Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:55 AM - Re: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas (Mark Hubelbank)
2. 11:05 AM - Re: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas (Don Honabach)
3. 01:45 PM - Re: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas (Carlos Sa)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas |
Ella,
I may have missed it but is there anything on the vortex
generators, source, installation locations, pictures? I believe these
things are very specific to the wing design so a design used for another
aircraft can't be carried over.
On 04/21/2011 3:12 PM, Don Honabach wrote:
> --> Zenith601-List message posted by: Don Honabach<don.honabach@pcperfect.com>
>
> Ella -
>
> Depending on loading/weight -- 40 to 50 MPH is the typical stall speeds I see
now.
>
> I had started out about 5 to 10 MPH faster before installing them. The AOA required
for stalling is also much higher during power on stalls like you may have
seen in some of the online videos from the company that sells the stick on
plastic ones from overseas.
>
> For me though, the stall speed really didn't matter much -- I was fine flying
and landing a bit faster although the safety margin is always nice. What really
got me was that the plane just flew better which is hard to quantify, but after
noticing/feeling the change, I personally wouldn't want to fly a 601HDS for
any real time without them. Another builder that I fly with a lot also noticed
that the plane flew much better after installing.
>
> Hope this helps --
>
> Thanks,
> Don
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of ella
> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 11:36 AM
> To: zenith601-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas
>
> --> Zenith601-List message posted by: "ella"<ella_rhodes@att.net>
>
> Hi
> What is the stall speed after installing the vortex generators Thanks Don-----
Original Message -----
> From: "Don Honabach"<don.honabach@pcperfect.com>
> To:<zenith601-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 12:57 PM
> Subject: RE: Zenith601-List: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas
>
>
>> --> Zenith601-List message posted by: Don Honabach
>> <don.honabach@pcperfect.com>
>>
>> Hey Doug -
>>
>> I really like my 601HDS. My plane climbs a lot faster than the spam cans
>> and has decent cruise performance. The one area that I wish I could change
>> though was to give it a little faster cruise speed (although, I think even
>> those flying at 300MPH still want more speed, so I'm not sure when enough
>> is enough sort of thing!).
>>
>> In order to try and get the maximum out of the design, I've installed
>> pretty much EVERYTHING -- vortex generators, wing-root fairings, and basic
>> aerodynamic clean ups. The one area I haven't done is to clean up the top
>> side of the gear legs which I suspect would add a few knots. Really wish I
>> had done those but haven't found the motivation to make them at this
>> point -- if someone had them for sale though, I'd probably buy and install
>> to try.
>>
>> The biggest improvement I saw was with the Vortex Generators and at least
>> in my particular build seemed to help climb and improve cruise speeds by
>> helping to keep the nose down. If nothing else, it added a safety margin
>> as it decreased the stall speeds as well.
>>
>> I'm flying behind a Jabiru 3300A. My cruise speed is at the 125 to 135MPH
>> no wind if I fly at a high RPM and willing to burn a lot of fuel. If I go
>> all out, I can get almost 140MPH Ground Speed (No Wind) in the right
>> conditions/altitude, etc.
>>
>> The 601HDS (as I think all small planes) are really affected by weight.
>> Anything you can do to reduce the weight will make the plane fly better.
>> When I did my first flight, I weighed 250 pounds, I now weigh under 200
>> and the plane does fly noticeable better as a result.
>>
>> Good luck!
>> Don
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
>> douglas.lindsay
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 4:36 PM
>> To: zenith601-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Zenith601-List: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas
>>
>> --> Zenith601-List message posted by: "douglas.lindsay"
>> --> <douglas.gj.lindsay@gmail.com>
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I'm considering buying a 601 HDS at the moment. Although there's nothing
>> desperately wrong with the plane's performance at the moment, I wanted to
>> gauge what sort of options there are out there for improving things.
>>
>> So: what sort of ideas have you implemented for aerodynamic cleanup that
>> haven't turned up in the forums already? I know some folk have applied
>> wing fairings, others vortex generators, and there have been suggestions
>> of converting to taildragger (bit too much work for me I think!) or even
>> simply filling in rivet heads; but what else is out there, and what cruise
>> speeds / stall speeds / climb rates have you ended up with as a result?
>>
>> Thanks all!
>> Douglas
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337638#337638
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
--
Mark Hubelbank
NorthEast Monitoring
2 Clock Tower Place
Suite 555
Maynard, MA, 01754 - USA
mhubel@nemon.com
978-443-3955
Message 2
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| Subject: | Aerodynamic clean-up ideas |
This is the company I purchased the vortex generators from http://www.stolspeed.com/id/60 ... they have instructions for placement there along with videos, etc.
Please keep in mind I'm flying a 601HDS and everyone's plane is different... even
if 'the same' or as they say, your results may vary, but I LOVE THEM and wouldn't
fly without them!
Don
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark Hubelbank
Sent: Friday, April 22, 2011 5:52 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas
Ella,
I may have missed it but is there anything on the vortex generators, source,
installation locations, pictures? I believe these things are very specific
to the wing design so a design used for another aircraft can't be carried over.
