RV-Archive.digest.vol-to
July 06, 2008 - - - - , 20-
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Grove Streamlined Gear For RV-8... |
Matt Dralle wrote:
>
>
> RV Listers,
>
> Grove makes a streamlined, airfoiled landing gear for the RV-8. Saves having
to use the fiberglass. They also have the brake line embedded within the gear
leg. Over all, they weigh a few pounds less.
>
> Does anyone have any experience with these gear legs? What is the cost differential
over the stock ones? Do they fit as good or better than stock?
>
> Should an RV-8 builder bother with the hassle of deleting the stock ones from
the Van's kit and ordering these?
>
> And another historic question... Why-o-why did Van's get away from the super
sweet looking swept-back, Whitman-style gear on the RV-8? The spring steel, forward
facing gear on the RV-8 just look dopy...
>
> Matt
I know only one person who's used them, & he did it for the weight
savings. It was a pretty expensive way to save weight.
Only Van knows for sure, but I'd bet that it was an engineering
decision, with money being a small contributor. The -8 is about a foot
longer than the -4 & stands a lot taller, so the gear legs would have
been a lot longer & much heavier to get the wheels in the right place
with the extra strength needed for the much higher gross weight of the
-8. Those gear towers do look like a real pain, though. They take up a
lot of room in the front cockpit & the guys I know with -8's all
complain about torquing the gear bolts.
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michael Seager" <rv6cfi(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | transition training in Michigan |
I will have the factory RV-7 in Three rivers Michigan for three days before
Oshkosh July 24 25 26. If you would like to take transition training you can
contact Bob Gearhart at 269 816 0163 cell or his home at 269 244 5102. Mike
Seager
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
SNIP Only Van knows for sure, but I'd bet that it was an engineering
decision, with money being a small contributor. The -8 is about a foot
longer than the -4 & stands a lot taller, so the gear legs would have
been a lot longer & much heavier to get the wheels in the right place
with the extra strength needed for the much higher gross weight of the
-8. Those gear towers do look like a real pain, though. They take up a
lot of room in the front cockpit & the guys I know with -8's all
complain about torquing the gear bolts. SNIP
This is just MHO, but the way around all of these problems is to simply
build a Rocket. The real question, for me anyway, is why didn't Van
tweak the Rocket design to fit his manufacturing expertise. Wow, what a
product that would have been or could be.
Before you flame me, know that I love the RVs. They are sweet, better
than anything out there... except the Rocket, which is pure,
unadulterated sex.
Vince
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jim-bean(at)att.net |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Karatsonyi <mkaratsonyi(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | FOR SALE: Isham RV Tool Kit with upgrades |
do you still have tools for sale? > Date: Sun=2C 6 Jul 2008 17:42:04 -0400>
From: dan(at)familybrown.org> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com> Subject: RV-List: FO
an Brown > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----> Hash:
SHA1> > For a variety of reasons=2C mostly relating to my being called to
active> duty with the Army=2C I won't be able to complete my planned RV-7A.
> Consequently=2C I'll need to sell my tools. This is the complete Isham> k
it pictured at:> > http://www.store-planetools.com/index.asp?PageAction=V
IEWPROD&ProdID=9> > This kit includes a pneumatic rivet squeezer and the
popular DRDT-2> dimpling tool.> > In addition=2C the following extras are i
ncluded:> > Screw-adjustable Rivet Squeezer Ram (a $70 value)> Avery Longer
on Yoke (a $150 value)> Avery Thin-nose (no-hole) Yoke (a $140 value)> Aver
y back-rivet plate (a $50 value)> Avery flush swivel rivet set (a $40 value
)> A couple of additional countersink cutters> Additional side-grip clecos
(about 10 extra of each=2C IIRC)> > That's $450 in upgrades=2C in addition
to the Isham set. All tools are in> excellent condition. The air drill is N
OT=2C repeat NOT included=3B> everything else is.> > This would cost nearly
$3000 for these tools ordered new. I'll take> $2500 OBO=2C plus shipping.
If you're local to Fayetteville=2C NC=2C you can> pick up. Contact me by e-
mail at dan(at)familybrown.org if interested.> Thanks for your interest!> > Th
e following tools are included:> > DRDT-2 Dimpler* (email for delivery date
on DRDT-2)> Pneumatic Rivet Squeezer (U.S.A.)*> 3=94 C-Yoke Installed on S
queezer (U.S.A.)*> Adjustable Set Holder for Pneumatic Squeezer (U.S.A.)*>
3X Rivet Gun with excellent teasing trigger*> EZ change spring for straight
rivet sets*> EZ Change Spring for flush sets (Snap-On Ind U.S.A.)*> Swivel
and Air Flow Restrictor with fine precision adjustment*> 1=94 Diameter Flu
sh Rivet Set (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 3/32=94 Cupped Rivet Set 3.5=94 (Snap-On U.
S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Cupped Rivet Set 3.5=94 (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 3/16=94 Cupped Ri
vet Set 3.5=94 (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Double Offset Rivet Set (Snap-On U
.S.A.)*> Back Rivet Set* (Special Small 1/2" Diameter for RV's)> Mini-Bucki
ng Bar=2C 1 lb. (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Bulkhead Bucking Bar (Snap-On U.S.A.)*>
Footed Bucking Bar (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Microstop Countersink Unit=2C needle-
bearing=2C non-chattering (U.S.A.)*> #40 Countersink Bit=2C 3/32=94 (Snap-O
n U.S.A.)*> #30 Countersink Bit=2C for 1/8=94 & #6 Screw (Snap-On U.S.A.)*>
#8 Countersink Bit=2C #8 Screw (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> #10 Countersink Bit=2C #
10 Screw (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Left Cut Snips=2C easy to use offset type (Klei
n Tools U.S.A.)*> Right Cut Snips=2C easy to use offset type (Klein Tools U
.S.A.)*> Straight Cut Snips=2C easy to use offset type (Klein Tools U.S.A.)
*> #40 Aviation Cobalt Drill Bits for 3/32=94 rivets=2C 8 each> #30 Aviatio
n Cobalt Drill Bits for 1/8=94 rivets=2C 6 each> #27 Aviation Cobalt Drill
Bit> #21 Aviation Cobalt Drill Bit> #19 Aviation Cobalt Drill Bit> #12 Avia
tion Cobalt Drill Bit> 1/4" Aviation Cobalt Drill Bit> 12=94 Aviation Extra
Long #40 Drill Bit> 12=94 Aviation Extra Long #30 Drill Bit> Deburr Tool
=2C Speed Handle Type for small & large holes (U.S.A.)*> Cleco Pliers*> 4 C
leco Clamps=2C 1/2" (Calif Assoc Prod or Zephyr U.S.A.)*> 4 Cleco Clamps=2C
1=94 (Calif Assoc Prod or Zephyr U.S.A.)*> Pop Rivet Tool=2C Professional
Heavy-Duty unit with Swivel Head*> 3/32" Universal Cupped Squeezer Set (Sna
p-On U.S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Universal Cupped Squeezer Set (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 5/32
" Universal Cupped Squeezer Set (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 3/16=94 Universal Cupped
Squeezer Set (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Flat Squeezer Set 1/8=94 (Snap-On U.S.A.)*
> Flat Squeezer Set 1/4" (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Flat Squeezer Set 3/8=94 (Snap-
On U.S.A.)*> Flat Squeezer Set 1/2" (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 3/32=94 Rivet Dimple
Die (Springback U.S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Rivet Dimple Die (Springback U.S.A.)*> 5/
32" Dimple Die*> 3/16" - #10 Screw Dimple Die*> #8 Screw Dimple Die*> #6 Sc
rew Dimple Die*> Squeezer Set Organizer*> Squeezer Set Adjustment Washers *
> Stainless Steel Rule=2C 12=94*> Unibit 1/4" - 3/4" by 1/16ths=2C (Klein U
.S.A.)*> 3 Permanent Markers=2C Sharpie> 1/2 x 1 Reducers for 3M Wheel*> 32
5 Cleco Fasteners=2C 3/32=94 (Calif Assoc Prod or Zephyr U.S.A.)*> 175 Clec
o Fasteners=2C 1/8=94 (Calif Assoc Prod or Zephyr U.S.A.)*> 10 Cleco Fasten
ers=2C 5/32" (Calif Assoc Prod or Zephyr U.S.A.)*> 10 Cleco Fasteners=2C 3/
16=94 (Calif Assoc Prod or Zephyr U.S.A.)*> Edge Deburring Tool=2C Hex Swiv
el type*> Fluting Pliers=2C Smooth Flute Nylon Jaws*> Fluting Pliers=2C Dee
p =93V=94 Nylon Jaws*> Rivet Cutter*> Air Tool Oil> Drill Stop Set of 4 wit
h Allen Wrench*> Rivet Set DOTS=2C Easier than Rivet Tape> 3/32=94 Pop Rive
t Dimple Die=2C Springback (U.S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Pop Rivet Dimple Die=2C Spring
back (U.S.A.)*> Hand Seamer (Klein Tools U.S.A.)*> 3/32=94 Drive Pin Punch
(Klein Tools U.S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Drive Pin Punch (Klein Tools U.S.A.)*> Scotch
Brite Hand Pads=2C 4 each> Rivet Length Gauge*> Rivet Shop Head Gauge=2C 4
-piece*> > - --> Dan Brown=2C KE6MKS=2C dan(at)familybrown.org> "Since all the
world is but a story=2C it were well for thee to buy the> more enduring st
ory rather than the story that is less enduring."> ~ -- The Judgment of St.
Colum Cille> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----> Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (MingW32
)> Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org> > iD8DBQ
FIcTwsyQGUivXxtkERArQ5AKDXyHERioqiOx7Di9qmwK5lYRUxZwCgxTEO> 1xKO82rbsPh08my
====================> > >
_________________________________________________________________
The i=92m Talkaton. Can 30-days of conversation change the world?
http://www.imtalkathon.com/?source=EML_WLH_Talkathon_ChangeWorld
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RICHARD MILLER <rickpegser(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: SLICK MAGS |
hi all
the a saga continues,my favorite 206 now has had three inflight mag failure
s in the last 100hrs. and two more mags where condemded on the ground due t
o the service bulletin inspections.
-
the full story is as follows
with about 400 hrs on the mags owner complains about high egt on climb out.
the old shop fiddle with the fuel system on the io-520 for the next hundre
d hours and finally send everything out for rebuild. after a very large che
ck later and the annual the mags have 510 on them. shop advises that the ma
gs are due the 500 hr inspection but every thing is fine. owner leaves bay
area and loses both mags at bakersfield, note here is that the always passe
d mag check and -damn near did not get in. total time on mags 520. but th
ey had been the high egt problem for the last 100 hrs, as it went away with
new mags. next in flight r/h mag burns up distributor block at 84 hrs.-
next at-90 hr perform- sb inspection find both brushes bad and the bran
d new r/h mag has an inproperly built coil or casing will not pass clearanc
e specs. so in the last hundred hrs, less then one year of flight, five bad
mags. and you wonder why the owner is a tad bit miffed. not counting
the fuel system overhaul that he was billed for, and did not need. that ma
y be why i have to drive two hrs to work on this bird. by the way unison is
aware of thier quality control problems but have yet to admit to them. the
bad coils and or casings are reflected in sb3-08 look at the tab height in
spection. bad unison bad unison, you should all be spanked for this crap.
rick
--- On Thu, 7/3/08, glen matejcek wrote:
From: glen matejcek <aerobubba(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: RE: SLICK MAGS
Date: Thursday, July 3, 2008, 4:40 AM
HI All-
This slick mag debacle doesn't affect me directly, but something occurs to
me that might be of use. A couple of you have written very good and
insightful notes on this subject. Suppose you sent them to Aviation
Consumer, their sister mx rag, Flying, AOPA Pilot, Kitplanes, et al as Op
Ed pieces. That way, the issue will be out in the open pre-Oshkosh. Well,
as I type this, it occurs to me that none of them will get into print by
the time OSH comes around, except perhaps via Barnstormers and AvWeb. In
any case, you guys could document the situation in public prior to the
event. If anything happens enr to or fro the convention, your concerns
will have been registered before hand. Hopefully, this situation will
trigger a pre-emptive action on slick's part. If not, your efforts will no
doubt be of great assistance to anyone going to court.
Just a thought-
glen matejcek
aerobubba(at)earthlink.net
============0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton01(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Hydraulic fluid |
On 6-Jul-08, at 19:44 , jim-bean(at)att.net wrote:
> I was just about to open a can of brake fluid when I noticed it is
> MIL-H-5606G rather that the usual MIL-H-5606A. After Googling around
> it seems that they should be compatible. Does anyone have an opinion
> about whether mixing these two fluids is OK?
MIL-H-5606A is a very early version of the spec. MIL-H-5606G is a
much later version. There should be no problem mixing fluids made
with any versions of the MIL-H-5606 spec.
But, why not use MIL-PRF-83282 brake fluid? It can be mixed with MIL-
H-5606 fluid, but has the advantage of a much higher flash point. And
it isn't expensive either. I bought a quart can of Royco 782, a MIL-
PRF-83282 fluid, from Leavens Brothers in Toronto for $11.25.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (final assemby)
Ottawa, Canada
http://www.kilohotel.com/rv8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: SLICK MAGS |
Now that's gotta be consumer abuse!!! Seriously, the only way Unison
will admit to a problem is if the FAA gets involved.
If the A&Ps file their discrepancy reports like they should, the FAA
takes notice. Filing a NASA form probably won't hurt either.
Linn
RICHARD MILLER wrote:
>
> hi all
>
> the a saga continues,my favorite 206 now has had three inflight mag
> failures in the last 100hrs. and two more mags where condemded on the
> ground due to the service bulletin inspections.
>
>
>
> the full story is as follows
>
> with about 400 hrs on the mags owner complains about high egt on climb
> out. the old shop fiddle with the fuel system on the io-520 for the
> next hundred hours and finally send everything out for rebuild. after
> a very large check later and the annual the mags have 510 on them.
> shop advises that the mags are due the 500 hr inspection but every
> thing is fine. owner leaves bay area and loses both mags at
> bakersfield, note here is that the always passed mag check and damn
> near did not get in. total time on mags 520. but they had been the
> high egt problem for the last 100 hrs, as it went away with new mags.
> next in flight r/h mag burns up distributor block at 84 hrs. next
> at 90 hr perform sb inspection find both brushes bad and the brand
> new r/h mag has an inproperly built coil or casing will not pass
> clearance specs. so in the last hundred hrs, less then one year of
> flight, five bad mags. and you wonder why the owner is a tad bit
> miffed. not counting the fuel system overhaul that he was billed for,
> and did not need. that may be why i have to drive two hrs to work on
> this bird. by the way unison is aware of thier quality control
> problems but have yet to admit to them. the bad coils and or casings
> are reflected in sb3-08 look at the tab height inspection. bad unison
> bad unison, you should all be spanked for this crap.
>
> rick
>
> --- On *Thu, 7/3/08, glen matejcek //* wrote:
>
> From: glen matejcek <aerobubba(at)earthlink.net>
> Subject: RV-List: RE: SLICK MAGS
> To: "RV-List Digest Server"
> Date: Thursday, July 3, 2008, 4:40 AM
>
>
>
> HI All-
>
> This slick mag debacle doesn't affect me directly, but something occurs to
> me that might be of use. A couple of you have written very good and
> insightful notes on this subject. Suppose you sent them to Aviation
> Consumer, their sister mx rag, Flying, AOPA Pilot, Kitplanes, et al as Op
> Ed pieces. That way, the issue will be out in the open pre-Oshkosh. Well,
> as I type this, it occurs to me that none of them will get into print by
> the time OSH comes around, except perhaps via Barnstormers and AvWeb. In
> any case, you guys could document the situation in public prior to the
> event. If anything happens enr to or fro the convention, your concerns
> will have been registered before hand. Hopefully, this situation will
> trigger a pre-emptive action on slick's part. If not, your efforts will
no
> doubt be of great assistance to anyone going to court.
>
> Just a thought-
>
> glen matejcek
> aerobubba(at)earthlink.net
>
>
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: SLICK MAGS |
Rick.....I have to ask......why do you keep unloading all this stuff on
us?? I think you have made it clear you are disgusted with Slick. ;-)
It's not like we as RV builders can cure the problem that Unison has
with Slick mags......
Respectfully,
Sam Buchanan
================================
RICHARD MILLER wrote:
> hi all the a saga continues,my favorite 206 now has had three
> inflight mag failures in the last 100hrs. and two more mags where
> condemded on the ground due to the service bulletin inspections.
>
> the full story is as follows with about 400 hrs on the mags owner
> complains about high egt on climb out. the old shop fiddle with the
> fuel system on the io-520 for the next hundred hours and finally send
> everything out for rebuild. after a very large check later and the
> annual the mags have 510 on them. shop advises that the mags are due
> the 500 hr inspection but every thing is fine. owner leaves bay area
> and loses both mags at bakersfield, note here is that the always
> passed mag check and damn near did not get in. total time on mags
> 520. but they had been the high egt problem for the last 100 hrs, as
> it went away with new mags. next in flight r/h mag burns up
> distributor block at 84 hrs. next at 90 hr perform sb inspection
> find both brushes bad and the brand new r/h mag has an inproperly
> built coil or casing will not pass clearance specs. so in the last
> hundred hrs, less then one year of flight, five bad mags. and you
> wonder why the owner is a tad bit miffed. not counting the fuel
> system overhaul that he was billed for, and did not need. that may be
> why i have to drive two hrs to work on this bird. by the way unison
> is aware of thier quality control problems but have yet to admit to
> them. the bad coils and or casings are reflected in sb3-08 look at
> the tab height inspection. bad unison bad unison, you should all be
> spanked for this crap. rick
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "t6pilot" <t6pilot(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Hydraulic fluid |
Kevin:
MIL-H-5606G is the revision level of the MIL-H-5606 standard that particular
manufacturer is certifying to. No impact, meets the latest MIL-H5606
specification.
Randy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Horton" <khorton01(at)rogers.com>
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 5:48 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Hydraulic fluid
>
> On 6-Jul-08, at 19:44 , jim-bean(at)att.net wrote:
>
>> I was just about to open a can of brake fluid when I noticed it is
>> MIL-H-5606G rather that the usual MIL-H-5606A. After Googling around it
>> seems that they should be compatible. Does anyone have an opinion about
>> whether mixing these two fluids is OK?
>
> MIL-H-5606A is a very early version of the spec. MIL-H-5606G is a much
> later version. There should be no problem mixing fluids made with any
> versions of the MIL-H-5606 spec.
>
> But, why not use MIL-PRF-83282 brake fluid? It can be mixed with MIL-
> H-5606 fluid, but has the advantage of a much higher flash point. And it
> isn't expensive either. I bought a quart can of Royco 782, a MIL-
> PRF-83282 fluid, from Leavens Brothers in Toronto for $11.25.
>
> --
> Kevin Horton RV-8 (final assemby)
> Ottawa, Canada
> http://www.kilohotel.com/rv8
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ed Holyoke <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hydraulic fluid |
Yeah, but if you mix the two, the flashpoint advantage is mostly lost.
The brake system should be drained and refilled with the high test
fluid. There's no need to flush it. One should probably replace the
O-rings in the calipers with Viton ones (# 218-V 1 1/4" X 1 1/2") as
they can handle much higher temperatures than the stock Nitrile O-rings.
You can get a lifetime supply of O-rings for about 10 bucks at any seal
dealer. I got the brown ones so that they don't get mixed up with
Nitrile later.
Pax,
Ed Holyoke
Kevin Horton wrote:
>
> On 6-Jul-08, at 19:44 , jim-bean(at)att.net wrote:
>
>> I was just about to open a can of brake fluid when I noticed it is
>> MIL-H-5606G rather that the usual MIL-H-5606A. After Googling around
>> it seems that they should be compatible. Does anyone have an opinion
>> about whether mixing these two fluids is OK?
>
> MIL-H-5606A is a very early version of the spec. MIL-H-5606G is a
> much later version. There should be no problem mixing fluids made
> with any versions of the MIL-H-5606 spec.
>
> But, why not use MIL-PRF-83282 brake fluid? It can be mixed with
> MIL-H-5606 fluid, but has the advantage of a much higher flash point.
> And it isn't expensive either. I bought a quart can of Royco 782, a
> MIL-PRF-83282 fluid, from Leavens Brothers in Toronto for $11.25.
>
> --
> Kevin Horton RV-8 (final assemby)
> Ottawa, Canada
> http://www.kilohotel.com/rv8
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RICHARD MILLER <rickpegser(at)yahoo.com> |
sam
how many of us are flying with slicks? alot. how many of us did not know th
at a mag that passed mag checks would cause high egts while failing.? not m
any. durring this disaster if have talked to cont, lyc, cpa, unison, faa lo
cal fsdo, the aco repsonsible chicago,- and faa aco head washington.
-
responses:
cont
this is a major problem, critical service bulletin, they are adding a secon
d shift to the bendix line.
lyc
this is a major problem, critical service bulletin
cpa
this is a major problem, replace brush with pma from aero accessory 1800-82
2-3200 no problems. note this does not solve the other problems. bad coils,
cases and cams.
unison
-we know about the problem, yes there is a problem with manufacturing tol
erances, no this is not a defect,"hey right" we will not have a good brush
design ready untill augest and are redoing tolling and inspection proceedur
es.. yes we will continue to ship old stock with the problem, and no recall
s are in the works
-
faa local fsdo
call the aco, lots of help there
-
aco chicago
we dont see a serious problem and "you have two mags anyways"
-
washington aco
showed some concern waiting for reponse. they where a little concren about
the "you have two mags anyways" line but i question if that was only pr
-
how many of of us comply with service bulletins, the average feeling is tha
t the faa will issue an ad if there is a real problem. remember ad stands f
or "after death". if this had happened to a chevy- 20 million cars would
already be recalled. the service bulletins are required for only one percen
t of the fleet. but what about the rest. that is why i write this. and if i
t bothers you sooooooooo much, delete it.
rick
-
-
-=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | FS: RV9/9A Unassembled Tail Kit + Tools + Primer + Construction |
Videos for $2500 in Vancouver BC
| From: | "Brandon Rigio" <brandon.rigio(at)kodak.com> |
I am putting my unassembled RV9 Empennage (VS spar match drilled) with
electric trim option and everything needed to complete the kit up for
sale. This includes all the hand tools needed, Sherwin Williams E2G973
primer and reducer, preview plans if wanted, and the construction
videos.
This is everything needed to start assembling your RV9/9A right away.
Not a single rivet pounded on this kit.
I would like $2500 for everything and need to get rid of it ASAP. If
you are planning to start a kit or know someone that is please consider
this or pass it along. It is everything you need to start building
immediately.
Tools picture:
http://server6.theimagehosting.com/image.php?img=tools.6cf.JPG
Tool List:
Pop rivet tool, Cleaveland
3 =BC" Seaming pliers
1 3/4 " vise grip seaming pliers, Avery
Vosburg edge forming tool
Cleco pliers
Taylor 2X rivet gun, Cleaveland
Sioux 1/4" pneumatic drill
Ct. Sink cage,Avery #19360
Dimple dies #30
Dimple dies #40
Dimple dies #6
Dimple dies #8
Dimple die,female 3/8 Dia. #40
Dimple die,female 3/8 Dia. #30
#40 cupped squeezer set, I pc.
1 3/16 ct. sink cutter, 3 flute #1057,threaded
1-#30 single flute Ct. sink cutter "
1-#19 Three flute Ct sink cutter. "
1-#40 Three flute Ct. sink cutter "
1-#40 single flute Ct. sink cutter "
1-single flute deburring cutter "
1-set #40 Pop rivet dimple dies
1-set #30 Pop rivet dimple dies
1 set #4 screw dimple dies
1-back rivet set
1- Avery swivel flush set
1 Avery flat set
1-#27 3 flute Ct. sink cutter,threaded
1-flat squeezer set 1/8 X =BD
1-set, 4 pcs. Plexi drills
1 Avery plastic dimpling hammer
60 Pcs. 1/8" Clecos
1-Rod end bearing tool, wrench
225-- 3/32 Clecos
1- Cleaveland C frame tool
2- Bucking Bars
Thank you,
Brandon Rigio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Karatsonyi <mkaratsonyi(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | FOR SALE: Isham RV Tool Kit with upgrades |
i am very interested=2C however i dont want to low ball you=2C i am also a
veteran of the us army (airborne infantry) and i am on a budget=2C i really
would like to purchase your kit however my budget is $1500 plus shipping i
f we can make a deal i would greatly appreciate it. Michael> Date: Sun=2C 6
com> Subject: RV-List: FOR SALE: Isham RV Tool Kit with upgrades> > --> RV-
List message posted by: Dan Brown > > -----BEGIN PGP S
IGNED MESSAGE-----> Hash: SHA1> > For a variety of reasons=2C mostly relati
ng to my being called to active> duty with the Army=2C I won't be able to c
omplete my planned RV-7A.> Consequently=2C I'll need to sell my tools. This
is the complete Isham> kit pictured at:> > http://www.store-planetools.com
/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=9> > This kit includes a pneumati
c rivet squeezer and the popular DRDT-2> dimpling tool.> > In addition=2C t
he following extras are included:> > Screw-adjustable Rivet Squeezer Ram (a
$70 value)> Avery Longeron Yoke (a $150 value)> Avery Thin-nose (no-hole)
Yoke (a $140 value)> Avery back-rivet plate (a $50 value)> Avery flush swiv
el rivet set (a $40 value)> A couple of additional countersink cutters> Add
itional side-grip clecos (about 10 extra of each=2C IIRC)> > That's $450 in
upgrades=2C in addition to the Isham set. All tools are in> excellent cond
ition. The air drill is NOT=2C repeat NOT included=3B> everything else is.>
> This would cost nearly $3000 for these tools ordered new. I'll take> $25
00 OBO=2C plus shipping. If you're local to Fayetteville=2C NC=2C you can>
pick up. Contact me by e-mail at dan(at)familybrown.org if interested.> Thanks
for your interest!> > The following tools are included:> > DRDT-2 Dimpler*
(email for delivery date on DRDT-2)> Pneumatic Rivet Squeezer (U.S.A.)*> 3
=94 C-Yoke Installed on Squeezer (U.S.A.)*> Adjustable Set Holder for Pneum
atic Squeezer (U.S.A.)*> 3X Rivet Gun with excellent teasing trigger*> EZ c
hange spring for straight rivet sets*> EZ Change Spring for flush sets (Sna
p-On Ind U.S.A.)*> Swivel and Air Flow Restrictor with fine precision adjus
tment*> 1=94 Diameter Flush Rivet Set (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 3/32=94 Cupped Riv
et Set 3.5=94 (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Cupped Rivet Set 3.5=94 (Snap-On U.
S.A.)*> 3/16=94 Cupped Rivet Set 3.5=94 (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Double Of
fset Rivet Set (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Back Rivet Set* (Special Small 1/2" Diame
ter for RV's)> Mini-Bucking Bar=2C 1 lb. (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Bulkhead Buckin
g Bar (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Footed Bucking Bar (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Microstop Co
untersink Unit=2C needle-bearing=2C non-chattering (U.S.A.)*> #40 Countersi
nk Bit=2C 3/32=94 (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> #30 Countersink Bit=2C for 1/8=94 & #6
Screw (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> #8 Countersink Bit=2C #8 Screw (Snap-On U.S.A.)*>
#10 Countersink Bit=2C #10 Screw (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Left Cut Snips=2C easy
to use offset type (Klein Tools U.S.A.)*> Right Cut Snips=2C easy to use o
ffset type (Klein Tools U.S.A.)*> Straight Cut Snips=2C easy to use offset
type (Klein Tools U.S.A.)*> #40 Aviation Cobalt Drill Bits for 3/32=94 rive
ts=2C 8 each> #30 Aviation Cobalt Drill Bits for 1/8=94 rivets=2C 6 each> #
27 Aviation Cobalt Drill Bit> #21 Aviation Cobalt Drill Bit> #19 Aviation C
obalt Drill Bit> #12 Aviation Cobalt Drill Bit> 1/4" Aviation Cobalt Drill
Bit> 12=94 Aviation Extra Long #40 Drill Bit> 12=94 Aviation Extra Long #30
Drill Bit> Deburr Tool=2C Speed Handle Type for small & large holes (U.S.A
.)*> Cleco Pliers*> 4 Cleco Clamps=2C 1/2" (Calif Assoc Prod or Zephyr U.S.
A.)*> 4 Cleco Clamps=2C 1=94 (Calif Assoc Prod or Zephyr U.S.A.)*> Pop Rive
t Tool=2C Professional Heavy-Duty unit with Swivel Head*> 3/32" Universal C
upped Squeezer Set (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Universal Cupped Squeezer Set
(Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 5/32" Universal Cupped Squeezer Set (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> 3
/16=94 Universal Cupped Squeezer Set (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Flat Squeezer Set 1
/8=94 (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Flat Squeezer Set 1/4" (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Flat Squ
eezer Set 3/8=94 (Snap-On U.S.A.)*> Flat Squeezer Set 1/2" (Snap-On U.S.A.)
*> 3/32=94 Rivet Dimple Die (Springback U.S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Rivet Dimple Die (
Springback U.S.A.)*> 5/32" Dimple Die*> 3/16" - #10 Screw Dimple Die*> #8 S
crew Dimple Die*> #6 Screw Dimple Die*> Squeezer Set Organizer*> Squeezer S
et Adjustment Washers *> Stainless Steel Rule=2C 12=94*> Unibit 1/4" - 3/4"
by 1/16ths=2C (Klein U.S.A.)*> 3 Permanent Markers=2C Sharpie> 1/2 x 1 Red
ucers for 3M Wheel*> 325 Cleco Fasteners=2C 3/32=94 (Calif Assoc Prod or Ze
phyr U.S.A.)*> 175 Cleco Fasteners=2C 1/8=94 (Calif Assoc Prod or Zephyr U.
S.A.)*> 10 Cleco Fasteners=2C 5/32" (Calif Assoc Prod or Zephyr U.S.A.)*> 1
0 Cleco Fasteners=2C 3/16=94 (Calif Assoc Prod or Zephyr U.S.A.)*> Edge Deb
urring Tool=2C Hex Swivel type*> Fluting Pliers=2C Smooth Flute Nylon Jaws*
> Fluting Pliers=2C Deep =93V=94 Nylon Jaws*> Rivet Cutter*> Air Tool Oil>
Drill Stop Set of 4 with Allen Wrench*> Rivet Set DOTS=2C Easier than Rivet
Tape> 3/32=94 Pop Rivet Dimple Die=2C Springback (U.S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Pop Riv
et Dimple Die=2C Springback (U.S.A.)*> Hand Seamer (Klein Tools U.S.A.)*> 3
/32=94 Drive Pin Punch (Klein Tools U.S.A.)*> 1/8=94 Drive Pin Punch (Klein
Tools U.S.A.)*> Scotch Brite Hand Pads=2C 4 each> Rivet Length Gauge*> Riv
et Shop Head Gauge=2C 4-piece*> > - --> Dan Brown=2C KE6MKS=2C dan@familybr
own.org> "Since all the world is but a story=2C it were well for thee to bu
y the> more enduring story rather than the story that is less enduring."> ~
-- The Judgment of St. Colum Cille> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----> Version
: GnuPG v1.2.1 (MingW32)> Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigma
il.mozdev.org> > iD8DBQFIcTwsyQGUivXxtkERArQ5AKDXyHERioqiOx7Di9qmwK5lYRUxZw
CgxTEO> 1xKO82rbsPh08my6buAF1iY=> =GTub> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----> >
-========================
===> > >
_________________________________________________________________
Use video conversation to talk face-to-face with Windows Live Messenger.
http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/connect_your_way.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM
_WL_Refresh_messenger_video_072008
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph Finch" <rgf(at)dcn.davis.ca.us> |
I don't understand this issue, could someone explain or point me to a
website....apparently a significant problem with Slick Mags??
Ralph Finch
Davis, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6 Flyer <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
http://www.lycoming.textron.com/support/publications/service-bulletins/pdfs
/SB58\
4.pdf
http://www.lycoming.textron.com/support/publications/service-bulletins/pdfs
/SB58\
3.pdf
One of the Unsion SB was revised 1 July 2008 but IMHO=2C it was a minor rev
ision.
Only one of my LASAR mags was in the S/N range listed in the Service Bullet
ins. It took me 1.5 hours to remove=2C inspect=2C reinstall and time to th
e engine. The cowl was off for an oil change.
The cam costs sixty cents and the brush cost less than $6 USD from Aircraft
Spruce.
Having an A&P license=2C the shop manuals and T-100 tool kit=2C I can servi
ce my own. The UNISON LASAR price increase in January 2008 priced the LAS
AR parts out of reach for most of us. I set my self up so that I can servi
ce my own as long as the controller does not go bad.
