Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 10:13 AM - Washington CORVAIR Community College at Magnificent Machine! (Brady)
2. 12:53 PM - Re: Must sell 601 XL wing and tail kit - leaving the country (ella)
3. 02:13 PM - Push Rods (BobbyPaulk@comcast.net)
4. 05:18 PM - I don't understand... (Brian A. Manlove)
5. 05:55 PM - Re: I don't understand... (mhubel)
6. 06:09 PM - Re: I don't understand... (Sabrina)
7. 06:44 PM - Re: Re: I don't understand... (Afterfxllc@aol.com)
8. 06:48 PM - Re: I don't understand... (John Smith)
9. 06:52 PM - Re: I don't understand... (hansriet)
10. 07:01 PM - Re: Re: I don't understand... (Paul Mulwitz)
11. 07:50 PM - Re: Re: I don't understand... (Ronald Steele)
12. 11:51 PM - Re: Re: I don't understand... (J.T. Machin)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Washington CORVAIR Community College at Magnificent Machine! |
For all those who might be interested:
William Wynne is coming to the Great North West!
Magnificent Machine will be hosting a Ccrvair "Community College"
The Dates will be Dec. 26th & 27th.
If you are interested in attending please contact Magnificent Machine:
By email= info@magnificentmachine.com
By phone= 360-635-6042
toll free for those of you out of state= 1-866-606-4152
Things you will see at the event are:
A running CH-750 WW Corvair installation!
A MagVair with a Dan Weseman 5th bearing!
Several other Corvair engine conversions in various stages including running!
CH-601's & CH-701's in various stages.
Magnificent Machine's New Facility!
Corvair Cars!
The adjacent space that maybe used for our builder assist program!
And most importantly other aviation & Corvair nuts that you have more in common
with than you realize.
DON'T MISS THIS OPPORTUNITY!
The Coffee is always on and is always free so if you can't make these dates please
feel free to stop by at your leisure.
Thank you,
Brady McCormick
CH-701/Corvair, CH-601/Corvair
5686 Minder RD NE
Suite #101
Poulsbo, WA 98370
1-866-606-4152 toll free!
info@magnificentmachine.com
www.magnificentmachine.com
--------
Brady McCormick
Poulsbo, WA
www.magnificentmachine.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=275994#275994
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Must sell 601 XL wing and tail kit - leaving the country |
Hi
I may be interested in your project. What would be the possibility
and approx.cost to ship to North Carolina Do you have any good pic. of
the construction
Thanks Don
----- Original Message -----
From: kaimaki@comcast.net
To: zenith601-list@matronics.com ; zenith601-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2009 12:49 PM
Subject: Zenith601-List: Must sell 601 XL wing and tail kit - leaving
the country
I am leaving the country in the not too distant future and would like
to find a good home for the completed tail kit and the partially
completed wing kit of a 601 XL.
The wing kit includes:
- standard tanks
- wing lockers
- landing lights
- complete fuel kit
The wing kit completion status:
- aileron incl. full length trim tab completed
- flaps completed
- left wing started
I also incl. all the tools and supplies and my 12 x 4 foot table in
the sale.
I am not sure what a fair asking price is so I decided to consider any
offer above $2000. I would like to sell everything together but I will
consider offers for parts of the kits.
Please contact me off-line at kaimaki@comcast.net for further
information and to make an offer.
Thank you.
Frank Wildensee
Portland, Oregon
kaimaki@comcast.net
Message 3
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List
I am thinking of changing the aileron cables to push rods while I have the wings
open for the "upgrades"
If anyone has photos, drawings, part numbers or tubing sizes I would appreciate
any info. Please e-mail me off list.
I have removed the ailerons primarily to keep from flying it and found no damage
or loose rivets.
Does anyone know if the upgrade kits are shipping for the E-AB builders?
Bobby
Hobbs stopped at 96 hrs.
