Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:49 AM - Re: Center of Radius Elevator (MacDonald Doug)
2. 06:23 AM - Re: Re: Front strut steering (John Swanson)
3. 06:55 AM - Re: Center of Radius Elevator (Perry Delano)
4. 07:09 AM - Re: Center of Radius Elevator (fritz)
5. 08:50 AM - Re: Center of Radius Elevator (JohnDRead@aol.com)
6. 09:29 AM - Re: Center of Radius Elevator (cdnch701builder)
7. 11:00 AM - Re: Center of Radius Elevator (Perry Delano)
8. 11:15 AM - Re: Center of Radius Elevator (cdnch701builder)
9. 11:21 AM - Re: Center of Radius Elevator (MacDonald Doug)
10. 06:47 PM - Re: Center of Radius Elevator (Robert Pelland)
11. 10:02 PM - Re: Center of Radius Elevator (Perry Delano)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Center of Radius Elevator |
Perry, just for clarification, which model are we talking about?=0A-=0ADo
ug M=0ACH-701 from scratch=0ANW Ontario, Canada=0A-=0ADo Not Archive=0A
=0A=0A________________________________=0A From: Perry Delano <pdelano@telus
.net>=0ATo: zenith701801-list@matronics.com =0ASent: Saturday, January 7, 2
012 5:17:21 PM=0ASubject: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator=0A
=0A=0AHi all,=0A-=0AWould like to confirm before drilling the skin for th
e elevator what is meant by center of radius for the skin and nose rib. I h
ave measured from the bent flange 450 mm and then from the unbent flange 46
5 mm which coincided with the mark for the 450 mm measurement. I am assumin
g what is meant by the center of radius is the mark 8- mm above the cente
rline of the rear rib projected to through the tip rib but I would like to
be sure.=0A-=0AHelp in clarifying this and some way to do a sanity check
====
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Front strut steering |
On Jan 3, 2012, at 12:30 PM, Larry wrote:
>
> Actually, the rudder/front wheel spring setup has been extremely well
tested/used. The same setup has been used on the RAF-2000 gyroplane for
many many years. It wasn't exactly my idea, I just put it on a 701. I
have 20+ hours of taxiing on my 701, and it works fine. Larry did fly,
Larry just doesn't care to anymore, as they say, "been there, done
that". When I flew gyros it helped a lot. If you don't think you would
like the setup you can always tighten them up where you have no spring
assistance. Take care, Larry
Larry
Thanks for the reply, I would like to try your spring mod.
on my CH701.
Do your have a parts list?
if not can you tell me more about the parts needed, size of spring etc.
thanks
John
ch701 912
Message 3
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| Subject: | Center of Radius Elevator |
Hi Doug,
It is a 701. Further to my query, although the plans seem to make it pretty
clear that the 18mm bent flange on the elevator skin is on the top, which
coincides with the hard copy of the photo assembly guide (Rev. 1.1) I got
with the plans, The DVD photo assembly guide Rev. 1.2 I bought recently
from Zenith says the bent flange is on the bottom. If I could get a
confirmation whether it's the top or bottom that would be greatly
appreciated.
Regards,
Perry
From: owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of MacDonald
Doug
Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 5:45 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator
Perry, just for clarification, which model are we talking about?
Doug M
CH-701 from scratch
NW Ontario, Canada
Do Not Archive
From: Perry Delano <pdelano@telus.net>
Sent: Saturday, January 7, 2012 5:17:21 PM
Subject: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator
Hi all,
Would like to confirm before drilling the skin for the elevator what is
meant by center of radius for the skin and nose rib. I have measured from
the bent flange 450 mm and then from the unbent flange 465 mm which
coincided with the mark for the 450 mm measurement. I am assuming what is
meant by the center of radius is the mark 8 mm above the centerline of the
rear rib projected to through the tip rib but I would like to be sure.
Help in clarifying this and some way to do a sanity check would be
appreciated.
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith701801-http://www.matronics.com/con
tribution" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">h
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Center of Radius Elevator |
Perry-- you should consider doing away with the bend (on the trailing edge
of the elevator)---- this was recommended by CH a long time ago--- but I
guess it never made it into the 701 plans.-------- Do it the way it is done
on the Ch-750.
The bend in the trailing edge of the elevator on the 701 leads to severe
elevator trim problems.