A homebuilder can do the inspection with a timing box=2C a Torx driver=2C a
nd a 4X magnifier. NO other special tools are necessary. The cam is made
out of plastic.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell=2C
2=2C115 + Flying Hours So. CA=2C USA
From: rgf(at)dcn.davis.ca.us
Subject: RV-List: RE: SLICK MAGS
Date: Tue=2C 8 Jul 2008 19:32:01 -0700
I don't understand
this issue=2C could someone explain or point me to a website....apparently
a
significant problem with Slick Mags??
Ralph
Finch
Davis=2C
CA
_________________________________________________________________
The i=92m Talkaton. Can 30-days of conversation change the world?
http://www.imtalkathon.com/?source=EML_WLH_Talkathon_ChangeWorld
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Green" <gpgreen(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Introducing myself |
I recently started building an RV-9. My build log is on the web at
http://www.bit-builder.com/rv9a/rv9a.html.
It is a lot of fun building it, I was a structural engineer at Boeing for
many years, but never got to touch the stuff, just design it. Not quite the
same.
Anyway, hello to the list.
--
Greg Green
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Darrell Reiley <lifeofreiley2003(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Introducing myself |
Welcome to the cult... ;-)
Ask all the question you want.
Rivet on!
Darrell
--- On Wed, 7/9/08, Greg Green wrote:
> From: Greg Green <gpgreen(at)gmail.com>
> Subject: RV-List: Introducing myself
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Wednesday, July 9, 2008, 2:42 PM
> I recently started building an RV-9. My build log is on the
> web at
> http://www.bit-builder.com/rv9a/rv9a.html.
>
> It is a lot of fun building it, I was a structural engineer
> at Boeing for
> many years, but never got to touch the stuff, just design
> it. Not quite the
> same.
>
> Anyway, hello to the list.
>
> --
> Greg Green
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Grimmonpre" <jerry(at)mc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Introducing myself |
Welcome Greg ...
You'll have fun here and we'll all learn something from your being here
and giving, as well as getting from us. There are a lot of talented
folks here and we cover everything over time. Someone has been there
and done that. I've flown a lot of the Boeing fleet and your
contribution to that is acknowledged ... thanks for building them strong
because some of my landings required designed-in strength. Have fun and
take some of this stuff with the grain.
Happy building ...
Jerry
RV8A Huntley IL
----- Original Message -----
From: Greg Green
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 2:42 PM
Subject: RV-List: Introducing myself
I recently started building an RV-9. My build log is on the web at
http://www.bit-builder.com/rv9a/rv9a.html.
It is a lot of fun building it, I was a structural engineer at Boeing
for many years, but never got to touch the stuff, just design it. Not
quite the same.
Anyway, hello to the list.
--
Greg Green
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Introducing myself |
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
Greg congratulations on your decision and welcome.
I hope you will be a regular poster on ideas and concerns you encounter
during your project.
At work, we curse the design engineers at Bombardier (almost daily) we
joke they are young French Canadians with no aviation experience but
advanced CAD skills for some of their hair brained designs and hope they
would be more like Boeing guys when they grow up. You could be a
valuable asset for safer aircraft, a reduced accident rate and more joy
and confidence in our mutual passion of the build.
John Cox - Oregon
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Greg Green
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 12:43 PM
Subject: RV-List: Introducing myself
I recently started building an RV-9. My build log is on the web at
http://www.bit-builder.com/rv9a/rv9a.html.
It is a lot of fun building it, I was a structural engineer at Boeing
for many years, but never got to touch the stuff, just design it. Not
quite the same.
Anyway, hello to the list.
--
Greg Green
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | VOR Antenna Mounting... |
RV-Listers,
I'm mounting a VOR antenna on the Vertical Fin and came up with this
idea for installation. I'm thinking maybe adding a .063" plate
underneath for added rigidity. Maybe another under the black antenna
mount as well. Does this seem like a decent way to mount this? Other ideas?
Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Vs" <dsvs(at)ca.rr.com> |
| Subject: | VOR Antenna Mounting... |
Matt,
Will the arms of the antenna clear the rudder counter weight? If yes this
looks good. I have also seen a few mounted underneath the fuse on tail
dtaggers to keep them from being "eye stickers".
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:38 PM
Subject: RV-List: VOR Antenna Mounting...
RV-Listers,
I'm mounting a VOR antenna on the Vertical Fin and came up with this
idea for installation. I'm thinking maybe adding a .063" plate
underneath for added rigidity. Maybe another under the black antenna
mount as well. Does this seem like a decent way to mount this? Other
ideas?
Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: VOR Antenna Mounting... |
Matt Dralle wrote:
>
> RV-Listers,
>
> I'm mounting a VOR antenna on the Vertical Fin and came up with this
> idea for installation. I'm thinking maybe adding a .063" plate
> underneath for added rigidity. Maybe another under the black antenna
> mount as well. Does this seem like a decent way to mount this? Other
> ideas?
>
> Matt
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
Matt, make sure you really want to mount the antenna on the top of the
stab. You are building a serious eye-poker--a real hazard for someone
walking near the back of your plane.
The antenna will work fine below the horiz stab and won't be a safety
hazard. Better yet, use the Archer antenna in the wingtip.
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Vs" <dsvs(at)ca.rr.com> |
| Subject: | VOR Antenna Mounting... |
Matt,
I have to agree with Sam. I used two Archer antennas in my "7" wing tips.
My original answer is only in refference to the useability of the mount you
choose. The potential for putting eyes in grave danger is there with the
system you want to use.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Don Vs
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:54 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: VOR Antenna Mounting...
Matt,
Will the arms of the antenna clear the rudder counter weight? If yes this
looks good. I have also seen a few mounted underneath the fuse on tail
dtaggers to keep them from being "eye stickers".
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:38 PM
Subject: RV-List: VOR Antenna Mounting...
RV-Listers,
I'm mounting a VOR antenna on the Vertical Fin and came up with this
idea for installation. I'm thinking maybe adding a .063" plate
underneath for added rigidity. Maybe another under the black antenna
mount as well. Does this seem like a decent way to mount this? Other
ideas?
Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DEAN PSIROPOULOS" <dean.psiropoulos(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Aileron Trim and wing leveler question |
RV builders who've installed manual aileron trim (the little lever between
the seats with the springs down to the control stick pushrod heim joint
bolt). I built the airplane with this mechanism but forgot to install it
when I assembled the control column, sticks and pushrod tubes. After
noticing my error and dragging out the parts I noticed that the trim lever
relys on the clamping force of a plastic block around the trim lever shaft.
This got me to wondering if the drag from the trim system would adversely
affect the operation of the autopilot (EZ Pilot). Anyone have experience
with manual aileron trim interfering with the operation of your wing
leveler? Or...is this a non issue? Thanks.
Dean Psiropoulos
RV-6A N197DM
Weighing this weekend, inspection next week.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Point" <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Trim and wing leveler question |
It's a non-issue. The system only puts a little pre-load on the aileron
controls via the springs. You won't feel it in the stick and the A/P
won't care. In fact, I find the my wing leveler (Naviad) works just a
little better when it has to fight the trim a little bit. Not sure
about the Trio, but I'd love to swap out the Navaid and find out!
I did replace the stock springs with much longer ones that ran most of
the length beteen the trim arm and the control stick, attached by very
short pieces of safety wire at the ends.
Jeff Point
RV-6 flying/ RV-8 building
Milwaukee
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "sheldon barrett" <sheldonb(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: VOR Antenna Mounting... |
I have a 6A and mounted my VOR antenna under the h.s. on the tail cone... so
outa sight, I forget it's there sometimes.. works very good too... Sheldon
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:38 PM
Subject: RV-List: VOR Antenna Mounting...
>
> RV-Listers,
>
> I'm mounting a VOR antenna on the Vertical Fin and came up with this
> idea for installation. I'm thinking maybe adding a .063" plate
> underneath for added rigidity. Maybe another under the black antenna
> mount as well. Does this seem like a decent way to mount this? Other
> ideas?
>
> Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: VOR Antenna Mounting... |
I have a 6A with the older tail - My VOR/LOC/GS antenna is mounted very similar
to how you are planning yours.
I put a backing plate under the top rib and built a hat section to raise the antenna
and level it. The hat sectioon is removeable for maintenance (or in case
I got the level angle wrong). My antenna is a Comant CI-182 (IIRC) and it fits
completely under the fiberglass cap - the only thing sticking out are the
'eye pokers' but with a 6A they're way up there.
Ralph
-----Original Message-----
>From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
>Sent: Jul 9, 2008 11:38 PM
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: VOR Antenna Mounting...
>
>
>RV-Listers,
>
>I'm mounting a VOR antenna on the Vertical Fin and came up with this
>idea for installation. I'm thinking maybe adding a .063" plate
>underneath for added rigidity. Maybe another under the black antenna
>mount as well. Does this seem like a decent way to mount this? Other ideas?
>
>Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Heathco" <cheathco(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Trim and wing leveler question |
I fabricated and instrlled the trim lever right after I got the plane,(
6a) its very effective, has no efect on the autopilot, nor is it
noticibel hand flying. Charlie heathco
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Bryan" <n616tb(at)btsapps.com> |
| Subject: | VOR Antenna Mounting... |
Matt,
I mounted mine just about like you show. In spite of all the eye poking
advice I also got for my taildragger, I have yet to poke mine or anyone
else. It has been a non issue and if anyone else gets that close to my
plane, I cringe anyway. Mine is a little more forward on the stabilizer
than you show and the black disc sticks out from the fiberglass by a small
amount on each side. It works great.
Tim Bryan
RV-6 Flying
N616TB over 100 hours now
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-
> server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
> Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 10:38 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: VOR Antenna Mounting...
>
>
> RV-Listers,
>
> I'm mounting a VOR antenna on the Vertical Fin and came up with this
> idea for installation. I'm thinking maybe adding a .063" plate
> underneath for added rigidity. Maybe another under the black antenna
> mount as well. Does this seem like a decent way to mount this? Other
> ideas?
>
> Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Introducing myself |
| From: | "Greg Green" <gpgreen(at)gmail.com> |
Had my subscription on digest, so didn't see your replay's.
Thanks for the welcome.
I am no longer a design engineer at Boeing. I switched to a software developer
(also at Boeing) in 1996, right about the time of the big push to composites,
instead of the beloved aluminum+rivets. The job (design engineer) was too much
paper pushing for me. I still work with all those guys, so if you have any questions
for me, I can ask the experts. There are some very fine engineers working
there, also at Northrop, Lockheed, Airbus, and countless second tier suppliers.
Never met anyone from Bombadier. They work on those little airplanes. :)
Now I work on software for helping the engineers, specifically the up-front design,
which is very interesting. Lots of cutting edge working going on, also a
lot of mistakes, notice the big delays with the new airplanes.
I think the guys at Vans do a fine job also, from what little I've gotten through
so far. More buildable than some of the stuff I did. :)
It is true that advanced CAD skills != good designs. That is what experience and
mentoring is for. Tools are just tools, it is the person behind them that makes
them work. One thing is pretty clear to me, there needs to be more young people
in aviation, it is greybeard's everywhere at Boeing and the other places.
Not the premium place for young people to go anymore it seems. That doesn't
bode well for the future, especially when the opposite seem to be true in Asia.
I guess I better stop yakking, Have a good day all.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=192170#192170
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton01(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | RV-8/8A builders/flyers meetings at OSH |
In years past there have been one or two RV-8/8A builders meetings in
the Theatre in the Woods. Several other builders who frequent the
Yahoo RV-8 Group have expressed interest this year, so there should
be at least a handful of builders at the Theatre in the Woods at the
following dates/times:
Tuesday at 10:15
Thursday at 10:15
Both meetings would be at the Theatre in the Woods. If it is raining,
we will meet under the roof. If it is not raining, we can meet just
outside on the end away from the stage. I'll bring stick-on name tags
and markers, so we can identify the people who belong to the names
we've seen online.
At one point, I had hoped to fly my RV to OSH this year. There is no
way that will happen, but maybe I will have flown by then. My wife
and I will drive down. She is originally from Green Bay, so will
spend the week visiting sisters while I bake (or drown) at OSH.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (final assemby)
Ottawa, Canada
http://www.kilohotel.com/rv8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
I emailed BPE this morning regarding the joy of having TWO brand
spanking new mags that fall under the SB. Rhonda did a little research
and found a solution that gets around the SB / future inspections. She
OK'd me to post this to the list:
Here is the pricing from the local accessory shop in Tulsa, Quality
Aircraft Accessories. Replace the carbon brush and cam, including labor
for any Slick mag at or around 100 hours for $75/mag. This would be
Aero-Accessory replacement parts, so they would not be affected by the
SB after the repair.
Justin Hicks at Quality can be reached directly at (918) 835-6948 for
assistance.
I am not sure what it takes to do this yourself. The SB makes the
replacement seem pretty simple.
Robin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RICHARD MILLER <rickpegser(at)yahoo.com> |
if you have a new mag 0806 and on then you are good on the cam and it is ju
st 6 screws. check the sac sky ranch for instructions. trun the brush clock
wise it come out easier that way.
rick
--- On Thu, 7/10/08, Robin Marks wrote:
From: Robin Marks <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Subject: RV-List: SLICK MAGs
Date: Thursday, July 10, 2008, 5:02 PM
I emailed BPE this morning regarding the joy of having TWO brand spanking n
ew mags that fall under the SB. Rhonda did a little research and found a so
lution that gets around the SB / future inspections. She OK=A2d me to post
this to the list: -
Here is the pricing from the local accessory shop in Tulsa, Quality Aircraf
t Accessories.- Replace the carbon brush and cam, including labor for any
Slick mag at or around 100 hours for $75/mag. -This would be Aero-Access
ory replacement parts, so they would not be affected by the SB after the re
pair. -
-Justin Hicks at Quality can be reached directly at (918) 835-6948 for as
sistance. - -I am not sure what it takes to do this yourself. The SB ma
kes the replacement seem pretty simple. -Robin
=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HCRV6(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Trim and wing leveler question |
<>
I don't know about the EZ Pilot but mine works just fine with my Navaid and works
perfectly when hand flying to relieve aileron stick force due to fuel burn
or passenger weight. I did find that I had to set the friction pretty high to
prevent creeping but once that was adjusted it has worked just fine.
--
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, flying - 480 hours
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "DEAN PSIROPOULOS" <dean.psiropoulos(at)verizon.net>
>
>
> RV builders who've installed manual aileron trim (the little lever between
> the seats with the springs down to the control stick pushrod heim joint
> bolt). I built the airplane with this mechanism but forgot to install it
> when I assembled the control column, sticks and pushrod tubes. After
> noticing my error and dragging out the parts I noticed that the trim lever
> relys on the clamping force of a plastic block around the trim lever shaft.
> This got me to wondering if the drag from the trim system would adversely
> affect the operation of the autopilot (EZ Pilot). Anyone have experience
> with manual aileron trim interfering with the operation of your wing
> leveler? Or...is this a non issue? Thanks.
>
> Dean Psiropoulos
> RV-6A N197DM
> Weighing this weekend, inspection next week.
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JVanLaak(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Reviews of Anywhere Travel Comanion? |
Listers,
My trusty 295 has given up the ghost and my PDA based Anywheremap is getting
mighty tired. If possible I would like to combine the functions into one
sunlight readable unit that will let me use the XM receiver I already own.
Anywheremap will upgrade my XM receiver to work with their new ATC for only $100
which sounds like a winner but I find the lack of press coverage of this new
unit to be a little suspicious.
Anyone out there with experience with this ATC unit? I don't need it for
the car so that side of the unit is of no use. The PDA unit I have is nearly
unreadable in the sun and if I don't use it every two weeks max I have to go
through reinstalling the software and so on. The ATC offers the potential of
bypassing many of those faults.
I have a Garmin 420 for primary navcom and this is backup and weather only,
so $2400 for a 495 is a bit much for me.
Thanks for any insights.
Jim Van Laak
RV-6 N79RL (bought flying)
**************Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music
scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com!
(http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus00050000000112)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dwight Frye <dwight(at)openweave.org> |
| Subject: | Lasar Mags For Sale |
I'm selling these for a friend who is getting out of flying. Along
the way he ended up with some spare Lasar Mags for his RV-8, neither
of which he ended up needing, so they went into his spares cabinet.
These are each being sold independently, as they are each timed a bit
differently. One (with "left mag" handwritten on the box) is timed
at 25 degrees and the other (with "right mag" handwritten on the box)
is timed at 20 degrees. Both of these have been installed, but only
run briefly. When removed they were in working condition.
A quick look on the web (at AC$, to be honest) they seem to sell new
for about $1600. A few pictures can be seen at :
http://picasaweb.google.com/DwightRFrye/LasarForSale
My understanding is that my friend will be happy with 1/2 the going
price for these units. If you are interested drop me a line with an
offer, I'll see if he agrees, and we'll ship them out to you right
away. Help me with this last little bit of hangar cleaning! :)
-- Dwight Frye
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dwight Frye <dwight(at)openweave.org> |
| Subject: | HobbyAir For Sale |
I have a HobbyAir 1 that I know I'll never use again, so it is up
for sale. I paid about $400 for it a few years ago. It is the single
person unit, and I got the full hood because with a beard I worried
that the face mask would not seal well enough.
You can see a few quick pictures at :
http://picasaweb.google.com/DwightRFrye/HobbyAirForSale
I used this a few times, but the unit is in excellent condition. I
do have a few paint smears on the hose, but otherwise the worst
abuse it has taken is to collect a little dust while in storage.
A quick look shows them as being a bit more expnsive these days, but
I'd be happy to get $300 out of it. If you are interested drop me
a line, and if you think I'm asking too much .. make me an offer.
-- Dwight Frye
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tom sargent <sarg314(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: UV SmoothPrime progress |
On June 8, 2008 I made a rather long post describing how I used UV
Smoothprime. I've altered my technique for the better lately and I
thought, for the record, I'd add what I have learned since.
I follow the steps outlined in the earlier post with the exception that
I now
1- wait 1/2 hr between successive coats of UV smoothprime (instead of
15min) and
2- sand each coat lightly at the end of the 1/2hr, blow of the dust with
compressed air and then start the next coat.
The sanding is VERY modest. Sanding my whole lower cowl - the largest
piece on the plane - with 400 grit open coat paper is only 5 or 10
minutes of work. You aren't trying to really smooth it out. You're just
trying to break open any tiny bubbles that have formed. These tend to
happen more at the edges, but can happen anywhere. Don't over sand the
edges - it's easy to go all the way thru at the edge!
After all 6 or 7 light coats are applied, the piece is pretty smooth to
start with and sands rapidly to a completely smooth surface. Polyfiber
says don't sand all the way thru it. It is used to rebuild the surface,
not spot fill pinholes (although it does that too). Use the glancing
illumination technique with a pen light described in the earlier email.
I think this is crucial in spotting pinholes and imperfections and
especially in telling you when to stop sanding a spot. If you're not
real near-sighted, put on a pair of strong drug store reading glasses so
you can become near-sighted. Or use a big magnifier. It's a definite
plus in examining the surface visually.
I don't claim to be a fiberglass expert or even a proponent of UV smooth
Prime. There are probably better ways to finish fiberglass. I'm just
reporting that I finally figured out a way to use the stuff that seems
to work well. Beware that my process contradicts Polyfiber's
documentation and advice!! I couldn't get the stuff to work using their
advice. I was probably doing it wrong - putting it on too thick, I'd
guess. But this procedure seems to have a high probability of working,
for me anyway.
--
Tom S., RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6 Flyer <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Lasar Mags For Sale |
4771 is a LEFT mag with Sensor and 4770 is a RIGHT Non-Sensor Mag. The 4770
can be set up at either 20 or 25 degrees depending on how the user install
s it.
Unison LASAR L-1525-E Price List revised 03-01-2006 has a MSRP of $738 for
the 4770 mag and $830 for the 4771 mag. If your friend has them sitting on
the shelf in his spares cabinet=2C he would not have paid more than that f
or them.
Unsion had a VERY SUBSTANTIAL increase in their LASAR prices this year. IF
someone is willing to pay what your friend paid=2C your friend will be gett
ing a good deal.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell=2C
2=2C116 + Flying Hours So. CA=2C USA
> From: dwight(at)openweave.org
> Subject: RV-List: Lasar Mags For Sale
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Sun=2C 13 Jul 2008 13:08:11 -0400
>
>
> I'm selling these for a friend who is getting out of flying. Along
> the way he ended up with some spare Lasar Mags for his RV-8=2C neither
> of which he ended up needing=2C so they went into his spares cabinet.
>
> These are each being sold independently=2C as they are each timed a bit
> differently. One (with "left mag" handwritten on the box) is timed
> at 25 degrees and the other (with "right mag" handwritten on the box)
> is timed at 20 degrees. Both of these have been installed=2C but only
> run briefly. When removed they were in working condition.
>
> A quick look on the web (at AC$=2C to be honest) they seem to sell new
> for about $1600. A few pictures can be seen at :
>
> http://picasaweb.google.com/DwightRFrye/LasarForSale
>
> My understanding is that my friend will be happy with 1/2 the going
> price for these units. If you are interested drop me a line with an
> offer=2C I'll see if he agrees=2C and we'll ship them out to you right
> away. Help me with this last little bit of hangar cleaning! :)
>
> -- Dwight Frye
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Making the world a better place one message at a time.
http://www.imtalkathon.com/?source=EML_WLH_Talkathon_BetterPlace
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dwight Frye <dwight(at)openweave.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Lasar Mags For Sale |
Gary,
Thanks for the feedback. I've not wanted to go the LASAR route so have
little experience with specific models and prices. This is good info.
I'll pass it on to him, and see what he'll really want for them. I'm just
trying to lend a hand because I "inherited" his hangar .. and am helping
him unload a few items.
-- Dwight
On Sun Jul 13 18:16:02 2008, RV6 Flyer wrote :
>4771 is a LEFT mag with Sensor and 4770 is a RIGHT Non-Sensor Mag. The 4770
> can be set up at either 20 or 25 degrees depending on how the user install
>s it.
>
>Unison LASAR L-1525-E Price List revised 03-01-2006 has a MSRP of $738 for
>the 4770 mag and $830 for the 4771 mag. If your friend has them sitting on
> the shelf in his spares cabinet=2C he would not have paid more than that f
>or them.
>
>Unsion had a VERY SUBSTANTIAL increase in their LASAR prices this year. IF
>someone is willing to pay what your friend paid=2C your friend will be gett
>ing a good deal.
>
>Gary A. Sobek
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Emrath" <emrath(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | FW: Training for flying over the Alps! |
This is pretty neat!
Go to Electric Oyster <http://www.electricoyster.com/electric3d/index.html>
Move your cursor over the screen (left, right , up ,down) and you will have
the impression that you are flying over the mountains.
Marty RV-6A Brentwood TN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
| Subject: | HobbyAir For Sale |
Hey Dwight if you still have it I could probably do $250. Let me know.
Michael Sausen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dwight Frye
Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 12:15 PM
Subject: RV-List: HobbyAir For Sale
I have a HobbyAir 1 that I know I'll never use again, so it is up
for sale. I paid about $400 for it a few years ago. It is the single
person unit, and I got the full hood because with a beard I worried
that the face mask would not seal well enough.
You can see a few quick pictures at :
http://picasaweb.google.com/DwightRFrye/HobbyAirForSale
I used this a few times, but the unit is in excellent condition. I
do have a few paint smears on the hose, but otherwise the worst
abuse it has taken is to collect a little dust while in storage.
A quick look shows them as being a bit more expnsive these days, but
I'd be happy to get $300 out of it. If you are interested drop me
a line, and if you think I'm asking too much .. make me an offer.
-- Dwight Frye
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Trip to St. Louis |
Can anyone suggest a good general aviation airport to go into following Oshkosh
for a day or two for business ... would need to get a rental car?
Thanks !
Len Leggette, RV-8A
Greensboro, NC? N910LL
710 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dwight Frye <dwight(at)openweave.org> |
| Subject: | Re: HobbyAir For Sale (SOLD) |
Michael,
Thanks for your (and everyone else's) interest. I've found a buyer,
and so the HobbyAir is sold. Heck, the guy who picked it up has
already got payment on the way .. so I've got to hussle to get it
shipped out. Thanks, everyone!
-- Dwight
On Mon Jul 14 07:47:58 2008, "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" wrote :
>Hey Dwight if you still have it I could probably do $250. Let me know.
>
>Michael Sausen
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Trip to St. Louis |
| From: | "Glaeser, Dennis A" <dennis.glaeser(at)eds.com> |
Creve Coeur airport (1H0). Is a very nice GA airport West of STL.
There is an antique airplane museum - 3 hangars worth - on the field
($10 donation for a tour).
I don't know if any of the recent flooding in that area has affected it.
It's been flooded in the past, so be sure to check.
If you're looking for something bigger, more commercial, Spirit of St.
Louis (SUS) is a bit further west, and St. Louis Downtown (CPS) is in
IL, across the river from downtown.
The other GA airports in the area, St. Charles (3SQ) and Smartt (SET)
are nice, but getting a rental car or transport to a hotel will be more
difficult.
Dennis Glaeser
Moved from STL to DET back in '93
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Cutter" <rcutter(at)cupower.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Trip to St. Louis |
Re: Trip to St. LouisLen,
Several years ago I was doing a job in ST. Louis and landed at SUS and
was there for 3 weeks. They were great. I did, however, go to Creve
Coeur airport and took the $10 tour. It was wonderful. Lots of rare
stuff there and they were very friendly as mentioned by Dennis.
RVRC
RC & Moonpie
Robert Cutter
----- Original Message -----
From: Glaeser, Dennis A
To: RV-List(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 10:55 AM
Subject: RV-List: Re: Trip to St. Louis
Creve Coeur airport (1H0). Is a very nice GA airport West of STL.
There is an antique airplane museum - 3 hangars worth - on the field
($10 donation for a tour).
I don't know if any of the recent flooding in that area has affected
it. It's been flooded in the past, so be sure to check.
If you're looking for something bigger, more commercial, Spirit of St.
Louis (SUS) is a bit further west, and St. Louis Downtown (CPS) is in
IL, across the river from downtown.
The other GA airports in the area, St. Charles (3SQ) and Smartt (SET)
are nice, but getting a rental car or transport to a hotel will be more
difficult.
Dennis Glaeser
Moved from STL to DET back in '93
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Trip to St. Louis |
| From: | John Jessen <n212pj(at)gmail.com> |
I concur. Flying my GlaStar from NC to OR last year, my first stop was a
visit to Creve Coeur. The FBO there, for a modest fee, put my plane in
their hanger for the couple days I was there to do business. Got a rental
car from Hertz. People on the field were very friendly. Besides a large
number of older planes, there's also a Reno racer of some type. Not sure
the category. Not sure about the other airports mentioned, but I would
think if it's not been flooded, this would be a great stop. .
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Glaeser, Dennis A
Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 7:56 AM
Subject: RV-List: Re: Trip to St. Louis
Creve Coeur airport (1H0). Is a very nice GA airport West of STL. There is
an antique airplane museum - 3 hangars worth - on the field ($10 donation
for a tour).
I don't know if any of the recent flooding in that area has affected it.
It's been flooded in the past, so be sure to check.
If you're looking for something bigger, more commercial, Spirit of St. Louis
(SUS) is a bit further west, and St. Louis Downtown (CPS) is in IL, across
the river from downtown.
The other GA airports in the area, St. Charles (3SQ) and Smartt (SET) are
nice, but getting a rental car or transport to a hotel will be more
difficult.
Dennis Glaeser
Moved from STL to DET back in '93
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: VOR Antenna Mounting... |
| From: | "marcausman" <marc(at)verticalpower.com> |
Matt,
I mounted it up there too on my -7 and it's worked great for 400 hrs. The antennas
point forward, as they rubbed on the rudder horn if backwards, and were more
"in the way" during preflight of the tail feathers..
I also added a red rubber cap on the end of each antenna so they have a bit more
visibility. You know, the ones they sell that go on the switches on your instrument
panel.
--------
Marc Ausman
http://www.verticalpower.com
RV-7 IO-390 Flying
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=192686#192686
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DEAN PSIROPOULOS" <dean.psiropoulos(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Trim servo cable routing |
Little items on the way to first flight... Installing the electric elevator
trim servo, I was planning on using the existing trim cable hole in the
elevator spar to route the 5 wire MAC cable out to the horizontal stab and
into the fuselage. But....the MAC servo jackscrew sticks out of the back of
the servo and into that hole also. There seems to be enough clearance but
I'd rather not have the jackscrew impinge on the cable and wear it through,
shorting out the trim motor. Since I'm using the Mac (Ray Allen)cable with
the tiny little wires it's probably a moot point but... Is this a non issue?
Any other routing ideas? I rather not drill any more holes in the elevator
spar web if I can help it. Thanks.
Dean Psiropoulos
RV-6A N197DM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | lower cowl 'snubber' question |
The 'snubber' (best term I can think of) that keeps the cowl from being
pushed up by air pressure has just broken on my -4. This is the 2nd time
it's happened (2 different -4's) so I'm looking for a convenient,
permanent fix. Anyone with photos to share of a reliable solution?
I've got an idea, but don't have any desire to re-invent the wheel.
This is the thing that typically mounts to the bottom of the starter or
alternator & extends down & touches the inside of the bottom cowl.
Thanks,
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "R. Craig Chipley" <mechtech81(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Trip to St. Louis |
Depends on what part of town. West and south, KSUS. East and middle KCPS. Creve
Couer 1H0 is right by Lambert KSTL.
--- On Mon, 7/14/08, lenleg(at)aol.com wrote:
> From: lenleg(at)aol.com <lenleg(at)aol.com>
> Subject: RV-List: Trip to St. Louis
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com, RV-8(at)yahoogroups.com, rvsoutheast-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Monday, July 14, 2008, 7:46 AM
> Can anyone suggest a good general aviation airport to go
> into following Oshkosh for a day or two for business ...
> would need to get a rental car?
>
> Thanks !
>
> Len Leggette, RV-8A
> Greensboro, NC? N910LL
> 710 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Heathco" <cheathco(at)cox.net> |
Wondering if anyone has traded up to the zulu, especially if previously
had the 3G's. If so, would like to know if you consider them a real step
up in noise reduction and comfort. Charlie heathco
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Jensen" <cjensen(at)dts9000.com> |
I bought a Zulu to add to my 30G and two 20s. The clamping pressure is
certainly less. Noise attenuation is very good, but then the earlier LS
were pretty good already, so the step up isn't a big one. The Zulu has
a little cleaner design with higher quality looking plastic than earlier
versions.
My personal recommendation is I would make it mission dependent. If you
fly long flights and don't appreciate the clamping pressure of earlier
versions, then the Zulu or Bose is probably worth the money. If you do
a lot of local flying and the 30G or 20s are comfortable, I'm not sure
I'd spend the money on either the high end Zulu or Bose. The difference
in price will buy you a couple tanks of gas...until the next price hike!
Aviation Consumer had the Bose and Zulu rated about dead even.
Depending on your use, they gave a slight edge to the Zulu because of
its Bluetooth capability.
Chuck Jensen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Charles Heathco
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2008 7:49 AM
Subject: RV-List: Zulu headsets
Wondering if anyone has traded up to the zulu, especially if previously
had the 3G's. If so, would like to know if you consider them a real step
up in noise reduction and comfort. Charlie heathco
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph Finch" <rgf(at)dcn.davis.ca.us> |
Yes. I was surprised at how much better they were than the 3G I traded in.
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charles Heathco
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2008 4:49 AM
Subject: RV-List: Zulu headsets
Wondering if anyone has traded up to the zulu, especially if previously had
the 3G's. If so, would like to know if you consider them a real step up in
noise reduction and comfort. Charlie heathco
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Cudney <yenduc(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Zulu headsets |
I decided to upgrade to Zulu after trying them out in a demo at AC
Spruce. I have never really liked my 3G's -- they are too big and
clunky. The Zulu's are very comfortable and efficient. Over the last
12 years, between my wife and I we've had most of the Lightspeed's
except for the micro in the ear type. The upgrade is $350 but they
won't be shipping for several weeks. I was just about to give up on
Lightspeed and buy a Bose set before they came out with the Zulu. My
reason for sticking with Lightspeed for so long was their warrantee,
service, and plus upgrade policies.
good luck
dave
On Jul 17, 2008, at 4:48 AM, Charles Heathco wrote:
> Wondering if anyone has traded up to the zulu, especially if
> previously had the 3G's. If so, would like to know if you consider
> them a real step up in noise reduction and comfort. Charlie heathco
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Schaefer" <n142ds(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Trip to St. Louis |
Creve Coeur has a large EAA following. Nice airport.
DWS
On Mon, Jul 14, 2008 at 7:46 AM, wrote:
> Can anyone suggest a good general aviation airport to go into following
> Oshkosh for a day or two for business ... would need to get a rental car?
