Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Tue 02/21/06


Total Messages Posted: 25



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 04:09 AM - Piet for sale (Building Belize)
     2. 05:03 AM - Re: Piet for sale (Kip and Beth Gardner)
     3. 05:16 AM - WARNING about the Piet for sale from Ray going to Belize (Michael D Cuy)
     4. 05:18 AM - Re: I just want to fit in... (Kip and Beth Gardner)
     5. 05:18 AM - Re: I just want to fit in... (Phillips, Jack)
     6. 05:24 AM - Re: I just want to fit in... (harvey rule)
     7. 05:30 AM - Re: I just want to fit in... (Phillips, Jack)
     8. 06:07 AM - washout & rigging (Oscar Zuniga)
     9. 06:32 AM - Re: I just want to fit in... (Alan Lyscars)
    10. 06:38 AM - hinge hardware (Dan Loegering)
    11. 07:00 AM - photos showing center section/cabane strut setups  (Michael D Cuy)
    12. 07:05 AM - Re: hinge hardware (Rick Holland)
    13. 07:12 AM - Re: I just want to fit in... (Rick Holland)
    14. 07:15 AM - Re: photos showing center section/cabane strut setups (harvey rule)
    15. 07:18 AM - test only - do not archive (Jeff Hill)
    16. 07:29 AM - Re: test only - do not archive (Rick Holland)
    17. 07:33 AM - Re: hinge hardware (Kirk Huizenga)
    18. 08:49 AM - Re: hinge hardware (Dick Navratil)
    19. 04:35 PM - Re: Washout & Rigging (Gary Gower)
    20. 04:53 PM - Re: Piet for sale (Isablcorky@aol.com)
    21. 04:56 PM - Re: WARNING about the Piet for sale from Ray going to Belize (Gary Gower)
    22. 09:13 PM - Re: I just want to fit in... (Michael Nadeau)
    23. 10:04 PM - Re: I just want to fit in... (Gary Gower)
    24. 10:34 PM - Re: Washout & Rigging (Mike Luther)
    25. 11:10 PM - Re: Washout & Rigging (Rcaprd@aol.com)
 
 
 


Message 1


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 04:09:19 AM PST US
    From: "Building Belize" <buildingbelize@centralpets.com>
    Subject: Piet for sale
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Building Belize" <buildingbelize@centralpets.com> We are retiring, the wife and I to the house we have spent three years building in the foothills of the Belize Alps. Trying to get there for July this year and putting the house in Miami up for sale and the 2.5 acre finca out in Hendry County for sale also. I've got three years part time in building my Piet. The fuselage is done, the tail feathers, the wheels and axles, the two wings. Got a corvair engine, not yet rebuilt, but it is the 90 hp model and looks to be in good shape. I can't figure a way to ship this to Belize by ship. It is just too bulky and the truck freight internal down there would break it up on those country roads. The steering gear and covering have to be done yet, with overhauling this engine I have. Can you tell me where to advertise this for sale? We want to put the house here in Miami up for sale in April for closing by June if possible. Best offer can take the plane. I haven't worked on it for a year. Been too busy. --------------------------------------------- This e-mail was sent using a CentralPets.com WebMail account Get yours at: http://mail.centralpets.com


    Message 2


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:03:27 AM PST US
    From: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
    Subject: Re: Piet for sale
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net> Uh-Oh. Do not archive At 12:06 PM +0000 2/21/06, Building Belize wrote: >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Building Belize" ><buildingbelize@centralpets.com> > > We are retiring, the wife and I to the house we have spent three >years building in the foothills of the Belize Alps. Trying to get >there for July this year and putting the house in Miami up for sale >and the 2.5 acre finca out in Hendry County for sale also. > > I've got three years part time in building my Piet. The fuselage >is done, the tail feathers, the wheels and axles, the two wings. >Got a corvair engine, not yet rebuilt, but it is the 90 hp model and >looks to be in good shape. > I can't figure a way to ship this to Belize by ship. It is just >too bulky and the truck freight internal down there would break it >up on those country roads. The steering gear and covering have to >be done yet, with overhauling this engine I have. Can you tell me >where to advertise this for sale? We want to put the house here in >Miami up for sale in April for closing by June if possible. Best >offer can take the plane. I haven't worked on it for a year. Been >too busy. > >--------------------------------------------- >This e-mail was sent using a CentralPets.com WebMail account >Get yours at: http://mail.centralpets.com > > -- North Canton, OH