Fritz
----- Original Message -----
From: "Perry Delano" <pdelano@telus.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 9:50 AM
Subject: RE: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator
> Hi Doug,
>
>
> It is a 701. Further to my query, although the plans seem to make it
> pretty
> clear that the 18mm bent flange on the elevator skin is on the top, which
> coincides with the hard copy of the photo assembly guide (Rev. 1.1) I got
> with the plans, The DVD photo assembly guide Rev. 1.2 I bought recently
> from Zenith says the bent flange is on the bottom. If I could get a
> confirmation whether it's the top or bottom that would be greatly
> appreciated.
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
> Perry
>
>
> From: owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> MacDonald
> Doug
> Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 5:45 AM
> To: zenith701801-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator
>
>
> Perry, just for clarification, which model are we talking about?
>
>
> Doug M
>
> CH-701 from scratch
>
> NW Ontario, Canada
>
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> From: Perry Delano <pdelano@telus.net>
> To: zenith701801-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Saturday, January 7, 2012 5:17:21 PM
> Subject: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator
>
> Hi all,
>
>
> Would like to confirm before drilling the skin for the elevator what is
> meant by center of radius for the skin and nose rib. I have measured from
> the bent flange 450 mm and then from the unbent flange 465 mm which
> coincided with the mark for the 450 mm measurement. I am assuming what is
> meant by the center of radius is the mark 8 mm above the centerline of
> the
> rear rib projected to through the tip rib but I would like to be sure.
>
>
> Help in clarifying this and some way to do a sanity check would be
> appreciated.
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith701801-http://www.matronics.com/con
> tribution" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">h
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Center of Radius Elevator |
The center of radius is shown on the drawings of the elevator.
Regards, John
CH701 - Colorado - Jabiru 3300
Cell: 719-494-4567
Home: 303-648-3261
In a message dated 1/8/2012 6:49:51 A.M. Mountain Standard Time,
dougsnash@yahoo.com writes:
Perry, just for clarification, which model are we talking about?
Doug M
CH-701 from scratch
NW Ontario, Canada
Do Not Archive
From: Perry Delano <pdelano@telus.net>
Sent: Saturday, January 7, 2012 5:17:21 PM
Subject: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator
Hi all,
Would like to confirm before drilling the skin for the elevator what is
meant by center of radius for the skin and nose rib. I have measured from the
bent flange 450 mm and then from the unbent flange 465 mm which coincided
with the mark for the 450 mm measurement. I am assuming what is meant by
the center of radius is the mark 8 mm above the centerline of the rear rib
projected to through the tip rib but I would like to be sure.
Help in clarifying this and some way to do a sanity check would be
appreciated.
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith701801-http://www.matronics.com/con
tribution" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">h
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith701801-List)
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution)
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Center of Radius Elevator |
Hey Perry...
Look at the enclosed PDF for the answer! This from the Zenair newsletter
from 1999... where
CH offered a solution to the elevator trim problems as well as with the
flaperons. The
problem is the with the riveted aft trailing edge of the control surface.
The original
elevator drawing(since day 1) was designed with the aft TE bent up... this
was done for the for
the older 2 stroke engines. When they went to the heavier 912 engines this
is where the
problem started... builders were have problems running out of elevator and
control. So CH
issued this notice in the newsletter... which was all nice and dandy, BUT
did not make the
change in the drawings... hence the problem still exists.
I sent Jon Croke a notice that this should be re-issued in the newsletter
last winter... BUT he
did not. If you phone Zenair they will tell you what to do to correct the
problem... which is
to bend the flange down(instead of up) where upper skin is level at the TE!
--
R.D.(Ron) Leclerc
Winnipeg, MB Canada
49-56-27N 097-06-44W Elev 729'
Plans Builder CH701 STOL
VW Type 4 Power, Redrive
http://www.ronleclerc.net
http://www.flyingonfloats.com
cdnch701@mts.net,
08/01/2012
****************************************
This E-Mail scanned with AVG Anti-Virus Ver: 10.0!
****************************************
<klondike@megalink.net>
:--)>
:--)> Perry-- you should consider doing away with the bend (on the trailing
edge of the
:--)> elevator)---- this was recommended by CH a long time ago--- but I
guess it never
:--)> made it into the 701 plans.-------- Do it the way it is done on the
Ch-750.
:--)>
:--)> The bend in the trailing edge of the elevator on the 701 leads to
severe elevator
:--)> trim problems.
