Today's Message Index:
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1. 05:41 AM - Re: Machining rivet gun heads (Tommy Walker)
2. 06:43 AM - Re: Machining rivet gun heads (BobKat)
3. 08:43 AM - Re: Machining rivet gun heads (Tommy Walker)
4. 06:53 PM - Re: Machining rivet gun heads (Larry)
5. 07:08 PM - Re: Machining rivet gun heads (Randy L. Thwing)
6. 11:04 PM - Official Zenith701801-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) (Matt Dralle)
7. 11:10 PM - Official Zenith701801-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Machining rivet gun heads |
People do it at home using a dremel tool. You may have to heat the heads t
o
soften them first. The aluminum rivets don't need the heat treated heads
anyway.
Here's the link to the builders site where the 701 updates are:
http://www.zenithair.com/bldr/bldr.htm#701
<http://www.zenithair.com/bldr/bldr.htm#701>I think you can update your
plans and get the CD from Joyce by snail mail.
We used the Zenith supplied Cortec rust inhibitor. Water based, and
supplied by Zenith.
Good luck,
Tommy Walker in Alabama
Do Not Archive
On Sat, Apr 30, 2011 at 11:16 AM, Perry Delano <pdelano@telus.net> wrote:
> I=92m anxious to rivet my rudder skeleton together, is there a good way t
o do
> this at home without any exotic bits or tools. If not, I=92ll send them t
o
> Zenith.
>
>
> Also, is Zinc-Chromate still the rust inhibitor of choice.
>
>
> Finally, I do not want to wear Joyce out at Zenith, so I=92ll ask the
> question here. I was originally going to build from plans but due to time
> contraints realize a kit is the only way to go.
>
> Where on the Zenith site or Builders site do I find where to buy the
> updated construction manual CD. Joyce tells me its there but I have not b
een
> able to find it.
>
> With the changes that have been made to the kit since I bought my plans
> I=92ve found that although I avoided any mistakes in putting the rudder
> skeleton together
>
> there was the potential to do something wrong given the predrilling
>
> in the new kit parts.
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
> *
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Machining rivet gun heads |
I used the white Cortec for a while but it didn=92t seem to stick very
well. Now as I=92m painting the plane and cleaning it prior to the
paint, areas that have that stuff on are a bit rough. Then I found it
comes off readily with alcohol and any cleaning solution. So I
wasn=92t impressed with it too much. I suppose between joints where
its not exposed to the elements it is safe, but I sure wouldn=92t use it
where it might be exposed to air or anything. I also tried some stuff
called =93self etching primer=94 from the local body shop supplier
place. I wasn=92t impressed that it stuck very well either and easily
removed a big area that I had previously sprayed.
So I=92d sure be leery of using either of those two products anywhere
that you would ultimately paint over. Both come off so easily that
paint over top of it I would worry about it ultimately flaking off.
What doesn=92t seem to come off and what I found to be best is the zinc
chromate primer. I actually tried my best to get it off an area which I
was planning on painting, but couldn=92t get it off, and whats best is
that it didn=92t show through the subsequent primer and paint, like the
cortec stuff did, before I figured out that it had to come off or live
with it.
So I guess I went full circle with the old standby zinc chromate stuff
that I=92d used liberally on a couple of previous aircraft builds,
mainly on steel tube and fabric parts rather than aluminum. Sticks well
and almost impossible to remove and at least with the paint method I=92m
using (Stewart systems) it doesn=92t show on areas that are exposed to
the surface.
I do a lot of other metal work, fabricating stuff for friends mainly
steel, and used the self etching stuff previously but now have gone back
to zinc chromate for any project that I want to last. Its old
technology maybe, but it does seem to stick and last!
From: Tommy Walker
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2011 7:38 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Machining rivet gun heads
People do it at home using a dremel tool. You may have to heat the
heads to soften them first. The aluminum rivets don't need the heat
treated heads anyway.
Here's the link to the builders site where the 701 updates are:
http://www.zenithair.com/bldr/bldr.htm#701
I think you can update your plans and get the CD from Joyce by snail
mail.
We used the Zenith supplied Cortec rust inhibitor. Water based, and
supplied by Zenith.
