Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 10:03 AM - Contributions Down By 23%... (Matt Dralle)
1. 12:48 AM - Re: Re: 701 Fuel system and torque tube (maxjohansson@elisanet.fi)
2. 06:54 AM - Re: Re: 701 Fuel system and torque tube (n801bh@netzero.com)
3. 07:27 AM - Re: Re: 701 Fuel system and torque tube (Stripling Cliff & Carolyn)
4. 08:47 AM - Re: 701 Fuel system and torque tube (striplic)
5. 09:31 AM - Re: Re: 701 Fuel system and torque tube (maxjohansson@elisanet.fi)
6. 06:57 PM - Re: Zenith701801-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 11/25/12 (Dougnoble@aol.com)
7. 07:26 PM - Re: Re: Zenith701801-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 11/25/12 (JohnDRead@aol.com)
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| Subject: | Contributions Down By 23%... |
Dear Listers,
As of today, Contributions to the Matronics List Fund Raiser are lagging behind
last year at this time by roughly 23%. I have a Fund Raiser each year simply
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Thank you for your support!
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Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Fuel system and torque tube |
Re Torque tube
There is nothing wrong per se with the 701 control torque tube but the whole setup
is a kludge resulting in one side biased flaperon control and also in simultaneously
sloppy and too rigid elevator control cables. Using a inner coaxial
tube in order to separate the two control inputs is also for me the best thing
I have done in my 701 so far in order to make flying more enjoyable and precise.
By selecting a slightly thicker wall for the inner tube It is easy to show
using simple rotational inertia calculations that the strenght of the inner
tube is at least equal to the outer tube. No fancy calculations is needed.
Re Snorkel fuel caps and fuel spillage
I have not had any issues with my snorkel caps if left pointed into the wind after
fuelling. All fuel spillage has come from the quick drains. It seems that
the small o-ring in the quick drain cannot handle the alcohol in the fuel. Fortunately
I had an extra quick drain and could prepare one at a time with new
viton o-rings. Unfortunately I exchanged them on the go without emptying the tanks,
so each time some fuel was spilled into my shirt sleeve. My wife was not
a friend that night.
best regards
Max
NYTerminat@aol.com kirjoitti:
> I put on snorkel caps that has a pitot tube that faces front. Make sure if
> using your standard Zenith caps, that you have drilled the extra holes in
> them according to the dwgs.
>
> There is nothing wrong with the Zenith touque tube.
>
> In a message dated 11/25/2012 2:38:38 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
> minisalways@shaw.ca writes:
>
> --> Zenith701801-List message posted by: "bobmccully"
> <minisalways@shaw.ca>
>
> Hello I am very new to this forum. I have built a CH701 and it has been
> test flown with no major issues but I am wondering about those gas tank
> caps. Do they vent properly? Do they allow even flow distribution? Or, should
I
> be looking for a better option?
>
> Also, I too was not happy with the original setup for the bellcrank/torque
> tube. I used the example from the Zenair newsletter that a builder
> submitted and I have to say that it works great. Wonder if Zenair could adopt
it
> as the new standard
> bob
>
> --------
> not sure what this is?
>
> Read this topic online here:
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=388926#388926
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Fuel system and torque tube |
Geez.... I always thought the controls in the 701's were identical to th
e 801's, other then upsizing the material used to construct them. I thou
ght the geometry of them were the same. My 801 does NOT show signs of bi
asing the flaperons and the elevator is nice and smooth during its movem
ent. I did go a little overboard in making sure all my controls had very
little if any play in them. I also use the No Slot Flaperon design as m
y plane was the prototype and the dozens of others that have bought that
kit from me or constructed their own set up have not mentioned any quir
ks in their control system.
As for the fuel vent /spillage issue, when I built my 801 I incorporated
additional fuel vents in my tanks that exit the lower skin of the wing.