:--)>
:--)> Fritz
:--)>
:--)>
:--)> ----- Original Message -----
:--)> From: "Perry Delano" <pdelano@telus.net>
:--)> To: <zenith701801-list@matronics.com>
:--)> Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 9:50 AM
:--)> Subject: RE: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator
:--)>
:--)>
:--)>:--)> Hi Doug,
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> It is a 701. Further to my query, although the plans seem to make
it pretty
:--)>:--)> clear that the 18mm bent flange on the elevator skin is on the
top, which
:--)>:--)> coincides with the hard copy of the photo assembly guide (Rev.
1.1) I got
:--)>:--)> with the plans, The DVD photo assembly guide Rev. 1.2 I bought
recently from
:--)>:--)> Zenith says the bent flange is on the bottom. If I could get a
confirmation
:--)>:--)> whether it's the top or bottom that would be greatly
appreciated.
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> Regards,
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> Perry
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> From: owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com
:--)>:--)> [mailto:owner-zenith701801-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf
Of MacDonald
:--)>:--)> Doug Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 5:45 AM To: zenith701801-
:--)>:--)> list@matronics.com
:--)>:--)> Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> Perry, just for clarification, which model are we talking about?
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> Doug M
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> CH-701 from scratch
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> NW Ontario, Canada
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> Do Not Archive
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> From: Perry Delano <pdelano@telus.net>
:--)>:--)> To: zenith701801-list@matronics.com
:--)>:--)> Sent: Saturday, January 7, 2012 5:17:21 PM
:--)>:--)> Subject: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> Hi all,
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> Would like to confirm before drilling the skin for the elevator
what is meant
:--)>:--)> by center of radius for the skin and nose rib. I have measured
from the bent
:--)>:--)> flange 450 mm and then from the unbent flange 465 mm which
coincided with the
:--)>:--)> mark for the 450 mm measurement. I am assuming what is meant by
the center of
:--)>:--)> radius is the mark 8 mm above the centerline of the
:--)>:--)> rear rib projected to through the tip rib but I would like to be
sure.
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)> Help in clarifying this and some way to do a sanity check would
be
:--)>:--)> appreciated.
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
:--)>:--)>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith701801-http://www.matronics.com/co
n
:--)>:--)> tribution" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">h
:--)>
:--)>
- The
Navigator to
Archive Search
-
Web Forums! _-
-
support!
:--)> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 7
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| Subject: | Center of Radius Elevator |
Hi Ron, Fritz, Doug
Thanks all, for your speedy replys. This is likely why the change in the
text of the most recent photo assembly manual which puts the bend on the
bottom. I'm building from component parts so the skin came with the bend.
Since I make enough errors without a a conflict in the instructions, I'll
confirm what I need to do with Zenair before forging ahead.
Regards,
Perry
Message 8
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| Subject: | Center of Radius Elevator |
G'Day Perry...
That change in the photo assembly was in Sept, 2009... still lots of time for them
to update
the drawings, I guess the 750 was more important!
Ron
:--)>
:--)> Hi Ron, Fritz, Doug
:--)>
:--)> Thanks all, for your speedy replys. This is likely why the change in the
text of
:--)> the most recent photo assembly manual which puts the bend on the bottom.
I'm
:--)> building from component parts so the skin came with the bend. Since I make
enough
:--)> errors without a a conflict in the instructions, I'll confirm what I need
to do
:--)> with Zenair before forging ahead.
:--)>
:--)> Regards,
:--)>
:--)> Perry
:--)>
:--)>
:--)> Zenith701801-List Email Forum -
:--)> MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
:--)> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Center of Radius Elevator |
Perry, I don't remember the exact issues with=C2-elevator radius=C2-par
t of the 701 build but I do recall I messed it up the first time=C2-and h
ad to build another elevator.=C2- Zenith gives a lengthy and somewhat con
fusing description of what you have to do to locate the centre of the radiu
s in the build manual, I recall something like three pages or so dedicated
to it.=C2- Follow these instructions exactly and it should work.=0A=C2-
=0AI know, not too much help.=0A=C2-=0ALike others have said, the 18mm be
nd at the trailing edge does not need to be there.=C2- Orriginally it was
bent up to prvide nose down trim.=C2- Almost everybody who puts the bend
in as per the plans eventually bends it back to neutral.=C2- The 701 run
s out of trim with full flaps with a neutral elevator trailing edge and the
little duck tail bend just agravates the situation.=0A=C2-=0AIf you are
still confused about the radius issue, drop me a line and I can run out the
garage and grab my plans and assembly book and see if I can provide any fu
rther help.=C2- I built my elevator about five years ago so the details a
re a little foggy now.=C2- =0A=C2-=0ABy the way, the 750's elevator is
much nicer and I am contemplating building one that will fit my 701 h-stab.