Good luck,
Tommy Walker in Alabama
Do Not Archive
On Sat, Apr 30, 2011 at 11:16 AM, Perry Delano <pdelano@telus.net>
wrote:
I=92m anxious to rivet my rudder skeleton together, is there a good
way to do this at home without any exotic bits or tools. If not, I=92ll
send them to Zenith.
Also, is Zinc-Chromate still the rust inhibitor of choice.
Finally, I do not want to wear Joyce out at Zenith, so I=92ll ask the
question here. I was originally going to build from plans but due to
time contraints realize a kit is the only way to go.
Where on the Zenith site or Builders site do I find where to buy the
updated construction manual CD. Joyce tells me its there but I have not
been able to find it.
With the changes that have been made to the kit since I bought my
plans I=92ve found that although I avoided any mistakes in putting the
rudder skeleton together
there was the potential to do something wrong given the predrilling
in the new kit parts.
ist"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith701801-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Machining rivet gun heads |
Hi Bobkat,
If I'm not mistaken, and I sure could be, the cortec is to be used only
under mating surfaces for raw aluminum. It isn't to be used as a primer for
paint.
Here's what we did for bare aluminum before painting:
cleaned and scuffed the surface with scotch bright pads (green).
washed the surface with alodine to treat the surface and thoroughly rinsed
with water.
sprayed our primer, which was an automotive primer.
sprayed our final coats of paint.
for unpainted mating surfaces, we cleaned the parts with lacquer thinner and
applied a coat of cortec to each surface and let it dry, then put the parts
together and riveted.
I'm using Stewarts on my latest build, but it is over fabric so the process
is different.
Tommy Walker in Alabama
do not archive and the advice I give is what you pay for it.
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| Subject: | Re: Machining rivet gun heads |
I made mine with a drill bit. Just put the flat head in a drill press
vice and use the right size bit (I forget the size), smoke it until it
burns enough of the head away, throw away the bit. Simple, I guarantee
it works. More than one way to skin a cat. Larry, N1345L
On 5/1/2011 10:41 AM, Tommy Walker wrote:
> Hi Bobkat,
>
> If I'm not mistaken, and I sure could be, the cortec is to be used only
> under mating surfaces for raw aluminum. It isn't to be used as a primer for
> paint.
> Here's what we did for bare aluminum before painting:
>
> cleaned and scuffed the surface with scotch bright pads (green).
> washed the surface with alodine to treat the surface and thoroughly rinsed
> with water.
> sprayed our primer, which was an automotive primer.
> sprayed our final coats of paint.
>
> for unpainted mating surfaces, we cleaned the parts with lacquer thinner and
> applied a coat of cortec to each surface and let it dry, then put the parts
> together and riveted.
>
> I'm using Stewarts on my latest build, but it is over fabric so the process
> is different.
>
> Tommy Walker in Alabama
> do not archive and the advice I give is what you pay for it.
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Machining rivet gun heads |
do not archive
>From the archives:
The Dremel works fine and fast, use a small green round ball (silicon
carbide) or any other stone that has a point or round end, Put the riviet
gun head in the lathe chuck and while spinning it, fire off the moto-tool,
hold it with both hands braced against whatever is nearby, and shape the end
in a nice conical shape, starting from the hole in the center and working
outward, keep the cone shallow, you can always go deeper. No gottem lathe?
Sure you do, put your fastest turning pistol grip drill motor in your
workbench vise, usually upside down with pistol grip up, (up is towards the
sky for you airplane builders!) tighten vise enough to hold drill case, not
crushing it where the armature will never turn again! Place the rivet head
in the drill chuck and lock the trigger back and grind away. Takes longer
to describe than to do, finish with emery cloth if your stones grind course.
Hope this helps.
Regards,
Randy L. Thwing, 701/plans
Message 6
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| Subject: | Official Zenith701801-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) |
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- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
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- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
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| Subject: | Official Zenith701801-List Usage Guidelines |
Dear Listers,
Please read over the Zenith701801-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete
Zenith701801-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Zenith701801-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
******************************************************************************
Zenith701801-List Usage Guidelines
******************************************************************************
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the Zenith701801-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the Zenith701801-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
Zenith701801-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the Zenith701801-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
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