>
> Thanks !
>
> Len Leggette, RV-8A
> Greensboro, NC N910LL
> 710 hrs
> ------------------------------
> The Famous, the Infamous, the Lame - in your browser. Get the TMZ Toolbar
> Now <http://toolbar.aol.com/tmz/download.html?NCID=aolcmp00050000000014>!
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
--
David W. Schaefer
RV-6A N142DS formerly "Geek One' reborn "Nerdgasm"
TMX-IO360 Dual-LightSpeed Plasma IIIs, Hartzell Blended Airfoil, GRT EFIS
www.n142ds.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rossmickey(at)comcast.net> |
I want to add a small, independent, digital manifold pressure and rpm gauge
to my panel. Any suggestions?
Ross Mickey
N9PT, RV6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | 10:1 Compression / IO-360 200 HP |
Does anyone have any experience with 10:1 compression in a IO-360 200 HP engine?
* What are the down sides of running 10:1 in that engine?
* What is the HP gain?
* What is the impact to TBO?
* What is the impact to reliability?
If you've done it, would you do it again, or just go with the standard 8.7:1 compression?
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Trip to St. Louis |
At 07:46 AM 7/14/2008, you wrote:
>Can anyone suggest a good general aviation airport to go into
>following Oshkosh for a day or two for business ... would need to
>get a rental car?
I am based at 1h0. Lots of rag and tube planes (9 WACOs, 7
Stearmans, 5 Monocoupes, etc.), lots of warbirds (3 AT6's, 1 SNJ, 1
P-51, 1 Skyraider), lots of homebuilts, all on the field. Then there
are 70 other planes in the museum, almost all of which are flying,
some really rare and very cool. Just completed restoration of a
DH-4, a JN-3, and work in progress on a WACO and a Sopwith pup - not
replicas. No flooding since 93. Rental Car available - just call
them to have it waiting. On nice weekend day, many of the hangars
are open. Sundays they serve lunch. Ask around and introduce
yourself. Take a look at the chart - just stay under 1400 feet to
stay under the airspace, right on the Missouri river couple miles
south of St. Charles, and you're there. Any other questions, let me know.
Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Hobby-RV" <hobby_rv(at)sbcglobal.net> |
I will be flying my RV-6 from West Texas (KABI) into Washington DC on Aug
8th for a wedding the next day. I am planning to land at Montgomery County
(KGAI) due to its proximity to the DC Metro system. I have landed at
Manassas Airport south of Dulles many years ago. I also recently took the
FAA online course regarding flying in the Wash DC area, however I would
appreciate any hints or suggestions that would facilitate a smooth flight
into the area and on Montgomery County Airport. I will probably be stopping
at Charleston, WV for fuel prior to entering the Wash DC area.
After Washington, I am going to the Gatlinburg, TN area for a few days
before returning to Texas. I am planning to land at KGKT (Gatlinburg) but
would like some comments from others that have flown into this airport
versus going on to McGee Tyson.
Thanks,
Hobby Steven
hobby_rv(at)sbcglobal.net
RV-6
78 hours and growing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Trip to Wash DC |
Hobby-RV wrote:
> After Washington, I am going to the Gatlinburg, TN area for a few days
> before returning to Texas. I am planning to land at KGKT (Gatlinburg) but
> would like some comments from others that have flown into this airport
> versus going on to McGee Tyson.
I've been to GKT a few times and Knoxville once several years ago (but
none were over-nighters). It really depends on what you want to
accomplish. If you want to visit Gatlinburg and the national park there
isn't any reason why you shouldn't go with GKT. Rental cars are
available (last time I was there rentals were via a local Ford
dealership) and the service I received was good. If you want to
primarily visit Knoxville and don't mind dealing with a larger airport
then Knoxville will work.
Have a great trip!
Sam Buchanan
North Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "rv4ross" <rv4ross(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | WTB RV4 Fuselage and Finishing Kits |
Finally, I'm looking to buy fuselage and finishing kits for a RV4,
preferably long gear legs. Have the tail and wings kits finished
and out of storage after building new house. Any stale projects laying
around?
Thanks,
Ross Scroggs
Mallards Landing
Locust Grove, GA
770-305-9904
J3 Cub sold but not forgotten.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Trip to Wash DC |
| From: | "tsts4" <tsts4(at)verizon.net> |
Just make sure you pick the ADIZ gate closest to KGAI and make that the origin
on your ADIZ flight plan with KGAI as the destination, and then plan to penetrate
the ADIZ through that gate. Be sure to activate it with FSS before you get
too close or Potomac Approach will keep you outside the ADIZ until they can
sort it out. Otherwise it's no big deal. I fly out of Manassas (KHEF) which
is also in the ADIZ and have found it to be pretty much a non-event.
--------
Todd Stovall
728TT (reserved)
RV-10 Empacone
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193493#193493
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net> |
| Subject: | 10:1 Compression / IO-360 200 HP |
The down side is you have to feed it more gas down low. The up side is that
it is more efficient up high. A little more power both places.
HP gain is probably only a couple percent.
It may reduce your TBO if you run it hard a lot.
I haven't seen any reliability problems in 500 hours and 5 airventure cup
races (wide open for 2 hours at low altitude).
Really, it depends on what you are aiming for. If you are after every bit of
performance, then it is good. If you just want to bomb around in a great
airplane, I would stay with stock.
Maybe a better way to go is port and polish. Cheap, and no related problems,
just 3-4 extra HP per cylinder.
For the ultimate performance of course, you do both. For the very best MPG,
add Lightspeed ignition for high altitude cruising.
Best, John Huft race 18, "Nuisance"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2008 10:56 AM
Subject: RV-List: 10:1 Compression / IO-360 200 HP
Does anyone have any experience with 10:1 compression in a IO-360 200 HP
engine?
* What are the down sides of running 10:1 in that engine?
* What is the HP gain?
* What is the impact to TBO?
* What is the impact to reliability?
If you've done it, would you do it again, or just go with the standard 8.7:1
compression?
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Trip to St. Louis |
Thanks Gary !!
Len
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org>
Sent: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 2:38 pm
Subject: Re: RV-List: Trip to St. Louis
?
At 07:46 AM 7/14/2008, you wrote:?
>Can anyone suggest a good general aviation airport to go into
>following Oshkosh for a day or two for business ... would need to
>get a rental car??
?
I am based at 1h0. Lots of rag and tube planes (9 WACOs, 7
Stearmans, 5 Monocoupes, etc.), lots of warbirds (3 AT6's, 1 SNJ, 1
P-51, 1 Skyraider), lots of homebuilts, all on the field. Then there
are 70 other planes in the museum, almost all of which are flying,
some really rare and very cool. Just completed restoration of a
DH-4, a JN-3, and work in progress on a WACO and a Sopwith pup - not
replicas. No flooding since 93. Rental Car available - just call
them to have it waiting. On nice weekend day, many of the hangars
are open. Sundays they serve lunch. Ask around and introduce
yourself. Take a look at the chart - just stay under 1400 feet to
stay under the airspace, right on the Missouri river couple miles
south of St. Charles, and you're there. Any other questions, let me know.?
?
Gary Liming?
?
?
?
?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 10:1 Compression / IO-360 200 HP |
These pistons were designed for a helicopter version of the engine, and
Lycoming recommends NO leaning below something like 5 thousand or higher.
I know of one of these engines that self destructed in a Mooney, that
was being run with only stock instruments, so didn't see the high temps
on other cylinders.
Others report high oil consumption sometime after 500 hours. Have a
friend that is running them with no trouble, but keeps his temps down
and stays within the STC requirement on certified planes of no more than
28.5" MP.
Other downside is if 100LL ever gets reformulated to lower octane, you
will have problems or have to top the engine with lower compression pistons.
John Huft wrote:
>
> The down side is you have to feed it more gas down low. The up side is that
> it is more efficient up high. A little more power both places.
>
> HP gain is probably only a couple percent.
>
> It may reduce your TBO if you run it hard a lot.
>
> I haven't seen any reliability problems in 500 hours and 5 airventure cup
> races (wide open for 2 hours at low altitude).
>
> Really, it depends on what you are aiming for. If you are after every bit of
> performance, then it is good. If you just want to bomb around in a great
> airplane, I would stay with stock.
>
> Maybe a better way to go is port and polish. Cheap, and no related problems,
> just 3-4 extra HP per cylinder.
>
> For the ultimate performance of course, you do both. For the very best MPG,
> add Lightspeed ignition for high altitude cruising.
>
> Best, John Huft race 18, "Nuisance"
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
> Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2008 10:56 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: 10:1 Compression / IO-360 200 HP
>
>
> Does anyone have any experience with 10:1 compression in a IO-360 200 HP
> engine?
>
> * What are the down sides of running 10:1 in that engine?
>
> * What is the HP gain?
>
> * What is the impact to TBO?
>
> * What is the impact to reliability?
>
> If you've done it, would you do it again, or just go with the standard 8.7:1
> compression?
>
> Matt Dralle
> RV-8 #82880
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton01(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 10:1 Compression / IO-360 200 HP |
On 17-Jul-08, at 12:55 , Matt Dralle wrote:
>
>
> Does anyone have any experience with 10:1 compression in a IO-360
> 200 HP engine?
>
> * What is the HP gain?
An increase in compression ratio increases the thermal efficiency of
the engine - i.e. a higher percentage of the energy in the fuel is
converted to mechanical work.
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/tech/0311_phr_compression_ratio_tech/index.html
In theory, if you made no other changes to the engine, the power would
increase by 4%, which would probably yield about a 5% increase in rate
of climb and about a 1.3% increase in speed.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (final assemby)
Ottawa, Canada
http://www.kilohotel.com/rv8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <dwhite17(at)columbus.rr.com> |
Clear DayGoodmorning all: My buidling partner and I need to get 3
hours each traning by a CFI in a RV6A, RV7A or RV9A to satisfy our
insurance company. We live in the Columbus, Ohio area and were
wondering if there are any transition trainers in the area?
D. White
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Judge" <bjudge(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Trip to Wash DC (Hobby-RV) |
Flying into the ADIZ there is one cardinal sin:
Sqwuaking 1200 in the ADIZ.
Which happens regularly by:
1. reverting to normal ops and changing to 1200 after the
controller dumps you.
2. pressing on despite the fact that Potomac approach hasn't
given you a code even though you are talking with them.
File a flight plan for the gate along your route of flight that avoids
class bravo, get flight following with a discrete code and you won't
have any problems.
Since the ADIZ started class bravo clearances are generally not given
because the ADIZ controllers do not own any airspace: all they do is
give out codes and observe your code. You'll hear "transponder
observed, proceed on course" They will not say "cleared into the
ADIZ."
The controllers hate the ADIZ as much as we do. as long as you
squawk, talk and stay out of the bravo life is grand.
The real gotcha that nails a lot of pilots is changing to 1200 after
the controller releases you the same way you would after canceling VFR
or IFR services.
Bill
N84WJ RV-8 w/ 250 hrs
Based in the ADIZ and FRZ at VKX
>
> ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________
>
>
> Subject: RV-List: Re: Trip to Wash DC
> From: "tsts4" <tsts4(at)verizon.net>
>
>
> Just make sure you pick the ADIZ gate closest to KGAI and make that the origin
> on your ADIZ flight plan with KGAI as the destination, and then plan to penetrate
> the ADIZ through that gate. Be sure to activate it with FSS before you get
> too close or Potomac Approach will keep you outside the ADIZ until they can
> sort it out. Otherwise it's no big deal. I fly out of Manassas (KHEF) which
> is also in the ADIZ and have found it to be pretty much a non-event.
>
> --------
> Todd Stovall
> 728TT (reserved)
> RV-10 Empacone
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193493#193493
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Reel" <dreel(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-A Purchase |
I'm still trying to sell my RV8-A so it's now up at the address
members.cox.net/reelpilot. If you find anyone of interest, especially
at the annual show, please direct them to this new website. It seems
that financial shortages have greatly slowed interest in aircraft
movement but my cancer has kept me having to sell.
Dave Reel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Meyette" <bmeyette(at)gmail.com> |
Here=92s a list of all known transition trainers. Let me know of any
that I
haven=92t listed
HYPERLINK
"http://brian76.mystarband.net/training.htm"http://brian76.mystarband.net
/tr
aining.htm
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
dwhite17(at)columbus.rr.com
Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 7:27 AM
Subject: RV-List: RV6A Training
Goodmorning all: My buidling partner and I need to get 3 hours each
traning by a CFI in a RV6A, RV7A or RV9A to satisfy our insurance
company.
We live in the Columbus, Ohio area and were wondering if there are any
transition trainers in the area?
D. White
Checked by AVG.
12:00
AM
Checked by AVG.
12:00
AM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tom & Cathy Ervin <tcervin(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6A Training |
I received my transition training from from Keith Embree at CDI Cambridge,
OH. Keith is an excellent builder,pilot and CFI .
=C2-=C2- I took less than 2 hours training and was signed off good to g
o in his RV8-A . I made the first flight in my RV6-A with no issues and had
my biannual with him last fall.
=C2-=C2- The RV8-A flies exactly like the the 6-A so your insurance com
pany should except that. The sign off of a CFI with RV experience is all th
at should be required not a time stipulation....this isn't a tail drager .
=C2-=C2- Try another insurance company if the balk. Contact Keith at 74
0-432-4123.
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- To
m in Ohio ( 10G Holmes Co.)=C2-
----- Original Message -----
From: dwhite17 @ columbus . rr .com
Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 7:27:29 AM ( GMT-0500 ) America/ New_York
Subject: RV-List : RV6A Training
Goodmorning all:=C2-=C2-=C2- My buidling partner and I need to get 3
hours each traning by a CFI in a RV6A , RV7A or RV9A to satisfy our insuran
ce company.=C2- We live in the Columbus, Ohio area and were wondering if
there are any transition trainers in the area?
D. White
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Hernandez <carlosh(at)structuralaz.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6A Training |
Try this yahoo RV group - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/OhioValleyRVators/
These guys are active and I'm pretty sure they can answer that question
quick.
Carlos
dwhite17(at)columbus.rr.com wrote:
> Goodmorning all: My buidling partner and I need to get 3 hours each
> traning by a CFI in a RV6A, RV7A or RV9A to satisfy our insurance
> company. We live in the Columbus, Ohio area and were wondering if
> there are any transition trainers in the area?
>
> D. White
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Checked by AVG.
>
--
Carlos Hernandez <carlosh@sec-engr.com>
Structural Engineers Company
2963 W. Elliot Rd. - Suite 3
Chandler, AZ 85224
Phone: 480.968.8600
Fax: 480.968.8608
www.sec-engr.com
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE
The information in this email may be confidential and/or privileged.
This email is intended to be reviewed by only the individual or
organization named above. If you are not the intended recipient or
an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby
notified that any review, dissemination or copyingof this email and
its attachments, if any, or the information contained herein is
prohibited. If you havereceived this email in error, please
immediately notify the sender by return email and delete this email
from your system.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6A Training |
Some insurance companies will not except time in any other model.
Jerry
CFI
Tom & Cathy Ervin wrote:
> I received my transition training from from Keith Embree at CDI
> Cambridge, OH. Keith is an excellent builder,pilot and CFI.
>
> I took less than 2 hours training and was signed off good to go in
> his RV8-A. I made the first flight in my RV6-A with no issues and had
> my biannual with him last fall.
>
> The RV8-A flies exactly like the the 6-A so your insurance company
> should except that. The sign off of a CFI with RV experience is all
> that should be required not a time stipulation....this isn't a tail
> drager.
>
> Try another insurance company if the balk. Contact Keith at
> 740-432-4123.
>
> Tom in
> Ohio (10G Holmes Co.)
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: dwhite17(at)columbus.rr.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 7:27:29 AM (GMT-0500) America/New_York
> Subject: RV-List: RV6A Training
>
> Goodmorning all: My buidling partner and I need to get 3 hours each
> traning by a CFI in a RV6A, RV7A or RV9A to satisfy our insurance
> company. We live in the Columbus, Ohio area and were wondering if
> there are any transition trainers in the area?
>
> D. White
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <gmcjetpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 10:1 Compression / IO-360 200 HP |
I have not done 10:1 on my RV but have some
experience with HC pistons on Lycs.
First Lyc engineers pretty much max out most Lycs at
8:50:1 or 8:75:1 because that is the highest reliable
compression with GOOD detonation margins.
Detonation can lead to valve, piston, rod or rod bearing
damage....total failure. That is a fact.
One big exception to the above are the O-235's at 9.70:1
CR. They where withdrawn from the market. They
where fine in the test cell, in service they where failing
in the hands of pilots. Although there are STC's to boost
the power of C-152's & Grumman Yankee's with 235's. I
worked on one of those STC's. We blew a piston during
FAA trials.
Why use HC pistons? In the example above going from
8:5:1 to 9.70:1 produced a HP increase from 118 HP to
125 HP, a gain of 7 HP. Not much.
Some Helicopter engines have 10.0:1. Look at the
NTSB accident reports and TBO for those aircraft. You
will be impressed on how often these HC piston
helicopter engines fail, total failure. I don't think newer
helicopters like the Robertson Helicopters run HC
piston engines (for a reason).
Gas in the future will not be 100LL. It's very likely we'll
get green Av-gas in the near future, likely called 95UL
or 92UL, which the Euro folks now have. This lower / no
lead gas will have less octane and thus will not be good
for HC (meaning it won't run safely). You can
retard timing to compensate for lower octane but there
goes your handful of extra ponies.
Bottom line - detonation margin is cut down drastically
with HC pistons. Detonation can happen with out being
noticed by pilot, very subtle, while causing damage and
eventually total engine failure. If you operate carefully
with full knowledge of how your engine works than it
can be done safely. Lyc has to make engines that will
work in all conditions with ham-handed pilots. 8.75 is a
reliable number.
My experience with the 9:7:1 STC on the O-235 Lyc
and the fear of detonation kept me from bumping up my
O-360 (180HP) up from the stock 8:5:1. I just don't need
the extra 4 or 6 HP.
I am using dual electronic ignition with timing advance.
To mix in HC pistons with timing advance is a bit of an
unknown, hit and miss guess. To compensate
people limit timing advance, arbitrarily. Less timing
advance less power and the "No Free Lunch Rule"
comes into play. You lose your HC pistion gain.
Lycs Key Reprints give several bullet points for max
engine life....... one being operate at 65% power. Well that
makes sense, 100% power the engine will not last as
long & wear faster. There is no doubt that higher
combustion pressures has Pros & Cons. The Pro is
more power and actually better SFC or efficiency. The
Con is you're running higher pressures & temps and
that affects all the parts in the engine.
If using a metal prop the affect on the props vibration
response & fatigue, a big unknown affect with HC pistions.
When you add up all the SHOULD and SHOULD NOT
............... I think there are more on the NOT side.
4-into-1 exhaust, Electronic Ignition for hotter spark all
add HP & efficiency with out as much draw back as the
HC Piston. Also making the airframe less draggy with a
better cowl or wheel & gear fairings is the gift that
keeps on giving. No down side but better efficiency that
equals or exceeds the speed gain you would get by adding
twice the HP HC pistons would give you. Sure more
power is better for takeoff and climb but RV's already do
pretty good with out more HP.
Cheers Matt
George
>From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
>Subject: RV-List: 10:1 Compression / IO-360 200 HP
>
>
>Does anyone have any experience with 10:1 compression in a IO-360 200
>HP engine?
>
>* What are the down sides of running 10:1 in that engine?
>
>* What is the HP gain?
>
>* What is the impact to TBO?
>
>* What is the impact to reliability?
>
>If you've done it, would you do it again, or just go with the standard
>8.7:1 compression?
>
>Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tom & Cathy Ervin <tcervin(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6A Training |
If they will accept a 9-A which is in "No WAY" comparable to the speed and handling
of a 6-A why not the 8-A which flies Exactly the same??
Get another insurance company!!!!!!!!!! In my opinion any CFI who would sign
off a pilot good to go in a 6-A after transition training in an 9-A should be
suspect. The 9-A is a nice cross country aircraft that I have found to be much
more forgiving in most of it's flight characteristic's than any other Van's model.
It will not prepare you to be Safe in a 6-A.
Off my "Soap Box" Tom in Ohio
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerry Springer" <jsflyrv(at)verizon.net>
Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 11:35:34 AM (GMT-0500) America/New_York
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6A Training
Some insurance companies will not except time in any other model.
Jerry
CFI
Tom & Cathy Ervin wrote:
> I received my transition training from from Keith Embree at CDI
> Cambridge, OH. Keith is an excellent builder,pilot and CFI.
>
> I took less than 2 hours training and was signed off good to go in
> his RV8-A. I made the first flight in my RV6-A with no issues and had
> my biannual with him last fall.
>
> The RV8-A flies exactly like the the 6-A so your insurance company
> should except that. The sign off of a CFI with RV experience is all
> that should be required not a time stipulation....this isn't a tail
> drager.
>
> Try another insurance company if the balk. Contact Keith at
> 740-432-4123.
>
> Tom in
> Ohio (10G Holmes Co.)
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: dwhite17(at)columbus.rr.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 7:27:29 AM (GMT-0500) America/New_York
> Subject: RV-List: RV6A Training
>
> Goodmorning all: My buidling partner and I need to get 3 hours each
> traning by a CFI in a RV6A, RV7A or RV9A to satisfy our insurance
> company. We live in the Columbus, Ohio area and were wondering if
> there are any transition trainers in the area?
>
> D. White
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jblake43(at)bellsouth.net |
| Subject: | Re: F I fuel pump for sale |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Travis Hamblen" <travishamblen(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | 2007 RV-7A 74 hrs TTAF/E for sale with factory new IO-390! |
Its time to move forward with some other dreams in life. In order to move
forward I have to sell my little girl. My 2007 RV-7A only has 74 hours
TTAF/E on a factory new IO-390 also sporting a factory new Hartzell contant
speed prop. She has all the avionics bells and whistles and is in perfect
condition with a fresh annual completed July 5, 2008. See the below links
for pictures and/or more information. The price is $99,900.00. Call or
e-mail me with ANY questions.
Pictures:
http://s286.photobucket.com/albums/ll112/N107XX/?albumview=slideshow
Ad on VAF:
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=32103
Travis Hamblen
651-269-6542
TravisHamblen(at)gmail.com
Based at 21D (Lake Elmo, MN)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <dwhite17(at)columbus.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6A Training |
Thanks. Our insurance company said training in 8A would be fine.
Thanks. We'll give Keith a call.
----- Original Message -----
From: Tom & Cathy Ervin
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 10:47 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6A Training
I received my transition training from from Keith Embree at CDI
Cambridge, OH. Keith is an excellent builder,pilot and CFI.
I took less than 2 hours training and was signed off good to go in
his RV8-A. I made the first flight in my RV6-A with no issues and had my
biannual with him last fall.
The RV8-A flies exactly like the the 6-A so your insurance company
should except that. The sign off of a CFI with RV experience is all that
should be required not a time stipulation....this isn't a tail drager.
Try another insurance company if the balk. Contact Keith at
740-432-4123.
Tom in
Ohio (10G Holmes Co.)
----- Original Message -----
From: dwhite17(at)columbus.rr.com
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 7:27:29 AM (GMT-0500) America/New_York
Subject: RV-List: RV6A Training
Goodmorning all: My buidling partner and I need to get 3 hours each
traning by a CFI in a RV6A, RV7A or RV9A to satisfy our insurance
company. We live in the Columbus, Ohio area and were wondering if there
are any transition trainers in the area?
D. White
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "glen matejcek" <aerobubba(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Tire Inflation away from home |
Hi All-
There was a recent discussion about fly away kit contents. One person mentioned
bringing a spare inner tube. Does anyone know of a reason to not use CO2 to
fill a newly replaced tube on the road?
TIA-
glen matejcek
aerobubba(at)earthlink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SCOTT SPENCER <aerokinetic(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 10:1 Compression / IO-360 200 HP |
Interesting to follow this thread...
Especially since I just upped my compression in the RV-4 from 8.5:1 to 9.0:1
on my O-320.
My personal experiences would make me tend to agree with jetpilotgeorge. I can
say that I detect no real differences in performance so far, and I have totally
given up the option to run on lower-octane fuels. I'm strictly 100LL now.
At 8.5 I found I could run most good-quality 87 octanes with no detonation. It
was right near the limit with stuff in that octane range. I've fooled around
with auto fuel for many years and while using an ANR headset I can hear (more
like feel) the onset of detonation. George is correct -it's very subtle and difficult
to detect unless it's really extreme detonation. Never hear it at all
without the ANR cutting out all the rumble.
I just ran the numbers using the formula from the article cited by Kevin Horton
earlier in this thread and found the efficiency increase gained by my doing
this to be a whopping one to 1.5 percent or 2.4 horsepower at best... and all
at the cost of longevity, reliability and the ability to run multiple (and less-expensive)
fuels.
A bad decision I feel... and if it wasn't so darn much work, I'd take those pistons
right back out today... and breathe easier. Big gains to be had going from
7.0:1 up to 8.5... just liabilities from 8.5 to 9.
All those people out there claiming they have such-and-such horsepower output
from their engines are mostly just blowing smoke. You hear it at every fly-in
or airport bull session. 99% have never run their engines on a dyno or otherwise
demonstrated what power they are really making. Some friends of mine just
had an O-320 built up with 9.0:1 pistons and cold-air induction and fuel injection
at a reputable shop. It was actually run in a dyno-equipped test cell at
Poplar Grove Airmotive. Made 168 horsepower. That's only 8 more than rated for
an 8.5:1 O-320 with a carb and Lycoming's own stock (hot-air) sump. I'd be willing
to bet serious money most of the gain is from the cold air alone and not
from the compression -and the math confirms it.
A stock O-360 would have been a cheaper and more reliable horsepower upgrade
-at the expense of some weight. Do your own math -lots of choices in this game...
but that's what makes it so interesting.
Your mileage may vary.
Scott
N4ZW
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <dwhite17(at)columbus.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6A Training |
Thanks. I will if a lead I now have doesn't pan out.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carlos Hernandez" <carlosh(at)structuralaz.com>
Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 11:10 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6A Training
>
> Try this yahoo RV group - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/OhioValleyRVators/
> These guys are active and I'm pretty sure they can answer that question
> quick.
>
> Carlos
>
> dwhite17(at)columbus.rr.com wrote:
>> Goodmorning all: My buidling partner and I need to get 3 hours each
>> traning by a CFI in a RV6A, RV7A or RV9A to satisfy our insurance
>> company. We live in the Columbus, Ohio area and were wondering if there
>> are any transition trainers in the area?
>> D. White
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Checked by AVG.
>
> --
> Carlos Hernandez <carlosh@sec-engr.com>
> Structural Engineers Company
> 2963 W. Elliot Rd. - Suite 3
> Chandler, AZ 85224
> Phone: 480.968.8600
> Fax: 480.968.8608
> www.sec-engr.com
>
>
> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE
>
> The information in this email may be confidential and/or privileged.
> This email is intended to be reviewed by only the individual or
> organization named above. If you are not the intended recipient or
> an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby
> notified that any review, dissemination or copyingof this email and
> its attachments, if any, or the information contained herein is
> prohibited. If you havereceived this email in error, please
> immediately notify the sender by return email and delete this email
> from your system.
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Dudley" <rhdudley1(at)bellsouth.net> |
Listers,
A combination of health and financial factors have forced our decision
to sell our beloved airplane. If you are seriously looking for a
beautiful, well-equipped and flying RV-6A read the description below.
RV-6A FOR SALE
Completed 2005 Total time <140 hrs
O-320-D1A Total time since new <140 hrs
Hartzell C/S Prop total time since new <140 hrs
Slider
Great paint
Garmin GNS 430 nav/com
SL-30 nav/com
Garmin GTX 327 Transponder
Garmin GMA 340 Audio panel
Dual CDI
IFR panel, heated pitot
Dual Duckworks landing/taxi lights with Wig-Wag
S-Tech System 20 auto pilot
New main tires
Always hangared
March 2008 annual
Asking: :$100K
Serious buyers contact me for photos and more details off line at:
rhdudley1(at)bellsouth.net
Richard Dudley
Orlando, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | RV-8 "Tall-man" Option... |
Fellow Listers,
What exactly does the RV-8 "Tall-man" option entail? What modifications are made
to the seat, weldment, etc? I'm not finding any mention of it on the plans.
If you order the Tall-man option with the QB kit, can you opt for the "Regular-man"
option at build time?
Knowing nothing about what it actually is, I assume it pushes the weldment back
some allowing you to mount the pilot's seat further aft. While I am a "Tall-man",
my preference would actually be to increase the pilot's seat back recline
amount by moving the weldment back, but leaving the bottom of the seat in the
normal position. Is this possible?
Does anyone have any detailed pictures of what the Tall-man option looks like and
specifically how it differs from the Regular-man option?
Thanks!
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gert <gert.v(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 "Tall-man" Option... |
hi Matt
The tallman option shifts the cross brace weldment back more so that the
seatback leans more. that's great if the 'tall' is in the top half of
your body. but in my case the 'tall' is in my legs, so i was still
rubbing my knees on the panel. To alleviate this I moved the bottom of
the seat back back in about the same amount as the top was moved back by
the tallman option, I did this by installing a second hinge on the
floorpanel. some pictures at
http://www.geocities.com/rv8abldr/frontseat.html
Gert
Matt Dralle wrote:
>
>
> Fellow Listers,
>
> What exactly does the RV-8 "Tall-man" option entail? What modifications are
made to the seat, weldment, etc? I'm not finding any mention of it on the plans.
If you order the Tall-man option with the QB kit, can you opt for the "Regular-man"
option at build time?
>
> Knowing nothing about what it actually is, I assume it pushes the weldment back
some allowing you to mount the pilot's seat further aft. While I am a "Tall-man",
my preference would actually be to increase the pilot's seat back recline
amount by moving the weldment back, but leaving the bottom of the seat in
the normal position. Is this possible?
>
> Does anyone have any detailed pictures of what the Tall-man option looks like
and specifically how it differs from the Regular-man option?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Matt Dralle
> RV-8 #82880
>
>
>
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------
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any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred Stucklen" <wstucklen1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | IO-360 with vertical sump |
Can any one tell me what they used for the throttle/mixture bracket
and throttle/mixture cable lengths for an IO-360 with a vertical sump?
I'm installing a TMX IO-360 with the experimental Precision fuel body.
Relative to a Carburetor, the throttle & mixture positions are reversed.
It looks like Van's Throttle/Mixture bracket is OK for the Throttle, but
will require modifications for the Mixture side. Also, it looks like the
cables have to be longer.
If anyone has pictures of this type of installation, and specifics on
the bracket and cable lengths, it would be a great help...
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924RV (Hope to be flying by Labor Day!)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | IO-360 with vertical sump |
I back fitted Airflow Performance fuel injection on RV-8A with a Van's
O-360-A1A. Both throttle and mixture required custom cable brackets, the
mixture being the far harder of the two. For the 8A the gear leg
interference is the problem.
I got a few lengths of 1x1 and 2x2 aluminum angle stock in 1/8" and 3/16"
thicknesses. Each bracket required two pieces of angle cut just right to
make the complex arm for where the control cable is secured. Once this is
done, fabricate the small piece of angle with the terminating hole for the
cable and bolt it to the now assembled arm. I trimmed the angle to clear
interference as needed, and to eliminate unnecessary bulk.
I had a lot of scrap aluminum and aluminum dust when I got done with this
painful evolution.
Carl Froehlich
RV-8A (450 hrs)
RV-10 (fuselage)
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Stucklen
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 4:04 PM
Subject: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
Can any one tell me what they used for the throttle/mixture bracket and
throttle/mixture cable lengths for an IO-360 with a vertical sump? I'm
installing a TMX IO-360 with the experimental Precision fuel body. Relative
to a Carburetor, the throttle & mixture positions are reversed. It looks
like Van's Throttle/Mixture bracket is OK for the Throttle, but will require
modifications for the Mixture side. Also, it looks like the cables have to
be longer.
If anyone has pictures of this type of installation, and specifics on the
bracket and cable lengths, it would be a great help...
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924RV (Hope to be flying by Labor Day!)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <terry(at)tcwatson.com> |
| Subject: | IO-360 with vertical sump |
I have a series of detail photos of the bracket I made for my RV-8A with a
Superior IO-360A1B with Airflow Performance fuel injection. As Carl says, it
took a lot of aluminum to come up with just the right combination that would
work. It's been awhile so I don't remember the details, but I can send the
photos or post them to a website if that would help.
Terry
RV-8A #80729
Stalled in the shop
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Carl Froehlich
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 4:10 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
I back fitted Airflow Performance fuel injection on RV-8A with a Van's
O-360-A1A. Both throttle and mixture required custom cable brackets, the
mixture being the far harder of the two. For the 8A the gear leg
interference is the problem.