    Message 3


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:16:04 AM PST US
    From: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
    Subject: WARNING about the Piet for sale from Ray going to Belize
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> Group--- Please read prior posts in the archive if you are even considering asking this guy about his Piet project. It is basically a piece of crap built to non-aircraft grade standards and materials and should be burned in a big campfire at the bast of the Alps in Belize....or wherever it sits. Mike C. Please Archive


    Message 4


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:18:59 AM PST US
    From: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
    Subject: Re: I just want to fit in...
    Cc: Piet List <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>, Michael Nadeau <nadeau@caldsl.com> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net> At 8:49 PM -0800 2/20/06, Michael Nadeau wrote: >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael Nadeau <nadeau@caldsl.com> > >Hi Guys, > >Don't mind me. I'm just a lurker who's going to get started on my >piet this year. I have the plans. I have the motor (corvair). I >have the carb I got on ebay. I even went up to Van Arsdale-Harris >in San Francisco to buy some spruce enough for the tail and ribs. >BTW. >Thats a heck of a place for raw lumber. One warehouse for spruce >and two for fur! Nice 20' 3"x12"s if you really want the big spars. >I picked through the small stuff and filled up my civic. But, >before I get started there's one thing I'd like to know. How does >one actually get into a piet? Specifically, the front cockpit. I >mean, I've seen pictures of people sitting in the front and I've >heard of people saying they've sat in one, but I've haven't actually >seen anyone get in one. I assume the wing comes off. Or it folds >up or something. Maybe they wear black leather and slide in in a >Matrix sort of way. I don't know, which is why I bring it up. > >Anyhow, for something that ranks just under taking out the garbage >on my wife's priority list it'll, I hope to be prop flipping in >about a decade or so. > >On technical terms I want to trim the bird for a max pilot weight of >250. (with clothes) Too much? > >Thanks, >Mike Nadeau >EAA # 0448121 Mike, Having gotten front-cockpit rides in several Piets over the past few years, I'd say that anyone who is bigger than my 150lb./5'6" frame is going to have to do some wiggling (and, yes, that is an understatement). If you have chronic aches & pains (I'm now developing arthritis, so I can relate), you might have some real trouble with amount of bending, stretching, twisting, high-wire balancing, etc. necessary to get into the front pit. It's not an easy job. Being a professional contortionist would help. You might want to consider adding the door option, plans for which are available from Keri-Ann Price (she has a web site, I think it's in the archives). At least one person on this list has added the door, so perhaps they can give you some insight into how it turned out. I would have put one on mine, but I bought a partailly done project & Keri-Ann told me that the door could be added to a finished fuse, but did not recommend it. Can't speak to the weight issue, as I stated before, I'm closer to the midget class that this plane seems to have been designed for. Given that you are hoping to fly at 250#, I think the Corvair is your best engine choice, make sure you do the William Wynne conversion to get the best performance out of the engine. Regards, KIp Gardner -- North Canton, OH


