Zenith-Archive.digest.vol-dd
November 18, 2002 - December 15, 2002
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rico Voss <vozzen(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Deburring Techniques |
> Thanks for the Vixen file links. At around $20 a
> pop,
Vixen files are available at AirParts, Inc, of Kansas
City (800-800-3229) for about $6-8, as well as full
line of speciality parts and materials.
I would NOT recommend de-burring with a Vixen, as it
tears into aluminum like a dog tears into a bone. If
the sheet can lay flat, use a fine file, slide gently
over the hole line. Otherwise the
hand-twist-the-drillbit technique.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi> |
| Subject: | Re: Deburring Techniques |
>Otherwise the hand-twist-the-drillbit technique.
Works best for me! And won't take too much time either...
-Jari
www.project-ch701.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | 601 HDS, 912 Performance Status |
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
With elliptical maingear wheel fairings and a 68" Warp Drive, ground-adjustable,
tapered 2-blade prop, I clocked 115. knots, GPS averaged, (132 mph) @ 5,500'
MSL in level max cruise, 5,500-5,600 rpm. The blades are set @ 27.5 degrees
at the inner end of the Ni leading edge. I did it twice to be sure I wasn't seeing
what I wanted to.
It must be about time to redo the upper cowl to reduce the gaping fish-mouth; that
might get me another knot or so as well as improve over-the-nose visibility
a tad.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick <rick.pitcher(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Deburring Techniques |
Rico Voss wrote:
> I would NOT recommend de-burring with a Vixen, as it
> tears into aluminum like a dog tears into a bone. If
> the sheet can lay flat, use a fine file, slide gently
> over the hole line. Otherwise the
> hand-twist-the-drillbit technique.
Hmmm.... you must be digging in at an angle if you're tearing into the
aluminum. You need to lay the file flat on the row of holes and use a
very light pressure to remove the burrs. It goes quick and easy so you
don't need to gouge at it.
Don't use it if you don't think you can control the tool, but like I
said earlier: this is the way Lockehhed taught me to deburr holes on the
L-1011 back when I was a young pup :)
Rick P.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Deburring Techniques |
A fellow builder uses a battery powered screwdriver with a countersink bit - the
kind with a hole through it - chucked in it. The speed is slow enough so it can
be controlled and it avoids the finger cramping when deburring a lot of holes at
once.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Deburring Techniques
>
> >Otherwise the hand-twist-the-drillbit technique.
>
> Works best for me! And won't take too much time either...
>
> -Jari
> www.project-ch701.net
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi> |
| Subject: | CH701 Service "hole"... |
There is two short L-stiffeners both side of service "hole".
What is the correct position for these L-stiffeners?
Maybe I'm blind, but I can't figure this out before
constructing baggage compartment...
-Jari
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Deiterich" <cfd(at)thegateway.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Deburring Techniques |
I used a deburring tool see
http://www.browntool.com/productselect.asp?productid=205 And it worked
fine even on 4130 steel. It does not enlarge or countersink the holes and
leaves nice smooth edges.
Chuck D.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <thilo.kind(at)gmx.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 601 nose gear steering |
Hi Gary,
I had the same issue with the nose gear. Flaten out the V a little bit. Then
put the engine on. With the weight of the engine the bungee will be
depressed somewhat and steering will be very light.
Happy building
Thilo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
>
> George,
> I've added Delrin bearings at the nose gear top and bottom which don't
> require any
> serious modifications to plans construction. These are found on the gear
> and firewall sections
> of my web site if you're interested. They make considerable difference in
> the steering forces
> I agree, the cross tube is easier to rotate on a flat than with the
> bottoming slopes.
> I've made those guides horizontal. When you're on the ground the forces
are
> light
> and when the plane is aloft the bungees are working you, even without
nylon
> guides.
> Larry C. McFarland 601hds at http://www.macsmachine.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com>
> To:
> Subject: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
>
>
>
> >
> > I've just installed the nose gear bungee and the steering pushrods. With
> the
> > airplane still on a cradle and the nose wheel and rudder not installed
the
> > steering effort is so high that I'm afraid I'll break the rudder pedals
> > while I try to get it loosened up. I've loosened the upper stop plate so
> it
> > isn't rubbing on the shelf, and I've greased everything that moves. I
> think
> > the problem is the contact between the steering cross-tube on the strut
> and
> > the lower stops (6-F-10-1). My lower stops have somewhat less slope
than
> > the drawing shows.
> >
> > The only tri-gear Zodiac I've flown in had high pedal forces in flight,
> but
> > not while taxying. Rudder pedal forces seemed normal on the factory's
> > taildragger.
> >
> > Have any of the rest of you tri-gear Zodiac builders experienced this
> > problem, and if so, what did you do to improve the situation. I don't
want
> > to fly with such a stiff rudder control.
> >
> > I wonder if the rudder pedal reinforcement mod was made necessary by
> > excessive steering force on nose gear airplanes, or was it excessive
brake
> > pedal force?
> >
> > Your experience and advice will be much appreciated.
> >
> > George Swinford
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Deburring and vixen files |
For what it may be worth:
For deburring drilled holes I am using a 5/16 drill bit in a chuck that fits into
my cordless screwdriver. The cordless screwdriver turns slowly enough that
the drill bit doesn't countersink the hole appreciably. The chuck is an inexpensive
hardware store item.
I deburr sheet metal edges with an 8 inch mill file held at an angle to the edge.
For dressing down a cut edge on aluminum sheet, plate and extrusions I have had
good results using a laminate file, which is similar to a vixen but not quite
so aggressive at metal removal. It is really made for dressing the edge of Formica
sheets, I believe. It was less expensive than a vixen file, and easier to
find in the local hardware stores. I have used the same file throughout the
construction of my 601 airframe. It is 10 inches long, not counting the tang,
and carries the identification "Simonds Nucut USA Multi-kut".
George Swinford
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Maxson" <pmaxpmax(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 10 Msgs - 11/16/02 |
>Phil, what does your 'forward fuse' consist of?
>If it ends at the TE of center wing section, you should be alright. If it
>goes all the way to the tail then you need all longerons and skins
>mounted with as many clecos as you can get your hand on.
>As support the tail with something.
It is the full canoe, from the tail to the firewall. No skins on top. From
your reply and from others, I'll need to put the top skins on.
Phil Maxson
XL
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Ferris" <ferret(at)wmtel.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 601 nose gear steering |
I get a shimmy-type vibration in the nosewheel if my nosewheel is on the
ground above 60mph. I can hold it off to avoid this, however sometimes I
get it just as I rotate. Has anyone else dealt with this?
Greg
----- Original Message -----
From: <thilo.kind(at)gmx.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
>
> Hi Gary,
>
> I had the same issue with the nose gear. Flaten out the V a little bit.
Then
> put the engine on. With the weight of the engine the bungee will be
> depressed somewhat and steering will be very light.
>
> Happy building
>
> Thilo
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
>
>
>
> >
> > George,
> > I've added Delrin bearings at the nose gear top and bottom which don't
> > require any
> > serious modifications to plans construction. These are found on the
gear
> > and firewall sections
> > of my web site if you're interested. They make considerable difference
in
> > the steering forces
> > I agree, the cross tube is easier to rotate on a flat than with the
> > bottoming slopes.
> > I've made those guides horizontal. When you're on the ground the forces
> are
> > light
> > and when the plane is aloft the bungees are working you, even without
> nylon
> > guides.
> > Larry C. McFarland 601hds at http://www.macsmachine.com
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > I've just installed the nose gear bungee and the steering pushrods.
With
> > the
> > > airplane still on a cradle and the nose wheel and rudder not installed
> the
> > > steering effort is so high that I'm afraid I'll break the rudder
pedals
> > > while I try to get it loosened up. I've loosened the upper stop plate
so
> > it
> > > isn't rubbing on the shelf, and I've greased everything that moves. I
> > think
> > > the problem is the contact between the steering cross-tube on the
strut
> > and
> > > the lower stops (6-F-10-1). My lower stops have somewhat less slope
> than
> > > the drawing shows.
> > >
> > > The only tri-gear Zodiac I've flown in had high pedal forces in
flight,
> > but
> > > not while taxying. Rudder pedal forces seemed normal on the factory's
> > > taildragger.
> > >
> > > Have any of the rest of you tri-gear Zodiac builders experienced
this
> > > problem, and if so, what did you do to improve the situation. I don't
> want
> > > to fly with such a stiff rudder control.
> > >
> > > I wonder if the rudder pedal reinforcement mod was made necessary by
> > > excessive steering force on nose gear airplanes, or was it excessive
> brake
> > > pedal force?
> > >
> > > Your experience and advice will be much appreciated.
> > >
> > > George Swinford
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | [PLEASE READ] - Why Do I Have A Fund Raiser Each Year? |
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 601 nose gear steering |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/11/11 13:21, Greg Ferris at ferret(at)wmtel.net wrote:
>
> I get a shimmy-type vibration in the nosewheel if my nosewheel is on the
> ground above 60mph. I can hold it off to avoid this, however sometimes I
> get it just as I rotate. Has anyone else dealt with this?
>
> Greg
Maybe the wheel needs to be balanced?
Grant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Weston, Jim" <Jim.Weston(at)delta.com> |
| Subject: | 601 nose gear steering |
Yes I have. I find that the nose wheel is pretty air pressure sensitive.
If the pressure drops a bit I also get shimmy on landing. Haven't really
noticed it on takeoff. Maybe because I'm holding back pressure for
rotation. Anyway, I have the old wheel barrel tire and try to keep it at 40
pounds of pressure.
Jim Weston
McDonough, Ga.
-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Ferris [mailto:ferret(at)wmtel.net]
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
I get a shimmy-type vibration in the nosewheel if my nosewheel is on the
ground above 60mph. I can hold it off to avoid this, however sometimes I
get it just as I rotate. Has anyone else dealt with this?
Greg
----- Original Message -----
From: <thilo.kind(at)gmx.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
>
> Hi Gary,
>
> I had the same issue with the nose gear. Flaten out the V a little bit.
Then
> put the engine on. With the weight of the engine the bungee will be
> depressed somewhat and steering will be very light.
>
> Happy building
>
> Thilo
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
>
>
>
> >
> > George,
> > I've added Delrin bearings at the nose gear top and bottom which don't
> > require any
> > serious modifications to plans construction. These are found on the
gear
> > and firewall sections
> > of my web site if you're interested. They make considerable difference
in
> > the steering forces
> > I agree, the cross tube is easier to rotate on a flat than with the
> > bottoming slopes.
> > I've made those guides horizontal. When you're on the ground the forces
> are
> > light
> > and when the plane is aloft the bungees are working you, even without
> nylon
> > guides.
> > Larry C. McFarland 601hds at http://www.macsmachine.com
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > I've just installed the nose gear bungee and the steering pushrods.
With
> > the
> > > airplane still on a cradle and the nose wheel and rudder not installed
> the
> > > steering effort is so high that I'm afraid I'll break the rudder
pedals
> > > while I try to get it loosened up. I've loosened the upper stop plate
so
> > it
> > > isn't rubbing on the shelf, and I've greased everything that moves. I
> > think
> > > the problem is the contact between the steering cross-tube on the
strut
> > and
> > > the lower stops (6-F-10-1). My lower stops have somewhat less slope
> than
> > > the drawing shows.
> > >
> > > The only tri-gear Zodiac I've flown in had high pedal forces in
flight,
> > but
> > > not while taxying. Rudder pedal forces seemed normal on the factory's
> > > taildragger.
> > >
> > > Have any of the rest of you tri-gear Zodiac builders experienced
this
> > > problem, and if so, what did you do to improve the situation. I don't
> want
> > > to fly with such a stiff rudder control.
> > >
> > > I wonder if the rudder pedal reinforcement mod was made necessary by
> > > excessive steering force on nose gear airplanes, or was it excessive
> brake
> > > pedal force?
> > >
> > > Your experience and advice will be much appreciated.
> > >
> > > George Swinford
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
| Subject: | Wow... I'm happy! |
Michel,
Well, I'm on the brink of turning in my 601HDS plans to purchase plans for a
640.
My finances are finally in a position for me to start on this. I'm *so*
sick of waiting and dreaming!
I just hope mine looks as good as yours does!
-Matt
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Michel
> Therrien
> Sent: Monday, October 21, 2002 8:09 PM
> To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Wow... I'm happy!
>
>
> Thanks Matt! What's fun with pictures is that
> everything look nicer than in reality... but I'm still
> quite happy with the panel and electrical system.
>
> I'm more disapointed with my GPS 196 (or with myself I
> should say) as I broke it during the weekend. I
> dropped it in the stairs and the screen is broke :(
>
> I'll see what my gold card insurance program can do
> for me.
>
> Good night!
>
> Michel
> PS: How's the progress on your plane?
>
> --- Matthew Mucker wrote:
> >
> >
> > Michel,
> >
> > As always, your craftsmanship is clearly evident in
> > your pictures. What
> > inspiration!
> >
> > -Matt
>
>
> =====
> ----------------------------
> Michel Therrien CH601-HD
> http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
> http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
> http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Wow... I'm happy! |
The 640 will be a BIG project. You have the space and
time for this? Initially, I wanted a four-place
plane and many convinced me that the back seat will
never be used. So, considering my single car garage
and all, I decided to build the two seater. If I'd do
it again, I'd go for the XL.
--- Matthew Mucker wrote:
>
>
> Michel,
>
> Well, I'm on the brink of turning in my 601HDS plans
> to purchase plans for a
> 640.
>
> My finances are finally in a position for me to
> start on this. I'm *so*
> sick of waiting and dreaming!
>
> I just hope mine looks as good as yours does!
>
> -Matt
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On
> Behalf Of Michel
> > Therrien
> > Sent: Monday, October 21, 2002 8:09 PM
> > To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Wow... I'm happy!
> >
> >
>
> >
> > Thanks Matt! What's fun with pictures is that
> > everything look nicer than in reality... but I'm
> still
> > quite happy with the panel and electrical system.
> >
> > I'm more disapointed with my GPS 196 (or with
> myself I
> > should say) as I broke it during the weekend. I
> > dropped it in the stairs and the screen is broke
> :(
> >
> > I'll see what my gold card insurance program can
> do
> > for me.
> >
> > Good night!
> >
> > Michel
> > PS: How's the progress on your plane?
> >
> > --- Matthew Mucker wrote:
> Mucker"
> > >
> > >
> > > Michel,
> > >
> > > As always, your craftsmanship is clearly evident
> in
> > > your pictures. What
> > > inspiration!
> > >
> > > -Matt
> >
> >
> > =====
> > ----------------------------
> > Michel Therrien CH601-HD
> > http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
> > http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
> >
> http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
> >
> >
>
>
>
> Month --
> Gifts!)
> Click on the Contribution
> Terrific Free Gifts!
> Dralle, List Admin.
> _->
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: One GPS company |
>The guy on the phone asked me what happened. I said I
>dropped the unit. When he learned I just bought the
>unit, he said "oh... it's a bad lock... send it to us
>and we'll repair it under warranty". He gave me a RMA
>number and the unit was flying his way the next
>morning.
>Well, they repaired it about the same day they
>received it and they sent it back to me, freight paid.
>WOW! THIS IS GOOOOOD SERVICE! It took less than two
>weeks to get it back from when I sent it.
>Garmin definitively have me as a satisfied customer
>and I'll buy as much of their products as possible.
>Michel
Michel, hope you don't mind if I took the last line of your post off - it's
service like this that deserves to be IN the archives...jeff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Aaron" <agustafson(at)chartermi.net> |
Listers
Speaking of good companies, I have a quad 4 in 1 instrument (made by Westberg Mfg.)
in my Kolb Firestar. Well after about 7 years of flying the tach started
to read too high. After checking I found it to be the tach itself. I called Westberg
and they said to send it to them with a note about what it was doing. I
did and received it back in about 2 weeks tested, repaired, calibrated and returned
postpaid.
Goooood service!!!
They sell West Tach brand.
Aaron Gustafson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Bergen <JBergen(at)rrc.mb.ca> |
Zenith-Archive.digest.complete
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <carlosfsa(at)yahoo.com> |
A while back, one of the listers (Todd?) was discouraged by a couple of mistakes
he
commited.
Well, if this is any consolation, I commited a fairly big one.
Here is what happened:
When I drilled the rear spar (6T1-4) and attached parts, I proceeded as follows:
a) I clamped in place 6T2-3, 6T2-6, 6T1-4, 6T1-6 and 6T1-7
b) I drilled 25 holes through 6T2-3, 6T2-6, 6T1-4, 6T1-6 and 6T1-7 (5 by 5
rectangular pattern on 6T2-3)
c) *** error #1: I forgot to drill the two rows of 4 holes on each side of shim
6T2-6
d) *** error #2: looks like I removed 6T2-3 and 6T2-6 before I drilled the remaining
holes with 40mm pitch on 6T1-4 and 6T1-7 (or I had drilled the holes before clamping
6T2-3, 6T2-6 and proceeding to step b - I do not remember)
e) *** error #3: while riveting, I noticed the two rows of 4 holes on each side
of
shim 6T2-6 were missing, so I drilled them on a spot halfway between 6T2-3 and
the
shim's edge.
At his point, situation is as depicted in attached drawing.
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/4a38ab4d/bc/My+Photos/__hr_major+mistake.jpg?bc.CU39ABB4_BiPv
(if the URL above is broken in two or more lines, you will need to copy/paste it
onto your browser)
At about 75 mm from the center line (and on EACH SIDE of the center line), the
spar
(6T1-4) and the bottom doubler (6T1-7) have a pair of holes 3 mm apart.
I have written and sent the drawing to Nick, who in turn forwarded it to Chris.
Nick says I'll have a reply in about 10 days.
Looks like, if I'm lucky, I'll have to replace the doubler (6T1-7).
If I'm not, the doubler AND the spar will have to be replaced.
Sigh...
Carlos - two planes, one in the garbage can, one to fly
601HD, plans
Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Can't wait to get started |
Hello folks; I have been reading your post for a while now and it seems to be
of great help to your fellow builders. Me and my partner, Steve, started with
a 601xl rudder about a month ago and have ordered the entire kit. I just got
a ship date of 12/26 and can't wait to continue building. On the inside of
the rudder I used a zinc chromate substitute but would like to know what kind
of primer you are using on the main spars and ribs? I read most of the posts
on primer but didn't see any mention of type.
Thanks for all of the future help!
Jack Russell (ex ercoupe driver)
601xl - rudder done
engine - not sure
color - not sure
instruments- not sure
potential fun - sure
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred or Sandy Hulen" <hulens61(at)birch.net> |
| Subject: | Final inspection |
Thanks to many of you who gave me valuable advice and encouragement, Jabiru
3300 powered 601 HDS, N-601LX passed the FAA inspection this morning. The
FAA inspector was as nice a guy as you will ever meet, and he issued my
"pink slip" (airworthiness certificate) and the "repairman certificate" at
the same time.
Finely the airplane is done, and I've been taxing it all over the airport.
Now I've got to get ME ready for that first flight!
Fred
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 601 nose gear steering |
I had a shimmy that was very pronounced just after liftoff. I knew it was
not the main gear as I could apply the brakes after liftoff and the shimmy
was still present. It would shake for a few seconds.
I removed my nose wheel and static balanced it. I used stick on weights
(purchased at a motorcycle shop). Like magic, no more shimmy.
Regards,
Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 179.3 flight hrs. - 281
landings)
web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
>I get a shimmy-type vibration in the nosewheel if my nosewheel is on the
>ground above 60mph. I can hold it off to avoid this, however sometimes I
>get it just as I rotate. Has anyone else dealt with this?
>
>Greg
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <thilo.kind(at)gmx.net>
>To:
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
>
>
> >
> > Hi Gary,
> >
> > I had the same issue with the nose gear. Flaten out the V a little bit.
>Then
> > put the engine on. With the weight of the engine the bungee will be
> > depressed somewhat and steering will be very light.
> >
> > Happy building
> >
> > Thilo
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > George,
> > > I've added Delrin bearings at the nose gear top and bottom which don't
> > > require any
> > > serious modifications to plans construction. These are found on the
>gear
> > > and firewall sections
> > > of my web site if you're interested. They make considerable difference
>in
> > > the steering forces
> > > I agree, the cross tube is easier to rotate on a flat than with the
> > > bottoming slopes.
> > > I've made those guides horizontal. When you're on the ground the forces
> > are
> > > light
> > > and when the plane is aloft the bungees are working you, even without
> > nylon
> > > guides.
> > > Larry C. McFarland 601hds at http://www.macsmachine.com
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com>
> > > To:
> > > Subject: Zenith-List: 601 nose gear steering
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > I've just installed the nose gear bungee and the steering pushrods.
>With
> > > the
> > > > airplane still on a cradle and the nose wheel and rudder not installed
> > the
> > > > steering effort is so high that I'm afraid I'll break the rudder
>pedals
> > > > while I try to get it loosened up. I've loosened the upper stop plate
>so
> > > it
> > > > isn't rubbing on the shelf, and I've greased everything that moves. I
> > > think
> > > > the problem is the contact between the steering cross-tube on the
>strut
> > > and
> > > > the lower stops (6-F-10-1). My lower stops have somewhat less slope
> > than
> > > > the drawing shows.
> > > >
> > > > The only tri-gear Zodiac I've flown in had high pedal forces in
>flight,
> > > but
> > > > not while taxying. Rudder pedal forces seemed normal on the factory's
> > > > taildragger.
> > > >
> > > > Have any of the rest of you tri-gear Zodiac builders experienced
>this
> > > > problem, and if so, what did you do to improve the situation. I don't
> > want
> > > > to fly with such a stiff rudder control.
> > > >
> > > > I wonder if the rudder pedal reinforcement mod was made necessary by
> > > > excessive steering force on nose gear airplanes, or was it excessive
> > brake
> > > > pedal force?
> > > >
> > > > Your experience and advice will be much appreciated.
> > > >
> > > > George Swinford
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Final inspection |
That's great news!!!!!
I knew you would have no problem with the beautiful and careful work that
you do.
I'm looking forward to hearing about the first flight.
Regards,
Bill
>Thanks to many of you who gave me valuable advice and encouragement, Jabiru
>3300 powered 601 HDS, N-601LX passed the FAA inspection this morning. The
>FAA inspector was as nice a guy as you will ever meet, and he issued my
>"pink slip" (airworthiness certificate) and the "repairman certificate" at
>the same time.
>
>Finely the airplane is done, and I've been taxing it all over the airport.
>Now I've got to get ME ready for that first flight!
>
>Fred
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Final inspection |
Congratulations, Fred! News like this keeps builders like me going. I hope
your first flight is a good one.
Bill
> Thanks to many of you who gave me valuable advice and encouragement, Jabiru
> 3300 powered 601 HDS, N-601LX passed the FAA inspection this morning.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 11/20/02 |
| From: | Greg P Jannakos <gpjann(at)juno.com> |
Greg Jannakos
6-4211 601 HDS
Plans building 70% complete
I've decided to use a C90 engine.
Am looking for motor mount or plans for one.
Uses same mount as C75 or 85
Any out there?
Also have Willian Wynee's close case Corvair 110HP along with finished
heads, oil cooler, fuel pump,
and all manuals for sale.
If interested email me at gpjann(at)juno.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: CH701 Service "hole"... |
Jari:
The two little pieces of "L" angle that go in the middle of the service
hole, go in "J" position ("L" inverted) with the vertical part in the
front side because you will have to rivet them to the pieces 7F5-4.
This you can see it in the page 7-F-6 in the two top drawings.
Saludos
Gary Gower
701 912S
"Being there done that" a few days ago.
--- Jari Kaija wrote:
>
>
> There is two short L-stiffeners both side of service "hole".
> What is the correct position for these L-stiffeners?
> Maybe I'm blind, but I can't figure this out before
> constructing baggage compartment...
>
> -Jari
>
>
>
> Contribution
> Gifts!
> _->
>
>
>
>
>
>
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Pwalsh4539(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Can't wait to get started |
I used zinc-chromate brushed on....on all interior surfaces...after cleaning
with laquer thinner. Suffices on the inside in my opinion. Simple, quick and
probably unneccessary on 6061 but what the heck.
Patrick Walsh
601 HD/912
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Aaron" <agustafson(at)chartermi.net> |
I'd like to hear from anyone building a 601 and more than 50% or so done especially
if you are building your own engine or cowl or any other mods.
Aaron Gustafson
601HD TD 75% done . Building engine cowl. EA81
agustafson(at)chartermi.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wayne Beattie" <wyne.beattie(at)snet.net> |
| Subject: | Warp Drive Propellor |
I'm toying with the idea of replacing my GSC standard issue propeller with a Warp
Drive or similar. I would like any current opinions that I might consider before
commiting. I am flying a CH601HDS currently getting 115-120 mph cruise using
the Rotax 912 UL 80 hp. with external radiator and stock wheelpants.
For those who have gone with the Warp Drive, some questions:
What made you decide to use the Warp Drive?
If changing fom the GSC, did you see any performance improvement in speed or climb?
How easy is the blade adjustment? How much time does it take?
What propeller diameter and pitch are you using?
What spinners are available to accomidate this propeller hub?
Thanks in advance,
Wayne N601WB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim & Diane Shankland <tshank(at)megsinet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 601 Plans built |
Aaron,
Yes, I happy to say that I think I'm over 50% I have a Status EA81 hanging on the
front and I'm in the middle of collection data for the radiators
that will be mounted under the cowling. I will be making my own cowling since I
discovered that one of my EAA chapter members has made several
fiberglass ones and knows the tricks and techniques.
Tim Shankland
Aaron wrote:
>
> I'd like to hear from anyone building a 601 and more than 50% or so done especially
if you are building your own engine or cowl or any other mods.
>
> Aaron Gustafson
> 601HD TD 75% done . Building engine cowl. EA81
> agustafson(at)chartermi.net
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Aaron" <agustafson(at)chartermi.net> |
Hey guys
If you respond to Wayne about the prop, do it on the list so the rest of us can
see.
Aaron
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Can't wait to get started |
Jack,
I'm using the spray-can variety zinc chromate primer to
do all the spar contact areas and all internal bottom surfaces.
You need a respirator and means to clear the work area of the
fumes immediately after. 3M 6000 filters and respirators work
really well. There are safer materials (zinc oxides) to use, but they don't
seem to stick very well, my experience.
I flew an Ercoupe once and never got over it. Think that's why I
was drawn to the 601.
Best regards,
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds @ http://www.macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <CLOJAN(at)aol.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Can't wait to get started
>
> Hello folks; I have been reading your post for a while now and it seems to
be
> of great help to your fellow builders. Me and my partner, Steve, started
with
> a 601xl rudder about a month ago and have ordered the entire kit. I just
got
> a ship date of 12/26 and can't wait to continue building. On the inside of
> the rudder I used a zinc chromate substitute but would like to know what
kind
> of primer you are using on the main spars and ribs? I read most of the
posts
> on primer but didn't see any mention of type.
> Thanks for all of the future help!
> Jack Russell (ex ercoupe driver)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Stout" <r5t0ut(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 601 Plans built |
Aaron
I'm not sure what you are looking for here. For me, the light at the end of
the tunnel is getting somewhat blinding. I have a few loose ends to tie up,
and I'm stuck on the cowl. I thought I was going to make my own, but I found
that I'm not much of a sculptor. I called ZAC this morning and found that
they make a cowl for the engine I am using, a Great Plains 2180 vdub. The
only catch is that I have a belted redrive, which raises the prop about 5
inches. I'm hoping that I can make a hump to compensate for that. I also
have a 3 blade Powerfin ground adjustable prop. The prop is extremely easy
to adjust. No protractors involved. Just a chart, a feeler gauge, and a 6mm
allen on a torque wrench. I'm not sure how any of this is going to work out
yet. I ran the engine for the first time with the prop installed a couple of
weeks ago. I'm glad I had the plane tied to a tree, because the brakes and
chocks were not going to hold it!
Randy Stout
CH 601 HD
r5t0ut(at)earthlink.net
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~r5t0ut/
----- Original Message -----
From: "Aaron" <agustafson(at)chartermi.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: 601 Plans built
>
> I'd like to hear from anyone building a 601 and more than 50% or so done
especially if you are building your own engine or cowl or any other mods.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | 601HDS 3300 Performance Status |
To add to 601 performance data following George's recent lead:
22Tango wears Czeched pants and has as many drag reducing details as were
able to be considered during construction. Among them: side opening canopy
with side sealing gaps of .030 or less, understab fairings (copied from Don
and Peter Chapman), sealed lip at front of rudder, and main gearbox
fairings. In addition, the wing splice strips and baggage doors show very
little evidence of lifting during flight. Tuft testing shows a low pressure
area at rear of canopy beginning about halfway down from rear hoop to
sealing strip.
Prop is a two-bladed, one-piece standard Jabiru unit made of Australian hoop
pine in 60X48. Engine has just over 28 hours and has been a jewel.
Yesterday's flight wx: OAT at start was 57 degrees; AOPA winds were ~260 at
one and a half barbs or 15kts at 5000'. At 10000' they had shifted to ~
280. WeatherMation winds were 260 at 12kts at 5000', and winds aloft from
the Pennsylvania reporting stations were averaging 270 at 11kts at 6000'.