I got a few lengths of 1x1 and 2x2 aluminum angle stock in 1/8" and 3/16"
thicknesses. Each bracket required two pieces of angle cut just right to
make the complex arm for where the control cable is secured. Once this is
done, fabricate the small piece of angle with the terminating hole for the
cable and bolt it to the now assembled arm. I trimmed the angle to clear
interference as needed, and to eliminate unnecessary bulk.
I had a lot of scrap aluminum and aluminum dust when I got done with this
painful evolution.
Carl Froehlich
RV-8A (450 hrs)
RV-10 (fuselage)
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Stucklen
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 4:04 PM
Subject: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
Can any one tell me what they used for the throttle/mixture bracket and
throttle/mixture cable lengths for an IO-360 with a vertical sump? I'm
installing a TMX IO-360 with the experimental Precision fuel body. Relative
to a Carburetor, the throttle & mixture positions are reversed. It looks
like Van's Throttle/Mixture bracket is OK for the Throttle, but will require
modifications for the Mixture side. Also, it looks like the cables have to
be longer.
If anyone has pictures of this type of installation, and specifics on the
bracket and cable lengths, it would be a great help...
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924RV (Hope to be flying by Labor Day!)
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bret Smith" <smithhb(at)tds.net> |
| Subject: | IO-360 with vertical sump |
Terry, I would like to see any photos you have. I am installing (actually,
trying to figure out how) the AFP FI on my IO-360.
Bret Smith
RV-9A N16BL
Blue Ridge, Ga
www.FlightInnovations.com <http://www.flightinnovations.com/>
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Terry Watson
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 8:49 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
I have a series of detail photos of the bracket I made for my RV-8A with a
Superior IO-360A1B with Airflow Performance fuel injection. As Carl says, it
took a lot of aluminum to come up with just the right combination that would
work. It's been awhile so I don't remember the details, but I can send the
photos or post them to a website if that would help.
Terry
RV-8A #80729
Stalled in the shop
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Carl Froehlich
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 4:10 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
I back fitted Airflow Performance fuel injection on RV-8A with a Van's
O-360-A1A. Both throttle and mixture required custom cable brackets, the
mixture being the far harder of the two. For the 8A the gear leg
interference is the problem.
I got a few lengths of 1x1 and 2x2 aluminum angle stock in 1/8" and 3/16"
thicknesses. Each bracket required two pieces of angle cut just right to
make the complex arm for where the control cable is secured. Once this is
done, fabricate the small piece of angle with the terminating hole for the
cable and bolt it to the now assembled arm. I trimmed the angle to clear
interference as needed, and to eliminate unnecessary bulk.
I had a lot of scrap aluminum and aluminum dust when I got done with this
painful evolution.
Carl Froehlich
RV-8A (450 hrs)
RV-10 (fuselage)
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Stucklen
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 4:04 PM
Subject: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
Can any one tell me what they used for the throttle/mixture bracket and
throttle/mixture cable lengths for an IO-360 with a vertical sump? I'm
installing a TMX IO-360 with the experimental Precision fuel body. Relative
to a Carburetor, the throttle & mixture positions are reversed. It looks
like Van's Throttle/Mixture bracket is OK for the Throttle, but will require
modifications for the Mixture side. Also, it looks like the cables have to
be longer.
If anyone has pictures of this type of installation, and specifics on the
bracket and cable lengths, it would be a great help...
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924RV (Hope to be flying by Labor Day!)
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: IO-360 with vertical sump |
MessageEmail Don at AFP or give him a call. I believe he has a photo
library of installation examples.
Dick Sipp
RV10 N110DV
----- Original Message -----
From: Bret Smith
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 9:40 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
Terry, I would like to see any photos you have. I am installing
(actually, trying to figure out how) the AFP FI on my IO-360.
Bret Smith
RV-9A N16BL
Blue Ridge, Ga
www.FlightInnovations.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Terry Watson
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 8:49 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
I have a series of detail photos of the bracket I made for my RV-8A
with a Superior IO-360A1B with Airflow Performance fuel injection. As
Carl says, it took a lot of aluminum to come up with just the right
combination that would work. It's been awhile so I don't remember the
details, but I can send the photos or post them to a website if that
would help.
Terry
RV-8A #80729
Stalled in the shop
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Carl Froehlich
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 4:10 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
I back fitted Airflow Performance fuel injection on RV-8A with a Van's
O-360-A1A. Both throttle and mixture required custom cable brackets,
the mixture being the far harder of the two. For the 8A the gear leg
interference is the problem.
I got a few lengths of 1x1 and 2x2 aluminum angle stock in 1/8" and
3/16" thicknesses. Each bracket required two pieces of angle cut just
right to make the complex arm for where the control cable is secured.
Once this is done, fabricate the small piece of angle with the
terminating hole for the cable and bolt it to the now assembled arm. I
trimmed the angle to clear interference as needed, and to eliminate
unnecessary bulk.
I had a lot of scrap aluminum and aluminum dust when I got done with
this painful evolution.
Carl Froehlich
RV-8A (450 hrs)
RV-10 (fuselage)
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Stucklen
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 4:04 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
Can any one tell me what they used for the throttle/mixture bracket
and throttle/mixture cable lengths for an IO-360 with a vertical sump?
I'm installing a TMX IO-360 with the experimental Precision fuel body.
Relative to a Carburetor, the throttle & mixture positions are reversed.
It looks like Van's Throttle/Mixture bracket is OK for the Throttle, but
will require modifications for the Mixture side. Also, it looks like the
cables have to be longer.
If anyone has pictures of this type of installation, and specifics
on the bracket and cable lengths, it would be a great help...
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924RV (Hope to be flying by Labor Day!)
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-Listhttp://forums.matronics.comhttp
://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.
com/Navigator?RV-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <terry(at)tcwatson.com> |
| Subject: | IO-360 with vertical sump |
I posted the pictures on this website: tcwatson.zenfolio.com. Look for the
RV-8A details gallery. Feel free to poke around my other photos. There are a
few very old photos of T-37 formation aerobatics by one of my pilot training
classmates that are fun.
Terry
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bret Smith
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 6:40 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
Terry, I would like to see any photos you have. I am installing (actually,
trying to figure out how) the AFP FI on my IO-360.
Bret Smith
RV-9A N16BL
Blue Ridge, Ga
www.FlightInnovations.com <http://www.flightinnovations.com/>
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Terry Watson
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 8:49 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
I have a series of detail photos of the bracket I made for my RV-8A with a
Superior IO-360A1B with Airflow Performance fuel injection. As Carl says, it
took a lot of aluminum to come up with just the right combination that would
work. It's been awhile so I don't remember the details, but I can send the
photos or post them to a website if that would help.
Terry
RV-8A #80729
Stalled in the shop
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "glen matejcek" <aerobubba(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV8-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 07/20/08 |
Hi Matt-
I'm the 6' 5" guy. I fit with the std seats, but fit much better with the
mod. IIRC, it moves the cross member aft 1 1/2". My wife is 5' 10" and
fits fine in the back seat. I will be able to fly from the rear seat with
the mod, but I wouldn't want to do it for very long. Cutting down (or
otherwise modding) the rear seat throttle will be pretty much required to
clear a tall person's knee, unless perhaps they are very much skinnier than
I.
One caveat: The original 'tall man' weldment moves the cross member
straight back without lowering it at all. The original plans made no
mention of the need to make the back of the rear seat taller. I forget the
dimension, but it is on the order of 3/4". Without that mod, the original
design seat back will just pass under the weldment. When making the taller
seat, just stretch the seat back sheet metal to match the increase in
dimension of the vertical members.
glen matejcek
aerobubba(at)earthlink.net
> Fellow Listers,
>
> What exactly does the RV-8 "Tall-man" option entail? What modifications
are made
> to the seat, weldment, etc? I'm not finding any mention of it on the
plans.
> If you order the Tall-man option with the QB kit, can you opt for the
"Regular-man"
> option at build time?
>
> Knowing nothing about what it actually is, I assume it pushes the
weldment back
> some allowing you to mount the pilot's seat further aft. While I am a
"Tall-man",
> my preference would actually be to increase the pilot's seat back recline
> amount by moving the weldment back, but leaving the bottom of the seat in
the
> normal position. Is this possible?
>
> Does anyone have any detailed pictures of what the Tall-man option looks
like and
> specifically how it differs from the Regular-man option?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Matt Dralle
> RV-8 #82880
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bret Smith" <smithhb(at)tds.net> |
| Subject: | Re: IO-360 with vertical sump |
MessageThank you Terry, very nicely done. That is a great help.
Bret Smith
RV-9A "Canopy"
Blue Ridge, GA
www.FlightInnovations.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Terry Watson
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 11:23 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
I posted the pictures on this website: tcwatson.zenfolio.com. Look
for the RV-8A details gallery. Feel free to poke around my other photos.
There are a few very old photos of T-37 formation aerobatics by one of
my pilot training classmates that are fun.
Terry
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bret Smith
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 6:40 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
Terry, I would like to see any photos you have. I am installing
(actually, trying to figure out how) the AFP FI on my IO-360.
Bret Smith
RV-9A N16BL
Blue Ridge, Ga
www.FlightInnovations.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Terry Watson
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 8:49 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
I have a series of detail photos of the bracket I made for my RV-8A
with a Superior IO-360A1B with Airflow Performance fuel injection. As
Carl says, it took a lot of aluminum to come up with just the right
combination that would work. It's been awhile so I don't remember the
details, but I can send the photos or post them to a website if that
would help.
Terry
RV-8A #80729
Stalled in the shop
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: IO-360 Throttle/Mixture Installation |
| From: | "Stucklen, Frederic W UTPWR" <Fred.Stucklen(at)UTCPower.com> |
ED,
Thanks for the reply. I'm installing the Precision Silver hawk Fuel
body, which is essentially the same as the old Bendix unit, on a
vertical sump TMX IO-360. Relative to a Carburetor, the throttle and
mixture arms on the Fuel Body are reversed, and, as you have implied,
the mixture arm requires an insert into the FAB box (or a 3/4" spacer
between the FAB box and the Fuel Body). The bracket Van's supplies for
the Carburetors is wrong for both throttle and mixture without some
major changes. And, yes, there appears to be room in the cowl for the
use of the spacer....
What I am looking at now is a custom made bracket that is designed in
a manner similar to Van's unit. I figure I can make it out of .050" alum
by bending the flanges in between two pieces of 3/4" plywood (using a
hammer to "persuade it to bend...).
What I don't know yet is the required cable lengths. It would seem
that they would have to be shorter than vans recommended cables for a
carburetor as the bracket tabs for mounting the cables are closer to the
firewall. How much shorter, I don't know. I do have a set of cables from
Van's, but I ordered cables that were longer. Might have to return
them....
The RV- Listers have given me a lot of ideas to work with. If I come
up with a successful bracket design, I'll make a formal drawing and post
it on the list, along with my resultant cable lengths......
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924RV
________________________________
From: Ed Pettiss [mailto:pettisse(at)hotmail.com]
Sent: Monday, July 21, 2008 9:18 AM
Subject: IO-360 Throttle/Mixture Installation
Most of the replies you got so far talk about making a custom bracket
for an 8A. For my RV-7A with Superior IO-360 and vertical Precision fuel
servo body, Van's sold me a ready-made mixture bracket (although I think
I might have had to cut one face.) I definitely had to buy longer
cables.
I can do a check of receipts for the part numbers and cable lengths, but
I probably won't get to the hangar until Wednesday - maybe tomorrow. I
suspect you'll hear from other 7A builders today, but let me know
off-line from the list if you'd like me to do that.
Are you using Van's standard FAB airbox? If the TMX IO-360 is like the
Superior (I suspect), do you know that you might have to create an inset
in the FAB for the mixture arm to hang down into? This one I know --
it's a VA-131-Q Mixture Arm Recess -- and I have good pictures to show
what this is all about.
Give me a call directly if you'd like to discuss.
Ed Pettiss
RV-7A N12KE flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | October Page, Az. Fly-In |
| From: | "Roger Lee" <ssadiver1(at)yahoo.com> |
Ok Guys and Gals,
Here is the important info. You are all invited.
The Flight Design group gets together each October for a fun few days. We will
fly Monument Vally, Lake Powell, Marble Canyon, Grand canyon and Bryce Canyon.
We take ground side trips during the day. We have other aircraft that come and
we would like to invite the Allegro pilots.
It is Oct. 16th Thursday and go home on Oct. 19th Sunday. We always have a great
time. Everyone attending is fun to be with and gets along very well.
We have a special rate at the same place we stayed last year.
Tell them you are with the "CT Group" and the rate is $49 a night. We will arrive
Thursday morning, Oct. 16th. and head home Oct. 19th. Sunday morning.
Best Western Arizona Inn
716 Rim View Dr.
Page, Az.
800-826-2718
928-645-2456
We will fly into the Page airport - KPGA.
We are staying with the Classic FBO and with our group we should get a .30 cent
discount on fuel.
Classic is not the first FBO next to the runway, but the second one behind them.
The Antelope Canyon tour is open if anyone wants. This is a land tour.
I did some checking for those who are interested. We can take a Lake Powell lake
tour by boat..
One is an evening dinner tour. It is 2.5 hours and serves Prime rib or Lasagna.
It cost $87.67 per person.
The other one is a boat tour that last 3 hours and goes through some famous canyons,
the Navajo Tapestry tour. It cost $63.52.
Orrrr we can rent 19" power boats our selves and take them out and explore the
lake and fingers. The cost of the boat is $325 a day (8am-5pm). They hold eight
people and this is only $40 a person.
Any of the boat items they would like a 24 hour notice.
These are only some ideas that I checked on. We don't have to do them and if only
some want to do them that is ok.
You guys are welcome to invite other planes that are not CT's and everyone is welcome.
Find some more LSA's.
_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Light Sport Repairman - Maint. Rated
Rotax Service Center
(520) 574-1080
[/b]
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated
Rotax Service Center
520-574-1080
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=194150#194150
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | IO-360 with vertical sump |
| From: | James H Nelson <rv9jim(at)juno.com> |
Bret,
I have AFP FI on my IO 360 and I made custom brackets. You can
see them on my web site at www.websites.expercraft.com/jimn and if that
is not enough, I can e=mail you the pix I took to mount the system. I
used the material that AFP provided and cut pieces to make up the
brackets and had them welded to mount the cables. I could have had a
longer mixture cable and it would have been better. THe only fire wlall
position that matched up was for the throttle. I made the bracket such
that it was a straight shot to the throttle linkage. The mixture bracket
was such that I had the cable come down from the top , just clearing the
fuel pump and terminating with the lainkage working thru the vertical
mode. That penetrated the fire wall thru the off set for the oil filter.
I have a 90* adapter so the filter mounts in the "vertical mode. That
freeded up that area. Again, if you want more pix I can send them to
you. It all works out fine as I have 5 hours TT on the airframe, Just
cleared to fly--- keep pounding as they are fine birds to take flight.
Jim
N15JN
RV9-A
____________________________________________________________
Click to go wireless with your computer, ultra fast speed.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3nBfh6waxgErL6pKmmEtM69b28YvrMWxREGklL0jPlXqBacz/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Saylor" <Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com> |
| Subject: | Andair Corrosion |
Here's a picture of an Andair GAS500 fuel bowl showing the nice little
nozzle created by corrosion all the way through the bowl. The pilot was
complaining of fuel smell. The plane is a Legacy that started flying in
2003. It has about 500 hours.
Before the corrosion got all the way through, the inside of the bowl had a
small, shiny, unanodized patch where the corrosion started. The outside
looks perfect except for a small black speck where the hole comes through.
Check carefully!
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: IO-360 with vertical sump |
| From: | "Stucklen, Frederic W UTPWR" <Fred.Stucklen(at)UTCPower.com> |
I'm installing the Precision Silver hawk Fuel body, which is
essentially the same as the old Bendix unit, on a vertical sump TMX
IO-360. It would appear that Van's IO-320/360 Throttle/Mixture bracket
will work for this fuel body....
So now I only have to determine where the firewall penetrations will
go, and how long the cables need to be....
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924RV (Hope to be flying by 9/1/08....)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Karl Ahamer" <kahamer(at)bigpond.net.au> |
Hi all,
I wonder if anyone else has experienced the following problem with the MT
Governor:
Engine RPM on take off will reach 2780 if power is not applied VERY slowly.
On engine run up the governor reacts much slower(somewhat delayed) than the
Woodward governor I used the have in my previous RV (same engine model and
prop)
In flight max rpm is 2670 at full throttle ,but throttling back in level
flight and reapplying power will also cause overspeeding for a brief moment.
With hot engine oil the problem on take off seems to almost go away (can
apply power more quickly)
Had latest modification done by MT,which improved things slightly.
The current set up is as follows:
RV7A
O-360-A1A 35hours
Hartzell prop 35 hours
MT governor
Running Shell 100 straight mineral oil for running engine in.
To me it looks like as if the governor can not change the oil pressure quick
enough to keep constant rpm.
Maybe it will be better when switching to multigrade engine oil eventually.
Any ideas what could cause this?
Regards
Karl Ahamer
7A VH-KAX near Sydney/Australia
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bret Smith" <smithhb(at)tds.net> |
| Subject: | Re: IO-360 with vertical sump |
Thanks Jim,
I have used your site several times and it has been very helpful. Thanks
for doing such a great job with it.
Bret Smith
RV-9A "Canopy"
Blue Ridge, GA
www.FlightInnovations.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "James H Nelson" <rv9jim(at)juno.com>
Sent: Monday, July 21, 2008 5:00 PM
Subject: RV-List: IO-360 with vertical sump
>
> Bret,
> I have AFP FI on my IO 360 and I made custom brackets. You can
> see them on my web site at www.websites.expercraft.com/jimn and if that
> is not enough, I can e=mail you the pix I took to mount the system. I
> used the material that AFP provided and cut pieces to make up the
> brackets and had them welded to mount the cables. I could have had a
> longer mixture cable and it would have been better. THe only fire wlall
> position that matched up was for the throttle. I made the bracket such
> that it was a straight shot to the throttle linkage. The mixture bracket
> was such that I had the cable come down from the top , just clearing the
> fuel pump and terminating with the lainkage working thru the vertical
> mode. That penetrated the fire wall thru the off set for the oil filter.
> I have a 90* adapter so the filter mounts in the "vertical mode. That
> freeded up that area. Again, if you want more pix I can send them to
> you. It all works out fine as I have 5 hours TT on the airframe, Just
> cleared to fly--- keep pounding as they are fine birds to take flight.
>
>
> Jim
> N15JN
> RV9-A
> ____________________________________________________________
> Click to go wireless with your computer, ultra fast speed.
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3nBfh6waxgErL6pKmmEtM69b28YvrMWxREGklL0jPlXqBacz/
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lessdragprod(at)AOL.COM |
Hi All,
Some of these comments are general comments and do not apply to the stated problem.?
They do apply to situations that have already happened.
The CS propeller typically operates with about 150 psi oil pressure in the hub.
The MT Governor is tested at the factory and the inspection data is shipped with
the governor.? You should see that the governor is tested at 375 psi with?a
flow rate?8 quarts per minute.? That's a flow rate of 120 gallons per hour.
The governor requires an inlet pressure of 15 psi to function properly.
It would seem that there is a restriction in the oil flow path.
Places to check.
The governor can have an extrenal cover?AND two small plastic plugs in the base.?
Make certain they are all removed.
The propeller hub normaly has a plastic dust cover stuck in the back.? If this
is left in place, it will restrict the oil flow.? After the propeller has been
installed with plastic plug in place, it is difficult to see inside the hub bore.?
At least one propeller has been removed and inspected for the plug, only
to remove the propeller as second time to actually remove the plug.
(I don't have to make these mistakes myself.? I can let other people do it for
me.? This really saves me a great deal of time, in the long run.)
There could also be a flow restriction between the governor and the propeller.?
(A piece of rag?)? I don't know an easy way to inspect for?this.? Or?a restriction
in the oil hose when manufactured.? Shouldn't be an issue with a SST line.?
I don't remember what's required now.
Regards,
Jim Ayers
-----Original Message-----
From: Karl Ahamer <kahamer(at)bigpond.net.au>
Sent: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 4:58 am
Subject: RV-List: MT Governor
Hi all,
I wonder if anyone else has experienced the following problem with the MT Governor:
?
Engine RPM on take off will reach 2780 if power is not applied VERY slowly.
On engine run up the governor reacts much slower(somewhat delayed) than the Woodward
governor I used the have in my previous RV (same engine model and prop)
In flight max rpm is 2670 at full throttle ,but throttling back in level flight
and reapplying power will also cause overspeeding for a brief moment.
With hot engine oil the problem on take off seems to almost go away (can apply
power more quickly)
Had latest modification done by MT,which improved things slightly.
The current set up is as follows:
RV7A
O-360-A1A? 35hours
Hartzell prop 35 hours
MT governor
Running Shell 100 straight mineral oil for running engine in.
To me it looks like as if the governor can not change the oil pressure quick enough
to keep constant rpm.
Maybe it will be better when switching to multigrade engine oil eventually.
Any ideas what could cause this?
Regards
Karl Ahamer
7A? VH-KAX?? near Sydney/Australia
?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390 |
Dear Listers,
What is the common opinion of Superior XP engines vs. the typical Lycoming engine?
In looking over the Superior web site, they have a new 220hp XP-400 engine designed
around the basic IO-360 Angle Valve chassis that looks pretty nice. At $30,000
new, its $3-4k cheaper than the Lycoming IO-390 solutions and, if you believe
the Superior mantra, a better designed engine in general.
What is the real-world quality and reliability of Superior-built engines?
Has anyone flown behind one of these new XP-400s?
Has anyone Dyno'd the XP-400 to prove the 220hp claim?
XP-400 Information: http://www.xp-360.com/index.asp?content=14
Avweb Article: http://www.avweb.com/news/motorhead/189629-1.html?type=pf
Thanks for your insight!
Matt Dralle
RV-8 # 82880
________________________________________________________________________________
Matt,
I've seen a lot of questions from you on the RV-8 and you've got a -8 S/N in
your signature. Did you give up your -4 and start on a -8? Inquiring minds
and all... At any event, welcome back to the active building world.
Regards,
Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix
Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
> Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 11:36 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390
>
>
>
> Dear Listers,
>
> What is the common opinion of Superior XP engines vs. the
> typical Lycoming engine?
>
> In looking over the Superior web site, they have a new 220hp
> XP-400 engine designed around the basic IO-360 Angle Valve
> chassis that looks pretty nice. At $30,000 new, its $3-4k
> cheaper than the Lycoming IO-390 solutions and, if you
> believe the Superior mantra, a better designed engine in general.
>
> What is the real-world quality and reliability of
> Superior-built engines?
>
> Has anyone flown behind one of these new XP-400s?
>
> Has anyone Dyno'd the XP-400 to prove the 220hp claim?
>
> XP-400 Information: http://www.xp-360.com/index.asp?content=14
>
> Avweb Article:
> http://www.avweb.com/news/motorhead/189629-1.html?type=pf
>
> Thanks for your insight!
>
> Matt Dralle
> RV-8 # 82880
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6 Flyer <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
Recently a local RV'er constant speed prop would not cycle. He checked oil
pressure to the governor like Jim is suggesting IAW (In Accordance With) L
ycoming Service Instruction SI-1462A. http://www.lycoming.textron.com/supp
ort/publications/service-instructions/pdfs/SI1462A.pdf
When the Lycoming Propeller Oil Control Leak Test Procedure listed above fa
iled=2C the prop was pulled. The PLUG behind the prop in the crankshaft tha
t is REQUIRED for constant speed operation was not seated.
The RV'er above had his engine overhauled 600 hours earlier and the prop wo
rked. One day=2C it went to high RPM and would not cycle.
None of our local experts (myself included) thought of checking this. This
leak check was suggested by Barrett Precision Engines and they found the p
roblem troubleshooting long distance.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell=2C
2=2C129 + Flying Hours So. CA=2C USA
Subject: Re: RV-List: MT Governor
Date: Tue=2C 22 Jul 2008 11:22:15 -0400
From: lessdragprod(at)aol.com
Hi All=2C
Some of these comments are general comments and do not apply to the stated
problem. They do apply to situations that have already happened.
The CS propeller typically operates with about 150 psi oil pressure in the
hub.
The MT Governor is tested at the factory and the inspection data is shipped
with the governor. You should see that the governor is tested at 375 psi
with a flow rate 8 quarts per minute. That's a flow rate of 120 gallons pe
r hour.
The governor requires an inlet pressure of 15 psi to function properly.
It would seem that there is a restriction in the oil flow path.
Places to check.
The governor can have an extrenal cover AND two small plastic plugs in the
base. Make certain they are all removed.
The propeller hub normaly has a plastic dust cover stuck in the back. If t
his is left in place=2C it will restrict the oil flow. After the propeller
has been installed with plastic plug in place=2C it is difficult to see in
side the hub bore. At least one propeller has been removed and inspected f
or the plug=2C only to remove the propeller as second time to actually remo
ve the plug.
(I don't have to make these mistakes myself. I can let other people do it
for me. This really saves me a great deal of time=2C in the long run.)
There could also be a flow restriction between the governor and the propell
er. (A piece of rag?) I don't know an easy way to inspect for this. Or a
restriction in the oil hose when manufactured. Shouldn't be an issue with
a SST line. I don't remember what's required now.
Regards=2C
Jim Ayers
-----Original Message-----
From: Karl Ahamer <kahamer(at)bigpond.net.au>
Sent: Tue=2C 22 Jul 2008 4:58 am
Subject: RV-List: MT Governor
Hi all=2C
I wonder if anyone else has experienced the following problem with the MT G
overnor:
Engine RPM on take off will reach 2780 if power is not applied VERY slowly.
On engine run up the governor reacts much slower(somewhat delayed) than the
Woodward governor I used the have in my previous RV (same engine model and
prop)
In flight max rpm is 2670 at full throttle =2Cbut throttling back in level
flight and reapplying power will also cause overspeeding for a brief moment
.
With hot engine oil the problem on take off seems to almost go away (can ap
ply power more quickly)
Had latest modification done by MT=2Cwhich improved things slightly.
The current set up is as follows:
RV7A
O-360-A1A 35hours
Hartzell prop 35 hours
MT governor
Running Shell 100 straight mineral oil for running engine in.
To me it looks like as if the governor can not change the oil pressure quic
k enough to keep constant rpm.
Maybe it will be better when switching to multigrade engine oil eventually.
Any ideas what could cause this?
Regards
Karl Ahamer
7A VH-KAX near Sydney/Australia
The Famous=2C the Infamous=2C the Lame - in your browser. Get the TMZ Toolb
ar Now!
_________________________________________________________________
Keep your kids safer online with Windows Live Family Safety.
http://www.windowslive.com/family_safety/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_
family_safety_072008
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John D. Heath" <altoq(at)cebridge.net> |
I'm not a builder but check out this web site
http://www.sacskyranch.com/eng41.htm
Hi all,
I wonder if anyone else has experienced the following problem with the
MT Governor:
Engine RPM on take off will reach 2780 if power is not applied VERY
slowly.
On engine run up the governor reacts much slower(somewhat delayed)
than the Woodward governor I used the have in my previous RV (same
engine model and prop)
In flight max rpm is 2670 at full throttle ,but throttling back in
level flight and reapplying power will also cause overspeeding for a
brief moment.
With hot engine oil the problem on take off seems to almost go away
(can apply power more quickly)
Had latest modification done by MT,which improved things slightly.
The current set up is as follows:
RV7A
O-360-A1A 35hours
Hartzell prop 35 hours
MT governor
Running Shell 100 straight mineral oil for running engine in.
To me it looks like as if the governor can not change the oil pressure
quick enough to keep constant rpm.
Maybe it will be better when switching to multigrade engine oil
eventually.
Any ideas what could cause this?
Regards
Karl Ahamer
7A VH-KAX near Sydney/Australia
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
The Famous, the Infamous, the Lame - in your browser. Get the TMZ
Toolbar Now!
http://www.matronics.com/Namatronics.com/contribution"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/cont=========
======
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Keep your kids safer online with Windows Live Family Safety. Help
protect your kids.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jan <jan(at)claver.demon.co.uk> |
| Subject: | Andair Corrosion |
Hi,
That looks bad .. Have you been in contact with Andair about it ...??
Jan
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: 21 July 2008 22:34
Subject: RV-List: Andair Corrosion
Here's a picture of an Andair GAS500 fuel bowl showing the nice little
nozzle created by corrosion all the way through the bowl. The pilot was
complaining of fuel smell. The plane is a Legacy that started flying in
2003. It has about 500 hours.
Before the corrosion got all the way through, the inside of the bowl had a
small, shiny, unanodized patch where the corrosion started. The outside
looks perfect except for a small black speck where the hole comes through.
Check carefully!
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
Hi,
That looks bad .. Have you been in
contact
with Andair about it …??
Jan
From:
owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: 21 July 2008
22:34
To: 'Lancair Mailing
List';
rv10-list(at)matronics.com; rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: Andair
Corrosion
Here's a picture of an Andair GAS500 fuel bowl showing the nice
little
nozzle created by corrosion all the way through the bowl. The
pilot was
complaining of fuel smell. The plane is a Legacy
that started flying
in 2003. It has about 500 hours.
Before the corrosion got all the way through, the inside of the
bowl
had a small, shiny, unanodized patch where the corrosion started.
The
outside looks perfect except for a small black speck where the hole
comes
through.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140
Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jan <jan(at)claver.demon.co.uk> |
| Subject: | Andair Corrosion - Fuel tank corrosion |
Makes me think ...Have anyone experience corrosion in the fuel tank on a RV
.... Assuming they have not used Alodine before assembling it with "Pro
Seal" ... Maybe not an issue in hot and dry climates ... but in humid
climates... ??
Jan
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of jan
Sent: 22 July 2008 22:17
Subject: RE: RV-List: Andair Corrosion
Hi,
That looks bad .. Have you been in contact with Andair about it ...??
Jan
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: 21 July 2008 22:34
Subject: RV-List: Andair Corrosion
Here's a picture of an Andair GAS500 fuel bowl showing the nice little
nozzle created by corrosion all the way through the bowl. The pilot was
complaining of fuel smell. The plane is a Legacy that started flying in
2003. It has about 500 hours.
Before the corrosion got all the way through, the inside of the bowl had a
small, shiny, unanodized patch where the corrosion started. The outside
looks perfect except for a small black speck where the hole comes through.
Check carefully!
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
Makes me think …Have anyone
experience corrosion in the fuel tank on a RV …. Assuming they
have not
used Alodine before assembling it with “Pro Seal” …
Maybe not
an issue in hot and dry climates … but in humid climates…
??
Jan
From:
owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of jan
Sent: 22 July 2008
22:17
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com;
'Lancair Mailing List'; rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV-List:
Andair
Corrosion
Hi,
That looks bad .. Have you been in
contact
with Andair about it …??
Jan
From:
owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: 21 July 2008
22:34
To: 'Lancair Mailing
List'; rv10-list(at)matronics.com;
rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: Andair
Corrosion
Here's a picture of an Andair GAS500 fuel bowl showing the nice
little
nozzle created by corrosion all the way through the bowl. The
pilot was
complaining of fuel smell. The plane is a Legacy
that started flying
in 2003. It has about 500 hours.
Before the corrosion got all the way through, the inside of the
bowl
had a small, shiny, unanodized patch where the corrosion started.
The
outside looks perfect except for a small black speck where the hole
comes
through.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140
Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Mortimore" <terry.mortimore(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Fellow Canadian builders, educate me please. Is EXPERIMENTAL |
required within cabin.
Hi Gang:
I just ordered my interior from Classic Aero Designs and I assumed that I
would have the word EXPERIMENTAL embroidered across the upper baggage
compartment panel. While talking with Anna she questioned wether a Canadian
plane requires this.
Looking through my RAA amateur built Aircraft builders manual the only
referance I see to placarding is 549.15 which states that a placard with
letters at least 3/8" high stating "Notice: This aircraft is operating with
a special certificate of airworthiness for amateur-built aircraft" must be
in plane view of the passenger.
Can anyone confirm that this is all that is required? If so I think I will
cancell my order for the embroidering.
Thanks,
Terry.
Fuselage kit finished, just ordered finishing kit.
Terry Mortimore
426 McNabb Street Apt#4
Sault Ste Marie, Ontario
P6B 1Z3
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Throttle/Mixture bracket Vertical Draft IO-360 RV-7A |
| From: | "Stucklen, Frederic W UTPWR" <Fred.Stucklen(at)UTCPower.com> |
Just to get this into the Archives, here's what is needed for an
IO-360 vertical induction system on an RV-7A with a Bendix or Silver
Hawk fuel body.
Both cables go through the firewall just below the centrally
located firewall heater box. Both firewall holes are located directly
behind their respective cable mounting holes on the bracket when it's
installed between the fuel body and the engine sump. The throttle cable
will enter the cabin area through a grommet in the cover in that area.
