---------------------------------------------------------- Zenith601-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 01/16/13: 5 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:13 AM - Re: CH601HD Wing tanks (Marcos Varela Sartal) 2. 07:31 AM - Re: CH601HD Wing tanks (Carlos Sa) 3. 08:09 AM - Re: CH601HD Wing tanks (Paul Mulwitz) 4. 11:35 AM - Re: CH601HD Wing tanks (Larry McFarland) 5. 01:29 PM - Re: Need help with diode across battery and starter relays (w8n2bup) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:13:13 AM PST US From: Marcos Varela Sartal Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks Hello Larry and all,=0A=C2-I=C2=B4m clear now. I have also a =C2-.032" 6061T6 sheet (I have to bought one only for rear spars and small pieces but is 12 x 4 ft)=0AAnother question as I=C2=B4m prepairing the order to Spruc e, the selector valve must switch between right and left tank only or right -left and both? I want to use aluminium fuel line of 1/4", It=C2=B4s ok? My engine is a Jabiru 2200.=0AThanks again=0AMarcos Varela=C2-=0A =0A=0A___ _____________________________=0A De: Larry McFarland =0APara: zenith601-list@matronics.com =0AEnviado: Mi=C3=A9rcoles 16 de enero de 2013 0:17=0AAsunto: RE: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks=0A =0A=0AHi Marcos,=0AYes, there are no holding points or fasteners per se, bu t the fit has to be such that the nose skin, spar bumpers only contact the cork that gets wrapped=0AAround the tank.=C2- The tank should fit like a glove and it will not move about at all after the nose skin is formally cle coed or riveted in place. =0A.040 is a bit heavier than I=99d use for wing tanks.=C2- .040 would weld fine, but it=99d be 25% heavier th an it should be and not improved for strength or durability.=0ANot so sure of the tank length, but the clearance was approximately =C2=BD inch tank en d to rib each end.=C2- =0A=C2-=0AThe first half of Journal section 2 co vers most of the process of doing tanks.=0AGood luck!=0A=C2-=0ALarry McFa rland =0A=C2-=0AFrom:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:ow ner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcos Varela Sartal =0ASent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 3:09 PM=0ATo: zenith601-list@matronics.c om=0ASubject: Re: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks=0A=C2-=0AHello Larry =C2-and all,=0AThanks a lot for your help, I=C2=B4ve studied your web sev eral times..... Great job with a lot of useful information.=0AI have an ide a of what I need but just some points of doubt:=0A- I understood thast ther e is no fixing points, just the cork and the wing skin around it?=0A- What about the angles on the rear (between tank and spar) Is only to separate a little, no rivets or screws=C2-to attach the tank?=0A- How long is the ta nk and how much separate from the first rib?=0A=C2-=0AI read about using 5052 aluminium sheet, but I have a lot of 6061T6 sheet of .040 but i=C2=B4m not sure if this is weldable.=0AThanks in advance=0AMarcos Varela=0A=C2- =0ADe:Larry McFarland =0APara: zenith601-list@ma tronics.com =0AEnviado: Martes 15 de enero de 2013 15:50=0AAsunto: RE: Zeni th601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks=0A=0A=0AHi Marcos,=0AI built tanks within my wing leading edges. It was and interesting process. The process is documen ted in Section 2 of my journal and in subjects of =0Aconstruct in the site menu called =9Clead edge tanks=9D. See my website at macsmachin e.com. The pictures show tools, jigs and some of the=0Amethods which enable d fitting, jigging and welding the ends, back and nose skins.=C2- I =99d recommend you use .032 minimum material if you are welding these.=0AYo u could=C2- possibly do without the drawings if you look very carefully a t what was done on my site and template tank ribs 1/8 inch smaller than the wing=0Aribs and shorter by the depth of spar bumpers.=C2- Also, it =99s not hard to make a set of filler caps that go flush with the wing skin if you study what was done on my site.=0AI will say that the constant chor d non-tapered wing should make the job much easier than what I had to do wi th the HDS.=0Ahttp://www.macsmachine.com/html/leadedgetanks.htm=0AAs you ma y have questions, do please feel free to ask.=0A=C2-=0ALarry McFarland=C2 - =C2-=0Alarrycmcfarland@gmail.com=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0AFrom:owner-zenit h601-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronic s.com] On Behalf Of Marcos Varela Sartal=0ASent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 7:30 AM=0ATo: zenith601-list@matronics.com=0ASubject: Zenith601-List: CH601 HD Wing tanks=0A=C2-=0AHello all,=0AI=C2=B4m started to build the wing sp ars, left spar=C2-is riveted and right one=C2-in proccess. I want to in stall wing tanks but my plans (Serial 8487) has not information about that. =0AI want to build my own tanks in 5052 aluminium sheet but I have no idea how to support them in the wing spars. The only information I get are some pictures from HDS wings and I think I have to move the ribs to allow space for the tanks.=0AAny information, photos, etc...?