Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:10 AM - 801 For sale (Ron & Erin Weich)
2. 11:46 AM - Chris Heintz letter (Jon Croke)
3. 05:03 PM - Re: Chris Heintz letter (n801bh@netzero.com)
4. 05:39 PM - Re: Chris Heintz letter (ZodieRocket)
5. 07:00 PM - Re: Chris Heintz letter (n801bh@netzero.com)
6. 07:19 PM - Cable tension (Zed Smith)
7. 08:32 PM - Re: Cable tension (n801bh@netzero.com)
8. 09:22 PM - Re: Cable tension (ZodieRocket)
Message 1
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N801TB for sale
Built 2004
235 TTAF
235 TSNEW Superior 0-360
LASAR Ignition
Apollo GX60 GPS/Com
Garmin GTX 327 Transponder
Trutrak AP
4-place intercom
"Steam Gauges"
Landshorter VG's on Horizontal stab
long range tanks
$65,000 Photos on trade-a-plane.com
Ron Weich
Las Cruces, NM
ron@ranchonogal.com<mailto:ron@ranchonogal.com>
575-621-5933
Message 2
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| Subject: | Chris Heintz letter |
FYI,
There is a NEW letter from Chris Heintz regarding aileron flutter posted
at www.zenair.org (open to all readers)
I would like to thank Chris Heintz for this letter, as I think it could
be of importance to all CH design builders and CH aircraft owners.
Thanks
Jon
editor
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Chris Heintz letter |
I love Zenith and their product line of kitplanes,,, BUT. The article st
ates to set the cable tension to 75 LBS on the first flight and let the
cable loosen. MY guess is at 75 LBS you will rip out all the pulleys an
d other components linked to the cables. I really can't believe Chris wo
uld have said that... Just my humble opinion though,
do not archive
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
-- "Jon Croke" <Jon@joncroke.com> wrote:
FYI, There is a NEW letter from Chris Heintz regarding aileron flutter p
osted at www.zenair.org (open to all readers)I would like to thank Chri
s Heintz for this letter, as I think it could be of importance to all CH
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Message 4
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| Subject: | Chris Heintz letter |
Ben, the 801 flies just fine with 80 lbs, the intent is to ensure that
all slack in the cables is released and then adjusted to proper value. I
have set the tension of cables for another builder and set them to
40lbs. After the first flight the cables were less then 10lbs. I quickly
re-adjusted them back to 35lbs and redid the safety wire and they stayed
constant to the first annual. The intent and desire is that during the
first flight all chances of flutter or overly loose cables is removed.
Chris has told me several times and at our chapter meeting for the RAA
to ensure that the cable tension is higher then spec for first flight
then backed off to appropriate # and checked often. During the 801's 25
hrs the last two weeks I checked the cable tension 5 times, the value
never changed from setting it to 35lbs, this is not always the case.
Mark Townsend
Can-Zac Aviation Ltd.
president@can-zacaviation.com
www.can-zacaviation.com <http://www.can-zacaviation.com/>
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
n801bh@netzero.com
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2008 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Chris Heintz letter
I love Zenith and their product line of kitplanes,,, BUT. The article
states to set the cable tension to 75 LBS on the first flight and let
the cable loosen. MY guess is at 75 LBS you will rip out all the
pulleys and other components linked to the cables. I really can't
believe Chris would have said that... Just my humble opinion though,
do not archive
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
-- "Jon Croke" <Jon@joncroke.com> wrote:
FYI,
There is a NEW letter from Chris Heintz regarding aileron flutter posted
at www.zenair.org <http://www.zenair.org/> (open to all readers)
I would like to thank Chris Heintz for this letter, as I think it could
be of importance to all CH design builders and CH aircraft owners.
Thanks
Jon
editor
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7/24/2008 5:42 PM
Message 5
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| Subject: | Chris Heintz letter |
The plans call for cable tension to be 25-35 lbs. That is with the front
gear off the ground so to get the full measurement. If the gear is sett
led the cables get real tight real quick when the gear is fully extended
.
On my 801 set the tension to 32 lbs. Checked it every few hours and it d
ropped 3 lbs in the first 10 hours and has not changes since. My rudder
pivot point is about worn out at 200+ hours and hundreds of landings. I
personally can't imagine 40 lbs> . 80 !!!! lbs Good luck. I will go bac
k to the 801 website and see if Chris has modified the tension specs on
the 801 to 80 lbs. My guess it is still 25-35 lbs. I am not wanting to
get in a pissing match with ya as I respect you alot but this is how I f
eel..