    Message 5


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:18:59 AM PST US
    Subject: I just want to fit in...
    From: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinal.com>
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinal.com> Welcome, Mike! Piet's aren't easy to enter for today's larger (supersized) folks, if built strictly to the plans. On mine, I made the centersection with a curved cutout over the rear cockpit to make ingress/egress easier, and to give better visibility. I also raised the wing by 2-1/2" to make entry and exit from both cockpits easier. And I used the diagonal cabane struts going forward to the motor mount attach points instead of the X-brace wires ont he right side of the front cockpit. I also added steps for each cockpit. Entry into the front seat is accomplished by stepping on the front step with the left foot while holding onto the left cabane struts, then inserting the head through the cockpit and out the right side, between the right cabane struts. The righ leg is swung into the cockpit, followed by the left leg, and then you back down into the seat. Getting out is pretty much the reverse of the process. My fiancee is 5'10" and 160 lbs and she can do it easily. I'm 6'2" and 200 lbs and can do it, but it's a struggle. Rear cockpit is easy. Good luck with your project! Jack Phillips Raleigh, NC NX899JP -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Nadeau Sent: Monday, February 20, 2006 11:50 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: I just want to fit in... --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael Nadeau <nadeau@caldsl.com> Hi Guys, Don't mind me. I'm just a lurker who's going to get started on my piet this year. I have the plans. I have the motor (corvair). I have the carb I got on ebay. I even went up to Van Arsdale-Harris in San Francisco to buy some spruce enough for the tail and ribs. BTW. Thats a heck of a place for raw lumber. One warehouse for spruce and two for fur! Nice 20' 3"x12"s if you really want the big spars. I picked through the small stuff and filled up my civic. But, before I get started there's one thing I'd like to know. How does one actually get into a piet? Specifically, the front cockpit. I mean, I've seen pictures of people sitting in the front and I've heard of people saying they've sat in one, but I've haven't actually seen anyone get in one. I assume the wing comes off. Or it folds up or something. Maybe they wear black leather and slide in in a Matrix sort of way. I don't know, which is why I bring it up. Anyhow, for something that ranks just under taking out the garbage on my wife's priority list it'll, I hope to be prop flipping in about a decade or so. On technical terms I want to trim the bird for a max pilot weight of 250. (with clothes) Too much? Thanks, Mike Nadeau EAA # 0448121 This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is prohibited. Espanol - Deutsch - Nederlands - Francais - Italiano - Norsk - Svenska - Japanese - Danish - Portuguese: www.cardinalhealth.com/legal/email


    Message 6


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:24:32 AM PST US
    From: harvey rule <harvey.rule@bell.ca>
    Subject: Re: I just want to fit in...
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: harvey rule <harvey.rule@bell.ca> The only thing is that with my plane there are these cables in the way on the right side that cross each other and there is no way to get your head through.I would have to take those cables off and then find some way to reinforce the structure to make up for the loss of those cables.I think I'll just leave my battery in the front seat for starting . "Phillips, Jack" wrote: > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinal.com> > > Welcome, Mike! > > Piet's aren't easy to enter for today's larger (supersized) folks, if > built strictly to the plans. On mine, I made the centersection with a > curved cutout over the rear cockpit to make ingress/egress easier, and > to give better visibility. I also raised the wing by 2-1/2" to make > entry and exit from both cockpits easier. And I used the diagonal > cabane struts going forward to the motor mount attach points instead of > the X-brace wires ont he right side of the front cockpit. I also added > steps for each cockpit. > > Entry into the front seat is accomplished by stepping on the front step > with the left foot while holding onto the left cabane struts, then > inserting the head through the cockpit and out the right side, between > the right cabane struts. The righ leg is swung into the cockpit, > followed by the left leg, and then you back down into the seat. Getting > out is pretty much the reverse of the process. > > My fiancee is 5'10" and 160 lbs and she can do it easily. I'm 6'2" and > 200 lbs and can do it, but it's a struggle. Rear cockpit is easy. > > Good luck with your project! > > Jack Phillips > Raleigh, NC > NX899JP > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael > Nadeau > Sent: Monday, February 20, 2006 11:50 PM > To: Piet List > Subject: Pietenpol-List: I just want to fit in... > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael Nadeau <nadeau@caldsl.com> > > Hi Guys, > > Don't mind me. I'm just a lurker who's going to get started on my > piet this year. I have the plans. I have the motor (corvair). I > have the carb I got on ebay. I even went up to Van Arsdale-Harris in > San Francisco to buy some spruce enough for the tail and ribs. BTW. > Thats a heck of a place for raw lumber. One warehouse for spruce and > two for fur! Nice 20' 3"x12"s if you really want the big spars. I > picked through the small stuff and filled up my civic. But, before I > get started there's one thing I'd like to know. How does one > actually get into a piet? Specifically, the front cockpit. I mean, > I've seen pictures of people sitting in the front and I've heard of > people saying they've sat in one, but I've haven't actually seen > anyone get in one. I assume the wing comes off. Or it folds up or > something. Maybe they wear black leather and slide in in a Matrix > sort of way. I don't know, which is why I bring it up. > > Anyhow, for something that ranks just under taking out the garbage on > my wife's priority list it'll, I hope to be prop flipping in about a > decade or so. > > On technical terms I want to trim the bird for a max pilot weight of > 250. (with clothes) Too much? > > Thanks, > Mike Nadeau > EAA # 0448121 > > > > > > _________________________________________________ > > This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is prohibited. > > Espanol - Deutsch - Nederlands - Francais - Italiano - Norsk - Svenska - Japanese - Danish - Portuguese: www.cardinalhealth.com/legal/email > > > > >