On my first flight with the stock caps it was clear the 701/ 801 wing d
esign has so much suction on the top of the wing as to pull fuel out thr
ough the vent holes in the staock caps with the fuel level at 3/4 to ful
l. I simply epoxied those holes over, basicially making the caps a seale
d unit and by using my additional vents, the fuel system has worked per
fectly for over 400 hours. Even with my higher fuel flows of 25+ GPH dur
ing take off there has not been an issue with venting. IMHO.
do not archive
Ben Haas
N801BH
www.haaspowerair.com
---------- Original Message ----------
From: maxjohansson@elisanet.fi
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Fuel system and torque tube
Re Torque tube
There is nothing wrong per se with the 701 control torque tube but the w
hole setup is a kludge resulting in one side biased flaperon control and
also in simultaneously sloppy and too rigid elevator control cables. Us
ing a inner coaxial tube in order to separate the two control inputs is
also for me the best thing I have done in my 701 so far in order to make
flying more enjoyable and precise. By selecting a slightly thicker wal
l for the inner tube It is easy to show using simple rotational inertia
calculations that the strenght of the inner tube is at least equal to th
e outer tube. No fancy calculations is needed.
Re Snorkel fuel caps and fuel spillage
I have not had any issues with my snorkel caps if left pointed into the
wind after fuelling. All fuel spillage has come from the quick drains.
It seems that the small o-ring in the quick drain cannot handle the alco
hol in the fuel. Fortunately I had an extra quick drain and could prepar
e one at a time with new viton o-rings. Unfortunately I exchanged them o
n the go without emptying the tanks, so each time some fuel was spilled
into my shirt sleeve. My wife was not a friend that night.
best regards
Max
NYTerminat@aol.com kirjoitti:
> I put on snorkel caps that has a pitot tube that faces front. Make sur
e if
> using your standard Zenith caps, that you have drilled the extra hol
es in
> them according to the dwgs.
>
> There is nothing wrong with the Zenith touque tube.
>
> In a message dated 11/25/2012 2:38:38 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
> minisalways@shaw.ca writes:
>
> --> Zenith701801-List message posted by: "bobmccully"
> <minisalways@shaw.ca>
>
> Hello I am very new to this forum. I have built a CH701 and it has b
een
> test flown with no major issues but I am wondering about those gas ta
nk
> caps. Do they vent properly? Do they allow even flow distribution? Or
, should I
> be looking for a better option?
>
> Also, I too was not happy with the original setup for the bellcrank/t
orque
> tube. I used the example from the Zenair newsletter that a builder
> submitted and I have to say that it works great. Wonder if Zenair cou
ld adopt it
> as the new standard
> bob
>
> --------
> not sure what this is?
>
> Read this topic online here:
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=388926#388926
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____________________________________________________________
Woman is 53 But Looks 25
Mom reveals 1 simple wrinkle trick that has angered doctors...
http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3241/50b38250ca1402500169st01vuc
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Fuel system and torque tube |
Max,
I have been reading this with interest. I am at the stage of installing the fuselage
controls and would like to know of alternative methods other than the stock
cable arrangement. I am unfamiliar with what you are describing in the "inner
coaxial tube" method of controlling the elevators separate from the ailerons.
Do you have any pictures of your arrangement and/or pointers to suppliers
of materials. I would appreciate any information.
I did see an arrangement while in Oshkosh this year where the builder installed
push pull tubes (such as in Van's RVs). I can't attempt anything heavy that
will increase weight in the tail as I will have more of a weight balance problem
(I already have changed out the fuselage fuel tank in favor of the wing tanks
which is already a big weight change toward the rear. His was the "turbo-prop
engined Zenith that was causing such a stir. It was highly modified and done
with flush rivets. My engine will be the Rotax 532 with wooden prop.
Thanks,
Cliff
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Fuel system and torque tube |
Max (and all),
I have been reading this with interest. I am at the stage of installing the fuselage
controls and would like to know of alternative methods other than the stock
cable arrangement. I am unfamiliar with what you are describing in the "inner
coaxial tube" method of controlling the elevators separate from the ailerons.
