Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 12:16 AM - A Message From AeroElectric's Bob Nuckolls... (Matt Dralle)
1. 08:14 AM - Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (SIDESLIP)
2. 08:15 AM - Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (SIDESLIP)
3. 08:37 AM - Re: Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (Rick Lindstrom)
4. 08:48 AM - Re: Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (Paul Mulwitz)
5. 10:02 AM - Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (SIDESLIP)
6. 10:20 AM - Re: Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (Paul Mulwitz)
7. 01:07 PM - Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (airplayn)
8. 01:23 PM - Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (SIDESLIP)
9. 01:39 PM - Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (airplayn)
10. 02:20 PM - Re: Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (Bryan Martin)
11. 04:55 PM - Re: Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (Bob Haring)
12. 05:16 PM - Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... HELP! (SIDESLIP)
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| Subject: | A Message From AeroElectric's Bob Nuckolls... |
Dear Listers,
The well known Bob Nuckolls of the AeroElectric posted a great message Monday on
the AeroElectric-List regarding the Matronics Lists and the importance of supporting
the operation during the Fund Raiser. Please take a minute to read Bob's
commentary below, reposted to the other Matronics Lists with his permission...
Date: Mon, 05 Nov 2012 08:58:41 -0600
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob@aeroelectric.com>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Please Make A Contribution Today!
At 02:14 AM 11/5/2012, Matt Dralle wrote:
>
> Each year at the end of the List Fund Raiser, I post a message
> acknowledging everyone that so generously made a Contribution to
> support the Lists. Its my way of publicly thanking everyone that
> took a minute to show their appreciation for the Lists.
>
I will add my voice to this suggestion. It's
easy to enjoy the benefits of what's available to us
off-the-shelves at the corner mega-marts. It's
seldom that we give pause to learn and understand the
processes and tools that made it possible to reach out
and select from dozens of options.
This, and all civil societies, runs on talent, energy
and mobility. Mobility exploited by thousands of hands,
machines and transportation that figure into the
'infrastructure' that puts the boxes of Wheaties and
Pop Tarts on the shelves.
See "I pencil" http://tinyurl.com/36xkhq
Any break in that chain of time, talent and resources
at least interrupts if not totally halts flow of
that benefit. Matt's room full of byte-thrashers is
like the natural gas pumping station a few miles from
my house. If those pumps stop, who ever is expecting
the furnace to come on at the other end of the pipe
is at risk for reduced service and/or higher costs
for that service.
Matt's yearly endeavor to keep his pumps running is
a trivial burden on the members of the Lists
but of incalculable value to those who participate
on them. No donation is too small.
We go to a fly-in a willingly chuck a few bucks into
the coffee can at the drinks and donuts table, let's
chuck a few bucks into Matt's coffee can too. 50,000
pounds of value doesn't get to the shelves on time
if one 18-wheeler runs out of gas. The T-bytes of
data flow we all enjoy don't get from your keyboard
to the screens of others unless Matt pays the light
bill and strokes the machines to keep them happy.
No, $5 won't get you a free copy of the 'Connection
or a fuel sampler but it will go toward the assurance
that logging onto your favorite List will open
doors that you would be sorely missed should you find
that hitting the return key doesn't produce the
expected response.
$5 from every List customer on Matt's system will
go a very long way to keeping the byte-pumps running.
$More$ will go a long way to upgrading the size
and quality of the machines as the old ones get
long in the tooth. No matter what size of donation
you choose . . . please do it now . . .
Bob . . .
Please make your Contribution today to support the continued operation and upgrade
of these services. You can pick up a really nice gift for making your Contribution
too!
You may use a Credit Card or Paypal at the Matronics Contribution Site here:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
or, you can send a personal check to the following address:
Matronics / Matt Dralle
581 Jeannie Way
Livermore, CA 94550
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
Bob;
I don't believe that there is a menu selection in the A200 for gain. An AME pulled
the radio today and is sending it for bench testing. Hopefully this is something
simple! Getting really frustrated! Spent all this money on this airplane,
and now can't fly it! Sucks!!!
Stay tuned....
Thanks Bob!
Chad
--------
C-GYXQ. 912ULS. 601XL-B
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=387087#387087
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
Bob.....
When your radio squealed, did the transmission also squeal and become unreadable?
Chad
--------
C-GYXQ. 912ULS. 601XL-B
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=387088#387088
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
Forgive me if you've already answered this, but could this be as simple as
acoustic feedback?
If your comm radio's sidetone is cranked all the way up, and it's feeding
back into your boom mic, you'll get a squeal that will obliterate all voice.
Rick
On Tue, Nov 6, 2012 at 8:14 AM, SIDESLIP <Chad2007@rogers.com> wrote:
>
> Bob;
>
> I don't believe that there is a menu selection in the A200 for gain. An
> AME pulled the radio today and is sending it for bench testing. Hopefully
> this is something simple! Getting really frustrated! Spent all this money
> on this airplane, and now can't fly it! Sucks!!!
>
> Stay tuned....
