Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:46 AM - Re: 2009 Northwest Aviation Conference & Trade Show (Tom Jones)
2. 07:37 AM - Re: Re: Will any company insure a student/Kitfox? (lance miller)
3. 08:04 AM - Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 (Cmflyboy12@aol.com)
4. 08:13 AM - Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 (lance miller)
5. 08:20 AM - Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 (Cmflyboy12@aol.com)
6. 08:28 AM - Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 (lance miller)
7. 08:37 AM - Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 (Cmflyboy12@aol.com)
8. 08:45 AM - Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 (lance miller)
9. 08:49 AM - Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 (lance miller)
10. 08:52 AM - Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 (Cmflyboy12@AOL.COM)
11. 08:53 AM - Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 (Cmflyboy12@aol.com)
12. 09:17 AM - Brake rotors (Ed Gray)
13. 09:34 AM - Re: Brake rotors (patrick reilly)
14. 09:37 AM - New issue, turtle deck security (WurlyBird)
15. 09:40 AM - Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 (Aerobatics@aol.com)
16. 09:58 AM - Re: New issue, turtle deck security (akflyer)
17. 10:13 AM - Re: New issue, turtle deck security (akflyer)
18. 10:23 AM - Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 (Paul Franz - Merlin GT)
19. 10:46 AM - Re: New issue, turtle deck security (WurlyBird)
20. 11:12 AM - Re: New issue, turtle deck security (akflyer)
21. 12:00 PM - Re: New issue, turtle deck security (WurlyBird)
22. 12:30 PM - Re: Re: New issue, turtle deck security (patrick reilly)
23. 01:14 PM - Re: New issue, turtle deck security (akflyer)
24. 02:03 PM - Re: Brake rotors (Guy Buchanan)
25. 02:39 PM - Re: New issue, turtle deck security (akflyer)
26. 03:03 PM - Re: Re: New issue, turtle deck security (Lynn Matteson)
27. 04:05 PM - Re: Re: New issue, turtle deck security (Paul Franz)
28. 05:14 PM - Re: New issue, turtle deck security (akflyer)
29. 05:49 PM - Re: Re: New issue, turtle deck security (patrick reilly)
30. 05:55 PM - Re: Re: New issue, turtle deck security (Lynn Matteson)
31. 06:07 PM - Re: Re: New issue, turtle deck security (Lynn Matteson)
32. 06:16 PM - Re: Will any company insure a student/Kitfox? (815TL)
33. 07:14 PM - Re: New issue, turtle deck security (Tom Jones)
34. 07:39 PM - Re: Re: New issue, turtle deck security (sbennett3)
35. 08:06 PM - Re: New issue, turtle deck security (vetdrem)
36. 08:11 PM - Re: Re: New issue, turtle deck security (Paul Franz - Merlin GT)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: 2009 Northwest Aviation Conference & Trade Show |
> Is this a good one to go to for shopping instruments and radios? It sure looks
like there is a lot of fun stuff there. Looks like it costs $5 which is pretty
reasonable. I see you can fly in to Thun Field and they have a shuttle service
that is free too.
>
> 2009 Northwest Aviation Conference & Trade Show
I enjoy this event each year. Dealers there often give show discounts. There
are some good seminars to choose from too.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230318#230318
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| Subject: | Re: Will any company insure a student/Kitfox? |
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Will any company insure a student/Kitfox?> From
: r66rc-matronics@yahoo.com> Date: Sat=2C 14 Feb 2009 20:23:21 -0800> To: k
6rc-matronics@yahoo.com>> > I found myself in exactly your predicament last
spring. I owned the plane=2C had no time in type=2C and couldn't get insur
ance.> > My solution was very close to what Guy Buchanan suggested=2C but w
ith a twist. I went to my instructor's insurance agency and arranged for a
complete policy (liability and hull damage) but named my instructor as the
only pilot. I was not in the loop except as a student under the direction o
f my PIC instructor. I also (later) added two fellow Kitfox owners (who are
experienced pilots) as named pilots on my policy. > > BTW=2C the insurance
carrier is AIG and they had no problems at all with the way the policy was
set up. Also of note is that my instructor wanted me to have my own policy
on my plane (with him named) and not expect to use his policy to cover my
plane or our flying in it. > > Best of luck=2C> > Rich Cunningham> > > i ha
ve a model 2 very clean airplane i havent flown her in 2 years=2C i need so
meone to help me get current again=2C im in giddings texas=2C close to aust
in tx...........HELP ! manceliller@hotmail.com> > Read this topic online h
ere:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230295#230295> > > >
========================> _
================> > > i have
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| Subject: | Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 |
hello,This is flyboy. I have a 582 kitfox 2 with a cgs prop I was thinking
abot changing to IVO 3 Blade,any advise
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| Subject: | what prop is the best,for a 582 |
isint it a gsc? i have a 3 blade wooden prop=2C it a gsc=2C and i like it !
