Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (Stephen R. Look)
9. 09:12 AM - Spar Cap Bolts (dougsire)
10. 10:08 AM - Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (Rick Lindstrom)
11. 11:36 AM - Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (William Dominguez)
12. 12:02 PM - Re: Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (Bill Pagan)
13. 12:04 PM - Re: Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (Rick Lindstrom)
14. 12:24 PM - Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (Elden Jacobson)
15. 12:55 PM - Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (Davcoberly@wmconnect.com)
16. 02:11 PM - Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (Randy)
17. 02:18 PM - Re: FAA grounds 601 and 650 (Terry Phillips)
18. 02:50 PM - Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (dougsire)
19. 02:58 PM - Re: Retrofitting Wing Lockers with the Upgrade (GLJSOJ1)
20. 03:04 PM - Re: FAA grounds 601 and 650 (Jim Belcher)
21. 03:13 PM - Re: Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs (Terry Turnquist)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Should the Modification Kit Be Free? |
I=B4ll pay without hesitation.
bye,
Alberto Martin
www.iberplanes.es
Igualada - Barcelona - Spain
----------------------------------------------
Zodiac 601 XL Builder
Serial: 6-7011
Tail Kit: Finished
Wings: Not Started
Fuselage: Started
Engine: Jabiru 3300
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Should the Modification Kit Be Free? |
Actually, I learned when I had to scrap my first wing and order
replacement parts to build another one that Zenith didn't make spars
at all. The spars were made for them by Zenair.
If I understood the drawings at all, there is not much being done to
the center section that relates to its original construction. We are
adding another piece, a doubler, to the top of the center section and
adding vertical reinforcements. It doesn't look difficult to do at
all. We will need to remove the seats to add reinforcements to them
that mate to the new parts on the top of the center section. The
additions to the wings will be considerably more difficult to
do. They require removal of a large portion of the skin and might
also involve removing rear ribs.
In any case, I'm sure you can get Zenith to perform the adjustments
to your center section. All you need to do is remove the whole thing
and ship it back to them along with a fee for the work.
Paul
At 10:01 PM 11/9/2009, you wrote:
>I don't know about your kit but my center spar and wing spars were
>completely built by Zenith. All I had to do was to mount the center
>spar and attach some parts to the wing spars. Now Zenith wanted me
>to remove those parts so that I could "fix" the spars that Zenith
>built. Something was wrong with that picture! I couldn't imagine
>those with Zenith quick built kit would feel. We all had to sign
>the contract to make purchases with Zenith but that would not
>completely release Zenith from liability as we shall see in pending
>and upcoming lawsuits.
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Should the Modification Kit Be Free? |
Basically I support Zenith and in this business, the best I can expect is what
apparently has happened, the engineering was done although I don't fully think
the correct issues were all addressed.
Having said that, I must express my disappointment in some issues with the 601
line. I will admit that when I selected it, perhaps I should have done more due
diligence. First and probably of most significance to the current issue, when
I saw the 6G number in the brochure, I assumed it had the same meaning as every
production plane I have flown. There the only advertised G number I have seen
is one the aircraft is designed to operate at on a regular basis. In that
light 6G is near acrobatic strength, I thought this is indestructible. I didn't
understand the meaning of the new term "ultimate" until I got the kit.
Secondly, the performance numbers in the factory brochure are a bit misleading.
They talk about a 120 knot cruse aircraft with the Jabiru 3300 engine. What is
not said is that this number is not at the normal 75% cruse power but at full
throttle. Yes the engine allows that but no aircraft engine that I know of will
last long if used at full throttle for extended periods. This does not count
the 10 GPH fuel rate. I don't call that "cruse".
At the moment the plane is to be dis-assembled and put in the corner of the hanger.
The prime spot will be occupied by a Grumman AA-1 if I can find one. It is
so strong that the people would probably be flattened before the wing complains.
If all this blows over and one can get reasonable liability insurance in
the future, the updates might be done. Otherwise, there will be an engine and
radios with a big metal bracket for sale.
--------
Mark Hubelbank
N708HU
CH601XL
Jabiru 3300
Rotec TBI 40 carb
Sensenich ground adj prop.
41 hr TAF
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272062#272062
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| Subject: | update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
could someone please provide the link (s) that shows or expains the
"required mods"?
Thank you in advance.
