Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:34 AM - Re: After 5 hours flight time, questions (kmccune)
2. 06:27 AM - Chat Room Reminder For "Digesters" (George Race)
3. 08:25 AM - Re: 701 Hard Landing (ricklach)
4. 09:41 AM - Re: Re: 701 Hard Landing (Joe Stevenson)
5. 10:09 AM - Re: 701 Hard Landing (kmccune)
6. 11:41 AM - Re: Re: 701 Hard Landing (Damien and Kathy)
7. 11:47 AM - Re: Re: 701 Hard Landing (Craig Payne)
8. 12:15 PM - Re: Re: 701 Hard Landing (Damien and Kathy)
9. 02:28 PM - Re: 801 wing root rib (Tom P)
10. 02:28 PM - Re: 801 wing root rib (Tom P)
11. 06:59 PM - Re: 701 Hard Landing (ricklach)
12. 08:16 PM - Re: BIG tires on 801 (John Swartout)
13. 08:30 PM - Re: fuel flow for CH701 (SafeAirOne)
14. 08:58 PM - Re: After 5 hours flight time, questions (mwpicard)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: After 5 hours flight time, questions |
I like that!
do not archive
mwpicard wrote:
> STOLness
--------
Mark Twain: Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that
you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream.
Discover.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 5357#205357
Message 2
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| Subject: | Chat Room Reminder For "Digesters" |
Please join us for our Monday evening chat room starting around 8:00 PM
Eastern Time.
<blocked::blocked::blocked::blocked::http://www.mykitairplane.com/chat/>
http://www.mykitairplane.com/chat/
George
CH-701 - N73EX - IT FLYS!
Do Not Archive
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Hard Landing |
I would not doubt that youre A&P is a very qualified person, but if he has not
repaired a 701 after a hard landing he might not know exactly where to look for
problems. I've repaired two hard landing 701's. Both hard landings were from
the same mistake, they pulled power to soon at too low an airspeed. This is typical
in a 701 and results in the big bounce. The big bounce bends the main gear
out and then after the big bounce the plane pitches forward and lands on the
nose gear, and if its a real big bounce it then continues forward over on to
its back.
There are two places to look to see how bad the bounce was. The main gear area.
It dose not ripple the out side skin but it flexes the box that the gear is recessed
in that runs from right to left under the seats. Go in from the belly
access door with a flash light and look at the box for kinks about 6 to 10 inches
inboard from the steel gear/strut mount. If they were bad kinks they should
have been repaired with doublers in that area. You should also look from under
the aircraft in this area for kinks in the box and around the floorboard.
The second place to look for problems is the nose gear. If the gear has been bottomed
from a hard landing or a big bounce the strut comes up and hits the engine
mount tubes. You cant see it because its between the firewall and the mount
tubes. But you can sure feel it with your fingers. Also you will find ripples
in the belly skin round the triangular plate that mounts the nose gear strut
to the bottom of the fuselage.
Also if it did go up on to the nose gear but did not go over it most likely hit
one of the wing tips as it pivoted and came back down. This would have damaged
the slat at the wing tip and required repair.
None of these problems are killer. The 701 is a rugged airplane and be repaired
easy.
Hope this helps youre A&P.