!! i really dont know the differance=2C between the 2
From: Cmflyboy12@aol.comDate: Sun=2C 15 Feb 2009 11:03:16 -0500Subject: Re:
Kitfox-List: what prop is the best=2Cfor a 582To: kitfox-list@matronics.co
m
hello=2CThis is flyboy. I have a 582 kitfox 2 with a cgs prop I was thinkin
g abot changing to IVO 3 Blade=2Cany advise
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| Subject: | Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 |
yes it is, I got it backwords.Why I ask is I,ve had a ivo 3 blade on a
challenger 2 and I liked the way it adjusted.
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| Subject: | what prop is the best,for a 582 |
well i had a dog attack my plane a few years ago=2C and he ran into the pro
p=2C it killed the dog=2C and cracked my prop! i bought a new gsc=2C and on
ly adjusted it once. do you play with your settings alot? p.s i just sent y
ou some pictures of my bird
From: Cmflyboy12@aol.comDate: Sun=2C 15 Feb 2009 11:19:53 -0500Subject: Re:
Kitfox-List: what prop is the best=2Cfor a 582To: kitfox-list@matronics.co
m
yes it is=2C I got it backwords.Why I ask is I=2Cve had a ivo 3 blade on a
challenger 2 and I liked the way it adjusted.
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| Subject: | Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 |
where do I get your pics at I,ll send you 1 of mine
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| Subject: | what prop is the best,for a 582 |
i sent them to cmflyboy12@aol.com
From: Cmflyboy12@aol.comDate: Sun=2C 15 Feb 2009 11:35:39 -0500Subject: Re:
Kitfox-List: what prop is the best=2Cfor a 582To: kitfox-list@matronics.co
m
where do I get your pics at I=2Cll send you 1 of mine
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| Subject: | what prop is the best,for a 582 |
well im headed to the airport=2C to do some taxiing.......wish me luck.....
.....good looking airplane
From: Cmflyboy12@aol.comDate: Sun=2C 15 Feb 2009 11:35:39 -0500Subject: Re:
Kitfox-List: what prop is the best=2Cfor a 582To: kitfox-list@matronics.co
m
where do I get your pics at I=2Cll send you 1 of mine
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09
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 |
yes I have found them. That is a very,very nice plane,I love that yellow,
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Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 |
Good luck stay on top of that tail wheel
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Message 12
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Lynn and Patrick, I would remove the outer rim of the rotors by making 4 or
5 radial cuts with an angle grinder and cutoff wheel, up to the outer radius
desired for each segment to be removed (like slicing a pie). Then lop of
the segments with the cutoff wheel and round off the circumference with a
grinder wheel on the same machine and dress with a file. No need for a band
saw here. I didn't bother because the weight savings seemed small, but next
time the rotors are off I will. I also drilled my axles one inch and tapped
them for a 5/16 bolt for future wheel pants. Then I made a C shaped clip
out of thick steel wire to pin the axle bolt and eliminate the cotter. Now
I can drill the axle dust caps, and install a stud to stabilize the pants.
I want to fly it a bit before adding the wheel pants. Got the engine and
radiator in this weekend. I vented the cylinder head into the water line
exiting the head above the oil pump since my water fill tank has no nipple.
Any 582 guys see any problem with this? I also didn't like the use of only
three bolts for the exhaust manifold, so I put short studs in the upper
inside holes and can put nuts on it by tightening the two nuts gradually as
the manifold goes on. I had to grind a little weld material from the flange
so the nuts are seated flush. Worked great.
I am now debating whether to add a Hacman control before completion. Any
comments about this decision are welcome.
