Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 10:53 AM - Seals (BobbyPaulk@comcast.net)
2. 11:36 AM - Re: Seals (Craig Payne)
3. 11:55 AM - Chat Tonight (George Race)
4. 12:32 PM - Re: Seals (Mark Hubelbank)
5. 12:34 PM - Re: Seals (Bill Steer)
6. 01:02 PM - Re: Seals (Bill Steer)
7. 01:07 PM - Re: Seals (Paul Mulwitz)
8. 01:50 PM - Re: Seals (Bryan Martin)
9. 02:04 PM - Re: Seals (Craig Payne)
Message 1
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List
On a recent breakfast run in cold weather ( 40 deg. OAT ) I closed both air vents.
Immediately I got a strong odor of exhaust and burned fuel. The only way I
believe it could get in the cockpit area is thru the seals around the nose wheel
steering rods. Everything else is caulked or sealed tight. Does anyone have
an easy way to seal the rods better than the factory slide. I seem to remember
someone had a sock or motorcycle / ATV seal that could be adapted to the rods.
Anyone have part numbers / photos / or supplier.
Too cold to fly with the vents open.
bobby
Jacksonville, Fl.
Do Not Archive
Message 2
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Here is an old message from Ben Haas on the snowmobile boots. They are
kind of big and clunky (I have some saved photos I can send you direct):
"This is a two part deal with the bellows to follow the rod travel and
the plates to fasten the boots to the firewall. These are from a 2001
Mountain Max snowmobile so you guys down south will get some REAL
strange looks from the Yamaha parts counter guy. The boot part number is
Yam: 8CR-2198F-00-00 and is labeled a "cover". The plane # is Yam:
8CR2195E-00-00. Because of the existing rivets in the firewall I was
only able to attach the plate with three A-5 rivets and a screw on the
bottom. You will have to carve out the top flange of the plate to miss
two rivets. For those that have not built their firewalls yet you can
incorporate the boots using ZAC called for rivet locations. Also the
small end of the boot is 3/4" id and our steering rods are 3/8" od. I
had some thick wall round aluminum stock laying around and I made some
bushings out of that. You guys can use anything to fill up that space.
ie/ take some fuel line and slide it over the rods etc etc. Happy
building Ben Haas. N801BH."
Craig again - you can make your own boots out of fiberglass cloth and
silicone adhesive. Since the rods don't move that far forward fore and
aft you don't need the full bellows on the snowmobile boots. There was
an article in one of the mags sometime in the past year. I used "Silpat"
silicone cookie sheet liners. But the silicone is pretty soft and I
suspect they will tear once I start flying. I have seen others made from
the fireproof cloth user in racing suits (Nomex) but I think it breaths
so you have to coat it.
-- Craig
From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
BobbyPaulk@comcast.net
Sent: Monday, December 06, 2010 10:43 AM
Subject: Zenith601-List: Seals
List
On a recent breakfast run in cold weather ( 40 deg. OAT ) I closed both
air vents. Immediately I got a strong odor of exhaust and burned fuel.
The only way I believe it could get in the cockpit area is thru the
seals around the nose wheel steering rods. Everything else is caulked or
sealed tight. Does anyone have an easy way to seal the rods better than
the factory slide. I seem to remember someone had a sock or motorcycle /
ATV seal that could be adapted to the rods. Anyone have part numbers /
photos / or supplier.
Too cold to fly with the vents open.
bobby
Jacksonville, Fl.
Do Not Archive
Message 3
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Live Chat Room every Monday evening around 8:00 EDT
http://www.mykitairplane.com <blocked::http://www.mykitairplane.com/>
Click on the Chat Room link at the top of the page.
George
Message 4
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Bobby,
Even if you do get it that well sealed up, I would be concerned
that there is that much exhaust in the area. This could be an indication
that there is a leak in the exhaust system or the end of the pipe is too
short and allows some exhaust to be blown back.