Tailwinds.
Ben Haas
N801BH
Ben, the 801 flies just fine with 80 lbs, the intent is to ensure that a
ll slack in the cables is released and then adjusted to proper value. I
have set the tension of cables for another builder and set them to 40lbs
. After the first flight the cables were less then 10lbs. I quickly re-a
djusted them back to 35lbs and redid the safety wire and they stayed con
stant to the first annual. The intent and desire is that during the firs
t flight all chances of flutter or overly loose cables is removed. Chris
has told me several times and at our chapter meeting for the RAA to ens
ure that the cable tension is higher then spec for first flight then bac
ked off to appropriate # and checked often. During the 801=92s 25 hrs th
e last two weeks I checked the cable tension 5 times, the value never ch
anged from setting it to 35lbs, this is not always the case.<?xml:names
pace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
Mark Townsend
Can-Zac Aviation Ltd.
president@can-zacaviation.com
www.can-zacaviation.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith7
01801-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of n801bh@netzero.com
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2008 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Chris Heintz letter
I love Zenith and their product line of kitplanes,,, BUT. The article st
ates to set the cable tension to 75 LBS on the first flight and let the
cable loosen. MY guess is at 75 LBS you will rip out all the pulleys an
d other components linked to the cables. I really can't believe Chris wo
uld have said that... Just my humble opinion though,
do not archive
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
-- "Jon Croke" <Jon@joncroke.com> wrote:
FYI,
There is a NEW letter from Chris Heintz regarding aileron flutter posted
at www.zenair.org (open to all readers)
I would like to thank Chris Heintz for this letter, as I think it could
be of importance to all CH design builders and CH aircraft owners.
Thanks
Jon
editor
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Message 6
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do not archive
In other industries, in particular those using extremely long cables....on the
order of 2000 to 2500 feet, it is common practice to "stretch" these prior to
actual use.
In the case of riggers building tall communications towers, a new piece of winch
cable is wound onto the winch reel then unwound up a tower, over a pulley and
back down, then loaded with at least 50 percent of the cable capacity to "straighten"
and relax the cable. In some cases they will simple stretch the cable
across a field and slowly drag a pickup truck as the cable is wound back on
the winch.
Whatever method is used, they NEVER use the cable without first a good smooth pull
to see that it is okay, free of burrs, defects, twists, etc.
Old crop duster (now deceased) once told me to "stretch" it before attaching second
thimble.
His method was to install first thimble, then cut the cable about a foot too long.
He attached the thimble end high in the hangar and attached an old engine block
to the bottom end; ran the loose end through a bolt hole, doubled it back and
clamped it with Vise Grip pliers. Let it hang several days.
Idea was/is that after having been stretched, the measurement for the second thimble
would be more likely to be correct for much longer......less stretch after
installation.
Surely everybody has a spare 300 pound cast iron block in the back yard.
Regards to all,
Zed
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Cable tension |
It ain't the cable that worries me. It is the attach points that the cab
le runs on, ie, Pulleys and their brackets, fairleads, turn buckles, cle
vis pins. etc.....
Over and out.
do not archive
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
-- Zed Smith <zsmith3rd@earthlink.net> wrote:
net>
do not archive
In other industries, in particular those using extremely long cables....
on the order of 2000 to 2500 feet, it is common practice to "stretch" th
ese prior to actual use.
In the case of riggers building tall communications towers, a new piece
of winch cable is wound onto the winch reel then unwound up a tower, ove
r a pulley and back down, then loaded with at least 50 percent of the ca
ble capacity to "straighten" and relax the cable. In some cases they wi
ll simple stretch the cable across a field and slowly drag a pickup truc
k as the cable is wound back on the winch.
Whatever method is used, they NEVER use the cable without first a good s
mooth pull to see that it is okay, free of burrs, defects, twists, etc.
Old crop duster (now deceased) once told me to "stretch" it before attac
hing second thimble.
His method was to install first thimble, then cut the cable about a foot
too long.
He attached the thimble end high in the hangar and attached an old engin
e block to the bottom end; ran the loose end through a bolt hole, double
d it back and clamped it with Vise Grip pliers. Let it hang several day
s.