Ed Gray, KII, 582 building, Dallas , do not archive
Message 13
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Ed=2C Thanks for the info. Sounds like a way to accomplish the outer rim re
movable of the brake disc without a bandsaw. But=2C it would be very time c
onsuming to make all those cuts in 1/4" steel with a cutoff wheel. Good luc
k with your build. CPS shows a diagram venting the head just as you did. Wh
ere did you find a 1"x1/4"x1" tee=2C if that is what you used. Pat ReillyMo
d 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL
From: egraylaw@swbell.netTo: kitfox-list@matronics.comSubject: Kitfox-List:
Brake rotorsDate: Sun=2C 15 Feb 2009 11:16:28 -0600
Lynn and Patrick=2C I would remove the outer rim of the rotors by making 4
or 5 radial cuts with an angle grinder and cutoff wheel=2C up to the outer
radius desired for each segment to be removed (like slicing a pie). Then
lop of the segments with the cutoff wheel and round off the circumference w
ith a grinder wheel on the same machine and dress with a file. No need for
a band saw here. I didn=92t bother because the weight savings seemed smal
l=2C but next time the rotors are off I will. I also drilled my axles one
inch and tapped them for a 5/16 bolt for future wheel pants. Then I made a
C shaped clip out of thick steel wire to pin the axle bolt and eliminate
the cotter. Now I can drill the axle dust caps=2C and install a stud to st
abilize the pants. I want to fly it a bit before adding the wheel pants.
Got the engine and radiator in this weekend. I vented the cylinder head in
to the water line exiting the head above the oil pump since my water fill t
ank has no nipple. Any 582 guys see any problem with this? I also didn=92
t like the use of only three bolts for the exhaust manifold=2C so I put sh
ort studs in the upper inside holes and can put nuts on it by tightening t
he two nuts gradually as the manifold goes on. I had to grind a little wel
d material from the flange so the nuts are seated flush. Worked great.
I am now debating whether to add a Hacman control before completion. Any c
omments about this decision are welcome.
Ed Gray=2C KII=2C 582 building=2C Dallas =2C do not archive
Message 14
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| Subject: | New issue, turtle deck security |
I can not tell you how much I hat being the guy who has one issue after another,
but I have to say I expected to have a series of issues purchasing a plane.
I just didn't think they would all be so EXCITING.
So yesterday I had my instructor take my wife up in the Kitfox for a quick ride
since she is half the owner and had never been up in it. They came back the
turtle deck had popped out from under the green house (is this what the large
sun roof window is called in this plane?) and was acting as a large scoop. What
I have been told was that they were doing some progressively steeper turns
and on a right turn the instructor let the nose tuck in the turn which let the
airspeed build a little, probably around 90-95 indicated, and then there was
a "pop" and a "woosh". [Shocked] Neither said where the trim ball was at the
time, but I am sure it was not in the center.
We pulled the turtle deck off and reinstalled it and the front edge of it buts
all the way against the metal strip which holds the gap under the window. All
DZUS fasteners (camlocks?) were installed and are as snug as I would expect.
So once again I am here with no ideas how to go about fixing this, or even if
there is something to fix. I am not sure what could have caused this to happen.
Any help is appreciated.
James
--------
James
Kitfox 3 / 582 / GSC prop
4 hrs of instruction and climbing (I solo tomorrow)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230357#230357
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: what prop is the best,for a 582 |
I have a KF with an 3 blade IVO.... 582 E box
Perfection
In a message dated 2/15/2009 10:05:29 A.M. Central Standard Time,
Cmflyboy12@aol.com writes:
hello,This is flyboy. I have a 582 kitfox 2 with a cgs prop I was thinking
abot changing to IVO 3 Blade,any advise
____________________________________
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(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List)
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution)
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Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
James, I read in my Avid manual of this happening if the windshield was cut to
short and the turtle deck did not stuck under it far enough. I thing they recommended
1.25" of turtle deck sticking under the windshield. The fix was to drill
out the rivets on the back edge of the windshield, slip a piece of aluminum
between the windshield and the spacer to get the full 1.25" over lap. Would
only take an hour tops to make the quick fix! I will dig through the files
and see if I can find the drawing for you and get it posted in the next couple
hours.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry aka SNAKE
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
#1 snake oil salesman since 1-22-2009
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230361#230361
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
here is some snake oil for today...... the service letter from Avid. This will
take care of you!