The mixture cable will penetrate the lower portion of the heater box
panel (but under the enclosed heater box) and will require a cable
grommet. The cables cross over inside the cockpit if they are
horizontally located on the sub panel. The mixture cable is a tad long,
but the next shorter cable is too short.
This list assumes the use of a Bendix or Silver Hawk Fuel body.
CT BLK THROTTLE 44.5 Throttle Cable, 44.5"
CT RED VMIXTURE 50.5 Mixture Cable 50.5"
VA-182-PC KIT Bracket IO-320/360/540 Vertical
Induction
FAB-360/540 O-360/540 Vertical Draft
The next step is to mount the airbox. The Airbox comes with a bracket
that allows the fuel body mixture arm to move below the plane of the
airbox top surface. I personally think that this overly complicates the
airbox construction. I'm planning on putting a 3/4" Delron spacer
between the bottom of the fuel body and the Airbox to allow for free
movement of the mixture arm with no airbox modifications. There appears
to be 10.25 " between the inside surface of the lower cowl just under
the airbox, to the bottom surface of the of the sump where the fuel body
mounts. The total height of the airbox, spacer, and fuel body, is only
9.25", leaving a inch clearance between the lower surface of the bottom
surface of the airbox and the cowl. The airbox also easily clears the
nose wheel gear leg. I've seen this done on other RV-7A aircraft, and
it seems to work out OK with the interface to the lower cowl snout.
I still have a question as to what to do about an alternate fuel body
air source. There has been documented instances of the air filter
becoming clogged with snow. Van came out with an alternate air source
fix that takes the lower cowl air directly into the fuel body, bypassing
the filter. This certainly qualifies as a solution, but it doesn't
prevent filter blockage from occurring (like the Carb Heat flap control
on carbureted systems can do). When I fly serious IFR in heavy rain or
snow, I think it's prudent to keep as much of that precipitation out of
the air box, and air filter, as possible. Van's alternate air fix
should be used as a last resort, while the Carb Heat solution would be
used as the first line of defense. So, I thinking that it would be
prudent to have both controls, but not necessarily heated air into the
Carb Heat type flapper control.....
Another issue for an IFR RV Aircraft is the current design of the
tank vents. It does not meet my requirements of system redundancy (only
one vent method per tank). Yes, there are two tanks. But the same IFR
conditions that plug one vent (inadvertent penetration into ice or snow)
can plug the second tank vent. Virtually all certified IFR aircraft have
fuel tank venting redundancy (tank vents plus cap vents in most cases).
Van's design does not. Van's design utilizes the tank vent position
behind the cowl (engine heat) to help mitigate this issue. While I have
never seen IFR conditions where this vent was compromised, it may be
possible under the right conditions.
With conventional RV design, I don't have a solution for this issue. I
unsuccessfully attempted making vents in the tank fuel caps. In my
installations of tip tanks, I still utilize the same fuselage vent, but,
in the tip tank vent line (which, because of the fuel system plumbing,
is the vent for the main tank as well), I put a small cut into the vent
line so that if the fuselage vent becomes plugged, there is still a
method to vent the tank.
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924V
________________________________
From: Emrath [mailto:emrath(at)comcast.net]
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 10:22 PM
Subject: RE: Re Throttle/Mixture bracket
Fred,
Try Part number VA-149-360-PC KIT in the Vans web catalog.
This is listed as an item included in the RV-10 firewall Forward kit.
Under the "List" it says $18 and included the extra gasket needed.
This is for use between the carb and the sump, but works equally well
between the servo and the sump. At least it did for me on my 0-360
converted to Fuel Injection, updraft Bendix system.
Marty =D2=D3=AC
-----Original Message-----
From: Stucklen, Frederic W UTPWR [mailto:Fred.Stucklen(at)UTCPower.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 11:51 AM
To: emrath(at)comcast.net
Subject: RE: Re Throttle/Mixture bracket
Marty,
Thanks for the input.. The tubing idea sounds good. I already have a
set of cables - just a little longer than the normal Carb units - so
will try those first. If they don't fit I'll try the tubing idea....
It turns out that the bracket that Van's sells for the IO-320 also
fits the Silver Hawk (Experimental version of the Bendix) fuel body. I
had bought one, but didn't think it would work. After making a cardboard
mockup, I figured out that it looked a lot like the part I had on the
bench!
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924RV
________________________________
From: emrath(at)comcast.net [mailto:emrath(at)comcast.net]
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 12:13 PM
To: Stucklen, Frederic W UTPWR
Subject: Re Throttle/Mixture bracket
Hey Fred,
Van's has a bracket for use on the RV-10, PC-182 comes to mind, but
you may have to search. I used this on my -6A and a 3/4" spacer
purchased years ago form Eustace Bowhay, now deceased. I'm not flying
yet, still working on fiberglass stuff, but it all fits fine with no
holes in the FAB for clearance. As for cable lengths, I cut the holes
in the firewall for pass thru and used some plastic tubing as a fit up
for length. I did have to return one cable, but Van's had the lengths I
needed. Hope this help.
Marty Emrath
RV-6A Brentwood TN
Subject: RV-List: RE: IO-360 Throttle/Mixture Installation
From: "Stucklen, Frederic W UTPWR" <Fred.Stucklen(at)UTCPower.com
<http://mailcenter.comcast.net/wmc/v/wm/48860538000E99F000007020220073407
6089B0E9D030A?cmd=ComposeTo&adr=Fred%2EStucklen%40UTCPower%2Ecom&sid=
c0> >
ED,
Thanks for the reply. I'm installing the Precision Silver hawk Fuel
body, which is essentially the same as the old Bendix unit, on a
vertical sump TMX IO-360. Relative to a Carburetor, the throttle and
mixture arms on the Fuel Body are reversed, and, as you have implied,
the mixture arm requires an insert into the FAB box (or a 3/4" spacer
between the FAB box and the Fuel Body). The bracket Van's supplies for
the Carburetors is wrong for both throttle and mixture without some
major changes. And, yes, there appears to be room i! n the c owl for
the
use of the spacer....
What I am looking at now is a custom made bracket that is designed
in
a manner similar to Van's unit. I figure I can make it out of .050"
alum
by bending the flanges in between two pieces of 3/4" plywood (using a
hammer to "persuade it to bend...).
What I don't know yet is the required cable lengths. It would seem
that they would have to be shorter than vans recommended cables for a
carburetor as the bracket tabs for mounting the cables are closer to
the
firewall. How much shorter, I don't know. I do have a set of cables
from
Van's, but I ordered cables that were longer. Might have to return
them....
The RV- Listers have given me a lot of ideas to work with. If I come
up with a successful bracket design, I'll make a formal drawing and
post
it on the list, along with my resultant cable lengths......
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ted French" <ted_french(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Fellow Canadian builders, educate me please. Is EXPERIMENTAL |
required within cabin.
Experimental is an American requirement, not Canadian. You only need the
words you refered to in English AND French
Ted French C-FXCS
RV-10 Flying
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Terry Mortimore
Sent: July 22, 2008 5:03 PM
Subject: RV-List: Fellow Canadian builders, educate me please. Is
EXPERIMENTAL required within cabin.
Hi Gang:
I just ordered my interior from Classic Aero Designs and I assumed that I
would have the word EXPERIMENTAL embroidered across the upper baggage
compartment panel. While talking with Anna she questioned wether a Canadian
plane requires this.
Looking through my RAA amateur built Aircraft builders manual the only
referance I see to placarding is 549.15 which states that a placard with
letters at least 3/8" high stating "Notice: This aircraft is operating with
a special certificate of airworthiness for amateur-built aircraft" must be
in plane view of the passenger.
Can anyone confirm that this is all that is required? If so I think I will
cancell my order for the embroidering.
Than
ks,
Terry.
Fuselage kit finished, just ordered finishing kit.
Terry Mortimore
426 McNabb Street Apt#4
Sault Ste Marie, Ontario
P6B 1Z3
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Patrick Kelley" <webmaster(at)flion.com> |
| Subject: | Throttle/Mixture bracket Vertical Draft IO-360 RV-7A |
Regarding alternate air: With my FWF kit (I think it=92s in the
instructions
for the FAB) there are instructions for a filter bypass. Basically
it=92s a
hole in the FAB bowl beneath the filter and a pivoting plate that covers
it
operated by a Bowden cable. It is not reclosable in flight; you have to
land and remove the cowl to =91reset=92 it. Then again, if your filter
is
clogged you should be landing anyway. I have heard that injected
engines
don=92t need carb heat so, to avoid confusion, I am only installing the
bypass
and not the heated air flapper; I may revisit that at another time.
Patrick Kelley ' RV-6A Superior XPIO-360 ' Should be flying soon
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stucklen,
Frederic
W UTPWR
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 6:05 AM
Subject: RV-List: Throttle/Mixture bracket Vertical Draft IO-360 RV-7A
Just to get this into the Archives, here's what is needed for an
IO-360
vertical induction system on an RV-7A with a Bendix or Silver Hawk fuel
body.
Both cables go through the firewall just below the centrally
located
firewall heater box. Both firewall holes are located directly behind
their
respective cable mounting holes on the bracket when it's installed
between
the fuel body and the engine sump. The throttle cable will enter the
cabin
area through a grommet in the cover in that area. The mixture cable will
penetrate the lower portion of the heater box panel (but under the
enclosed
heater box) and will require a cable grommet. The cables cross over
inside
the cockpit if they are horizontally located on the sub panel. The
mixture
cable is a tad long, but the next shorter cable is too short.
This list assumes the use of a Bendix or Silver Hawk Fuel body.
CT BLK THROTTLE 44.5 Throttle Cable, 44.5"
CT RED VMIXTURE 50.5 Mixture Cable 50.5"
VA-182-PC KIT Bracket IO-320/360/540 Vertical
Induction
FAB-360/540 O-360/540 Vertical Draft
The next step is to mount the airbox. The Airbox comes with a bracket
that
allows the fuel body mixture arm to move below the plane of the airbox
top
surface. I personally think that this overly complicates the airbox
construction. I'm planning on putting a 3/4" Delron spacer between the
bottom of the fuel body and the Airbox to allow for free movement of the
mixture arm with no airbox modifications. There appears to be 10.25 "
between the inside surface of the lower cowl just under the airbox, to
the
bottom surface of the of the sump where the fuel body mounts. The total
height of the airbox, spacer, and fuel body, is only 9.25", leaving a
inch
clearance between the lower surface of the bottom surface of the airbox
and
the cowl. The airbox also easily clears the nose wheel gear leg. I've
seen
this done on other RV-7A aircraft, and it seems to work out OK with the
interface to the lower cowl snout.
I still have a question as to what to do about an alternate fuel body
air
source. There has been documented instances of the air filter becoming
clogged with snow. Van came out with an alternate air source fix that
takes
the lower cowl air directly into the fuel body, bypassing the filter.
This
certainly qualifies as a solution, but it doesn't prevent filter
blockage
from occurring (like the Carb Heat flap control on carbureted systems
can
do). When I fly serious IFR in heavy rain or snow, I think it's prudent
to
keep as much of that precipitation out of the air box, and air filter,
as
possible. Van's alternate air fix should be used as a last resort, while
the
Carb Heat solution would be used as the first line of defense. So, I
thinking that it would be prudent to have both controls, but not
necessarily
heated air into the Carb Heat type flapper control.....
Another issue for an IFR RV Aircraft is the current design of the
tank
vents. It does not meet my requirements of system redundancy (only one
vent
method per tank). Yes, there are two tanks. But the same IFR conditions
that
plug one vent (inadvertent penetration into ice or snow) can plug the
second
tank vent. Virtually all certified IFR aircraft have fuel tank venting
redundancy (tank vents plus cap vents in most cases). Van's design does
not.
Van's design utilizes the tank vent position behind the cowl (engine
heat)
to help mitigate this issue. While I have never seen IFR conditions
where
this vent was compromised, it may be possible under the right
conditions.
With conventional RV design, I don't have a solution for this issue. I
unsuccessfully attempted making vents in the tank fuel caps. In my
installations of tip tanks, I still utilize the same fuselage vent, but,
in
the tip tank vent line (which, because of the fuel system plumbing, is
the
vent for the main tank as well), I put a small cut into the vent line so
that if the fuselage vent becomes plugged, there is still a method to
vent
the tank.
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924V
_____
From: Emrath [mailto:emrath(at)comcast.net]
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 10:22 PM
Subject: RE: Re Throttle/Mixture bracket
Fred,
Try Part number VA-149-360-PC KIT in the Vans web catalog.
This is listed as an item included in the RV-10 firewall Forward kit.
Under the "List" it says $18 and included the extra gasket needed.
This is
for use between the carb and the sump, but works equally well between
the
servo and the sump. At least it did for me on my 0-360 converted to
Fuel
Injection, updraft Bendix system.
Marty =D2=D3=AC
-----Original Message-----
From: Stucklen, Frederic W UTPWR [mailto:Fred.Stucklen(at)UTCPower.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 11:51 AM
Subject: RE: Re Throttle/Mixture bracket
Marty,
Thanks for the input.. The tubing idea sounds good. I already have a
set
of cables - just a little longer than the normal Carb units - so will
try
those first. If they don't fit I'll try the tubing idea....
It turns out that the bracket that Van's sells for the IO-320 also
fits
the Silver Hawk (Experimental version of the Bendix) fuel body. I had
bought
one, but didn't think it would work. After making a cardboard mockup, I
figured out that it looked a lot like the part I had on the bench!
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924RV
_____
From: emrath(at)comcast.net [mailto:emrath(at)comcast.net]
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 12:13 PM
Subject: Re Throttle/Mixture bracket
Hey Fred,
Van's has a bracket for use on the RV-10, PC-182 comes to mind, but you
may
have to search. I used this on my -6A and a 3/4" spacer purchased years
ago
form Eustace Bowhay, now deceased. I'm not flying yet, still working
on
fiberglass stuff, but it all fits fine with no holes in the FAB for
clearance. As for cable lengths, I cut the holes in the firewall for
pass
thru and used some plastic tubing as a fit up for length. I did have to
return one cable, but Van's had the lengths I needed. Hope this help.
Marty Emrath
RV-6A Brentwood TN
Subject: RV-List: RE: IO-360 Throttle/Mixture Installation
From: "Stucklen, Frederic W UTPWR" <Fred.Stucklen(at)UTCPower.com
<http://mailcenter.comcast.net/wmc/v/wm/48860538000E99F000007020220073407
608
9B0E9D030A?cmd=ComposeTo&adr=Fred%2EStucklen%40UTCPower%2Ecom&sid=c
0> >
ED,
Thanks for the reply. I'm installing the Precision Silver hawk Fuel
body, which is essentially the same as the old Bendix unit, on a
vertical sump TMX IO-360. Relative to a Carburetor, the throttle and
mixture arms on the Fuel Body are reversed, and, as you have implied,
the mixture arm requires an insert into the FAB box (or a 3/4" spacer
between the FAB box and the Fuel Body). The bracket Van's supplies for
the Carburetors is wrong for both throttle and mixture without some
major changes. And, yes, there appears to be room i! n the c owl for the
use of the spacer....
What I am looking at now is a custom made bracket that is designed in
a manner similar to Van's unit. I figure I can make it out of .050" alum
by bending the flanges in between two pieces of 3/4" plywood (using a
hammer to "persuade it to bend...).
What I don't know yet is the required cable lengths. It would seem
that they would have to be shorter than vans recommended cables for a
carburetor as the bracket tabs for mounting the cables are closer to the
firewall. How much shorter, I don't know. I do have a set of cables from
Van's, but I ordered cables that were longer. Might have to return
them....
The RV- Listers have given me a lot of ideas to work with. If I come
up with a successful bracket design, I'll make a formal drawing and post
it on the list, along with my resultant cable lengths......
Fred Stucklen
RV-7A N924RV
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
7/22/2008
4:05 PM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Boyd" <sportav8r(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fellow Canadian builders, educate me please. Is EXPERIMENTAL |
required within cabin.
A foretaste of things to come. Soon enough I predict we US builders will
need the placard in Spanish and English (likely in that order.)
-Stormy / RV-6A
On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 9:23 AM, Ted French wrote:
>
> Experimental is an American requirement, not Canadian. You only need the
> words you refered to in English AND French
>
> Ted French C-FXCS
> RV-10 Flying
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Terry Mortimore
> Sent: July 22, 2008 5:03 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Fellow Canadian builders, educate me please. Is
> EXPERIMENTAL required within cabin.
>
>
> Hi Gang:
>
> I just ordered my interior from Classic Aero Designs and I assumed that I
> would have the word EXPERIMENTAL embroidered across the upper baggage
> compartment panel. While talking with Anna she questioned wether a Canadian
> plane requires this.
>
> Looking through my RAA amateur built Aircraft builders manual the only
> referance I see to placarding is 549.15 which states that a placard with
> letters at least 3/8" high stating "Notice: This aircraft is operating with
> a special certificate of airworthiness for amateur-built aircraft" must be
> in plane view of the passenger.
>
> Can anyone confirm that this is all that is required? If so I think I will
> cancell my order for the embroidering.
>
>
> Than
> ks,
> Terry.
>
> Fuselage kit finished, just ordered finishing kit.
>
>
> Terry Mortimore
> 426 McNabb Street Apt#4
> Sault Ste Marie, Ontario
> P6B 1Z3
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Welcome back |
At 10:40 AM 7/22/2008 Tuesday, you wrote:
>
>Matt,
>
>I've seen a lot of questions from you on the RV-8 and you've got a -8 S/N in
>your signature. Did you give up your -4 and start on a -8? Inquiring minds
>and all... At any event, welcome back to the active building world.
>
>Regards,
>Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
>RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix
>Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A
>
Hi Greg/All,
For various reasons I've put the old RV-4 project on hold and have started a new
RV-8 QB project. The -8' tail is done and the rest is suppose to arrive next
month. My hope is to get the -8 in the air quickly, maybe flying as early as
next Summer.
On a side note, it is almost unbelievable how much better Van's kits are now compared
to the circa 1988 RV-4 kit. Wow. The pre-punch is amazing and the fit
is perfect. It really is a testament to Van's and his dedication to making his
products better. As a point of reference, it took me 240 hours to build the
RV-4 tail and about 120 hours to build the RV-8 tail. And, the RV-8 tail cosmetically
is near perfect. Granted, some of that has to do with experience (riveting
skill), but most of it has to do with Van's kits.
I really like Van's Internet support these days too. You can send an email to
support with a couple of pictures attached and a description of your problem,
and I generally find an excellent response in my email the next morning. Parts
ordering from the online catalog is just as efficient. I found that parts are
shipped the next business day without exception. I really like that every
part in the kit can be found in the online order/search. Very cool. Don't mean
to be preaching to the choir, but building is just so much more of a pleasure
now.
In any case, I've attached a picture of my -8 instrument panel layout. Those are
the new 3D HX GRT EFIS models, and Vertical Power's sweet VP-200 electrical
system. Power will likely be one of the new IO-390's with a CS prop.
Feels good to be back!
Matt Dralle
RV-8 # 82880
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David E. Nelson" <david.nelson(at)pobox.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Welcome back |
Hi Matt,
Welcome back to this crazy and rewarding thing that we do! ;) What
make/model is the entertainment system? What influenced your decision?
Thank you,
/\/elson
Austin, TX
RV-7A Tip-Up - Canopy Side Skirts
~~ Lately my memory seems to be like a steel trap .... without any spring.
~~
On Wed, 23 Jul 2008, Matt Dralle wrote:
> Hi Greg/All,
>
> For various reasons I've put the old RV-4 project on hold and have
> started a new RV-8 QB project. The -8' tail is done and the rest is
> suppose to arrive next month. My hope is to get the -8 in the air
> quickly, maybe flying as early as next Summer.
>
> On a side note, it is almost unbelievable how much better Van's kits are
> now compared to the circa 1988 RV-4 kit. Wow. The pre-punch is amazing
> and the fit is perfect. It really is a testament to Van's and his
> dedication to making his products better. As a point of reference, it
> took me 240 hours to build the RV-4 tail and about 120 hours to build
> the RV-8 tail. And, the RV-8 tail cosmetically is near perfect.
> Granted, some of that has to do with experience (riveting skill), but
> most of it has to do with Van's kits.
>
> I really like Van's Internet support these days too. You can send an
> email to support with a couple of pictures attached and a description of
> your problem, and I generally find an excellent response in my email the
> next morning. Parts ordering from the online catalog is just as
> efficient. I found that parts are shipped the next business day without
> exception. I really like that every part in the kit can be found in the
> online order/search. Very cool. Don't mean to be preaching to the
> choir, but building is just so much more of a pleasure now.
>
> In any case, I've attached a picture of my -8 instrument panel layout.
> Those are the new 3D HX GRT EFIS models, and Vertical Power's sweet
> VP-200 electrical system. Power will likely be one of the new IO-390's
> with a CS prop.
>
> Feels good to be back!
>
> Matt Dralle
> RV-8 # 82880
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Perry Yaremchuk" <payaremchuk(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | RV-9 take-off flap settings....again! |
Hi all,
I am training on my newly purchased RV-9a, and my instructor wants me
to do a short-field take-off, clearing an obstacle, ( naturally, the
50-foot tree at the end of the strip!)
I've surfed the list and other resources extensively, and can find no
hard data on this!
Van's nicely responded that they have no data, and each plane/pilot
will have to establish their own procedure!
Surely when John Roncz designed the airfoil for the '9, he could tell
that adding 10 degrees of flap added some lift, and 20 added more
drag,
thus one should use 15 for optimum lift at 62 kts.,
and 5 for best angle of climb at 74 kts, or whatever!!!!
If there is no such data, I guess we'll have to get out the tape
measure and test pilot gear!
thanks
Perry Yaremchuk
C-FINT RV-9a Penticton BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9 take-off flap settings....again! |
Perry Yaremchuk wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> I am training on my newly purchased RV-9a, and my instructor wants me
> to do a short-field take-off, clearing an obstacle, ( naturally, the
> 50-foot tree at the end of the strip!)
Perry, you will most likely find that you won't need any flaps to clear
the 50' tree at the end of the strip....by about 150'......unless the
strip is too short to land on!
> I've surfed the list and other resources extensively, and can find no
> hard data on this!
Probably because RVer's hardly ever have to resort to "short field"
technique. The planes just climb so much better than the typical C172.
>
> Van's nicely responded that they have no data, and each plane/pilot
> will have to establish their own procedure!
That is true. How can you establish standard procedure when every plane
is different?
Vx is going to be somewhere in the range of 70-115 kts, depending on
what engine you have, what prop you have, pilot technique, how heavy the
plane is, the density altitude, how much you want to scare your
instructor, etc, etc.........
Welcome to the world of experimental aviation! Enjoy your new plane. :-)
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brian Alley <n320wt(at)yahoo.com> |
I have an RV-6A in my shop with a damaged canopy. Its unusual in the fact that
the airframe used a tip up canopy with the front cut off and attached as a windshield.
The center portion is split down the middle and made into gullwing doors.
The pilots door was destroyed today and we are looking for part of a canopy
to remake the pilots door. I've checked with Vans and Aero Plane Plastics with
no luck. Anyone with a canopy that may work, please call me on my cell. I'm
trying to get this fixed in time for Airventure. Thanks in advance!!!
BRIAN ALLEY (N320WT)
CARBON FIBER COMPOSITES
101 Caroline Circle
Hurricane, WV 25526
www.carbonfibercomposites.net
304-562-6800 home
304-395-4932 cell
How are you going to win by a nose if you don't stick out your neck?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gordon or Marge" <gcomfo(at)tc3net.com> |
| Subject: | Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390 |
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 12:36 PM
Subject: RV-List: Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390
Dear Listers,
What is the common opinion of Superior XP engines vs. the typical Lycoming
engine?
In looking over the Superior web site, they have a new 220hp XP-400 engine
designed around the basic IO-360 Angle Valve chassis that looks pretty nice.
At $30,000 new, its $3-4k cheaper than the Lycoming IO-390 solutions and, if
you believe the Superior mantra, a better designed engine in general.
Matt: A 2.6% increase in displacement yields a 4.8% increase in power? Is
Lycoming stupid? Maybe. Is Superior still in development? Probably. Will
they actually deliver 220? Who knows? A cynic might suspect a bit of
brochursmanship here.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Skylor Piper <skylor4(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390 |
I'm having trouble following this math: "A 2.6% increase in displacement yields
a 4.8% increase in power?"
An increase in displacement from 360 to 390 is an 8.3% increase, while an increase
in power from 200 to 210 is a 5% increase...reasonable in the Lycoming case
if it's true that the IO-360 angle valve doesn't produce a full 200 horsepower
to begin with.
An increase in displacement from 360 to 400 (Superior) is an 11.1% increase, and
an increase in power from 200 to 220 is exactly a 10% increase.
Skylor
RV-8 Underconstruction
IO-360, 200HP
--- On Thu, 7/24/08, Gordon or Marge wrote:
From: Gordon or Marge <gcomfo(at)tc3net.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390
Date: Thursday, July 24, 2008, 5:59 AM
Matt: A 2.6% increase in displacement yields a 4.8% increase in power? Is
Lycoming stupid? Maybe. Is Superior still in development? Probably. Will
they actually deliver 220? Who knows? A cynic might suspect a bit of
brochursmanship here.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Patrick Kelley" <webmaster(at)flion.com> |
| Subject: | Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390 |
Gordon's cynicism is entirely understandable, but I'd bet on Superior to
deliver at least 220. I agree that they're probably still in development;
they don't stand still just because they've put a product on the table. I
pondered an XP engine for a long time and watched the product evolve. What
finally got me off the fence was my wife paying for the Build School. I
thought I had read up a lot on the engine and various manufacturer but in
three days I learned a ton. As it happened, the other student (they run two
at a time) had to cancel, so they used the other station to build one of the
Vantage engines. During the build, I got to compare: flat tappet vs.
roller, carb vs. injection, and so on. And I also got shown some of those
improvements over the stock Lycoming, like oiling the thrust bearing face or
the sump improvements (in hot rods, you'd call that porting and polishing).
I also got to see their specifications - the checklist of tolerances that
they use when building. I'd guess that Lycoming uses similar but they are
way tighter than the acceptable tolerances in the Lycoming manuals. And
after my build (which was inspected by their QA staff as I watched) they ran
the thing on a test stand before shipping it to me.
So that's the product; obviously I have a good opinion of it. Now, let me
tell you about the people. I was treated like a VIP there, which you'd
expect. Everyone, from the CEO down knew who I was and took time to say hi
or answer questions. Then I left and got my engine, so you might think that
I'd be forgotten. Not at all. They've answered every question I could ask
about my installation, quickly and helpfully. And I recently stupidly lost
an intake manifold bolt, so I emailed them to order a replacement. Two days
later, I had the replacement plus washer and star washer at no charge. Sure
a minor thing, but I've known other businesses that would charge for the
part and add a handling charge. I like this company. In fact, I asked if
they might do an XPIO-540; I'm considering an RV-10 for a future project.
They don't have one in the works, but they wouldn't rule it out. If I do
and they do, I'll be buying one, you betcha.
Patrick Kelley - RV-6A - Cowling and final engine hookups; flying in Sept?
-----Original Message-----
Matt: A 2.6% increase in displacement yields a 4.8% increase in power? Is
Lycoming stupid? Maybe. Is Superior still in development? Probably. Will
they actually deliver 220? Who knows? A cynic might suspect a bit of
brochursmanship here.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
-----Original Message-----
Dear Listers,
What is the common opinion of Superior XP engines vs. the typical Lycoming
engine?
In looking over the Superior web site, they have a new 220hp XP-400 engine
designed around the basic IO-360 Angle Valve chassis that looks pretty nice.
At $30,000 new, its $3-4k cheaper than the Lycoming IO-390 solutions and, if
you believe the Superior mantra, a better designed engine in general.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Garey Wittich <gareywittich2000(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Rivet Spacing for Elevator Skin Stiffeners |
Greetings:
I have "older" drawings for the RV-8 Elevators. They show NO required rivet spacing
(the number of rivets to be used) for each Elevator Skin Stiffener. Understand
the newer Stiffeners come with pilot holes already prepunched in them
from Vans.
Can someone give me the "number" of rivets used for EACH Stiffener:
E-720G E-720A E-720F
E-720H E-720B
E-720J E-720C
E-720K E-720D
E-720L E-720E
(Using a rivet spacing fan, I can then make the rivet spacing equal for each Stiffener.)
Thanks for your help, Garey Wittich Santa Monica, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Hills <jason(at)hills.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet Spacing for Elevator Skin Stiffeners |
A: 10
B: 9
C: 9
D: 8
E: 8
F: 7
G: 7
H: 6
J: 8
K: 8
L: 7
Off my drawing DWG 4 & DWG 5 for RV-8 kit purchased Sept 2006.
Hope that helps!
...Jason
On Jul 24, 2008, at 8:41 PM, Garey Wittich wrote:
Greetings:
I have "older" drawings for the RV-8 Elevators. They show NO required
rivet spacing (the number of rivets to be used) for each Elevator Skin
Stiffener. Understand the newer Stiffeners come with pilot holes
already prepunched in them from Vans.
Can someone give me the "number" of rivets used for EACH Stiffener:
E-720G E-720A E-720F
E-720H E-720B
E-720J E-720C
E-720K E-720D
E-720L E-720E
(Using a rivet spacing fan, I can then make the rivet spacing equal
for each Stiffener.)
Thanks for your help, Garey Wittich Santa Monica, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ed Holyoke <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet Spacing for Elevator Skin Stiffeners |
Garey,
I'd guess that the drawing does show rivet spacing, i.e.: 1 1/4" or 1
1/2" typ. Layout the rivets on each end and use a rivet fan set near the
"typ (ical)" space and when in doubt, err to the side of shorter
spacing. If a spacing is not called on the drawing, measure the rivet X
marks on the drawing and account for the scale. Again, err to the
shorter spacing if it isn't clear.
Pax,
Ed Holyoke
Garey Wittich wrote:
>
> Greetings:
>
> I have "older" drawings for the RV-8 Elevators. They show NO required rivet
spacing (the number of rivets to be used) for each Elevator Skin Stiffener. Understand
the newer Stiffeners come with pilot holes already prepunched in them
from Vans.
>
> Can someone give me the "number" of rivets used for EACH Stiffener:
>
> E-720G E-720A E-720F
>
> E-720H E-720B
>
> E-720J E-720C
>
> E-720K E-720D
>
> E-720L E-720E
>
> (Using a rivet spacing fan, I can then make the rivet spacing equal for each
Stiffener.)
>
> Thanks for your help, Garey Wittich Santa Monica, CA
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob-tcw" <rnewman(at)tcwtech.com> |
Fellow RV builders,
We head out today to Oshkosh today and look forward to meeting
you all. We'll be camping with the RV-10 group this year and we'll be
exhibiting in the East Hall, Booth 5016.
Please stop by and see our new products. We will be
introducing two new products to the TCW Technologies offerings.
Come try out the working demos of "Intelligent Power Stabilizer" and
"Intelligent Lighting Controller". A preview of these new products
is now up on our web site. www.tcwtech.com
We also have our working demo of Safety-Trim and Intelligent
Flap Controller for your review.
Best regards,
Bob Newman
TCW Technologies, LLC.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 07/24/08 |
| From: | "John Michael Coers" <jcoers(at)hughes.net> |
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T (Hughes.net)
-----Original Message-----
From: RV-List Digest Server <rv-list(at)matronics.com>
Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2008 23:57:51
Subject: RV-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 07/24/08
*
=================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
=================================================
Today's complete RV-List Digest can also be found in either of the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the RV-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 08-07-24&Archive=RV
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 08-07-24&Archive=RV
===============================================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
===============================================
----------------------------------------------------------
RV-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Thu 07/24/08: 6
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:09 AM - Re: Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390 (Gordon or Marge)
2. 07:48 AM - Re: Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390 (Skylor Piper)
3. 08:25 AM - Re: Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390 (Patrick Kelley)
4. 08:44 PM - Rivet Spacing for Elevator Skin Stiffeners (Garey Wittich)
5. 09:27 PM - Re: Rivet Spacing for Elevator Skin Stiffeners (Jason Hills)
6. 09:58 PM - Re: Rivet Spacing for Elevator Skin Stiffeners (Ed Holyoke)
________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________
From: "Gordon or Marge" <gcomfo(at)tc3net.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 12:36 PM
Subject: RV-List: Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390
Dear Listers,
What is the common opinion of Superior XP engines vs. the typical Lycoming
engine?
In looking over the Superior web site, they have a new 220hp XP-400 engine
designed around the basic IO-360 Angle Valve chassis that looks pretty nice.
At $30,000 new, its $3-4k cheaper than the Lycoming IO-390 solutions and, if
you believe the Superior mantra, a better designed engine in general.
