Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:41 AM - Re: Official Usage Guideline [Please Read] (Jeff Boatright)
2. 05:56 AM - Re: Try to wipe that smile off my face! (hans.vander.voort@alfalaval.com)
3. 06:01 AM - Re: Seat Belts (lshutks@webtv.net (Leon Stefan))
4. 11:45 AM - Re: Model A spark plug gaps (walt evans)
5. 12:28 PM - Securing Brake Line to Gear (Lynn Knoll)
6. 12:34 PM - seat belts (Oscar Zuniga)
7. 12:44 PM - Diesel Piet (Bill Church)
8. 02:57 PM - Re: Model A spark plug gaps (Larry Nelson)
9. 03:30 PM - Spirialing Slipstream (Rcaprd@aol.com)
10. 03:39 PM - Re: Model A spark plug gaps (walt evans)
11. 04:54 PM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 09/01/05 (DONALD COOLEY)
12. 04:56 PM - Re: Spirialing Slipstream (walt evans)
13. 05:26 PM - Re: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 09/01/05 (Jim Markle)
14. 06:00 PM - Re: Spirialing Slipstream (sbobka@charter.net)
15. 07:37 PM - Re: Spirialing Slipstream & Other Forces (Rcaprd@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Official Usage Guideline [Please Read] |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu>
Thanks for the reminder.
Piet content: The plan is to fly the Piet for the first time this evening!
--
Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD
Assistant Professor, Emory Eye Center, Atlanta, GA, USA
Senior Editor, Molecular Vision, http://www.molvis.org/molvis
mailto:jboatri@emory.edu
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Try to wipe that smile off my face! |
27, 2005) at 09/02/2005 08:56:16 AM
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: hans.vander.voort@alfalaval.com
Larry,
Congratulations, enjoy.
Hans
Message 3
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ETAsAhQ/76CmRolq4NlWJ9Era3oZhwi3IgIUWBx6qFv5d2Gs86SMzaynUerRipY=
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: lshutks@webtv.net (Leon Stefan)
John: I mounted my belts from a suggestions in an old Buckeye Piet News.
I put a 1x1x2" piece above the lower longeron at the attach location,
then a U strap around the lower longeron with a bolt threw the added
block above. Then a strap from the threw bolt, threw the ply seat bottom
which I will attach the seat belt. The inverted U strap to the added
block above the longeron so as to not have to drill a hole threw the
longeron. I'm going to add a head rest as a routing for the shoulder
harness. This will locate the sholder belts higher and cover the attach
cable that I will run back to the tail wheel bolt. The front belts will
hook up to eye bolts running threw the floor board, ash crossmember, and
14g steel strap. Front shoulder belts will attach to top cabane area ala
Bill Ruewe I scrounged my belts at the Osh. fly market. Leon S. In Ks.
giving to the Red Cross.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Model A spark plug gaps |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "walt evans" <wbeevans@verizon.net>
If it's an Eisemann mag,,, it's .018"
If this helps.
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Nelson" <lnelson208@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A spark plug gaps
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Larry Nelson <lnelson208@yahoo.com>
>
>
>
> Somewhere in my pile o' Pietenpol stuff, there is a
> discussion of gapping Model A plugs differently for
> magneto use.
>
> Someone please save me the trouble of looking.
>
> Larry Nelson
> Springfield, MO
> Beechcraft Bonanza V-35B N2980A
> Cessna 195 N9883A
> Pietenpol Air Camper N444MH
> 1963 GMC 4106-1618
> SV/ Spirit of America
> ARS WB0JOT
>
> __________________________________________________
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Securing Brake Line to Gear |
We are ready to paint the split axel gear after welding some sort of clips or hold
downs to the aft gear leg to secure the brake line. Would appreciate some
ideas and suggestions.