=0A=C2-=0AMarcos Varela =0ASPAIN=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Ze nith601-List=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/=0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/cont ribution=0A=C2-=0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/========== ===============0Aforums.matronics.com/" rel=" nofollow" target="_blank">http://forums.mat/==C2-=C2- --> =0A=0A=0A =0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith601- List=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com=0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/contribution ==================== ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:31:50 AM PST US From: Carlos Sa Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks Hello, Marcos I believe the valve and fuel line specs are regulated locally. I didn't do the plumbing yet, but I recall having read posts saying that in Canada we need at least 3/8" (if memory serves me). There is also some restriction on the fuel valve (I think it cannot (or must??) have a "both" position...). I suggest you talk to local builders to see what is required. Good luck Carlos On 16 January 2013 10:12, Marcos Varela Sartal wrot e: > Hello Larry and all, > I=B4m clear now. I have also a .032" 6061T6 sheet (I have to bought one > only for rear spars and small pieces but is 12 x 4 ft) > Another question as I=B4m prepairing the order to Spruce, the selector va lve > must switch between right and left tank only or right-left and both? I wa nt > to use aluminium fuel line of 1/4", It=B4s ok? My engine is a Jabiru 2200 .. > Thanks again > Marcos Varela > > *De:* Larry McFarland > *Para:* zenith601-list@matronics.com > *Enviado:* Mi=E9rcoles 16 de enero de 2013 0:17 > *Asunto:* RE: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks > > Hi Marcos, > Yes, there are no holding points or fasteners per se, but the fit has to > be such that the nose skin, spar bumpers only contact the cork that gets > wrapped > Around the tank. The tank should fit like a glove and it will not move > about at all after the nose skin is formally clecoed or riveted in place. > .040 is a bit heavier than I=92d use for wing tanks. .040 would weld fin e, > but it=92d be 25% heavier than it should be and not improved for strength or > durability. > Not so sure of the tank length, but the clearance was approximately =BD i nch > tank end to rib each end. > > The first half of Journal section 2 covers most of the process of doing > tanks. > Good luck! > > Larry McFarland > > *From:* owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com [mailto: > owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Marcos Varela > Sartal > *Sent:* Tuesday, January 15, 2013 3:09 PM > *To:* zenith601-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Re: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks > > Hello Larry and all, > Thanks a lot for your help, I=B4ve studied your web several times..... Gr eat > job with a lot of useful information. > I have an idea of what I need but just some points of doubt: > - I understood thast there is no fixing points, just the cork and the win g > skin around it? > - What about the angles on the rear (between tank and spar) Is only to > separate a little, no rivets or screws to attach the tank? > - How long is the tank and how much separate from the first rib? > > I read about using 5052 aluminium sheet, but I have a lot of 6061T6 sheet > of .040 but i=B4m not sure if this is weldable. > Thanks in advance > Marcos Varela > > *De:* Larry McFarland > *Para:* zenith601-list@matronics.com > *Enviado:* Martes 15 de enero de 2013 15:50 > *Asunto:* RE: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks > > > Hi Marcos, > I built tanks within my wing leading edges. It was and interesting > process. The process is documented in Section 2 of my journal and in > subjects of > construct in the site menu called =93lead edge tanks=94. See my website a t > macsmachine.com. The pictures show tools, jigs and some of the > methods which enabled fitting, jigging and welding the ends, back and nos e > skins. I=92d recommend you use .032 minimum material if you are welding > these. > You could possibly do without the drawings if you look very carefully at > what was done on my site and template tank ribs 1/8 inch smaller than the > wing > ribs and shorter by the depth of spar bumpers. Also, it=92s not hard to > make a set of filler caps that go flush with the wing skin if you study > what was done on my site. > I will say that the constant chord non-tapered wing should make the job > much easier than what I had to do with the HDS. > http://www.macsmachine.com/html/leadedgetanks.htm > As you may have questions, do please feel free to ask. > > Larry McFarland > larrycmcfarland@gmail.com > > > *From:* owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com [ > mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] > *On Behalf Of *Marcos Varela Sartal > *Sent:* Tuesday, January 15, 2013 7:30 AM > *To:* zenith601-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks > > Hello all, > I=B4m started to build the wing spars, left spar is riveted and right one in > proccess. I want to install wing tanks but my plans (Serial 8487) has not > information about that. > I want to build my own tanks in 5052 aluminium sheet but I have no idea > how to support them in the wing spars. The only information I get are som e > pictures from HDS wings and I think I have to move the ribs to allow spac e > for the tanks. > Any information, photos, etc...? > > Marcos Varela > SPAIN > > * * > > * * > > * * > > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith601-List* > > *http://forums.matronics.com/* > > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > > * * > > *http://www.matronics.com/=============== =========* > > *forums.matronics.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://forums. mat/= --> * > > * > > > * > > > * * > > * > * > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith601-List* > > ** > > ** > > *http://forums.matronics.com* > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > > ** > > * * > > *com/Navigator?Zenith601-List" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http:// wwwhref="http://forums.matronics.