Matt: A 2.6% increase in displacement yields a 4.8% increase in power? Is
Lycoming stupid? Maybe. Is Superior still in development? Probably. Will
they actually deliver 220? Who knows? A cynic might suspect a bit of
brochursmanship here.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________
From: Skylor Piper <skylor4(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390
I'm having trouble following this math: "A 2.6% increase in displacement yields
a 4.8% increase in power?"
An increase in displacement from 360 to 390 is an 8.3% increase, while an increase
in power from 200 to 210 is a 5% increase...reasonable in the Lycoming case
if it's true that the IO-360 angle valve doesn't produce a full 200 horsepower
to begin with.
An increase in displacement from 360 to 400 (Superior) is an 11.1% increase, and
an increase in power from 200 to 220 is exactly a 10% increase.
Skylor
RV-8 Underconstruction
IO-360, 200HP
--- On Thu, 7/24/08, Gordon or Marge wrote:
From: Gordon or Marge <gcomfo(at)tc3net.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390
Matt: A 2.6% increase in displacement yields a 4.8% increase in power? Is
Lycoming stupid? Maybe. Is Superior still in development? Probably. Will
they actually deliver 220? Who knows? A cynic might suspect a bit of
brochursmanship here.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________
From: "Patrick Kelley" <webmaster(at)flion.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Superior vs. Lycoming; XP-400 vs. IO-390
Gordon's cynicism is entirely understandable, but I'd bet on Superior to
deliver at least 220. I agree that they're probably still in development;
they don't stand still just because they've put a product on the table. I
pondered an XP engine for a long time and watched the product evolve. What
finally got me off the fence was my wife paying for the Build School. I
thought I had read up a lot on the engine and various manufacturer but in
three days I learned a ton. As it happened, the other student (they run two
at a time) had to cancel, so they used the other station to build one of the
Vantage engines. During the build, I got to compare: flat tappet vs.
roller, carb vs. injection, and so on. And I also got shown some of those
improvements over the stock Lycoming, like oiling the thrust bearing face or
the sump improvements (in hot rods, you'd call that porting and polishing).
I also got to see their specifications - the checklist of tolerances that
they use when building. I'd guess that Lycoming uses similar but they are
way tighter than the acceptable tolerances in the Lycoming manuals. And
after my build (which was inspected by their QA staff as I watched) they ran
the thing on a test stand before shipping it to me.
So that's the product; obviously I have a good opinion of it. Now, let me
tell you about the people. I was treated like a VIP there, which you'd
expect. Everyone, from the CEO down knew who I was and took time to say hi
or answer questions. Then I left and got my engine, so you might think that
I'd be forgotten. Not at all. They've answered every question I could ask
about my installation, quickly and helpfully. And I recently stupidly lost
an intake manifold bolt, so I emailed them to order a replacement. Two days
later, I had the replacement plus washer and star washer at no charge. Sure
a minor thing, but I've known other businesses that would charge for the
part and add a handling charge. I like this company. In fact, I asked if
they might do an XPIO-540; I'm considering an RV-10 for a future project.
They don't have one in the works, but they wouldn't rule it out. If I do
and they do, I'll be buying one, you betcha.
Patrick Kelley - RV-6A - Cowling and final engine hookups; flying in Sept?
-----Original Message-----
Matt: A 2.6% increase in displacement yields a 4.8% increase in power? Is
Lycoming stupid? Maybe. Is Superior still in development? Probably. Will
they actually deliver 220? Who knows? A cynic might suspect a bit of
brochursmanship here.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
-----Original Message-----
Dear Listers,
What is the common opinion of Superior XP engines vs. the typical Lycoming
engine?
In looking over the Superior web site, they have a new 220hp XP-400 engine
designed around the basic IO-360 Angle Valve chassis that looks pretty nice.
At $30,000 new, its $3-4k cheaper than the Lycoming IO-390 solutions and, if
you believe the Superior mantra, a better designed engine in general.
________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________
From: Garey Wittich <gareywittich2000(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: RV-List: Rivet Spacing for Elevator Skin Stiffeners
Greetings:
I have "older" drawings for the RV-8 Elevators. They show NO required rivet spacing
(the number of rivets to be used) for each Elevator Skin Stiffener. Understand
the newer Stiffeners come with pilot holes already prepunched in them
from Vans.
Can someone give me the "number" of rivets used for EACH Stiffener:
E-720G E-720A E-720F
E-720H E-720B
E-720J E-720C
E-720K E-720D
E-720L E-720E
(Using a rivet spacing fan, I can then make the rivet spacing equal for each Stiffener.)
Thanks for your help, Garey Wittich Santa Monica, CA
________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________
From: Jason Hills <jason(at)hills.org>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Rivet Spacing for Elevator Skin Stiffeners
A: 10
B: 9
C: 9
D: 8
E: 8
F: 7
G: 7
H: 6
J: 8
K: 8
L: 7
Off my drawing DWG 4 & DWG 5 for RV-8 kit purchased Sept 2006.
Hope that helps!
....Jason
On Jul 24, 2008, at 8:41 PM, Garey Wittich wrote:
Greetings:
I have "older" drawings for the RV-8 Elevators. They show NO required
rivet spacing (the number of rivets to be used) for each Elevator Skin
Stiffener. Understand the newer Stiffeners come with pilot holes
already prepunched in them from Vans.
Can someone give me the "number" of rivets used for EACH Stiffener:
E-720G E-720A E-720F
E-720H E-720B
E-720J E-720C
E-720K E-720D
E-720L E-720E
(Using a rivet spacing fan, I can then make the rivet spacing equal
for each Stiffener.)
Thanks for your help, Garey Wittich Santa Monica, CA
________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________
From: Ed Holyoke <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Rivet Spacing for Elevator Skin Stiffeners
Garey,
I'd guess that the drawing does show rivet spacing, i.e.: 1 1/4" or 1
1/2" typ. Layout the rivets on each end and use a rivet fan set near the
"typ (ical)" space and when in doubt, err to the side of shorter
spacing. If a spacing is not called on the drawing, measure the rivet X
marks on the drawing and account for the scale. Again, err to the
shorter spacing if it isn't clear.
Pax,
Ed Holyoke
Garey Wittich wrote:
>
> Greetings:
>
> I have "older" drawings for the RV-8 Elevators. They show NO required rivet
spacing (the number of rivets to be used) for each Elevator Skin Stiffener. Understand
the newer Stiffeners come with pilot holes already prepunched in them
from Vans.
>
> Can someone give me the "number" of rivets used for EACH Stiffener:
>
> E-720G E-720A E-720F
>
> E-720H E-720B
>
> E-720J E-720C
>
> E-720K E-720D
>
> E-720L E-720E
>
> (Using a rivet spacing fan, I can then make the rivet spacing equal for each
Stiffener.)
>
> Thanks for your help, Garey Wittich Santa Monica, CA
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Glasgow" <willfly(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | A Tough Decision |
After three years building and five years flying my RV-8, I have decided to
move into Light Sport aviation.
I will always cherish the memories of RVs and all they have to offer.
After spending months researching Builder Liability Issues, I have decided
to donate Cappys Toy to an Aviation Museum.
The museum has offered to create an Experimental Aircraft Section featuring
Cappys Toy. It is heartwarming to know Cappys Toy will forevermore be
representing Experimental Aviation, and that I have found a good home for
her.
The museum has agreed to accept Cappys Toy without the engine, engine
accessories, NAV/COM GNC 300XL, transponder GTX 327, autopilot Trio Avionics
EZ Pilot and 5 point airline type seat belts.
The expected delivery date is September 15, 2008.
In addition to a tax deduction, the sale of these items will enable me to
re-coup some of the losses incurred from not selling the airplane outright.
If you are interested in a proven complete functioning power plant package
with less than 450 hours for your project, or any of the other items, please
give me a call.
Engine and Engine Accessories
Superior XP 360: 0-360 A1A2, 180 HP
Main Alternator: B&C Specialty Products, L-40 with LR3C voltage regulator
Standby Alternator: B&C Specialty Products, SD-8 with SB1B-14 voltage
regulator, mounted in the Suction Pump engine case pad
Starter: B&C Specialty Products, BC315, Light Weight
Top Ignition: Light Speed Plasma II, with built in Crank Sender
Bottom Ignition: Slick 4000 Magneto with Impulse Coupler, mounted in the
Left Magneto engine case pad
Carburetor: Precision Airmotive MA4-5
Oil Filter Adapter: B&C BC7000
Oil Cooler: Stewart Warner
Exhaust: Viterman
Package Cost New $29,500. Price $19,000
Steve Glasgow-Cappy
N123SG RV-8
Cappy's Toy
3931 Melchor Avenue
Charlotte, NC
willfly(at)carolina.rr.com
704-362-0005 Home
704-281-7884 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Boyd" <sportav8r(at)gmail.com> |
Fellow aviators:
A few weeks back I loaded a heavy, folding shade tent into the pax seat of
my RV-6A to take to a neighbor's fly-in event, in the process bumping the
tuning knob of my Icom A200 radio and bending its shaft. The radio has
since stopped responding to turning the outer ring (MHz) selector, and needs
repair.
I'm not afraid to try this repair myself if I can get my hands on a
replacement concentric optical shaft encoder that is a proper fit, nor
opposed to sending the radio off for repair by an avionics shop is I can
find a reasonable quote. Menawhile, looking for a loaner radio while I get
the repairs done, or a good deal on a replacement A200 if I decide to swap
first / repair later.
Any help out there?
Thanks,
Bill B/ Stormy
RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Hernandez <carlosh(at)structuralaz.com> |
Bill,
Sorry to say, but other than IcomAmerica in Washington, there are no
parts available or a repair station you can send it to for repair. They
won't even send you parts. You have to send it back to them. I've sent
mine in for repair before and I've been advised to take special
precaution with the tuning knobs when shipping as they are some of the
most expensive parts to replace. I'm guessing your quote maybe be up
there along the lines of a new radio. Of course check with them first.
Sorry for the misfortune.
Carlos in AZ
Bill Boyd wrote:
> Fellow aviators:
>
> A few weeks back I loaded a heavy, folding shade tent into the pax
> seat of my RV-6A to take to a neighbor's fly-in event, in the process
> bumping the tuning knob of my Icom A200 radio and bending its shaft.
> The radio has since stopped responding to turning the outer ring (MHz)
> selector, and needs repair.
>
> I'm not afraid to try this repair myself if I can get my hands on a
> replacement concentric optical shaft encoder that is a proper fit, nor
> opposed to sending the radio off for repair by an avionics shop is I
> can find a reasonable quote. Menawhile, looking for a loaner radio
> while I get the repairs done, or a good deal on a replacement A200 if
> I decide to swap first / repair later.
>
> Any help out there?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bill B/ Stormy
> RV-6A
> *
>
>
> *
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Checked by AVG.
>
--
Carlos Hernandez <carlosh@sec-engr.com>
Structural Engineers Company
2963 W. Elliot Rd. - Suite 3
Chandler, AZ 85224
Phone: 480.968.8600
Fax: 480.968.8608
www.sec-engr.com
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE
The information in this email may be confidential and/or privileged.
This email is intended to be reviewed by only the individual or
organization named above. If you are not the intended recipient or
an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby
notified that any review, dissemination or copyingof this email and
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: A Tough Decision |
| From: | "N395V" <Bearcat(at)bearcataviation.com> |
> After spending months researching Builder Liability Issues, I have decided
> to donate Cappys Toy to an Aviation Museum.
>
What is it you found during your research that made you go this route?
--------
Milt
2003 F1 Rocket
2006 Radial Rocket
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=195039#195039
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris W <3edcft6(at)cox.net> |
It's ashame Kenwood doesn't make aviation radios. There are 2 or 3
different parts stores that you can buy virtually any part for one of
their current, and even a lot of their discontinued radios. At least
you can for their commercial and ham radios, not sure about the consumer
FRS type radios, if Kenwood even sales them anymore. Unfortunately it
is darn near impossible to get parts for Icom radios.
Carlos Hernandez wrote:
>
>
> Bill,
> Sorry to say, but other than IcomAmerica in Washington, there are no
> parts available or a repair station you can send it to for repair.
> They won't even send you parts. You have to send it back to them. I've
> sent mine in for repair before and I've been advised to take special
> precaution with the tuning knobs when shipping as they are some of the
> most expensive parts to replace. I'm guessing your quote maybe be up
> there along the lines of a new radio. Of course check with them first.
> Sorry for the misfortune.
>
> Carlos in AZ
>
> Bill Boyd wrote:
>> Fellow aviators:
>>
>> A few weeks back I loaded a heavy, folding shade tent into the pax
>> seat of my RV-6A to take to a neighbor's fly-in event, in the process
>> bumping the tuning knob of my Icom A200 radio and bending its shaft.
>> The radio has since stopped responding to turning the outer ring
>> (MHz) selector, and needs repair.
>>
>> I'm not afraid to try this repair myself if I can get my hands on a
>> replacement concentric optical shaft encoder that is a proper fit,
>> nor opposed to sending the radio off for repair by an avionics shop
>> is I can find a reasonable quote. Menawhile, looking for a loaner
>> radio while I get the repairs done, or a good deal on a replacement
>> A200 if I decide to swap first / repair later.
>>
>> Any help out there?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Bill B/ Stormy RV-6A
>> *
>>
>>
>> *
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Checked by AVG.
>
--
Chris W
KE5GIX
"Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM,
learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm"
Ham Radio Repeater Database.
http://hrrdb.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Boyd" <sportav8r(at)gmail.com> |
Chris-
Long time Kenwood TS-430 & 440 user here, but I have no beef with Icom
radios - I own an IC-703 I will be using wilderness-portable most of the
afternnoon today, and an IC-7000 in the shack, both of which I'm quite happy
with. More impressed with Yaesu's hand-held VHF stuff than anyone else's
(my FT-23R is still as durable as the day I bought it in 1985). But you are
right about Icom's service on avionics - I called the factory and spoke with
service and parts dept. All I can get out of them is the labor rate
($84/hr) and the rotary encoder price ($25), but the tech had no idea how
long it would take to solder in a new one - so I have no idea if this is a
$100 repair or a $400 repair. Frustrating. Since I could do this myself if
the part was available - and I'm not a factory-trained service tech, but
just a dangerous ham with a soldering iron - I tend to think it's closer to
a one-hour minumum job, but I hate handing them a blank check and not
knowing.
Shucks, it's just money - and everyone knows it is money, not lift, that
keeps planes in the air. I have one offer for a new A200 at a fair price,
so probably going that route now and repair the old one later for resale or
unicom use here at the farm.
On a side note, my LightSpeed Mach One in-ear headset broke again today -
earpiece stem sheared off inside the custom ear mold. Second time this has
happened, and last time they replaced it for free with a newly reconditioned
unit, no questions asked. Now THAT'S customer service. This time I have
some questions for them - about a trade in toward their Zulu ANR haedset.
Headset breakage in flight is a safety of flight issue, and I'm also finding
iit takes too long to unplug and re-fit those ear buds each time I get all
strapped in and realize the oil door is unlocked or the pitot cover is still
on ;-) Checklist items, I know... but I've been there too many times.
Thanks to all who replied. Fly safe.
-Bill
On Sat, Jul 26, 2008 at 8:58 AM, Chris W<3edcft6(at)cox.net> wrote:
>
> It's ashame Kenwood doesn't make aviation radios. There are 2 or 3
> different parts stores that you can buy virtually any part for one of their
> current, and even a lot of their discontinued radios. At least you can for
> their commercial and ham radios, not sure about the consumer FRS type
> radios, if Kenwood even sales them anymore. Unfortunately it is darn near
> impossible to get parts for Icom radios.
>
> Carlos Hernandez wrote:
>
>> >
>>
>> Bill,
>> Sorry to say, but other than IcomAmerica in Washington, there are no parts
>> available or a repair station you can send it to for repair. They won't even
>> send you parts. You have to send it back to them. I've sent mine in for
>> repair before and I've been advised to take special precaution with the
>> tuning knobs when shipping as they are some of the most expensive parts to
>> replace. I'm guessing your quote maybe be up there along the lines of a new
>> radio. Of course check with them first. Sorry for the misfortune.
>>
>> Carlos in AZ
>>
>> Bill Boyd wrote:
>>
>>> Fellow aviators:
>>>
>>> A few weeks back I loaded a heavy, folding shade tent into the pax seat
>>> of my RV-6A to take to a neighbor's fly-in event, in the process bumping the
>>> tuning knob of my Icom A200 radio and bending its shaft. The radio has
>>> since stopped responding to turning the outer ring (MHz) selector, and needs
>>> repair.
>>>
>>> I'm not afraid to try this repair myself if I can get my hands on a
>>> replacement concentric optical shaft encoder that is a proper fit, nor
>>> opposed to sending the radio off for repair by an avionics shop is I can
>>> find a reasonable quote. Menawhile, looking for a loaner radio while I get
>>> the repairs done, or a good deal on a replacement A200 if I decide to swap
>>> first / repair later.
>>>
>>> Any help out there?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Bill B/ Stormy RV-6A
>>> *
>>>
>>>
>>> *
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> Checked by AVG.
>>>
>>
>>
> --
> Chris W
> KE5GIX
>
> "Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at
> http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm"
>
> Ham Radio Repeater Database.
> http://hrrdb.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <gmcjetpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
Yea, just ship it to ICOM America Washington State (near Seattle). I'm not sure
about cost but I don't think its near the cost of a new radio. Call them first,
get the return authorization.
You may want to get insurance or tracking # or signature required (one of the
above but not all). USPS has been losing stuff lately. I ship a lot of items
USPS.
Stuff happens, you have to fix it and the factory is the only way. Parts, manuals,
tools and test equip makes it not user fixable (my guess).
You could hunt eBay or the aviation classifieds for a used unit? They go for
at least $400-$600 depending on condition, used, still in box. If you buy a new
or used unit, still get the old one fixed. You can keep it for spare or sell
it. It's not working right? You have to fix it.
I would advise you don't even try and take it apart and as Carlos, there is no
manual or parts.
Personally I like ICOM and Narco's factory repair only deal. I find avionics
shops to be good with some gear but cost wise and quality you are going to get
more consistency. Yes its a monopoly but the cost of a new A200 is only $600-$800
depending on if you got it on sale.
I think Garmin also has factory repair and they have like a flat cost no matter
what, in the $200-$300 range, may be it goes up from there. That might be a
little unfair, to have such high min charge, but it could work to your advantage
may be.
Things now a days are just plug and replace whole boards or panels. They don't
go in and fiddle with individual capacitors. Most of that stuff is surface mount
or in IC chips. Try getting a new flat screen LCD or Plazma fixed. The min
charge is $200-$300 (that is why I got extended warranty).
Its a bummer and sorry that happened but in RV's the panel is kind of prone to
hitting with body parts of cargo when loading. I know one guy who took out one
of his rear canopy fixed quarter panel and put a cargo door in (tip up RV-6).
That way he does not have to go over the front seats.
For slider canopies on side by side RV's, there is a reverse tip up mod, which
makes access to the baggage area easy.
Its a good thing to remind people to be careful. May be a little semi hard fiberglass
panel or cover can be made to pop over the panel or avionics where knobs
sticking out that can be hit and bent. You could store the cover in some out
of the way place under the panel when not in use? The cover could be very light
composite sandwich construction.
Cheers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Reel" <dreel(at)cox.net> |
It's very interesting to see so many are planning or have already put an
A200 or other radio into their communication panel. I built my RV8-A,
N4032Q, using only 2 of the ICOM IC-A22. I'm still trying to sell my
plane because of my cancer, however, I feel I have an extremely reliable
installation beyond normal aircraft reliability and at a lower cost. In
my AC, one of the portable units is mounted with just the operational
top in front of the panel and connected to AC power and antenna. This
has given me excellent communication just as good as normal 5 watt and
better frequency selection than normal two AC communication systems. No
problems have occured but ...
The second ICOM IC-A22 can just be put into the panel unit position. It
takes about 30 seconds and you're back to using the same antenna, power
and means of operation. You don't need two communications panels or
know different operational methods. If the problem is your AC power,
you can just directly connect the second unit to your AC antenna and use
your second units battery power. Puts you back to to the same 5 watt
audibility and the operational methods are still the same. The only
thing that is left that can lower communications capability is if the AC
antenna breaks and you have to use the portable antenna attached to your
IC-A22. Extremely unlikely compared to most aircraft problems, yet
still a very remote failure that restricts the distance over which you
can usefully communicate.
Anyway, I thought it would be useful to pass on how I made my VFR
day/night communications system more reliable, operational, and cheaper.
Something you can consider if you're still thinking how to build your
own.
Dave Reel
N4032Q
for sale
members.cox.net/reelpilot
703-385-9811
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Lenhardt" <av8or(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | FOR SALE - RV10 Quickbuild Kit |
Due to medical condition and financial situation, I am selling my Van's
Aircraft RV-10 quickbuild kit consisting of the empennage, wing, and
fuselage kits. I've only started on the tail kit with minimal work
being done on parts preparation without any assembly. Extras included
are the landing light kit, float fuel sending units, and flap
positioning system.
Also, available is a brand new pneumatic rivet squeezer.
Cost over $40,000. Asking $38,000.
Please contact me off list at 540-774-0387 or email av8or(at)cox.net
Located in SW VA.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Dudley" <rhdudley1(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | RV-6A For Sale (revised) |
Listers,
My re-review of the market suggests a revision of asking price.
This is one more try here before going to other locations to advertise.
A combination of health and financial factors have forced our decision
to sell our beloved airplane. If you are seriously looking for a
beautiful, well-equipped and flying RV-6A read the description below.
RV-6A FOR SALE
Completed 2005 Total time <140 hrs
O-320-D1A Total time since new <140 hrs
Hartzell C/S Prop total time since new <140 hrs
Slider
Great paint
Garmin GNS 430 nav/com
SL-30 nav/com
Garmin GTX 327transponder
Garmin GMA 340 Audio panel
Dual CDI with glideslope and coupling to either Nav
IFR panel, heated pitot, certified altimeter, encoder, transponder and
pitot static system
Dual Duckworks landing/taxi lights with Wig-Wag
S-Tech System 20 auto pilot/ turn coordinator
New main tires
Always hangared
March 2008 annual
Asking: :$95K
Serious buyers contact me off line and I'll send you more details.
Richard Dudley
rhdudley1(at)bellsouth.net
Orlando, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene Gottschalk" <miranda(at)tartan30.org> |
RV 6 project for sale. Over $20,000 invested. Empange done, wings done
(Except main skins on starboard wing), fuselage ready to remove from jig and
place on gear. Includes finishing kit and many options. Contact me off the
list for additional information and complete list. Asking less than 1/2
price. Make offer, seller "motivated".
miranda(at)tartan30.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Karatsonyi <mkaratsonyi(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | FOR SALE - RV10 Quickbuild Kit |
i am inter3sted in your pneumatic squeezer=2C how much?
From: av8or(at)cox.netTo: rv-list(at)matronics.comSubject: RV-List: FOR SALE - RV
10 Quickbuild KitDate: Sun=2C 27 Jul 2008 13:29:06 -0400
Due to medical condition and financial situation=2C I am selling my Van=92s
Aircraft RV-10 quickbuild kit consisting of the empennage=2C wing=2C and f
uselage kits. I=92ve only started on the tail kit with minimal work being
done on parts preparation without any assembly. Extras included are the la
nding light kit=2C float fuel sending units=2C and flap positioning system.
Also=2C available is a brand new pneumatic rivet squeezer.
Cost over $40=2C000. Asking $38=2C000.
Please contact me off list at 540-774-0387 or email av8or(at)cox.net Located
in SW VA.
_________________________________________________________________
Keep your kids safer online with Windows Live Family Safety.
http://www.windowslive.com/family_safety/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_
family_safety_072008
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Lenhardt" <av8or(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: FOR SALE - RV10 Quickbuild Kit |
I'm sorry. It's already sold, but if it falls through, I'll let you
know.
John
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Karatsonyi
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2008 10:30 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: FOR SALE - RV10 Quickbuild Kit
i am inter3sted in your pneumatic squeezer, how much?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: av8or(at)cox.net
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: FOR SALE - RV10 Quickbuild Kit
Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:29:06 -0400
Due to medical condition and financial situation, I am selling my
Van=92s Aircraft RV-10 quickbuild kit consisting of the empennage, wing,
and fuselage kits. I=92ve only started on the tail kit with minimal
work being done on parts preparation without any assembly. Extras
included are the landing light kit, float fuel sending units, and flap
positioning system.
Also, available is a brand new pneumatic rivet squeezer.
Cost over $40,000. Asking $38,000.
Please contact me off list at 540-774-0387 or email av8or(at)cox.net
Located in SW VA.
get=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
ttp://forums.matronics.com
=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Keep your kids safer online with Windows Live Family Safety. Help
protect your kids.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
7/28/2008 6:55 AM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Christopher Stone <rv8iator(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | RV-8 on Grove Gear |
As an occasional poster but daily reader... And having searched the archives...
I am hoping someone on this list has built a RV-8 and installed the Grove airfoiled
gear legs.
I am in the midst of installing the Grove legs and have found that the Grove legs
are thicker (dhoo! that's right they are aluminum and thus would need to be
30% thicker to be as stiff as the steel).
Because of the increased thickness the clamp blocks will protrude beyond the fuse
skin. My first thought was to eliminate the wear blocks between the gear legs
and fusalage to reduce the installed height of the gear legs. I don't think
ommiting the wear plates is a good idea.
Thus my question, what have other done? Does the gear leg inersection fairing
cover up the protruding gear leg attach block?
Chris Stone
Newberg, OR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Kenwood DNX8120 Entertainment System (was: Welcome back) |
At 10:50 AM 7/23/2008 Wednesday, you wrote:
>
>Hi Matt,
>
>Welcome back to this crazy and rewarding thing that we do! ;) What make/model
is the entertainment system? What influenced your decision?
I went with the Kenwood DNX8120 for a number of reasons. Certainly the "coolness"
factor had a little to do with it, and, well, I'm trying to see just how many
LCD flatpanels I can wedge into an RV-8 instrument panel... :-)
Seriously, though, the DNX8120 has a lot of features that come in a nicely integrated
solution. The 7" LCD is very clear and bright. It has both an iPod control
interface and a USB hard drive/thumb drive interface. More on those later.
It has a Garmin-based full moving map with POI database, which is probably
not exactly useful in an airplane, but here's a situation: Let's say you're
flying along on a cross country to somewhere far away and suddenly you've got
a huge hanker'n for an A&W Papa Burger and a frosty mug of Root Beer. Your next
way point could then easily include a local city with just such an establishment.
Doesn't A&W have car hops? Maybe they'll rollerskate out to the RV-8...
Okay, its a stretch, but I had to justify the coolness somehow...
It has a "touch-screen" where all but a couple of things can be viewed, configured,
and changed. The upside of the touch screen is ease of use and "coolness",
but the downside are the finger prints and ultimate wear on the screen. The
screen is "fingerprint resistant", but sweaty fingers still leave prints. There
are some "hard-buttons" for Volume control and switching sources.
It also has a "rear-view" camera for "check-six" (very tiny and clear). Kind of
like a rearview mirror actually. Very cool.
Audio quality of the DVD player, MP3, XM, and HD radio are all extremely clear.
I've got a PM3000 stereo intercom and new Bose NR headsets and the audio is
stellar to say the least.
Kenwood also makes a matching 7" "headrest" rest flat panel (Kenwood LZ-702IR
) that I will be mounting to the back of the pilot's set so the passenger can enjoy
some "in-flight" entertainment.
The iPod direct control interface works really well and will stream both music
and videos off your iPod. The downside is that it appears to use the line-level
audio output from the iPod, so the quality suffers a little. Does anyone know
if you can stream digital audio from the iPod?
The USB harddisk/thumbdrive interface (can be connected at the same time as the
iPod interface), works very well and the audio quality is superb since the D/A
conversion is done in the Kenwood. The downside is the severely limited number
of MP3 file the Kenwood seems to be able to handle. It appears to be a little
over 3000 tracks. I have a 160GB 2.5" USB hard drive with about 100GB of
MP3's and I was hoping to be able to access all 18,000 tracks, but it won't seem
to read them all. Maybe on the next firmware update. There is no track limitation
on the iPod interface and the Kenwood lists all 80GB of MP3's I have
on the iPod.
There is full bluetooth integration as well. It sync's up with my Blackberry 8820
great and I can dial and place calls right from the Kenwood with phone audio
coming through the Bose headsets. Voice pickup is through a dedicated microphone
plugged into the Kenwood; I'm not sure how well that will work in the noise
airplane environment, however.
The Garmin-based GPS Navigation works great! The maps are very detailed and updates
are quick. There are a TON of POI's and all include address and phone number.
It will be interesting to bring up the ground speed on the Kenwood and
compare to the GRT to A-B test the response time. Probably aren't too many car
installations where the cruse speed will exceed 200mph!
So, to summarize, the Kenwood DNX8120 is an very nice, high-quality, highly integrated
entertainment system that makes a nice installation in the panel. Perhaps
the only downside to it is the weight. The HU itself is pretty heavy and
all of the external "boxes" (XM, HD Radio, etc) add up too.
Here are a couple of links to the main unit and the remote screen:
http://www.kenwoodusa.com/Car_Entertainment/eXcelon/Mobile_Video_n_Navigation/DNX8120
http://www.kenwoodusa.com/Car_Entertainment/CarPortal%E2%84%A2/LZ-702IR
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | RV6-A for sale website |
My RV6-A is now actively being advertised for sale, see :
http://www3.telus.net/public/a6a36537/
TT 45 Hr.
Aero Sport-Power O-360-A1A 50 Hr.
Hartzell C/S prop -50 Hr.
Oil filter
Aeroelectric connection Z-11 based wiring
1 Slick mag 1 electronic ign.
55 Amp. Nippon Denzo alternator
Whelen wingtip strobes
Wingtip landing lights with wigwags
Automotive geared starter with extra new spare starter
Navaid wing leveler (accepts handheld GPS waypoints)
Altrack Altitude hold
Dynon EFIS D10-A plus internal battery, OAT probe and remote compass
module
Analog, airspeed, altitude,fuel gauges
Sirs compass
Rocky mountain Instruments uMonitor & uEncoder also with remote compass
module
SL-40 com - SL-70 Xponder
PM-3000 stereo intercom
Electric flaps
Elevator and aileron trims on left stick
Sliding canopy
Professionally upholstered Conforfoam seats
Removable control panel with removable instrument section.
Custom built aluminium floors.
Nose wheel fork mod done.
Professionally painted yellow (very nicely visible), add decor (stripes
etc.) per taste
Many painstaking hours spent on rigging, fit and finish.
First annual done July 10 2008.
Asking $99000.00
The website is; http://www3.telus.net/public/a6a36537/ If you are
interested in further information contact.
Jim Jewell in Kelowna B.C.
jjewell @ telus.net
Ph- (250) 861-8706
Checked by PC Tools AntiVirus (4.0.0.26 - 10.100.007).
http://www.pctools.com/free-antivirus/
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 on Grove Gear |
Hi Chris
I am building an -8 and used the grove airfoil gear. I used the wear plates
that came in vans kit and the new clamp blocks that came with the grove
gear. The inner one does not protrude. It alls seems to fit just fine under
the
cover plates. The fiberglass fairings will cover all the outboard ones
without problem.
My bird is up on the gear now. The Grove gear look pretty good and you get
to avoid all the gear fairing stuff. Good choice from my limited frame of
reference.
Regards,
Michael Wynn
RV 8 FWF
San Ramon, CA
In a message dated 7/28/2008 9:05:06 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
rv8iator(at)earthlink.net writes:
--> RV-List message posted by: Christopher Stone
As an occasional poster but daily reader... And having searched the
archives...
I am hoping someone on this list has built a RV-8 and installed the Grove
airfoiled gear legs.
I am in the midst of installing the Grove legs and have found that the Grove
legs are thicker (dhoo! that's right they are aluminum and thus would need
to be 30% thicker to be as stiff as the steel).
Because of the increased thickness the clamp blocks will protrude beyond the
fuse skin. My first thought was to eliminate the wear blocks between the
gear legs and fusalage to reduce the installed height of the gear legs. I
don't think ommiting the wear plates is a good idea.
Thus my question, what have other done? Does the gear leg inersection
fairing cover up the protruding gear leg attach block?
Chris Stone
Newberg, OR
**************Get fantasy football with free live scoring. Sign up for
FanHouse Fantasy Football today.
(http://www.fanhouse.com/fantasyaffair?ncid=aolspr00050000000020)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 on Grove Gear |
Michael,
How about posting some pictures of the gear legs with close ups and distance shots
to get a idea what they look like on the plane. When did you order them,
when did you get them? I ordered mine a couple of weeks ago and was told about
10 weeks for delivery or more.