Lynn & Kevin Knoll
Wichita Vair/Peit
Message 6
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Now here's a topic I can post a useful opinion on. The seatbelts that came
with NX41CC are just fine, but the connection between the shoulder belt and
the lap belt buckle is not the best. It's like the typical Cessna
connection which allows you to disconnect the shoulder harness from the lap
belt buckle in order to lean forward or reach the floor, but the problem is
that it comes off unexpectedly and usually without being noticed. In the
case of 41CC, it is fortunate that Charlie did not have the shoulder harness
disconnected prior to the nose-over incident or he would have been thrown
forward with much more force; as it was, his forehead hit the ignition
switch and snapped the key off in his forehead. I did not charge him for a
replacement key, however ;o)
The best type of harness setup is similar to the ones used in race cars and
aerobatic planes, where the master buckle captures all of the straps in one
release mechanism in a very positive way. The ones I have in my "Flying
Squirrel" are from Summit Racing, 3" wide, and a fraction the cost of what
the aero suppliers want for "authentic airplane" seatbelts.
There are plenty of clear and descriptive website photos out there showing
nifty ways of mounting both seat belts and shoulder harnesses for both
cockpits. Some of the older methods are as on Ernie Moreno's Piet, photos
at http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/piets3.html and one of the neatest
passenger shoulder harness connections is somewhere on the U.K. Piet
builders' site but I don't remember where.
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 7
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|
Just had a peek at the UK Pietenpol site, and found some pictures of
G-BUXK, taking it's maiden flight.
http://www.pietenpolclub.co.uk/gallery/
G-BUXK is the first Pietenpol to be fitted with the new Wilksch WAM 100
three cylinder engine that can run on diesel or jet fuel.
http://www.wilksch.com/
Looks like it works!
The only drawback I see is the cost - approx 11,000 pounds, or
$20,000 US.
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Model A spark plug gaps |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Larry Nelson <lnelson208@yahoo.com>
How about a Scintilla, Walt? I reckon I will set them
at .018" just for fun. Goin' flyin' again manana with
new plugs and new oil filler cap. (I didn't have it on
very good, I guess, and it went flying PAST me on my
very first flight. It went by on MY LEFT SIDE. Go
figure THAT ONE out.
Thanks Walt.
--- walt evans <wbeevans@verizon.net> wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "walt evans"
> <wbeevans@verizon.net>
>
> If it's an Eisemann mag,,, it's .018"
> If this helps.
> walt evans
> NX140DL
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Larry Nelson" <lnelson208@yahoo.com>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 10:15 PM
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A spark plug gaps
>
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Larry Nelson
> <lnelson208@yahoo.com>
> >
> >
> >
> > Somewhere in my pile o' Pietenpol stuff, there is
> a
> > discussion of gapping Model A plugs differently
> for
> > magneto use.
> >
> > Someone please save me the trouble of looking.
> >
> > Larry Nelson
> > Springfield, MO
> > Beechcraft Bonanza V-35B N2980A
> > Cessna 195 N9883A
> > Pietenpol Air Camper N444MH
> > 1963 GMC 4106-1618
> > SV/ Spirit of America
> > ARS WB0JOT
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> protection around
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Larry Nelson
Springfield, MO
Beechcraft Bonanza V-35B N2980A
Cessna 195 N9883A
Pietenpol Air Camper N444MH
1963 GMC 4106-1618
SV/ Spirit of America
ARS WB0JOT
Message 9
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| Subject: | Spirialing Slipstream |
In a message dated 9/2/2005 5:00:27 PM Central Standard Time,
lnelson208@yahoo.com writes:
Goin' flyin' again manana with new plugs and new oil filler cap. (I didn't
have it on
very good, I guess, and it went flying PAST me on my very first flight. It
went by on MY LEFT SIDE. Go figure THAT ONE out.
Spiraling Slipstream. That's also one of the reasons the plane will yaw to
the left, at slow airspeeds. It flows in a helical pattern around the fuselage
at slow speeds, and smacks the left side of the vert stab, pushing the nose
to the right. At higher speeds the slipstream is more parallel to the fuselage.
Chuck G.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Model A spark plug gaps |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "walt evans" <wbeevans@verizon.net>
Larry,
I don't know . It's just the concept was explained to me by my mentor. The
era of the Eismann Mags were during a time that the voltage output wasn't
that high. So the spark couldnt jump that far. Today the voltages are so
high in the auto ignitions, that the amperage is low and the plugs last
forever.
My guess would be that if those mags are from the same era, the gap would be
the same.
I just searched on Google.com for "scintilla", then at the bottom under
"search within results" searched "magneto" then under "search within
results" again,,,searched "gap".
Got oodles of sites explaining the old mags, and their gappage.