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry aka SNAKE
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
#1 snake oil salesman since 1-22-2009
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230367#230367
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/turtle_deck_service_letter_994.pdf
Message 18
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| Subject: | what prop is the best,for a 582 |
On Sun, February 15, 2009 8:28 am, lance miller wrote:
>
clip clip
> ..... p.s i just sent you some pictures of my bird
I'd like to see them too. Probably everyone else does too!
They're very easy to post using the forum interface to this list.
<http://forums.matronics.com/viewforum.php?f=8>
--
Paul A. Franz
Registration/Aircraft - N14UW/Merlin GT
Engine/Prop - Rotax 914/NSI CAP
Bellevue WA
425.241.1618 Cell
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
Thanks a bunch. I read the letter and checked my measurements. I am sitting at
1 1/2" so I am good according to the letter. But I find it odd that they are
measuring from the front edge of FC-3. Why not state the minimum requirement
as amount of over hang? I have 5/8" of lexan that over laps the turtle deck,
does this sound like the appropriate amount?
--------
James
Kitfox 3 / 582 / GSC prop
4 hrs of instruction and climbing (I solo tomorrow)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230371#230371
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
NO, they state you need 1.25" overlap. The drawing is a little hosed up, read
the written description. The letter kinda states why... it you dont have the
overlap, and you are doing slips (could be an uncoordinated turn) you can pressure
up the fuse and blammo you got a nice little speed brake right behind your
head and soiled pair of shorts. Not so bad if they are yours, but if you make
the ole lady soil hers, you can expect some couch time in the near future and
the playground is liable to be off limits for a very long time.
Do the fix they show and you will both be happier.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry aka SNAKE
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
#1 snake oil salesman since 1-22-2009
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230373#230373
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
I re-read it two more times, everything is indicating that the minimum required
1 1/4" is measured from the front of FC-3. Do you have 1 1/4" of lexan that
overlaps the turtle deck? Can I get a quick poll on this from a few people?
I can certainly see that the extra would help keep everything together.
--------
James
Kitfox 3 / 582 / GSC prop
4 hrs of instruction and climbing (I solo tomorrow)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230377#230377
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/avid_clip_189.jpg
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
James. Looking at Lenoards drawing =2C " frrom the front of FC-3 overlap" w
ould not give you 1 1/4 overlap of the turtle deck. It would give you 1 1/4
" minus the width of FC-28. Leonards drawing shows that dimention to be 5/8
".Pat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: New
issue=2C turtle deck security> From: james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil> Date: Su
n=2C 15 Feb 2009 11:58:42 -0800> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> > --> Kitfo
x-List message posted by: "WurlyBird" <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>> > I r
e-read it two more times=2C everything is indicating that the minimum requi
red 1 1/4" is measured from the front of FC-3. Do you have 1 1/4" of lexan
that overlaps the turtle deck? Can I get a quick poll on this from a few pe
ople? I can certainly see that the extra would help keep everything togethe
r.> > --------> James> Kitfox 3 / 582 / GSC prop> 4 hrs of instruction and
climbing (I solo tomorrow)> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://
forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230377#230377> > > > > Attachments:
==========> > >
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
WurlyBird wrote:
> I re-read it two more times, everything is indicating that the minimum required
1 1/4" is measured from the front of FC-3. Do you have 1 1/4" of lexan that
overlaps the turtle deck? Can I get a quick poll on this from a few people?
I can certainly see that the extra would help keep everything together.
OK as I said the DRAWING is hosed... use it a REFERENCE to give you a visual on
the fix... the written description states
The leading edge of the turtle deck must engage the skylight with a minimum overlap
of 1 1/4"
This does not say from the edge of yada yada, it states OVERLAP period. Go by
the written letter not the drawing and you cant go wrong.
I put this on mine as I did not feel like having an in-flight air-conditioning
system self activating at inopportune moments.
[/b]
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry aka SNAKE
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
#1 snake oil salesman since 1-22-2009
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230386#230386
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Brake rotors |
At 09:16 AM 2/15/2009, you wrote:
>I am now debating whether to add a Hacman control before
>completion. Any comments about this decision are welcome.