    Message 7


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:30:40 AM PST US
    Subject: I just want to fit in...
    From: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinal.com>
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinal.com> That's why you need the diagonal cabane struts going down to the upper engine mount attach points, so you can eliminate that bracing wire. Jack Phillips -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of harvey rule Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 8:24 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: I just want to fit in... --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: harvey rule <harvey.rule@bell.ca> The only thing is that with my plane there are these cables in the way on the right side that cross each other and there is no way to get your head through.I would have to take those cables off and then find some way to reinforce the structure to make up for the loss of those cables.I think I'll just leave my battery in the front seat for starting . "Phillips, Jack" wrote: > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinal.com> > > Welcome, Mike! > > Piet's aren't easy to enter for today's larger (supersized) folks, if > built strictly to the plans. On mine, I made the centersection with a > curved cutout over the rear cockpit to make ingress/egress easier, and > to give better visibility. I also raised the wing by 2-1/2" to make > entry and exit from both cockpits easier. And I used the diagonal > cabane struts going forward to the motor mount attach points instead of > the X-brace wires ont he right side of the front cockpit. I also added > steps for each cockpit. > > Entry into the front seat is accomplished by stepping on the front step > with the left foot while holding onto the left cabane struts, then > inserting the head through the cockpit and out the right side, between > the right cabane struts. The righ leg is swung into the cockpit, > followed by the left leg, and then you back down into the seat. Getting > out is pretty much the reverse of the process. > > My fiancee is 5'10" and 160 lbs and she can do it easily. I'm 6'2" and > 200 lbs and can do it, but it's a struggle. Rear cockpit is easy. > > Good luck with your project! > > Jack Phillips > Raleigh, NC > NX899JP > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael > Nadeau > Sent: Monday, February 20, 2006 11:50 PM > To: Piet List > Subject: Pietenpol-List: I just want to fit in... > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael Nadeau <nadeau@caldsl.com> > > Hi Guys, > > Don't mind me. I'm just a lurker who's going to get started on my > piet this year. I have the plans. I have the motor (corvair). I > have the carb I got on ebay. I even went up to Van Arsdale-Harris in > San Francisco to buy some spruce enough for the tail and ribs. BTW. > Thats a heck of a place for raw lumber. One warehouse for spruce and > two for fur! Nice 20' 3"x12"s if you really want the big spars. I > picked through the small stuff and filled up my civic. But, before I > get started there's one thing I'd like to know. How does one > actually get into a piet? Specifically, the front cockpit. I mean, > I've seen pictures of people sitting in the front and I've heard of > people saying they've sat in one, but I've haven't actually seen > anyone get in one. I assume the wing comes off. Or it folds up or > something. Maybe they wear black leather and slide in in a Matrix > sort of way. I don't know, which is why I bring it up. > > Anyhow, for something that ranks just under taking out the garbage on > my wife's priority list it'll, I hope to be prop flipping in about a > decade or so. > > On technical terms I want to trim the bird for a max pilot weight of > 250. (with clothes) Too much? > > Thanks, > Mike Nadeau > EAA # 0448121 > > > > > > _________________________________________________ > > This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is prohibited. > > Espanol - Deutsch - Nederlands - Francais - Italiano - Norsk - Svenska - Japanese - Danish - Portuguese: www.cardinalhealth.com/legal/email > > > > > This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is prohibited. Espanol - Deutsch - Nederlands - Francais - Italiano - Norsk - Svenska - Japanese - Danish - Portuguese: www.cardinalhealth.com/legal/email