I picked a course of 350 to 000 for test, attempting to keep course
perpendicular to expected winds aloft. George didn't report a course
heading for his runs but 5500' would suggest an easterly heading. Yes, I
know I should have technically been at an even + 500 altitude for this
heading but I wanted to duplicated things as much as possible.
Stabilized at 2800rpm and 5440', the Garmin showed 135mph (117kts) for over
three minutes. A reciprocal course showed a consistent 133mph. While on
that heading I reduced to 2700rpm (50rpm below Jabiru recommended cruise)
and saw 127mph. A very quick run to the east picked up speed, and a run to
the west lost speed.
...for the skeptical there's a jpeg at
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/JeffS/
A few weeks ago Bill Morelli wrote me of his successful LE tank repair and
wing surgery closeup. As a part of his test flight he took 2Bravo Mike to
13070'. Had to try for that. Stopped at 13500' where climb rate was still
about 200fpm+. Had no oxygen so only stayed above 12500 for about eight
minutes.
The aircraft probably weighed between 1102 and 1110 lbs for the flight with
19 gallons of fuel at beginning and a 120 lb "passenger" in the right seat -
three bags of water conditioner salt.
You don't have to be a member of the list long to realize that builders have
fierce loyaliyties: the 912UL/S's have been long popular, Grant loves his
CAM100 and a few others are soon to follow; at times, if you're not a Soobie
driver you feel out of place; and I'm growing quite fond of this 3300.
Soon, the XL 235 guys will be aboard and we'll get their numbers, but
whatever you choose, keep building because there are days when no clouds
paint the blue and all you want to do is reach.
Let's keep adding to the information that we gather. If we "post in" with
"performance status" as the subject line, the ease of finding it with Matt's
search engine is greatly facilitated.
That said, I'm still honestly impressed by the figures that George and a few
other get with the 80hp Rotax. Well done. Now, I'm looking at those drag
inducing two-inch gear legs sticking down and have an idea that...
Regards...jeff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cleone Markwell <cleone(at)rr1.net> |
I have down loaded the SB and IB referred to in the AD. I'm still not sure
about what to do in the pressure test and inspection of valve train
lubrication so expect to work with an experienced A&P with AI rating when
she gets her hanger cleaned out. What are other builders doing? I realize
it is not mandatory for experimental but since the FAA considers it so
important that it must be completed before further flight we plan to follow
the AD. Hope to hear from other 912 owners. Cleone
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Can't wait to get started |
Jack,
We are using Zinc Chromate with a HVLP spray gun, this is a
traditional good product BUT is very dangerous, if you use it always
wear a respirator system, if possible spray outdoors with the wind from
you to the parts painted. No kids around.
Saludos
Gary Gower
701 912S
--- CLOJAN(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Hello folks; I have been reading your post for a while now and it
> seems to be
> of great help to your fellow builders. Me and my partner, Steve,
> started with
> a 601xl rudder about a month ago and have ordered the entire kit. I
> just got
> a ship date of 12/26 and can't wait to continue building. On the
> inside of
> the rudder I used a zinc chromate substitute but would like to know
> what kind
> of primer you are using on the main spars and ribs? I read most of
> the posts
> on primer but didn't see any mention of type.
> Thanks for all of the future help!
> Jack Russell (ex ercoupe driver)
> 601xl - rudder done
> engine - not sure
> color - not sure
> instruments- not sure
> potential fun - sure
>
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
Dear Listers,
We are quickly approaching the end of November and the official end of the
List Fund Raiser. If you look forward to checking your List email everyday
(and a lot of you have written to say that you do!), then you're probably
getting at least $20 or $30 worth of Entertainment from the Lists each
year. You'd pay twice that for a subscription to some lame magazine or
even a dinner out. Isn't the List worth at least that much to
you? Wouldn't it be great if you could pay that same amount and get a
well-managed media source free of advertising, SPAM, and viruses? Come to
think of it, you do... :-)
Won't you please take a minute to make your Contribution today and support
YOUR Lists.
Contribution Page:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Again, I want to say THANK YOU to everyone that has made a Contribution
thus far during this year's List Fund Raiser!! These Lists are made
possible exclusively through YOUR generosity!!
Thank you for your support!
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Warp Drive Propellor |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/11/21 20:16, Wayne Beattie at wyne.beattie(at)snet.net wrote:
> What made you decide to use the Warp Drive?
Others success with this prop
> How easy is the blade adjustment? How much time does it take?
Loosen 12 nuts (i.e. on 3-blade version), adjust with provided tool,
re-tourque nuts.... takes me about 30-60 minutes?
> What propeller diameter and pitch are you using?
70inches. Started at 12 deg. (measured with protractor at the tip) - have
been at 18 but found the engine lugged too much - currently at 16.5 deg.
This is with 3-bladed tapered ends on a 100 hp CAM100 - cruise rpm about
2100 at the prop. (5000 at the engine)
> What spinners are available to accomidate this propeller hub?
UHS (Mike) makes a nice fg spinner
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 601HDS 3300 Performance Status |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/11/21 23:11, zodiacjeff at zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com wrote:
> Now, I'm looking at those drag
> inducing two-inch gear legs sticking down and have an idea that...
Jeff,
Great report - thanks.
A local Jodel owner rigs up a gear leg fairing made with aluminum (maybe
.025?) that attaches with a couple of 'radiator clamps'. Very slick and
easy - looks good and definitely gives an aerodynamic shape in the trailing
edge (i.e. most important) side. I've also seen some European models that
use a wheel pant that fairs upwards into a gearleg fairing. More complex
fiberglass work required for this I think.
Meanwhile, my aircraft is back in the garage for the 'winter works' program.
I plan to convert my canopy to a forward tilt model, finally install the
wing lockers, wheel fairings, interiour finishing, heater, ... and hopefully
solve my engine problem now that it has finally been traced to ignition
(after many hours spent 'solving' a non-existant fuel vaporization
problem)....
Anyhow! - you and Fred and George (and others) show me what's possible in
the way of producing a beautifully-finished aircraft. It's a good thing I
live in winter-land or I'd probably never go back to building 'cause the
flying part is just so much fun with this little aircraft.
Grant Corriveau
-------------------------------
Every happening, great and small is a parable whereby God speaks to us
and the art of life is to get the message. -- Malcom Muggeridge
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Bergen <JBergen(at)rrc.mb.ca> |
| Subject: | 601 Plans Wanted |
Anyone know of someone with 601 plans for sale?? I'm sure there are
hundreds out there that have not been used, given up on ect....
thanks
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Todd Osborne" <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 601 Plans Wanted |
You looking for HDS or XL? I have a set of HDS available
if you are interested.
Todd
John Bergen wrote:
>
>
> Anyone know of someone with 601 plans for sale?? I'm
>sure there are
>hundreds out there that have not been used, given up on
>ect....
>
>thanks
>
>
>--
>the Contribution
>Terrific Free Gifts!
>List Admin.
>Contributions of
>other form
>latest messages.
>List members.
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/browselist/zenith-list
>http://www.matronics.com/zenith-list
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
Web Site: www.toddtown.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Bergen <JBergen(at)rrc.mb.ca> |
| Subject: | 601 Plans Wanted |
Xl looks sexy but hds would be good, the wing mod is attractive. What kind
of price are you looking at?
-----Original Message-----
From: Todd Osborne [mailto:todd(at)toddtown.com]
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 Plans Wanted
You looking for HDS or XL? I have a set of HDS available
if you are interested.
Todd
John Bergen wrote:
>
>
> Anyone know of someone with 601 plans for sale?? I'm
>sure there are
>hundreds out there that have not been used, given up on
>ect....
>
>thanks
>
>
>--
>the Contribution
>Terrific Free Gifts!
>List Admin.
>Contributions of
>other form
>latest messages.
>List members.
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/browselist/zenith-list
>http://www.matronics.com/zenith-list
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
Web Site: www.toddtown.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <carlosfsa(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | 601 Plans Wanted |
I believe you can upgrade the DHS plans to XL (US$120).
Take a look into the Zenair builders web site:
http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/upgrade.html
Carlos
John Bergen
>
> Xl looks sexy but hds would be good, the wing mod is attractive. What kind
> of price are you looking at?
Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Bergen <JBergen(at)rrc.mb.ca> |
| Subject: | 601 Plans Wanted |
What would you be looking for for your plans??
-----Original Message-----
From: Carlos Sa [mailto:carlosfsa(at)yahoo.com]
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 601 Plans Wanted
I believe you can upgrade the DHS plans to XL (US$120).
Take a look into the Zenair builders web site:
http://www.zenithair.com/zodiac/xl/upgrade.html
Carlos
--- John Bergen wrote: > --> Zenith-List message posted
by: John Bergen
>
> Xl looks sexy but hds would be good, the wing mod is attractive. What
> kind of price are you looking at?
Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "SKYSHOP" <duba(at)gate.net> |
Wayne,
why not consider also Sport Prop? They are just as easy to adjust on the
ground as other props, it doesn' take more than 10 mins. In addition the
carbon blade design is more aerodynamic than the competition. This is
especially true close to the spinner where Sport prop blades' transition is
quick from the hub to an aerodynamic cross section. Other props have round
cross section close to spinner which does nothing for propulsion and only
causes turbulence to the air entering the cowling openings. For more info go
to http://www.skyshops.org/woodcomp/woodcomp.htm.
Danny (N601DD)
SKYSHOP INC
USA distributor for Czech Aircraft Works
e-mail zaneta(at)skyshops.org Phone # 772-223-8915 Fax # 772-382-0607
cell # 772-370-9465
1837 S. FEDERAL HWY # 200, STUART, FLORIDA 34994 USA
www.skyshops.org
-----Original Message--I'm toying with the idea of replacing my GSC standard
issue propeller with a Warp Drive or similar. I would like any current
opinions that I might consider before commiting. I am flying a CH601HDS
currently getting 115-120 mph cruise using the Rotax 912 UL 80 hp. with
external radiator and stock wheelpants.
For those who have gone with the Warp Drive, some questions:
What made you decide to use the Warp Drive?
If changing fom the GSC, did you see any performance improvement in speed or
climb?
How easy is the blade adjustment? How much time does it take?
What propeller diameter and pitch are you using?
What spinners are available to accomidate this propeller hub?
Thanks in advance,
Wayne N601WB-
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "SKYSHOP" <duba(at)gate.net> |
| Subject: | new cowling which we just completed for the CH601XL |
George,
have a look at our new cowling which we just completed for the CH601XL. We
have done a lot of aerodynamic testing to optimize not only speed but also
cooling for the 912ULS. We have innovative induction NACA intake scoop and
air filter air box combination integrated into the cowling. With the
addition of 3" prop spacer which is necessary for improved aerodynamic shape
of the forward portion of the cowling. This would be a great addition for
CH601XL, HD, or HDS owners who are looking for the extra knots. We have this
cowling on our CH601XL demo which is now permanently based at Skyshop for
anyone who would like to take a look. More performance and test data will be
posted in the future. http://www.skyshops.org/COWLING-601XL.htm
Danny (N601DD)
SKYSHOP INC
USA distributor for Czech Aircraft Works
e-mail zaneta(at)skyshops.org Phone # 772-223-8915 Fax # 772-382-0607
cell # 772-370-9465
1837 S. FEDERAL HWY # 200, STUART, FLORIDA 34994 USA
www.skyshops.org
---
-----Original Message-----
"Pinneo, George"
With elliptical maingear wheel fairings and a 68" Warp Drive,
ground-adjustable, tapered 2-blade prop, I clocked 115. knots, GPS averaged,
(132 mph) @ 5,500' MSL in level max cruise, 5,500-5,600 rpm. The blades are
set @ 27.5 degrees at the inner end of the Ni leading edge. I did it twice
to be sure I wasn't seeing what I wanted to.
It must be about time to redo the upper cowl to reduce the gaping
fish-mouth; that might get me another knot or so as well as improve
over-the-nose visibility a tad.
GGP
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: new cowling which we just completed for the CH601XL |
> have a look at our new cowling which we just completed for the CH601XL. We
> have done a lot of aerodynamic testing to optimize not only speed but also
> cooling for the 912ULS. We have innovative induction NACA intake scoop and
> air filter air box combination integrated into the cowling. With the
> addition of 3" prop spacer which is necessary for improved aerodynamic
shape
> of the forward portion of the cowling. This would be a great addition for
> CH601XL, HD, or HDS owners who are looking for the extra knots. We have
this
> cowling on our CH601XL demo which is now permanently based at Skyshop for
> anyone who would like to take a look. More performance and test data will
be
> posted in the future. http://www.skyshops.org/COWLING-601XL.htm
Is skyshop looking at doing anything simular for the Stratus Subaru? I've
never been happy with the cowling I have on the plane.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Stratus valve adjustments |
I was adjusting the valves on my engine yesterday and had something strange happen.
One of the valves seemed loose. It was the valve on the right when facing
the engine from the front, third back from front. All of the other valves
adjusted easily to .016". This one didn't want to get that tight. I could only
get it to .018". Does anyone have any idea what this means or does it mean
nothing?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stratus valve adjustments |
Phil,
I adjust all of my Stratus valves to .014" - I have adjusted them four
times and have never had a problem getting those dimensions.
I would contact Mykal and ask him but to my mind, that is not normal. To me
it could be several things:
1 - That particular valve (which is an Exhaust Valve) is not closed all the
way so the stem is not out far enough. You could verify that it is closed
with a compression test on that cylinder. By the way, on each head the
outside two valves are the intakes and the inside two are the exhaust. In
lieu of a compression test you could try and measure how far out the stem
is compared to one that adjusts OK.
2 - The pushrod for that valve is not pushing the rocker arm all the way
back. Not very likely as the push rods are a fixed length.
3 - The adjusting mechanism for that valve is not moving far enough. Again
not very likely.
Are you sure you had the piston at TDC? What I do is pull all of the plugs,
Stick my pinky in the plug hole for the cylinder I want at TDC. Turn the
prop till my pinky gets blown out by the compression, then by shinning a
light into the plug hole you can see the piston and tweak the prop to get
it right at TDC.
Good luck
Regards,
Bill
> I was adjusting the valves on my engine yesterday and had something
> strange happen. One of the valves seemed loose. It was the valve on the
> right when facing the engine from the front, third back from front. All
> of the other valves adjusted easily to .016". This one didn't want to
> get that tight. I could only get it to .018". Does anyone have any idea
> what this means or does it mean nothing?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Danielson" <steved(at)nc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Gear legs on the Skyshop Demo XL are different than the Zenith |
XL Demo
I notice the gear legs on the Demo XL are differerent than the ones on the
Zenith XL demo. I asked Roger about this and he said he though CAW was
making some new fiberglass legs that were lighter. Can you tell us about the
different gear legs?
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Ferris" <ferret(at)wmtel.net> |
| Subject: | Re: new cowling which we just completed for the CH601XL |
I have a cowling such as this in my HD and I've been happy with it. I
bought the basic plug and added NACA scoops that I made to feed air to the
oil cooler and cylinders. I also had to design and fabricate a 3" spacer
for the prop.
I get 104mph in my HD at 3000', 912UL, 5200 RPM, 68" 3 blade Warp prop, no
other mods such as wheelpants. Comparing with other results, it appears
that the cowling yields some advantage. It's a good thing because it was a
lot of trouble to do it.
Greg
----- Original Message -----
From: "SKYSHOP" <duba(at)gate.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: new cowling which we just completed for the CH601XL
>
>
> George,
> have a look at our new cowling which we just completed for the CH601XL. We
> have done a lot of aerodynamic testing to optimize not only speed but also
> cooling for the 912ULS. We have innovative induction NACA intake scoop and
> air filter air box combination integrated into the cowling. With the
> addition of 3" prop spacer which is necessary for improved aerodynamic
shape
> of the forward portion of the cowling. This would be a great addition for
> CH601XL, HD, or HDS owners who are looking for the extra knots. We have
this
> cowling on our CH601XL demo which is now permanently based at Skyshop for
> anyone who would like to take a look. More performance and test data will
be
> posted in the future. http://www.skyshops.org/COWLING-601XL.htm
>
> Danny (N601DD)
>
> SKYSHOP INC
> USA distributor for Czech Aircraft Works
> e-mail zaneta(at)skyshops.org Phone # 772-223-8915 Fax # 772-382-0607
> cell # 772-370-9465
> 1837 S. FEDERAL HWY # 200, STUART, FLORIDA 34994 USA
> www.skyshops.org
> ---
> -----Original Message-----
> "Pinneo, George"
>
> With elliptical maingear wheel fairings and a 68" Warp Drive,
> ground-adjustable, tapered 2-blade prop, I clocked 115. knots, GPS
averaged,
> (132 mph) @ 5,500' MSL in level max cruise, 5,500-5,600 rpm. The blades
are
> set @ 27.5 degrees at the inner end of the Ni leading edge. I did it
twice
> to be sure I wasn't seeing what I wanted to.
>
> It must be about time to redo the upper cowl to reduce the gaping
> fish-mouth; that might get me another knot or so as well as improve
> over-the-nose visibility a tad.
>
> GGP
>
>
> ---
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Fund Raiser Free Gift Shipping Status... |
Dear Listers,
A couple of people have written asking what the shipping status was of
their free List Contribution Gifts. Seemed like some status was in order
and I thought I detail where we're at...
Flight Bag Requests
-------------------
On 11/20/02 I shipped out the first batch of Flight Bag-Only (FBO) gift
requests. I shipped all FBO gift requests I had received from 11/1 to
11/19 except for 3 (Sorry guys!) - I ran out of my first shipment flight
bags! Andy Gold of the Builder's Bookstore ( http://www.buildersbooks.com
) is supplying me with another batch flight bags which should arrive in
about 2 weeks.
By the way, these are REALLY nice Flight Bags. Extremely well built and
very professional looking. Folds down into a very small size, but will
hold a huge amount of stuff. If you fly, and you've got a lot of stuff,
they you WANT one of these guys. Surf over to the List Contribution page
for details on how to get one of your own!!!
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
The Flight Bags have been shipped out US Mail Parcel Post in a large, and I
mean LARGE, padded white plastic envelope. According to the Post Office,
worse case delivery time would be 8 days to destinations on the East Coast,
but indicated it would likely take a lot less time.
Archive CDROM Requests
----------------------
The Archive CDROMs will be mastered and burned on or about December 1 and
should ship out shortly there after. Shipping will be US Mail, Media Rate
in a big padded white envelope. The Archive List data included will be up
to November 30th.
Flight Bag and Archive CDROM Requests
-------------------------------------
These combination orders will ship out when the Archive CDROMs are complete
as described above, likely a little after December 1. The Flight Bag and
the CDROM will be shipped together in the same Giant white padded envelope!
Again, I want to thank Andy Gold of the Builder's Bookstore for providing
these awesome Flight Bags to support the List Fund Raiser. Andy has gone
way beyond the call of duty with regard to his support of the Lists this
year and to show your gratitude I would ask that you have a look at his web
site and great media offerings. You'll find some excellent deals on some
very useful material. http://www.buildersbooks.com
And finally, I would like to thank everyone that has so generously made a
Contribution so far this year! Your generosity and kindness is greatly
appreciated. If you've been putting off making a Contribution, now's a
great time show your appreciation in plenty of time to make it onto this
year's List of Contributors AND get your free gift with qualifying
Contribution!!!
List Contribution Site:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution/
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
Benjamin Franklin
Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Noel & Yoshie Simmons" <blueskyaviation(at)mcn.net> |
I have joined this list for to gaining knowledge of Zenair's STOL CH 701 . I have
flown a 701 before and was impressed enough to recommend this aircraft to
anyone with the need for a FUN aircraft.
No comes the kicker! I am a builder assistance center here in central Montana.
I have a potential customer that is looking for some help from the ground up.
As all of the aircraft I do I really want to do this right the first time.
So what do you suggest as far as options. Any tips that will keep us out of
trouble?
Thank you,
Noel and Yoshie Simmons
Blue Sky Aviation, Inc.
"We do builder assistance!"
Toll Free: 866-859-0390
info(at)blueskyaviation.net
www.blueskyaviation.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi> |
| Subject: | Re: Fund Raiser Free Gift Shipping Status... |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Fund Raiser Free Gift Shipping Status...
>
>
> Dear Listers,
>
> A couple of people have written asking what the shipping status was of
> their free List Contribution Gifts. Seemed like some status was in order
> and I thought I detail where we're at...
>
>
> Flight Bag Requests
> -------------------
>
> On 11/20/02 I shipped out the first batch of Flight Bag-Only (FBO) gift
> requests. I shipped all FBO gift requests I had received from 11/1 to
> 11/19 except for 3 (Sorry guys!) - I ran out of my first shipment flight
> bags! Andy Gold of the Builder's Bookstore ( http://www.buildersbooks.com
> ) is supplying me with another batch flight bags which should arrive in
> about 2 weeks.
>
> By the way, these are REALLY nice Flight Bags. Extremely well built and
> very professional looking. Folds down into a very small size, but will
> hold a huge amount of stuff. If you fly, and you've got a lot of stuff,
> they you WANT one of these guys. Surf over to the List Contribution page
> for details on how to get one of your own!!!
>
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
> The Flight Bags have been shipped out US Mail Parcel Post in a large, and
I
> mean LARGE, padded white plastic envelope. According to the Post Office,
> worse case delivery time would be 8 days to destinations on the East
Coast,
> but indicated it would likely take a lot less time.
>
>
> Archive CDROM Requests
> ----------------------
>
> The Archive CDROMs will be mastered and burned on or about December 1 and
> should ship out shortly there after. Shipping will be US Mail, Media Rate
> in a big padded white envelope. The Archive List data included will be up
> to November 30th.
>
>
> Flight Bag and Archive CDROM Requests
> -------------------------------------
>
> These combination orders will ship out when the Archive CDROMs are
complete
> as described above, likely a little after December 1. The Flight Bag and
> the CDROM will be shipped together in the same Giant white padded
envelope!
>
>
> Again, I want to thank Andy Gold of the Builder's Bookstore for providing
> these awesome Flight Bags to support the List Fund Raiser. Andy has gone
> way beyond the call of duty with regard to his support of the Lists this
> year and to show your gratitude I would ask that you have a look at his
web
> site and great media offerings. You'll find some excellent deals on some
> very useful material. http://www.buildersbooks.com
>
> And finally, I would like to thank everyone that has so generously made a
> Contribution so far this year! Your generosity and kindness is greatly
> appreciated. If you've been putting off making a Contribution, now's a
> great time show your appreciation in plenty of time to make it onto this
> year's List of Contributors AND get your free gift with qualifying
> Contribution!!!
>
> List Contribution Site:
>
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution/
>
>
> Thank you!
>
> Matt Dralle
> Email List Administrator
>
>
> Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
> http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
>
>
> They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little
> temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
>
> Benjamin Franklin
> Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi> |
| Subject: | Re: Fund Raiser Free Gift Shipping Status... |
>
> Dear Listers,
>
> A couple of people have written asking what the shipping status was of
> their free List Contribution Gifts. Seemed like some status was in order
> and I thought I detail where we're at...
First of your message gone without anykind of "tapahtumia", I think it's
something like (in english) """"we/I do not care about this money
maker....""""....
....laughing loud and almost floor.............with my friends (LLAF....F)
Hey c'mon! Matt, are you handling "MESSAGE LIST" or what!. In these
days, when everyone can take/rent xDLS line, can easily manage anykind of
msg-system. What is the major problem with you to handle this one?
Yep, I'm sorry, I came from our local "bar" and I'm a little.... how I
should
to say this, "taken, drunk, etc..." perhaps... Still! 20-30 bucks from every
listers...
hey, really! I can do it for free for everyone. It costs to me (and
evereyone else
too, who like to keep this kind of msg- list). under 20$/year....
Sorry, I'm in the drunk, and I willl really say what I'm thinking.... I'm so
sorry,
if there is people who can't understand straight talkt, but it's not my
problem at all...
in english (USA)
Straight to face / Behind your back...
I like you When! the hell, this one goes away?
I will help you This idiot can''t understand nothing....
Nice to see you! I hope, this asshole kills himself as soon as
possible...
Maybe everyone wondering, what the hell I wrote... Really, I do not think
so...
-Jari Kaija
....
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fund Raiser Free Gift Shipping Status... |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/11/23 22:06, Jari Kaija at jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi wrote:
Notice to self:
SET JUNK MAIL FILTER to dump all postings from "Jari Kaija"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "cc9647" <cc9647(at)netzero.com> |
Hello, All.
I am new to this list. I am astonished that there does not appear to be much of
an internet presence of builders sites, discussion groups, etc. for the CH-640.
After underutilizing my Private Pilot certificate for the better part of 8 years
now, I am seriously considering building a kitplane (I need to first convince
myself that I have the necessary prerequisite skills). Anyway, the CH-640 is
near the top of my list.
Are there any CH-640 builders out there subscribed to this list? Or anyone also
considering this kit?
Chris C.
Contemplating the CH-640 in Appleton, Wisconsin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hal Rozema <hartist1(at)cox.net> |
Suggest you check the Zenith website or contact Sebastian at the ZAC factory.
I'm building a CH701 beginning in January 2002 and have all wings with flaperons
and slats, and entire tail all ready to hang. Have fuselage partially done.
Ordered Jabiru 3300 engine this past week. Instructions: photos and captions
and drawings, are clear with
few glitches of any consequence. So far, a piece of cake. Never built anything
via aluminum and rivets.
If it fits your budget, go for it. A word of advise. The closer your shop is
to your bedroom, the quicker you'll finish. Built ours on the patio in a downtown
Phoenix condo.
Hal and Jackie
theplanefolks.net
cc9647 wrote:
>
> Hello, All.
>
> I am new to this list. I am astonished that there does not appear to be much
of an internet presence of builders sites, discussion groups, etc. for the CH-640.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
Chris,
There are a few 640 buiders out there. Not many yet, but a few.
I'm preparing to start scratchbuilding a 640. Today I'm building a shed in
the back yard to move all the yard equipment out of the airplane factory.
I'm also working to get a set of plans for the 640 and plans for an 8 ft.
bending brake.
I agree that the 640 is a very attractive kit. It is a relatively new
design and I think we'll see more and more builders choosing the 640 in the
near future. Until the RV-10 arrives, I think it's going to be the only
aluminum four-seater on the market that many builders find attractive.
I think it's a great plane. Except for the lack of baggage area (and a
300mph cruise, of course), it's everything I'd want. And I can't wait to get
started on the building.
-Matt
Dallas, TX
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of cc9647
> Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2002 11:40 AM
> To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Zenith-List: CH-640
>
>
> Hello, All.
>
> I am new to this list. I am astonished that there does not
> appear to be much of an internet presence of builders sites,
> discussion groups, etc. for the CH-640.
>
> After underutilizing my Private Pilot certificate for the better
> part of 8 years now, I am seriously considering building a
> kitplane (I need to first convince myself that I have the
> necessary prerequisite skills). Anyway, the CH-640 is near the
> top of my list.
>
> Are there any CH-640 builders out there subscribed to this list?
> Or anyone also considering this kit?
>
> Chris C.
> Contemplating the CH-640 in Appleton, Wisconsin
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
Chris,
The CH640 is relatively new to the Zenith shop, so it will be a while
gaining momentum.
The design philosophy is the same and the problems encountered will often
cut across
model series. If you were a scratch builder,( I don't know if plans are
available) the 640 would win hands down
because the materials and tooling are not as demanding as would be for the
RV. This is important,
because when you mess a part up, you'll have gained the ability to make a
new one yourself and
with the Zenith aircraft, this is a possibility where RVs are heavily
dependent on CNC presses and
large shears etc. The skills come as you become a student of processes.
Fortunately Zenith people are very helpful in the very early stages when you
need thee assist. You'll find there is a lot of willing help here too.
Good luck in your decision.
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds @ http://www.macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "cc9647" <cc9647(at)netzero.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: CH-640
>
> Hello, All.
>
> I am new to this list. I am astonished that there does not appear to be
much of an internet presence of builders sites, discussion groups, etc. for
the CH-640.
>
> After underutilizing my Private Pilot certificate for the better part of 8
years now, I am seriously considering building a kitplane (I need to first
convince myself that I have the necessary prerequisite skills). Anyway, the
CH-640 is near the top of my list.
>
> Are there any CH-640 builders out there subscribed to this list? Or
anyone also considering this kit?
>
> Chris C.
> Contemplating the CH-640 in Appleton, Wisconsin
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
| Subject: | Subaru valve adjustments questions |
Subaru drivers,
I will be getting to my 20 hour valve adjustment within a week, so to better prepare
for this procedure I purchased a 1983 Subaru service manual for 1600 & 1800
engines. Looking at this shop manual it states to adjust the intake valves
to .010, & the exhaust valves to .014. Stratus (my engine manufacture) says to
adjust both intake & exhaust to .014. I'm just wondering if any of you Stratus
owners ever questioned that???
Also the shop manual states this procedure must be done when engine coolant temps
are between 68 & 104 deg F. (kind of hard to do in the midst of winter). Did
any of you ever find this to be a problem?
And lastly the shop manual suggests that the cylinder heads need to be re-torqued
the same time you perform the first valve adjustment. Once again are any of
you Subaru guys doing that (Stratus manual doesn't mention this)?