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Nelson" <lnelson208@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A spark plug gaps
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Larry Nelson <lnelson208@yahoo.com>
>
> How about a Scintilla, Walt? I reckon I will set them
> at .018" just for fun. Goin' flyin' again manana with
> new plugs and new oil filler cap. (I didn't have it on
> very good, I guess, and it went flying PAST me on my
> very first flight. It went by on MY LEFT SIDE. Go
> figure THAT ONE out.
>
> Thanks Walt.
>
>
> --- walt evans <wbeevans@verizon.net> wrote:
>
> > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "walt evans"
> > <wbeevans@verizon.net>
> >
> > If it's an Eisemann mag,,, it's .018"
> > If this helps.
> > walt evans
> > NX140DL
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Larry Nelson" <lnelson208@yahoo.com>
> > To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 10:15 PM
> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A spark plug gaps
> >
> >
> > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Larry Nelson
> > <lnelson208@yahoo.com>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Somewhere in my pile o' Pietenpol stuff, there is
> > a
> > > discussion of gapping Model A plugs differently
> > for
> > > magneto use.
> > >
> > > Someone please save me the trouble of looking.
> > >
> > > Larry Nelson
> > > Springfield, MO
> > > Beechcraft Bonanza V-35B N2980A
> > > Cessna 195 N9883A
> > > Pietenpol Air Camper N444MH
> > > 1963 GMC 4106-1618
> > > SV/ Spirit of America
> > > ARS WB0JOT
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > protection around
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > browse
> > Subscriptions page,
> > FAQ,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Larry Nelson
> Springfield, MO
> Beechcraft Bonanza V-35B N2980A
> Cessna 195 N9883A
> Pietenpol Air Camper N444MH
> 1963 GMC 4106-1618
> SV/ Spirit of America
> ARS WB0JOT
>
> __________________________________________________
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 09/01/05 |
Sr. Gower,
Don't worry about your English...it's better than that we hear from some of
our "native sons". I have always enjoyed your contributions and have never had
any trouble understanding them. Keep up the good work! Don Cooley, rib jig
under way in Fairfield, CA
Pietenpol-List Digest Server <pietenpol-list-digest@matronics.com> wrote:
*
==================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
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Today's complete Pietenpol-List Digest can also be found in either of the
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such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list/Digest.Pietenpol-List.2005-09-01.html
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================================================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
================================================
Pietenpol-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Thu 09/01/05: 19
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:53 AM - Re: fuel prices and gas tanks (harvey.rule@bell.ca)
2. 04:18 AM - Re: fuel prices and gas tanks (Jeff Boatright)
3. 08:56 AM - Re: Try to wipe that smile off my face! (Larry Nelson)
4. 10:05 AM - Seat Belts (Egan, John)
5. 11:02 AM - Re: Try to wipe that smile off my face! (Michael D Cuy)
6. 11:16 AM - Re: Try to wipe that smile off my face! (Phillips, Jack)
7. 11:35 AM - Re: Try to wipe that smile off my face! (Larry Nelson)
8. 11:48 AM - ribs & bbq sauce (Michael D Cuy)
9. 11:51 AM - Re: Seat Belts (harvey.rule@bell.ca)
10. 12:11 PM - Re: Try to wipe that smile off my face! (Larry Nelson)
11. 12:14 PM - Re: Try to wipe that smile off my face! (Galen Hutcheson)
12. 02:09 PM - Re: HAPI powered Pietenpol for sale on Barnstormers.com (Tuu2Tango@aol.com)
13. 02:14 PM - Re: fuel prices and gas tanks (Gary Gower)
14. 03:09 PM - Re: Try to wipe that smile off my face! (Rcaprd@aol.com)
15. 03:22 PM - Re: Try to wipe that smile off my face! (Christian Bobka)
16. 05:37 PM - Re: fuel prices and gas tanks (Mitty)
17. 06:46 PM - Re: fuel prices and gas tanks (Jeff Boatright)
18. 07:16 PM - Re: Model A spark plug gaps (Larry Nelson)
19. 07:20 PM - Re: fuel prices and gas tanks (Mitty)
________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________
Time: 03:53:28 AM PST US
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: fuel prices and gas tanks
From: harvey.rule@bell.ca
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: harvey.rule@bell.ca
I went to the New Orleans web page yesterday and they have bigger
problems than anyone could imagine.There are now sharks and alligators
wondering around in those waters.Boy ,that's scary!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: fuel prices and gas tanks
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Mark
I got my commercial CFI and CFII at Jackson. Times like this bring out
the best in people and the worst in people. I hope you told the guy
what he could do with the hundred that someone would eventually pay even
if you didn't. Yet with the jerks you don't hear about the good
stories. My dad after Camile picked up a camp stove for my aunt in
Gulfport at the time. He took it to the counter to check out. The
owner looked at him and asked, "Is this going to someone on the Gulf
Coast?" He told him it was for his sister in the Gulfport area. He
just said, "No charge, and wish her my best."