    Message 8


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:07:36 AM PST US
    From: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
    Subject: washout & rigging
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com> Mike Cuy wrote- >If they are rigged neutral I'm told they'll ride up a bit causing drag. And we can't have any of that nasty drag on a Pietenpol, can we? ;o) Mike Nadeau wrote- >I want to trim the bird for a max pilot weight of 250. (with clothes) Now there's a novel thought... "skinny-flying". I get a heck of a mental picture here. Like, how do you get the plane out of the hangar, chock the wheels, swing the prop, pull the chocks, and climb in... without any "clothing malfunctions"? And to add proper Pietenpol content to this post, I can report that my missing ignition lead has finally been located. It was supposed to ship out of Lake Havasu City a month ago (Aircraft Spruce) and yesterday the customer service rep was kind enough to give me the tracking number to prove that it had, indeed, been delivered on January 18. I then pointed out to her that the tracking data showed that it was left on a porch in Dayton, Ohio... and I'm sitting here in San Antonio, Texas. She's scrambling to find out who has it and if they will kindly send it to me so I can START MY A65 ENGINE!!!! Makes a guy want to cry in his beer, waiting and waiting and waiting to hear the roar of the mighty Continental and finding out that some poor Yankee is sitting in their living room looking at a funny wire and not knowing what the @#$%& it's for!!! I think I'll try that skinny-flying stuff one day, but just not when the naugahyde seat is too hot ;o) Hope I don't get a ramp-check from a friendly Fed, either (unless she's female). Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net


    Message 9


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:32:24 AM PST US
    From: "Alan Lyscars" <alyscars@maine.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: I just want to fit in...
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Alan Lyscars" <alyscars@maine.rr.com> Jack & the Gang, Do any of you fellows have a sketch of this cabane/wire setup that you could email me? I've just started an Aircamper and I can't visualize this reccommendation. Alan Lyscars Portland, Maine ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinal.com> Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 8:29 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: I just want to fit in... > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinal.com> > > That's why you need the diagonal cabane struts going down to the upper > engine mount attach points, so you can eliminate that bracing wire. > > Jack Phillips > >


    Message 10


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:38:34 AM PST US
    Subject: hinge hardware
    From: "Dan Loegering" <danl@odayequipment.com>
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Dan Loegering" <danl@odayequipment.com> Hi all, Last night I was sitting back thumbing through the AS&S dream book looking for some mounting hardware for my Kapler hinges and ran into a bit of a problem. When I measured the mounting holes in the hinges, I found they were .160" in diameter - so I planned on using some 6-32 (.138" Dia.) hardware to mount them. This would give a generous clearance to allow fine adjustment when mating the elevator halves to the horiz. stabilizer. So I set up and pre drilled my main beam, glued the horiz stab together, and was ready to test mount a few hinges. Then to my horror, I can not find any AN 100 Deg, 6-32 machine screws long enough to reach through the beam and secure the hinge. (Drat...) So I thought I would just upsize to 8-32 hardware, but wouldn't you know it - 8-32 is .164" dia. and won't fit through the hinges without modifying them. Since I really would rather not have to drill all the hinges and mounting holes in my beam, I am wondering what those of you who used Vi's hinges have used to mount them? Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thank you! Dan Loegering Fargo, ND


    Message 11


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:00:48 AM PST US
    From: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
    Subject: photos showing center section/cabane strut setups
    Mike-- good to hear you are on your way to building the Pietenpol Air Camper. As Jack Phillips mentioned, make your center section higher than plans. Most guys make the cabane struts (the four vertical streamlined struts over the cockpit areas) two and sometimes three inches longer than the plans call for. Not only does this make it easier to get in and out of the front seat but it dramatically increases the pilot's visibility forward and above. Don't install the X cable bracing on the right side of the front cockpit, but rather install the diagonal struts from your two upper motor mount fittings to a bracket/fitting that you'll have to make on the front two cabane struts near the top.l (as seen in the attached photos that show the two different center section bracing options) Mike C.


    Message 12


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:05:41 AM PST US
    From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: hinge hardware
    Hello Dan I am using 8-32 screws on my Kapler hinges, just reamed the holes out to around .170. Rick H On 2/21/06, Dan Loegering <danl@odayequipment.com> wrote: > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Dan Loegering" < > danl@odayequipment.com> > > Hi all, > > Last night I was sitting back thumbing through the AS&S dream book looking > for some mounting hardware for my Kapler hinges and ran into a bit of a > problem. > > When I measured the mounting holes in the hinges, I found they were .160" > in diameter - so I planned on using some 6-32 (.138" Dia.) hardware to mount > them. This would give a generous clearance to allow fine adjustment when > mating the elevator halves to the horiz. stabilizer. So I set up and pre > drilled my main beam, glued the horiz stab together, and was ready to test > mount a few hinges. Then to my horror, I can not find any AN 100 Deg, 6-32 > machine screws long enough to reach through the beam and secure the > hinge. (Drat...) > > So I thought I would just upsize to 8-32 hardware, but wouldn't you know > it - 8-32 is .164" dia. and won't fit through the hinges without modifying > them. > > Since I really would rather not have to drill all the hinges and mounting > holes in my beam, I am wondering what those of you who used Vi's hinges have > used to mount them? > > Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > Thank you! > > Dan Loegering > Fargo, ND > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > -- Rick Holland "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 13