Thanks for your recommendations,
Kelly Meiste
601 HD Stratus Powered
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Walker" <dwalk3dw(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Subaru valve adjustments questions |
Reiner originally called for.016 on all of them. Then this was changed to
.014 by Mykal. I saw the book difference but don't know. Since the cam has
been changed it may make a difference from factory specs I suspect. I did my
last one about two weeks ago in 55 degrees and see no problem. It is not a
big deal to redo when it is warmer. don Walker, HDS 255 hours.
----- Original Message -----
From: "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Subaru valve adjustments questions
>
> Subaru drivers,
> I will be getting to my 20 hour valve adjustment within a week, so to
better prepare for this procedure I purchased a 1983 Subaru service manual
for 1600 & 1800 engines. Looking at this shop manual it states to adjust the
intake valves to .010, & the exhaust valves to .014. Stratus (my engine
manufacture) says to adjust both intake & exhaust to .014. I'm just
wondering if any of you Stratus owners ever questioned that???
> Also the shop manual states this procedure must be done when engine
coolant temps are between 68 & 104 deg F. (kind of hard to do in the midst
of winter). Did any of you ever find this to be a problem?
> And lastly the shop manual suggests that the cylinder heads need to be
re-torqued the same time you perform the first valve adjustment. Once again
are any of you Subaru guys doing that (Stratus manual doesn't mention this)?
> Thanks for your recommendations,
>
> Kelly Meiste
> 601 HD Stratus Powered
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brent Battles <brentbattles(at)pipeline.com> |
| Subject: | 601 Transcontinental Trip Narrative & Pictures |
I am happy to share my recent transcontinental trip experiences via two new
pages on my website. To go directly to these pages, use this link:
http://brentbattles.home.pipeline.com/FlyingIIa.HTM
I have also posted a complete update on my maintenance log which you can
reach via links on the above-referenced page or through my "Brent's Hangar"
home page at
http://brentbattles.home.pipeline.com/Brent'sZodiac.HTM
The home page has links to other pages on selected construction details,
some of the modifications I made to my airplane, some simple tools I
designed, and an article I wrote for InFlight USA magazine on the
construction of my airplane.
I hope others will find my experiences useful and encouraging.
Regards,
Brent Battles N16BZ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Subaru valve adjustments questions |
Kelly,
I originally set mine to .010 and .014 but then most other builders were
setting them all to .014 per Mykal and so that's what I have done for the
last three adjusts.
I adjust them with the engine cold not really paying attention to how cold.
I retorqued my head bolts to 48 ft / lbs when the engine had 27 hours on
it. Adjusted the valves at that time also.
Regards,
Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 180.3 flight hrs. - 282
landings)
web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
>I will be getting to my 20 hour valve adjustment within a week, so to
>better prepare for this procedure I purchased a 1983 Subaru service manual
>for 1600 & 1800 engines. Looking at this shop manual it states to adjust
>the intake valves to .010, & the exhaust valves to .014. Stratus (my
>engine manufacture) says to adjust both intake & exhaust to .014. I'm just
>wondering if any of you Stratus owners ever questioned that???
>Also the shop manual states this procedure must be done when engine
>coolant temps are between 68 & 104 deg F. (kind of hard to do in the midst
>of winter). Did any of you ever find this to be a problem?
>And lastly the shop manual suggests that the cylinder heads need to be
>re-torqued the same time you perform the first valve adjustment. Once
>again are any of you Subaru guys doing that (Stratus manual doesn't
>mention this)?
>Thanks for your recommendations,
>
>Kelly Meiste
>601 HD Stratus Powered
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | HDS - Forward Opening Canopy Design considerations |
| From: | charles.long(at)gm.com |
11/25/2002 09:00:35 AM
I'm at a point where I need to start installing the canopy hardware.
I purchased the kit about three years ago when the Forward tilting open
first came out. At that time they were using very long gas shocks that
mounted at the floor level. Since then, the XL has went to what looks to
me to be a cleaner setup. Shorter gas shocks that mount to the Upper
Forward Longeron. Does anyone have any comments on the merits of these two
different approaches. Does the XL design also fit the HDS w/o any
adaptation issues? I'm in a little bit of an awkward situation as I opted
for the NACA vents using the ZAC plans. I didn't realize that the vents
are in major interference with the floor mounted gas shocks.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
| Subject: | 601 project for sale |
A friend has his 601 project for sale. The workmanship is excellent. If anybody's
interested, please contact him directly at twilson(at)clinic.net for details.
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randewilbers1(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: HDS - Forward Opening Canopy Design considerations |
Charles: I am in the processof installing the "new" front hinged, forwaed
opening canopy on a 601HDS. You will have to replace the top forward skin as
well as the side angle (CF2C, you will have to remove all the A-4 rivets in
the top front longeron), and the side frames of the canopy will be shorter
in the HDS than the XL.
It has created a lot of extra work, but I believe it will be more than worth
the effort.
Best regards, Dick Wilbers 601HDS/Stratus subaru 98% finished (
going to Florida for the winter, will start again in May to finish up)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred or Sandy Hulen" <hulens61(at)birch.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 601 Transcontinental Trip Narrative & Pictures |
> The web pages covering my transcontinental trip have been repaired so that
> all pictures now appear as they should.
> http://brentbattles.home.pipeline.com/FlyingIIa.HTM
+++ ABSOLUTELY AWSOME !!!
Don't miss it guys.
Fred
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
Don't know how much interest there may be, but I've been playing around
with Harbor Freight's powder coating system, and it's kind of neat! Write
up at www.liming.org/ch801/powder.html
Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.p.reynolds" <r.p.reynolds(at)blueyonder.co.uk> |
| Subject: | Connecting the tail cone to the centre wing section |
I am about to connect the tail cone to the centre wing section could you help me
in setting up the correct wing angle of attack. What is the best way to align
the two large structures and get the longerons in the correct place.
Also is ther anyone out there using a rotax 80HP engine with variable pitch prop?
what performance figures are you getting.
regards,
Paul in the uk
CH601 UL with flaps and twin wing tanks.
620 hours into the build
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Fothergill <mfothergill(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Connecting the tail cone to the centre wing section |
Hi;
I was using an IVO in-flight with the 80 on my 601HD. Cruise was in the 100 mph
range. After converting the wing to HDS, speed up to120 were possible. Now with
the 912S and an Arplast PV-50, top speed is 140. I usually only cruise
at 120 mph but a 130 mph cruise is comfortable.
Mike
CH-601HDS C-FRND
UHS Spinners
"r.p.reynolds" wrote:
>
> I am about to connect the tail cone to the centre wing section could you help
me in setting up the correct wing angle of attack. What is the best way to align
the two large structures and get the longerons in the correct place.
> Also is ther anyone out there using a rotax 80HP engine with variable pitch prop?
what performance figures are you getting.
>
> regards,
>
> Paul in the uk
> CH601 UL with flaps and twin wing tanks.
> 620 hours into the build
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: HDS - Forward Opening Canopy Design considerations |
Charles,
I'm building an HDS with the plans provided for the forward tilt canopy
w/short shocks.
The shorter shocks are much easier to build to and I believe the in-line
compression
of the shorter shocks are less a strain on the frame parts with the canopy
down. I've completed
the side frames, cylinder mounts, latch-locks and bows according to plans
provided but cannot make comparison with the XL.
So far I'm not having any difficulty with the guidance provided by the
plans. Note, the rear
bow sockets are supposed to be attached to a side plate that is bent inward
to align with
the rear bow. Just looking at it, I believe the canopy will fit fine
without bending those plates.
That can be done any time, but I've not mounted the canopy to it all yet
because I cannot get
in the plane until the top center section skins are riveted and my tank
installation is complete.
The convergence of so many things! I like the latch mechanism. They work
great.
Good luck,
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds at http://www.macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <charles.long(at)gm.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: HDS - Forward Opening Canopy Design considerations
>
> I'm at a point where I need to start installing the canopy hardware.
> I purchased the kit about three years ago when the Forward tilting open
> first came out. At that time they were using very long gas shocks that
> mounted at the floor level. Since then, the XL has went to what looks to
> me to be a cleaner setup. Shorter gas shocks that mount to the Upper
> Forward Longeron. Does anyone have any comments on the merits of these
two
> different approaches. Does the XL design also fit the HDS w/o any
> adaptation issues? I'm in a little bit of an awkward situation as I opted
> for the NACA vents using the ZAC plans. I didn't realize that the vents
> are in major interference with the floor mounted gas shocks.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Bockius" <bruce(at)whiteantelopesoftware.com> |
>
> Don't know how much interest there may be, but I've been
> playing around
> with Harbor Freight's powder coating system, and it's kind of
> neat! Write
> up at www.liming.org/ch801/powder.html
>
> Gary Liming
And it's on sale for $59.95 this month.
-Bruce
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ZodiacBuilder(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Log book enties..... |
What is the required log book entry for a conditional inspection?
Thanks in Advance guys,
John W. Tarabocchia
http://hometown.aol.com/zodiacbuilder
N6042T 80hrs Flown.....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Karnes" <jpkarnes(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Re: HDS - Forward Opening Canopy Design considerations |
After having my side opening canopy ripped from the fuselage on my maiden
flight, I opted for the forward opening design. I even had to wait for the
new engineering a couple of months before they would send the kit to me.
The refit went very smoothly and I coundn't be happier with the end result.
The only change I needed to make was shorten the bottom frame a few inches.
Good luck!
----- Original Message -----
From: <charles.long(at)gm.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: HDS - Forward Opening Canopy Design considerations
>
> I'm at a point where I need to start installing the canopy hardware.
> I purchased the kit about three years ago when the Forward tilting open
> first came out. At that time they were using very long gas shocks that
> mounted at the floor level. Since then, the XL has went to what looks to
> me to be a cleaner setup. Shorter gas shocks that mount to the Upper
> Forward Longeron. Does anyone have any comments on the merits of these
two
> different approaches. Does the XL design also fit the HDS w/o any
> adaptation issues? I'm in a little bit of an awkward situation as I opted
> for the NACA vents using the ZAC plans. I didn't realize that the vents
> are in major interference with the floor mounted gas shocks.
>
>
=
> _->
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
Dear Listers,
There are only a few days left until the November List of Contributors. I
thought I'd take another opportunity to pass along some of the really nice
things people have been saying recently about the Lists and how much they
mean to them.
If you receive value from the Lists in the form of ideas, assistance,
comradery, moral support, inspiration, or just plain 'ol good
entertainment, then won't take a moment to make a Contribution to support
the continued operation and upgrade of them?
Secure List Contribution Site: http://www.matronics.com/contribution
What does the List mean to you? Here's what some of your fellow
contributing List members have said...
------------------------- What Listers Are Saying -------------------------
Great service for aviation types like me.
Larry H
Best investment I've made.
Harley B
I've been on this list since around 1996 and used it to
help me finish my RV-6A three years ago. I'm still here
because I still learn from it and use it to help others
like me who may be where nobody else is building a RV.
Thanks for your service to our community. It's appreciated.
Jim S
[List] people are a great break away from politics, religion
and other sordid subjects.
Robert B
This site is a great confidence builder for the amateur builder.
Gene L
Great service!
Barry P
Very handy list to have, a good place for a beginner to
get great answers from those who already experienced it.
...sure enjoy reading it.
Joel R
...valuable service!
Chris & Indira K
This is the better than any morning paper - the best and
most frequent service that I use on the Internet. Great
job! This will make building the RV doable for me.
Pete E
I enjoy all of the ideas, suggestions and humor that comes
with this list. I don't think I could build my RV4 with
out everyone's help.
Ross S
GRRRRRRRRRRRREAT!
James W
The list is a great source of information, motivation,
entertainment, passionate debate, and light-hearted back
slapping. I wouldn't be without it.
Roger H
...would still be looking for plans to hook-up s-tec auto
pilot without your service!
David S
The new [digest] format is good.
Graham S
Great information you can't get anywhere else. Lots of nice
people who have "Been there...done that."
George D
My normal morning routine:
1 Kiss "the princess"
2 Good cup of coffee
3 Log onto "List"
A wonderful means of exchanging ideas, asking questions,
gathering information, and sharing experiences.
Robert G
Great lists. Not only are the lists professionally and efficiently
managed, but the *people* on the lists are very helpful, friendly
and fun to chat with. Thank you for this wonderful resource.
Ihab A
Thanks a million, well maybe not a million!!! (:
Ken H
I need this fix every morning or I get grumpy...
Wayne P
Very useful lists
Paul E
This communication medium that you created, nurtured and
continue to maintain is the best thing since AN rivets!
Jim J
The information I gleaned off the list has always been
helpful.
Kenneth B
I've been a subscriber to varied lists for several years
now. The knowledge provided has been extremely useful
throughout.
David P
Enjoy everyone's input even though I am not a
builder...just a flyer.
Douglas P
Just laughin' and a scratchin'
Dennis N
It is a real asset and good for comic relief.
Ross S
I can't build my plane without your service!
Kent H
Great info on the lists!
Wesley H
I'm very new to the List but have already benefited
greatly.
Jim S
The "List" has been my best source for information
concerning my aviation projects. Besides, it also
brings a bunch of people together to share their
interests and knowledge. Thanks for providing a
state of the art, easy to use resource tool.
David A
I have saved a lot of grief and dollars from referencing
this site. It is truly an extension of Van's product
support.
Joseph C
Terrific asset this List is to the builder!
Scott J
Great service!
Tony B
Look forward to the list each and every day.
John B
I could not cope up here in this lonely island without
the help of the List and all the wonderful helpful
people that have the experience of aircraft building
and flying for fun.
Johann J
This list is part of my daily routine. I'm addicted.
Terry D
Great forum!
John H
This list is my main interest in the Internet.
George R
Great list. The best out there on any subject.
Kevin H
Been on the list since 1998 and I still look forward to
reading the list every day. A most valuable tool. I have
picked up many useful tips during the construction of
my RV-4.
Jerry I
Thanks for all of your hard work on the lists. It is
one of the reasons I bought a CJ-6A. Without the
Yak-list, I believe it would have been much more
difficult to get all the information that I need
for safe operation and maintenance of this fine
aircraft.
David L
The List has been an amazing source of useful
information. I consider it one of my best builder
tools.
Gunter M
An excellent channel of information. I have gained a
wealth of knowledge on both building and flying Kolb
aircraft.
Jim B
Enjoy the wealth of information that is shared.
Richard N
Fine service.
Beauford T
[The] List is the first stop of the day. Made lot of
friends from it.
Orie S
The information I gleaned off the List has always been
helpful.
Kenneth B
Over the 3+ years that I have been building, I check it
several times each day. I have learned a lot of very
useful tips that have helped me in my building.
Richard D
Not only is it worth a contribution for the info gleaned
from it but the personalities alone are pure entertainment!
Stephen F
This is great stuff!!! Entertaining, too!! Fast answers
from those who really know...
Bob R
I am building an RV-9A and have received help from
the lists and occasionally been able to give help to
others.
Alden Van W
This list has saved me countless hours of work and worry
already, and I'm only halfway there! Undoubtedly the most
important aid I have yet found in this sometimes
intimidating process of building an aircraft.
Paul H
I've been a member since '96 and have learned so much from
the vast knowledge of the listers.
Gary Z
Outstanding List, exceptionally maintained.
David S
Thanks for all the improvements you've made this year. The
Photoshare feature definitely proves "one picture is worth
a thousand words".
Richard H
I finished my RV6A this year. It is a much better airplane
because of the help I found on the RV and Aeroelectric
Lists.
Dale W
Can't imagine building without the list.
Larry H
The list continues to be a great resource of information
and advice.
Jeff O
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Log book enties..... |
Below is the minimum entry that should be made in the engine and airframe logs.
=================================
Airframe Log Entry for Annual Condition Inspection 11/14/01
Inspected and tested ELT in accordance with FAR 91.207 par. D. Battery due
FEB 2002
I certify that this aircraft has been inspected in accordance with FAR 43
Appendix D for an annual condition inspection and was determined to be
airworthy.
John Doe, Anywhere, VT - Repairman
Certificate xxxxxx
Engine Log Entry for Annual Condition Inspection 11/14/01
I certify that this engine has been inspected in accordance with FAR 43
Appendix D for an annual condition inspection and was determined to be
airworthy.
John Doe, Anywhere,VT - Repairman
Certificate xxxxxx
===================================
Regards,
Bill
>
>What is the required log book entry for a conditional inspection?
>
>Thanks in Advance guys,
>
>John W. Tarabocchia
>
>http://hometown.aol.com/zodiacbuilder
>N6042T 80hrs Flown.....
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Log book enties..... |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/11/25 21:54, ZodiacBuilder(at)aol.com at ZodiacBuilder(at)aol.com wrote:
...
> John W. Tarabocchia
>
> http://hometown.aol.com/zodiacbuilder
> N6042T 80hrs Flown.....
Hey John! Long time - no see (er, hear? read?)
How's the plane working out? Any bugs needing to be shaken out? How are
you enjoying the modified control sticks? Is your paint still looking as
good as when installed - I thought that was a great suggestion for saving
money. How is the performance with the Lyc? engine (or was it Cont?) --
anyways, I remember it is a 'traditional' aviation engine.
Seeing as I am currently working through some issues with my automotive
conversion (Honda/CAM100) I am particularly iterested in that last question.
Maybe airplanes should only be powered by AIRPLANE engines? (or do these
have their own problems too?)
Warm regards,
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Trip report and web site |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
Hi Brent,
I just wanted to add my thanks for your informative web site. I enjoyed
reading about the trip and the photos are spectacular.
I also want to commend you on your web site - especially the maintenance
page. As I have been going through some frustrations tracking down an
ignition problem on my engine, I was less discouraged when reminded that
even Rotaxes have 'issues' (as George Pinneo would say... ;-).
I'm sure that the 'debugging' process is a significant part of flying any
new aircraft - but especially a homebuilt - and this is the kind of
information that we need more of.
I guess we are (okay, I am) a little shy about reporting problems as we are
afraid that 1) we will scare off others from investing in the same airframe
and/or engine and we'll end up as 'orphans' with even less support for our
product, and 2) that we will have to admit that we made a mistake, or at
least admit that our choice is not as SUPERIOUR as we might have originally
thought... ;-)
Anyhow - seeing how much fun and recreation we can look forward to having as
our aircraft matures, is very encouraging!
Thanks!
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "SKYSHOP" <duba(at)gate.net> |
| Subject: | Please do not open the postcard you received from my address. |
It is a virus!!! Danny (SKYSHOP)
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: XL Wing Nose skin |
David-
I'm in the process of finishing my first XL wing today. The bending process
is quite easy with at least four rachet type straps. I assume you have the
XL manual. If so go to page 8 and 9 of the wing assembly section. and
follow the pictures. Once you have the bottom rear skin clecoed, clecoe the
bottom nose skin over the rear skin. Turn over the wing and cleco the top
rear skin in position. To close the nose skin down, use 2x4x8 and a 2x4x4
and a 1x2x8 and 1x2x4 under the straps and slowly, one at a time, ratchet
down the straps, re adjusting the wood each time. I would also put a 1x3x8
inside the rear spar so not to damage it when the straps get tight. Keep
tightening until the rear edge of the nose skin is about 20mm over the front
flange of the main spar.Onec you are satisfied that the skin is where it
should be, trace a line with your felt tip pen on the rear top skin. I
think it will all come together as you follow the instructions. Good luck-
Al Young N601AY
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Barth <davids601xl(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: XL Wing Nose skin |
Al. Thanks for the excellent description. It shows
in the plans something about first benting the nose
skin around a piece of 1 3/8 inch pipe. Did you do
this process with a piece of flat sheet? By the way -
thanks for the quick reply.
David
--- Al Young <armyret@one-eleven.net> wrote:
> <armyret@one-eleven.net>
>
> David-
> I'm in the process of finishing my first XL wing
> today. The bending process
> is quite easy with at least four rachet type straps.
> I assume you have the
> XL manual.
=====
David Barth
601 XL Plansbuilder
Currently making parts.
Soob EA-82 SPFI
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wizard-24(at)juno.com |
Any XL builders out there have to bend the canopy side rails to match the
curvature of the upper longerons on the forward fuselage? The
instructions indicate that they shouldn't need to be bent at all, but to
me it seems necessary so that the rails line up with the outside edge of
the fuselage.
Thanks.
Mike Fortunato
601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
Mike,
I'm building the 601hds (plans with same message)but found it necessary to
put just a little bend into
the square tubing to get a match. Shouldn't hurt anything to do this.
I used a c-clamp and a couple of 1-inch blocks at 30-inch spacing on the
table.
This way, you get just a little bit of bend until its right.
Larry C. McFarland
----- Original Message -----
From: <wizard-24(at)juno.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: XL Canopy
>
>
> Any XL builders out there have to bend the canopy side rails to match the
> curvature of the upper longerons on the forward fuselage? The
> instructions indicate that they shouldn't need to be bent at all, but to
> me it seems necessary so that the rails line up with the outside edge of
> the fuselage.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Mike Fortunato
> 601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "doug" <dm10495(at)cedarnet.org> |
If the top or the radiator is mounted below the head of the engine will it
make any difference if you pull water from the top or bottom inlet of the
radiator?
Doug Mattson
dm10495(at)cedarnet.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David & Maria Lumgair" <dlummy(at)visi.net> |
Doug
I am not familiar with airplane cooling systems but am very versed in
automotive cooling systems - my recommendation is always draw from the
bottom and do so for 3 reasons:
1) Air rises to the top of a radiator - in the event that some of your
coolant does get "hot" and boil the pump will be pulling steam - need I say
more? steam doesn't cool very well.
2) Just as air is convective so is water - the water at the bottom of a
radiator is significantly cooler than the top.
3) Similar to reason 1 but less important - getting the air out of the
system becomes a task even with a head tank..
Hope this helps your decision - It's not impossible to have a system that
draws from the top BUT I would definitely have a head system that maintains
pressure even when cold to keep the air in the tank and not the radiator.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "doug" <dm10495(at)cedarnet.org>
Subject: Zenith-List: Radiator
>
> If the top or the radiator is mounted below the head of the engine will it
> make any difference if you pull water from the top or bottom inlet of the
> radiator?
>
> Doug Mattson
> dm10495(at)cedarnet.org
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Schallgren(at)aol.com |
601 HDS'ers:
N323WS finally flew as fast as Zenith said it would. Changed the prop today
from a Prince 58 X 48 to a Sensenich 64 X 49. Speeds recorded as follows
with the new prop:
6,500' - 2840 rpm=135 mph; 2750 rpm=130 mph; 2650 rpm=128 mph; 2550 rpm=120
mph.
7,500' - 2850 rpm=135 mph; 2750 rpm=128 mph; 2650 rpm=125 mph; 2550 rpm=120
mph.
Sixteen months and over 85 hours flying trying to fix a slow flying aircraft
was solved with a one hour prop change. Many thanks to Pete Krotje and
Sensenich for coming up with the solution. TR and I very much appreciate
the superb support provided by Pete of Jabiru US as we struggled to find
the solution. Numerous carb mods and changes were not the problem but we
really know a lot more about our aircraft as a result of our efforts.
After Turkey day we'll fly some more tests and provide a more comprehensive
report.
Fast at Last,
Stan Challgren & TR Moore
Zodiac 601 HDS/JABIRU 3300/Sensenich 64 X 49
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Bearing Clearance on Gear Legs - HDS |
| From: | charles.long(at)gm.com |
11/27/2002 11:02:33 AM
Made a Boo Boo on the Upper Nose Gear Bearing. Planned on .005
diametral clearance and ended up at .010-.015" Will be somewhat less after
painting the gear leg. There is noticable play fore and aft as well as
side to side. If this too much clearance or am I putting too much rocket
science into this? Appreciate everyone's feedback. Without experience,
it's hard to know what's an acceptable level of clearance.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Wood <mawood(at)zoo.uvm.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Bearing Clearance on Gear Legs - HDS |
My own feeling is that this would not be too bad. If you wanted to, you
could put a nylon/plastic bearing under the top surface. The paint will
take up most of this space, but will wear off quickly with use.
>
> Made a Boo Boo on the Upper Nose Gear Bearing. Planned on .005
>diametral clearance and ended up at .010-.015" Will be somewhat less after
>painting the gear leg. There is noticable play fore and aft as well as
>side to side. If this too much clearance or am I putting too much rocket
>science into this? Appreciate everyone's feedback. Without experience,
>it's hard to know what's an acceptable level of clearance.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Hartl" <pdhartl(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Subject: Zenith List, 601 Transcontinental Trip Narrative |
& Pictures
Hey Brent,
Thanks for making such a great website for us who are still in the
building process - it really helps to able to see where all this will be
going someday.
I was disappointed though, when I saw that you had flown right
past my home airport, Sun Valley (KSUN) in southern Idaho, and I
didn't get to see your beautiful red HD up close! If I had known a
fellow lister was flying out to my area, I would have thrown out the
red carpet! Which got me to thinking ....
Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
completed, flying Zenith aircraft. I for one would love to meet other
listers (and, of course, their airplanes) and would be more than
happy to offer up our guestroom (free, of course) to any Zenith
builder who needed a place to set down for the night. (Yes, I have
checked with my wife!). I am a 601HDS builder, and there is also a
701 builder, Win Ellis, 12 miles up the road from me. Our valley is
a pretty nice spot to visit, summer or winter, and the distances out
here in the west are such that any cross-country flyer is going to
need a place or two to set down, for fuel or rest, or both. Sun
Valley's Friedman Memorial Airport (KSUN - actually located in
Hailey, Idaho) has 6600' of paved runway (at 5315' MSL) and is
pretty much across the street from my house. (Watch those
afternoon gusty crosswinds in the summer, though!)
The Sun Valley Company's Bald Mountain ski resort is one of the
better ski resorts in the U.S., and the hiking, white-water rafting
and mountain biking in the summer is hard to beat anywhere. So
come on out you Zenith listers - Win and I would love to meet you,
see your aircraft and admire your craftsmanship, give you a tour of
the area - and maybe ask a little building advice!
If anyone else likes this idea of a Zenith builder location map put up
on a Website, let me know. I could do it at my Website (below) or
perhaps Matt has a spot on the Matronix site?
Thanks again, Brent!
Paul
Paul Hartl, 601HDS Stratus Subaru
Tail, rear fuse, central and outer wing panels completed; getting there!
FS2002 Aircraft Website: http://home.mindspring.com/~pdhartl/
email: pdhartl(at)mindspring.com or paul_hartl(at)communityschool.org
Sun Valley, Idaho 208-788-9147
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pilots Visits, was 601 Transcontinental Trip Narrative |
& Pictures
Paul,
That is a great idea, in fact, something similar happens here.
We are so few homebuilders (and active pilots here) that everytime a
pilot or pilots from a near club comes to visit us, we offer all the
help we can give: free rides to the gas station (no fuel pump in our
aerodrome), to the hotel, we make the reservations, etc.
If it happens to be in Saturday, we even make a Barbacue party... Same
happens when we visit any of the clubs near here.
Saludos
Gary Gower
Guadalajara, Jalisco, Mexico
701 912S
--- Paul Hartl wrote:
>
>
> Hey Brent,
>
> Thanks for making such a great website for us who are still in the
> building process - it really helps to able to see where all this will
> be
> going someday.
>
> I was disappointed though, when I saw that you had flown right
> past my home airport, Sun Valley (KSUN) in southern Idaho, and I
> didn't get to see your beautiful red HD up close! If I had known a
> fellow lister was flying out to my area, I would have thrown out the
> red carpet! Which got me to thinking ....
>
> Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
> least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> completed, flying Zenith aircraft. I for one would love to meet
> other
> listers (and, of course, their airplanes) and would be more than
> happy to offer up our guestroom (free, of course) to any Zenith
> builder who needed a place to set down for the night. (Yes, I have
> checked with my wife!). I am a 601HDS builder, and there is also a
> 701 builder, Win Ellis, 12 miles up the road from me. Our valley is
> a pretty nice spot to visit, summer or winter, and the distances out
> here in the west are such that any cross-country flyer is going to
> need a place or two to set down, for fuel or rest, or both. Sun
> Valley's Friedman Memorial Airport (KSUN - actually located in
> Hailey, Idaho) has 6600' of paved runway (at 5315' MSL) and is
> pretty much across the street from my house. (Watch those
> afternoon gusty crosswinds in the summer, though!)
>
> The Sun Valley Company's Bald Mountain ski resort is one of the
> better ski resorts in the U.S., and the hiking, white-water rafting
> and mountain biking in the summer is hard to beat anywhere. So
> come on out you Zenith listers - Win and I would love to meet you,
> see your aircraft and admire your craftsmanship, give you a tour of
> the area - and maybe ask a little building advice!
>
> If anyone else likes this idea of a Zenith builder location map put
> up
> on a Website, let me know. I could do it at my Website (below) or
> perhaps Matt has a spot on the Matronix site?
>
> Thanks again, Brent!
>
> Paul
> Paul Hartl, 601HDS Stratus Subaru
> Tail, rear fuse, central and outer wing panels completed; getting
> there!
> FS2002 Aircraft Website: http://home.mindspring.com/~pdhartl/
> email: pdhartl(at)mindspring.com or paul_hartl(at)communityschool.org
> Sun Valley, Idaho 208-788-9147
>
>
>
> _->
>
>
>
>
>
>
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Aaron" <agustafson(at)chartermi.net> |
| Subject: | Zenith flyers home airports |
Great idea Paul . Count me in! Lets get started.I'm in Iron Mountain Mich. Truly
Gods country.
