Today's Message Index:
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1. 09:46 AM - Chat Tonight (George Race)
2. 01:40 PM - Re: Re: 601-650 Upgrade Kit W/Wing Lockers (Jeff)
3. 02:31 PM - Fw: Hartwell latch (Carlos Sa)
4. 06:00 PM - Re: Fw: Hartwell latch (Jeff)
Message 1
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Live Chat Room every Monday evening around 8:00 EDT
http://www.mykitairplane.com <blocked::http://www.mykitairplane.com/>
Click on the Chat Room link at the top of the page.
George
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: 601-650 Upgrade Kit W/Wing Lockers |
Try Wicks. $12 each.
Jeff D
_____
From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Carlos Sa
Sent: Monday, December 20, 2010 12:02 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Re: 601-650 Upgrade Kit W/Wing Lockers
They are cool indeed, but obscenely expensive.
AS&S has them in their catalog for $121
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/ap/latches.html
The trick is to find "new surplus", which I did manage to do.
Airparts Inc has them for $20, but they are for the wrong material
thickness.
You need to learn the anatomy of these gadgets: they must fit the material
you are working with; also the version that has a travel limited to 90 deg.
is better, or it will hit the material around it and make a dent.
http://www.airpartsinc.com/products/flush-latch-hartwell.htm
There is also a version with a round button, which is much easier to
install, but I never found them for a reasonable price.
This site has them for $48. Five or 7 per door... do the math... do not
archive
https://www.circletracksupply.com/product.php?productid 26
I believe I posted some information on the list a while back.
If you can't find it, send me a note and I'll gather the info for you (I'm
about to crash, it's almost midnight here in Montreal).
Cheers
Carlos
On 19 December 2010 22:38, Don Honabach <don.honabach@pcperfect.com> wrote:
Those are cool!
Do you have a source for the latches?
Don
Message 3
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| Subject: | Fwd: Hartwell latch |
Below is a summary of what I learned during the intalation of the Hartwell
latches.
It's a note I sent to some builders that were interested in this set up.
Carlos
________________
To operate the latches, you will need to apply a force perpendicular to the
skin, so the skin
and the area around it must be able to take the stress. My locker cover is
0.020" - I should have used 0.025", but I think it will survive. If not, it
should be a matter of hours to make another one with thicker material.
New latches are a bit stiff, so I operated each one a number of times until
they became easier
to work with - before I ever installed them in their "final resting place".
They open with a jolt, so they can damage the skin when they reach fully
open position. The
damage is visible on the picture of the hole patters. One of them shows some
deformation (3rd from left, on top). So, to fix the problem, I made a
"cage", or travel stop, to make sure the latch stops before denting the
skin. This is the purpose of those funny "match boxes" you see.
I learned *after* purchasing these latches that *there is an model with
travel limited to 90 degrees* ...
Should you decide to use Hartwell latches, look for this particular model.
See page 2 of the AS&S specs at
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/hartwell.pdf
I think this would be an H5000-3.
I used H5000-2-025-051, where 025 is the door thickness, and 051 is door
plus frame thickness (the "limited travel" version would be
H5000-3-025-051).
In my case they are both 0.020 and it fits well.
I got them from aviation-instrument.com , a gentleman named Chuck Gonzales -
mailto: cgonzalez@aviation-instrument.com
Great people to work with.
They were "surplus new", $10.00 each - that was a year ago, not sure if they
have any left...
Hartwell wanted $100 each - they would manufacture them, as they have none
in stock ...!!!
Wicks sells them at $10 each. I asked the complete part number (not shown
on-line), and they are for thicker material - you might want to inquire
and/or order a sample to see if it fits.
http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_detail.php/pid=5075~subid=1456/index.html<http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_detail.php/pid=5075%7Esubid=1456/index.html>
There is also the "helicopter" variation, which would have been easier to
install (round
holes), but the only source I found wanted $50/each.
http://www.crracing.com/custom_built/hartwell_styles.shtml
I think it deserves a little more searching, as it would save the time and
effort of making irregular shaped holes.
If you decide against Hartwell latches, I would suggest camlock fasteners -
more expensive than dzus, but, in my opinion, a better engineered
solution: http://www.milspecproducts.com/
About the pictures:
I made hole patterns, starting with cardboard and then making them a bit
better (on 0.016"),
until I was happy. I used the one to the right to trace the hole shape on
the door, then
drilled small holes all around and shaped with a file.
The travel stop / cage was made of thin stock (0.020"?), and then a
trapezoidal piece (0.032")
riveted inside (see sample next to the hole templates).
One more consideration (?): a Hartwell latch installation will be more
permeable to air and water - there are more ways for the water to pass
through, if compared to a dzu or camlock. But, for a "high performance"
craft as the Zodie, I think this is no issue...