Fritz--- do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "mhubel" <mhubel@nemon.com>
Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 2:55 PM
Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: The real work of the update on the CH601XL
>
> I figure one takes any personal estimate and double it to get to reality.
> That is how I got 200 hours.
>
> Even assuming we do all this. will anyone write insurance for it after?
> That is not at all clear.
>
> Anyone want an engine, and radios with a big metal bracket attached?
>
> --------
> Mark Hubelbank
> N708HU
> CH601XL
> Jabiru 3300
> Rotec TBI 40 carb
> Sensenich ground adj prop.
> 41 hr TAF
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=271961#271961
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
Try this,
http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6-ZU-1-2-3%20NOV%208.pdf
it should get you there
Robert
----- Original Message -----
From: fritz
To: zenith601-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 8:30 AM
Subject: Zenith601-List: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs
could someone please provide the link (s) that shows or expains the
"required mods"?
Thank you in advance.
Fritz--- do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "mhubel" <mhubel@nemon.com>
To: <zenith601-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 2:55 PM
Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: The real work of the update on the
CH601XL
>
> I figure one takes any personal estimate and double it to get to
reality.
> That is how I got 200 hours.
>
> Even assuming we do all this. will anyone write insurance for it
after?
> That is not at all clear.
>
> Anyone want an engine, and radios with a big metal bracket attached?
>
> --------
> Mark Hubelbank
> N708HU
> CH601XL
> Jabiru 3300
> Rotec TBI 40 carb
> Sensenich ground adj prop.
> 41 hr TAF
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=271961#271961
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Warning - Slightly off topic - Yankee vs. Zodiac and |
specsmanship.
Hi Mark,
Like you, I have always liked the Yankee. I got a demo ride in one
ca. 1967 when it was a shiny new entry into the light plane
market. Its roll rate was so fast you could get a special kind of dizzy.
Unfortunately, it developed a horrible accident record. Probably
because of the very high stall speed and small wings (that made it
handle with so much spirit) it was beyond the skill level of many of
the low time pilots who were attracted to it. I agree with your
comment it had a strong structure, but its handling was just too
"Good". Its follow on 4-place design, the AA-5 just never made a big
hit on the market. In my experience, the quality of the factory
built AA-5s just wasn't very good - too many rattling parts.
The Zodiac XL is a departure from the Zodiac line in a couple of
ways. The biggest visible change is the long tapered wing instead of
the shorter bent wing of previous models. The current list of
updates being handed out to American owners suggests this wing change
was not engineered with the same robustness as the previous
models. We all hope the update fixes this shortcoming and the plane
recovers its leadership position in the market.
The other big change in the XL is the early adoption of the LSA
concept and performance specifications. This caused several years of
continual changing in the design and the specifications. The LSA
standard kept changing before final adoption and the XL design kept
trying to keep up with the limits of the changes. This is only part
of the reason for big changes in XL specifications. The other one is
the normal tendency airplane designers and sellers have to give their
product more attractive numbers than are justified. This is not a
new phenomenon.
In practice, I don't think the difference between any airplane's real
performance and it's glossy brochure numbers are a big deal. One of
my friends makes a handsome living ferrying airplanes around the
country. He says the only way to get improved average speed is to
extend each flight to the maximum length of time. The time to land,
refuel, eat and smell the roses between flight legs is a lot more
significant than the small differences in airspeed that happen as you
adjust the throttle and mixture. I understand it is an issue to get
really high airspeed numbers. This makes me feel good too. Alas,
this is one of the least important characteristics of any plane.
I respect your choice to have your plane taken apart and stored in
the corners of your hangar. Mine has been that way for 7 months
now. I am looking forward to installing the mods and getting my
plane in the air. I suspect you will feel that way too several
months from now.
I wish you the best.
Paul
XL moving on to installing the new changes
At 05:16 AM 11/10/2009, you wrote:
>At the moment the plane is to be dis-assembled and put in the corner
>of the hanger. The prime spot will be occupied by a Grumman AA-1 if
>I can find one. It is so strong that the people would probably be
>flattened before the wing complains. If all this blows over and one
>can get reasonable liability insurance in the future, the updates
>might be done. Otherwise, there will be an engine and radios with a
>big metal bracket for sale.