Idea was/is that after having been stretched, the measurement for the se
cond thimble would be more likely to be correct for much longer......les
s stretch after installation.
Surely everybody has a spare 300 pound cast iron block in the back yard.
Regards to all,
Zed
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========================
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========================
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Message 8
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Hi Ben, I am not worried about the pully's or attach points. The only
thing I would be concerned about is the fairleads in the high tensile
setting and since that is only for one circuit then I am not very
concerned. The rest of the hardware can handle a lot more then you would
expect. I have an 801 with a LOM engine right now that is in for
repairs, it had a boo boo with the nose gear. I expect the cables were
well over 200 lbs before I released as much pressure as I could, they
are still well over 70 lbs but I am at the end of the turnbuckle and I
do not wish to release the rudder until it is in the shop. There has
been no damage to the any parts the cables are in contact with. Though
this is not as big an issue with 701 and 801's as our flapperons are
tube operated and the lighter cables on the rudder and elevator are not
such a big deal. The letter is directed at more of the 601 family. There
have been many planes in the 601 series that I have seen with very loose
cables and though in the older 601's that cruised at 90 mph it was never
really such a big deal and warranted little attention. The 601XL with a
larger aileron that can cruise at 130 mph and as we have heard on the
other list several guys exceeded the Vne having loose cables can be a
serious issue. I believe Chris is just bringing to attention that AC43-
13B chapter 7 should be read and followed by all builders in order to
have the safest plane.
Also Ben thanks for the kind words, and never be afraid to speak up
against me, I write these letters late at night after a very long day. I
try to help out as much as possible, but if I am in error then I expect
to be slapped silly. I have no issue with admitting that I am wrong from
time to time as we all are. Often I add my personal feelings into my
answers as well. What I like is definitely not what everyone likes,
which is the perfect reason for newbie's to read these lists in order to
get many opinions and decide for themselves. I simply tell the guys in
my shop if you think your opinion is far better then mine all you have
to do is convince me, if I have more reasons for my way then that is how
it is done, if they have more reasons then I have, I'm open for change.
Prime example is the engine discussion for the 701, if your alternate
engine is better then the Rotax, then convince me. I always had a Subaru
in my 601's until the XL. I had a Sub EA-82 MPFI Turbo mounted on the XL
at first, but I was shown the light on the Corvair being a better choice
so the Sub is sitting in the corner of the hanger. Yes the 701 is
sporting a Rotax 912.
Mark Townsend
Can-Zac Aviation Ltd.
president@can-zacaviation.com
www.can-zacaviation.com <http://www.can-zacaviation.com/>
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
n801bh@netzero.com
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2008 11:28 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Cable tension
It ain't the cable that worries me. It is the attach points that the
cable runs on, ie, Pulleys and their brackets, fairleads, turn buckles,
clevis pins. etc.....
Over and out.
do not archive
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
-- Zed Smith <zsmith3rd@earthlink.net> wrote:
<zsmith3rd@earthlink.net>
do not archive
In other industries, in particular those using extremely long
cables....on the order of 2000 to 2500 feet, it is common practice to
"stretch" these prior to actual use.
In the case of riggers building tall communications towers, a new piece
of winch cable is wound onto the winch reel then unwound up a tower,
over a pulley and back down, then loaded with at least 50 percent of the
cable capacity to "straighten" and relax the cable. In some cases they
will simple stretch the cable across a field and slowly drag a pickup
truck as the cable is wound back on the winch.
Whatever method is used, they NEVER use the cable without first a good
smooth pull to see that it is okay, free of burrs, defects, twists, etc.
Old crop duster (now deceased) once told me to "stretch" it before
attaching second thimble.
His method was to install first thimble, then cut the cable about a foot
too long.
He attached the thimble end high in the hangar and attached an old
engine block to the bottom end; ran the loose end through a bolt hole,
doubled it back and clamped it with Vise Grip pliers. Let it hang
several days.
Idea was/is that after having been stretched, the measurement for the
second thimble would be more likely to be correct for much
longer......less stretch after installation.
Surely everybody has a spare 300 pound cast iron block in the back yard.
Regards to
all,===================================================================
============================bsp; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
____________________________________________________________
Recharge and relax.
<http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2242/fc/Ioyw6i4uHYu5MOaJuQEcQNgU
FvzLgnPHryNgHbwzNvXAQCaNWEqw1U/> Click for great vacation ideas.
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7/24/2008 5:42 PM
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