On 12/06/2010 1:43 PM, BobbyPaulk@comcast.net wrote:
> List
> On a recent breakfast run in cold weather ( 40 deg. OAT ) I closed
> both air vents. Immediately I got a strong odor of exhaust and burned
> fuel. The only way I believe it could get in the cockpit area is thru
> the seals around the nose wheel steering rods. Everything else is
> caulked or sealed tight. Does anyone have an easy way to seal the rods
> better than the factory slide. I seem to remember someone had a sock
> or motorcycle / ATV seal that could be adapted to the rods. Anyone
> have part numbers / photos / or supplier.
> Too cold to fly with the vents open.
>
>
> bobby
> Jacksonville, Fl.
>
> Do Not Archive
> *
>
> *
--
Mark Hubelbank
NorthEast Monitoring
2 Clock Tower Place
Suite 555
Maynard, MA, 01754 - USA
mhubel@nemon.com
978-443-3955
Message 5
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I have a 601HD and sealed my steering rods with a Jeep shifter boot.
Works great! I got the idea and directions for doing it from another
fellow on this list. Let me try to dig that up. If I find it, I'll
respond again.
Bill
On 12/6/2010 1:43 PM, BobbyPaulk@comcast.net wrote:
> List
> On a recent breakfast run in cold weather ( 40 deg. OAT ) I closed
> both air vents. Immediately I got a strong odor of exhaust and burned
> fuel. The only way I believe it could get in the cockpit area is thru
> the seals around the nose wheel steering rods. Everything else is
> caulked or sealed tight. Does anyone have an easy way to seal the rods
> better than the factory slide. I seem to remember someone had a sock
> or motorcycle / ATV seal that could be adapted to the rods. Anyone
> have part numbers / photos / or supplier.
> Too cold to fly with the vents open.
>
>
> bobby
> Jacksonville, Fl.
>
> Do Not Archive
> *
>
> *
Message 6
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Found it. Here's his message:
**I have a solution for the steering rod sealing which uses a Jeep 4wd dual
rubber boot purchased off of Ebay for about $25. It seals quite well and
matches up nicely with the slots and steering rod travel. Email me direct
if you would like pictures and some fabrication details. Will also try to
post on Matronics enclosure site.
Chuck Long, P.E.
Zodie Rocket HDS
N601LE, 150 hr TT
His email address is charles.long@allisontransmission.com
Bill
**
On 12/6/2010 1:43 PM, BobbyPaulk@comcast.net wrote:
> List
> On a recent breakfast run in cold weather ( 40 deg. OAT ) I closed
> both air vents. Immediately I got a strong odor of exhaust and burned
> fuel. The only way I believe it could get in the cockpit area is thru
> the seals around the nose wheel steering rods. Everything else is
> caulked or sealed tight. Does anyone have an easy way to seal the rods
> better than the factory slide. I seem to remember someone had a sock
> or motorcycle / ATV seal that could be adapted to the rods. Anyone
> have part numbers / photos / or supplier.
> Too cold to fly with the vents open.
>
>
> bobby
> Jacksonville, Fl.
>
> Do Not Archive
> *
>
> *
Message 7
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I was having similar thoughts - there just shouldn't be so much exhaust
in the engine compartment.
If you can do it, an extension to the exhaust pipe might help. I saw an
article in the EAA magazine (perhaps a very old issue) about a home-made
muffler that actually ran along the bottom of the fuselage and
discharged the exhaust well aft of the passenger compartment.
Another thought - the exhaust might not be coming from the rudder
control rods at all. Perhaps there is a vacuum created in the rear of
the canopy and the exhaust is coming in from the slip stream around the
fuselage.
If you have cabin heat the air flow from it will prevent any vacuum from
forming in the cabin. If you don't have cabin heat perhaps you should
consider adding it.
Paul
XL - still doing upgrade installation.
From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark
Hubelbank
Sent: Monday, December 06, 2010 12:28 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Seals
Bobby,
Even if you do get it that well sealed up, I would be concerned that
there is that much exhaust in the area. This could be an indication that
there is a leak in the exhaust system or the end of the pipe is too
short and allows some exhaust to be blown back.
On 12/06/2010 1:43 PM, BobbyPaulk@comcast.net wrote:
List
On a recent breakfast run in cold weather ( 40 deg. OAT ) I closed both
air vents. Immediately I got a strong odor of exhaust and burned fuel.