I was on the coast about 2 weeks after Camile. This has many
simularities. Its almost like you combine the flooding of Virginia, but
put it in worst terrain (New Orleans) and the other destruction and you
have damage that will last for decades. The last time I was there only
a few years ago you could still see some signs of Camile and that was
decades later. This one will be no different and likely worse in some
ways.
Hopefully those that had airplanes in the area got them out and can go
fly them occasionally to get away from the rest of the mess.
Mitty wrote:
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Mitty
>
>Here in Jackson ms yesterday some clown were selling 5
>gal jugs for $100.Damn bastards!! :(It's pretty bad
>here at the moment.No gas,no drinking water...We got
>power but my internet still dont work...SUX
>
>--- Rick Holland wrote:
>
>
>
>>$2.40? Ha! Thats peanuts, I am in San Diego on a
>>business trip and regular
>>is already $2.99 before any increase. By the way had
>>the afternoon off and
>>visited the San Diego Aerospace Museam, it is
>>excellent. They have the
>>original wing rib jig used to make the Spirt of St.
>>Louis wing down the road
>>at Lindberg field and it used 1/2" x 1/4" cap strips
>>just like the Piet
>>except they are rotated 90 degrees so the entire rib
>>is 1/4" thick.
>>
>>
>>On 8/30/05, hans.vander.voort@alfalaval.com
>>
>>wrote:
>>
>>
>>>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by:
>>>
>>>
>>hans.vander.voort@alfalaval.com
>>
>>
>>>Some inside info: Gasoline wholesale price
>>>
>>>
>>(automobil) just hit 2.40 ,
>>
>>
>>>forty cents up from yesterday!
>>>Fill up your gas tanks, retail price will be 3 +
>>>
>>>
>>by the end of the week
>>
>>
>>>Hans
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>=====================================
>>=====================================
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>--
>>Rick Holland
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>__________________________________________________
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________
Time: 04:18:41 AM PST US
<984E798CE7C4D4419A6D99DF385597A8961557@toroondc511.bell.corp.bce.ca>
<984E798CE7C4D4419A6D99DF385597A8961557@toroondc511.bell.corp.bce.ca>
From: Jeff Boatright
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: fuel prices and gas tanks
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jeff Boatright
http://www.mds.mennonite.net/
http://www.redcross.org/
http://www.aspca.org/
At 6:52 AM -0400 9/1/05, harvey.rule@bell.ca wrote:
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: harvey.rule@bell.ca
>
>I went to the New Orleans web page yesterday and they have bigger
>problems than anyone could imagine.There are now sharks and alligators
>wondering around in those waters.Boy ,that's scary!
--
Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD
Assistant Professor, Emory Eye Center, Atlanta, GA, USA
Senior Editor, Molecular Vision, http://www.molvis.org/molvis
mailto:jboatri@emory.edu
________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________
Time: 08:56:58 AM PST US
From: Larry Nelson
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Try to wipe that smile off my face!
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Larry Nelson
Howard Hendersons Pietenpol, N444MH (for MacLaren /
Henderson I guess) flew this morning. I made three
flights and everything went GREAT.
She is a bit "right wing low" hand off, BUT she does
has a broken left wing tip rib, that might be the
cause of that, although it is hardly noticable.
My little strip is just east of metro Springfield,
MIssouri, the Flying Bar H. She is banana shaped in
plan view and I didn't realize that till this morning
when I looked DOWN on it. She is "take off to the SW
and land to the NE" kind of strip, due to
obstructions. Immediately upon departure you fly over
a deep railroad "trench" with trees on both sides. Not
a good place to have to put her back down, and on my
mind, you can be sure.