Message 4
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| Subject: | I don't understand... |
I am having a hard time understanding why anyone would even consider NOT
fixing their 601/650, if they built it themselves. If you live up north,
it'll be a good winter project. Any home-built kit should be flown by
carefully by the seat of your pants anyway... and adding hours will add
confidence. With all of the different "certified" aircraft that have
crashed and burned, I believe Zenith is doing this for complete redundancy,
not because the aircraft is inherently badly designed. Look at the
THOUSANDS of hours on these 601's, including some very hard flying by some
very good pilots. without incident.
I can understand the desire for redundancy. But I also understand that
being careful and thorough and knowing what you are doing is more important.
I just re-read "Stick and Rudder" by Wolfgang Langenwieshe, and there is a
chapter in there by an NTSB accident investigator. More novice pilots have
died trying to circle their house and do "wing salutes" than almost every
other category. Add some too-sloppy control cables and a slow speed, tight
turn and I don't care if you're flying a brand-new anything, you are risking
your life.
If anyone wants to give me their 601, I'll be happy to come and pick it up.
I have a nice trailer.
CH750/Corvair, in the works.
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: I don't understand... |
While I can see your point, to some degree I can understand. Some of us decided
to build a plane once with no intention of ever doing it again. It was fun once.
Then it was time to fly it. This "upgrade" is a very significant fraction
of the original build time.
I had doubts myself. Had it not been for the two others who have offered to help
do the modifications, my enthusiasm to do this would be very low.
--------
Mark Hubelbank
N708HU
CH601XL
Jabiru 3300
Rotec TBI 40 carb
Sensenich ground adj prop.
41 hr TAF
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=276087#276087
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: I don't understand... |
If your XL winged craft is parked outside, the upgrade could actually degrade the
strength of the main spar over time since Zenith has moved back toward main
spar AN bolts that cannot be inspected and re-torqued. I don't know if it would
take months or more than a year, but at some point while I am in college I
would be in worse shape than I am now.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=276092#276092
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/an_762.jpg
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: I don't understand... |
In a message dated 12/3/2009 9:09:46 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
chicago2paris@msn.com writes:
since Zenith has moved back toward main spar AN bolts that cannot be
inspected and re-torqued. I don't know if it would take months or more than a
yea
r, but at some point while I am in college I would be in worse shape than
I am now.
Sabrina
In the Q&A he has always said rivets are better than bolts. The bolts in
your pic might just have been temporary since the hole is the same size for
either.
Mine is riveted all the way across... it makes no since to add bolts where
there is no inspection covers and I don't want to have to re open the wing
in two years. Not to mention the added weight of bolts.
Jeff
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: I don't understand... |
"=C2-I believe Zenith is doing this for complete redundancy, not because
the aircraft is inherently badly designed.=C2- Look at the THOUSANDS of h
ours on these 601=99s, including some very hard flying by some very g
ood pilots without incident."=0A=0AIf one really believes in the a
bove statement, then it should not be difficult to understand the additiona
l work required to=C2-modify completed aircraft=C2-is unnecessary.=0A
=0A=0A
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: I don't understand... |
[quote="Sabrina"]If your XL winged craft is parked outside, the upgrade could actually
degrade the strength of the main spar over time since Zenith has moved
back toward main spar AN bolts that cannot be inspected and re-torqued. I don't
know if it would take months or more than a year, but at some point while I
am in college I would be in worse shape than I am now.[/quote]
I noticed that too. Also the aileron balance is bolted in between the two new aileron
ribs. I don't like either of these solutions.
Hans van Riet
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=276101#276101
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: I don't understand... |
As I understand it this coin has two bad sides . . .
We discussed this situation at my last EAA chapter meeting. One
member (who happens to be a supervisor at Boeing) mentioned a
potential problem with aircraft rivets. His point was that if the
rivets are not properly set they may not compress the parts they are
supposed to hold together. This is not an issue (according to him)
with bolts since the torque applied is directly reflected in the joint.