Aaron
601HDTD plans 75%
Re. from Paul Hartl
Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
completed, flying Zenith aircraft. I for one would love to meet other
listers (and, of course, their airplanes) and would be more than
happy to offer up our guestroom (free, of course) to any Zenith
builder who needed a place to set down for the night. (Yes, I have
checked with my wife!).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Golovich" <john(at)golovich.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Subject: Zenith List, 601 Transcontinental Trip Narrative |
& Pictures
Great Idea Paul.
KONZ is where I call home, Grosse Ile, MI
For those of you who don't know this airport (most don't), Grosse Ile is an
island on the Detroit River. The Detroit River connects Lake Erie and Lake
St. Clair.
If the wind is right, you will have a wonderful approach over the water to
one of the two runways, laid out in a V pattern.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Hartl" <pdhartl(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Subject: Zenith List, 601 Transcontinental Trip
Narrative & Pictures
>
> Hey Brent,
>
> Thanks for making such a great website for us who are still in the
> building process - it really helps to able to see where all this will be
> going someday.
>
> I was disappointed though, when I saw that you had flown right
> past my home airport, Sun Valley (KSUN) in southern Idaho, and I
> didn't get to see your beautiful red HD up close! If I had known a
> fellow lister was flying out to my area, I would have thrown out the
> red carpet! Which got me to thinking ....
>
> Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
> least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> completed, flying Zenith aircraft. I for one would love to meet other
> listers (and, of course, their airplanes) and would be more than
> happy to offer up our guestroom (free, of course) to any Zenith
> builder who needed a place to set down for the night. (Yes, I have
> checked with my wife!). I am a 601HDS builder, and there is also a
> 701 builder, Win Ellis, 12 miles up the road from me. Our valley is
> a pretty nice spot to visit, summer or winter, and the distances out
> here in the west are such that any cross-country flyer is going to
> need a place or two to set down, for fuel or rest, or both. Sun
> Valley's Friedman Memorial Airport (KSUN - actually located in
> Hailey, Idaho) has 6600' of paved runway (at 5315' MSL) and is
> pretty much across the street from my house. (Watch those
> afternoon gusty crosswinds in the summer, though!)
>
> The Sun Valley Company's Bald Mountain ski resort is one of the
> better ski resorts in the U.S., and the hiking, white-water rafting
> and mountain biking in the summer is hard to beat anywhere. So
> come on out you Zenith listers - Win and I would love to meet you,
> see your aircraft and admire your craftsmanship, give you a tour of
> the area - and maybe ask a little building advice!
>
> If anyone else likes this idea of a Zenith builder location map put up
> on a Website, let me know. I could do it at my Website (below) or
> perhaps Matt has a spot on the Matronix site?
>
> Thanks again, Brent!
>
> Paul
> Paul Hartl, 601HDS Stratus Subaru
> Tail, rear fuse, central and outer wing panels completed; getting there!
> FS2002 Aircraft Website: http://home.mindspring.com/~pdhartl/
> email: pdhartl(at)mindspring.com or paul_hartl(at)communityschool.org
> Sun Valley, Idaho 208-788-9147
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Cannon <matt.cannon(at)asml.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
You can count me in too, although I am not a builer yet, I plan to be as
soon as money allows. I'm in Dallas area, between Addison and McKinney
airports. And if there's anyone in the area that could use an extra hand
for anything I would love to learn what I cn abefore I start building..
Matt Cannon
Plano, Tx
Aaron wrote:
>
>
> Great idea Paul . Count me in! Lets get started.I'm in Iron Mountain Mich.
Truly Gods country.
>
> Aaron
> 601HDTD plans 75%
>
> Re. from Paul Hartl
>
> Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
> least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> completed, flying Zenith aircraft. I for one would love to meet other
> listers (and, of course, their airplanes) and would be more than
> happy to offer up our guestroom (free, of course) to any Zenith
> builder who needed a place to set down for the night. (Yes, I have
> checked with my wife!).
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Pwalsh4539(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
Ditto, here...have a grass strip(1500' with obstructions) or nearby 9000 ft
runway uncontrolled....3 miles away...guest room etc....
Patrick Walsh
601HD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chesterman Family <chesterman(at)on.aibn.com> |
Hi John.
We are always looking for neat spots to fly to from southern ont. Is the
island classed as USA which would mean we would have to deal with
customs at prt huron first?
Dave Chesterman
701/582 flown to osh once and counting
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
I'm in Atlanta. My flying 601HDS is based at KVPC, Cartersville, GA at the
moment. There are several other Zodiacs in the Greater Atlanta area.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Aaron" <agustafson(at)chartermi.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Zenith flyers home airports
>
> Great idea Paul . Count me in! Lets get started.I'm in Iron Mountain
Mich. Truly Gods country.
>
> Aaron
> 601HDTD plans 75%
>
>
> Re. from Paul Hartl
>
>
> Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
> least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> completed, flying Zenith aircraft. I for one would love to meet other
> listers (and, of course, their airplanes) and would be more than
> happy to offer up our guestroom (free, of course) to any Zenith
> builder who needed a place to set down for the night. (Yes, I have
> checked with my wife!).
>
>
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Bulging Wing Tank |
| From: | Tony Bonsell <tbonsell(at)luxuria.com> |
Hi Guys
I'm installing the wing tank on my 701. It REALLY bulges out at the top and
bottom, so much so that it won't clear the fuel level sender on top, while
sitting on the bottom wing skin on it's bulged middle (rather than at the
front and back edges).
I can oil can the top down to clear the fuel level sender, but if I push in
the bottom, I'm sure the weight of fuel will punch it back down into the
botton skin again. Should I leave the bottom bulged down and hold it up a
bit somehow? Additional cork thickness? An additional supporting "l" on the
rear channel?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Stainless Steel Firewall for 701 |
This week we build a mold to make the firewall for our 701 out of
Stainless Steel, same gauge as the galvanized one in the kit.
We couldnt resist making it, we have the material already, we
manufacture Stainless Steel food carts for a living...
Cost (for us) was very low, we buy materials wholesale... a little
harder to work, but is worth it. Looks first class.
We paid special atention to have a flat piece of material for every
rivet (for the pitch in the plans). What do you think?
I send photos to photoshare.
Saludos
Gary Gower
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Stout" <r5t0ut(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
One of the guys on the KR list has a similar program. Check it out and see
if you like it: http://www.fortunecity.com/marina/anchor/270/mapframe.html .
Notice the Copyright.... Carlos Sa. Feel free to jump in here any time
Carlos.
Randy Stout - Las Vegas NV
CH601HD N282RS
r5t0ut(at)earthlink.net
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~r5t0ut/
>
>
> Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
> least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> completed, flying Zenith aircraft. I for one would love to meet other
> listers (and, of course, their airplanes) and would be more than
> happy to offer up our guestroom (free, of course) to any Zenith
> builder who needed a place to set down for the night. (Yes, I have
> checked with my wife!).
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <mark.townsend(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Steel Firewall for 701 |
Gary you may wish to invite Chris Heintz 's opinion on the SS. For several
reasons he is against it. Get the facts first so that you will know what you
must do in order to use it with the 6061
Mark
601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Wednesday, November 27, 2002 9:36 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Stainless Steel Firewall for 701
>
>
>This week we build a mold to make the firewall for our 701 out of
>Stainless Steel, same gauge as the galvanized one in the kit.
>
>We couldnt resist making it, we have the material already, we
>manufacture Stainless Steel food carts for a living...
>
>Cost (for us) was very low, we buy materials wholesale... a little
>harder to work, but is worth it. Looks first class.
>
>We paid special atention to have a flat piece of material for every
>rivet (for the pitch in the plans). What do you think?
>
>I send photos to photoshare.
>
>Saludos
>Gary Gower
>
>
>http://mailplus.yahoo.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | New Gift Selection Added - List Fund Raiser! [Please Read] |
Dear Listers,
I've just added a great new last minute Gift Selection to this year's List
Fund Raiser line up! I have a very limited number of sets of a wonderful
collection of Aircraft Technical books by Jeppesen entitled "The A&P
Technical Series Book Set". This is a great opportunity to make a generous
Contribution to support the Lists and walk away with a great set of
reference manuals at the same time.
This set of books normally retails for over $117 PLUS shipping, but you can
pick up your set AND make this year's List Contribution for a cool C-note -
that's a $100, by the way! :-) I'm thinking "Great Christmas Gift"...
There's more information on the books and making your Contribution at the
List Contribution web site:
Email List Contribution Web Site: http://www.matronics.com/contribution
We're coming close to the official end of this year's List Fund Raiser and
if you haven't yet made your Contribution, there's still time get your name
on that List of Contributors! The percentage of contributors is kind of
low this year but I'm hoping many of you are just holding out until the
last minute!
I want to thank each and everyone of you that has already made a donation
to support the continued operation and upgrade of these List Services. As
I've mentioned in the past, running these Lists is a labor of love for me
and the hours upon hours of code development, system maintenance, and
upgrades are MY Contribution to support this great resource for Builders
and Flyer's alike. Won't your take a minute and make YOUR Contribution today?
I want to thank you for your support both during the Fund Raiser but also
throughout the year in the form of kind words and moral support. A nice
comment from a List member about how much the lists have helped them is
always a sure way to brighten my day!
Thank you to all!
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wayne McIntosh" <mcintosh3017(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Steel Firewall for 701 |
Gary,
Listen to Mark, years ago some Bonanzas had their engines fall off upon
making a hard landing. It was caused by corrosion where the stainless steel
firewall and aluminum fuselage met. Somehow Beechcraft fixed it.
Wayne McIntosh Lafayette IN
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Townsend" <mark.townsend(at)sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Stainless Steel Firewall for 701
>
> Gary you may wish to invite Chris Heintz 's opinion on the SS. For several
> reasons he is against it. Get the facts first so that you will know what
you
> must do in order to use it with the 6061
>
> Mark
> 601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com>
> To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Wednesday, November 27, 2002 9:36 PM
> Subject: Zenith-List: Stainless Steel Firewall for 701
>
>
> >
> >
> >This week we build a mold to make the firewall for our 701 out of
> >Stainless Steel, same gauge as the galvanized one in the kit.
> >
> >We couldnt resist making it, we have the material already, we
> >manufacture Stainless Steel food carts for a living...
> >
> >Cost (for us) was very low, we buy materials wholesale... a little
> >harder to work, but is worth it. Looks first class.
> >
> >We paid special atention to have a flat piece of material for every
> >rivet (for the pitch in the plans). What do you think?
> >
> >I send photos to photoshare.
> >
> >Saludos
> >Gary Gower
> >
> >
> >http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "eric tingey" <etingeyzenair(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
You can count me in to.
Eric Tingey
Grand Haven MI
601HD
>From: Matt Cannon <matt.cannon(at)asml.com>
>Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Zenith flyers home airports
>Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 16:57:08 -0700
>
>
>You can count me in too, although I am not a builer yet, I plan to be as
>soon as money allows. I'm in Dallas area, between Addison and McKinney
>airports. And if there's anyone in the area that could use an extra hand
>for anything I would love to learn what I cn abefore I start building..
>
>Matt Cannon
>Plano, Tx
>
>Aaron wrote:
> >
> >
> > Great idea Paul . Count me in! Lets get started.I'm in Iron Mountain
>Mich. Truly Gods country.
> >
> > Aaron
> > 601HDTD plans 75%
> >
> > Re. from Paul Hartl
> >
> > Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> > Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
> > least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> > completed, flying Zenith aircraft. I for one would love to meet other
> > listers (and, of course, their airplanes) and would be more than
> > happy to offer up our guestroom (free, of course) to any Zenith
> > builder who needed a place to set down for the night. (Yes, I have
> > checked with my wife!).
> >
>
>
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fast at Last |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/11/27 00:56, Schallgren(at)aol.com at Schallgren(at)aol.com wrote:
> 601 HDS'ers:
>
> N323WS finally flew as fast as Zenith said it would. Changed the prop today
> from a Prince 58 X 48 to a Sensenich 64 X 49.
Cool!
I know that Mike uses a short prop on his HDS and gets better cruise speeds
too.
After the turkey is digested, maybe you could provide some more data about
your prop. Is it two or three blades? I think the 64 refers to diameter
and the 49 refers to the theoretical forward travel in one revolution...
yes? So, does anyone have a formula for converting this to propellor blade
angle for those who use ground adjustable props like the Warp Drives, etc..
Good work,
by the way - What is the official Horsepower rating of the Jab 3300?
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/11/27 18:40, Matthew Mucker at matthew(at)mucker.net wrote:
>
> All,
>
> I'm willing to host a database on my web server. I'm putting up a new
> website within a few days to chronicle the building of my soon-to-be CH640.
>
> Anyone know of any cheap/free solutions that would do a geographical search?
> For instance, if I'm going to visit airport K123, I'd like to be able to do
> a search on my website for nearby builders.
Maybe a graphical map-based interface with the home airports identified?
Similar to a gps map depiction of airports?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Steel Firewall for 701 |
Hello Mark and list,
I just sent an email to ZAC asking for the advise.
I will let you know their comment, lists are a great tool for safety
flying.
A few months ago we made two SS firewalls for two local Kitfox Series 6
projects, the diference is that those fuselages are cromoly, maybe
there is no problem.
I will post another comment is separate subject about something strange
that happened with paint...
Saludos
Gary Gower
--- Mark Townsend wrote:
>
>
> Gary you may wish to invite Chris Heintz 's opinion on the SS. For
> several
> reasons he is against it. Get the facts first so that you will know
> what you
> must do in order to use it with the 6061
>
> Mark
> 601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com>
> To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Wednesday, November 27, 2002 9:36 PM
> Subject: Zenith-List: Stainless Steel Firewall for 701
>
>
> >
> >
> >This week we build a mold to make the firewall for our 701 out of
> >Stainless Steel, same gauge as the galvanized one in the kit.
> >
> >We couldnt resist making it, we have the material already, we
> >manufacture Stainless Steel food carts for a living...
> >
> >Cost (for us) was very low, we buy materials wholesale... a little
> >harder to work, but is worth it. Looks first class.
> >
> >We paid special atention to have a flat piece of material for every
> >rivet (for the pitch in the plans). What do you think?
> >
> >I send photos to photoshare.
> >
> >Saludos
> >Gary Gower
> >
> >
> >http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> >
> >
>
>
>
> _->
>
>
>
>
>
>
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Painting comment. |
Hello list,
This are the facts:
CH 701 912 S
We are building our plane as per plans, the only diference at present
is that we are painting inside and out every part with Zinc Chromate,
not as ZAC advices just to paint the contact areas only, (and the new
Stainless Steel firewall, now in stand by untill is OK'ed).
Well when we finished the assemble of the firewall parts
(reinforcements and front wheel) with clecos, everything was green over
Stainless Steel, so yesterday morning Larry decided to finish paint all
the parts to see how they will look over the firewall.
We are using Dupont "Imron". Only the inside part of one of the two
"Z" reinforcements was not painted, he had the paint ready (is a two
part poluiretane (sp?) paint) so if not used had to be dumped, he
cleaned the unprotected side with Acetone and once dryed he painted it.
Well, when we arrived for the night work on the project, the paint was
already dryed. The paint in the unprotected side (no Zinc Chromate)
just peeled off like a stamp with no glue! The paint with the ZC is
hard as rock and was ready for the second hand of paint.
What paint are you using in the plain aluminum fuselage? Someone has
experienced a similar problem.
The only parts of the plane previous painted were the cromoly parts of
the cabin and engine mount, paint perfect here, we normally use this
type of paint in our shop (not over AL of course).
Your comments will be appreciated.
Saludos
Gary Gower.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Steel Firewall for 701 |
Gary,
I used stainless on my firewall, but it's a lot of work besides the forming.
When you use stainless steel for the firewall, you need to coat and seal
surface contact parts of both aluminum and stainless, then these joints need
to be sealed to eliminate moisture that might get between these parts.
Parts are riveted after zinc chromating and then coated again. Commercial
aircraft have used some stainless but it is always plated or coated and
isolated.
The rate of corrosion reaction depends on how close you are to salt water or
polluted acid air.
Even just aluminum will corrode rather rapidly to distruction if you live on
the coast
and have not primed all the internal and joining surfaces.
Best regards,
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Gower" <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Stainless Steel Firewall for 701
>
>
> This week we build a mold to make the firewall for our 701 out of
> Stainless Steel, same gauge as the galvanized one in the kit.
>
> We couldnt resist making it, we have the material already, we
> manufacture Stainless Steel food carts for a living...
>
> Cost (for us) was very low, we buy materials wholesale... a little
> harder to work, but is worth it. Looks first class.
>
> We paid special atention to have a flat piece of material for every
> rivet (for the pitch in the plans). What do you think?
>
> I send photos to photoshare.
>
> Saludos
> Gary Gower
>
>
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ZodiacBuilder(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
In a message dated 11/27/2002 9:41:27 PM Eastern Standard Time,
r5t0ut(at)earthlink.net writes:
> Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> >Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
> >least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> >completed, flying Zenith aircraft.
You can count me in too.........
John W. Tarabocchia
http://hometown.aol.com/zodiacbuilder
N6042T 80hrs Flown.....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Flydog1966(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | stainless firewall |
Couple comments...I may be mistaken, but I think I read somewhere in AC43.13
that it is o.k. to put stainless in contact with alum.,I'll have to look and
see if I can find that again. Also in the 3rd. edition manual/plans it says
"stainless or galvinized" for firewall. Why do they not recomend it now?
And if I use galv., I'm sure 'gonna scratch that coating some place, and I'd
better prime the drilled holes, and I hope when the rivet is pulled it
does'nt scratch off the primer,or else i'm still 'gonna have steel-to-alum
problems. Geez, theres just no way to prevent corrosion is there?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: stainless firewall |
>
>Couple comments...I may be mistaken, but I think I read somewhere in AC43.13
>that it is o.k. to put stainless in contact with alum.,I'll have to look and
>see if I can find that again. Also in the 3rd. edition manual/plans it says
>"stainless or galvinized" for firewall. Why do they not recomend it now?
>And if I use galv., I'm sure 'gonna scratch that coating some place, and I'd
>better prime the drilled holes, and I hope when the rivet is pulled it
>does'nt scratch off the primer,or else i'm still 'gonna have steel-to-alum
>problems. Geez, theres just no way to prevent corrosion is there?
I'm not sure its as bad as that. In one of Chris Heinz's talks, he
describes an experiment where a piece of tape is placed across some metal,
and the metal is sprayed with ZnChromate and then the the tape is
removed. Corrosion doesn't occur for 1/4 inch from the border of where the
zinc chromate stops, proving that the galvanic action of the zinc extends
for a small distance from the border of the zinc.
This is why he says that the rivets themselves are offered some protection,
as well as the rims of holes that have been sprayed (or coated with zinc,
as in the galvanized steel.) Even with the galvanized steel, priming it
and painting it will offer some additional protection with very little
weight gain. As for weight, I have some approximate calculations for that at
www.liming.org/ch801/research.html (take the Corrosion link)
and welcome any differing opinions.
Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dirk Andrepont" <dandrepont(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
Aaron wrote:
Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
completed, flying Zenith aircraft
Please count me in as well.
Dirk Andrepont 801 builder
St. Landry Parish Airport...Ahart Field KOPL
Opelousas, La
----- Original Message -----
From: "Aaron" <agustafson(at)chartermi.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Zenith flyers home airports
>
> Great idea Paul . Count me in! Lets get started.I'm in Iron Mountain
Mich. Truly Gods country.
>
> Aaron
> 601HDTD plans 75%
>
>
> Re. from Paul Hartl
>
>
> Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
> least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> completed, flying Zenith aircraft. I for one would love to meet other
> listers (and, of course, their airplanes) and would be more than
> happy to offer up our guestroom (free, of course) to any Zenith
> builder who needed a place to set down for the night. (Yes, I have
> checked with my wife!).
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | [PLEASE READ!] "What is my Contribution used for?" |
Dear Listers,
Some have asked, "What is my Contribution used for?", and this is a valid
question. Here are just a few examples of what your direct List support
enables. It provides for the expensive, business-class, high-speed
Internet connection used on the List, insuring maximum performance and
minimal contention when accessing List services. It pays for the regular
system hardware and software upgrades enabling the highest performance
possible for services such as the Archive Search Engine and List
Browser. It pays for 14+ years worth of online archive data available for
instant random access. And, it offsets the many hours spent writing,
developing, and maintaining the custom applications that power this List
Service such as the List Browse, Search Engine, and Photoshare.
But most importantly, your List Contribution enables a forum where you and
your peers can communicate freely in an environment that is free from
moderation, censorship, advertising, commercialism, SPAM, and computer
viruses. How many places on the Internet can you make all those statements
about these days? I will venture to say - next to none...
It is YOUR CONTRIBUTION that directly enables these many desirable aspects
of this most valuable List service. Please support it today with your List
Contribution. Its the best investment you can make in your Sport - BAR NONE!
Email List Contribution Web Site:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Thank you for your support!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Christoph Weber <Chrisoz(at)gmx.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Steel Firewall |
Hello Listers,
I have made the firewall for my second, scratch build 601 from stainless
steel, and it looks beautifull. Forming it was easy, took the better part of two
hours. Zinccromate primer on the contact surfaces, but nothing else. My
first Zodiac has been living next to the ocean for the last two years, was build
50 meters of the beach in a shed, and is bare, i.e. polished up. Exept for
the odd blemish there is no corrosion at all, more a problem with sweatstains
then anything else.
So I am not worried about electrolytic corrosion between firewall and
airframe.
Relax, guys, this 6061T6 is pretty strong medicine!
Cheers, Chris
601 UL "Small And Humble" 55 h
601 HD 60% construction
--
+++ GMX - Mail, Messaging & more http://www.gmx.net +++
NEU: Mit GMX ins Internet. Rund um die Uhr fr 1 ct/ Min. surfen!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Steel Firewall |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/11/29 03:54, Christoph Weber at Chrisoz(at)gmx.net wrote:
...
> So I am not worried about electrolytic corrosion between firewall and
> airframe.
> Relax, guys, this 6061T6 is pretty strong medicine!
Chris,
Thanks for posting this! I originally followed Chris Heinz's recommendation
and built my aircraft without extra anti-corrosion treatment. Then as I
read postings on this list, I did include some Zinc Oxide undercoating in
the fuselage areas, especially in the cockpit where dirty shoes (i.e. with
winter salt?) would often tread...
Then the more I'd read other's opinions about corrosion treatments the more
paranoid I was getting about my 'unprotected' aircraft. Your note of actual
experience helps me re-establish a balanced view.
The one place that I do need to pay more attention to, however, is some of
my steel parts. The Zenair plans really don't provide much guidance about
the need to protect these parts, and I find that in some areas, I should do
more - so I'm going back and checking for any necessary 'upgrade' to the
corrosion protection. I think these are more important than any of the
alu-on-alu areas.
Thanks again,
Grant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JNBOLDING1" <JNBOLDING1(at)mail.ev1.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Steel Firewall |
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net>
Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 07:36:47 -0500
>
>on 02/11/29 03:54, Christoph Weber at Chrisoz(at)gmx.net wrote:
>...
>> So I am not worried about electrolytic corrosion between firewall and
>> airframe.
>> Relax, guys, this 6061T6 is pretty strong medicine!
>
>Chris,
>
>Thanks for posting this! I originally followed Chris Heinz's recommendation
>and built my aircraft without extra anti-corrosion treatment. Then as I
>read postings on this list, I did include some Zinc Oxide undercoating in
>the fuselage areas, especially in the cockpit where dirty shoes (i.e. with
>winter salt?) would often tread...
>
>Then the more I'd read other's opinions about corrosion treatments the more
>paranoid I was getting about my 'unprotected' aircraft. Your note of actual
>experience helps me re-establish a balanced view.
>
>The one place that I do need to pay more attention to, however, is some of
>my steel parts. The Zenair plans really don't provide much guidance about
>the need to protect these parts, and I find that in some areas, I should do
>more - so I'm going back and checking for any necessary 'upgrade' to the
>corrosion protection. I think these are more important than any of the
>alu-on-alu areas.
>
Normally I just lurk and listen but this is what I did for a living for 32 yrs.
(corrosion control) Built one of the first RV3s in the early 70's and used
somebodys corrosion resistant epoxy primer inside and out on all parts before
assy. (also used stainless firewall). I live in Baytown Tx about 2 miles from
salt water in one of the worst areas in the country as far a industrial pollution.
I operated the Rv off the beach for YEARS as I used it for fishing transportation
to the Lower Texas coast. During a rebuild of this airplane last year
I removed the wing skins and had a good look around, found one area of light
corrosion between the top of one rib and the inside of the skin, about 1/2 inch
in dia. This is all 2024t3 opposed to the more resistant 6061t6. Figure it
out. Prior to painting use Alum cleaner and lots of water to rinse instead of
solvent. You are just moving the oils and contaminates around with lacq. thinner
and other solvents, when you wash your greasy hands do you get them all
soaped up and go to the towel before rinsing? Low and Slow John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
Can anyone on the list help me with a paint colour question..
I want to use camoflage colours as used by wartime aircraft. I have the
definition of the colours in British standards numbers and Federal Standards
numbers.
How do I get paint suppliers to create the colours I want? None of them
seem to recognise BS or FS numbers.
Guess what I need is a cross-reference of how much red/yellow/blue I have
to mix together to get each of the desired colours, but I can't find
anything like that.
Anyone help?
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
________________________________________________________________________________
Folks: I just transferred to this list from the Ercoupers list and corrosion
is a big deal over there. A lot of our coupes have died an early death (only
50 years) from center spar corrosion. The design of the windows allow rain to
flow into the cockpit and accumulate under the spar even though there are
drain holes. In fact, the FAA is proposing a new AD on inspection plates.
The other 1946 coupe at my field was just laid to rest at the last annual for
this.I guess my point is that the coupes have only lasted 56 years with no
protection and a very poor design for water accumulation. The owners of
"Clean" coupes expect them to see 100 years. I do plan on zinc-ing my new XL
just because. I am 50 now and if I can get another 50 years out of it that
will just about take me to the end of my flying career.
Jack Russell
Fresno-chandler CA
601xl (shipping Dec26- takes me back to the childhood excitement of waiting
for Christmas day)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Frisby" <marslander(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
Jim Frisby (marslander(at)hotmail.com)
Visit in person:
Palmer Alaska
Palmer Municipal Airport PAQ (ICAO symbol PAAQ)
Visit on line:
http://www.palmerchamber.org/palmer_attractions.htm
http://www.alaskascreensavers.com/webcam.htm
Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | When to install the elevator trim? |
Rough finished the elevator on my XL a few minutes ago and decided to come
in and take a short break be for I pull the Clecos and start deburring. I
started to wonder if now before closing up the elevator would be the best
time to install the trim tab or should I wait.
My question is which will be easier do it now as part of the elevator build
(That seem logical to me.) or is there a reason to wait till some later
point and when is that later point?
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
Zodiac 601XL
N601WR (Working on Tail)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | B K Johnson <wa7dvd(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: When to install the elevator trim? |
Hi,
Like many I have been reading for some time, but never posted a reply.
I am at about the same stage on my elevator, and I elected to install the trim
tab before
closing. I am glad I did. I found that being able to reach the inside through
the front
edge made it a lot easier.
Bruce Johnson
Zodiac 601 XL
(elevator nearly done)
"W. R. \"Gig\" Giacona" wrote:
>
> Rough finished the elevator on my XL a few minutes ago and decided to come
> in and take a short break be for I pull the Clecos and start deburring. I
> started to wonder if now before closing up the elevator would be the best
> time to install the trim tab or should I wait.
>
> My question is which will be easier do it now as part of the elevator build
> (That seem logical to me.) or is there a reason to wait till some later
> point and when is that later point?
>
> W.R. "Gig" Giacona
> Zodiac 601XL
> N601WR (Working on Tail)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dave" <dave(at)netbase.net> |
I installed my elavator and aileron trims after closing up surfaces, no problem
XL ready to test fly,now to find some decent weather
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: When to install the elevator trim? |
W.R.,
The trim tab is probably best laid out on the completed stabilizer. On my
601 hds, the trim tab is externalized, (plans show it either way). In either
case,
it was easier for me to add the access plates, align hinge and driving
hardware
after the assembly was all riveted up. Note: when riveting the plastic
flanged motor
housing, put a rivet-washer over the end of the 4 pop-rivets that go thru
the plastic flange.
Then the rivets won't crack the plastic by expanding in the plastic while
drawing
it down in place.
Your question: If there be anything that needs attention prior to closing
the stab, like wiring
and adding grommets for those wires, do it. That part would probably be
easier if you
have any mid-rib holes to make.
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds
----- Original Message -----
From: "W. R. "Gig" Giacona" <wr.giacona@cox-internet.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: When to install the elevator trim?
<wr.giacona@cox-internet.com>
>
> Rough finished the elevator on my XL a few minutes ago and decided to come
> in and take a short break be for I pull the Clecos and start deburring. I
> started to wonder if now before closing up the elevator would be the best
> time to install the trim tab or should I wait.
>
> My question is which will be easier do it now as part of the elevator
build
> (That seem logical to me.) or is there a reason to wait till some later
> point and when is that later point?