On 04/21/2011 3:12 PM, Don Honabach wrote:
> --> Zenith601-List message posted by: Don
> --> Honabach<don.honabach@pcperfect.com>
>
> Ella -
>
> Depending on loading/weight -- 40 to 50 MPH is the typical stall speeds I see
now.
>
> I had started out about 5 to 10 MPH faster before installing them. The AOA required
for stalling is also much higher during power on stalls like you may have
seen in some of the online videos from the company that sells the stick on
plastic ones from overseas.
>
> For me though, the stall speed really didn't matter much -- I was fine flying
and landing a bit faster although the safety margin is always nice. What really
got me was that the plane just flew better which is hard to quantify, but after
noticing/feeling the change, I personally wouldn't want to fly a 601HDS for
any real time without them. Another builder that I fly with a lot also noticed
that the plane flew much better after installing.
>
> Hope this helps --
>
> Thanks,
> Don
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of ella
> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 11:36 AM
> To: zenith601-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas
>
> --> Zenith601-List message posted by: "ella"<ella_rhodes@att.net>
>
> Hi
> What is the stall speed after installing the vortex generators
> Thanks Don----- Original Message -----
> From: "Don Honabach"<don.honabach@pcperfect.com>
> To:<zenith601-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 12:57 PM
> Subject: RE: Zenith601-List: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas
>
>
>> --> Zenith601-List message posted by: Don Honabach
>> <don.honabach@pcperfect.com>
>>
>> Hey Doug -
>>
>> I really like my 601HDS. My plane climbs a lot faster than the spam
>> cans and has decent cruise performance. The one area that I wish I
>> could change though was to give it a little faster cruise speed
>> (although, I think even those flying at 300MPH still want more speed,
>> so I'm not sure when enough is enough sort of thing!).
>>
>> In order to try and get the maximum out of the design, I've installed
>> pretty much EVERYTHING -- vortex generators, wing-root fairings, and
>> basic aerodynamic clean ups. The one area I haven't done is to clean
>> up the top side of the gear legs which I suspect would add a few
>> knots. Really wish I had done those but haven't found the motivation
>> to make them at this point -- if someone had them for sale though,
>> I'd probably buy and install to try.
>>
>> The biggest improvement I saw was with the Vortex Generators and at
>> least in my particular build seemed to help climb and improve cruise
>> speeds by helping to keep the nose down. If nothing else, it added a
>> safety margin as it decreased the stall speeds as well.
>>
>> I'm flying behind a Jabiru 3300A. My cruise speed is at the 125 to
>> 135MPH no wind if I fly at a high RPM and willing to burn a lot of
>> fuel. If I go all out, I can get almost 140MPH Ground Speed (No Wind)
>> in the right conditions/altitude, etc.
>>
>> The 601HDS (as I think all small planes) are really affected by weight.
>> Anything you can do to reduce the weight will make the plane fly better.
>> When I did my first flight, I weighed 250 pounds, I now weigh under
>> 200 and the plane does fly noticeable better as a result.
>>
>> Good luck!
>> Don
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
>> douglas.lindsay
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 4:36 PM
>> To: zenith601-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Zenith601-List: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas
>>
>> --> Zenith601-List message posted by: "douglas.lindsay"
>> --> <douglas.gj.lindsay@gmail.com>
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I'm considering buying a 601 HDS at the moment. Although there's
>> nothing desperately wrong with the plane's performance at the moment,
>> I wanted to gauge what sort of options there are out there for improving things.
>>
>> So: what sort of ideas have you implemented for aerodynamic cleanup
>> that haven't turned up in the forums already? I know some folk have
>> applied wing fairings, others vortex generators, and there have been
>> suggestions of converting to taildragger (bit too much work for me I
>> think!) or even simply filling in rivet heads; but what else is out
>> there, and what cruise speeds / stall speeds / climb rates have you ended up
with as a result?
>>
>> Thanks all!
>> Douglas
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337638#337638
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
--
Mark Hubelbank
NorthEast Monitoring
2 Clock Tower Place
Suite 555
Maynard, MA, 01754 - USA
mhubel@nemon.com
978-443-3955
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Aerodynamic clean-up ideas |
Klaus also has some interesting ideas:
http://www.utdallas.edu/~klaus/Airplane/airplane.html
Carlos
CH601-HD, plans
> >>
> >> --> Zenith601-List message posted by: "douglas.lindsay"
> >> --> <douglas.gj.lindsay@gmail.com>
> >>
> >> Hi all,
> >>
> >> I'm considering buying a 601 HDS at the moment. Although there's
> >> nothing desperately wrong with the plane's performance at the moment,
> >> I wanted to gauge what sort of options there are out there for improving
> things.
> >>
> >> So: what sort of ideas have you implemented for aerodynamic cleanup
> >> that haven't turned up in the forums already? I know some folk have
> >> applied wing fairings, others vortex generators, and there have been
> >> suggestions of converting to taildragger (bit too much work for me I
> >> think!) or even simply filling in rivet heads; but what else is out
> >> there, and what cruise speeds / stall speeds / climb rates have you
> ended up with as a result?
> >>
> >> Thanks all!
> >> Douglas
> >>
>
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