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank" >htn" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribut ion============ > * > > > * > =========== =========== =========== =========== > * > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:09:07 AM PST US From: Paul Mulwitz Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks Hi Marcos, Both on fuel selector only works for high wing aircraft. If you want to learn why, get two glasses of water and two straws. Put only a little water in one glass and fill the other one. Then suck on both straws together. What will happen is you will empty one glass and then just suck air without ever getting any more from the full one. Paul Camas, WA USA On 1/16/2013 7:12 AM, Marcos Varela Sartal wrote: > Hello Larry and all, > Im clear now. I have also a .032" 6061T6 sheet (I have to bought > one only for rear spars and small pieces but is 12 x 4 ft) > Another question as Im prepairing the order to Spruce, the selector > valve must switch between right and left tank only or right-left and > both? I want to use aluminium fuel line of 1/4", Its ok? My engine is > a Jabiru 2200. > Thanks again > Marcos Varela > > *De:* Larry McFarland > *Para:* zenith601-list@matronics.com > *Enviado:* Mircoles 16 de enero de 2013 0:17 > *Asunto:* RE: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks > > Hi Marcos, > Yes, there are no holding points or fasteners per se, but the fit has > to be such that the nose skin, spar bumpers only contact the cork that > gets wrapped > Around the tank. The tank should fit like a glove and it will not > move about at all after the nose skin is formally clecoed or riveted > in place. > .040 is a bit heavier than Id use for wing tanks. .040 would weld > fine, but itd be 25% heavier than it should be and not improved for > strength or durability. > Not so sure of the tank length, but the clearance was approximately > inch tank end to rib each end. > The first half of Journal section 2 covers most of the process of > doing tanks. > Good luck! > Larry McFarland > *From:*owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of > *Marcos Varela Sartal > *Sent:* Tuesday, January 15, 2013 3:09 PM > *To:* zenith601-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Re: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks > Hello Larry and all, > Thanks a lot for your help, Ive studied your web several times..... > Great job with a lot of useful information. > I have an idea of what I need but just some points of doubt: > - I understood thast there is no fixing points, just the cork and the > wing skin around it? > - What about the angles on the rear (between tank and spar) Is only to > separate a little, no rivets or screws to attach the tank? > - How long is the tank and how much separate from the first rib? > I read about using 5052 aluminium sheet, but I have a lot of 6061T6 > sheet of .040 but im not sure if this is weldable. > Thanks in advance > Marcos Varela > *De:*Larry McFarland > > *Para:* zenith601-list@matronics.com > > *Enviado:* Martes 15 de enero de 2013 15:50 > *Asunto:* RE: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks > > > Hi Marcos, > I built tanks within my wing leading edges. It was and interesting > process. The process is documented in Section 2 of my journal and in > subjects of > construct in the site menu called lead edge tanks. See my website at > macsmachine.com. The pictures show tools, jigs and some of the > methods which enabled fitting, jigging and welding the ends, back and > nose skins. Id recommend you use .032 minimum material if you are > welding these. > You could possibly do without the drawings if you look very carefully > at what was done on my site and template tank ribs 1/8 inch smaller > than the wing > ribs and shorter by the depth of spar bumpers. Also, its not hard to > make a set of filler caps that go flush with the wing skin if you > study what was done on my site. > I will say that the constant chord non-tapered wing should make the > job much easier than what I had to do with the HDS. > http://www.macsmachine.com/html/leadedgetanks.htm > As you may have questions, do please feel free to ask. > Larry McFarland > larrycmcfarland@gmail.com > *From:*owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of > *Marcos Varela Sartal > *Sent:* Tuesday, January 15, 2013 7:30 AM > *To:* zenith601-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks > Hello all, > Im started to build the wing spars, left spar is riveted and right > one in proccess. I want to install wing tanks but my plans (Serial > 8487) has not information about that. > I want to build my own tanks in 5052 aluminium sheet but I have no > idea how to support them in the wing spars. The only information I get > are some pictures from HDS wings and I think I have to move the ribs > to allow space for the tanks. > Any information, photos, etc...? > Marcos Varela > SPAIN > * * > * * > * * > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith601-List* > *http://forums.matronics.com/* > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > * * > *http://www.matronics.com/========================* > *forums.matronics.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://forums.mat/= -->* > *_ > > > _* > * * > * > * > ** > ** > ** > ** > ** > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith601-List* > ** > ** > *http://forums.matronics.com* > ** > ** > ** > ** > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > ** > * * > *com/Navigator?Zenith601-List" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://wwwhref="http://forums.matronics.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">htn" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution============ > > * > > > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 11:35:20 AM PST US From: "Larry McFarland" Subject: RE: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks HI Marcos, You=99ll be better off using 3/8 O.D.- .035 wall 3000 series aluminum fuel line. The 3/8 line has been nearly a requirement in aviation for a long time. Select only a fuel valve that allows left, right or off. 6061 T6 is also easily by TIG process. 