I just LOVE flying this plane. My first landing was
the best. My last as just sort of flaring too high and
she just settled in without complaint.
Anyway, since Chuck wouldn't let me ride in HIS plane
at Brodhead '04 (said I was way too fat, but he did
take my friend Wes up).....I thought I need to join
the fun.
Try to wipe my smile off....I dare ya.
Larry Nelson
Springfield, MO
Beechcraft Bonanza V-35B N2980A
Pietenpol Air Camper N444MH
1963 GMC 4106-1618
SV/ Spirit of America
ARS WB0JOT
__________________________________
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html
________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________
Time: 10:05:37 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Seat Belts
From: "Egan, John"
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Egan, John"
What is the best practice for seat and shoulder belts for a new Piet and
does anybody have any purchase sourcing suggestions? Thanks all.
This e-mail is intended for the use of the addressee(s) only and may contain privileged,
confidential, or proprietary information that is exempt from disclosure
under law. If you have received this message in error, please inform us promptly
by reply e-mail, then delete the e-mail and destroy any printed copy.
Thank you.
==============================================================================
________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________
Time: 11:02:47 AM PST US
From: Michael D Cuy
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Try to wipe that smile off my face!
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy
Larry-- way to go. Congratulations on logging your 1st few flights in a
Pietenpol !!!
On the broken wingtip bow....is that the bow that is broken ? If so--that
is a compression
member and I'd not fly it like that. If it is a rib--less worry.
Mike C.
________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________
Time: 11:16:43 AM PST US
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Try to wipe that smile off my face!
From: "Phillips, Jack"
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Phillips, Jack"
Way to go, Larry! Great feeling, isn't it?
Depending on how the rib is broken, you might be able to repair it
without having to do much fabric work. I had to repair one broken rib
after my forced landing last fall and was able to do the repair in place
by working through one inspection hole and a 6" slit in the fabric which
was easily patched with tape. How did the rib get broken?
Jack Phillips
Raleigh, NC
________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________
Time: 11:35:03 AM PST US
From: Larry Nelson
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Try to wipe that smile off my face!
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Larry Nelson
Mike, it is a rib that was actually broken, I believe,
by HH hisself. Previous owner never repaired but I am
planning on doing so this winter.
--- Michael D Cuy wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy
>
>
> Larry-- way to go. Congratulations on logging your
> 1st few flights in a
> Pietenpol !!!
>
> On the broken wingtip bow....is that the bow that is
> broken ? If so--that
> is a compression
> member and I'd not fly it like that. If it is a
> rib--less worry.
>
> Mike C.
>
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Larry Nelson
Springfield, MO
Beechcraft Bonanza V-35B N2980A
Cessna 195 N9883A
Pietenpol Air Camper N444MH
1963 GMC 4106-1618
SV/ Spirit of America
ARS WB0JOT
________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________
Time: 11:48:26 AM PST US
From: Michael D Cuy
Subject: Pietenpol-List: ribs & bbq sauce
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy
Larry-- that's great news. Just slather some bbq sauce on some ribs this
weekend and
worry about repairing the wood one when the flying season wanes and sunsets
become annoyingly early !
Mike C.
PS_-way to go !
PSS--- do not archive
________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________
Time: 11:51:54 AM PST US
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Seat Belts
From: harvey.rule@bell.ca
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: harvey.rule@bell.ca
I used the military type from Aircraft Spruce.I havn't flown with them
yet but just sitting in the seat and making motor noises;they feel just
fine.
I bought the lap belt and two shoulder strap type that has a long single
belt on the shoulder for feeding back behind the seat and around the
cable and through the special wrap back on itself piece.It looks like a
square piece of metal with slots in it.This piece comes with the order.I
cut a slot in the wood that my back rests on,as high as I could get it
without running into too much wood from the turtle deck.Seems to work
OK.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Egan,
John
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Seat Belts
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Egan, John"
What is the best practice for seat and shoulder belts for a new Piet and
does anybody have any purchase sourcing suggestions? Thanks all.
------
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________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________
Time: 12:11:12 PM PST US
From: Larry Nelson
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Try to wipe that smile off my face!