>
>--------
>Mark Hubelbank
>N708HU
>CH601XL
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Warning - Slightly off topic - Yankee vs. Zodiac and |
specs
Paul,
I agree the AA1 is a bit wild. I have flown Grummans for 20 years. I know they
are in the class of you love them or you hate them. I find their aggressive handling
to be part of the fun. I sort of look forward to an AA-1 as it is even
more demanding than the AA-5.
The local Grumman group used to even have a winter ice landing event just to make
things even more interesting. It has been a while since the lake has been frozen
well enough to do it.
If you ask the question, would I put a AA-1 in the hands of a very low time pilot
who has just flown C-150s on long runways? No. They may have been called trainers
at one time but maybe that really implied trainer for jet fighter pilots.
--------
Mark Hubelbank
N708HU
CH601XL
Jabiru 3300
Rotec TBI 40 carb
Sensenich ground adj prop.
41 hr TAF
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272072#272072
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
Maybe I read a different Q&A paper... as I read along I got the idea
that Chris didn't really think that any of this was necessary.
Steve
Steve Look
Monticello, IL
www.ilrt66.com
"Dogs have owners, Cats have staff"
Message 9
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|
The upgrade plans call for using AN3 or AN4 bolts to attach the spar extrusion,
6-ZU-1-1, to the existing upper spar cap (after drilling out existing rivets.
Are there any issues or concerns with having bolts hold the spar cap on in
an area that is not accessible for inspection or maintenance?
--------
Doug Sire 601XL
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272106#272106
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
Hi, Gang!
Like so many others here, I'm contemplating ripping apart my QB 601XL to install
the suggested mods, and am considering what the positives and negatives will
be.
Of course, I'm thrilled at the prospect of restoring some of the value to design,
as well as silencing that nagging fear of airframe failure in the back of my
head. I've said all along that I'd love a beefier, more G-tolerant airframe
to increase the margin of safety. (I've flown enough cross country to experience
sudden clear air turbulence that has bounced my head off of the canopy, and
I can easily imagine how a 601 or 650 might have its G load limits exceeded through
no fault of the pilot.)
One of things I'm NOT thrilled about is the additional weight these mods will add
to the empty weight. So I called up Robbie Grove this morning, and he said
that if we got enough guys together to place a group order for his lightweight,
gun-drilled main gear, he could probably knock off 10 to 20 percent of the price.
If you're not familiar with the Grove gear for the 601, it saves about 15
pounds over the stock gear while eliminating exterior brake lines to the calipers.
Really slick.
Robbie said he needs a minimum of ten orders. Anyone else interested in this?
Rick Lindstrom
ZenVair 601XL N42KP
-----Original Message-----
>From: Robert Pelland <robert.pelland@cgocable.ca>
>Sent: Nov 10, 2009 8:36 AM
>To: zenith601-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs
>
>Try this,
>
> http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6-ZU-1-2-3%20NOV%208.pdf
>
>it should get you there
>
>Robert
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
Rick,
How much is the regular price for this gear? Is there a web site for this company
where I can read about the gear?
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami Florida
http://sites.google.com/site/billplane/
tigerrick(at)mindspring.c wrote:
> Hi, Gang!
>
> Like so many others here, I'm contemplating ripping apart my QB 601XL to install
the suggested mods, and am considering what the positives and negatives will
be.
>
> Of course, I'm thrilled at the prospect of restoring some of the value to design,
as well as silencing that nagging fear of airframe failure in the back of
my head. I've said all along that I'd love a beefier, more G-tolerant airframe
to increase the margin of safety. (I've flown enough cross country to experience
sudden clear air turbulence that has bounced my head off of the canopy, and
I can easily imagine how a 601 or 650 might have its G load limits exceeded
through no fault of the pilot.)
>
> One of things I'm NOT thrilled about is the additional weight these mods will
add to the empty weight. So I called up Robbie Grove this morning, and he said
that if we got enough guys together to place a group order for his lightweight,
gun-drilled main gear, he could probably knock off 10 to 20 percent of the
price. If you're not familiar with the Grove gear for the 601, it saves about
15 pounds over the stock gear while eliminating exterior brake lines to the calipers.
Really slick.
>
> Robbie said he needs a minimum of ten orders. Anyone else interested in this?
>
> Rick Lindstrom
> ZenVair 601XL N42KP
>
> --
--------
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami Florida
http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272126#272126
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
the website lists the price at $1357.00 pluss $200.00 for the gundrill.