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:12:26 AM PST US
    From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: I just want to fit in...
    One other thing you may want to consider is increasing the fuselage width by one to four inches, many people on this list have done this (I increases mine by two). I also am building a wing cutout and 2 1/2" longer cabanes. Rick H. On 2/20/06, Michael Nadeau <nadeau@caldsl.com> wrote: > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael Nadeau <nadeau@caldsl.com> > > Hi Guys, > > Don't mind me. I'm just a lurker who's going to get started on my > piet this year. I have the plans. I have the motor (corvair). I > have the carb I got on ebay. I even went up to Van Arsdale-Harris in > San Francisco to buy some spruce enough for the tail and ribs. BTW. > Thats a heck of a place for raw lumber. One warehouse for spruce and > two for fur! Nice 20' 3"x12"s if you really want the big spars. I > picked through the small stuff and filled up my civic. But, before I > get started there's one thing I'd like to know. How does one > actually get into a piet? Specifically, the front cockpit. I mean, > I've seen pictures of people sitting in the front and I've heard of > people saying they've sat in one, but I've haven't actually seen > anyone get in one. I assume the wing comes off. Or it folds up or > something. Maybe they wear black leather and slide in in a Matrix > sort of way. I don't know, which is why I bring it up. > > Anyhow, for something that ranks just under taking out the garbage on > my wife's priority list it'll, I hope to be prop flipping in about a > decade or so. > > On technical terms I want to trim the bird for a max pilot weight of > 250. (with clothes) Too much? > > Thanks, > Mike Nadeau > EAA # 0448121 > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > -- Rick Holland "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 14


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:15:24 AM PST US
    From: harvey rule <harvey.rule@bell.ca>
    Subject: Re: photos showing center section/cabane strut setups
    I have both;is this over done?See pics in attachment. Michael D Cuy wrote: > > Mike-- good to hear you are on your way to building the Pietenpol Air Camper. > > As Jack Phillips mentioned, make your center section higher than > plans. Most guys make the cabane struts > (the four vertical streamlined struts over the cockpit areas) two and > sometimes three inches longer than the plans call for. > > Not only does this make it easier to get in and out of the front seat but > it dramatically increases the pilot's visibility forward > and above. > > Don't install the X cable bracing on the right side of the front cockpit, > but rather install the diagonal struts from your > two upper motor mount fittings to a bracket/fitting that you'll have to > make on the front two cabane struts near the top.l > (as seen in the attached photos that show the two different center section > bracing options) > > Mike C. > > Name: Diagonal Braces.jpg > Diagonal Braces.jpg Type: JPEG Image (image/jpeg) > Encoding: base64 > > Name: X Cable Braces.jpg > X Cable Braces.jpg Type: JPEG Image (image/jpeg) > Encoding: base64


    Message 15


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:18:20 AM PST US
    From: "Jeff Hill" <jeff2dogs@hotmail.com>
    Subject: test only - do not archive
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jeff Hill" <jeff2dogs@hotmail.com> I hope this works; I've changed the format slightly. Jeff in Texas with all the woodwork done for both Piets


    Message 16


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:29:06 AM PST US
    From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: test only - do not archive
    Looks like it worked. Wow, two Piets at once! You have at least double the modivation that I have. Although I would think it would take far less than double the time to build two Piets at once. Rick H do not archive On 2/21/06, Jeff Hill <jeff2dogs@hotmail.com> wrote: > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jeff Hill" <jeff2dogs@hotmail.com> > > I hope this works; I've changed the format slightly. > > Jeff in Texas with all the woodwork done for both Piets > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > -- Rick Holland "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 17