>
> W.R. "Gig" Giacona
> Zodiac 601XL
> N601WR (Working on Tail)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Subaru valve adjustments questions |
Hi Bill,
Thanks for all the help on the valve adjustment, and also sending copies of
your manual. I did my first adjustment today (at 18.5 hour). Your tip on
putting a finger over the spark plug hole & finding the compression, then
looking with a flash light into the hole worked great. All the advice you
sent really made things MUCH easier for me. I'm very glad I checked mine as
the valves were ALL low (to tight). The average gap I had was .0085, a far
cry from Mykal's .014 spec (and I only had 18 hours on it). I found once I
did the first one to get the hang of it, the rest were pretty easy. I ran
through the entire adjustment twice just to make sure.
How were your valves on the first adjustment? Did Mykal have yours that
tight?
Thanks once again for coming to the rescue!
Kelly
PS. Hope you and the family had a Happy Thanksgiving!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <carlosfsa(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Shopping for a drill press |
If you are shopping for a drill press, consider this:
I'm building from scratch (601HD), and tonight I was all set to drill the holes
in
the centre spar web. I moved the drill press from its small table to the large
workbench, so I could maneuver the spar easily.
I placed supports on both sides, set the drill speed, installed the fly cutter,
set
the radius to 47.5 mm and... guess what, the press does not reach the centre of
the
spar.
In other words, the distance from the press column to the axis of the drill bit
is
some 127 mm (5"), ~10 mm too short for the job.
Similar situation happened when cutting holes on the ribs, so I cut them by holding
the fly cutter. Not too bad, as the Al is fairly thin. The spar web is made of
.040...
Nuts!
Carlos
Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Subaru valve adjustments questions |
Sorry list, I meant to send that to Bill & not to everyone..............
do not achieve
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Gary Gower ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Gary Gower
Subject: Stailess Steel Firewall
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/ggower_99@yahoo.com.11.29.2002/index.html
--------------------------------------------
o EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
o Main Photo Share Index:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
--------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
Hello Dick,
Just for the fun of it, I am "looking" at every airport that all the
listers kindly offer...
In your airport the photo is missing, will be great to send them one.
Just click on "airports" every time someone post a identifier, is a
wonderfull filling to dream in visit all of them.
Sorry that it only covers USA airports, my airstrip mexican identifier
is PAKO and this same one is from a military one in Alazca, maybe this
is why we are not listed...
Here we should have a diferent identifier system... well at least we
still have some airports left :-(
Saludos
Gary Gower
--- Dirk Andrepont wrote:
>
>
>
> Aaron wrote:
>
> Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
> least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> completed, flying Zenith aircraft
>
> Please count me in as well.
>
> Dirk Andrepont 801 builder
> St. Landry Parish Airport...Ahart Field KOPL
> Opelousas, La
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Aaron" <agustafson(at)chartermi.net>
> To:
> Subject: Zenith-List: Zenith flyers home airports
>
>
>
> >
> > Great idea Paul . Count me in! Lets get started.I'm in Iron
> Mountain
> Mich. Truly Gods country.
> >
> > Aaron
> > 601HDTD plans 75%
> >
> >
> > Re. from Paul Hartl
> >
> >
> > Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> > Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
> > least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> > completed, flying Zenith aircraft. I for one would love to meet
> other
> > listers (and, of course, their airplanes) and would be more than
> > happy to offer up our guestroom (free, of course) to any Zenith
> > builder who needed a place to set down for the night. (Yes, I have
> > checked with my wife!).
> >
> >
>
>
>
> _->
>
>
>
>
>
>
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
Sorry, forgot the link...
http://www.airnav.com/airport/KOPL
Saludos
Gary Gower
--- Gary Gower wrote:
>
> Hello Dick,
>
> Just for the fun of it, I am "looking" at every airport that all the
> listers kindly offer...
>
> In your airport the photo is missing, will be great to send them
> one.
>
> Just click on "airports" every time someone post a identifier, is a
> wonderfull filling to dream in visit all of them.
>
> Sorry that it only covers USA airports, my airstrip mexican
> identifier
> is PAKO and this same one is from a military one in Alazca, maybe
> this
> is why we are not listed...
>
> Here we should have a diferent identifier system... well at least we
> still have some airports left :-(
>
> Saludos
> Gary Gower
>
> --- Dirk Andrepont wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Aaron wrote:
> >
> > Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> > Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps at
> > least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> > completed, flying Zenith aircraft
> >
> > Please count me in as well.
> >
> > Dirk Andrepont 801 builder
> > St. Landry Parish Airport...Ahart Field KOPL
> > Opelousas, La
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Aaron" <agustafson(at)chartermi.net>
> > To:
> > Subject: Zenith-List: Zenith flyers home airports
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Great idea Paul . Count me in! Lets get started.I'm in Iron
> > Mountain
> > Mich. Truly Gods country.
> > >
> > > Aaron
> > > 601HDTD plans 75%
> > >
> > >
> > > Re. from Paul Hartl
> > >
> > >
> > > Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a map of all the
> > > Zenith/Matronix listers' home airports on a website - or perhaps
> at
> > > least those of us who would enjoy a visit from a builder of a
> > > completed, flying Zenith aircraft. I for one would love to meet
> > other
> > > listers (and, of course, their airplanes) and would be more than
> > > happy to offer up our guestroom (free, of course) to any Zenith
> > > builder who needed a place to set down for the night. (Yes, I
> have
> > > checked with my wife!).
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > _->
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com
>
>
>
> _->
>
>
>
>
>
>
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
Dear Listers,
This is the last "official" day of the List Fund Raiser. Based on previous
year's percentages of Lister's making a Contribution, this year we are
nearly 40% behind the normal... And I thought all those great gifts would
eke the percentage up past the average a little. Oh well. Maybe people
just don't really mind the flashing banner ads for Viagra, and popups for
X10 minicams...
There's still plenty of time to get your name of the List of
Contributors. I'll probably publish the LOC on Monday night after I
process the checks from the Post Office.
I do want to thank everyone that has so generously made a Contribution so
far this year. Your support is greatly appreciated and is what makes the
Lists possible.
How to support your Lists this month: http://www.matronics.com/contributions
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Benford2(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Zenith Flyers Home Airports |
If you are going skiing, snowmobilin or anything else look me up here in
Jackson Hole, JAC. We have a log guest house that is just sitting there
staring at the Tetons waiting to have the woodstove lit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Karnes" <jpkarnes(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
Hi listers,
I'm based at the scenic Bremerton National Airport. Airport identifier
KPWT.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Owens" <owensp(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Airport contact list |
Dear fellow builders,=0D
=0D
I also would like to be included in a map of builders locations, I am
building a CH-801 in Beloit,Wisconsin and construction is being done at the
Wisconsin Aviation Academy Hangar at the Rock County Airport (JVL) in
Wisconsin. Any and all builders wishing to stop by would be more than
welcome. This is also the home of the Beloit/Janesville EAA Chapter 60
which meets the 2nd Wednesday of every month at 7:30PM and we welsome
visitors.=0D
=0D
Phil Owens, =0D
CH-801 Builder
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com |
Dear 701 builders on the list.
I am about to finish the right slats on my 701, and just tried to install the
inboard slat 24mm inside the outboard slat.
I had some problems with it, and just as I left for work I had to stop trying,
and then I realized that maybe I was not doing this right.
Do I need to remove 24 mm of the "Z" inside either slat to be able to insert
the inboard slat in the outboard, or will the "Z" just overlap each other?
I appreciate your help here.
Best regards,
Johann G.
Iceland.
-------------------------------------------------
This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sam Cajun" <sam.caj(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Slats for 701? |
Johann, check out:
http://www.zenithair.com/stolch701/data/7-slats-3.pdf , page
11.
Sam(701)
I need to remove 24 mm of the "Z" inside either slat to be able
to insert
> the inboard slat in the outboard, or will the "Z" just overlap
each other?
>
> I appreciate your help here.
>
> Best regards,
> Johann G.
> Iceland.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: Slats for 701? |
Hello Sam.
Thank you for pointing out the obvious.
This tells me again to read the instructions a little better.
Makes things much easier.
Best wishes,
Johann G.
Iceland.
>
>
> Johann, check out:
> http://www.zenithair.com/stolch701/data/7-slats-3.pdf , page
> 11.
>
> Sam(701)
>
> I need to remove 24 mm of the "Z" inside either slat to be able
> to insert
> > the inboard slat in the outboard, or will the "Z" just overlap
> each other?
> >
> > I appreciate your help here.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Johann G.
> > Iceland.
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
-------------------------------------------------
This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | All New List Digest Format!! |
Dear Listers,
I've just finished up some awesome code that will completely change your
thinking about how email Digests should work and look! Yeah, I'm kind of
proud of it, that is true... :-)
What you'll be getting in the new List Digest message is the
following: The main message will contain the new text-based index I
introduced a few weeks back. But here's where things get
different... Instead of simply including all of the day's posts in line
within the message, there will now be included two enclosures - one with a
HTML encoded version of the Digests, and another with the usual text-only
version of the Digests.
I think you're really going to like the new HTML enclosure of the
Digests. All of the Indexes at the top are now hyperlinked to the actual
posts and there are hyperlinks at the top of each post that will:
o Take you back to the Index
o Take you to the next post
o Take you to the previous post
o Allow you to respond to the LIST regarding the message
o Allow you to respond directly to the POSTER regarding the message
You'll have to check it out to appreciate the full goodness of the new
format! :-)
The text-only version is basically exactly the same data that has been
normally sent in line within the message.
You'll also note that the filenames of the enclosures are such that they
can be conveniently placed in a personal "archive" directory for future
reference.
Hope you enjoy the new Digest format!!!
Oh, and don't forget about the Fund Raiser! :-)
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Weber" <chrisoz(at)gmx.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 11/29/02 |
>
> Can anyone on the list help me with a paint colour question..
> I want to use camoflage colours as used by wartime aircraft. I have the
> definition of the colours in British standards numbers and Federal
Standards
> numbers.
Hello Dave,
fwiw, a couple of month ago I had to make a low goaround because a friends
Messerschmidt 109 G Replica, retractable undercarriage and all, had suffered
a flat tailwheel on our grassstrip. You just don't see those things when
they are camourflaged!!!
I saw the white spinner before I saw the rest of the plane.
As much as I love the British WWII planes, they are the reason that got me
into flying, I would hesitate to run the additional risk of collision and
lost time if you should ever get in trouble and you are invisible.
How about polishing her up and marking her as a Mustang P51? Nice and shiny!
Cheers, Chris
601 "Small and Humble", polished
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Shopping for a drill press |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/11/29 22:16, Carlos Sa at carlosfsa(at)yahoo.com wrote:
>
> Good point, Michel.
>
> However, it takes only about 15 minutes to cut each hole by hand, so that's
> what I'm
> doing.
Carlos,
When you say you are using the flycutter 'by hand', do you mean with a
hand-held drill? I used the flycutter in my variable speed handheld drill,
to make holes for instruments, etc... I got pretty good at it after a couple
of practice tries -- working at a very slow drill speed with the metal
well-clamped to a peice of wood behind . fwiw
Grant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cleone Markwell <cleone(at)rr1.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith Flyers Home Airports |
And if you are crossing Illinois between St. Louis and Indianapolis my home
airport is Casey, Illinois, 1H8, One Hotel Eight on the eastern side of
the state. Love to see Zodiacs. Cleone
>
>If you are going skiing, snowmobilin or anything else look me up here in
>Jackson Hole, JAC. We have a log guest house that is just sitting there
>staring at the Tetons waiting to have the woodstove lit.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | William Nichelson <bn2(at)bright.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Airport contact list |
Please include me in the map of builders too. I live in Bellefontaine, Ohio
and my plane is hangered in Kenton, Ohio at Hardin County Airport (I95). I
have a 601HDS, with about 120 hours of flying behind me.
I have had several builders and prospective builders come by to see my
plane and would welcome any visitors. My kids are all grown too, so I have
spare bedrooms if you need a place to stay for the night. I think I will
plan a trip for next summer and take advantage of stopping in on other
builders - sounds like a great time and adventure.
Bill Nichelson
Bellefontaine, Ohio USA
Zodiac 601HDS
S/N 6-3556 - N132BN - "Casual Passion"
3300 Jabiru Engine, Prince Prop
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/pm.cgi?login=bn2&ID=272125&action=display
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Kramer" <edkramer(at)prodigy.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith Flyers Home Airports |
Greetings Listers,
I also would like to be included in the map of Zenith builders &
flyers. I live in West Seneca, NY. I am 2 miles from Buffalo Airfield (9G0).
I am currently building a CH 701 & any builders, prospective builders or
flyers are welcome to stop by for a visit.
Ed Kramer
West Seneca, NY
CH 701
edkramer(at)prodigy.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith flyers home airports |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/11/30 00:18, Gary Gower at ggower_99(at)yahoo.com wrote:
>
> Sorry, forgot the link...
>
> http://www.airnav.com/airport/KOPL
>
Gary,
Thanks for sending that link - what a great site. I sincerely hope that the
will extend it to cover Canada and Mexico and the Bahamas...
This is not only a great way to plan/dream flights on the Zodie, but during
my frequent crossings of the USA, I have several emergency/alternate
airports along the route that I always keep an eye on. Our company manuals
contain very sketchy information (sometimes out of date) about these
airports, so I intend to print up my own file for certain airports from this
website. (and pass it on to my Pilot's Union for others too)
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wizard-24(at)juno.com |
OK, I'm at the point now where I can no longer just stare at the plane
and wonder where and how the fuel lines will be run. Time to get to it!
Problem is, I'm having trouble figuring out how to plumb for 4 tanks for
my XL, so I was wondering what everyone else is doing.
Here's my situation: Two main wing tanks (inboard), and two auxilliary
tanks (outboard). That means 4 fuel lines total -- two from each side of
the plane entering the fuselage. The gascolator is already installed in
the floor of the cabin per ZAC's plans. So now I have to decide what's
best.....do I run each tank independently to its own valve, or do I "T"
them together so I have only 2 systems. And if I "T" them.....do I
connect the two outboard tanks to each other, or do I "T" each set of
wing tanks? I'm not sure how the fuel will flow when one tanks empties
under a "T"d system. And as for valves, to avoid having a bump in the
fuel lines, I suppose they'll have to be installed on the floor channel
per the plans....but that seems awfully hard to reach the valves that
would over in the passenger side of the cockpit. I suppose I could use
one of those expensive Andair valves with an extension so the control
handle can be mounted on the center section, but they don't seem to make
one that accomodates four separate tanks.
Also -- with respect to wiring --- where is everyone routing everything?
Through the middle tunnel? (and if so, how are you avoiding interference
with the control cables?) Or are you cutting a hole in the middle spar?
There's lots to run in the way of wiring, antennae, pitot/static lines,
brake lines, etc, and I'm just not finding enough room for all that
stuff!
Thanks,
Mike Fortunato
601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Schallgren(at)aol.com |
601'ers especially Perry and Grant:
Some additional info I would have included on my previous report had time
permitted.
The Jabiru 3300 produces 120 HP at 3300 rpm.
The empty weight of N323WS is 632 pounds. That has been supplemented by a 5
pound lead weight on the tail at 146.6" courtesy of Jeff Small. This latter
was required because we put the battery in the engine compartment which made
it a very forward CG.
The aircraft is a trike and the engine is air cooled so no radiator is
required.
The cowl came from Jabiru along with the firewall forward package. Great
cowl, highly recommended.
75% cruise is 2750 rpm which gave us 130 mph at 6,500.' I am hoping it will
be a little higher when we can fly lower without running into the ground.
We have no speed mods completed as yet. The nose gear wheel pant attaching
points are mounted and the pant will soon be installed. The only gap cover
installed is immediately below the horizontal stabilizer. Several additional
speed enhancements are planned.
Sensenich has two prop divisions, the wooden division is in Florida where our
prop came from. Our prop is wooden, two bladed and the diameter is 64" with
a 49 degree pitch. We got only about 2500 rpm at the beginning of the
takeoff roll so what we have now is a cruise prop. Takeoff roll even with
about 500 fewer rpm's was still impressive.
Considerable self-doubt was generated by the flying with a Prince 58 X 48
with much slower speeds resulting. When you are failing you wonder if it's
sloppy building, improperly functioning engine or the prop. Now we feel that
we have passed the building test as the aircraft flies at the speeds Zenith
says it should. Quite simply, the problem always was the prop. New much
reduced fuel flows and higher speeds are predicted and will be reported.
So from two unbiased, impartial builders we say; Build Zenith, Power by
Jabiru, Prop by Sensenich.
Stan Challgren and TR Moore
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don" <grandpanma(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | 601HDS Patial Kit For Sale |
Hi List,
***** UPDATE *****
*** PRICE REDUCED AGAIN ***
Still have my Partial Kit FOR SALE. $4995.00
*********** MUST SELL ************
Get a head start or add cheaply to what you already have.
My financial situation has changed and I can no longer afford to
continue building.
I started out building the 601HDS Rudder in the factory weekend
workshop, brought the "Tail kit" home with me. Finished the "Tail kit",
now was working on the "Wing kit".
I only finished the skeleton of one wing, that's where I stopped.
Must sell what I have.
Drawings & Manuals: (stays with kit) $340.00
Complete Tail Kit W/flush electric trim tab:(Finished) 1495.00
Wing & Aileron Kit: (finished skeleton of one wing) 4580.00
Leading Edge fuel tank kit: 875.00
Navigation/strobe light Kit: ** SOLD **
____________
Total: 7280.00
Have a few EXTRA parts I will include.
Will sell at a very reasonable price: ---- Around ---- $4995.00
My E-mail Address is: grandpanma(at)earthlink.net
I live in Puckett, MS. That's about 25 miles south/east of Jackson, MS.
My phone No. 601-591-1589
Sincerely,
Donald Vough Jr.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ RURUNY ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: RURUNY
Subject: 701 Elevator Mistake Photo
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/RURUNY@aol.com.12.01.2002/index.html
--------------------------------------------
o EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
o Main Photo Share Index:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
--------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randewilbers1(at)aol.com |
Mike: If you have access to a 5" or 6" vise mounted to a work bench you can
make a nice bending tool. Tape three 3/8" bolts to the jaws as follows:
Put 2 0n one jaw at each end. Let the bolts be perpendicular to the jaw and
let the heads rest on the jaw and tape securely.
Put the other bolt in the center of the other jaw and tape securely.
Place your frame in the vise and tighten the vise. The frames will bend very
easily.
Make SMALL frequent bends to get the profile of the longerons. This job
doesn't take very long, but it sure works well.
Dick Wilbers 601HDS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <carlosfsa(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Shopping for a drill press |
Grant, I mean it literaly: I drill the centre hole and then hold the cutter and
turn
it with my hands. It sounds worse than it actually is.
The cutter shaft is too large for my drills...
Regards
Carlos
> > However, it takes only about 15 minutes to cut each hole by hand, so that's
> > what I'm
> > doing.
>
> Carlos,
>
> When you say you are using the flycutter 'by hand', do you mean with a
> hand-held drill? I used the flycutter in my variable speed handheld drill,
> to make holes for instruments, etc... I got pretty good at it after a couple
> of practice tries -- working at a very slow drill speed with the metal
> well-clamped to a peice of wood behind . fwiw
>
> Grant
>
>
>
>
>
>
Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 11/29/02 |
Chris,
The colour scheme is for a replica warplane! Not the Zodie, but thought
someone on the list would have an answer.
I appreciate your comments.
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Chris Weber chrisoz(at)gmx.net
Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2002 20:43:05 +0100
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 11/29/02
>
> Can anyone on the list help me with a paint colour question..
> I want to use camoflage colours as used by wartime aircraft. I have the
> definition of the colours in British standards numbers and Federal
Standards
> numbers.
Hello Dave,
fwiw, a couple of month ago I had to make a low goaround because a friends
Messerschmidt 109 G Replica, retractable undercarriage and all, had suffered
a flat tailwheel on our grassstrip. You just don't see those things when
they are camourflaged!!!
I saw the white spinner before I saw the rest of the plane.
As much as I love the British WWII planes, they are the reason that got me
into flying, I would hesitate to run the additional risk of collision and
lost time if you should ever get in trouble and you are invisible.
How about polishing her up and marking her as a Mustang P51? Nice and shiny!
Cheers, Chris
601 "Small and Humble", polished
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fast At Last |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/12/01 13:31, Schallgren(at)aol.com at Schallgren(at)aol.com wrote:
> Now we feel that
> we have passed the building test as the aircraft flies at the speeds Zenith
> says it should
Good stuff! It's educational From 80 Hp to 120 is a 50% increase from the
original design, and produces the last 10 to 15 mph that we weren't seeing
in Heinz's original specs (or at least as they developed into the 601HDS)
.... the 'wall of drag' laws are valid. (i.e. square of the speed, etc.))
Anyhow, now we know what's required.
Good work discovering a decent prop for the Jab 3300! That'll help out a lot
of folks.
Grant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: When to install the elevator trim? |
----- Original Message -----
From: "W. R. \"Gig\" Giacona" <wr.giacona@cox-internet.com>
Date: Friday, November 29, 2002 1:16 pm
Subject: Zenith-List: When to install the elevator trim?
> <wr.giacona@cox-internet.com>
>
I installed the recessed trim tab on my XL elevator after closing. It
was no problem.
Bryan Martin
________________________________________________________________________________
Brian Unruh ruruNY(at)aol.com
Long Island, NY
STOL CH 701
Ser No 4831
Drawing 7-H-5
Part Numbers 7H5-3 7H5-1
While finishing the last steps for the elevator construction I pilot drilled &
clecoed(#40) 7H5-3 horn angle and 7H5-1 upper elevator horn to elevator.I was
very proud of my work at this point till I realized the elevator was upside down.
After crying for 10 minutes, I calmed down accepted my error,
turned it right side up and reinstalled these 2 parts and the 7H5-2 lower horn
all in their proper place and drilled and clecoed A5. What I am left with is 4
#40 holes on the front of the spar and 4 #40 holes on the bottom skin. I would
like to know if only rivets can be put in these holes by them selves or should
I make backing plates from scrap for backside of holes. Or is this unreparable.
See photo in photoshare at:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/RURUNY@aol.com.12.01.2002/index.html
Im waiting to hear from zenith but would like input from listers.
Started Oct17 2002...Completed rudder Stab and....elevator I hope.
Thank you,
Brian Unruh
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/bunruh
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Frisby" <marslander(at)hotmail.com> |
Brian,
Those holes look like #30 to me, in any case, as long as they are 10mm or
more from the new holes, they don't present any structural problem. For
cosmetic purposes, you can put blind rivets in them, some say that putting a
rivet in those stray holes reduces any tendency for a crack to start there,
I'm not convinced, but it does look better.
Jim Frisby
Palmer, Alaska
>From: RURUNY(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>Date: Sun, 01 Dec 2002 23:03:44 -0500
>
>
>Brian Unruh ruruNY(at)aol.com
>Long Island, NY
>STOL CH 701
>Ser No 4831
>Drawing 7-H-5
>Part Numbers 7H5-3 7H5-1
>
>While finishing the last steps for the elevator construction I pilot
>drilled & clecoed(#40) 7H5-3 horn angle and 7H5-1 upper elevator horn to
>elevator.I was very proud of my work at this point till I realized the
>elevator was upside down.
>After crying for 10 minutes, I calmed down accepted my error,
>turned it right side up and reinstalled these 2 parts and the 7H5-2 lower
>horn all in their proper place and drilled and clecoed A5. What I am left
>with is 4 #40 holes on the front of the spar and 4 #40 holes on the bottom
>skin. I would like to know if only rivets can be put in these holes by them
>selves or should I make backing plates from scrap for backside of holes. Or
>is this unreparable. See photo in photoshare at:
>http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/RURUNY@aol.com.12.01.2002/index.html
>
>Im waiting to hear from zenith but would like input from listers.
>Started Oct17 2002...Completed rudder Stab and....elevator I hope.
>
>Thank you,
> Brian Unruh
>http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/bunruh
>
>
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | New, NEW List Digest Format... |
Dear Listers,
Okay, so I woke up this morning to an email box full of hate-mail about the
new List Digest format. I thought it was cool, but I guess not... Still,
it seemed like too much code to just throw out, so I've modified things a
little and I'm hoping everyone will be happy with the new, NEW
arrangement. Here's how it works now:
o The HTML and TXT enclosures aren't sent in the Digest any longer.
o URL Links to the HTML and TEXT versions of the day's Digests
will be found at the top of the digest email.
o The new Digest Index will be found at the top of the digest email
following the URL Links.
o The full digest text will then be found in the email as before.
o All of the previous Digests will now be available on line. The
URL for the main digest page is:
http://www.matronics.com/digest
From here, you can drill into the specific List Digest of interest.
o Both the HTML and TXT versions of the Digests can be found here.
o The List Message Trailer will contain a Link directly to the given
o Right now there's only one Digest shown, but each day there will
be another. They will be sorted with the newest at the top.
Left-hand column is the HTML version, right-hand column the TXT
version.
A couple people also complained that some messages in the HTML version were
just one long line that went off to the right forever and they hated
that. Come to think of it, this is also an issue in the Search Engine,
List Browser, and Archive Browser. Some email programs don't included hard
Returns at regular intervals and that's what causes this. I wrote a
program tonight that will automatically chop these long lines into 78
characters or less and wrap the rest of the line. After tonight's Archive
transfer, all of the Searching and Browsing tools shouldn't have the
problem any longer either. Woo hoo!
So, back to the new Digest format. What people are going to see in the
new, NEW Digest is a bit of verbiage at the top of the email describing the
URL links to the HTML and TXT on-line versions, followed by the Links,
followed by the day's Index, followed by the day's messages just as
before. Lines longer than 78 characters will also be automatically wrapped
onto the next line.
Hopefully this will be a more pleasing arrangement for everyone. Sorry to
get everybody so stirred up over the format change!
The List of Contributors is coming out tomorrow night... Still time to
make that Contribution! http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Barth <davids601xl(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: XL Fuel System |
Hi Mike. I am not at the stage you are but have
talked with Chris Heintz about the tank plumming. He
said it would be no problem treating both tanks in
each wing like one tank. Connect the tanks at the top
and bottom. The only filler and vent is on the
outboard end of the outboard tank. The inboard tank is
sealed - no vent or filler. You can put the fuel
sender guage on either tank depending on the factor of
safety you want. You would still want to put drains
in the lowest point of each though. This will
simplify the plumbing a lot and for now it is what I
plan to do.
I haven't gone through the process far enough to
address your other concerns but this simplification
should help all around.
If this solution is in conflict with some regulation
or other, please let me know list
David
>
> OK, I'm at the point now where I can no longer just
> stare at the plane
> and wonder where and how the fuel lines will be run.
> Time to get to it!
> Problem is, I'm having trouble figuring out how to
> plumb for 4 tanks for
> my XL, so I was wondering what everyone else is
> doing.
>
> Here's my situation: Two main wing tanks (inboard),
> and two auxilliary
> tanks (outboard). That means 4 fuel lines total --
> two from each side of
> the plane entering the fuselage. The gascolator is
> already installed in
> the floor of the cabin per ZAC's plans. So now I
> have to decide what's
> best.....do I run each tank independently to its own
> valve, or do I "T"
> them together so I have only 2 systems. And if I "T"
> them.....do I
> connect the two outboard tanks to each other, or do
> I "T" each set of
> wing tanks? I'm not sure how the fuel will flow when
> one tanks empties
> under a "T"d system. And as for valves, to avoid
> having a bump in the
> fuel lines, I suppose they'll have to be installed
> on the floor channel
> per the plans....but that seems awfully hard to
> reach the valves that
> would over in the passenger side of the cockpit. I
> suppose I could use
> one of those expensive Andair valves with an
> extension so the control
> handle can be mounted on the center section, but
> they don't seem to make
> one that accomodates four separate tanks.
> Thanks,
>
> Mike Fortunato
> 601XL
>
=====
David Barth
601 XL Plansbuilder
Currently making parts.
Soob EA-82 SPFI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: XL Fuel System |
The only comment I have (similar instalation in diferent plane in our
Club) is that to get both tanks full, will take some time, the gasoline
has to transfer from one tank (out) to the other tank (inner) to get
both of them full, this time will depend directly in the size of the
gasoline tube that conects them.
Saludos
Gary Gower
--- David Barth wrote:
>
>
> Hi Mike. I am not at the stage you are but have
> talked with Chris Heintz about the tank plumming. He
> said it would be no problem treating both tanks in
> each wing like one tank. Connect the tanks at the top
> and bottom. The only filler and vent is on the
> outboard end of the outboard tank. The inboard tank is
> sealed - no vent or filler. You can put the fuel
> sender guage on either tank depending on the factor of
> safety you want. You would still want to put drains
> in the lowest point of each though. This will
> simplify the plumbing a lot and for now it is what I
> plan to do.
>
> I haven't gone through the process far enough to
> address your other concerns but this simplification
> should help all around.
>
> If this solution is in conflict with some regulation
> or other, please let me know list
> David
> >
> > OK, I'm at the point now where I can no longer just
> > stare at the plane
> > and wonder where and how the fuel lines will be run.
> > Time to get to it!
> > Problem is, I'm having trouble figuring out how to
> > plumb for 4 tanks for
> > my XL, so I was wondering what everyone else is
> > doing.