>
> Thanks Bob!
>
>
> Chad
>
> --------
> C-GYXQ. 912ULS. 601XL-B
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=387087#387087
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
Chad,
I'm glad to hear you are having the radio bench tested. I was thinking
of suggesting something like that.
My thought was that having two transmitters connected to the same
antenna might cause one or the other to be damaged. I'm not sure it
even matters if one is turned off while the other is transmitting. The
power of the transmitter might damage the other radio even if it is
turned off.
Good luck,
Paul
Camas, WA
On 11/6/2012 8:14 AM, SIDESLIP wrote:
>
> Bob;
>
> I don't believe that there is a menu selection in the A200 for gain. An AME pulled
the radio today and is sending it for bench testing. Hopefully this is something
simple! Getting really frustrated! Spent all this money on this airplane,
and now can't fly it! Sucks!!!
>
> Stay tuned....
>
> Thanks Bob!
>
>
> Chad
>
> --------
> C-GYXQ. 912ULS. 601XL-B
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=387087#387087
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
Hey guys....
Could it be feedback? If it were, would the tower not be able to hear me either?
That theory makes sense to me... Ive messed around with High Power CB radios
and SSB stuff in years past. Ran a 500Watt boot on the CB radio in my car. Had
a TON of trouble shooting to do with that much power. Ran dual alternators and
batteries. I never encountered feedback though..... but turned anything within
500 feet with metal in it into a speaker though! I think i actually have a
SWR meter still around somewhere. Both radios have their own independent antennas,
so there isnt a mixing between the two. Like I said before.... Im praying
the radio has issues.... HA! That would make it an easy fix.
The previous owner said he never had any issues until recently..... IF that is
true, then the wiring should be correct and proper. He says that hes ALWAYS heard
the strobe 'PoP' from day one however..... so there still must be an RF leak
somewhere still. Hopefully the bench test shows something. Truthfully......
Id rather spend $1300.00 on a new A210 that plugs straight in and be done with
it if it were that simple. Wiring scares me! Such a pandora's box of possibilities.....
It does sound like feedback though.... Honestly. But, like I said, if it were in
fact a feedback issue between the comm and the Flightcom 403mc, would tower
still not get a clear voice? The other thing.... the radio slid out of the tray
really easy, so I wonder if some of the connections in the tray were intermittent?
Thanks guys!
Chad
--------
C-GYXQ. 912ULS. 601XL-B
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=387098#387098
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
Hi Chad,
I am not optimistic on the feedback theory. If you are using a
headphone with directional microphone (the aviation norm) it would be
hard to get sound from the ear pieces to the mike. That would be audio
sidetone back to the mike type feedback. If the transmit signal is
somehow getting into the receiver then the radio is broken. The
receiver should be turned off when the transmitter is hot.
Paul
On 11/6/2012 10:02 AM, SIDESLIP wrote:
>
> Hey guys....
>
> Could it be feedback? If it were, would the tower not be able to hear me either?
That theory makes sense to me... Ive messed around with High Power CB radios
and SSB stuff in years past. Ran a 500Watt boot on the CB radio in my car.
Had a TON of trouble shooting to do with that much power. Ran dual alternators
and batteries. I never encountered feedback though..... but turned anything within
500 feet with metal in it into a speaker though! I think i actually have
a SWR meter still around somewhere. Both radios have their own independent antennas,
so there isnt a mixing between the two. Like I said before.... Im praying
the radio has issues.... HA! That would make it an easy fix.
>
> The previous owner said he never had any issues until recently..... IF that is
true, then the wiring should be correct and proper. He says that hes ALWAYS
heard the strobe 'PoP' from day one however..... so there still must be an RF
leak somewhere still. Hopefully the bench test shows something. Truthfully......
Id rather spend $1300.00 on a new A210 that plugs straight in and be done with
it if it were that simple. Wiring scares me! Such a pandora's box of possibilities.....
>
> It does sound like feedback though.... Honestly. But, like I said, if it were
in fact a feedback issue between the comm and the Flightcom 403mc, would tower
still not get a clear voice? The other thing.... the radio slid out of the tray
really easy, so I wonder if some of the connections in the tray were intermittent?
>
> Thanks guys!
>
> Chad
>
> --------
> C-GYXQ. 912ULS. 601XL-B
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=387098#387098
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
I reiterate, have you checked ALL grounds to ALL electronic equipment and made
sure NONE of them SHARE A GROUND? Check all grounds (and not just communication
equipment, even meters or indicators, anything that has a ground wire) for looseness
or bad connection and do not share any ground wire between devices. It
doesn't sound like it would make a difference, but it does! Sharing grounds
may cause feedback circuits to develop even if the radio is not on the same ground.
Sometimes one of the multiple grounds may be a slight high resistance and
it two systems are on that ground can cause problems on every other system,
even if it does not share that ground.
I really do have experience in this problem and this is one of the first things
any good radio shop will tell you to check. I've been building and restoring
aircraft since the 70's and also used to be an electronic tech.