The only way I believe it could get in the cockpit area is thru the
seals around the nose wheel steering rods. Everything else is caulked or
sealed tight. Does anyone have an easy way to seal the rods better than
the factory slide. I seem to remember someone had a sock or motorcycle /
ATV seal that could be adapted to the rods. Anyone have part numbers /
photos / or supplier.
Too cold to fly with the vents open.
bobby
Jacksonville, Fl.
Do Not Archive
--
Mark Hubelbank
NorthEast Monitoring
2 Clock Tower Place
Suite 555
Maynard, MA, 01754 - USA
mhubel@nemon.com
978-443-3955
Message 8
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This is very possible, I have noticed that air comes into my cabin from the tail
cone and flows out under the gap between the canopy rails and frame. It would
cause the boot around the control stick to balloon up before I sealed the gap
under the canopy rails.
If your exhaust pipes are very short, the exhaust may flow back along the fuselage
and be pulled in through the openings under the horizontal stabilizer and
flow back forward through the rudder cable tunnel into the cabin.
On Dec 6, 2010, at 4:03 PM, Paul Mulwitz wrote:
>
> Another thought - the exhaust might not be coming from the rudder control rods
at all. Perhaps there is a vacuum created in the rear of the canopy and the
exhaust is coming in from the slip stream around the fuselage.
>
> Paul
> XL - still doing upgrade installation.
>
>
>> On 12/06/2010 1:43 PM, BobbyPaulk@comcast.net wrote:
>> List
>> On a recent breakfast run in cold weather ( 40 deg. OAT ) I closed both air
vents. Immediately I got a strong odor of exhaust and burned fuel. The only way
I believe it could get in the cockpit area is thru the seals around the nose
wheel steering rods. Everything else is caulked or sealed tight. Does anyone
have an easy way to seal the rods better than the factory slide. I seem to remember
someone had a sock or motorcycle / ATV seal that could be adapted to the
rods. Anyone have part numbers / photos / or supplier.
>> Too cold to fly with the vents open.
>>
>>
>> bobby
>> Jacksonville, Fl.
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus re-drive.
do not archive.
Message 9
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I vaguely recall someone going through the exercise of lowering the CO level
in the cockpit of his 601. I believe he found the CO was entering through
the bottom access cover and moving forward.
Another builder (Gary Ray?) installed a muffin fan on the rear wall of his
luggage deck and found that the natural flow would make it spin backwards.
All this indicates the cockpit being an area of low pressure.
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bryan Martin
Sent: Monday, December 06, 2010 1:48 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Seals
<bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
This is very possible, I have noticed that air comes into my cabin from the
tail cone and flows out under the gap between the canopy rails and frame. It
would cause the boot around the control stick to balloon up before I sealed
the gap under the canopy rails.
If your exhaust pipes are very short, the exhaust may flow back along the
fuselage and be pulled in through the openings under the horizontal
stabilizer and flow back forward through the rudder cable tunnel into the
cabin.
On Dec 6, 2010, at 4:03 PM, Paul Mulwitz wrote:
>
> Another thought - the exhaust might not be coming from the rudder control
rods at all. Perhaps there is a vacuum created in the rear of the canopy
and the exhaust is coming in from the slip stream around the fuselage.
>
> Paul
> XL - still doing upgrade installation.
>
>
>> On 12/06/2010 1:43 PM, BobbyPaulk@comcast.net wrote:
>> List
>> On a recent breakfast run in cold weather ( 40 deg. OAT ) I closed both
air vents. Immediately I got a strong odor of exhaust and burned fuel. The
only way I believe it could get in the cockpit area is thru the seals around
the nose wheel steering rods. Everything else is caulked or sealed tight.
Does anyone have an easy way to seal the rods better than the factory slide.
I seem to remember someone had a sock or motorcycle / ATV seal that could be
adapted to the rods. Anyone have part numbers / photos / or supplier.
>> Too cold to fly with the vents open.
>>
>>
>> bobby
>> Jacksonville, Fl.
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus re-drive.
do not archive.
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