Rick
--------
Rick
N35 26.700, W118 16.743
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 5372#205372
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Hard Landing |
Rick,=0A=0AExcellent post, I've saved to to my "need to keep" file, thanks
a lot, this is thkind of information I love to learn about from others and
why I joined the list.=0A=0AJoe=0A=0ADo Not Archive =0A=0A=0A=0A----- Origi
nal Message ----=0AFrom: ricklach <rick@ravengear.us>=0ATo: zenith701801-li
st@matronics.com=0ASent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 10:25:16 AM=0ASubject:
Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Hard Landing=0A=0A--> Zenith701801-List message
posted by: "ricklach" <rick@ravengear.us>=0A=0AI would not doubt that you
=99re A&P is a very qualified person, but if he has not repaired a 70
1 after a hard landing he might not know exactly where to look for problems
. I've repaired two hard landing 701's. Both hard landings were from the sa
me mistake, they pulled power to soon at too low an airspeed. This is typic
al in a 701 and results in the big bounce. The big bounce bends the main ge
ar out and then after the big bounce the plane pitches forward and lands on
the nose gear, and if it=99s a real big bounce it then continues for
ward over on to it=99s back. =0A=0AThere are two places to look to se
e how bad the bounce was. The main gear area. It dose not ripple the out si
de skin but it flexes the box that the gear is recessed in that runs from r
ight to left under the seats. Go in from the belly access door with a flash
light and look at the box for kinks about 6 to 10 inches inboard from the
steel gear/strut mount.- If they were bad kinks they should have been rep
aired with doublers in that area. You should also look from under the aircr
aft in this area for kinks in the box and around the floorboard.=0A=0AThe s
econd place to look for problems is the nose gear. If the gear has been bot
tomed from a hard landing or a big bounce the strut comes up and hits the e
ngine mount tubes. You can=99t see it because it=99s between th
e firewall and the mount tubes. But you can sure feel it with your fingers.
Also you will find ripples in the belly skin round the triangular plate th
at mounts the nose gear strut to the bottom of the fuselage. =0A=0AAlso if
it did go up on to the nose gear but did not go over it most likely hit one
of the wing tips as it pivoted and came back down. This would have damaged
the slat at the wing tip and required repair. =0A=0ANone of these problems
are killer. The 701 is a rugged airplane and be repaired easy. =0A=0AHope
this helps you=99re A&P.=0A=0ARick=0A=0A--------=0ARick=0AN35 26.700,
- W118 16.743=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://foru
- - - - - - - - - - - - - -Matt Dralle, List Admi
======0A=0A=0A
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Hard Landing |
I'll second that, good info.
Kevin
--------
Mark Twain: Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that
you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream.
Discover.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 5380#205380
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Hard Landing |
Rick:
Thanks for the info. It will be very useful for the future. Unfortunately I
have since found out that in addition to the hard landing it also had a prop
strike. That is more damage history than I want to deal with, but the search
goes on.
Regards,
Damien
DO NOT ARCHIVE
----- Original Message -----
From: "ricklach" <rick@ravengear.us>
Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 11:25 AM
Subject: Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Hard Landing
>
> I would not doubt that you?Tre A&P is a very qualified person, but if he
> has not repaired a 701 after a hard landing he might not know exactly
> where to look for problems. I've repaired two hard landing 701's. Both
> hard landings were from the same mistake, they pulled power to soon at too
> low an airspeed. This is typical in a 701 and results in the big bounce.
> The big bounce bends the main gear out and then after the big bounce the
> plane pitches forward and lands on the nose gear, and if it?Ts a real big
> bounce it then continues forward over on to it?Ts back.
>
> There are two places to look to see how bad the bounce was. The main gear
> area. It dose not ripple the out side skin but it flexes the box that the
> gear is recessed in that runs from right to left under the seats. Go in
> from the belly access door with a flash light and look at the box for
> kinks about 6 to 10 inches inboard from the steel gear/strut mount. If
> they were bad kinks they should have been repaired with doublers in that
> area. You should also look from under the aircraft in this area for kinks
> in the box and around the floorboard.
>
> The second place to look for problems is the nose gear. If the gear has
> been bottomed from a hard landing or a big bounce the strut comes up and
> hits the engine mount tubes. You can?Tt see it because it?Ts between the
> firewall and the mount tubes. But you can sure feel it with your fingers.
> Also you will find ripples in the belly skin round the triangular plate
> that mounts the nose gear strut to the bottom of the fuselage.
>
> Also if it did go up on to the nose gear but did not go over it most
> likely hit one of the wing tips as it pivoted and came back down. This
> would have damaged the slat at the wing tip and required repair.
>
> None of these problems are killer. The 701 is a rugged airplane and be
> repaired easy.
>
> Hope this helps you?Tre A&P.
>
> Rick
>
> --------
> Rick
> N35 26.700, W118 16.743
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 5372#205372
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Hard Landing |
Was this a 701 on Barnstormers? If so, which one?
-- Craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Damien
and Kathy
Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 12:06 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Hard Landing
<dgraham7@twcny.rr.com>
Rick:
Thanks for the info. It will be very useful for the future. Unfortunately I
have since found out that in addition to the hard landing it also had a prop
strike. That is more damage history than I want to deal with, but the search
goes on.
Regards,
Damien
DO NOT ARCHIVE
----- Original Message -----
From: "ricklach" <rick@ravengear.us>
Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 11:25 AM
Subject: Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Hard Landing
>
> I would not doubt that you?Tre A&P is a very qualified person, but if he
> has not repaired a 701 after a hard landing he might not know exactly
> where to look for problems. I've repaired two hard landing 701's. Both
> hard landings were from the same mistake, they pulled power to soon at too
> low an airspeed. This is typical in a 701 and results in the big bounce.
> The big bounce bends the main gear out and then after the big bounce the
> plane pitches forward and lands on the nose gear, and if it?Ts a real big
> bounce it then continues forward over on to it?Ts back.
>
> There are two places to look to see how bad the bounce was. The main gear
> area. It dose not ripple the out side skin but it flexes the box that the
> gear is recessed in that runs from right to left under the seats. Go in
> from the belly access door with a flash light and look at the box for
> kinks about 6 to 10 inches inboard from the steel gear/strut mount. If
> they were bad kinks they should have been repaired with doublers in that
> area. You should also look from under the aircraft in this area for kinks
> in the box and around the floorboard.
>
> The second place to look for problems is the nose gear. If the gear has
> been bottomed from a hard landing or a big bounce the strut comes up and
> hits the engine mount tubes. You can?Tt see it because it?Ts between the
> firewall and the mount tubes. But you can sure feel it with your fingers.
> Also you will find ripples in the belly skin round the triangular plate
> that mounts the nose gear strut to the bottom of the fuselage.
>
> Also if it did go up on to the nose gear but did not go over it most
> likely hit one of the wing tips as it pivoted and came back down. This
> would have damaged the slat at the wing tip and required repair.
>
> None of these problems are killer. The 701 is a rugged airplane and be
> repaired easy.
>
> Hope this helps you?Tre A&P.
>
> Rick
>
> --------
> Rick
> N35 26.700, W118 16.743
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 5372#205372
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Hard Landing |
It was the one in Kentucky. Nice looking plane, nice paint job. I have not
looked at the plane in person, Kentucky is just too far away (I live in NY)
for me to be able to properly evaluate the airplane for damage.
Regards,
Damien
DO NOT ARCHIVE
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig Payne" <craig@craigandjean.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 2:47 PM
Subject: RE: Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Hard Landing
> <craig@craigandjean.com>
>
> Was this a 701 on Barnstormers? If so, which one?
>
> -- Craig
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Damien
> and Kathy
> Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 12:06 PM
> To: zenith701801-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Hard Landing
>
> <dgraham7@twcny.rr.com>
>
> Rick:
> Thanks for the info. It will be very useful for the future. Unfortunately
> I
> have since found out that in addition to the hard landing it also had a
> prop
> strike. That is more damage history than I want to deal with, but the
> search
> goes on.
> Regards,
> Damien
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "ricklach" <rick@ravengear.us>
> To: <zenith701801-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 11:25 AM
> Subject: Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Hard Landing
>
>
>>
>> I would not doubt that you?Tre A&P is a very qualified person, but if he
>> has not repaired a 701 after a hard landing he might not know exactly
>> where to look for problems. I've repaired two hard landing 701's. Both
>> hard landings were from the same mistake, they pulled power to soon at
>> too
>> low an airspeed. This is typical in a 701 and results in the big bounce.
>> The big bounce bends the main gear out and then after the big bounce the
>> plane pitches forward and lands on the nose gear, and if it?Ts a real
>> big
>> bounce it then continues forward over on to it?Ts back.
>>
>> There are two places to look to see how bad the bounce was. The main gear
>> area. It dose not ripple the out side skin but it flexes the box that the
>> gear is recessed in that runs from right to left under the seats. Go in
>> from the belly access door with a flash light and look at the box for
>> kinks about 6 to 10 inches inboard from the steel gear/strut mount. If
>> they were bad kinks they should have been repaired with doublers in that
>> area. You should also look from under the aircraft in this area for kinks
>> in the box and around the floorboard.