> >
> > Here's my situation: Two main wing tanks (inboard),
> > and two auxilliary
> > tanks (outboard). That means 4 fuel lines total --
> > two from each side of
> > the plane entering the fuselage. The gascolator is
> > already installed in
> > the floor of the cabin per ZAC's plans. So now I
> > have to decide what's
> > best.....do I run each tank independently to its own
> > valve, or do I "T"
> > them together so I have only 2 systems. And if I "T"
> > them.....do I
> > connect the two outboard tanks to each other, or do
> > I "T" each set of
> > wing tanks? I'm not sure how the fuel will flow when
> > one tanks empties
> > under a "T"d system. And as for valves, to avoid
> > having a bump in the
> > fuel lines, I suppose they'll have to be installed
> > on the floor channel
> > per the plans....but that seems awfully hard to
> > reach the valves that
> > would over in the passenger side of the cockpit. I
> > suppose I could use
> > one of those expensive Andair valves with an
> > extension so the control
> > handle can be mounted on the center section, but
> > they don't seem to make
> > one that accomodates four separate tanks.
>
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Mike Fortunato
> > 601XL
> >
>
> =====
> David Barth
> 601 XL Plansbuilder
> Currently making parts.
> Soob EA-82 SPFI
>
>
>
> _->
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: XL Fuel System |
| From: | wizard-24(at)juno.com |
> Hi Mike. I am not at the stage you are but have
> talked with Chris Heintz about the tank plumming. He
> said it would be no problem treating both tanks in
> each wing like one tank. Connect the tanks at the top
> and bottom.
The problem with this solution is that I have already installed the tanks
in the wings (and installed sending units in both tanks of one wing), and
they are already plumbed per ZAC's XL plans whereby the outboard tank's
fuel line runs through a welded sleeve in the inboard tank. So, I could T
them together, but only after both lines leave the wing. I'm not sure
this would be wise?
Mike Fortunato
601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: XL Fuel System |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/12/01 12:38, wizard-24(at)juno.com at wizard-24(at)juno.com wrote:
>...do I run each tank independently to its own valve, or do I "T"
> them together so I have only 2 systems.
The older HDS systems with a tank in the wing locker AND an aux tank in the
leading edge, the two are Teed together and works as one tank per wing.
However, if your tanks are inboard/outboard in the leading edge, because the
wing has positive dihedral (the ob tank is higher), you might not be able to
do this. If your inboard tank has a vent tube or vented cap, then this
would be the limit of how high you could fill the outboard tank in a T'eed
system ... However, if your inboard tank was somehow vented into the top
corner of the outboard tank, then it could work...
With respect to wiring, my routing on the HDS would not work on the XL due
to the different wingroot attachment point....
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
| Subject: | Instrument panel layout |
I'm laying out my instrument panel (winter work in Maine). I know about software
like Panel Planner, but am looking for something like paper cutouts of varous
instruments for now. Does anybody know if such a thing exists?
Thanks for info.
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred or Sandy Hulen" <hulens61(at)birch.net> |
| Subject: | Instrument panel layout |
> I'm laying out my instrument panel. I know about software like Panel
Planner, but am looking for something like paper cutouts of varous
instruments for now. Does anybody know if such a thing exists?
Bill
++ Bill,
As a suggestion, Sky Sports has a neat catalog of all kinds of instruments
in full color and full size. They will gladly give you two catalogs which
will allow you to cut one up and save the other one. I laid out my panel
that way and found it great because I could rearrange the layout so quickly
and easily. Incidentally, I bought several instruments from them, fuel
level sensors, and some headphones, and found the quality of the them to be
very nice, and those folks are great to do business with.
Fred
Jabiru 3300 powered 601 HDS (N601LX ) now doing taxi tests in prep for first
flight
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Instrument panel layout |
Bill,
The Aircraft Spruce catalog has a page or two on the dimensions
you need for each type of instrument with cutouts for the rate of climb
and the sensitive altimeter, etc. Do a layout on the panel directly with
ink marker on a compass and square. Adjust for centerlines. There's
guidance on spacing too.
I must have laid out the final panel and readjusted it 4 or 5 times. I cut
a bunch of
scrap aluminum to set fly-cutter diameter accurately. The cutouts were done
with a piece of masking tape placed over a good cutout template, marked it
and restuck
it on the 45-degree radial for the instrument and marked steps lightly
around it with a punch.
Then cut close with a nibbler, slowly on .065, and filed to the lines. Got
a really
good fit in all. I made templates too, but had to do it on the panel to see
the proportions
for the layout.
Hope this helps,
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds @ http://www.macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Instrument panel layout
>
> I'm laying out my instrument panel (winter work in Maine). I know about
software like Panel Planner, but am looking for something like paper cutouts
of varous instruments for now. Does anybody know if such a thing exists?
>
> Thanks for info.
>
> Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Instrument panel layout |
Bill:
The Aircraft Spruce catalog, page 365 has the dimensions of the standard
instruments. That's a start, at least.
George
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Instrument panel layout
>
> I'm laying out my instrument panel (winter work in Maine). I know about
software like Panel Planner, but am looking for something like paper cutouts
of varous instruments for now. Does anybody know if such a thing exists?
>
> Thanks for info.
>
> Bill
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jon Croke" <Jon(at)joncroke.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Slats for 701? |
Hi Johann,
I am about at the same place in building as you are ...
As an answer to your question on the slats:
On page 11 of Section 3 of the builders manual, bottom picture, it is
written:
"There will be a cutout in the zee bends to make room for the fiberglass
tips and for the overlap of the I/B and O/B, the cutout is 20mm by 20mm
Hope that helps
Jon
near Green Bay
www.joncroke.com
> Dear 701 builders on the list.
>
> I am about to finish the right slats on my 701, and just tried to install
the
> inboard slat 24mm inside the outboard slat.
> I had some problems with it, and just as I left for work I had to stop
trying,
> and then I realized that maybe I was not doing this right.
> Do I need to remove 24 mm of the "Z" inside either slat to be able to
insert
> the inboard slat in the outboard, or will the "Z" just overlap each other?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Hi Bill,
The tracing I took off of my instrument looked pretty bad so I cut out the
one from the AC spruce (Orange Catalog) page 359. the outline on the bottom
right of the page matches exactly except that the pull to cage cut out should
be on the right side of the instrument (as you are looking at it) as opposed
to how it is shown in the book. Aside from that it is a dead on match.
I hope this info helps, and sorry it took me so long to get it to you but I
finally got the canopy back off of the air frame and was able to get in there
for you.
Talk to you soon,
Steve Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Instrument panel layout |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/12/02 19:07, Bill Steer at bsteer(at)gwi.net wrote:
>
> I'm laying out my instrument panel (winter work in Maine). I know about
> software like Panel Planner, but am looking for something like paper cutouts
> of varous instruments for now. Does anybody know if such a thing exists?
The Aircraft Spruce catalog contains panel cutout templates for various
sorts of instruments (at least the edition I last looked at did)...
Grant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Shay King" <shaking(at)eircom.net> |
| Subject: | VHF Antenna / 701 / Advice |
Dear Listers,
I've just spent the day fitting the VHF antenna [ Comant 121 ] to the rear upper
fuselage on my 701. It's very awkward to do once the fuselage is finished, my
back aches like hell after spending the day wriggling in and out through that
hole.
For anyone building the aft fuselage I'd recommend getting your antenna now and
do the fitting while it's still easy to get in there.
Regards,
Shay King.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg P Jannakos <gpjann(at)juno.com> |
Looking for following items for Zodiac 601
1.Engine mount for C series Continental engine or plans for building
same.
2. Canopy
Any available?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Todd Osborne" <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
It looks like I am going to be forced to sell my Zodiac XL
components because of divorce. No, the plane didn't cause
it! Pictures and other details are on my web site at
www.toddtown.com, follow the Todd and Aviation links. Here
is what I have, feel free to make an offer:
Completed tail, including elevator, rudder, horizontal
stabilizer, electric trim, etc. Includes extra rudder
skin, in case you want or need it, the rudder is fine.
Ailerons and Flags kit, all components
Manual and drawings, XL and 601 HDS
Past builder publications
Avex rivets
Would prefer to sell all together, but will separate if
buyers are found for each item.
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
Web Site: www.toddtown.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bradley Mullins" <bradleym(at)infinet.com> |
| Subject: | corrosion control |
How about using zinc chr were al meets al, then overspray (light coat) with PPG
epoxy primer?
> I welcome all comments.
> regards,
> Brad
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Hart" <dan(at)pyramid3.net> |
Dear Greg:
Sorry, Can't help you. Dan Hart
----- Original Message -----
From: "Greg P Jannakos" <gpjann(at)juno.com>
>
> Looking for following items for Zodiac 601
>
> 1.Engine mount for C series Continental engine or plans for
building
> same.
> 2. Canopy
>
> Any available?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Got the Stainless Steel advice from Nick. |
Hello list,
Here is the OK'ed advise about using the Stainless Steel firewall in
our project. In fact today we beguin building another one for The
other kit...
If someone interested, we can make one and ship from Mc Allen, TX.
maybe the costs of the material and shipping charges are worth it???
>>>>>>>>>>>
--- Zenith Aircraft Company wrote:
> From: "Zenith Aircraft Company" <info(at)zenithair.com>
> To: Gary Gower
> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 14:05:41 -0600
> Subject: Re: (Fwd) Re: Advise about Stainless Steel Firewall.
>
> Thanks for your message to Zenith Aircraft Company. You wrote us:
>
> Subject: (Fwd) Re: Advise about Stainless Steel Firewall.
>
> > > > Using the plans, we build a Stainless Steel firewall for our
> > > > first 701, I commented this to the Zenith list and they told me
> > > > to ask for advise if there is no problem with the SS,the 6061
> > > >and the ribets contacting.
>
> > > > Their main concern is corrosion.
>
> > Yes we are applying a light coat of Zinc Chromate inside and out
> > with a HVLP paint gun. We can aply an extra coat of ZC where the
> > aluminum parts touch the SS if necesary.
> >
> > Attached is the photo of the First Rivet Ceremony... This was
> about
> > 6 months ago, here you can see the parts Zinc Chromated.
>
> Thanks for the photo
>
> When using a stainless steel firewall, both the firewall and the
> aluminum, must be correction protected with zinc chromate primer to
> prevent corrosion of the aluminum which would occur when SS touches
> the aluminum. An thicker layer of primer on both parts is best.
>
> Nick Heintz
> Zenith Aircraft Company
> support(at)zenithair.com
> http://www.zenithair.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <thilo.kind(at)gmx.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Instrument panel layout |
Hi Bill,
here is what I did:
using a CAD software - AutoCad in my case - I made a drawing of the IP.
Then, using the templates provided by the A/S catalogue I drew all the
instruments plus the cut-out area and center hole for each instrument.
The CAD software allowed to move the instruments around the IP until I found
a layout I liked. Next I found myself a company, that uses AutoCad and had a
big printer (most engineering offices have that). They printed the IP plus
instrument layout in scale 1:1. The printout was glued to the IP and -
voila - I had all cutout areas, centerholes, etc. right on the IP.
Happy layout-ing
Thilo Kind
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Instrument panel layout
>
> I'm laying out my instrument panel (winter work in Maine). I know about
software like Panel Planner, but am looking for something like paper cutouts
of varous instruments for now. Does anybody know if such a thing exists?
>
> Thanks for info.
>
> Bill
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Schemmel, Grant" <Grant.Schemmel(at)Aeroflex.com> |
| Subject: | RE: C series Continental mount |
From: Greg P Jannakos <gpjann(at)juno.com>
Looking for following items for Zodiac 601
1.Engine mount for C series Continental engine or plans for building same.
2. Canopy
Any available?
************************
Greg,
I have a welding jig I built up for mine, along with the initial sketches I made
to put it together. The jig was initially off laterally by about 3 inches,
resulting in the front flange of the engine being 3 inches off from center. I
had it cut off and re-welded correctly, and with the second mount iteration,
my o-200 fit perfectly.
I could probably either send you my sketches or the jig if you're interested (jig
for cost+shipping). Be aware though that the jig is pretty heavy, as I made
it out of plate steel and 1.5" angles.
Contact me off-list if you are: grant.schemmel(at)aeroflex.com
Grant Schemmel
Penrose, Colorado
N602GS - 601HDS w/ o-200, 32 hours and free to roam
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "paulrod36" <paulrod36(at)msn.com> |
I'm just about to order the wing kit for a 601XL, Corvair powered, and was wondering:
has anybody done wet wings, instead of using internal tanks yet?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.p.reynolds" <r.p.reynolds(at)blueyonder.co.uk> |
| Subject: | painting my ch601ul |
Hello guys,
I am working on my fus at the moment but I was just thinking of the paint job.
As anyone concidered hand painting the aircraft. If so what type of paint could
be used and what would the quality of the finish be?
Regards Paul 650 hours in and counting. UK.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Pwalsh4539(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: painting my ch601ul |
Cant recall just who, but some member of this list has a web-site and did
exactly that...hand painted their Zodiac. I bet you can find it in the
archives.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fran tschida" <tschidax(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Instrument panel layout |
What is the A/S catalog?
----- Original Message -----
From: <thilo.kind(at)gmx.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Instrument panel layout
>
> Hi Bill,
>
> here is what I did:
> using a CAD software - AutoCad in my case - I made a drawing of the IP.
> Then, using the templates provided by the A/S catalogue I drew all the
> instruments plus the cut-out area and center hole for each instrument.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bryan Martin" <bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | RE: elevator error |
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
RURUNY(at)aol.com
Subject:
Just plug the holes with rivets, a backing plate would add unnecessary
weight.
Bryan Martin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: painting my ch601ul |
Randy Stout posted a note to this list in October, talking about painting his
plane with polyurethane boat paint applied with a roller. The brand was
Interlux Brightside, which you may find on their web site at www.yachtpaint.com.
Bill
>
> Hello guys,
> I am working on my fus at the moment but I was just thinking of the paint job.
> As anyone concidered hand painting the aircraft. If so what type of paint
could be used and what would the quality of the finish be?
>
>
> Regards Paul 650 hours in and counting. UK.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Ferris" <ferret(at)wmtel.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 601 fuel tanks |
I helped a friend with a Midgit Mustang where he opted for wet wings. It
was VERY nasty. The sealant he used was also very expensive with a limited
pot life. Even after we gobbed the sealant on everything, he chased leaks
for a long time.
With how thick the Zodiac's wings are, I would use separate fuel cells
without any inclination to make wet wings after the experience I had. For
him it made more sense because his wings were very slim.
Greg
----- Original Message -----
From: "paulrod36" <paulrod36(at)msn.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: 601 fuel tanks
>
> I'm just about to order the wing kit for a 601XL, Corvair powered, and was
wondering: has anybody done wet wings, instead of using internal tanks yet?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Stout" <r5t0ut(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: painting my ch601ul |
Paul
I have some info on my web page about using polyurethane boat paint and
applying it with a roller if you are interested.
Randy Stout
CH 601 HD
r5t0ut(at)earthlink.net
http://www.geocities.com/r5t0ut21/index.html
----- Original Message -----
From: "r.p.reynolds" <r.p.reynolds(at)blueyonder.co.uk>
Subject: Zenith-List: painting my ch601ul
>
> Hello guys,
> I am working on my fus at the moment but I was just thinking of the paint
job.
> As anyone concidered hand painting the aircraft. If so what type of paint
could be used and what would the quality of the finish be?
>
>
> Regards Paul 650 hours in and counting. UK.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alexander Birca (RMD)" <Alexander.Birca(at)rmd.ericsson.se> |
| Subject: | painting my ch601ul |
Hello Paul,
it is the things I am think to do. But before of us it was done by John W. Tarabocchia,
check his site: http://hometown.aol.com/zodiacbuilder.
BR,
Alex
-----Original Message-----
From: r.p.reynolds [mailto:r.p.reynolds(at)blueyonder.co.uk]
Subject: Zenith-List: painting my ch601ul
Hello guys,
I am working on my fus at the moment but I was just thinking of the paint job.
As anyone concidered hand painting the aircraft. If so what type of paint could
be used and what would the quality of the finish be?
Regards Paul 650 hours in and counting. UK.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: painting my ch601ul |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
For an example of someone's experience you DON'T want to follow:
> He used
> one of the water-based paints, and after 200 hours of painting and buffing
> it peeled off in sheets. All of it. Check the heartbreaking story at:
http://www.kaon.co.nz/europa/272ca.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James J. Cullen, Ph.D." <flyingcrownranch(at)lvcm.com> |
Hi Group!
My wife and I have decided to build a 601-XL from kit components and we were just
notified by ZAC that the empennage kit was shipped today. I'm sure that most
of the assembly is fairly straightforward. However, evey kit I have worked
on has its own pecularities. I would appreciate a heads-up from 601 builders
on any part of the empennage assembly where you had problems or think a newbie
builder might run into potential troubles.
If you happen to be visiting Las Vegas and would like to see an XL in the nest,
please e-mail us.
Best wishes,
Jim and Carolyn Cullen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Todd Osborne" <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
There are several good places to make mistakes in the
tail. Check out my site at www.toddtown.com to see the
ones I made. I made some of the very common ones, so maybe
you can avoid these.
Todd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
| Subject: | Builder database is ready for testing |
(subtitled "Solving the Brent Battles problem." )
All,
I'm really, really, really afraid of what's going to happen to my web server
here, but I think that the builder locator database is ready for testing.
There are currently 49 builders in the database, all but one of them are
Zenith builders. (One record didn't make it from the test to the live
database, so if you registered on the test database, make sure you still
exist in the live database.)
My code is, I think, working, but the stress y'all are going to put on the
server will tell for sure.
Just so you know why I'm fearful, here's the query that the web server runs
against the database:
Select TOP 10 BuilderName, BuilderNum, BuilderAircraftMake,
BuilderAircraftModel, BuilderCity, State, ((Atn(-((sin(Latitude) *
sin(0.570296874877829) + cos(Latitude) * cos(0.570296874877829) *
cos(Longitude - -1.6933788635836)))/ Sqr((-((sin(Latitude) *
sin(0.570296874877829) + cos(Latitude) * cos(0.570296874877829) *
cos(Longitude - -1.6933788635836)))* ((sin(Latitude) *
sin(0.570296874877829) + cos(Latitude) * cos(0.570296874877829) *
cos(Longitude - -1.6933788635836))))+1))+2*Atn(1))*57.29746) AS Distance2,
Int(Int(Distance2) *60 + (Distance2 - Int(Distance2)) * 60) AS Distance from
Builders, RadianZipCodes WHERE Builders.BuilderZip = RadianZipCodes.ZIP
ORDER BY ((Atn(-((sin(Latitude) * sin(0.570296874877829) + cos(Latitude) *
cos(0.570296874877829) * cos(Longitude - -1.6933788635836)))/
Sqr((-((sin(Latitude) * sin(0.570296874877829) + cos(Latitude) *
cos(0.570296874877829) * cos(Longitude - -1.6933788635836)))*
((sin(Latitude) * sin(0.570296874877829) + cos(Latitude) *
cos(0.570296874877829) *
cos(Longitude - -1.6933788635836))))+1))+2*Atn(1))*57.29746)
Is that a hideously monstrous SQL query, or what!? I think I can hear the
web server scream in agony every time I hit this page. Anyone with a spare
pair of fast Pentium II processors want to make a donation? (For the
curious, the complexity of the query is necessary since the Jet database
engine doesn't support an acos() function natively; it must be derived to
compute great circle distance.)
In any case, the database is live at
www.matthewmucker.com/builder_directory.asp. Go check it out.
Please email me with problems or suggestions.
Please do NOT pass on the URL to others until we've exercised this system
for a few days.
Don't be too surprised if I take the database down if problems are
discovered.
-Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.p.reynolds" <r.p.reynolds(at)blueyonder.co.uk> |
Hi guys,
Thanks for the info on painting. I think more thought my be required. I would like
to do it myself if possible to try to keep the cost down. When completed I
would like a finish that is easy to repair if chips etc. happen. My friend paid
a lot of money to have his RV6 painted and he is not happy. The paint used
will not let him remove his fuel tank screws without ripping off the paint around
each screw.
Regards
Paul UK.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James J. Cullen, Ph.D." <flyingcrownranch(at)lvcm.com> |
Hi Todd:
Many thanks for your reply. Actually, I came across your web site while
Carolyn and I were researching which airplane we wanted to build and I took
the liberty of printing out copies of your Builders' Logs! I hope you get
to continue work on your airframe (and stay ahead of us by a few months!) so
we can learn more from you. I'm pretty handy with avionics -- I installed
an entire UPSAT/Apollo IFR stack in our Cherokee 180 (under the supervision
of an A&P) and would be happy to return the favor if you need any help in
that area.
I'm relatively literate when it comes to computers but not at all when it
comes to web sites and I'd like to set up one similar to yours. I have
Microsoft FrontPage on my computer but haven't had enough time to diddle
with it to learn it. Any suggestions on how I might speed up the learning
curve would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks again and if you ever make it to Las Vegas, look us up.
Jim (and Carolyn) Cullen
9456 Mast Drive, Las Vegas, NV 89117-0286
Voice: (702) 804-0801
Fax: (702) 360-5620
e-mail: flyingcrownranch(at)lvcm.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Todd Osborne" <todd(at)toddtown.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: New Builder
>
> There are several good places to make mistakes in the
> tail. Check out my site at www.toddtown.com to see the
> ones I made. I made some of the very common ones, so maybe
> you can avoid these.
>
> Todd
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Golovich" <john(at)golovich.com> |
| Subject: | Shipping Lesson Learned |
A quick lesson I learned today.
Since I work crazy work schedues and it doesn't make sense to have Roadway deliver
the kit into my subdivision, I pick the kits up from the Roadway terminals.
I picked up the wing kits today and looked at the Invoice.
Roadway will charge you a $33.30 fee just to call you and tell you it is ready
to be picked up. In the future, I will just monitor their website and call them
myself to see if it is ready. Worst thing of it, they called my cell phone
which I have to also pay the minute charge for (my fault for giving them that
number as well).
Im just happy my wing kit has arrived.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Shipping Lesson Learned |
Is Roadway the best way to have a kit shipped? Since we are paying for the
shipping do we have a choice on which carrier to use or does ZAC exclusively
use Roadway because of price? Jack Russell Fresno-Chandler CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff & Marcia Davidson" <jdavidso(at)fcc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Shipping Lesson Learned |
> Is Roadway the best way to have a kit shipped? Since we are paying for the
> shipping do we have a choice on which carrier to use or does ZAC
exclusively
> use Roadway because of price? Jack Russell Fresno-Chandler CA
My recent experience was that the relationship ZAC has with Roadway worked
in my favor. Roadway lost an entire shipment to me. This was a 4x3x9 foot
box! ZAC handled the problem completely, refilled the order, and had it
shipped to me free of cost. I presume that they used their influence with
Roadway based on the business they provide the carrier. The important thing
was that I didn't have to bother with it myself. The only thing I suffered
was a delay of about 2 months figuring out what happened and getting the
order re-filled. It was much easier that dealing with, say a mail-order
pharmacy.
Jeff Davidson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JEEdmondson(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Builder database is ready for testing |
In a message dated 12/6/02 5:06:39 PM Central Standard Time,
matthew(at)mucker.net writes:
<< www.matthewmucker.com/builder_directory.asp >>
WAY TO COOL Mat!!!
Jimmy Edmondson
jeedmondson(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Orton" <corton(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Speed Comparisons? |
Hi all; Considering a Zenith kit, but have seen some disparaging remarks (yeah,
I know, ford vs chevy) on other newgroups about the 601 speeds not being what
they're advertised.
Data from the Zenith site indicates:
HD: 120 mph, 630 lbs useful load
HDS: 135 mph, 630 lbs
XL: 128 mph, 540 lbs
I'm looking for something to have fun in (aside from burning $$$) with occasional
500 mile trips with a passenger. I'm a bit on the chunky side, so full fuel
with me and a typical would be close/over gross. I don't care too much about
the speed, but want something faster than a 150/172.
I would want a standard nav/com with VOR plus transponder, but I've read some concerns
about the HD series not having enough panel depth due to the fuel tank.
I also noticed that the XL only uses wing tanks (BTW - are these wet wings, or
metal/bladder tanks?), so I would assume the avionics are a better fit.
So.... are the speeds above true? What is your typical cruise speed? How do you
fit your avionics. It seems like the XL would be better for the avionics (i.e.,
no "customization needed), but the HD/S would be better for higher gross weight.
Any observations to help decide?
Finally, anyone building/flying a Zodiac in the DFW area?
Thanks for your experience and opinions;
Carl
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James J. Cullen, Ph.D." <flyingcrownranch(at)lvcm.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Speed Comparisons? |
Hi Carl:
> I would want a standard nav/com with VOR plus transponder, but I've read
some concerns about the HD series not having enough panel depth due to the
fuel tank.
My wife and I just started work on an XL. I've also heard about the panel
depth concerns on the HD (can't verify that it's true) but some builders
have added a center console just forward of the control stick and mount
their avionics there. The problem doesn't seem to exist on the XL because a
header tank isn't used.
I'm going to try to talk you out of a VOR installation if panel space is a
concern. We're going to install an Apollo/UPSAT GPS/COM and transponder in
ours. They'll both fit in the center console nicely and, because the GPS
doesn't require a VOR head, that saves even more panel space.
One thing I haven't figured out yet has to do with the gyros. We're
planning to install a Rotax 912S, which, I don't believe, has a vacuum pump.
Are builders installing electric gyros (expensive), no gyros (dangerous if
you inadvertently penetrate IMC), some form of electric powered vacuum pump
or (heaven forbid) a couple of vacuum venturis?
> I also noticed that the XL only uses wing tanks (BTW - are these wet
wings, or metal/bladder tanks?), so I would assume the avionics are a better
fit.
The wing tanks in the XL are aluminum -- prewelded at the factory or you can
build them yourself from the information provided in the plans. Cork strips
are used to float the tanks inside the leading edges of the wings.
>
> Finally, anyone building/flying a Zodiac in the DFW area?
If you ever get out to Las Vegas, you're welcome to visit our (just started)
project.
Tailwinds,
Jim Cullen
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Speed Comparisons? |
In a message dated 12/7/02 11:12:48 AM Eastern Standard Time,
corton(at)charter.net writes:
> It seems like the XL would be better for the avionics (i.e., no
> "customization needed), but the HD/S would be better for higher gross
> weight. Any observations to help decide?
>
I am building my HDS with LE wing tanks - no header tank so I will have same
panel space as an XL and 20+ gal. fuel..Enough for me and I don't want fuel
in the fuselage anyway..
Chris Carey
N601BZ
Richmond, VA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Speed Comparisons? |
Carl,
>HD: 120 mph, 630 lbs useful load
>HDS: 135 mph, 630 lbs
>XL: 128 mph, 540 lbs
>
>I'm looking for something to have fun in (aside from burning $$$) with
>occasional 500 mile trips with a passenger. I'm a bit on the chunky side,
>so full fuel with me and a typical would be close/over gross. I don't care
>too much about the speed, but want something faster than a 150/172.
- My HDS came in at 710 lbs so I made 1300 lbs my gross which gives me 590
useful load. Mine is powered by a Stratus Subaru which adds some extra
weight. If you wanted to maximize your useful load, I would go with a Rotax
or Jabiru and build LIGHT!!!! I weight 185 and my wife weights 130 so we
have plenty left for full fuel and baggage. I have a Radio(no VOR) ,
transponder, GPS and full set of instruments except for directional gyro
(which I left a spot for in the panel). Also the ZODIAC is pretty wide at
the shoulders (44 inches). I have taken up passengers in the 240 lb range
and they fit fine. Chunky is better than way tall in a ZODIAC.
>I would want a standard nav/com with VOR plus transponder, but I've read
>some concerns about the HD series not having enough panel depth due to the
>fuel tank.
The story with the HD and HDS is that if you use the 16 gallon header, it
is tight between the panel and the tank. I used an 8 gallon header (which
leaves plenty of room behind the panel) as well as two leading edge wing
tanks. That gives me 29,5 gallons of fuel. My average burn is 5.5 gph so I
have a good range. My HDS cruises at 120 mph. You can also go with no
header and just use LE tanks and will have around 21 gallons of fuel.
There are not too many that get the ZAC advertised speeds. There is a
Jabiru powered ZAC getting the advertised numbers but that is with 120 hp
which is way more than the original specs said you needed. Definitely
faster than a 150 and similar to a 172. The climb rate in a Zodiac (all
models) is typically way better than any 150 / 172.
The best part in my opinion is that my HDS is way more fun to fly than a
150/172. The visibility with the bubble canopy is outstanding, it is easy
to fly and very easy to land even in stiff cross winds.
If you like, you can check out my web site below. There you can play with
weight and balance numbers and see some photos.
Regards,
Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 182.5 flight hrs. - 285
landings)
web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eric Tauch" <erictauch(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Speed Comparisons?..confusing specs |
Hi,
One thing I have noticed on the Zenith site is that the specs have been
moving around
based on the sport pilot regs. I think they see this as a big factor with
XL sales, even
to the detriment of the best published specifications (seems crazy).
I noticed the cruise has been moved down to the sport pilot figures. It
will actually
cruise much faster, and have read that you will have to "slow the plane
down" with a
climb prop to meet the regs. I have also heard that the top speed is not as
important
as the stall speed as applied to the sport pilot regs. I dont agree with
ZACS strategy
here as I think it will confuse their customers. I think they should have a
separate
sport pilot model, maybe limited to a lighter 80hp engine.