-
You can see it here:- http://www.groveaircraft.com/landing_gear.html-
Bill Pagan
EAA Tech Counselor #4395
601XL QBK/Corvair/N565BW (RES)
--- On Tue, 11/10/09, William Dominguez <bill_dom@yahoo.com> wrote:
From: William Dominguez <bill_dom@yahoo.com>
Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs
om>
Rick,
How much is the regular price for this gear? Is there a web site for this c
ompany where I can read about the gear?
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami Florida
http://sites.google.com/site/billplane/
tigerrick(at)mindspring.c wrote:
> Hi, Gang!
>
> Like so many others here, I'm contemplating ripping apart my QB 601XL to
install the suggested mods, and am considering what the positives and negat
ives will be.
>
> Of course, I'm thrilled at the prospect of restoring some of the value to
design, as well as silencing that nagging fear of airframe failure in the
back of my head. I've said all along that I'd love a beefier, more G-tolera
nt airframe to increase the margin of safety. (I've flown enough cross coun
try to experience sudden clear air turbulence that has bounced my head off
of the canopy, and I can easily imagine how a 601 or 650 might have its G l
oad limits exceeded through no fault of the pilot.)
>
> One of things I'm NOT thrilled about is the additional weight these mods
will add to the empty weight. So I called up Robbie Grove this morning, and
he said that if we got enough guys together to place a group order for his
lightweight, gun-drilled main gear, he could probably knock off 10 to 20 p
ercent of the price. If you're not familiar with the Grove gear for the 601
, it saves about 15 pounds over the stock gear while eliminating exterior b
rake lines to the calipers. Really slick.
>
> Robbie said he needs a minimum of ten orders. Anyone else interested in t
his?
>
> Rick Lindstrom
> ZenVair 601XL N42KP
>
> --
--------
William Dominguez
Zodiac 601XL Plans
Miami Florida
http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272126#272126
le, List Admin.
=0A=0A=0A
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
A quick visit to the Grove website (http://www.groveaircraft.com) didn't result in pricing, but I remember the price of the gun-drilled gear for the 601 being around $1600. We also need the mounting plate that AMD has developed for this gear, and I have no idea what the cost of that is.
We could also get the gear with the external, rear brake line channel instead of
the internal brake line, most likely at a bit lower cost.
Not cheap, I know, but I hate giving up useful load. It means I'd hafta go on a
diet and stick to it!
Rick
-----Original Message-----
>From: William Dominguez <bill_dom@yahoo.com>
>Sent: Nov 10, 2009 2:36 PM
>To: zenith601-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs
>
>
>Rick,
>
>How much is the regular price for this gear? Is there a web site for this company
where I can read about the gear?
>
>William Dominguez
>Zodiac 601XL Plans
>Miami Florida
>http://sites.google.com/site/billplane/
>
>
>tigerrick(at)mindspring.c wrote:
>> Hi, Gang!
>>
>> Like so many others here, I'm contemplating ripping apart my QB 601XL to install
the suggested mods, and am considering what the positives and negatives will
be.
>>
>> Of course, I'm thrilled at the prospect of restoring some of the value to design,
as well as silencing that nagging fear of airframe failure in the back of
my head. I've said all along that I'd love a beefier, more G-tolerant airframe
to increase the margin of safety. (I've flown enough cross country to experience
sudden clear air turbulence that has bounced my head off of the canopy,
and I can easily imagine how a 601 or 650 might have its G load limits exceeded
through no fault of the pilot.)
>>
>> One of things I'm NOT thrilled about is the additional weight these mods will
add to the empty weight. So I called up Robbie Grove this morning, and he said
that if we got enough guys together to place a group order for his lightweight,
gun-drilled main gear, he could probably knock off 10 to 20 percent of the
price. If you're not familiar with the Grove gear for the 601, it saves about
15 pounds over the stock gear while eliminating exterior brake lines to the
calipers. Really slick.
>>
>> Robbie said he needs a minimum of ten orders. Anyone else interested in this?
>>
>> Rick Lindstrom
>> ZenVair 601XL N42KP
>>
>> --
>
>
>--------
>William Dominguez
>Zodiac 601XL Plans
>Miami Florida
>http://www.geocities.com/bill_dom
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272126#272126
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
Rick:
-
At about what price?
-
Elden J.
--- On Wed, 11/11/09, Rick Lindstrom <tigerrick@mindspring.com> wrote:
From: Rick Lindstrom <tigerrick@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs
com>
Hi, Gang!