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880
At 04:18 PM 7/28/2008 Monday, you wrote:
>Hi Chris
>
>I am building an -8 and used the grove airfoil gear. I used the wear plates that
came in vans kit and the new clamp blocks that came with the grove gear.
The inner one does not protrude. It alls seems to fit just fine under the cover
plates. The fiberglass fairings will cover all the outboard ones without problem.
>
>My bird is up on the gear now. The Grove gear look pretty good and you get to
avoid all the gear fairing stuff. Good choice from my limited frame of reference.
>
>Regards,
>
>Michael Wynn
>RV 8 FWF
>San Ramon, CA
>
>In a message dated 7/28/2008 9:05:06 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, rv8iator(at)earthlink.net
writes:
>
>As an occasional poster but daily reader... And having searched the archives...
>
>I am hoping someone on this list has built a RV-8 and installed the Grove airfoiled
gear legs.
>
>I am in the midst of installing the Grove legs and have found that the Grove legs
are thicker (dhoo! that's right they are aluminum and thus would need to be
30% thicker to be as stiff as the steel).
>
>Because of the increased thickness the clamp blocks will protrude beyond the fuse
skin. My first thought was to eliminate the wear blocks between the gear
legs and fusalage to reduce the installed height of the gear legs. I don't think
ommiting the wear plates is a good idea.
>
>Thus my question, what have other done? Does the gear leg inersection fairing
cover up the protruding gear leg attach block?
>
>Chris Stone
>Newberg, es y --> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS nbsp; - List
Contribution Web Site ; ========================
>
>
>----------
>Get fantasy football with free live scoring. <http://www.fanhouse.com/fantasyaffair?ncid=aolspr00050000000020>Sign up for FanHouse Fantasy Football today.
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kevin Horton" <khorton01(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 on Grove Gear |
On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 10:57 AM, Christopher Stone
wrote:
>
> As an occasional poster but daily reader... And having searched the
> archives...
>
> I am hoping someone on this list has built a RV-8 and installed the Grove
> airfoiled gear legs.
>
> I am in the midst of installing the Grove legs and have found that the
> Grove legs are thicker (dhoo! that's right they are aluminum and thus would
> need to be 30% thicker to be as stiff as the steel).
>
> Because of the increased thickness the clamp blocks will protrude beyond
> the fuse skin. My first thought was to eliminate the wear blocks between
> the gear legs and fusalage to reduce the installed height of the gear legs.
> I don't think ommiting the wear plates is a good idea.
>
> Thus my question, what have other done? Does the gear leg inersection
> fairing cover up the protruding gear leg attach block?
>
The upper gear leg intersection fairing is a builder fabricated part. So,
you can make it whatever shape it needs to be to cover the clamp blocks and
bolt heads. Leave the wear plates in place. You don't want the gear
wearing at the longeron.
Kevin Horton
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dan <dan(at)rdan.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Battery --- Re: Kenwood DNX8120 Entertainment System (was: |
Welcome back)
Matt,
Where did you install your battery?
I am still trying to decide where to install mine.
Dan
-8
AWO
--- On Mon, 7/28/08, Matt Dralle wrote:
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: RV-List: Re: Kenwood DNX8120 Entertainment System (was: Welcome back)
Date: Monday, July 28, 2008, 10:51 AM
At 10:50 AM 7/23/2008 Wednesday, you wrote:
>
>Hi Matt,
>
>Welcome back to this crazy and rewarding thing that we do! ;) What
make/model is the entertainment system? What influenced your decision?
I went with the Kenwood DNX8120 for a number of reasons. Certainly the
"coolness" factor had a little to do with it, and, well, I'm
trying to see just how many LCD flatpanels I can wedge into an RV-8 instrument
panel... :-)
Seriously, though, the DNX8120 has a lot of features that come in a nicely
integrated solution. The 7" LCD is very clear and bright. It has both an
iPod control interface and a USB hard drive/thumb drive interface. More on
those later. It has a Garmin-based full moving map with POI database, which is
probably not exactly useful in an airplane, but here's a situation:
Let's say you're flying along on a cross country to somewhere far away
and suddenly you've got a huge hanker'n for an A&W Papa Burger and
a frosty mug of Root Beer. Your next way point could then easily include a
local city with just such an establishment. Doesn't A&W have car hops?
Maybe they'll rollerskate out to the RV-8... Okay, its a stretch, but I
had to justify the coolness somehow...
It has a "touch-screen" where all but a couple of things can be
viewed, configured, and changed. The upside of the touch screen is ease of use
and "coolness", but the downside are the finger prints and ultimate
wear on the screen. The screen is "fingerprint resistant", but
sweaty fingers still leave prints. There are some "hard-buttons" for
Volume control and switching sources.
It also has a "rear-view" camera for "check-six" (very tiny
and clear). Kind of like a rearview mirror actually. Very cool.
Audio quality of the DVD player, MP3, XM, and HD radio are all extremely clear.
I've got a PM3000 stereo intercom and new Bose NR headsets and the audio is
stellar to say the least.
Kenwood also makes a matching 7" "headrest" rest flat panel
(Kenwood LZ-702IR
) that I will be mounting to the back of the pilot's set so the passenger
can enjoy some "in-flight" entertainment.
The iPod direct control interface works really well and will stream both music
and videos off your iPod. The downside is that it appears to use the
line-level audio output from the iPod, so the quality suffers a little. Does
anyone know if you can stream digital audio from the iPod?
The USB harddisk/thumbdrive interface (can be connected at the same time as the
iPod interface), works very well and the audio quality is superb since the D/A
conversion is done in the Kenwood. The downside is the severely limited number
of MP3 file the Kenwood seems to be able to handle. It appears to be a little
over 3000 tracks. I have a 160GB 2.5" USB hard drive with about 100GB of
MP3's and I was hoping to be able to access all 18,000 tracks, but it
won't seem to read them all. Maybe on the next firmware update. There is
no track limitation on the iPod interface and the Kenwood lists all 80GB of
MP3's I have on the iPod.
There is full bluetooth integration as well. It sync's up with my
Blackberry 8820 great and I can dial and place calls right from the Kenwood
with phone audio coming through the Bose headsets. Voice pickup is through a
dedicated microphone plugged into the Kenwood; I'm not sure how well that
will work in the noise airplane environment, however.
The Garmin-based GPS Navigation works great! The maps are very detailed and
updates are quick. There are a TON of POI's and all include address and
phone number. It will be interesting to bring up the ground speed on the
Kenwood and compare to the GRT to A-B test the response time. Probably
aren't too many car installations where the cruse speed will exceed 200mph!
So, to summarize, the Kenwood DNX8120 is an very nice, high-quality, highly
integrated entertainment system that makes a nice installation in the panel.
Perhaps the only downside to it is the weight. The HU itself is pretty heavy
and all of the external "boxes" (XM, HD Radio, etc) add up too.
Here are a couple of links to the main unit and the remote screen:
http://www.kenwoodusa.com/Car_Entertainment/eXcelon/Mobile_Video_n_Navigation/DNX8120
http://www.kenwoodusa.com/Car_Entertainment/CarPortal%E2%84%A2/LZ-702IR
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Battery --- Re: Kenwood DNX8120 Entertainment System (was: |
Welcome back)
Well, with an IO-390 and a Hartzell, its definitely going to have to go waaay in
the back. I've ordered the Grove gear to save a few pounds forward of CG.
Its just a bummer having to run the cables that far back there. I'm also wondering
if mounting the Redbox CU for the Vertical Power in the back next to the
battery might be a good place. Still, then all the wires would have to go up
forward to the panel, which isn't that attractive of an idea. In any case, I
can't imagine being sorry about mounting the battery in the back, especially
if you have a big motor and CS.
Matt
At 06:15 AM 7/29/2008 Tuesday, you wrote:
>Matt,
>
>Where did you install your battery?
>
>I am still trying to decide where to install mine.
>
>Dan
>
>-8
>
>AWO
>
>--- On Mon, 7/28/08, Matt Dralle wrote:
>From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
>Subject: RV-List: Re: Kenwood DNX8120 Entertainment System (was: Welcome back)
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Date: Monday, July 28, 2008, 10:51 AM
>
>
>At 10:50 AM 7/23/2008 Wednesday, you wrote:
>
>
>
>
>>
>
>>Hi Matt,
>
>>
>
>>Welcome back to this crazy and rewarding thing that we do! ;) What
>
>make/model is the entertainment system? What influenced your decision?
>
>
>I went with the Kenwood DNX8120 for a number of reasons. Certainly the
>
>"coolness" factor had a little to do with it, and, well, I'm
>
>trying to see just how many LCD flatpanels I can wedge into an RV-8 instrument
>
>panel... :-)
>
>
>Seriously, though, the DNX8120 has a lot of features that come in a nicely
>
>integrated solution. The 7" LCD is very clear and bright. It has both an
>
>iPod control interface and a USB hard drive/thumb drive interface. More on
>
>those later. It has a Garmin-based full moving map with POI database, which is
>
>probably not exactly useful in an airplane, but here's a situation:
>
>Let's say you're flying along on a cross country to somewhere far away
>
>and suddenly you've got a huge hanker'n for an A&W Papa Burger and
>
>a frosty mug of Root Beer. Your next way point could then easily include a
>
>local city with just such an establishment. Doesn't A&W have car hops?
>
> Maybe they'll rollerskate out to the RV-8... Okay, its a stretch, but I
>
>had to justify the coolness somehow...
>
>
>It has a "touch-screen" where all but a couple of things can be
>
>viewed, configured, and changed. The upside of the touch screen is ease of use
>
>and "coolness", but the downside are the finger prints and ultimate
>
>wear on the screen. The screen is "fingerprint resistant", but
>
>sweaty fingers still leave prints. There are some "hard-buttons" for
>
>Volume control and switching sources.
>
>
>It also has a "rear-view" camera for "check-six" (very tiny
>
>and clear). Kind of like a rearview mirror actually. Very cool.
>
>
>Audio quality of the DVD player, MP3, XM, and HD radio are all extremely clear.
>
> I've got a PM3000 stereo intercom and new Bose NR headsets and the audio is
>
>stellar to say the least.
>
>
>Kenwood also makes a matching 7" "headrest" rest flat panel
>
>(Kenwood LZ-702IR
>
>) that I will be mounting to the back of the pilot's set so the passenger
>
>can enjoy some "in-flight" entertainment.
>
>
>The iPod direct control interface works really well and will stream both music
>
>and videos off your iPod. The downside is that it appears to use the
>
>line-level audio output from the iPod, so the quality suffers a little. Does
>
>anyone know if you can stream digital audio from the iPod?
>
>
>The USB harddisk/thumbdrive interface (can be connected at the same time as the
>
>iPod interface), works very well and the audio quality is superb since the D/A
>
>conversion is done in the Kenwood. The downside is the severely limited number
>
>of MP3 file the Kenwood seems to be able to handle. It appears to be a little
>
>over 3000 tracks. I have a 160GB 2.5" USB hard drive with about 100GB of
>
>MP3's and I was hoping to be able to access all 18,000 tracks, but it
>
>won't seem to read them all. Maybe on the next firmware update. There is
>
>no track limitation on the iPod interface and the Kenwood lists all 80GB of
>
>MP3's I have on the iPod.
>
>
>There is full bluetooth integration as well. It sync's up with my
>
>Blackberry 8820 great and I can dial and place calls right from the Kenwood
>
>with phone audio coming through the Bose headsets. Voice pickup is through a
>
>dedicated microphone plugged into the Kenwood; I'm not sure how well that
>
>will work in the noise airplane environment, however.
>
>
>The Garmin-based GPS Navigation works great! The maps are very detailed and
>
>updates are quick. There are a TON of POI's and all include address and
>
>phone number. It will be interesting to bring up the ground speed on the
>
>Kenwood and compare to the GRT to A-B test the response time. Probably
>
>aren't too many car installations where the cruse speed will exceed 200mph!
>
>
>So, to summarize, the Kenwood DNX8120 is an very nice, high-quality, highly
>
>integrated entertainment system that makes a nice installation in the panel.
>
>Perhaps the only downside to it is the weight. The HU itself is pretty heavy
>
>and all of the external "boxes" (XM, HD Radio, etc) add up too.
>
>
>Here are a couple of links to the main unit and the remote screen:
>
>
>
>
>http://www.kenwoodusa.com/Car_Entertainment/eXcelon/Mobile_Video_n_Navigation/DNX8120
>
>
> http://www.kenwoodusa.com/Car_Entertainment/CarPortal%E2%84%A2/LZ-702IR
>
>
>Best regards,
>
>
>Matt Dralle
>
>RV-8 #82880
>
>
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "stewart" <stucopeland(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | RV-9A kit for sale |
Bought an RV-6, can't afford to keep building RV-9A too. Tail 80% done,
wings 60%, Van's quickbuild fuselage nearly as purchased, Lyc. 0-320
engine used, and aircraft tools. Asking $20,000 for all but will
consider splitting off engine/tools. Call at (509) 965-1209 or email
stucopeland(at)charter.net.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Battery --- Re: Kenwood DNX8120 Entertainment System (was: |
Welcome back)
The IO-390 should be within a pound or two of the IO-360. One could go
with either an MT prop or Hartzell carbon fiber prop to reduce weight on
the front end by about 15 lbs.
Matt Dralle wrote:
>
> Well, with an IO-390 and a Hartzell, its definitely going to have to go waaay
in the back. I've ordered the Grove gear to save a few pounds forward of CG.
Its just a bummer having to run the cables that far back there. I'm also wondering
if mounting the Redbox CU for the Vertical Power in the back next to the
battery might be a good place. Still, then all the wires would have to go
up forward to the panel, which isn't that attractive of an idea. In any case,
I can't imagine being sorry about mounting the battery in the back, especially
if you have a big motor and CS.
>
> Matt
>
>
> At 06:15 AM 7/29/2008 Tuesday, you wrote:
>
>
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Meyette" <bmeyette(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | RV-9A kit for sale |
wow - seems like quite a flurry of planes & kits for sale lately
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of stewart
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 7:52 PM
Subject: RV-List: RV-9A kit for sale
Bought an RV-6, can't afford to keep building RV-9A too. Tail 80% done,
wings 60%, Van's quickbuild fuselage nearly as purchased, Lyc. 0-320 engine
used, and aircraft tools. Asking $20,000 for all but will consider
splitting off engine/tools. Call at (509) 965-1209 or email
stucopeland(at)charter.net.
"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List"http://www.matronics.com/Navigat
or?RV-List
"http://www.matronics.com/contribution"http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Checked by AVG.
5:13 PM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Bell" <carlbell(at)gforcecable.com> |
| Subject: | RV-9A kit for sale |
It's the price of gas and the stock market that is scaring a lot of retirees
like my self. I'm going to hang on and keep building my RV7, and
reprioritize things so I can do what I love. Crap who need health insurance
anyway? CJ
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian Meyette
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 10:46 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: RV-9A kit for sale
wow - seems like quite a flurry of planes & kits for sale lately
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of stewart
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 7:52 PM
Subject: RV-List: RV-9A kit for sale
Bought an RV-6, can't afford to keep building RV-9A too. Tail 80% done,
wings 60%, Van's quickbuild fuselage nearly as purchased, Lyc. 0-320 engine
used, and aircraft tools. Asking $20,000 for all but will consider
splitting off engine/tools. Call at (509) 965-1209 or email
stucopeland(at)charter.net.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/N
avigator?RV-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Checked by AVG.
7/28/2008 5:13 PM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Fogarty at Lakes & Leisure Realty" <jfogarty(at)tds.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A kit for sale |
Carl, It's a major workout building these RV's, I'm sure your health is
much better because you are building an airplane and hopefully flying as
much as possible. Crap who does need health insurance, give me that
rivet gun....
Jim
RV9a building slow
----- Original Message -----
From: Carl Bell
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 10:21 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: RV-9A kit for sale
It's the price of gas and the stock market that is scaring a lot of
retirees like my self. I'm going to hang on and keep building my RV7,
and reprioritize things so I can do what I love. Crap who need health
insurance anyway? CJ
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian Meyette
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 10:46 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV-List: RV-9A kit for sale
wow - seems like quite a flurry of planes & kits for sale lately
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of stewart
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 7:52 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: RV-9A kit for sale
Bought an RV-6, can't afford to keep building RV-9A too. Tail 80%
done, wings 60%, Van's quickbuild fuselage nearly as purchased, Lyc.
0-320 engine used, and aircraft tools. Asking $20,000 for all but will
consider splitting off engine/tools. Call at (509) 965-1209 or email
stucopeland(at)charter.net.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.
com/Navigator?RV-Listhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.m
atronics.comhref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.mat
270.5.6/1578 - Release Date: 7/28/2008 5:13 PM
Checked by AVG.
7/28/2008 5:13 PM
- The RV-List Email Forum - - MATRONICS WEB
FORUMS ---> http://forums.matronics.com - List Contribution
Web Site - -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Checked by AVG.
7/30/2008 6:56 AM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Chesteen" <bchesteen(at)hughes.net> |
| Subject: | (WTB) Carb for O-360 |
Needed in the worst kind of way is a carb for an O-360. MA4-5 #10-3878 or
#10-4164-1.
I will entertain all options like new reman, reman, good shape runable used,
good for core only etc. Cores must have all the parts to make it viable for
a 100% core.
Please PM me if you have something to offer or know someone who does.
Best regards,
Brian Chesteen (Brantel)
b c h e s t e e n @ h u g h e s . n e t
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Mortimore" <terry.mortimore(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Fellow Canadian builders, educate me please. Is EXPERIMENTAL |
required within cabin.
Hi gang, thanks for all the replies. I've removed the experimental from the
order.
Just got back from Oshkosh, had a good time. Lots of nice RV's.
Cheers, Terry.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted French" <ted_french(at)telus.net>
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 9:23 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Fellow Canadian builders, educate me please. Is
EXPERIMENTAL required within cabin.
>
> Experimental is an American requirement, not Canadian. You only need the
> words you refered to in English AND French
>
> Ted French C-FXCS
> RV-10 Flying
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Terry Mortimore
> Sent: July 22, 2008 5:03 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Fellow Canadian builders, educate me please. Is
> EXPERIMENTAL required within cabin.
>
>
> Hi Gang:
>
> I just ordered my interior from Classic Aero Designs and I assumed that I
> would have the word EXPERIMENTAL embroidered across the upper baggage
> compartment panel. While talking with Anna she questioned wether a
> Canadian
> plane requires this.
>
> Looking through my RAA amateur built Aircraft builders manual the only
> referance I see to placarding is 549.15 which states that a placard with
> letters at least 3/8" high stating "Notice: This aircraft is operating
> with
> a special certificate of airworthiness for amateur-built aircraft" must be
> in plane view of the passenger.
>
> Can anyone confirm that this is all that is required? If so I think I will
> cancell my order for the embroidering.
>
>
>
> Than
> ks,
> Terry.
>
> Fuselage kit finished, just ordered finishing kit.
>
>
> Terry Mortimore
> 426 McNabb Street Apt#4
> Sault Ste Marie, Ontario
> P6B 1Z3
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George Inman 204 287 8334 <ghinman(at)mts.net> |
| Subject: | Starter gear won't retract |
The gear on my starter will not retract back
away from the flywheel gear.
It is not jammed against the flywheel because it will not retract
even when the flywheel is removed
Any ideas
It is a Lycoming O-360 with one of the larger starters.
--
George H. Inman
ghinman(at)mts.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "rv4ross" <rv4ross(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Starter gear won't retract |
George,
Spray some lubricant such as LPS1 onto the gear and the shaft that it
slides on. Rotate that gear until the lubricant
is worked back onto the shaft. If this does not free it up you may have to
replace the starter.
Good luck,
Ross Scroggs
RV4 Fuselage
Locust Grove, GA
----- Original Message -----
From: "George Inman 204 287 8334" <ghinman(at)mts.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2008 10:20 PM
Subject: RV-List: Starter gear won't retract
>
>
> The gear on my starter will not retract back
> away from the flywheel gear.
> It is not jammed against the flywheel because it will not retract
> even when the flywheel is removed
> Any ideas
> It is a Lycoming O-360 with one of the larger starters.
>
> --
>
> George H. Inman
> ghinman(at)mts.net
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Starter gear won't retract |
rv4ross wrote:
>
> George,
> Spray some lubricant such as LPS1 onto the gear and the shaft that
> it slides on. Rotate that gear until the lubricant
> is worked back onto the shaft. If this does not free it up you may
> have to replace the starter.
You should still clean the LPS1 off. And you can take the starter to an
auto starter place and they'll replace the parts. If it were me ....
I'd just buy a Skytec. ..... and no, I don't get paid for my opinion. I
really like mine .... and hate anything with a bendix.
>
> Good luck,
>
> Ross Scroggs
> RV4 Fuselage
> Locust Grove, GA
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Inman 204 287 8334"
>
> To: "RV-list matronics"
> Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2008 10:20 PM
> Subject: RV-List: Starter gear won't retract
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> The gear on my starter will not retract back
>> away from the flywheel gear.
>> It is not jammed against the flywheel because it will not
>> retract
>> even when the flywheel is removed
>> Any ideas
>> It is a Lycoming O-360 with one of the larger starters.
>>
>> --
>>
>> George H. Inman
>> ghinman(at)mts.net
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Starter gear won't retract |
George Inman 204 287 8334 wrote:
>
>
>
> The gear on my starter will not retract back
> away from the flywheel gear.
> It is not jammed against the flywheel because it will not
> retract
> even when the flywheel is removed
> Any ideas
> It is a Lycoming O-360 with one of the larger starters.
>
Is this after starting? The starter gear will not retract untill it
reaches a certain RPM
If you engage the starter and the engine does not start they will
sometime not retract.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Boyd" <sportav8r(at)gmail.com> |
Rick:
Thank you for taking the time to respond to the discussion of the broken
tuning knob on the A200. That certainly is good news about the part
availability. Too often, misunderstandings, half-truths and false
information are repeated on the internet without question, to everyone's
detriment.
I will be contacting ICOM for a replacement part, and installing it myself,
and probably blogging the process.
I agree with your time estimate: about 10 minutes start to finish (1 hour
minimum charge) seems right, based on my experience. I am glad that ICOM
will make this part available to owner-pilot-builders who have the savvy to
effect this repair. Thanks for clearing that up. I own 4 different ICOM
amateur and aviation radios, and am happy with them all. Keep up the good
work!
-Bill Boyd
On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 2:41 PM, Rick Waedekin
wrote:
> Good morning/ afternoon everyone. I was forwarded a link to your blog
> site and felt compelled to respond. It appears there is a lot of
> misinformation floating around about ICOM so I thought I would clear up a
s
> much as I could for you.
>
>
> I would've posted this to your site, but I couldn't figure out how to do
> so=85
>
>
> 1) The part needed to fix the busted knob is our part number
> 0308670106 and anyone can call our parts department and buy one for $64.2
7.
> Our parts department contact information is listed on our website but her
e
> it is as well.
>
> Icom America Parts Department
> (800) 346-0495
> Monday - Friday, 8:00 AM-5:00 PM Pacific Time
>
> 2) We have many Avionics Shops that could also get the part and fix
> it for you. Gulf/ Pacific Coast, Eastern Avionics, Aircraft Spruce,
> American Avionics, Banyan just to name a few shops. Plus, we have our
> Service department here in Bellevue, WA as well as our regional service
> center in Anderson, SC that could fix this for you as well. All of this
> information is right on our website as well.
>
> 3) It only takes one hour to repair/ replace the rotary encoder on
> the A200.
>
>
> Obviously we'd rather have one of our dealers/ repair facilities fix this
> problem as there are a lot of ribbon cables and such that if not treated
> correctly can do even more damage to the unit, and wind up costing even m
ore
> money down the road.
>
>
> On a final note, as a rule ICOM's parts department supports most of the
> parts needed to fix our products for up to 10 years after the last date o
f
> manufacture.
>
>
> I hope this cleared up some of the questions floating around.
>
>
> Thanks for your support of ICOM products.
>
>
> *Rick Waedekin |* National Sales Manager | *Icom America, Inc.*
>
> 2380 116th Ave NE | Bellevue, WA | 98004
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6 Flyer <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
At Oshkosh AirVenture 2008=2C I asked Icom about how to replace the rubber
on the knobs. They gave me one of the rubber rings for one of the knobs on
the spot. They would have given me all of them if they had them. They had
a good selection but not everything. They gave me a business card with a
phone number to call so that I can get all of the replacement rubber parts.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell=2C
2=2C142.6 + Flying Hours So. CA=2C USA
Date: Fri=2C 1 Aug 2008 15:25:47 -0400
From: sportav8r(at)gmail.com
Subject: RV-List: Re: ICOM A200
Rick:
Thank you for taking the time to respond to the discussion of the broken tu
ning knob on the A200. That certainly is good news about the part availabi
lity. Too often=2C misunderstandings=2C half-truths and false information
are repeated on the internet without question=2C to everyone's detriment.
I will be contacting ICOM for a replacement part=2C and installing it mysel
f=2C and probably blogging the process.
I agree with your time estimate: about 10 minutes start to finish (1 hour m
inimum charge) seems right=2C based on my experience. I am glad that ICOM
will make this part available to owner-pilot-builders who have the savvy to
effect this repair. Thanks for clearing that up. I own 4 different ICOM
amateur and aviation radios=2C and am happy with them all. Keep up the goo
d work!
-Bill Boyd
On Fri=2C Aug 1=2C 2008 at 2:41 PM=2C Rick Waedekin wrote:
Good morning/ afternoon everyone. I was forwarded a
link to your blog site and felt compelled to respond. It appears there is
a lot of misinformation floating around about ICOM so I thought I would cle
ar
up as much as I could for you.
I would've posted this to your site=2C but I couldn't
figure out how to do so=85
1) The part
needed to fix the busted knob is our part number 0308670106 and anyone can
call
our parts department and buy one for $64.27. Our parts department contact
information is listed on our website but here it is as well.
Icom America Parts Department
(800) 346-0495
Monday - Friday=2C 8:00 AM-5:00 PM Pacific Time
2) We have many
Avionics Shops that could also get the part and fix it for you. Gulf/
Pacific Coast=2C Eastern Avionics=2C Aircraft Spruce=2C American Avionics
=2C Banyan
just to name a few shops. Plus=2C we have our Service department here in B
ellevue=2C WA as well as
our regional service center in Anderson=2C
SC that could fix this for you as
well. All of this information is right on our website as well.
3) It only
takes one hour to repair/ replace the rotary encoder on the A200.
Obviously we'd rather have one of our dealers/ repair
facilities fix this problem as there are a lot of ribbon cables and such th
at
if not treated correctly can do even more damage to the unit=2C and wind up
costing even more money down the road.
On a final note=2C as a rule ICOM's parts department
supports most of the parts needed to fix our products for up to 10 years af
ter
the last date of manufacture.
I hope this cleared up some of the questions floating
around.
Thanks for your support of ICOM products.
Rick Waedekin | National Sales
Manager | Icom America=2C Inc.
2380
116th Ave NE | Bellevue=2C
WA | 98004
_________________________________________________________________
Keep your kids safer online with Windows Live Family Safety.
http://www.windowslive.com/family_safety/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_
family_safety_072008
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Starter gear won't retract |
In a message dated 8/1/2008 3:38:31 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
jsflyrv(at)verizon.net writes:
Is this after starting? The starter gear will not retract until it
reaches a certain RPM
If you engage the starter and the engine does not start they will
sometime not retract.
Ditto. That has been my experience with those antiques. I welded a bracket
to adapt a Mitsubishi starter (looks like a skytec but got it free off a junk
car) and it has been great for the last 10 years.
Jim
**************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget?
Read reviews on AOL Autos.
(http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Grimmonpre" <jerry(at)mc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Starter gear won't retract |
Jim
Is it possible to submit a picture to the list showing what you have
done to make the Mitsubishi starter useable? Maybe a word description?
Thanks ...
Jerry
RV4
In a message dated 8/1/2008 3:38:31 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
jsflyrv(at)verizon.net writes:
Ditto. That has been my experience with those antiques. I welded a
bracket to adapt a Mitsubishi starter (looks like a skytec but got it
free off a junk car) and it has been great for the last 10 years.
Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Starter gear won't retract |
In a message dated 8/1/2008 5:15:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, jerry(at)mc.net
writes:
Is it possible to submit a picture to the list showing what you have done to
make the Mitsubishi starter useable? Maybe a word description?
Thanks ...
Jerry
RV4
In a message dated 8/1/2008 3:38:31 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
_jsflyrv(at)verizon.net_ (mailto:jsflyrv(at)verizon.net) writes:
Ditto. That has been my experience with those antiques. I welded a bracket
to adapt a Mitsubishi starter (looks like a skytec but got it free off a junk
car) and it has been great for the last 10 years.
Jim
Jerry;
I looked through my files and this pathetic photo is the only thing I
have. It is a permanent magnet gear reduction "nose-less" type of starter that
I remember getting out of a Mitsubishi. They should be easy to come by
because the engines and frames usually fall apart and all that's left is the
starter. It has 2 mounting ears and I made a flat plate with holes, that mounts
to
the spot where the original starter went on my 0-360. I welded 2 ears onto
the plate with a tube (for bolts) on each ear. You have to get this part right
for the correct gear engagement. There is a small support "tang" on the back
of the plate that rests on the back of the starter so the drive won't push
out of the flywheel teeth when engaged. It weighs about half as much as the
stock starter so keep weight and balance in mind. It spins the engine about
twice as fast which may cause a problem as mine did. It spun just fast enough
that the magneto impulse coupler would not engage. I had to lighten the fly
weights in the magneto. Works great now.
One other thing; shortly after I put it in the starter drive clutch
started to slip. A replacement drive was outrageous but the Mitsubishi drive can
be disassembled. I removed the worn cam rollers and bought a drill blank a
few thousandths larger. Cut it up and used them as replacement rollers. That
was 10 years ago and it still works perfect.
Jim
**************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget?
Read reviews on AOL Autos.
(http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Boyd" <sportav8r(at)gmail.com> |
Funny you should mention that! My present A200 has lost both the smaller
rubber rings (tuning and volume)to dry-rot/UV damage. I need replacements
to get that nice "feel" back, although the knobs do turn okay without the
grip rings.
I guess I can at least save shipping ordering them along with the switch
unit.
-Bill B
On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 4:39 PM, RV6 Flyer wrote:
> At Oshkosh AirVenture 2008, I asked Icom about how to replace the rubber
> on the knobs. They gave me one of the rubber rings for one of the knobs on
> the spot. They would have given me all of them if they had them. They had a
> good selection but not everything. They gave me a business card with a
> phone number to call so that I can get all of the replacement rubber parts.
>
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> 2,142.6 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tom sargent <sarg314(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | vm1000 DPU orientation |
I have an old Vision Micro VM1000. Does any one recall if there is any
orientation restriction on the DPU (digital processor unit) box? The
manual doesn't indicate any preference, but the thing does have some
socketed parts in it, which will be upside down if I mount it the way I
want to.
Thanks,
--
Tom S., RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: vm1000 DPU orientation |
When I had mine in (and didn't fly with it) - I mounted it so access to the
cable disconects was easiest....worked fine on the ground....
I didn't see any restrictions....
----- Original Message -----
From: "tom sargent" <sarg314(at)comcast.net>
Sent: Saturday, August 02, 2008 3:01 AM
Subject: RV-List: vm1000 DPU orientation
>
> I have an old Vision Micro VM1000. Does any one recall if there is any
> orientation restriction on the DPU (digital processor unit) box? The
> manual doesn't indicate any preference, but the thing does have some
> socketed parts in it, which will be upside down if I mount it the way I
> want to.
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Tom S., RV-6A
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Wanted to buy 2 Parachutes-Cash |
Hi guys,
Anyone interested in selling a set of parachutes?
I had 2 parachutes lined up to buy from a friend for my Yak-52, but he
decided to keep all 4 of his chutes, so I'm back to trying to find 2 used seat
chutes that someone out there no longer needs or might want to unload for cash.
My wife is pregnant and is putting the squeeze on me to have parachutes when
I fly the Yak.
If anyone knows of someone that would like to sell their used chutes please
have them contact me off the matronics list directly via my email which is
_sd737(at)aol.com_ (mailto:sd737(at)aol.com)
Again, please email me directly.
Thanks guys,
Scott Douglass
Reno, Nv
_sd737(at)aol.com_ (mailto:sd737(at)aol.com)
**************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget?
Read reviews on AOL Autos.
(http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Bryan" <n616tb(at)btsapps.com> |
| Subject: | vm1000 DPU orientation |
Hi Tom,
I don't recall there being any orientation to the DPU but there isn't
anything inside that would matter. I have been inside mine to change a
circuit board and there isn't anything but electronics. You probably
already know this, but there isn't much support or parts available for the
VM1000 anymore. The company website had said they were forced to move to
Texas last year and now it says they have moved to Costa Mesa, Ca. The
original owner who knew anything about the VM1000 left the company
unexpectedly. Have you checked on the ability to upgrade the unit to their
latest product? The newer VM 1000C is less money and better product. If
mine had not been already installed I would have tried to upgrade it. Just
a thought.