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:33:57 AM PST US
    From: Kirk Huizenga <kirk.huizenga@moundsviewschools.org>
    Subject: Re: hinge hardware
    Same here - I just picked up some more 8-32 SS machine screws (1-1/2") from Home Depot for that very purpose. The only thing that I would like that I couldn't find is a phillips head screw instead of slotted. Kirk On Feb 21, 2006, at 9:04 AM, Rick Holland wrote: > Hello Dan > > I am using 8-32 screws on my Kapler hinges, just reamed the holes > out to around .170. > > Rick H > > On 2/21/06, Dan Loegering < danl@odayequipment.com> wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Dan Loegering" < > danl@odayequipment.com> > > Hi all, > > Last night I was sitting back thumbing through the AS&S dream book > looking for some mounting hardware for my Kapler hinges and ran > into a bit of a problem. > > When I measured the mounting holes in the hinges, I found they > were .160" in diameter - so I planned on using some 6-32 (.138" > Dia.) hardware to mount them. This would give a generous clearance > to allow fine adjustment when mating the elevator halves to the > horiz. stabilizer. So I set up and pre drilled my main beam, glued > the horiz stab together, and was ready to test mount a few hinges. > Then to my horror, I can not find any AN 100 Deg, 6-32 machine > screws long enough to reach through the beam and secure the hinge. > (Drat...) > > So I thought I would just upsize to 8-32 hardware, but wouldn't you > know it - 8-32 is .164" dia. and won't fit through the hinges > without modifying them. > > Since I really would rather not have to drill all the hinges and > mounting holes in my beam, I am wondering what those of you who > used Vi's hinges have used to mount them? > > Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > Thank you! > > Dan Loegering > Fargo, ND > > > <========================================= ="http:// > www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http:// > www.matronics================================================ > p; -Matt Dralle, Li> > =================================================== > > > -- > Rick Holland > > "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" Kirk Huizenga Community Expert kirk.huizenga@moundsviewschools.org 651.482.8203 my views are not necessarily the view of my employer


    Message 18


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:49:39 AM PST US
    From: "Dick Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net>
    Subject: Re: hinge hardware
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Dick Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net> Why not go to Stainless 6x32 with locking nuts? They are available at the hardware store. Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Loegering" <danl@odayequipment.com> Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 8:37 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: hinge hardware > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Dan Loegering" > <danl@odayequipment.com> > > Hi all, > > Last night I was sitting back thumbing through the AS&S dream book looking > for some mounting hardware for my Kapler hinges and ran into a bit of a > problem. > > When I measured the mounting holes in the hinges, I found they were .160" > in diameter - so I planned on using some 6-32 (.138" Dia.) hardware to > mount them. This would give a generous clearance to allow fine adjustment > when mating the elevator halves to the horiz. stabilizer. So I set up and > pre drilled my main beam, glued the horiz stab together, and was ready to > test mount a few hinges. Then to my horror, I can not find any AN 100 > Deg, 6-32 machine screws long enough to reach through the beam and secure > the hinge. (Drat...) > > So I thought I would just upsize to 8-32 hardware, but wouldn't you know > it - 8-32 is .164" dia. and won't fit through the hinges without modifying > them. > > Since I really would rather not have to drill all the hinges and mounting > holes in my beam, I am wondering what those of you who used Vi's hinges > have used to mount them? > > Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > Thank you! > > Dan Loegering > Fargo, ND > > >


    Message 19


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 04:35:58 PM PST US
    From: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Washout & Rigging
    Hello Mike, This mail of yours is a REAL KEEPER! Everything makes lots of sense, so has to be perfectly correct. Saludos Gary Gower. Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> wrote: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy I have about 2.5 degrees of dihedral, 3/8" washout at a point 3 ribs in from the wingtip, and ailerons in neutral are rigged 1/4" down on both sides. Reason for 3/8" washout is that is what 150 years of aviation experience (my two 75 year old IA buddies who work on nothing but old airplanes) told me that most Cubs, Champs, and such have in them, and the 1/4" droop because that is the way they used to rig old airplanes (including the DC-3's) because air pressures in flight on will make the ailerons sit pretty then, exactly neutral. If they are rigged neutral I'm told they'll ride up a bit causing drag. Mike C. --------------------------------- Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.


    Message 20


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 04:53:18 PM PST US
    From: Isablcorky@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Piet for sale
    Need a bit more information on your Piet for Sale, please. Any pics?