Do you have any pictures of your arrangement and/or pointers to suppliers
of coaxial materials. I would appreciate any information.
I did see an arrangement while in Oshkosh this year where the builder installed
push pull tubes (such as in Van's RVs). I can't attempt anything heavy that
will increase weight in the tail as I already have a weight balance problem having
changed out the fuselage fuel tank in favor of the wing tanks. His was the
turbo-prop engined Zenith that was causing such a stir. It is highly modified
and done with flush rivets. My engine will be the Rotax 532 with wooden prop
so I need all the weight up front I can manage.
Thanks,
Cliff
PS If anyone has a Rotax side mount exhaust system including the manifold I need
the complete system including accessories (I have the brackets). If it has
been altered to fit the older 701 kit that would be even better.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=388974#388974
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: 701 Fuel system and torque tube |
Cliff,
sorry, my description was somewhat misleading to someone not yet working on the
discussed parts. There is no push pull tubes apart from the 7C1-3 connected
to the stick. The aileron is controlled using the new inner tube and the arm assembly
welded to the 7C2-2 tube is now fixed and non-rotating. This rotation
was the original evil. From the stick the 7C1-3 control rod must additionally
now use real bearing rod ends and not only simple bolts and tube holes as before.
Many methods to fix the arm assembly has been described and depicted on the
various 701 lists. The best description of the tubes (with pictures and some
material dimensions) have in my opinion been submitted by Joe Truncale. The
CrMo 4130 structural tubes with suitable OD and ID can be ordered from Aircraft
Spruce. The table is on page 62, but my catalogue is a few years old . . .
BR Max
Stripling Cliff & Carolyn [striplic@gmail.com] kirjoitti:
>
> Max,
>
> I have been reading this with interest. I am at the stage of installing the
fuselage controls and would like to know of alternative methods other than the
stock cable arrangement. I am unfamiliar with what you are describing in the
"inner coaxial tube" method of controlling the elevators separate from the ailerons.
Do you have any pictures of your arrangement and/or pointers to suppliers
of materials. I would appreciate any information.
>
> I did see an arrangement while in Oshkosh this year where the builder installed
push pull tubes (such as in Van's RVs). I can't attempt anything heavy that
will increase weight in the tail as I will have more of a weight balance problem
(I already have changed out the fuselage fuel tank in favor of the wing tanks
which is already a big weight change toward the rear. His was the "turbo-prop
engined Zenith that was causing such a stir. It was highly modified and
done with flush rivets. My engine will be the Rotax 532 with wooden prop.
>
> Thanks,
> Cliff
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Zenith701801-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 11/25/12 |
Yes there are much better ways to do the controls concerning the torque
tube system.
In a message dated 11/26/2012 12:04:23 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
zenith701801-list@matronics.com writes:
*
=================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
=================================================
Today's complete Zenith701801-List Digest can also be found in either of
the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the Zenith701801-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text
editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=37461&View=html&Chapter
12-11-25&Archive=Zenith701801
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=37461&View=txt&Chapter
2012-11-25&Archive=Zenith701801
===============================================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
===============================================
----------------------------------------------------------
Zenith701801-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Sun 11/25/12: 2
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 11:38 AM - Re: 701 Fuel system (bobmccully)
2. 03:15 PM - Re: Re: 701 Fuel system (NYTerminat@aol.com)
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 11:38:30 AM PST US
Subject: Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Fuel system
From: "bobmccully" <minisalways@shaw.ca>
Hello I am very new to this forum. I have built a CH701 and it has been
test flown
with no major issues but I am wondering about those gas tank caps. Do they
vent properly? Do they allow even flow distribution? Or, should I be
looking
for a better option?
Also, I too was not happy with the original setup for the bellcrank/torque
tube.