5052 is selected for deep formed products that need to stretch. 6061 is very corrosion resistant and suitable for tank material. Try to get something like an Andair fuel valve, with left right and off, see FS20 valves at Aircraft Spruce. Larry McFarland From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcos Varela Sartal Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:13 AM Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks Hello Larry and all, I=C2=B4m clear now. I have also a .032" 6061T6 sheet (I have to bought one only for rear spars and small pieces but is 12 x 4 ft) Another question as I=C2=B4m prepairing the order to Spruce, the selector valve must switch between right and left tank only or right-left and both? I want to use aluminium fuel line of 1/4", It=C2=B4s ok? My engine is a Jabiru 2200. Thanks again Marcos Varela De: Larry McFarland Para: zenith601-list@matronics.com Enviado: Mi=C3=A9rcoles 16 de enero de 2013 0:17 Asunto: RE: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks Hi Marcos, Yes, there are no holding points or fasteners per se, but the fit has to be such that the nose skin, spar bumpers only contact the cork that gets wrapped Around the tank. The tank should fit like a glove and it will not move about at all after the nose skin is formally clecoed or riveted in place. .040 is a bit heavier than I=99d use for wing tanks. .040 would weld fine, but it=99d be 25% heavier than it should be and not improved for strength or durability. Not so sure of the tank length, but the clearance was approximately =C2=BD inch tank end to rib each end. The first half of Journal section 2 covers most of the process of doing tanks. Good luck! Larry McFarland From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcos Varela Sartal Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 3:09 PM Subject: Re: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks Hello Larry and all, Thanks a lot for your help, I=C2=B4ve studied your web several times..... Great job with a lot of useful information. I have an idea of what I need but just some points of doubt: - I understood thast there is no fixing points, just the cork and the wing skin around it? - What about the angles on the rear (between tank and spar) Is only to separate a little, no rivets or screws to attach the tank? - How long is the tank and how much separate from the first rib? I read about using 5052 aluminium sheet, but I have a lot of 6061T6 sheet of .040 but i=C2=B4m not sure if this is weldable. Thanks in advance Marcos Varela De: Larry McFarland Para: zenith601-list@matronics.com Enviado: Martes 15 de enero de 2013 15:50 Asunto: RE: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks Hi Marcos, I built tanks within my wing leading edges. It was and interesting process. The process is documented in Section 2 of my journal and in subjects of construct in the site menu called =9Clead edge tanks=9D. See my website at macsmachine.com. The pictures show tools, jigs and some of the methods which enabled fitting, jigging and welding the ends, back and nose skins. I=99d recommend you use .032 minimum material if you are welding these. You could possibly do without the drawings if you look very carefully at what was done on my site and template tank ribs 1/8 inch smaller than the wing ribs and shorter by the depth of spar bumpers. Also, it=99s not hard to make a set of filler caps that go flush with the wing skin if you study what was done on my site. I will say that the constant chord non-tapered wing should make the job much easier than what I had to do with the HDS. http://www.macsmachine.com/html/leadedgetanks.htm As you may have questions, do please feel free to ask. Larry McFarland larrycmcfarland@gmail.com From: owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith601-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcos Varela Sartal Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 7:30 AM Subject: Zenith601-List: CH601HD Wing tanks Hello all, I=C2=B4m started to build the wing spars, left spar is riveted and right one in proccess. I want to install wing tanks but my plans (Serial 8487) has not information about that. I want to build my own tanks in 5052 aluminium sheet but I have no idea how to support them in the wing spars. The only information I get are some pictures from HDS wings and I think I have to move the ribs to allow space for the tanks. Any information, photos, etc...? Marcos Varela SPAIN http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith601-List http://forums.matronics.com/ http://www.matronics.com/contribution http://www.matronics.com/================ ======= forums.matronics.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://forums.mat/= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith601-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution com/Navigator?Zenith601-List" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://wwwhref= "http://forums.matronics.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">htn" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution====== ====== ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 01:29:57 PM PST US Subject: Zenith601-List: Re: Need help with diode across battery and starter relays From: "w8n2bup" thanks to all. A combination of all of your responses gave me the information I needed Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392459#392459 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message zenith601-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Zenith601-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/zenith601-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/zenith601-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.