I posted a video on youtube, and when I went there to see it, I found one
more on hartwell latches.
Here are the URLs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGtyj-jPIb0
This is my video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evD30x62UwU
There are several RV builder sites where they show how they used this latch
for the oil door.
I remember Don Checkoway is one of them.
Links:
http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_search_results.php/search=aGFydHdlbGw
http://www.milspecproducts.com/
http://www.milspecproducts.com/26002700c-lock.htm
http://www.skybolt.com/
http://www.crracing.com/custom_built/hartwell_styles.shtml
http://www.milspecproducts.com/tool.htm#mst98
http://store.wagaero.com/product_info.php?products_id=2699
http://www.eberhard.com/ProductCateloge.aspx?CategoryID=12
Message 4
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| Subject: | Fwd: Hartwell latch |
Thanks for the great information Carlos!
Jeff D
do not archive
_____
From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Carlos Sa
Sent: Monday, December 20, 2010 5:27 PM
Subject: Zenith601-List: Fwd: Hartwell latch
Below is a summary of what I learned during the intalation of the Hartwell
latches.
It's a note I sent to some builders that were interested in this set up.
Carlos
________________
To operate the latches, you will need to apply a force perpendicular to the
skin, so the skin
and the area around it must be able to take the stress. My locker cover is
0.020" - I should have used 0.025", but I think it will survive. If not, it
should be a matter of hours to make another one with thicker material.
New latches are a bit stiff, so I operated each one a number of times until
they became easier
to work with - before I ever installed them in their "final resting place".
They open with a jolt, so they can damage the skin when they reach fully
open position. The
damage is visible on the picture of the hole patters. One of them shows some
deformation (3rd from left, on top). So, to fix the problem, I made a
"cage", or travel stop, to make sure the latch stops before denting the
skin. This is the purpose of those funny "match boxes" you see.
I learned *after* purchasing these latches that there is an model with
travel limited to 90 degrees ...
Should you decide to use Hartwell latches, look for this particular model.
See page 2 of the AS&S specs at
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/hartwell.pdf
I think this would be an H5000-3.
I used H5000-2-025-051, where 025 is the door thickness, and 051 is door
plus frame thickness (the "limited travel" version would be
H5000-3-025-051).
In my case they are both 0.020 and it fits well.
I got them from aviation-instrument.com , a gentleman named Chuck Gonzales -
mailto: <mailto:cgonzalez@aviation-instrument.com>
cgonzalez@aviation-instrument.com
Great people to work with.
They were "surplus new", $10.00 each - that was a year ago, not sure if they
have any left...
Hartwell wanted $100 each - they would manufacture them, as they have none
in stock ...!!!
Wicks sells them at $10 each. I asked the complete part number (not shown
on-line), and they are for thicker material - you might want to inquire
and/or order a sample to see if it fits.
http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_detail.php/pid=5075~subid=1456/
index.html
<http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_detail.php/pid=5075%7Esubid=14
56/index.html>
There is also the "helicopter" variation, which would have been easier to
install (round
holes), but the only source I found wanted $50/each.
http://www.crracing.com/custom_built/hartwell_styles.shtml
I think it deserves a little more searching, as it would save the time and
effort of making irregular shaped holes.
If you decide against Hartwell latches, I would suggest camlock fasteners -
more expensive than dzus, but, in my opinion, a better engineered solution:
http://www.milspecproducts.com/ <http://www.milspecproducts.com/>
About the pictures:
I made hole patterns, starting with cardboard and then making them a bit
better (on 0.016"),
until I was happy. I used the one to the right to trace the hole shape on
the door, then
drilled small holes all around and shaped with a file.
The travel stop / cage was made of thin stock (0.020"?), and then a
trapezoidal piece (0.032")
riveted inside (see sample next to the hole templates).
One more consideration (?): a Hartwell latch installation will be more
permeable to air and water - there are more ways for the water to pass
through, if compared to a dzu or camlock. But, for a "high performance"
craft as the Zodie, I think this is no issue...
I posted a video on youtube, and when I went there to see it, I found one
more on hartwell latches.
Here are the URLs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGtyj-jPIb0
This is my video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evD30x62UwU
There are several RV builder sites where they show how they used this latch
for the oil door.
I remember Don Checkoway is one of them.
Links:
http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_search_results.php/search=aGFyd
HdlbGw
http://www.milspecproducts.com/
http://www.milspecproducts.com/26002700c-lock.htm
http://www.skybolt.com/
http://www.crracing.com/custom_built/hartwell_styles.shtml
http://www.milspecproducts.com/tool.htm#mst98
http://store.wagaero.com/product_info.php?products_id=2699
http://www.eberhard.com/ProductCateloge.aspx?CategoryID=12
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