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Larry Nelson
Jack, HH kept meticulous logs and so did Joe Santana.
I believe it was HH that ground looped her. And thanks
for the advice.
--- "Phillips, Jack"
wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Phillips,
> Jack"
>
> Way to go, Larry! Great feeling, isn't it?
>
> Depending on how the rib is broken, you might be
> able to repair it
> without having to do much fabric work. I had to
> repair one broken rib
> after my forced landing last fall and was able to do
> the repair in place
> by working through one inspection hole and a 6" slit
> in the fabric which
> was easily patched with tape. How did the rib get
> broken?
>
> Jack Phillips
> Raleigh, NC
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Larry Nelson
Springfield, MO
Beechcraft Bonanza V-35B N2980A
Cessna 195 N9883A
Pietenpol Air Camper N444MH
1963 GMC 4106-1618
SV/ Spirit of America
ARS WB0JOT
__________________________________
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html
________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________
Time: 12:14:50 PM PST US
From: Galen Hutcheson
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Try to wipe that smile off my face!
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Galen Hutcheson
Congratulations Larry!!! Say, I live in Harrison, AR
just south of you. If you want to make a short long
distance flight sometime, give me a call and come on
down. Harrison (HRO) has around 6000' X 150' so it
shouldn't give you much trouble. It's a nice flight
too with the lakes to look at from the air. Have a
great time enjoying your plane.
Doc (H) 870-741-5539
Do Not Archive
--- Larry Nelson wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Larry Nelson
>
>
>
>
> Howard Hendersons Pietenpol, N444MH (for MacLaren /
> Henderson I guess) flew this morning. I made three
> flights and everything went GREAT.
>
> She is a bit "right wing low" hand off, BUT she does
> has a broken left wing tip rib, that might be the
> cause of that, although it is hardly noticable.
>
> My little strip is just east of metro Springfield,
> MIssouri, the Flying Bar H. She is banana shaped in
> plan view and I didn't realize that till this
> morning
> when I looked DOWN on it. She is "take off to the SW
> and land to the NE" kind of strip, due to
> obstructions. Immediately upon departure you fly
> over
> a deep railroad "trench" with trees on both sides.
> Not
> a good place to have to put her back down, and on my
> mind, you can be sure.
>
> I just LOVE flying this plane. My first landing was
> the best. My last as just sort of flaring too high
> and
> she just settled in without complaint.
>
> Anyway, since Chuck wouldn't let me ride in HIS
> plane
> at Brodhead '04 (said I was way too fat, but he did
> take my friend Wes up).....I thought I need to join
> the fun.
>
> Try to wipe my smile off....I dare ya.
>
> Larry Nelson
> Springfield, MO
> Beechcraft Bonanza V-35B N2980A
> Pietenpol Air Camper N444MH
> 1963 GMC 4106-1618
> SV/ Spirit of America
> ARS WB0JOT
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the
> tour:
> http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html
>
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________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________
Time: 02:09:51 PM PST US
From: Tuu2Tango@aol.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: HAPI powered Pietenpol for sale on Barnstormers.com
This might be worth exploring except for the VW engine. Been there, done
that and VERY disappointed in VW based "airplane" engines.. Won't fly in an
aircamper very well, that I can promise.
________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________
Time: 02:14:52 PM PST US
From: Gary Gower
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: fuel prices and gas tanks
Yes, Harvey, is more serious that you think, in the short time. Drinking water
will be the most important thing first... (hope I can explain with my low
english) the smell of dead animals, and swamped water with garbage will make
people very sick, then getting food and things to wear, probably one less
problem now, is that is not winter,
I dont know how cold could get there at night or early in the morning... then
some ileness gets serious with many people and medicines get dificult to deliver...
All this beguins in a few days and get worse in a daily basis, until
everithing gets under control.
Another problem is the mud, trucks with help cant get easy over dirt roads (or
broken asphalt roads) to little towns.
I dont know how rainy will get later, but will lower the speed in pumping the water
out...
Is important that people close to them volunter to help,
One of the first things we do is to trow from our airplanes, when weather permits
little parachutes with 1/2 quart bottled water and chocolate bars or cookies
and bread, What ever we get donated... Volunteers make the little parachutes...