I think Zenith was orignally posting a XL cruise speed of 138mph, which with
the 100-120hp
Jab 3300, is probably more accurate. I am building an XL and remember the
gross being
at 1350, although the site lists differently now. Personally, I would not
consider
starting one of the previous designs, as the XL was designed to succeed the
earlier
models. Noticed I tip-toed around saying "improved"...;)
Eric Tauch
PS, I'm in the DFW area...Plano.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Carl Orton
Subject: Zenith-List: Speed Comparisons?
Hi all; Considering a Zenith kit, but have seen some disparaging remarks
(yeah, I know, ford vs chevy) on other newgroups about the 601 speeds not
being what they're advertised.
Data from the Zenith site indicates:
HD: 120 mph, 630 lbs useful load
HDS: 135 mph, 630 lbs
XL: 128 mph, 540 lbs
I'm looking for something to have fun in (aside from burning $$$) with
occasional 500 mile trips with a passenger. I'm a bit on the chunky side,
so full fuel with me and a typical would be close/over gross. I don't care
too much about the speed, but want something faster than a 150/172.
I would want a standard nav/com with VOR plus transponder, but I've read
some concerns about the HD series not having enough panel depth due to the
fuel tank.
I also noticed that the XL only uses wing tanks (BTW - are these wet wings,
or metal/bladder tanks?), so I would assume the avionics are a better fit.
So.... are the speeds above true? What is your typical cruise speed? How do
you fit your avionics. It seems like the XL would be better for the
avionics (i.e., no "customization needed), but the HD/S would be better for
higher gross weight. Any observations to help decide?
Finally, anyone building/flying a Zodiac in the DFW area?
Thanks for your experience and opinions;
Carl
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Speed Comparisons? |
Hello, Carl. I'm not flying yet, so can't comment on the speeds. But I can
tell you that, depending upon your fuel system design, there can be plenty of
room for instruments in a 601HD. The standard 16 gallon header tank does take
most of the room behind the instrument panel, but you have two other options
available - either use the 8 gallon header tank or use the wing tanks, with or
without the smaller header tank. The wing tanks are welded aluminum, btw,
wrapped in cork when inserted into the leading edge of the wings.
Hope this helps.
Bill
> I would want a standard nav/com with VOR plus transponder, but I've read some
concerns about the HD series not having enough panel depth due to the fuel tank.
>
> I also noticed that the XL only uses wing tanks (BTW - are these wet wings, or
metal/bladder tanks?), so I would assume the avionics are a better fit.
>
> So.... are the speeds above true? What is your typical cruise speed? How do
you fit your avionics. It seems like the XL would be better for the avionics
(i.e., no "customization needed), but the HD/S would be better for higher gross
weight. Any observations to help decide?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Frisby" <marslander(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Shipping Lesson Learned |
I agree, Roadway is a good way to ship from ZAC. However it seems you
should have ZAC arrange the shipping, I got a quote directly from Roadway
for shipping a CH801 cowl and an engine mount from MO to Kent WA ( an ocean
shipper "SpanAlaska") would take it from there. The Roadway quote (to me as
an individual) was about $250, Shirley at ZAC got it shipped by the same
company for about $90.
Jim
The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE*
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Rehmel" <traveler601(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Corvair engines for a 601HDS |
Hi, I am seeking information from anyone who is using a Corvair engine. I
have one I can use and am intending on using William Wynnes method to set
it up. I would like to know what there experience has been.
Thank you
--- Robert Rehmel
--- traveler601(at)earthlink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Speed Comparisons? |
> One thing I haven't figured out yet has to do with the gyros. We're
> planning to install a Rotax 912S, which, I don't believe, has a vacuum
pump.
> Are builders installing electric gyros (expensive), no gyros (dangerous if
> you inadvertently penetrate IMC), some form of electric powered vacuum
pump
> or (heaven forbid) a couple of vacuum venturis?
>
At the moment I have no gyros in my HDS. I'm thinking about getting an
Anywhere AI package and using that. About the same cost as electric gyros
and nothing behind the panel. Also portable.
I currently have a Garmin 250XL, CD-player, and Collins TDR-950 xpndr in my
panel. It all fits with the 16 gallon header tank.
I normally cruise anywhere between 100-130mph. It is all a matter of how
much gas I want to burn. I could probably get more speed by changing the
pitch on my prop. I typically climb out at 1000-1500 fpm in my
Stratus-powered HDS. I'm not usually in a hurry, so I haven't bothered to
mess with the prop.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Shipping Lesson Learned |
I agree with this. Get ZAC to arrange for the shipping. You can get them to
bill you for the shipping costs, along with your kit. That way there's no
hassle with the trucking company.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Frisby" <marslander(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Shipping Lesson Learned
>
> I agree, Roadway is a good way to ship from ZAC. However it seems you
> should have ZAC arrange the shipping, I got a quote directly from Roadway
> for shipping a CH801 cowl and an engine mount from MO to Kent WA ( an ocean
> shipper "SpanAlaska") would take it from there. The Roadway quote (to me as
> an individual) was about $250, Shirley at ZAC got it shipped by the same
> company for about $90.
> Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil & Michele Miller" <millerpg(at)ps.gen.nz> |
| Subject: | Speed Comparisons? |
Cheers,
Phil M
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of James J.
Cullen, Ph.D.
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Speed Comparisons?
-->
>One thing I haven't figured out yet has to do with the gyros. We're
planning to install a Rotax 912S, which, I don't believe, has a vacuum
pump.
Jim (and others),
I think you will find that a vacuum pump is an available oprion on all
Rotax 912 and 914 engines. Additional weight is 1.8 pounds.
Regards,
Phil Miller
New Zealand
(701 with 912ULS)
=
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Speed Comparisons? |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)ca.inter.net> |
on 02/12/07 12:29, James J. Cullen, Ph.D. at flyingcrownranch(at)lvcm.com
wrote:
> We're
> planning to install a Rotax 912S, which, I don't believe, has a vacuum pump.
I've seen a 912S with a vacuum pump and standard Gyro panel, so it must be
possible. fwiw
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Golovich" <john(at)golovich.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Shipping Lesson Learned |
In my case, ZAC did take care of the shipping for me and sent it Freight
Collect.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Shipping Lesson Learned
>
> I agree with this. Get ZAC to arrange for the shipping. You can get them
to
> bill you for the shipping costs, along with your kit. That way there's no
> hassle with the trucking company.
>
> Bill
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jim Frisby" <marslander(at)hotmail.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Shipping Lesson Learned
>
>
> >
> > I agree, Roadway is a good way to ship from ZAC. However it seems you
> > should have ZAC arrange the shipping, I got a quote directly from
Roadway
> > for shipping a CH801 cowl and an engine mount from MO to Kent WA ( an
ocean
> > shipper "SpanAlaska") would take it from there. The Roadway quote (to
me as
> > an individual) was about $250, Shirley at ZAC got it shipped by the same
> > company for about $90.
> > Jim
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
| Subject: | Speed Comparisons? |
Carl,
>
> Finally, anyone building/flying a Zodiac in the DFW area?
>
Why, funny you should mention that... questions like this are easily
answered using the "Homebuilder Locator Database" at
http://www.matthewmucker.com/builder_directory.asp.
Go to that link, scroll down to "Find Builders by Airport," type in "DFW"
and click "Submit."
After admiring that ugly math equation that I had to derive (and spending a
few seconds in meditative admiration for the guy who wrote the website ),
scroll down and get contact information for the builders closest to dfw
airport!
-Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Matt maybe you can help me out |
Matt,
I've been a long time user and contributor to the Zenith List you maintain
and really appreciated what it has done for my building and post building
support.
I have an electrical question maybe you could help me with or steer me in
the right direction if you don't mind.
I am working on a wing leveler for my Zodiac and am will be using a MEMS
chip (solid state gyro). The chip only comes in a BALL GRID ARRAY package.
What I need is a source for a prototype board that will accept BGA type
devices so I can then plug that into my breadboard for debugging purposes.
Do you know of such a source? If not, do you have any engineer type
acquaintances that may be able to help?
Regards,
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "doug" <dm10495(at)cedarnet.org> |
Any recommendations for an alternator to fit on my CAM100. Cheap, light,
around 30 to 35 amps and easy to find?
Doug Mattson
dm10495(at)cedarnet.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Stabilizer Ribs & Spar Connection |
It's Sunday Zenith is closed and I have a question.
The plans say the Stabilizer ribs are attached with 2 A4s but you are
going through skin, doublers & rib. That seems a little thick for an A4.
There is also text in the manual that makes it seem like there are A4s &
A5s. (4 total per rib.) But I don't see that on the plans.
Looking at the photos at the Zenith Builders there are clearly 2 A5 clecos
except in the 360mm positions where there is no doublers.
I noticed all this after building with 2 A5s in each rib except in the 360mm
position where I have A4s.
I haven't riveted yet just clacked but I'm ready to rivet up the stabilizer
skeleton except for this.
Any help would be appreciated. I get the digest so please also please reply
direct as well.
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
Zodiac 601XL
N601WR (Working on Tail)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stabilizer Ribs & Spar Connection |
Gig,
Chris Heinz recently published a statement in the Zenith Newsletter that
covers "most often"
things they are asked. One of them is about the distinction between
A4 and A5 usage. "It's generally O.K. to use A5s in place of A4s". I'd
assume this is stated
to fix an oversized 1/8" hole or simply get a better grip for thickness.
You can use your
descretion on this issue. Of course, one would not substitute A5s with A4s
in any case.
Hope this helps,
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds @ http://www.macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "W.R. "Gig" Giacona" <wr.giacona@cox-internet.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Stabilizer Ribs & Spar Connection
<wr.giacona@cox-internet.com>
>
> It's Sunday Zenith is closed and I have a question.
>
> The plans say the Stabilizer ribs are attached with 2 A4s but you are
> going through skin, doublers & rib. That seems a little thick for an A4.
>
> There is also text in the manual that makes it seem like there are A4s &
> A5s. (4 total per rib.) But I don't see that on the plans.
>
> Looking at the photos at the Zenith Builders there are clearly 2 A5 clecos
> except in the 360mm positions where there is no doublers.
>
> I noticed all this after building with 2 A5s in each rib except in the
360mm
> position where I have A4s.
>
> I haven't riveted yet just clacked but I'm ready to rivet up the
stabilizer
> skeleton except for this.
>
> Any help would be appreciated. I get the digest so please also please
reply
> direct as well.
>
> W.R. "Gig" Giacona
> Zodiac 601XL
> N601WR (Working on Tail)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
Doug,
Did you look at the alternators on the AeroElectric Connection?
They have several. Cheap I'm not sure about.
> Any recommendations for an alternator to fit on my CAM100. Cheap, light,
> around 30 to 35 amps and easy to find?
>
> Doug Mattson
> dm10495(at)cedarnet.org
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Matt maybe you can help me out |
In a message dated 12/8/2002 3:18:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, billvt(at)together.net
writes:
> Do you know of such a source? If not, do you have any
> engineer type
> acquaintances that may be able to help?
Hi Bill,
If Matt can't help, try Don Honabach. He is not an elctrical engineer but he has
designed some of his own high end custom electronics complete with custom burned
circuit boards. I bet he could help, and it might even motivate him to get
out of his 2+ year building slump.
Worth a try.
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fran tschida" <tschidax(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Doug; Great Plains Aircraft, www.greatplainsas.com sells a belt driven
alternator for $89.96. Weight is 6 1/2lbs. Output is supposed to be
approx. 40 amps.
I also know of some people using a John Deere small tractor alternator of 35
amps and about 6 pounds. Have no idea of the price.
Fran
----- Original Message -----
From: "doug" <dm10495(at)cedarnet.org>
Subject: Zenith-List: alternator
>
> Any recommendations for an alternator to fit on my CAM100. Cheap, light,
> around 30 to 35 amps and easy to find?
>
> Doug Mattson
> dm10495(at)cedarnet.org
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eric Tauch" <erictauch(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Matt maybe you can help me out |
Hi Bill,
Check the following links:
http://www.adapters.com/catalog/BGA_solutions.pdf
www.adapter-tech.com
http://www.emulation.com
http://www.arieselec.com
Depending on your debug system, and the number of pins on the package, you
may need
an adapter that is mounted to a small PCB to break-out the pins to something
you can
easily get onto. The smaller BGA packages are on 0.8mm spacing up to about
1.27mm.
These adapters are not cheap, and typically run in the hundreds of dollars
(maybe not
so much for a low pin count package).
I would be interested in what you are working on, as I want a wing leveler
on my
601XL, but decided I would go with the TRU TRAC system ($$). I am an EE,
and design
and fabricate PCB for a living on a contract basis, so I can help you out
with that
part of it. Nowadays, the fabrication and assembly of PCB is dirt cheap due
to
fabrication overseas (Im sorry to say, as this is not good for our American
economy),
if productization or assembly of a few protos is desired.
Send me the product link, as I would be interested in looking at it.
Eric Tauch
erictauch(at)attbi.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bill Morelli
Subject: Zenith-List: Matt maybe you can help me out
Matt,
I've been a long time user and contributor to the Zenith List you maintain
and really appreciated what it has done for my building and post building
support.
I have an electrical question maybe you could help me with or steer me in
the right direction if you don't mind.
I am working on a wing leveler for my Zodiac and am will be using a MEMS
chip (solid state gyro). The chip only comes in a BALL GRID ARRAY package.
What I need is a source for a prototype board that will accept BGA type
devices so I can then plug that into my breadboard for debugging purposes.
Do you know of such a source? If not, do you have any engineer type
acquaintances that may be able to help?
Regards,
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Weber" <chrisoz(at)gmx.net> |
| Subject: | Questions reg. BRS and Subaru |
Hello Listers,
scratchbuilding my second Zodiac I now reach the stage where I will start on
the engine mount, the fuselage is on its wheels and the tailfeathers mostly
done.
A friend has rebuilt an EA81 with dual carbs, hotter cams and Amex-reduction
for me. I plan to weld up a bed mount ala 912, but to do this I have to know
the distance of the engine from the firewall and approx. how high it is of
the floor of the plane. If one of you Stratus-drivers has got his (or her)
cowling of one of these days, could you just measure the distance between
the rear end of the left- or righthand cylinder head and the firewall, and
the distance of that spot on the firewall to the bottom of same? It would be
very much appreciated.
Have any of you guys put the radiator between the engine and firewall, and
if yes, how?
An other tricky one: have just bought a BRS 5 1050 Balistic System. It goes
where the fuse tank would normaly be, any ideas as to where to fix the
bridles to the airframe?
The front ones obviously go to the upper engine mounts, but what about the
rear points?
At the moment I toy with the idea of hooking the bridles up to stainless
steel cables and connect these to the rear spar inside of the fairings.
Any reasons why not?
I have managed to sell my firstborn, 601 UL 912 'Small and Humble', with 52
hours on the clock, for a price that I don't want to convert to US$ as the
Australian Peso is to pathetic at the moment. It still sits in my hangar but
soon it will be gone, and that is a very weird feeling.
Guess I have to speed up number two a bit, otherwise the withdrawal symptoms
get to severe. First flight should be early March, we'll see.
Happy landings,
Chris
601 UL 912 "Small and Humble"
601 HD Sub, X minus 3 month (???)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James J. Cullen, Ph.D." <flyingcrownranch(at)lvcm.com> |
| Subject: | Roadway Notification Charges |
Hi Group:
I was somewhat concerned about the rather exhorbitant notification charge
that one of our members had incurred from Roadway -- especially in light of
the fact that I have a 601 XL tail section kit en route. So, I called the
local Roadway Terminal to find out what gives. The dispatcher that I talked
to seemed a bit miffed that I would try to avoid this charge and kept
putting me on hold while she talked to other customers. However, I finally
got the following information out of her.
If you're being scheduled for home delivery, they're going to charge you the
notificaton fee because, in her words, they have to handle your package
twice -- once to offload it and once to reload it on the local truck. (I
thought that this was what th local delivery fee was for!) Anyway, Roadway
seems to feel that it is OK for them to charge you an additional $30+ to
call you and schedule the delivery.
They will also levy this charge against you if you are picking up the
package at the terminal and they call you to notify you of your package's
arrival.
I asked her if there was any way that I could avoid the fee. She wasn't
happy I asked this question. However, the drill goes like this. Once the
package is enroute, call the local Roadway terminal where you are going to
pick it up and find out what the actual scheduled delivery date is. Be
advised that the delivery date that you get from Roadway's internet
notification system is just their "standard delivery date" -- not the actual
delivery date. Apparently, the internet notification system advises you of
a delivery date based on standard routes and transit times but does not
track the package well enough to nail the date down accurately -- despite
the fact that the internet system tracks and notifies you depot-by-depot as
the package moves. Go figure.. My package is scheduled to arrive on 12/11
but I keep getting 12/12 off their internet system. This makes Roadway look
good -- they delivered ahead of "schedule." It also gives them an extra day
to contact you and levy their notification charge.
Once the local Roadway office gives you the real delivery date, call them
after 7AM local time on the morning of the delivery to schedule your pick-up
time. This will allow them to set your crate on their dock where you can
easily get at it at the appointed time. If you do this, they can't levy the
notification charge.
This seems like a Roadway scam to me. Considering that ZAC is a sizeable
shipper with Roadway, I would hope that they might be willing to use their
influence to help their customer avoid these unnecessary charges.
Tailwinds,
Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
| Subject: | New Builder Website |
Well, now that I've got the homebuider's directory up, I might as well
announce that I have a new website up to chronicle a scratchbuilt CH640.
The URL is a very original www.matthewmucker.com.
-Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Clifton J. Bardwell" <clif(at)duck.org> |
Hi all,
As the subject says, I'm new to the list (actually I've been lurking for
a couple of months). I got interested in plane kits with the first
episode of "A Plane Is Born" and have been doing research on which kit
I'd like to build.
One of the first kits I found, and one of the two I'm definitely leaning
toward, is the Zenith Zodiac CH640. (The other is the Kitfox Series 7).
I tend to favour the CH640 because I like the possibility of 4 seat and
the 150 mph cruise.
I had been planning on building from the kit, but recent postings by
Matthew Mucker almost has me convinced to try and build from scratch. I
do have a few questions, though.
1. One of the things that cause me to think about building from scratch
is the ability to build my own bending brake. But that is for creating
straight bends. How would one go about bending a rib as shown here
(third image down):
http://www.zenair.com/kit.html
2. For any parts I can't/don't want to fabricate, can I buy these parts
individually from Zenith/ third party?
3. Not necessarily based on the 640, but how much can I really save if I
build from scratch rather than from kit?
4. Can one person build a kit? If not, how much is a helper required?
5. The specs shows a height of 7' 4". If I build this in my garage
which has a 7' door, will I be able to move it in and out by just
tilting the tail down?
6. How does the panel compare to the CH801? Larger? Smaller? (Having
to do with panel layout software which lists CH801 but not CH640)
Thanks for your indulgence.
Clif
Pre-builder
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <carlosfsa(at)yahoo.com> |
Hi, Clif
As a scratch builded, I think I can manage to answer a couple of your questions...
> 1. One of the things that cause me to think about building from scratch
> is the ability to build my own bending brake. But that is for creating
> straight bends. How would one go about bending a rib as shown here
> (third image down):
> http://www.zenair.com/kit.html
(a) You don't need to own a bending brake, just need a few hours alone with one
:o)
After looking around for months, I found one next to the airport I fly from (Bush
Caddy operates there).
Look around for machine shops that might have one, and rent it if necessary.
You could have a small one built (4 feet) for small stuff. There are free plans
on
the web - search the archives, I posted a link a few weeks ago.
(b) ribs are easily built, see pictures here:
http://members.tripod.com/zodiacbuilder/pictures.htm
> 2. For any parts I can't/don't want to fabricate, can I buy these parts
> individually from Zenith/ third party?
Yes, you can.
> 3. Not necessarily based on the 640, but how much can I really save if I
> build from scratch rather than from kit?
Many people will say that if you are building to save money, you are doing the
wrong
thing (as there are many decent, used A/C around for a reasonable price).
On the other hand, if I had acquired the parts I bent at Bush Caddy, it would have
cost me more than US$1,000. I spent about US$100 on materials, a lot of my time
and
a couple of boxes of donuts for the guys at Bush Caddy...
Of course, it takes oodles of time to do anything. As you get more experienced,
it
takes less oodles... :o)
> 4. Can one person build a kit? If not, how much is a helper required?
I did not get there yet, but occasionally you'll need an extra pair of hands to
help
with bigger parts.
Whatever you choose, have fun with it.
Carlos
CH601 HD, plans
Montreal, Canada
Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Kramer" <edkramer(at)prodigy.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stabilizer Ribs & Spar Connection |
----- Original Message -----
From: "W.R. "Gig" Giacona" <wr.giacona@cox-internet.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Stabilizer Ribs & Spar Connection
<wr.giacona@cox-internet.com>
>
> The plans say the Stabilizer ribs are attached with 2 A4s but you are
> going through skin, doublers & rib. That seems a little thick for an A4.
Gig,
I can't address your actual problem on the stabilizer, but the grip range
for an A4 rivet is from 0-6mm and an A5 is from 0-8mm. Hope that helps.
Ed Kramer
West Seneca, NY
CH 701
edkramer(at)prodigy.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim and Lucy <jpollard(at)mnsi.net> |
Hi Clif
Welcome to the Zenair list!!
You are doing the right thing monitoring the lists. This is a great
way to find out what you want to build.
I believe that the 640 is a kit only. The plans may be more geared
towards assembly of the factory kit. At least thats the way it was
a couple years ago.
1 The ribs are usually made by sandwiching the aluminum between
2 pieces of plywood that is cut to the proper shape. The aluminum
extends beyond the plywood and the aluminum is taped around
the plywood forms with a small hammer.
2 You can purchase any single parts you need from Zenair as long
as you own a serial number for the aircraft the parts are for.
3 You could save about half the cost by plans building in exchange
of about 4 or 5 times the building time. This depends how much
experience you have of course and the amount of machinery you have in
your shop.
4 I have put the engine and wings on by myself but it is nice to have a
helper
for these operations. There are times like this that 2 people make the
operation
easier but it is not necessary.
5 Just take the rudder off to get it out your garage door or tip it down
on the
tail.
6 I drew the instrument panel using a cad program called deltacad. It is easy
to use and you can get a rough idea how to fit everything. It is not
a big
concern until you are much farther along with your project. Not sure how
the 2 planes panels compare but I expect they are close to the same size.
Jim Pollard
Merlin Ont
ch601hds
ea81
>
>Hi all,
>
>As the subject says, I'm new to the list (actually I've been lurking for
>a couple of months). I got interested in plane kits with the first
>episode of "A Plane Is Born" and have been doing research on which kit
>I'd like to build.
>
>One of the first kits I found, and one of the two I'm definitely leaning
>toward, is the Zenith Zodiac CH640. (The other is the Kitfox Series 7).
>I tend to favour the CH640 because I like the possibility of 4 seat and
>the 150 mph cruise.
>
>I had been planning on building from the kit, but recent postings by
>Matthew Mucker almost has me convinced to try and build from scratch. I
>do have a few questions, though.
>
>1. One of the things that cause me to think about building from scratch
>is the ability to build my own bending brake. But that is for creating
>straight bends. How would one go about bending a rib as shown here
>(third image down):
> http://www.zenair.com/kit.html
>
>2. For any parts I can't/don't want to fabricate, can I buy these parts
>individually from Zenith/ third party?
>
>3. Not necessarily based on the 640, but how much can I really save if I
>build from scratch rather than from kit?
>
>4. Can one person build a kit? If not, how much is a helper required?
>
>5. The specs shows a height of 7' 4". If I build this in my garage
>which has a 7' door, will I be able to move it in and out by just
>tilting the tail down?
>
>6. How does the panel compare to the CH801? Larger? Smaller? (Having
>to do with panel layout software which lists CH801 but not CH640)
>
>Thanks for your indulgence.
>
>Clif
>Pre-builder
>
>
>_-
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
Clifton,
>
> I had been planning on building from the kit, but recent postings by
> Matthew Mucker almost has me convinced to try and build from scratch. I
> do have a few questions, though.
Don't let my postings persuade you that I am necessarily sane or competent.
I haven't yet started my building but I do sincerely believe that building
the 640 from scratch is do-able. Of course, I haven't seen the plans yet so
I'm not one to talk. However, Mathieu knows I'm planning on building from
scratch and hasn't attempted to dissuade me. (Mathieu is Chris Hientz' son
and supervises operations at AMD, where the 640 kit is produced.)
>
> 1. One of the things that cause me to think about building from scratch
> is the ability to build my own bending brake. But that is for creating
> straight bends. How would one go about bending a rib as shown here
> (third image down):
> http://www.zenair.com/kit.html
See this page from my old website when I was planning on building a CH601:
http://www.mucker.net/zodiac/logs/making_wing_ribs_13.htm
>
> 2. For any parts I can't/don't want to fabricate, can I buy these parts
> individually from Zenith/ third party?
Yes. You can buy from Zenith. I'm certainly planning on buying the canopy
from them.
>
> 3. Not necessarily based on the 640, but how much can I really save if I
> build from scratch rather than from kit?
Good question. I initially got turned on to scratchbuilding as a way to
save money, but now want to do it just to do it.
>
> 4. Can one person build a kit? If not, how much is a helper required?
Most builders on the list seems to indicate it's mainly a one-person job.
>
> 5. The specs shows a height of 7' 4". If I build this in my garage
> which has a 7' door, will I be able to move it in and out by just
> tilting the tail down?
7'4? What? I stood by the thing and swear it wasn't that tall. You can
probably get it out of the garage easily by not putting the rudder on till
you get it to the airport.
>
> 6. How does the panel compare to the CH801? Larger? Smaller? (Having
> to do with panel layout software which lists CH801 but not CH640)
The firewall is the same as the 801, that's been confirmed by Zenith. I
can't say about the IP, tho.
-Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
Clifton,
Welcome to the list! The process of scratch building
would especially depend on what your experience in making things
draws from. If you're and engineer or a serious tinkerer, you'll do well.
If you have no tools or background in this, it could be more difficult.
The kit is definitely the fastest, and it may indeed be the least expensive,
considering the time you'd spend making the tooling for everything sheet
metal.
The 640 is a kit-only from my understanding, but you'd be able to make parts
from the plans if something got messed up if plans are as complete as the
ones
provided for the HD and HDS. Much harder to do with an RV.
You could spend over 15K for a kit or 4K for raw materials and the engine
and avionics
will add another 10K or more to your project. A large part of the
difference will be
spent on tooling and jigging just to go scratch. This will be reduced by
another
3K in tools and plywood. That leaves you a savings of maybe 8 or 9k after
spending
the next 5 years building.
Nothing wrong with any of that if it's what you'd rather be doing more than
anything else.
One person can easily get by with very little help if you think way ahead.
The rudder can be removed rather easily for the transition to the airport if
necessary.
A bend brake can be made or borrowed, but it's definitely much easier when
it's sitting
there just looking at you for any part large or small. The time I saved
making my own
brake more than saved and equivalent amount of time that might have been
spent traveling
back and forth to the sheet metal shop.
In any case, I wish you well and hope you can make a decision
that satisfies.
If you need further assist, please visit my website and journal.
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds @ http://www.macsmachine.com
>
> 1. One of the things that cause me to think about building from scratch
> is the ability to build my own bending brake. But that is for creating
> straight bends. How would one go about bending a rib as shown here
> (third image down):
> http://www.zenair.com/kit.html
>
> 2. For any parts I can't/don't want to fabricate, can I buy these parts
> individually from Zenith/ third party?
>
> 3. Not necessarily based on the 640, but how much can I really save if I
> build from scratch rather than from kit?
>
> 4. Can one person build a kit? If not, how much is a helper required?
>
> 5. The specs shows a height of 7' 4". If I build this in my garage
> which has a 7' door, will I be able to move it in and out by just
> tilting the tail down?
>
> 6. How does the panel compare to the CH801? Larger? Smaller? (Having
> to do with panel layout software which lists CH801 but not CH640)
>
> Thanks for your indulgence.
>
> Clif
> Pre-builder
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Tellet" <telletdl(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Roadway Notification Charges |
Watch out also for the after delivery charges. Both the wing kit and the
fuselage kit came on Roadway, I paid them for the delivery, and then a week
or so later Roadway sent me an additional bill for a "corrected" weight. I
paid since I couldn't really argue the point, but it was a bit annoying.
You might want to run past some truck scales and get a weight so they can't
play this card.
David Tellet 601HD working on center section.
----- Original Message -----
From: "James J. Cullen, Ph.D." <flyingcrownranch(at)lvcm.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Roadway Notification Charges
>
> Hi Group:
>
> I was somewhat concerned about the rather exhorbitant notification charge
> that one of our members had incurred from Roadway -- especially in light
of ...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "reineros" <reineros(at)pacbell.net> |
Has anyone used a corvair on a 701? I apears it would be about 40 to 50 lbs. heaver
but my wallet would be much heaver than anything the factory seams to recomend
in 4 cycle.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wayne McIntosh" <mcintosh3017(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Questions reg. BRS and Subaru |
Chris,
Get in touch with BRS, I am sure they have installed chutes in a 601
before.