Tim Bryan
RV-6 Flying
N616TB over 100 hours now
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-
> server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of tom sargent
> Sent: Saturday, August 02, 2008 2:01 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: vm1000 DPU orientation
>
>
> I have an old Vision Micro VM1000. Does any one recall if there is any
> orientation restriction on the DPU (digital processor unit) box? The
> manual doesn't indicate any preference, but the thing does have some
> socketed parts in it, which will be upside down if I mount it the way I
> want to.
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Tom S., RV-6A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Gray" <Bruce(at)glasair.org> |
| Subject: | vm1000 DPU orientation |
If you have an older VM1000C, JPI will upgrade it to the new VM1000C for
free. The new one is a JPI EMD900 in the VM1000C case.
Bruce
www.Glasair.org
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Bryan
Sent: Sunday, August 03, 2008 11:44 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: vm1000 DPU orientation
Hi Tom,
I don't recall there being any orientation to the DPU but there isn't
anything inside that would matter. I have been inside mine to change a
circuit board and there isn't anything but electronics. You probably
already know this, but there isn't much support or parts available for the
VM1000 anymore. The company website had said they were forced to move to
Texas last year and now it says they have moved to Costa Mesa, Ca. The
original owner who knew anything about the VM1000 left the company
unexpectedly. Have you checked on the ability to upgrade the unit to their
latest product? The newer VM 1000C is less money and better product. If
mine had not been already installed I would have tried to upgrade it. Just
a thought.
Tim Bryan
RV-6 Flying
N616TB over 100 hours now
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-
> server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of tom sargent
> Sent: Saturday, August 02, 2008 2:01 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: vm1000 DPU orientation
>
>
> I have an old Vision Micro VM1000. Does any one recall if there is
> any orientation restriction on the DPU (digital processor unit) box?
> The manual doesn't indicate any preference, but the thing does have
> some socketed parts in it, which will be upside down if I mount it the
> way I want to.
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Tom S., RV-6A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Leaking QB Tanks |
| From: | James H Nelson <rv9jim(at)juno.com> |
List:
I have a QB RV9-A and I have a leaking left tank. The unusual part is-
the pro seal is softening with the 100LL. On the spar end of the last
rib, the leak begins about half the way down and around the bottom and
almost to the leading edge. The pro seal is soft enough to act like
grease. You can wipe it from the aluminum skin. Not firm and stiff
like it is suppose to. I keep my tanks full after every flight so the
whole rib is subjected to fuel. It is only on the left tank and the
right one is fine. My guru / EAA inspector here has had two tanks which
leaked on other QB RV's. He is building a 9-A also and they all have
passed the balloon test. But he is now questioning the pro seal on his
tanks. Has any others had the same problem? I hope I can clean the pro
seal away and put on some new sealant and stop the problem. A message is
going to Van's also about my problem.
Jim Nelson
RV9-A
N15JN (5 hours)
____________________________________________________________
Play it loud with a new car stereo! Click here!
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3n6nDMYKsoIPPJLox55cJRk0c37EpWd00895opHbzZFHtA4j/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tom sargent <sarg314(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: vm1000 DPU orientation |
Bruce:
I didn't know that (kind of late for me since all the sensors are
installed). Doesn't the newer unit use a different type of sensor?
You'd be starting from scratch to switch to the new unit.
Here is a lesson to all builders: Delay the purchase of your
electronics/avionics as long as possible. I bought my vm1000 early
because I was offered a deal on it. Big mistake. (Well, I have to
admit that taking 10 years to finish the project gives you more
opportunities to make such mistakes.)
--
Tom S., RV-6A
Bruce Gray wrote:
>
> If you have an older VM1000C, JPI will upgrade it to the new VM1000C for
> free. The new one is a JPI EMD900 in the VM1000C case.
>
> Bruce
> www.Glasair.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Pardue <n5lp(at)warpdriveonline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Leaking QB Tanks |
On Aug 3, 2008, at 3:09 PM, James H Nelson wrote:
>
> List:
> I have a QB RV9-A and I have a leaking left tank. The unusual part
> is-
> the pro seal is softening with the 100LL. On the spar end of the last
> rib, the leak begins about half the way down and around the bottom and
> almost to the leading edge. The pro seal is soft enough to act like
> grease. You can wipe it from the aluminum skin. Not firm and stiff
> like it is suppose to...Has any others had the same problem?
Exactly what happened to my quick-build tank. Pictures here http://
www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=26159&highlight=sealant
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Leaking QB Tanks |
Gentlemen,
This problem is not just related to the relatively new quick-build
tanks. Last week I found the same problem with one of the fuel tanks on
an RV-4 (1993) I recently purchased. The previous owner (original
builder) repaired a small leak in the tank a few years ago and is very
confident that the pro-seal he applied was done correctly. We were both
very surprised to find most of the pro-seal on the lower portion of the
tank soft and gooey. The pro-seal on the upper portion of the tank is
still hard. Another local builder had the same problem with one of his
-8 QB tanks. It appears that this is a somewhat common problem on tanks
that have been leaking for an extended period of time. I found the
following comments on another RV list:
The proseal on my lhs wing inner rib has gone totally sticky [can smear
it off with a finger] after flying with a leaking tank for 2 months. The
wings are quickbuilt and the inspection cover was leaking. Avgas has
leaked onto the factory applied proseal on the bottom of the inner rib.
[just below the cover]
I queried this with Vans and they said that the blue dye in avgas and
oxygen cause the proseal to soften. I cannot argue with them, but they
couldnt explain why this happened.
The proseal that did not have fuel leaking on it is ok.
I know I should have attended to the leak sooner, but flying was more
important at the time. Had I known I would have taken care of it sooner.
What I still dont understand is why the proseal went totally soft. Can
anyone explain ??
Gus at Vans said that there are no fuel fumes on the outside of the
tank, so as the fuel drips onto the proseal, it evaporates and leaves
the blue dye behind. This will lead to the proseal becoming soft and
sticky and resembles uncured proseal. At least this is how I understand it.
I asked how its possible because it is a fuel sealer, and he said they
are not quite sure.
Basically they say its my fault, [which I wont dispute as the inspection
cover had weeped fuel for 2 months] ,but i still would like a technical
explanation why this happened.[ie why the proseal softened]
Either way I have to sort it out.
It is the bead of proseal from the leading edge to the rear spar on the
outside of the inner rib that has gone soft.
I've seen this on a re-seal job that was done on our Cessna Cardinal. I
scraped it all out of our tanks and reapplied with new/good proseal.
That is NOT normal, don't believe Van's on this one.
Vans has been promising to speak to their supplier to get me the facts.
I have been patiently waiting for a answer ,but none yet. The clearly
told me they mixed it correctly and that it was my fault it went
soft.[fuel shouldnt leak on it]
I dont want to make a issue about it, but feel a bit short changed at
the moment. Vans has always been great about sorting out issues. I
wonder why they are avoiding this one ??
As I said before, if its my fault ,so be it. However everyone I speak to
says its not, and Vans doesnt seem to agree.
My plan is to gently scrape & wipe off the soft stuff, scratch up the
aluminum surface, and re-apply fresh pro-seal I purchased from Van's.
Regards,
Doug Morrison
RV-4 (N818WW)
RV-8A (N666NJ Reserved) (In the process of converting to a -8)
Larry Pardue wrote:
>
>
> On Aug 3, 2008, at 3:09 PM, James H Nelson wrote:
>
>>
>> List:
>> I have a QB RV9-A and I have a leaking left tank. The unusual part is-
>> the pro seal is softening with the 100LL. On the spar end of the last
>> rib, the leak begins about half the way down and around the bottom and
>> almost to the leading edge. The pro seal is soft enough to act like
>> grease. You can wipe it from the aluminum skin. Not firm and stiff
>> like it is suppose to...Has any others had the same problem?
>
>
> Exactly what happened to my quick-build tank. Pictures here http://
> www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=26159&highlight=sealant
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RICHARD MILLER <rickpegser(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Leaking QB Tanks |
proseal applied and cured per the spec does not disolve with 100ll. so what
happened.
-
are you using marvel mystry oil. or any other fuel additive.
-
-if not i would have to think that the proseal was stored improperly or o
ut of date. excessive heat and time will screwup- proseal still in the ca
n. since this is a quick build with only 5 hrs on it. i would be requesting
two new tanks since the other was probably built with the same bad proseal
. and a payment for the cost of painting. remember all of the material for
the q biuld are shipped ocean cargo to the pi. and without climate controll
s on the container. it is quite possible that the material saw in excess of
150 degrees inside the container.
-
please tell us what happens, if vans does not stand behind thier q builds i
t might be a good time to have the local faa give them a chat.
-
i have repaired more of this type of tank then you can shake a stick at, so
call me if you have to do it yourself. be happy to help with advice.
-
ps
i am replacing the bonded doublers on a exec helicopter rotor blades right
now , it is my thought that the epoxy used was probably out of date and fai
led as a result. having way to much fun removing it.
-
rick miller
559-270-7113
a+p, i/a
-
--- On Sun, 8/3/08, Doug Morrison <rv8a.doug@net-lynx.com> wrote:
From: Doug Morrison <rv8a.doug@net-lynx.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Leaking QB Tanks
Date: Sunday, August 3, 2008, 4:41 PM
Gentlemen,
This problem is not just related to the relatively new quick-build tanks. L
ast week I found the same problem with one of the fuel tanks on an RV-4 (19
93) I recently purchased. The previous owner (original builder) repaired a
small leak in the tank a few years ago and is very confident that the pro-s
eal he applied was done correctly. We were both very surprised to find most
of the pro-seal on the lower portion of the tank soft and gooey. The pro-s
eal on the upper portion of the tank is still hard. Another local builder h
ad the same problem with one of his -8 QB tanks. It appears that this is a
somewhat common problem on tanks that have been leaking for an extended per
iod of time. I found the following comments on another RV list:
The proseal on my lhs wing inner rib has gone totally sticky [can smear it
off with a finger] after flying with a leaking tank for 2 months. The wings
are quickbuilt and the inspection cover was leaking. Avgas has leaked onto
the factory applied proseal on the bottom of the inner rib. [just below th
e cover]
I queried this with Vans and they said that the blue dye in avgas and oxyge
n cause the proseal to soften. I cannot argue with them, but they couldnt e
xplain why this happened.
The proseal that did not have fuel leaking on it is ok.
I know I should have attended to the leak sooner, but flying was more impor
tant at the time. Had I known I would have taken care of it sooner.
What I still dont understand is why the proseal went totally soft. Can anyo
ne explain ??
Gus at Vans said that there are no fuel fumes on the outside of the tank, s
o as the fuel drips onto the proseal, it evaporates and leaves the blue dye
behind. This will lead to the proseal becoming soft and sticky and resembl
es uncured proseal. At least this is how I understand it.
I asked how its possible because it is a fuel sealer, and he said they are
not quite sure.
Basically they say its my fault, [which I wont dispute as the inspection co
ver had weeped fuel for 2 months] ,but i still would like a technical expla
nation why this happened.[ie why the proseal softened]
Either way I have to sort it out.
It is the bead of proseal from the leading edge to the rear spar on the out
side of the inner rib that has gone soft.
I've seen this on a re-seal job that was done on our Cessna Cardinal. I scr
aped it all out of our tanks and reapplied with new/good proseal. That is N
OT normal, don't believe Van's on this one.
Vans has been promising to speak to their supplier to get me the facts. I h
ave been patiently waiting for a answer ,but none yet. The clearly told me
they mixed it correctly and that it was my fault it went soft.[fuel shouldn
t leak on it]
I dont want to make a issue about it, but feel a bit short changed at the m
oment. Vans has always been great about sorting out issues. I wonder why th
ey are avoiding this one ??
As I said before, if its my fault ,so be it. However everyone I speak to sa
ys its not, and Vans doesnt seem to agree.
My plan is to gently scrape & wipe off the soft stuff, scratch up the alumi
num surface, and re-apply fresh pro-seal I purchased from Van's.
Regards,
Doug Morrison
RV-4 (N818WW)
RV-8A (N666NJ Reserved) (In the process of converting to a -8)
Larry Pardue wrote:
On Aug 3, 2008, at 3:09 PM, James H Nelson wrote:
List:
I have a QB RV9-A and I have a leaking left tank.- The unusual part- is
-
the pro seal is softening with the 100LL.- On the spar end of the last
rib, the leak begins about half the way down and around the bottom and
almost to the leading edge.- The pro seal is soft enough to act like
grease.- You can wipe it from the aluminum- skin.- Not firm and stiff
like it is suppose to...Has any others had the same problem?
Exactly what happened to my quick-build tank. Pictures here http:// www.van
sairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=26159&highlight=sealant
=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Leaking QB Tanks |
Any chance mogas was used in any of these tanks? I've seen Proseal
reduced to jelly/peanut butter by mogas.
Doug Morrison wrote:
> Gentlemen,
>
> This problem is not just related to the relatively new quick-build
> tanks. Last week I found the same problem with one of the fuel tanks
> on an RV-4 (1993) I recently purchased. The previous owner (original
> builder) repaired a small leak in the tank a few years ago and is very
> confident that the pro-seal he applied was done correctly. We were
> both very surprised to find most of the pro-seal on the lower portion
> of the tank soft and gooey. The pro-seal on the upper portion of the
> tank is still hard. Another local builder had the same problem with
> one of his -8 QB tanks. It appears that this is a somewhat common
> problem on tanks that have been leaking for an extended period of
> time. I found the following comments on another RV list:
>
> The proseal on my lhs wing inner rib has gone totally sticky [can
> smear it off with a finger] after flying with a leaking tank for 2
> months. The wings are quickbuilt and the inspection cover was leaking.
> Avgas has leaked onto the factory applied proseal on the bottom of the
> inner rib. [just below the cover]
> I queried this with Vans and they said that the blue dye in avgas and
> oxygen cause the proseal to soften. I cannot argue with them, but they
> couldnt explain why this happened.
> The proseal that did not have fuel leaking on it is ok.
> I know I should have attended to the leak sooner, but flying was more
> important at the time. Had I known I would have taken care of it sooner.
> What I still dont understand is why the proseal went totally soft. Can
> anyone explain ??
>
> Gus at Vans said that there are no fuel fumes on the outside of the
> tank, so as the fuel drips onto the proseal, it evaporates and leaves
> the blue dye behind. This will lead to the proseal becoming soft and
> sticky and resembles uncured proseal. At least this is how I
> understand it.
> I asked how its possible because it is a fuel sealer, and he said they
> are not quite sure.
> Basically they say its my fault, [which I wont dispute as the
> inspection cover had weeped fuel for 2 months] ,but i still would like
> a technical explanation why this happened.[ie why the proseal softened]
> Either way I have to sort it out.
> It is the bead of proseal from the leading edge to the rear spar on
> the outside of the inner rib that has gone soft.
>
> I've seen this on a re-seal job that was done on our Cessna Cardinal.
> I scraped it all out of our tanks and reapplied with new/good proseal.
> That is NOT normal, don't believe Van's on this one.
>
> Vans has been promising to speak to their supplier to get me the
> facts. I have been patiently waiting for a answer ,but none yet. The
> clearly told me they mixed it correctly and that it was my fault it
> went soft.[fuel shouldnt leak on it]
> I dont want to make a issue about it, but feel a bit short changed at
> the moment. Vans has always been great about sorting out issues. I
> wonder why they are avoiding this one ??
> As I said before, if its my fault ,so be it. However everyone I speak
> to says its not, and Vans doesnt seem to agree.
>
>
> My plan is to gently scrape & wipe off the soft stuff, scratch up the
> aluminum surface, and re-apply fresh pro-seal I purchased from Van's.
>
> Regards,
>
> Doug Morrison
>
> RV-4 (N818WW)
> RV-8A (N666NJ Reserved) (In the process of converting to a -8)
>
>
> Larry Pardue wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Aug 3, 2008, at 3:09 PM, James H Nelson wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> List:
>>> I have a QB RV9-A and I have a leaking left tank. The unusual part
>>> is-
>>> the pro seal is softening with the 100LL. On the spar end of the last
>>> rib, the leak begins about half the way down and around the bottom and
>>> almost to the leading edge. The pro seal is soft enough to act like
>>> grease. You can wipe it from the aluminum skin. Not firm and stiff
>>> like it is suppose to...Has any others had the same problem?
>>
>> Exactly what happened to my quick-build tank. Pictures here http://
>> www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=26159&highlight=sealant
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton01(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Leaking QB Tanks |
On 3 Aug 2008, at 20:50, RICHARD MILLER wrote:
> please tell us what happens, if vans does not stand behind thier q
> builds it might be a good time to have the local faa give them a chat.
>
These are not type-certificated aircraft, so FAR 39 (Airworthiness
Directives) does not apply. If the local FAA wanted to talk to Van's
about this, which FAR subparagraph should they discuss?
--
Kevin Horton
RV-8 (FInal Assembly)
Ottawa, Canada
http://www.kilohotel.com/rv8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Pardue <n5lp(at)warpdriveonline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Leaking QB Tanks |
On Aug 3, 2008, at 7:11 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
>
> Any chance mogas was used in any of these tanks? I've seen Proseal
> reduced to jelly/peanut butter by mogas.
My tanks have never had anything in them but 100LL avgas.
Larry Pardue
>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Exactly what happened to my quick-build tank. Pictures here
>>> http:// www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?
>>> t=26159&highlight=sealant
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Leaking QB Tanks |
RICHARD MILLER wrote:
>
> time to have the local faa give them a chat.
>
>
> rick miller
> 559-270-7113
> a+p, i/a
>
Give them a chat, what for? The FAA did not build it.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Leaking QB Tanks |
List,
I'll use Richard's message to answer his and John's, Kelly's, &
Kevin's. Remember the comment in red below are from a Vansairforce.net
thread. They are not my comments.
1) Use of a plastic scraper and MEK to remove the soft pro-seal sounds
like a good idea.
2) I am fairly confident that oil additives and mogas have never been
used in my -4 (circa 1993) or my friends -8 QB. The only commonality is
that the tanks were leaking for an extended period of time.
3) The previous owner of my -4 is fairly confident that the pro-seal he
used was fresh and mixed in the proper ratio.
4) The pro-seal on the QB tanks of the -8A I have under construction is
full cured. Only time will tell if the pro-seal will soften up when
exposed to fuel in the tank.
5) I am very satisfied with the workmanship of my -8A QB. If the tanks
begin to leak due to outdated pro-seal used at the time of manufacturer,
I will fix the problem and move on. Of course I will advise Van's of the
problem so they can revise their manufacture procedure and hopefully
prevent the problem in the future. To be safe, I will probably fill the
tanks with fuel (with the tanks off the wing) and let them sit for a few
months before I begin painting and final assembly. Any leaks or pro-seal
softening should show up during that time.
As far as I am concerned, the -8A kit is a real bargain, even with the
inevitable anomalies. Each of you will have to decide if you want to
press the issue with Van's. Personally, I am prepared to accept a few
minor problems and just move on. Also, getting the FAA involved would be
the last thing I would do.
Thanks for everyone's comments.
Regards,
Doug Morrison
RICHARD MILLER wrote:
> proseal applied and cured per the spec does not disolve with 100ll. so
> what happened.
>
> are you using marvel mystry oil. or any other fuel additive.
>
> if not i would have to think that the proseal was stored improperly
> or out of date. excessive heat and time will screwup proseal still in
> the can. since this is a quick build with only 5 hrs on it. i would be
> requesting two new tanks since the other was probably built with the
> same bad proseal. and a payment for the cost of painting. remember all
> of the material for the q biuld are shipped ocean cargo to the pi. and
> without climate controlls on the container. it is quite possible that
> the material saw in excess of 150 degrees inside the container.
>
> please tell us what happens, if vans does not stand behind thier q
> builds it might be a good time to have the local faa give them a chat.
>
> i have repaired more of this type of tank then you can shake a stick
> at, so call me if you have to do it yourself. be happy to help with
> advice.
>
> ps
> i am replacing the bonded doublers on a exec helicopter rotor blades
> right now , it is my thought that the epoxy used was probably out of
> date and failed as a result. having way to much fun removing it.
>
> rick miller
> 559-270-7113
> a+p, i/a
>
>
>
> --- On Sun, 8/3/08, Doug Morrison <rv8a.doug@net-lynx.com> wrote:
>
> From: Doug Morrison <rv8a.doug@net-lynx.com>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Leaking QB Tanks
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Sunday, August 3, 2008, 4:41 PM
>
> Gentlemen,
>
> This problem is not just related to the relatively new quick-build
> tanks. Last week I found the same problem with one of the fuel
> tanks on an RV-4 (1993) I recently purchased. The previous owner
> (original builder) repaired a small leak in the tank a few years
> ago and is very confident that the pro-seal he applied was done
> correctly. We were both very surprised to find most of the
> pro-seal on the lower portion of the tank soft and gooey. The
> pro-seal on the upper portion of the tank is still hard. Another
> local builder had the same problem with one of his -8 QB tanks. It
> appears that this is a somewhat common problem on tanks that have
> been leaking for an extended period of time. I found the following
> comments on another RV list:
>
> The proseal on my lhs wing inner rib has gone totally sticky [can
> smear it off with a finger] after flying with a leaking tank for 2
> months. The wings are quickbuilt and the inspection cover was
> leaking. Avgas has leaked onto the factory applied proseal on the
> bottom of the inner rib. [just below the cover]
> I queried this with Vans and they said that the blue dye in avgas
> and oxygen cause the proseal to soften. I cannot argue with them,
> but they couldnt explain why this happened.
> The proseal that did not have fuel leaking on it is ok.
> I know I should have attended to the leak sooner, but flying was
> more important at the time. Had I known I would have taken care of
> it sooner.
> What I still dont understand is why the proseal went totally soft.
> Can anyone explain ??
>
> Gus at Vans said that there are no fuel fumes on the outside of
> the tank, so as the fuel drips onto the proseal, it evaporates and
> leaves the blue dye behind. This will lead to the proseal becoming
> soft and sticky and resembles uncured proseal. At least this is
> how I understand it.
> I asked how its possible because it is a fuel sealer, and he said
> they are not quite sure.
> Basically they say its my fault, [which I wont dispute as the
> inspection cover had weeped fuel for 2 months] ,but i still would
> like a technical explanation why this happened.[ie why the proseal
> softened]
> Either way I have to sort it out.
> It is the bead of proseal from the leading edge to the rear spar
> on the outside of the inner rib that has gone soft.
>
> I've seen this on a re-seal job that was done on our Cessna
> Cardinal. I scraped it all out of our tanks and reapplied with
> new/good proseal. That is NOT normal, don't believe Van's on this one.
>
> Vans has been promising to speak to their supplier to get me the
> facts. I have been patiently waiting for a answer ,but none yet.
> The clearly told me they mixed it correctly and that it was my
> fault it went soft.[fuel shouldnt leak on it]
> I dont want to make a issue about it, but feel a bit short changed
> at the moment. Vans has always been great about sorting out
> issues. I wonder why they are avoiding this one ??
> As I said before, if its my fault ,so be it. However everyone I
> speak to says its not, and Vans doesnt seem to agree.
>
>
> My plan is to gently scrape & wipe off the soft stuff, scratch up
> the aluminum surface, and re-apply fresh pro-seal I purchased from
> Van's.
>
> Regards,
>
> Doug Morrison
>
> RV-4 (N818WW)
> RV-8A (N666NJ Reserved) (In the process of converting to a -8)
>
>
> Larry Pardue wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Aug 3, 2008, at 3:09 PM, James H Nelson wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> List:
>>> I have a QB RV9-A and I have a leaking left tank. The unusual
>>> part is-
>>> the pro seal is softening with the 100LL. On the spar end of
>>> the last
>>> rib, the leak begins about half the way down and around the
>>> bottom and
>>> almost to the leading edge. The pro seal is soft enough to act
>>> like
>>> grease. You can wipe it from the aluminum skin. Not firm and
>>> stiff
>>> like it is suppose to...Has any others had the same problem?
>>
>>
>> Exactly what happened to my quick-build tank. Pictures here
>> http://
>> www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=26159&highlight=sealant
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Heathco" <cheathco(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Leaking QB Tanks |
Wanted to comment on the Mogas reducing proseal to PBJ. My plane has run
on mogas since first flight 8 yrs ago, no leaks, no sign of leaks.
Charles
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Bryan" <n616tb(at)btsapps.com> |
| Subject: | Leaking QB Tanks |
>>proseal applied and cured per the spec does not disolve with 100ll. so
what happened. <<
I am pretty sure the response quoted from Vans was the die in 100ll causes
the problem when a leak is allowed to persist. This is actually pretty good
information for us all to realize if true. I would be definitely concerned
if they said 100ll caused it. But that isn't what I read in the post.
Tim Bryan
RV-6 Flying
N616TB over 100 hours now
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Leaking QB Tanks |
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
Repeating something posted a long time ago. ProSeal is a trademarked
name and is often generically used in conversation to identify tank
sealant(much like Scotch Tape or Kleenex). The product is PolySulfate
Thixotrophic. Most of the stuff Van's sells is sealant but is not
ProSeal. ProSeal comes in scores of product viscosities of A, B and C
and various temperature and adhesion formulations (which are numbered).
When Kelly mentions proseal turning to putty, it was probably
Flamemaster and was not formulated for MOGAS. I am confident I can find
a Desoto "ProSeal" (tm) which can withstand MOGAS. I will do some
research and do a trial on the stuff.
There has been poor reporting on what products will hold up to MOGAS.
Fixing a leaking tank is a serious enough issue to get to the root and
remediate.
John Cox
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doug Morrison
Sent: Sunday, August 03, 2008 7:37 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Leaking QB Tanks
List,
I'll use Richard's message to answer his and John's, Kelly's, &
Kevin's. Remember the comment in red below are from a Vansairforce.net
thread. They are not my comments.
1) Use of a plastic scraper and MEK to remove the soft pro-seal sounds
like a good idea.
2) I am fairly confident that oil additives and mogas have never been
used in my -4 (circa 1993) or my friends -8 QB. The only commonality is
that the tanks were leaking for an extended period of time.
3) The previous owner of my -4 is fairly confident that the pro-seal he
used was fresh and mixed in the proper ratio.
4) The pro-seal on the QB tanks of the -8A I have under construction is
full cured. Only time will tell if the pro-seal will soften up when
exposed to fuel in the tank.
5) I am very satisfied with the workmanship of my -8A QB. If the tanks
begin to leak due to outdated pro-seal used at the time of manufacturer,
I will fix the problem and move on. Of course I will advise Van's of the
problem so they can revise their manufacture procedure and hopefully
prevent the problem in the future. To be safe, I will probably fill the
tanks with fuel (with the tanks off the wing) and let them sit for a few
months before I begin painting and final assembly. Any leaks or pro-seal
softening should show up during that time.
As far as I am concerned, the -8A kit is a real bargain, even with the
inevitable anomalies. Each of you will have to decide if you want to
press the issue with Van's. Personally, I am prepared to accept a few
minor problems and just move on. Also, getting the FAA involved would be
the last thing I would do.
Thanks for everyone's comments.
Regards,
Doug Morrison
RICHARD MILLER wrote:
proseal applied and cured per the spec does not disolve with 100ll. so
what happened.
are you using marvel mystry oil. or any other fuel additive.
if not i would have to think that the proseal was stored improperly or
out of date. excessive heat and time will screwup proseal still in the
can. since this is a quick build with only 5 hrs on it. i would be
requesting two new tanks since the other was probably built with the
same bad proseal. and a payment for the cost of painting. remember all
of the material for the q biuld are shipped ocean cargo to the pi. and
without climate controlls on the container. it is quite possible that
the material saw in excess of 150 degrees inside the container.
please tell us what happens, if vans does not stand behind thier q
builds it might be a good time to have the local faa give them a chat.
i have repaired more of this type of tank then you can shake a stick at,
so call me if you have to do it yourself. be happy to help with advice.
ps
i am replacing the bonded doublers on a exec helicopter rotor blades
right now , it is my thought that the epoxy used was probably out of
date and failed as a result. having way to much fun removing it.
rick miller
559-270-7113
a+p, i/a
--- On Sun, 8/3/08, Doug Morrison <rv8a.doug@net-lynx.com>
rv8a.doug@net-lynx.com> wrote:
From: Doug Morrison <rv8a.doug@net-lynx.com>
rv8a.doug@net-lynx.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Leaking QB Tanks
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Sunday, August 3, 2008, 4:41 PM
Gentlemen,
This problem is not just related to the relatively new
quick-build tanks. Last week I found the same problem with one of the
fuel tanks on an RV-4 (1993) I recently purchased. The previous owner
(original builder) repaired a small leak in the tank a few years ago and
is very confident that the pro-seal he applied was done correctly. We
were both very surprised to find most of the pro-seal on the lower
portion of the tank soft and gooey. The pro-seal on the upper portion of
the tank is still hard. Another local builder had the same problem with
one of his -8 QB tanks. It appears that this is a somewhat common
problem on tanks that have been leaking for an extended period of time.
I found the following comments on another RV list:
The proseal on my lhs wing inner rib has gone totally sticky
[can smear it off with a finger] after flying with a leaking tank for 2
months. The wings are quickbuilt and the inspection cover was leaking.
Avgas has leaked onto the factory applied proseal on the bottom of the
inner rib. [just below the cover]
I queried this with Vans and they said that the blue dye in
avgas and oxygen cause the proseal to soften. I cannot argue with them,
but they couldnt explain why this happened.
The proseal that did not have fuel leaking on it is ok.
I know I should have attended to the leak sooner, but flying was
more important at the time. Had I known I would have taken care of it
sooner.
What I still dont understand is why the proseal went totally
soft. Can anyone explain ??
Gus at Vans said that there are no fuel fumes on the outside of
the tank, so as the fuel drips onto the proseal, it evaporates and
leaves the blue dye behind. This will lead to the proseal becoming soft
and sticky and resembles uncured proseal. At least this is how I
understand it.
I asked how its possible because it is a fuel sealer, and he
said they are not quite sure.
Basically they say its my fault, [which I wont dispute as the
inspection cover had weeped fuel for 2 months] ,but i still would like a
technical explanation why this happened.[ie why the proseal softened]
Either way I have to sort it out.
It is the bead of proseal from the leading edge to the rear spar
on the outside of the inner rib that has gone soft.
I've seen this on a re-seal job that was done on our Cessna
Cardinal. I scraped it all out of our tanks and reapplied with new/good
proseal. That is NOT normal, don't believe Van's on this one.
Vans has been promising to speak to their supplier to get me the
facts. I have been patiently waiting for a answer ,but none yet. The
clearly told me they mixed it correctly and that it was my fault it went
soft.[fuel shouldnt leak on it]
I dont want to make a issue about it, but feel a bit short
changed at the moment. Vans has always been great about sorting out
issues. I wonder why they are avoiding this one ??
As I said before, if its my fault ,so be it. However everyone I
speak to says its not, and Vans doesnt seem to agree.
My plan is to gently scrape & wipe off the soft stuff, scratch
up the aluminum surface, and re-apply fresh pro-seal I purchased from
Van's.
Regards,
Doug Morrison
RV-4 (N818WW)
RV-8A (N666NJ Reserved) (In the process of converting to a -8)
Larry Pardue wrote:
On Aug 3, 2008, at 3:09 PM, James H Nelson wrote:
List:
I have a QB RV9-A and I have a leaking left tank. The unusual
part is-
the pro seal is softening with the 100LL. On the spar end of
the last
rib, the leak begins about half the way down and around the
bottom and
almost to the leading edge. The pro seal is soft enough to act
like
grease. You can wipe it from the aluminum skin. Not firm and
stiff
like it is suppose to...Has any others had the same problem?
Exactly what happened to my quick-build tank. Pictures here
http://
www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=26159&highlight=seala
nt
href="3D%22http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List%22">http://www.ma
t
ronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Meyette" <bmeyette(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Leaking QB Tanks |
I talked to a tech at ProSeal a few years ago about expiration dates. As
he described it, the only problem older ProSeal will cause is extended
curing time. So, it would seem to me that , if it cured, then it's not a
problem with expiration date. I'd suggest a direct call to the ProSeal
people to ask about this problem .
_____
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RICHARD MILLER
Sent: Sunday, August 03, 2008 8:50 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Leaking QB Tanks
proseal applied and cured per the spec does not disolve with 100ll. so what
happened.
are you using marvel mystry oil. or any other fuel additive.
if not i would have to think that the proseal was stored improperly or out
July 06, 2008 - - - - , 20-
RV-Archive.digest.vol-to