Ed,
Highly recommended. Check the archives for lots of specifics.
Guy Buchanan
San Diego, CA
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
marked up the PDF and reposted
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry aka SNAKE
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
#1 snake oil salesman since 1-22-2009
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230404#230404
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
This is an unfortunate circumstance where the "picture guy" and the
"dialogue guy" did not get on the same page...literally....before
this Service Bulletin went out.
It's too bad too, because it leaves us builders to try to figure out
if the situation calls for the 1 -1/4" overlap of turledeck and
skylight, or the "apparent" 5/8" of overlap as shown on the drawing.
What do we follow...words or picture?
Just to interject my own situation, I followed the *Kitfox* drawing
and dialogue, and mine came out closer to the 5/8" dimension. I have
not had the trouble that James has had and I do a LOT of slips to
both sides.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
On Feb 15, 2009, at 2:58 PM, WurlyBird wrote:
> <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
>
> I re-read it two more times, everything is indicating that the
> minimum required 1 1/4" is measured from the front of FC-3. Do you
> have 1 1/4" of lexan that overlaps the turtle deck? Can I get a
> quick poll on this from a few people? I can certainly see that the
> extra would help keep everything together.
>
> --------
> James
> Kitfox 3 / 582 / GSC prop
> 4 hrs of instruction and climbing (I solo tomorrow)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230377#230377
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/avid_clip_189.jpg
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
On Sun, February 15, 2009 2:38 pm, akflyer wrote:
>
> marked up the PDF and reposted
Excellent! Now this is perfectly clear. However, I must point out that the markup
did
not get distributed to the e-mail list but it appears in the forum posting just
fine.
click this link to see Leni's (Snakeman's) perfectly clear markup.
<http://forums.matronics.com/download.php?id=14596&sid=7a9dbd247008ae785633dd9eb88241c2>
>
> --------
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> Leonard Perry aka SNAKE
> Soldotna AK
> Avid "C" / Mk IV
> 582 IVO IFA
> Full Lotus 1260
> #1 snake oil salesman since 1-22-2009
>
> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230404#230404
>
>
--
Paul Franz
425.440.9505 (O)
425.241.1618 (C)
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
Paul A. Franz, P.E. wrote:
> On Sun, February 15, 2009 2:38 pm, akflyer wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > marked up the PDF and reposted
> >
> >
>
> Excellent! Now this is perfectly clear. However, I must point out that the markup
did
> not get distributed to the e-mail list but it appears in the forum posting just
fine.
> click this link to see Leni's (Snakeman's) perfectly clear markup.
>
>
>
>
> >
> > --------
> > DO NOT ARCHIVE
> > Leonard Perry aka SNAKE
> > Soldotna AK
> > Avid "C" / Mk IV
> > 582 IVO IFA
> > Full Lotus 1260
> > #1 snake oil salesman since 1-22-2009
> >
> > hander outer of humorless darwin awards
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 30404#230404
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Paul Franz
> 425.440.9505 (O)
> 425.241.1618 (C)
Paul, I think it is because the PDF did not attach right when I first made the
post. I edited the post and now it shows up on the forum, but not to anyone who
is just using emails. For the sake of all, I will post the attachment again
with this reply.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry aka SNAKE
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
#1 snake oil salesman since 1-22-2009
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230429#230429
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/turtle_deck_marked_up_211.pdf
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
Len=2C Thanks for info. I made my 2 piece windshield cabin top same as orig
inal it has about 5/8 " overlap. Guess I'll have to install the aluminum ov
erhang addition to be safe. Hard to believe 5/8" isn't adequate.