I didn't really understand his comments, but the bottom line is there
are potential problems with bolts or rivets - especially rivets set
by builders who may have selected the Zodiac design because it didn't
require setting any hard rivets.
Paul
XL upgrade kit on order
At 06:52 PM 12/3/2009, you wrote:
>the upgrade could actually degrade the strength of the main spar
>over time since Zenith has moved back toward main spar AN bolts that
>cannot be inspected and re-torqued.
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: I don't understand... |
I certainly understand "no solid rivets" comment. I have every
intention to rivet mine, but I'll be buying a bunch of cheap aluminum
at Home Depot and a bunch of extra rivets to practice with.
Fortunately my airport is "infested" with RV builders, so I have some
more experienced people around.
I just can't see having the inspection headache and weight.
Ron
On Dec 3, 2009, at 10:01 PM, Paul Mulwitz wrote:
>
> As I understand it this coin has two bad sides . . .
>
> We discussed this situation at my last EAA chapter meeting. One
> member (who happens to be a supervisor at Boeing) mentioned a
> potential problem with aircraft rivets. His point was that if the
> rivets are not properly set they may not compress the parts they are
> supposed to hold together. This is not an issue (according to him)
> with bolts since the torque applied is directly reflected in the
> joint.
>
> I didn't really understand his comments, but the bottom line is
> there are potential problems with bolts or rivets - especially
> rivets set by builders who may have selected the Zodiac design
> because it didn't require setting any hard rivets.
>
> Paul
> XL upgrade kit on order
>
>
> At 06:52 PM 12/3/2009, you wrote:
>> the upgrade could actually degrade the strength of the main spar
>> over time since Zenith has moved back toward main spar AN bolts
>> that cannot be inspected and re-torqued.
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: I don't understand... |
I guess I don't understand.
If a bolt is properly torqued and has some locking feature it is just as reliable
as a rivet. Our aircraft has hundreds of non serviceable bolts, never been
a problem. Certified aircraft as well.
Jim Machin
601xl Quick build, 0-200
--- On Thu, 12/3/09, Ronald Steele <rsteele@rjsit.com> wrote:
> From: Ronald Steele <rsteele@rjsit.com>
> Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Re: I don't understand...
> To: zenith601-list@matronics.com
> Date: Thursday, December 3, 2009, 7:46 PM
> --> Zenith601-List message posted
> by: Ronald Steele <rsteele@rjsit.com>
>
> I certainly understand "no solid rivets" comment. I
> have every intention to rivet mine, but I'll be buying a
> bunch of cheap aluminum at Home Depot and a bunch of extra
> rivets to practice with. Fortunately my airport is
> "infested" with RV builders, so I have some more experienced
> people around.
> I just can't see having the inspection headache and
> weight.
>
> Ron
>
>
>
> On Dec 3, 2009, at 10:01 PM, Paul Mulwitz wrote:
>
> <psm@att.net>
> >
> > As I understand it this coin has two bad sides . . .
> >
> > We discussed this situation at my last EAA chapter
> meeting. One member (who happens to be a supervisor at
> Boeing) mentioned a potential problem with aircraft
> rivets. His point was that if the rivets are not
> properly set they may not compress the parts they are
> supposed to hold together. This is not an issue
> (according to him) with bolts since the torque applied is
> directly reflected in the joint.
> >
> > I didn't really understand his comments, but the
> bottom line is there are potential problems with bolts or
> rivets - especially rivets set by builders who may have
> selected the Zodiac design because it didn't require setting
> any hard rivets.
> >
> > Paul
> > XL upgrade kit on order
> >
> >
> > At 06:52 PM 12/3/2009, you wrote:
> >> the upgrade could actually degrade the strength of
> the main spar over time since Zenith has moved back toward
> main spar AN bolts that cannot be inspected and re-torqued.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
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