We "waypoint" every family found with the GPS to later send help.
Here floods get serious mostly with poor people that live in low (cheap) land
and near the rivers.
Saludos
Gary Gower
Local Volunteer in Search and Rescue
Do not archive
harvey.rule@bell.ca wrote:
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: harvey.rule@bell.ca
I went to the New Orleans web page yesterday and they have bigger
problems than anyone could imagine.There are now sharks and alligators
wondering around in those waters.Boy ,that's scary!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: fuel prices and gas tanks
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Mark
I got my commercial CFI and CFII at Jackson. Times like this bring out
the best in people and the worst in people. I hope you told the guy
=== message truncated ===
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Spirialing Slipstream |
Chuck,
My understanting of this whole thing is that the offset of the engine that we put
in upon building ( down and to the right or left) is a way to make the plane
fly straight during mid range power.
During normal climbout the Piet is angled up, but a plane doesn't follow the nose
angle, so the prop see's a condition where the prop is taking bigger bites
on the right side. So a right rudder is in order. (P- Factor)
When you chop the power, the oppisite seems to happen,,you need left rudder.
If you ever read , in depth, about the pilots that fly behind the WWI planes where
the cylinders<sp> spin,,like at Old Rhinebeck,,It's a whole new class of flying.
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: Rcaprd@aol.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 6:29 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Spirialing Slipstream
Spiraling Slipstream. That's also one of the reasons the plane will yaw to the
left, at slow airspeeds. It flows in a helical pattern around the fuselage
at slow speeds, and smacks the left side of the vert stab, pushing the nose to
the right. At higher speeds the slipstream is more parallel to the fuselage.
Chuck G.
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 09/01/05 |
Agreed......
----- Original Message -----
From: DONALD COOLEY
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 6:53 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 09/01/05
Sr. Gower,
Don't worry about your English...it's better than that we hear from some
of our "native sons". I have always enjoyed your contributions and have never
had any trouble understanding them. Keep up the good work! Don Cooley, rib
jig under way in Fairfield, CA
Pietenpol-List Digest Server <pietenpol-list-digest@matronics.com> wrote:
Message 14
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| Subject: | Spirialing Slipstream |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "sbobka@charter.net" <sbobka@charter.net>
Chuck,
If it smacks the left side of the vertical stab, it would push the nose to
the left.
chris
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Rcaprd@aol.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Spirialing Slipstream
In a message dated 9/2/2005 5:00:27 PM Central Standard Time,
lnelson208@yahoo.com writes:
Goin' flyin' again manana with new plugs and new oil filler cap. (I didn't
have it on
very good, I guess, and it went flying PAST me on my very first flight. It
went by on MY LEFT SIDE. Go figure THAT ONE out.
Spiraling Slipstream. That's also one of the reasons the plane will yaw to
the left, at slow airspeeds. It flows in a helical pattern around the
fuselage
at slow speeds, and smacks the left side of the vert stab, pushing the nose
to the right. At higher speeds the slipstream is more parallel to the
fuselage.
Chuck G.
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Spirialing Slipstream & Other Forces |
In a message dated 9/2/2005 6:58:15 PM Central Standard Time,
wbeevans@verizon.net writes:
Chuck,
My understanting of this whole thing is that the offset of the engine that we
put in upon building ( down and to the right or left) is a way to make the
plane fly straight during mid range power.
During normal climbout the Piet is angled up, but a plane doesn't follow the
nose angle, so the prop see's a condition where the prop is taking bigger
bites on the right side. So a right rudder is in order. (P- Factor)
When you chop the power, the oppisite seems to happen,,you need left rudder.
If you ever read , in depth, about the pilots that fly behind the WWI planes
where the cylinders<sp> spin,,like at Old Rhinebeck,,It's a whole new class=20of
flying.
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: Rcaprd@aol.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Spirialing Slipstream
Spiraling Slipstream. That's also one of the reasons the plane will yaw to
the left, at slow airspeeds. It flows in a helical pattern around the fuselage
at slow speeds, and smacks the left side of the vert stab, pushing the nose
to the right. At higher speeds the slipstream is more parallel to the fuselage.
Chuck G.