=C2- I seem to recall somebody on this list was building a scaled down 75
0 tail to fit his 701 scratch project.=0A=C2-Doug M=0ACH-701 from scratch
=0ANW Ontario, Canada=0A=C2-=0ADo Not Archive=0A=0A______________________
__________=0AFrom: Perry Delano <pdelano@telus.net>=0ATo: zenith701801-list
@matronics.com =0ASent: Sunday, January 8, 2012 8:50:40 AM=0ASubject: RE: Z
enith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator=0A=0A=0AHi Doug,=0A=C2-=0AIt
is a 701. Further to my query, although the plans seem to make it pretty cl
ear that the 18mm bent flange on the elevator skin is on the top, which coi
ncides with the hard copy of the photo assembly guide (Rev. 1.1) I got with
the plans, The DVD photo assembly guide Rev. 1.2=C2- I bought recently f
rom Zenith says the bent flange is on the bottom. If I could get a confirma
tion whether it=99s the top or bottom that would be greatly appreciat
ed.=0A=C2-=0ARegards,=0A=C2-=0APerry
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Center of Radius Elevator |
Doug,
I was the one who built the 701 rudder to the original size on the
plans, however I did so using the exact same construction methods and
technique, as is found on the 750 elevator. I have to admit it turned
out a lot better then an original 701 elevator, and also much easier to
assemble. Other then that, the only mod I incorporated in the
construction, was to install the hinge pins ( 7H3-2 ) on the interior of
the outer rib, rather then on the outside of the end rib. Personally, I
felt they would be more secure on the inside, then where originally
called for.
I did take quite a few photos, so anyone interested in receiving an
assortment, please e-me off the List at the following personal e-mail
address.
robert.pelland@cgocable.ca
Fly safe
Bob the 701 & 750 Scratch
Three Rivers , Quebec, Canada
----- Original Message -----
From: MacDonald Doug
To: zenith701801-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2012 2:17 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator
Perry, I don't remember the exact issues with elevator radius part of
the 701 build but I do recall I messed it up the first time and had to
build another elevator. Zenith gives a lengthy and somewhat confusing
description of what you have to do to locate the centre of the radius in
the build manual, I recall something like three pages or so dedicated to
it. Follow these instructions exactly and it should work.
I know, not too much help.
Like others have said, the 18mm bend at the trailing edge does not
need to be there. Orriginally it was bent up to prvide nose down trim.
Almost everybody who puts the bend in as per the plans eventually bends
it back to neutral. The 701 runs out of trim with full flaps with a
neutral elevator trailing edge and the little duck tail bend just
agravates the situation.
If you are still confused about the radius issue, drop me a line and I
can run out the garage and grab my plans and assembly book and see if I
can provide any further help. I built my elevator about five years ago
so the details are a little foggy now.
By the way, the 750's elevator is much nicer and I am contemplating
building one that will fit my 701 h-stab. I seem to recall somebody on
this list was building a scaled down 750 tail to fit his 701 scratch
project.
Doug M
CH-701 from scratch
NW Ontario, Canada
Do Not Archive
From: Perry Delano <pdelano@telus.net>
To: zenith701801-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 8, 2012 8:50:40 AM
Subject: RE: Zenith701801-List: Center of Radius Elevator
Hi Doug,
It is a 701. Further to my query, although the plans seem to make it
pretty clear that the 18mm bent flange on the elevator skin is on the
top, which coincides with the hard copy of the photo assembly guide
(Rev. 1.1) I got with the plans, The DVD photo assembly guide Rev. 1.2
I bought recently from Zenith says the bent flange is on the bottom. If
I could get a confirmation whether it=99s the top or bottom that
would be greatly appreciated.
Regards,
Perry
Message 11
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| Subject: | Center of Radius Elevator |
John,
Thanks. Your comment helped to confirm where I needed to look. Enjoyed a
trip to your state this past week. The weather was beautiful in Denver and
Colorado Springs on Thursday.
Regards,
Perry
North Vancouver, BC
Do Not Archive
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