Wayne McIntosh Lafayette IN
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Weber" <chrisoz(at)gmx.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Questions reg. BRS and Subaru
>
> Hello Listers,
> scratchbuilding my second Zodiac I now reach the stage where I will start
on
> the engine mount, the fuselage is on its wheels and the tailfeathers
mostly
> done.
> A friend has rebuilt an EA81 with dual carbs, hotter cams and
Amex-reduction
> for me. I plan to weld up a bed mount ala 912, but to do this I have to
know
> the distance of the engine from the firewall and approx. how high it is of
> the floor of the plane. If one of you Stratus-drivers has got his (or her)
> cowling of one of these days, could you just measure the distance between
> the rear end of the left- or righthand cylinder head and the firewall, and
> the distance of that spot on the firewall to the bottom of same? It would
be
> very much appreciated.
> Have any of you guys put the radiator between the engine and firewall, and
> if yes, how?
>
> An other tricky one: have just bought a BRS 5 1050 Balistic System. It
goes
> where the fuse tank would normaly be, any ideas as to where to fix the
> bridles to the airframe?
> The front ones obviously go to the upper engine mounts, but what about the
> rear points?
> At the moment I toy with the idea of hooking the bridles up to stainless
> steel cables and connect these to the rear spar inside of the fairings.
> Any reasons why not?
>
> I have managed to sell my firstborn, 601 UL 912 'Small and Humble', with
52
> hours on the clock, for a price that I don't want to convert to US$ as the
> Australian Peso is to pathetic at the moment. It still sits in my hangar
but
> soon it will be gone, and that is a very weird feeling.
> Guess I have to speed up number two a bit, otherwise the withdrawal
symptoms
> get to severe. First flight should be early March, we'll see.
>
> Happy landings,
>
> Chris
> 601 UL 912 "Small and Humble"
> 601 HD Sub, X minus 3 month (???)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Corvair on 701 |
| From: | "Edward T. Jeffko" <riovista(at)bossig.com> |
I thought about a corvair in a 701 for my next project so I asked ZAC a HP
and weight question. They recommend a max of 100 HP and 200lbs. weight.
Anything heavier would require ballast in the tail. They indicated no
structural problems with the heavier engine, only W&B. You're going to lose
50 to 100 lbs. of useful load if you stay within gross weight, depending on
how you build the engine. WW dosen't recommend a 701 as a good airframe for
the vair. Didn't say why.
Ed
> From: "reineros" <reineros(at)pacbell.net>
> Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:35:27 -0800
> To:
> Subject: Zenith-List: Corvair on 701
>
>
> Has anyone used a corvair on a 701? I apears it would be about 40 to 50 lbs.
> heaver but my wallet would be much heaver than anything the factory seams to
> recomend in 4 cycle.
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Clifton J. Bardwell" <clif(at)duck.org> |
Well, based on all the posts, it's official. I'm going with the 640 as
a scratch built.
Thanks to all for your quick replies. I will try to address everyone's
comments in one post.
First of all, I'd like to share a bit more about myself and my plans.
Currently my main hobby is woodcraft (ala Norm Abram), so I am not a
stranger to building by plans by a long stretch :). I truly enjoy
building and have always wanted to fly so when I discovered "A Plane Is
Born" I figured, what the heck.
I am not currently a pilot, although that will come in time. My main
reason for wanting to build, is just to build with flying a close
second. My original decision with wanting to go with a kit was due to
what I saw as complexities in the metal working. I'm sure someone will
wonder, if I'm into wood working why not just build a wood plane. Well,
to tell you the truth, I'd much prefer the structural integrity of
metal. I know how weak wood can be, even if it appears strong.
At any rate...
---
Carlos Sa,
I would prefer to build my own bending brake.
I found a neat one which I believe I can build here:
http://www3.sympatico.ca/murray.j/tools.htm
I've already thought of some improvements for that design. If push
comes to shove, though, I do know of a fabricator in the area which I'm
sure can bend the long pieces.
Thanks ever so much for the link to the pictures of bending the curves.
That explains a lot and lead to my final decision.
I am not building to save money, although every little bit helps. The
reason I was leaning toward a kit is because of things like the rib,
which I thought required specialized machines.
---
Ed Ulrich,
Thanks for the comment about the address. It's no relation to Ducks
Unlimited, it's actually a family thing.
See my comment to Carlos above about the bending brake.
Carlos provided a great link which explains how to bend the ribs. It
seems very easy. When looking at the picture on the ZAC site, it looked
like it required specialized equipment.
Thanks for the offer for fabricating items I can't. I'll certainly keep
it in mind.
"Gazillions"? Is that a financial term? :) Based on your post, as
well as others, it sounds like it's definitely a money saver to scratch
build.
---
Jim Pollard,
According to the Zenith web site, the $495 drawings and manual is "All
you need to 'scratch-build' the ZODIAC CH 640". One hopes that this is
in fact the case.
The rib fabrication was explained very well in a link Carlos provided.
Thanks for the reasonable estimate of money savings. Time to build is
not an issue. I'd rather save money and build more. :)
---
Matthew Mucker,
It wasn't your posting specifically. It was more of your link to the
plans for the bending brake. :) Although I will probably build a
different design, your web site allowed me to know that it could be
done. The more I can do myself, and not have to outsource, the happier
I'll be.
The one piece that I was most interested in buying (as opposed to
building) was the canopy. I'm glad to know that I can indeed buy.
---
Larry C. McFarland,
As I've said elsewhere in this post, the time building is not an issue.
I enjoy building things. I was more worried about requiring specialized
tools that cost a lot with no (or little) resale value. If I can enough
save money by building from scratch, then I would prefer it over a kit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "SKYSHOP" <duba(at)gate.net> |
| Subject: | Rotax 912S on e-bay |
Just for your info, we have Rotax 912S on e-bay. Overstock powerplant. Have
a look.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=26437&item
=1874117536&rd=1
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=26437&item
=1874118499&rd=1
Danny
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Wood <mawood(at)zoo.uvm.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Corvair on 701 |
One of the issues of using a Corvair engine is that they make power at a
little higher RPM. To do this you need to turn a smaller diameter prop.
This makes a big difference with a high drag airframe where you want max
acceleration like in the 701.
I don't know how much of a difference it would make and I don't have the
background to figure it out, I am just passing on things I have been told
over the years.
Mark Wood
601HD 90% down 90% to go.
>
>I thought about a corvair in a 701 for my next project so I asked ZAC a HP
>and weight question. They recommend a max of 100 HP and 200lbs. weight.
>Anything heavier would require ballast in the tail. They indicated no
>structural problems with the heavier engine, only W&B. You're going to lose
>50 to 100 lbs. of useful load if you stay within gross weight, depending on
>how you build the engine. WW dosen't recommend a 701 as a good airframe for
>the vair. Didn't say why.
>
>Ed
>
>> From: "reineros" <reineros(at)pacbell.net>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "SKYSHOP" <duba(at)gate.net> |
| Subject: | Rotax 912S on e-bay working links |
Is your link correct for the Rotax 912S, I was not able to access it.
Steve Shuck
Steve : link is to big for line , goto http://www.skyshops.org/801EBAY.htm
for Rotax link.
Danny
Just for your info, we have Rotax 912S on e-bay. Overstock powerplant. Have
a look.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=26437&item
=1874117536&rd=1
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=26437&item
=1874118499&rd=1
Danny
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Caithcart" <bcaithcart(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Corvair on 701 |
The corvair engine if converted as per William Wynne's manual produces an
honest 90-100 HP at 2900 RPM. Many of the old myths about corvair engines
have been blown out of the water since William Wynne came on the scene. Many
of the older Bernie Pietenpol conversions produced less horsepower and were
heavier because they used stock parts, retained the blower fan and used the
early model engines. The only engine to use is a late model (1965-1969)
110HP.
The corvair conversion for my 601 will start with a late model (1966) 110HP
engine. The blower fan will be removed and the engine will be totally
rebuilt with the best of the best everything. I will be using TRW forged
pistons and Clark's OT-10 cam. The OT-10 cam changes the torque curve to be
more favorable for direct drive aircraft applications.
The corvair is a bit heavy for the 701 at 235 pounds but is a perfect match
for the 601.
The popular overheating myths are a result of using the wrong heads and the
wrong spark advance, or just from using the wrong model engine. The oil
leaking problems have been solved by using modern gaskets. The originals
were natural rubber and would dry out.
For more info check out William Wynne's website: www.flycorvair.com
My engine will cost about $3000 CDN ready to fly. The best deal in sport
aviation.
Regards,
Brian Caithcart
CH601HD
>From: Mark Wood <mawood(at)zoo.uvm.edu>
>Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Corvair on 701
>Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 10:08:35 -0500
>
>
>One of the issues of using a Corvair engine is that they make power at a
>little higher RPM. To do this you need to turn a smaller diameter prop.
>This makes a big difference with a high drag airframe where you want max
>acceleration like in the 701.
>
>I don't know how much of a difference it would make and I don't have the
>background to figure it out, I am just passing on things I have been told
>over the years.
>
>Mark Wood
>601HD 90% down 90% to go.
>
>
>
> >
> >I thought about a corvair in a 701 for my next project so I asked ZAC a
>HP
> >and weight question. They recommend a max of 100 HP and 200lbs. weight.
> >Anything heavier would require ballast in the tail. They indicated no
> >structural problems with the heavier engine, only W&B. You're going to
>lose
> >50 to 100 lbs. of useful load if you stay within gross weight, depending
>on
> >how you build the engine. WW dosen't recommend a 701 as a good airframe
>for
> >the vair. Didn't say why.
> >
> >Ed
> >
> >> From: "reineros" <reineros(at)pacbell.net>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Birgiolas" <johnbirgiolas(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Instrument Panel |
Dear List,
I am choosing the instruments for my 701 panel and could use your experience.
Power will be 912s.
My tentative list of instruments are:
Electric turn and bank
Airspeed, Altimeter, Variometer
Compass(airpass pedistal)
EIS (engine information system) Spruce catalogue page 353 for Rotax
Power panel (either mini power panel or exp bus) Spruce catalogue page 370
Radio panel mount ??
ELT ??
Garmin 196
That's my christmas wish list. Regarding the instruments, has anyone had problems
with the inexpensive imports (quite a savings), or would you suggest rc allen,
uma, sigma tek, or united instruments. Among the name brands, who gives
the best bang for the buck?
Will an electric turn and bank be enough to save my bacon in the occasional cloud
or fog, or would an artificial horizon be better.
Should i go electric with the gyro, or venturi for simplicity, and is the 2 inch
venturi enough to power a gyro in the 701?
The EIS seems pretty popular and serves many functions including tach, voltmeter
and hourmeter. Or would individual instruments (say Westach) be better.
Should I go with the panel mounted radio, or handheld portable?. I will not be
visiting busy airports often, mainly short cottage trips. Any particular brands
or models that are popular?
Intercoms are another source of confusion, there are so many, What are you using
and are you happy with the performance?
The power panels in the spruce catalogue seem to simplify the whole panel building
process. I have read the aeroelectrics arguments pro and con, but they seem
simple and elegant, and look good on the panel. Any experiences of users would
be greatly appreciated.
The garmin 196 seems a no brainer.
Finally, is there a popular ELT for a reasonable price?
Am I missing anything? Please let me know before I give my christmas wishlist to
my wife.
Thanks in advance
John Birgiolas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "reineros" <reineros(at)pacbell.net> |
Thanks for all the 701/corvair information. I look forward to hearing more if
anyone else has information. What a great way to share information, thanks again.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JNBOLDING1" <JNBOLDING1(at)mail.ev1.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Corvair on 701 |
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
>
>The corvair engine if converted as per William Wynne's manual produces an
>honest 90-100 HP at 2900 RPM. Many of the old myths about corvair engines
>have been blown out of the water since William Wynne came on the scene. Many
>of the older Bernie Pietenpol conversions produced less horsepower and were
>heavier because they used stock parts, retained the blower fan and used the
>early model engines. The only engine to use is a late model (1965-1969)
>110HP.
>
>The corvair conversion for my 601 will start with a late model (1966) 110HP
>engine. The blower fan will be removed and the engine will be totally
>rebuilt with the best of the best everything. I will be using TRW forged
>pistons and Clark's OT-10 cam. The OT-10 cam changes the torque curve to be
>more favorable for direct drive aircraft applications.
>
>The corvair is a bit heavy for the 701 at 235 pounds but is a perfect match
>for the 601.
>
>The popular overheating myths are a result of using the wrong heads and the
>wrong spark advance, or just from using the wrong model engine. The oil
>leaking problems have been solved by using modern gaskets. The originals
>were natural rubber and would dry out.
>
>For more info check out William Wynne's website: www.flycorvair.com
>
>My engine will cost about $3000 CDN ready to fly. The best deal in sport
>aviation.
>
>Regards,
>Brian Caithcart
>CH601HD
>
Am also CONSIDERING a Corvair for a 701 but will use a hand prop version with the
alum. cylinders to keep the weight low. Even with the EXPENSIVE LN cylinders
the total cost of the engine will be under $7500 Am going to the Corvair College
in San Antonio in Jan. Started looking around for core engines and they
aren't too hard to find at $2-300 each. Wynn's manual is well worth the $60
if you are even THINKING about this engine. He is a "hands on" guy and has
put a lot of hours FLYING what he sells,not just talking about it. Low and Slow
John Bolding
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Birgiolas" <johnbirgiolas(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | 701 venturi driven instruments |
I am considering installing venturi vacuum driven AI and wonder if anyone has had
any experience with this type of system.
Thanks John Birgiolas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Leo J. Corbalis" <l.corbalis(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Matt maybe you can help me out |
Go to a model plane hobby shop. They have several versions of a piezo rate
gyro in ready to use packaging.
Leo
> I am working on a wing leveler for my Zodiac and am will be using a MEMS
> chip (solid state gyro). The chip only comes in a BALL GRID ARRAY package.
> What I need is a source for a prototype board that will accept BGA type
> devices so I can then plug that into my breadboard for debugging purposes.
>
> Do you know of such a source? If not, do you have any engineer type
> acquaintances that may be able to help?
>
> Regards,
> Bill
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 venturi driven instruments |
John,
I've had a vacuum driven AH since 1993 which has served me well. The vac
generator is an 8 inch one - too big, and probably costs me some drag, but
I'm still here because I had it. It's big enough to drive at least two
instruments. It is mounted on the passenger side below and to the front of
the canopy. Price of the vac AH was much cheaper than an electrically
driven AH and not as long so it fitted between the panel and the gas tank..
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912 - 525 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | kit vs scratch built, was: New To List |
>>3. Not necessarily based on the 640, but how much can I really save
if I build from scratch rather than from kit?
This is a very personal answer we all have to find out:
1.- Building a Kit will take about 6 months to a year (maybe some time
more or less) of part time work.
2.- Building from scratch with the same time invested per week will
take several years, because you will need to build also the "jigs" to
make the parts...
3.- Te cost of the kit is about 13,000 (without engine for the 701, my
case) plus shipping and costs. If the cost will be 1/3rd, from scratch
will cost me about 5,000 dls. maybe more because is dificult (if not
imposible) to buy "exactly" the amount of material for each part, so
the material left over will be part of your costs.
4.- If you can use the time remaining working part time, you will earn
easy the 8,000 remaining for the cost of the kit. If you are retired,
you will have all the time and no paid work to do, this is another
history...
Well, this is one point of view.
Saludos
Gary Gower
701 kit 912S
Guadalajara, Jalisco, Mexico.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Corvair on 701 |
Try the Geo-Raven conversions... they have several engines and the
prices are in reason, Is the Geo Traker engine conversion (3 and 4
cylinders), they send reduction kits or ready to install full engines,
the weight are similar to the Rotax 582 and the 912...
Saludos
Gary Gower
--- reineros wrote:
>
> Has anyone used a corvair on a 701? I apears it would be about 40 to
> 50 lbs. heaver but my wallet would be much heaver than anything the
> factory seams to recomend in 4 cycle.
>
>
>
> _->
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "reineros" <reineros(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Corvair on 701 |
Keep us posted on the 701 corvair project. Think of hand propping a
tricycle airplane, not the same geometry as a tail dragger I have had to
hand prop both and if you are of any stature at all, over 4' tall it is not
comfortable to do. I want to teach my twelve year old daughter to fly so
hand propping is out of the question. I am going to hold my engine decision
in abeyance as long as possible, but it sure would be nice to make the
correct selection as soon as possible to manage the budget considerations
now and not be stuck with the airframe and no money for an engine.
----- Original Message -----
From: "JNBOLDING1" <JNBOLDING1(at)mail.ev1.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Corvair on 701
>
> ---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
>
> >
> >The corvair engine if converted as per William Wynne's manual produces an
> >honest 90-100 HP at 2900 RPM. Many of the old myths about corvair engines
> >have been blown out of the water since William Wynne came on the scene.
Many
> >of the older Bernie Pietenpol conversions produced less horsepower and
were
> >heavier because they used stock parts, retained the blower fan and used
the
> >early model engines. The only engine to use is a late model (1965-1969)
> >110HP.
> >
> >The corvair conversion for my 601 will start with a late model (1966)
110HP
> >engine. The blower fan will be removed and the engine will be totally
> >rebuilt with the best of the best everything. I will be using TRW forged
> >pistons and Clark's OT-10 cam. The OT-10 cam changes the torque curve to
be
> >more favorable for direct drive aircraft applications.
> >
> >The corvair is a bit heavy for the 701 at 235 pounds but is a perfect
match
> >for the 601.
> >
> >The popular overheating myths are a result of using the wrong heads and
the
> >wrong spark advance, or just from using the wrong model engine. The oil
> >leaking problems have been solved by using modern gaskets. The originals
> >were natural rubber and would dry out.
> >
> >For more info check out William Wynne's website: www.flycorvair.com
> >
> >My engine will cost about $3000 CDN ready to fly. The best deal in sport
> >aviation.
> >
> >Regards,
> >Brian Caithcart
> >CH601HD
> >
>
> Am also CONSIDERING a Corvair for a 701 but will use a hand prop version
with the alum. cylinders to keep the weight low. Even with the EXPENSIVE LN
cylinders the total cost of the engine will be under $7500 Am going to the
Corvair College in San Antonio in Jan. Started looking around for core
engines and they aren't too hard to find at $2-300 each. Wynn's manual is
well worth the $60 if you are even THINKING about this engine. He is a
"hands on" guy and has put a lot of hours FLYING what he sells,not just
talking about it. Low and Slow John Bolding
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Stutzman <stutzman(at)stutzman.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 venturi driven instruments |
On Sun, 8 Dec 2002, John Birgiolas wrote:
>
> I am considering installing venturi vacuum driven AI and wonder if
> anyone has had any experience with this type of system.
Yes. On a Cessna 170. Didn't like it very much. The venturi really
didn't pull enough vacuum until you were pretty much at the end of take
off roll. Made it pretty hard to make sure it was working before
take-off. Also, it never happended to me, but venturii are pretty prone
to icing over, rendering them somewhat useless.
As you mentioned only installing an AI, I assume (sincerly hope!) you
arn't planning on doing IFR in your 701. While instrument rated, I have
never flown a 701 (something I hope to fix soon). I can't imagine it
being a good instrument platform, though.
If you are putting in the AI for those inadvertant IMC situations, then
your purpose might be better served by a TC or a T&B. Almost as easy to
use as a AI in such situations. Much cheaper (both to buy and overhaul),
and easier to install as they are typically electric.
Frank Stutzman
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Combo EFIS & Moving Map GPS |
| From: | charles.long(at)gm.com |
12/12/2002 09:10:08 AM
If you are looking for a "save your bacon" system for inadvertant
IMC, you should consider Anywhere Map's GPS Moving Map and EFIS combo
using a solid state gyro pac. Cost for whole system including GPS engine,
Compac IPAC and Solid State Gyro is around $1800! Couple this with an
electric T&B at $300 and you even have redundancy.
Chuck Long, CFI
> I am considering installing venturi vacuum driven AI and wonder if
> anyone has had any experience with this type of system.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Danielson" <steved(at)nc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Question about Painting & Alodining |
I've got a question about painting, and was wondering what opninions folks
had on this. I was looking through the archives for information on acid etch
followed by alodining, and while I didn't find too many folks using it
internally before priming, I saw several folks say that when it was time to
paint the exterior of the plane, they did it. But I know of other folks that
did not use that process before painting (like John T with the spray can
rustoleum and others that used the "real" spray gun/painting)
My questions are:
What external painting systems require the alodining process? If they don't
require it, do they recommend it? (Looking through big corporate websites
for the manufacturers like Dupont yields very little results that I could
find)
If a person was planning to paint their plane after alodining the exterior,
would it make sense to alodine the exterior during construction and leave
the unpainted alodined exterior for a year or more until such time as
painting? (Would you want to go ahead and do the rivets as well, since the
heads would be getting it if you did it after assembly)
If a person was planning to do item 2 above (alodine now during
construction) what benefit would be received by doing the interior as well
(would it be total overkill due to the corrosion resistant 6061-T6 we are
using?
Thanks all
Steve
PS I too noticed the list was quiet so these popular topics will be stir up
some replies.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Noel & Yoshie Simmons" <noel(at)blueskyaviation.net> |
| Subject: | Combo EFIS & Moving Map GPS |
I looked into this for a customer and found that you can not run both GPS
and EFIS at the same time. To switch between the two takes some time for
the EFIS system to re calibrate itself and while doing this you must be in a
good strait and level attitude with out to much up and down turbulence. My
though is that when you need it the most it will fail you because it will
not have calibrated correctly.
Noel and Yoshie Simmons
Blue Sky Aviation, Inc.
"We do builder assistance!"
Toll Free: 866-859-0390
info(at)blueskyaviation.net
www.blueskyaviation.net
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
charles.long(at)gm.com
Subject: Zenith-List: Combo EFIS & Moving Map GPS
If you are looking for a "save your bacon" system for inadvertant
IMC, you should consider Anywhere Map's GPS Moving Map and EFIS combo
using a solid state gyro pac. Cost for whole system including GPS engine,
Compac IPAC and Solid State Gyro is around $1800! Couple this with an
electric T&B at $300 and you even have redundancy.
Chuck Long, CFI
> I am considering installing venturi vacuum driven AI and wonder if
> anyone has had any experience with this type of system.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Question about Painting & Alodining |
Steve,
Any etch process should be left until it's in close proximity to
paint preperation. Alodine is a way of handling the etch process and it's
one easier way to cover the large area required, but I'd leave
it for the week you paint. I'm using acrylic enamels
inside, over zinc chromate. (inexpensive and repairable) An organic
3M mask offers adequate protection from the chromate.
The outside will consider a harder finish, but it too must be something
that is repairable without killer fumes like urethanes where an organic
mask doesn't even get close to protecting you or the family.
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Danielson" <steved(at)nc.rr.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Question about Painting & Alodining
>
> I've got a question about painting, and was wondering what opninions folks
> had on this. I was looking through the archives for information on acid
etch
> followed by alodining, and while I didn't find too many folks using it
> internally before priming, I saw several folks say that when it was time
to
> paint the exterior of the plane, they did it. But I know of other folks
that
> did not use that process before painting (like John T with the spray can
> rustoleum and others that used the "real" spray gun/painting)
>
> My questions are:
>
> What external painting systems require the alodining process? If they
don't
> require it, do they recommend it? (Looking through big corporate websites
> for the manufacturers like Dupont yields very little results that I could
> find)
>
> If a person was planning to paint their plane after alodining the
exterior,
> would it make sense to alodine the exterior during construction and leave
> the unpainted alodined exterior for a year or more until such time as
> painting? (Would you want to go ahead and do the rivets as well, since the
> heads would be getting it if you did it after assembly)
>
> If a person was planning to do item 2 above (alodine now during
> construction) what benefit would be received by doing the interior as well
> (would it be total overkill due to the corrosion resistant 6061-T6 we are
> using?
>
> Thanks all
>
> Steve
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick <rick.pitcher(at)verizon.net> |
"Larry C. McFarland" wrote:
> Clifton,
> Welcome to the list! The process of scratch building
> would especially depend on what your experience in making things
> draws from.
>
> If you need further assist, please visit my website and journal.
>
> Larry C. McFarland - 601hds @ http://www.macsmachine.com
I gotta say, that website of Larry's is a GREAT source of info for those
of us building the 601. It's really helped me visualize how this bird
goes together :)
I'm about 2 or 3 months into my kit built wing/ scratch built fuselage
601HD right now, here's the latest pics building and mating the fuselage
sections:
http://lightflyers.com/fuse.html
http://lightflyers.com/mate.html
Hoping to have an Airplane Shaped Object by New Years' Day.
Rick Pitcher
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <thilo.kind(at)gmx.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Instrument panel layout |
Aircraft Spruce catalogue
best regards
Thilo Kind
----- Original Message -----
From: "fran tschida" <tschidax(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Instrument panel layout
>
> What is the A/S catalog?
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <thilo.kind(at)gmx.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Instrument panel layout
>
>
> >
> > Hi Bill,
> >
> > here is what I did:
> > using a CAD software - AutoCad in my case - I made a drawing of the IP.
> > Then, using the templates provided by the A/S catalogue I drew all the
> > instruments plus the cut-out area and center hole for each instrument.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Leo J. Corbalis" <l.corbalis(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Combo EFIS & Moving Map GPS |
Get 2 PDA's, one for efis and one for gps.
I have a Navaid wing leveler autopilot with a GPS coupler, cross country is
a sightseeing ride. If I get my tail in a crack, I know I can use the
wingleveler / tracker to get me there while I fly the elevator. You MUST be
able to ignore vertigo!
Leo Corbalis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Combo EFIS & Moving Map GPS |
>
> I looked into this for a customer and found that you can not run both GPS
> and EFIS at the same time. To switch between the two takes some time for
> the EFIS system to re calibrate itself and while doing this you must be in
a
> good strait and level attitude with out to much up and down turbulence.
My
> though is that when you need it the most it will fail you because it will
> not have calibrated correctly.
>
This seems to contradict what their website says. They say the gyros don't
take any computing power and are always running therefore preventing the
problem you describe. Also, the price is $2295 with the PDA, AI, and
Anywhere Map combo. They have a holiday sale of $2195.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jon Croke" <Jon(at)joncroke.com> |
Does anyone understand rivets well enough to explain to me how I can specify
the color of a rivet?
I slightly over-enlarged some holes on the trailing edge of the flaps which
are to use solid, soft 3/32 rivets, and are gold in color as supplied by
ZAC. I ordered a bag of the next size up (1/8) and received, from Wicks,
the right size, but they are SILVER in color and hence, dont match the gold
ones!
Is the color of these rivets some how part of the part number??
I ordered MS20470A4-3
Thanks for any insight
Jon
701
www.joncroke.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet color?? |
Jon,
The color of MS20470 rivets isn't like clecos. These come either
hard or soft, so you might just squeeze a couple to be assured that they
are the soft ones you wanted. Sounds like the former were anodized
to keep them from oxidation and the silver were perhaps protected
by some other process, or not. Pure 1100 doesn't likely need protection.
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jon Croke" <Jon(at)joncroke.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Rivet color??
> Does anyone understand rivets well enough to explain to me how I can
specify
> the color of a rivet?
>
> I slightly over-enlarged some holes on the trailing edge of the flaps
which
> are to use solid, soft 3/32 rivets, and are gold in color as supplied by
> ZAC. I ordered a bag of the next size up (1/8) and received, from Wicks,
> the right size, but they are SILVER in color and hence, dont match the
gold
> ones!
>
> Is the color of these rivets some how part of the part number??
> I ordered MS20470A4-3
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ac6qj(at)earthlink.net |
| Subject: | Jabiru Electrical Budget |
Hello List,
I've been considering a Jabiru 3300 engine installation but am
disappointed by the engine's electrical generating capacity of 40
watts (i.e. 20 Amps at 13.8). A reasonable plan for avionics and
lighting is shown below. The worse case operational scenario places
the Jabiru 3300 electrical budget at a 117 watt deficit.
Power Budget Voltage Current Watts
Intercom / Marker Receiver 13.8 1.00 13.800
GPS Nav / Comm 13.8 5.50 75.900
VOR/LOC/GPS CDI 13.8 0.10 1.380
Transponder 13.8 1.45 20.010
Altitude Encoder 13.8 0.60 6.900
Electric Turn & Bank 13.8 0.50 9.660
Tail Light 13.8 2.00 27.600
Position Light with Strobe 13.8 4.00 55.200
Position Light with Strobe 13.8 4.00 55.200
Landing Light 13.8 7.25 100.050
Cabin Lighting 13.8 0.24 3.312
Instrument Lighting 13.8 0.64 8.832
Other 13.8 1.00 13.800
Total Power Consumption 13.8 28.48 390.264
Jabiru 3300 Electrical Capacity 13.8 20.00 276.000
Electrical Budget Balance 13.8 -8.48 -117.024
The Jabiru's generator is integral and driven directly from the
flywheel. The generator is woefully inadequate for my power budget
requirements (and the avionics package is _not_negotiable_). It
would seem that a 40 amp (550 watt) generating capacity would be much
more appropriate and would provide ample margin.
Has anyone come up with an alternative source for electrical power
for the Jabiru, such as a belt driven alternator?
If so, how was the alternate electrical power source accommodated
November 18, 2002 - December 15, 2002
Zenith-Archive.digest.vol-dd