Soon after I sent this message, I realized my error...a couple of them in
fact !! The spiraling slipstream rotates around the fuse in a Counter Clockwise
direction, when viewing from the front, looking back...the same direction the
prop rotates. This negates the possibility that it was the cause of Larry's
oil filler cap going past him on the left side (the Model A oil filler cap is
on the right side of the engine) . Maybe it came off, and just bounced of the
cabane strut, and bounced to the left side.
Let me attempt to explain the forces involved that makes the plane yaw to the
left. For a Corvair engine, which spins in the Wrong direction :) the
engine and prop rotates in the opposite direction, all these forces cause the
plane to yaw to the right. The Brits built the Hawker Sea Fury, which also=20had
an engine that spins in the Wrong direction !! It was a rude awakening for
guys that were not used to it.
Angle of Attack - The angle represented between the Mean Aerodynamic Chord,
and the Relative Wind.
Spiraling Slipstream - Circulates around the fuselage in a helical pattern,
at slower airspeeds. At higher speeds it tends to straighten out, and at
speeds when the airframe is overrunning the prop, there is No spiraling slipstream,
and the airflow is parallel to the fuselage. At the slower speeds, and high
thrust (Takeoff) It might make a full revolution around the fuse, coming up=20in
front of the Left Horizontal Stab, and smack the Left side of the Vertical
Stab, causing the plane to Yaw to the Left.
P - Factor - When the airframe is at a High Angle of Attack, the prop blade
that is descending is at a higher angle of attack than the one that is going
up. This means the blade that is descending (on the right side) is pulling
harder than the one going up (on the left side), causing an un-equal pull on the
crankshaft, and causing the airframe to yaw to the Left. At a Zero angle of
Attack, there is no P-Factor.
Torque - The most powerful of the forces, and it causes the airframe to Roll
Left. Imagine if a Giant Hand grabbed the spinning prop, stopping it, causing
the rest of the airframe to rotate, or roll, to the Left. The highest thrust
is produced when the airframe is sitting still, and at full power...such as
doing a Static Run Up. If you could put a pull gage between the prop and the
airframe, this is the time period when the highest thrust reading will occur.
In
cruise flight, the prop is not producing nearly as much thrust, and when the
airframe overruns the prop, Thrust and Torque Factor is not even there.
Gyroscopic Precession - When a spinning mass on an axle is moved at the axis,
this force acts at a Ninety Degree angle to the force that moved it. This
force only occurs DURING a change in attitude, such as when on the Take Off
roll, during motion of the tail coming up. As soon as the tail is up, and the
motion ceases, Gyroscopic Precession is no longer there. It causes the nose to
pull to the Left. This is the force that wreaked havoc on those pilots of
planes that the cylinders rotated with the prop, like the Gnome Engine. That
rotating mass had so much Gyroscopic Precession, that even full rudder could not
overcome it. A good example would be if you took a Spoked Wire Wheel from a
Pietenpol (or even a bicycle), and held it at arms reach, holding end of the
axle with each hand, and the tire almost rubbing on your nose, have someone=20spin
the tire, and then tilt the axle. There is a Very Noticeable force that acts
at a 90=BA angle to the direction that you tilted the spinning wheel. The
faster that mass spins the higher the force, and the more that mass weights, the
higher the force. This is also the reason that Crop Dusters always wore out
the thrust bearing at the front of the engine, from doing all those hammerhead
turn arounds !!
These are Dynamic Forces, and change constantly through each phase of flight.
That's is one of the reasons why the trim changes.
The Engine Mount angled Down, is an effort to reduce the Pendulum Effect of
the thrust pulling forward at a location that is below the horizontal Center of
Gravity, causing the nose to pitch up. The thrust line is below the high
drag of the wing, and it causes a nose up pitch when power is applied, is another
way of saying it. The closer the wings Mean Aerodynamic Chord is located to
the Thrust Line, the less the need to angle the engine mount down. A low wing
airplane has the opposite effect.
The Engine Mount angled to the Right, is an effort to counteract all of the
forces that cause the airframe to yaw left.
Everything in the design of an aircraft is a compromise. That's why when you
change something in the original design, you WILL effect other items and
flight characteristics.
Gives ya a Lot to think about...huh?
Chuck Gantzer
NX770CG
Wow !! All this, trying to figure out why Larry's oil filler cap went flying
past him on the Left side...
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