Like so many others here, I'm contemplating ripping apart my QB 601XL to in
stall the suggested mods, and am considering what the positives and negativ
es will be.
Of course, I'm thrilled at the prospect of restoring some of the value to d
esign, as well as silencing that nagging fear of airframe failure in the ba
ck of my head. I've said all along that I'd love a beefier, more G-tolerant
airframe to increase the margin of safety. (I've flown enough cross countr
y to experience sudden clear air turbulence that has bounced my head off of
the canopy, and I can easily imagine how a 601 or 650 might have its G loa
d limits exceeded through no fault of the pilot.)
One of things I'm NOT thrilled about is the additional weight these mods wi
ll add to the empty weight. So I called up Robbie Grove this morning, and h
e said that if we got enough guys together to place a group order for his l
ightweight, gun-drilled main gear, he could probably knock off 10 to 20 per
cent of the price. If you're not familiar with the Grove gear for the 601,
it saves about 15 pounds over the stock gear while eliminating exterior bra
ke lines to the calipers. Really slick.
Robbie said he needs a minimum of ten orders. Anyone else interested in thi
s?
Rick Lindstrom
ZenVair 601XL N42KP
-----Original Message-----
>From: Robert Pelland <robert.pelland@cgocable.ca>
>Sent: Nov 10, 2009 8:36 AM
>To: zenith601-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs
>
>Try this,
>
> http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/data/6-ZU-1-2-3%20NOV%208.pdf
>
>it should get you there
>
>Robert
le, List Admin.
=0A=0A=0A
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
Rick,
Weight has also been one of my big concerns as I was already pushing the
#1320 limit most of the time even with reduced fuel. So how much do you think
were talking here. David Coberly
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
Steve, I must have read the same Q&A as you did, because I came to the
same conclusion.
Randy Ferri
----- Original Message -----
From: Stephen R. Look
To: zenith601-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 8:42 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs
Maybe I read a different Q&A paper... as I read along I got the idea
that Chris didn't really think that any of this was necessary.
Steve
Steve Look
Monticello, IL
www.ilrt66.com
"Dogs have owners, Cats have staff"
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: FAA grounds 601 and 650 |
Bryan
I have to agree with you and Doug, that, once you have the airworthiness
certificate, you, the manufacturer and pilot of an E-AB, are the judge of
whether or not your creation is airworthy. But I would like to add a bit
more information for you to consider. With Mat's permission, I am posting
the following message that I received this morning. I hope that all owners
of E-AB 601XL's and 650's will consider what Mat has to say, particularly
in the 3rd and 4th paragraphs.
>>Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 06:16:33 -0800 (PST)
>>From: Mat Heintz <heintz_mat@yahoo.com>
>>Subject: Re: Transmittal of ZBAG CH601XL Flutter Report
>>To: Terry Phillips <ttp44@rkymtn.net>
>>X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.21 required=4.00
>>tests=HTML_MESSAGE,BAYES_40,MR_NOT_ATTRIBUTED_IP,NO_RDNS2,MR_DIFF_MID,OTHER
>> version=3.2.1
>>X-Spam-Level: ***
>>X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.1 (1.0) on mail.rkymtn.net
>>
>>Hi Terry,
>>I was forwarded your comments on the Matronics list and has very happy to
>>see that you are in full support of the upgrade.
>>We estimate that the upgrade parts will be significantly less than $1,000
>>USD as we will be supplying them at cost. As you stated, there is
>>absolutely no way that we can supply the parts free. We have been
>>spending way too much money on all this testing and litigation, so I
>>appreciate what you said. Our mission now is to get everyone to fly
>>safely and for us to stay in business so that we can support the aircraft
>>fro years to come.
>>
>>We now have a Q&A posted on the ZAC site and will be continuing a Q&A on
>>the zenith.aero site so that everyones questions will be answered.
>>
>>Regarding the Safety Alert. It is critical that everyone follows it and
>>that they do not fly thier aircraft until the upgrade is done. We are
>>talking about the Experimantal and AMD aircraft 601 XL and 650.
>>
>>I spent the weekend with the FAA and NTSB going over the accident in AR.
>>The NTSB will be about180 days before releasing anything of significance.