do not archivePat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL> Date: Sun=2C 15 Fe
b 2009 16:04:29 -0800> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: New issue=2C turtle de
ck security> From: paul@eucleides.com> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> > -->
Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Franz" <paul@eucleides.com>> > > On S
un=2C February 15=2C 2009 2:38 pm=2C akflyer wrote:> > --> Kitfox-List mess
age posted by: "akflyer" <akflyer_2000@yahoo.com>> >> > marked up the PDF a
nd reposted> > Excellent! Now this is perfectly clear. However=2C I must po
int out that the markup did> not get distributed to the e-mail list but it
appears in the forum posting just fine.> click this link to see Leni's (Sna
keman's) perfectly clear markup.> > <http://forums.matronics.com/download.p
hp?id=14596&sid=7a9dbd247008ae785633dd9eb88241c2>> > >> > --------> > D
O NOT ARCHIVE> > Leonard Perry aka SNAKE> > Soldotna AK> > Avid "=3BC&q
uot=3B / Mk IV> > 582 IVO IFA> > Full Lotus 1260> > #1 snake oil salesman s
ince 1-22-2009> >> > hander outer of humorless darwin awards> >> >> >> >> >
Read this topic online here:> >> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p
hp?p=230404#230404> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > -- > Paul Franz> 42
========================> _
==> > >
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
Perfectly clear, but is this 1-1/4" dimension really needed? The
Kitfox seems to work ok with the 5/8" overlap, and this is the first
time we've (I've, at least) heard of the turtledeck blowing out...or
is it? Somebody with more time in type and on this list should be
able to answer this question. Is there a Service Bulletin out on the
Kitfox? Remember this is an Avid Service Bulletin. I'm not saying
anything bad about Avids, just trying to understand why no SB on a
Kitfox, if indeed there are none.
Next is the history of this particular plane. Just the other day we
had a flutter problem on this plane. Now we've got a turtledeck
trying to exit the plane. How about thinking a bit further into this
plane, and wondering if maybe the plane was sold because it exhibited
some of these strange behaviors. How about a weak framework? How
about a broken tube joint somewhere hidden from normal view that
would allow the framework to flex? Did the new owner take the seats
out, and look for any new welds, or broken ones? Are all the camlocks
present and accounted for?...my plane has 9 of them holding the
t'deck on...factory count. Are they tight? How thick is the
windshield/skylight material? How many machine screws hold the rear
of the skylight in place, or are they rivets as the Kitfox and the
Avid drawings show? I chose to use machine screws and nutplates on my
installation after I read of so many builders needing to replace
windshields/skylights due to crazing/cracks, etc. That might account
for some of the strength in that area that my plane apparently exhibits.
Remember this is a recently sold/purchased airplane....maybe the
buyer need to do more than kick the tires and light 'er up.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
On Feb 15, 2009, at 7:04 PM, Paul Franz wrote:
>
>
> On Sun, February 15, 2009 2:38 pm, akflyer wrote:
>>
>> marked up the PDF and reposted
>
> Excellent! Now this is perfectly clear. However, I must point out
> that the markup did
> not get distributed to the e-mail list but it appears in the forum
> posting just fine.
> click this link to see Leni's (Snakeman's) perfectly clear markup.
>
> <http://forums.matronics.com/download.php?
> id=14596&sid=7a9dbd247008ae785633dd9eb88241c2>
>
>>
>> --------
>> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>> Leonard Perry aka SNAKE
>> Soldotna AK
>> Avid "C" / Mk IV
>> 582 IVO IFA
>> Full Lotus 1260
>> #1 snake oil salesman since 1-22-2009
>>
>> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230404#230404
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Paul Franz
> 425.440.9505 (O)
> 425.241.1618 (C)
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
Hard for me to believe too, Pat, but remember that this is an Avid
Service Letter, *undated*, and refers to slips with the door open.
Maybe this was released before Kitfox broke away from the "parent"
organization, and Kitfox strengthened something after this, rendering
this SL non-applicable to the 'fox.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
On Feb 15, 2009, at 8:47 PM, patrick reilly wrote:
> Len, Thanks for info. I made my 2 piece windshield cabin top same
> as original it has about 5/8 " overlap. Guess I'll have to install
> the aluminum overhang addition to be safe. Hard to believe 5/8"
> isn't adequate.
> do not archive
>
> Pat Reilly
> Mod 3 582 Rebuild
> Rockford, IL
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Will any company insure a student/Kitfox? |
Thank you all again. Falcon got back to me, and they found an underwriter that
is willing to cover as soon as I have 10 hours of dual, and 10 take offs and
landings. Not as bad as I thought at $950 for the year. I am still going to
ask around at some of the suggestions you all have made, to see if I can get a
better deal.