Tim
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=387107#387107
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
Tim;
I know what you are saying, and I've also had actual personal issues with bad grounds
before. Electricity will find the least resistant method of completing
a circuit. I've seen it first hand. I haven't had a chance to climb under the
dash, as you need to be a contortionist to do so, and it's freezing here. Where
my confusion comes in is that almost all of the research I've done says to actually
group the grounds together. Avionics together, NAV lights together and
so on. So, which do I do? Grounds to same spot / block or to all different places
on the airframe? Flightcom says to make the grounds all terminate together.
So, you can imagine my confusion. I think a few of the grounds were made by
riveting the grounds to the airframe in a few locations. The other challenge
is to actually LOCATE all the grounds.
Thanks for your help Tim! It is VERY appreciated!
Chad
--------
C-GYXQ. 912ULS. 601XL-B
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=387108#387108
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
The individual ground wires can go to the same ground connection ON THE FUSELAGE,
but they all have to be parallel and have their own wire.
check out these websites which have info on grounding problems and fixes (you don't
have to read the whole thing if you don't want to, just scan for the ground
sections):
http://www.radioworks.com/nbgnd.html
http://www.sacskyranch.com/bond.htm
http://www.zenithair.com/kit-data/ra/electric2.html
and a here are downloadable PDF file with full aircraft wiring tips AND sections
on "that evil ground".
www.eaa.org/experimenter/articles/0903_aircraft_wiring.pdf
engineer.jpl.nasa.gov/practices/1214.pdf
Remember, ground loops are not only in taildraggers! LOL
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=387111#387111
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
You should ground all of your avionics units to the same point on the airframe
but each one should have its own separate ground wire running to that point. your
lighting circuits and such can share ground wires but the avionics units and
many of your engine gauges should not. I have a common grounding point for
nearly everything on my airplane. I even have the engine block and battery grounded
to this point. The only things that use the airframe as ground are the nav
and landing lights.
One more point to remember is this: the shield on your audio transmission lines
should not be part of the audio circuit. The audio should line should have a
separate wire for signal high and signal low within the same shield. All of the
shields on audio transmission lines should be grounded at one end only, not
both. It is best to ground all of the shields at the same common point. Usually
this means grounding them at the audio panel or intercom panel, whichever is
the main hub of the audio system.
This is not to be confused with the shield on radio frequency transmission lines.
In this case the shield IS part of the circuit and MUST be grounded on both
ends.
The shield on audio lines is to keep stray signals out, the shield on RF lines
is to keep the signals in.
The audio low line should not be grounded if it can be avoided. If the audio is
returning to the radio through the airframe, all the noise running through the
airframe will come through with it. Most head phone and microphone jacks have
the audio low line connected to the outer threaded shell of the jack. If these
jacks are mounted to the metal airframe they should be installed with insulators
to prevent them from grounding out to the airframe.
Some avionics equipment is built with the audio low line grounded to the equipment
chassis, in this case you can't avoid grounding the audio. You just have to
be extra careful not to ground it anywhere else.
On Nov 6, 2012, at 4:23 PM, SIDESLIP <Chad2007@rogers.com> wrote:
>
> Tim;
>
> I know what you are saying, and I've also had actual personal issues with bad
grounds before. Electricity will find the least resistant method of completing
a circuit. I've seen it first hand. I haven't had a chance to climb under the
dash, as you need to be a contortionist to do so, and it's freezing here. Where
my confusion comes in is that almost all of the research I've done says to
actually group the grounds together. Avionics together, NAV lights together and
so on. So, which do I do? Grounds to same spot / block or to all different
places on the airframe? Flightcom says to make the grounds all terminate together.
So, you can imagine my confusion. I think a few of the grounds were made
by riveting the grounds to the airframe in a few locations. The other challenge
is to actually LOCATE all the grounds.
>
> Thanks for your help Tim! It is VERY appreciated!
>
> Chad
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL,
RAM Subaru, Stratus re-drive.
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
Chad,
When I transmitted the guys on the ground heard it (I was doing my initial
flight).What I did initially was to put the mike farther away from my mouth
.That worked until I adjusted the gain.I hear you about your frustration.I
was ready to install my wings when the" upgrade was published"
B
ob
zman601xl@aol.com
-----Original Message-----
From: SIDESLIP <Chad2007@rogers.com>
Sent: Tue, Nov 6, 2012 11:16 am
Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flyi
ng... HELP!
Bob.....
When your radio squealed, did the transmission also squeal and become
unreadable?
Chad
--------
C-GYXQ. 912ULS. 601XL-B
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=387088#387088
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| Subject: | Re: Radio/Comm issue! Grounding airplane from flying... |
HELP!
Oh no! All that way, only to have to rip them apart again! Yikes! As for my squeal....
It squeals immediately when pushing the PTT. No talking nesassary.
Chad
I should have an answer about the bench test tomorrow around noon. Stay tuned.
--------
C-GYXQ. 912ULS. 601XL-B
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=387130#387130
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