>>I want to make it cleare is that it does not seem to be overstressing of
>>the airframe but rather from vibrations or flutter. We have found out
>>that the owner did have flutter a few months back where he tensioned his
>>control cables. Recently, he installed an auto pilot and it could well be
>>that he was flight testing that. It could be that the auto pilot
>>overloaded the aileron system thus causing loose control cables. Or
>>manybe a loose flap system started severe vibrations. The bottom line is
>>that people should not fly until the upgrade is done. We will have
>>another drawing with more things to do (but very minor things).
>>
>>Thanks again for suporting the upgrade.
>>
>>Mathieu Heintz
At 10:45 PM 11/7/2009 -0500, you wrote:
>From: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
>Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: FAA grounds 601 and 650
>Date: Sat, 7 Nov 2009 22:45:54 -0500
>To: zenith601-list@matronics.com
>Sender: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com
>X-Spam-Flag: YES
>X-Spam-Status: Yes, hits=5.30 required=4.00
>tests=LOCALPART_IN_SUBJECT,BAYES_05,SPF_PASS,NO_RDNS2,OTHER
> version=3.2.1
>X-Spam-Level: *****
>X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.1 (1.0) on mail.rkymtn.net
>
>
>The FAA may be able to ground 601s with S-LSA certificates but they
>have no authority to ground all E-AB 601s because there is no type
>certificate to take action against. The FAA would have to ground each
>individual E-AB on a case by case basis since each one is considered a
>one of a kind airplane. Besides which, during phase 1 testing I have
>flown my airplane to 4 Gs at a gross weight of 1320 lbs and have flown
>it to 110% of my stated Vne. I have carefully and systematically test
>flown my plane to the limits of its documented flight envelope and am
>confident that it is airworthy if flown within that envelope. I see no
>reason to reduce my flight envelope. I am the manufacturer, it is my
>decision to make, no one else's.
Terry Phillips ZBAGer
ttp44~at~rkymtn.net
Corvallis MT
601XL/Jab 3300 s .. l .. o .. o .. w build kit - Tail, flaps, & ailerons
are done; waiting on the wings
http://www.mykitlog.com/N47TP/
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
Rick,
I would be interested in considering the Grove gear. Then I would just need to
figure out what to do with my current, standard, gear. I think it is too big
for the slot at the recycling center.
--------
Doug Sire 601XL
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272158#272158
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Retrofitting Wing Lockers with the Upgrade |
For those of you on the fence about the wing lockers, I can get into a lot of my
wings with the lockers open to fish out cables wires and such. Saved me a couple
of times building.
--------
601XL N676L FLYING PHASE I
CHESAPEAKE VA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272159#272159
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: FAA grounds 601 and 650 |
On Tuesday 10 November 2009 16:13, Terry Phillips wrote:
<snip>
> >>I was forwarded your comments on the Matronics list and has very happy to
> >>see that you are in full support of the upgrade.
> >>We estimate that the upgrade parts will be significantly less than $1,000
> >>USD as we will be supplying them at cost.
<snip>
Supplying them at materials cost is a step in the right direction. It's
necessary, but whether or not it is acceptable remains to be seen.
Meanwhile, I've been looking at the draft drawings to see just how much it
would cost me for raw stock to get on with this show. I'm reluctant to jump
in to some of thease changes, because I suspect some fine tuning remains to
be done. However, so far, it looks like I could do this for a heck of a lot
less than $1,000. I also might be able to avoid waiting for the upgrade parts
to be available.
I have run into a snag: finding .093 3/4 x 3/4 6061-T6 for the spar uprights,
and 1/8x1x1-1/2 for the front wing uprights and wing extrusion angle. There
are some other snags, but those are things that I won't be doing for a while.
I've looked at ACS, Wicks, Airparts, and a few others with no luck. Has anyone
else found a potential source for these materials?
--
============================================
Do not archive.
============================================
Jim B Belcher
BS, MS Physics, Math, Computer Science
A&P/IA
Retired aerospace technical manager
Mathematics and alcohol do not mix.
Do not drink and derive.
============================================
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs |
----- Original Message ----
From: dougsire <dsire@imt.net>
Sent: Tue, November 10, 2009 4:50:21 PM
Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: update on the CH601XL--- REQUIRED MODs
Rick,
I would be interested in considering the Grove gear. Then I would just need to
figure out what to do with my current, standard, gear. I think it is too big
for the slot at the recycling center.
--------
Doug Sire 601XL
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272158#272158
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