I used the example from the Zenair newsletter that a builder submitted and
I
have to say that it works great. Wonder if Zenair could adopt it as the
new standard
bob
--------
not sure what this is?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=388926#388926
________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
Time: 03:15:09 PM PST US
From: NYTerminat@aol.com
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Fuel system
I put on snorkel caps that has a pitot tube that faces front. Make sure if
using your standard Zenith caps, that you have drilled the extra holes
in
them according to the dwgs.
There is nothing wrong with the Zenith touque tube.
In a message dated 11/25/2012 2:38:38 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
minisalways@shaw.ca writes:
--> Zenith701801-List message posted by: "bobmccully"
<minisalways@shaw.ca>
Hello I am very new to this forum. I have built a CH701 and it has been
test flown with no major issues but I am wondering about those gas tank
caps. Do they vent properly? Do they allow even flow distribution? Or,
should
I
be looking for a better option?
Also, I too was not happy with the original setup for the
bellcrank/torque
tube. I used the example from the Zenair newsletter that a builder
submitted and I have to say that it works great. Wonder if Zenair could
adopt
it
as the new standard
bob
--------
not sure what this is?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=388926#388926
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Zenith701801-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 11/25/12 |
Hi Guys,
Where is the info regarding the torque tube system? Thanks.
Regards, John
CH701 - Colorado - Jabiru 3300
Cell: 719-494-4567
Home: 303-648-3261
In a message dated 11/26/2012 7:57:25 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,
Dougnoble@aol.com writes:
Yes there are much better ways to do the controls concerning the torque
tube system.
In a message dated 11/26/2012 12:04:23 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
zenith701801-list@matronics.com writes:
*
========================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
========================
Today's complete Zenith701801-List Digest can also be found in either of
the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the Zenith701801-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text
editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=37461&View=html&Chapter
12-11-25&Archive=Zenith701801
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=37461&View=txt&Chapter
2012-11-25&Archive=Zenith701801
======================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
======================
----------------------------------------------------------
Zenith701801-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Sun 11/25/12: 2
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 11:38 AM - Re: 701 Fuel system (bobmccully)
2. 03:15 PM - Re: Re: 701 Fuel system (NYTerminat@aol.com)
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 11:38:30 AM PST US
Subject: Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Fuel system
From: "bobmccully" <minisalways@shaw.ca>
Hello I am very new to this forum. I have built a CH701 and it has been
test flown
with no major issues but I am wondering about those gas tank caps. Do they
vent properly? Do they allow even flow distribution? Or, should I be
looking
for a better option?
Also, I too was not happy with the original setup for the bellcrank/torque
tube.
I used the example from the Zenair newsletter that a builder submitted and
I
have to say that it works great. Wonder if Zenair could adopt it as the
new standard
bob
--------
not sure what this is?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=388926#388926
________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
Time: 03:15:09 PM PST US
From: NYTerminat@aol.com
Subject: Re: Zenith701801-List: Re: 701 Fuel system
I put on snorkel caps that has a pitot tube that faces front. Make sure if
using your standard Zenith caps, that you have drilled the extra holes
in
them according to the dwgs.
There is nothing wrong with the Zenith touque tube.
In a message dated 11/25/2012 2:38:38 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
minisalways@shaw.ca writes:
--> Zenith701801-List message posted by: "bobmccully"
<minisalways@shaw.ca>
Hello I am very new to this forum. I have built a CH701 and it has been
test flown with no major issues but I am wondering about those gas tank
caps. Do they vent properly? Do they allow even flow distribution? Or,
should
I
be looking for a better option?
Also, I too was not happy with the original setup for the
bellcrank/torque
tube. I used the example from the Zenair newsletter that a builder
submitted and I have to say that it works great. Wonder if Zenair could
adopt
it
as the new standard
bob
--------
not sure what this is?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=388926#388926< bsp;
(And Get Some AWESOME FREE o find ifts bsp; lder's LP you for ;
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