>>
>> The second place to look for problems is the nose gear. If the gear has
>> been bottomed from a hard landing or a big bounce the strut comes up and
>> hits the engine mount tubes. You can?Tt see it because it?Ts between
>> the
>> firewall and the mount tubes. But you can sure feel it with your fingers.
>> Also you will find ripples in the belly skin round the triangular plate
>> that mounts the nose gear strut to the bottom of the fuselage.
>>
>> Also if it did go up on to the nose gear but did not go over it most
>> likely hit one of the wing tips as it pivoted and came back down. This
>> would have damaged the slat at the wing tip and required repair.
>>
>> None of these problems are killer. The 701 is a rugged airplane and be
>> repaired easy.
>>
>> Hope this helps you?Tre A&P.
>>
>> Rick
>>
>> --------
>> Rick
>> N35 26.700, W118 16.743
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 5372#205372
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: 801 wing root rib |
I would order the right length you need to make it the correct length. Keep in
mind also that your cabin frame will be adjusted to the length of the main spar
to the rear spar. When it comes time to do that you will be making a template
for each wing that holds top cabin frame at the correct distance for each wing.
I'm not sure how much of a difference in the two would be acceptable so keep
that in mind that you might want to make sure both wings will be kinda close
in this distance. Mine happen to be exact! The final test though will be when
I put the wings on, hopefully they fit perfectly and I made no mistakes while
measuring for my templates.
--------
Tom CH801
Dynon D180
Lycoming IO-360 From Teledyne Mattituck
www.computerclubcanada.com/plane.htm
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 5405#205405
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: 801 wing root rib |
I would order the right length you need to make it the correct length. Keep in
mind also that your cabin frame will be adjusted to the length of the main spar
to the rear spar. When it comes time to do that you will be making a template
for each wing that holds top cabin frame at the correct distance for each wing.
I'm not sure how much of a difference in the two would be acceptable so keep
that in mind that you might want to make sure both wings will be kinda close
in this distance. Mine happen to be exact! The final test though will be when
I put the wings on, hopefully they fit perfectly and I made no mistakes while
measuring for my templates.
--------
Tom CH801
Dynon D180
Lycoming IO-360 From Teledyne Mattituck
www.computerclubcanada.com/plane.htm
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 5406#205406
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Hard Landing |
Thank You all for your kind comments.
--------
Rick
N35 26.700, W118 16.743
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 5437#205437
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: BIG tires on 801 |
WOW, those are expensive tires. Seems like the 701 is really flourishing 25
years after its introduction.
John
On Sun, Sep 21, 2008 at 12:23 AM, Ken Ryan <kenryan@alaska.net> wrote:
>
> Hi John,
>
> Don't know about 801s but look at this 701 for ideas:
>
> http://qualitysportplanes.com/qsp-2006_027.htm
>
>
> On 20 Sep 2008 at 21:01, John Swartout wrote:
>
> >
> > Have any of you 801 builders put big tundra tires on your airplane? You
> would have to put a huge
> > fork on the nose gear, I would think. Kind of awkward on a tri-gear, but
> I wonder if anybody's
> > done it.
> >
> > John
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: fuel flow for CH701 |
Great study of the issue, Bob!
I was curious about this problem and its solution in production aircraft. A web
search revealed the same complaint from everything from Yaks to Cessnas. Of
course, the Yaks are low-winged, but the discussion in their forum eventually
turned to the problem in Cessnas.
See:
http://www.aviatorair.com/Site/Aviator_Forum.html
>From what I gather, unless you can get a common vent line completely above the
fuel level, (and we can't do this with any degree of elegance in the 701/801)
you can only minimize the issue, as Cessna has, and not eliminate it.
Interesting to note that the full tank is the one feeding the engine and siphoning
the fuel out of the emptier tank to fill the vacuum created in the feeding
tank.
-Mark
do not archive
Read this topic online here:
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Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: After 5 hours flight time, questions |
IF I were to do the windows again, I would think about a suggestion from Doug Dugger
to make one of the windows opening so you have easy access to the baggage
compartment as well.
martin
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 5452#205452
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