Andrew
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230439#230439
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
> We pulled the turtle deck off and reinstalled it and the front edge of it buts
all the way against the metal strip which holds the gap under the window. All
DZUS fasteners (camlocks?) were installed and are as snug as I would expect.
So once again I am here with no ideas how to go about fixing this, or even if
there is something to fix. I am not sure what could have caused this to happen.
Any help is appreciated.
>
> James
James, I just now went out and looked at my turtle deck. Mine is a Classic 4 and
I have never seen a Model III in person. It may be different than a 4. I
see no way the leading edge can come out from under the skylight trailing edge
without some significant permanent bending.
Attached is a picture of the inside of the leading edge on a Classic 4 turtle deck.
Note the notch in the lower left where it fits around the rear spar carry
through. Also the stiffening angles riveted to the inside of the deck. The
camlock on the side near the leading edge.
The wear marks where it has been fitting shows 5/8 inch overlap under the skylight
lexan.
Is it possible your turtle deck was installed with the leading edge on top of the
trailing edge of the skylight by mistake before the flight?
I would not hesitate to install the mod posted for the avid if you can't find a
logical reason for what happened. It would be good to hear from some model III
owners on this.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230447#230447
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/turtle_deck_603.jpg
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
On a long cross country with the turtle deck FULL of cargo this happened to me.
We landed at a controlled field that night and went home. When I returned the
next day I noticed that it was the overloading of the turtledeck that caused
this. I agree with the last post that maybe the deck was installed with the trailing
edge over the lip. I don't know what else to call it but if it got loud
and windy and cold in the cockpit, that's probably what happened. I'm not
a builder, but this has happened to me as well... I bought a cargo sack from Kitfox
and maybe we wont have to have this conversation again. Steve Bennett Classic
4 1200 912 Durham NC.
In a message dated 02/15/09 22:15:27 Eastern Standard Time, nahsikhs@elltel.net
writes:
> We pulled the turtle deck off and reinstalled it and the front edge of it buts
all the way against the metal strip which holds the gap under the window. All
DZUS fasteners (camlocks?) were installed and are as snug as I would expect.
So once again I am here with no ideas how to go about fixing this, or even if
there is something to fix. I am not sure what could have caused this to happen.
Any help is appreciated.
>
> James
James, I just now went out and looked at my turtle deck. Mine is a Classic 4 and
I have never seen a Model III in person. It may be different than a 4. I
see no way the leading edge can come out from under the skylight trailing edge
without some significant permanent bending.
Attached is a picture of the inside of the leading edge on a Classic 4 turtle deck.
Note the notch in the lower left where it fits around the rear spar carry
through. Also the stiffening angles riveted to the inside of the deck. The
camlock on the side near the leading edge.
The wear marks where it has been fitting shows 5/8 inch overlap under the skylight
lexan.
Is it possible your turtle deck was installed with the leading edge on top of the
trailing edge of the skylight by mistake before the flight?
I would not hesitate to install the mod posted for the avid if you can't find a
logical reason for what happened. It would be good to hear from some model III
owners on this.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230447#230447
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/turtle_deck_603.jpg
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
My model 3 only has about 3/8"overlap. I have not had any problems with mine.
I just tried to push it out by hand, to see if i could cause it to come out,
but even applying more force than I was comfortable doing, I could not get it
to pop out..
Louie
Model 3 912ul
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=230453#230453
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: New issue, turtle deck security |
On Sun, February 15, 2009 7:13 pm, Tom Jones wrote:
> Attached is a picture of the inside of the leading edge on a Classic 4 turtle
deck.
> Note the notch in the lower left where it fits around the rear spar carry through.
> Also the stiffening angles riveted to the inside of the deck. The camlock on
the side
> near the leading edge.
The attachment is actaully here:
<http://forums.matronics.com/files/turtle_deck_132.jpg>
Rather than the improperly shown link in the e-mail distributed to the KF List:
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/turtle_deck_603.jpg
Something goofy happens when a forum post with a picture gets sent to e-mail. Notice
the extra forward slash in the posted link? Just enough so that the matronics web
server can't resolve the file location.
--
Paul A. Franz
Registration/Aircraft - N14UW/Merlin GT
Engine/Prop - Rotax 914/NSI CAP
Bellevue WA
425.241.1618 Cell
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