Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:47 AM - 4 bladed Props (Jay Parker)
2. 07:09 AM - Re: Re: VNE (Ken Arnold)
3. 05:34 PM - Re: VGs (d.shrader)
4. 07:12 PM - Re: Re: VGs. (Gary Gower)
5. 09:53 PM - Re: Re: VGs (JohnDRead@aol.com)
Message 1
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JG;=0A--- I was browsing your VG website and came across your propell
er study.- I saw the pictures of the bright orange 4 bladed Brolga propel
ler for UltraLights and really liked its looks.- Do you know of any manuf
acturers who make them to fit an 801?- I believe I'd need a propeller wit
h shorter blades as I am considering getting the Rotec R3600 radial, 150 hp
engine which has its shaft central compared to other engines like Lycoming
, Franklin or Jabiru-which place it's hub higher up on the engine's frame
.--The centrally placed hub of the Rotec will lower the distance to the
ground, so I'm going to need shorter blades.- Zenith recommends an O-360
engine fitted with a fixed-pitch Sensenich 76-EM8-0-54 metal propeller.-
It's hub-appears to be about 6 inches higher on the Lycoming in relation
to the plane than it would be on a centrally placed hub of a Rotec R3600 e
ngine, making the blade length around 70 inches on a Rotec instead of the 7
6 inch on
the Sensenich.- =0A--- Propeller science is new to me and I was su
rprised that the different propellers you used in your tests and studies ac
hieved-all pretty close to the same results.- Anyhow, I haven't started
this CH-801 yet, but I'm diligently doing as much research as possible bef
ore I start this project.-I'm-pretty much convinced now to buy the VGs
for both the wings and elevators instead of investing in-a leading edge s
lat kit (I can always add them later if needed), but I just couldn't find m
uch information for a layman regarding propeller characteristics, proper pi
tch, lengths, materials, etc, until your study.- Thanks for all your work
and effort.- That was why I was happy to read your section on props even
though it was research on the blades for a 701/Savannah and not the 801, i
t pretty much told me that propellers are propellers, you just need to know
if you want better cruise or climb abilities.-- Do you or any of the r
eaders know of a
manufacturer of props who can make a 4 bladed, 70 inch blades, set for bes
t cruise performance, composite-material and rated-for 150hp engines?
- I know you-are asking...why 4 blades instead of 3 or 2.- I just wan
t 4 blades.....heard they are quieter and I believe it would look better wi
th the radial engine.=0A=0AThanks;=0AJay
Message 2
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Ooops. Make that per minute.
Ken
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Wilde" <dwilde@clearwire.net>
Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2009 4:47 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Re: VNE
>
> Ken Arnold wrote:
>> Hey JB,
>> My DAR doesn't like to fly beyond Vne. Just a tad under Vne at 50%
>> throttle gets great mileage. A tad over Vne and the wings twist off
>> is not great!
>>
>> I will never intentionally exceed Vne. Hanging around the FBO you
>> often hear stories about bold pilots and their exciting flights. I am
>> perfectly satisfied flying by the rules.
>>
>> My CH701 climbs out at about 1200 ft per sec. Plenty fast for plane
>> built to Zenith specs.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Ken
>>
>> do not archive
>>
>>
> 1200 feet per second. Did you install a JATO rocket? :-)
>
> Dan Wilde
>
>
>
>
Message 3
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John,
vg's are part of all modern airfoil design STOL included from boeing on down
to cessna. If it didn't come equiped that way there is a STC for it. All the
aircraft I work on have them and most of the ones that fly out of this reagon
have them. Cub's & 185's included. I'm not trying to stoke the flames at all
just pointing out vg's will improve almost any airfoil (not lamanar flow)
study it for your self and make an informed decision and good luck in your build.
Dave
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=254537#254537
Message 4
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I second that,- The slats do work,- At the airstrips I fly from...- I
Sure trust the slats 100%
-
There is also a "plus": they give that beautifull STOL- "looks" to the wi
ngs.
In the local flyins- I have heard peoples comment about the "massive wing
s" of my 701...
(smiling proud owner(s) below the wing's shade).
Is also part of the 701 looks, same as the transition from the wings to the
cabin,- make it look very "jeep" like...- I love my airplane.
-
Removing the slats (I-think, because never-WILL test that-"up"-here
) -is like driving around in a souped up car (1/4 mile look alike) with a
big muscle engine, headers, decals-and everything, but running on normal
white walls...-- Why install the wide racy ones?...- (yes, looks and
performance).
-
VERY Sincerely,-one recent-experience with our 701:
-
I would had NEVER-tried to take off without the slats at 6,300 ft ASL in
a 97=BAF-day!!!!
This last week end from Lagos Air Club barbaque, @ 1,028-lbs take off wei
ght (yes, a good very serious preflight is a must, including exact-weight
of gas and passenger)
21=B015'20.94"N 101=B056'47.33"W
Also notice, in the Google Earth, that only about 2,300 ft on the south sid
e of that closed airport is usable (for Ultralights/ very light planes only
).
Also another important plus of the 701:- 5 gph autogas...-
-
Saludos
Gary Gower
701 912S-- 255 hrs.
Flying from Chapala, Mexico.-
Coordenadas Google Earth.
20=B018'33.86"N 103=B0 9'36.99"W
-
--- On Wed, 7/22/09, Gordon <cscsail@gmavt.net> wrote:
From: Gordon <cscsail@gmavt.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Re: VGs
I'm with you 100% John. People that like the planes flying characteristics
with the slats removed, probably selected the wrong plane to build.
Gordon-
----- Original Message -----
From: JohnDRead@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2009 10:07 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Re: VGs
Why bother to build a STOL aircraft if you take away the things that make i
t so? VGs only make poor airfoils work better, they do not make a STOL wing
out of any airfoil. Flame away!
-
John Read
CH701 - Elbert CO - Jabiru 3300
Phone: 303-648-3261
Fax: 303-648-3262
Cell: 719-494-4567
-
In a message dated 7/22/2009 1:52:36 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, peterltho
mson@gmail.com writes:
.com>
I have the Stolspeed VG's on wings and elevator.
I took my slats off, and I'll never re-fit them.
I think the only time you'll find a difference (if one exists) is
when the nose is pointing at an angle which would scare most people to
death.
The Vg's on the elevator make it easy to hold the nose off at very
slow touchdown speeds.
Key advantages are the loss of drag, better fuel economy and ease of
cruise near the maximum.
Peter
CH701 SP (CZAW)
912ULS
VG's - no Use utilities Day ===============
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Message 5
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I am familiar with vgs and how they work. The fact is that a slotted wing
is the best way to get STOL characteristics. And I'll repeat vgs make a
poor (or under performing) airfoil work better. They will not make a regular
airfoil into a STOL airfoil. Find a copy of Abbot and Von Doenhoff, they
explain slots very well.
John Read
CH701 - Elbert CO - Jabiru 3300
Phone: 303-648-3261
Fax: 303-648-3262
Cell: 719-494-4567
In a message dated 7/23/2009 6:34:59 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time,
chilledj@yahoo.com writes:
--> Zenith701801-List message posted by: "d.shrader" <chilledj@yahoo.com>
John,
vg's are part of all modern airfoil design STOL included from boeing on
down to cessna. If it didn't come equiped that way there is a STC for it.
All the aircraft I work on have them and most of the ones that fly out of
this reagon have them. Cub's & 185's included. I'm not trying to stoke
the flames at all just pointing out vg's will improve almost any airfoil (not
lamanar flow) study it for your self and make an informed decision and
good luck in your build.
Dave
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=254537#254537
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