    Message 21


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 04:56:00 PM PST US
    From: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: WARNING about the Piet for sale from Ray going to
    Belize I knew he will not finish it... LESS fly it! Even if he was "Completly"convinced of his materials suaping... Is a diferent thing to argue to the list that "this material looks the same as the good one", "why to pay more, just because it says Aircraft Quality" and other completly diferent thing is to sit in the flying plane and look down at 3,000 ft in turbulence :-) Saludos Gary Gower. Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> wrote: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy Group--- Please read prior posts in the archive if you are even considering asking this guy about his Piet project. It is basically a piece of crap built to non-aircraft grade standards and materials and should be burned in a big campfire at the bast of the Alps in Belize....or wherever it sits. Mike C. Please Archive --------------------------------- Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.


    Message 22


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 09:13:10 PM PST US
    From: Michael Nadeau <nadeau@caldsl.com>
    Subject: Re: I just want to fit in...
    --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael Nadeau <nadeau@caldsl.com> Thanks guys for all the info. I'm satisfied someone will squeeze in my front cockpit. Keri Ann's website seems to be down. I'll keep on lurking and pipe in time to time with questions. Thanks again, Mike BTW I don't weigh 250 lbs but I probably will by the time I fly :-)


    Message 23


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 10:04:41 PM PST US
    From: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: I just want to fit in...
    Michael Nadeau <nadeau@caldsl.com> wrote: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael Nadeau Thanks guys for all the info. I'm satisfied someone will squeeze in my front cockpit. Keri Ann's website seems to be down. I'll keep on lurking and pipe in time to time with questions. Thanks again, Mike BTW I don't weigh 250 lbs but I probably will by the time I fly :-) Just forget about pizza and beer snacks while building :-) :-) The fuselage door is a good idea, hope you find the plans soon. Saludos Gary Gower --------------------------------- Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.


    Message 24


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 10:34:27 PM PST US
    From: Mike Luther <luther@gci.net>
    Subject: Re: Washout & Rigging
    Hi guys: The Pietenpol manual, page 75, says that "When Mr. Pietenpol assembled and covered wings he would place either a 1/4" or 1/2" spacer under the last outboard rib, where it intersects the rear spar." to build in his washout. I just happened to be working on this part of my Piet, today, so I did a measurement using Mike C.'s number of 3/8" at the third rib in and came up with 9/16" at the last rib. So I will add 1/8" to the Pietenpol manual's 1/2" number and live with the extra drag. What is really a valuable tidbit for me is Mike C.'s information about rigging the ailerons 1/4" low in their neutral position. Good, common-sense, info is always easy for me to remember. Mike Luther ----- Original Message ----- From: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Washout & Rigging > Hello Mike, > > This mail of yours is a REAL KEEPER! Everything makes lots of > sense, so has to be perfectly correct. > > Saludos > Gary Gower. > > Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy > > I have about 2.5 degrees of dihedral, 3/8" washout at a point 3 > ribs in > from the wingtip, and ailerons in neutral are rigged 1/4" down on both > sides. > > Reason for 3/8" washout is that is what 150 years of aviation > experience > (my two 75 year old IA buddies who work on nothing but old airplanes) > told me that most Cubs, Champs, and such have in them, > > and the 1/4" droop because that is the way they used to rig old > airplanes > (including the DC-3's) because air pressures in flight on will make > the ailerons sit pretty then, exactly neutral. If they are rigged > neutral > I'm told they'll ride up a bit causing drag. > > Mike C. > > --------------------------------- > Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.


    Message 25


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 11:10:17 PM PST US
    From: Rcaprd@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Washout & Rigging
    In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:14:06 PM Central Standard Time, Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov writes: the 1/4" droop because that is the way they used to rig old airplanes (including the DC-3's) because air pressures in flight on will make the ailerons sit pretty then, exactly neutral. If they are rigged neutral I'm told they'll ride up a bit causing drag. Mike et all, I have my ailerons rigged even with the wing's trailing edge, and they stay there in flight. The flight control rigging of the Pietenpol should Not have any tension to speak of...just remove all slack. When I stand out by the wing, and move one aileron 1/16", the other aileron moves exactly that much - in other words, no play. It seems to me that 1/4" is quite a lot, and if they stay 1/4" low in flight, this would negate a lot of the washout you have. Here is an old trick : If you already have your wing rigged, and you find you have a tip stall condition, rig the ailerons trailing edge a little bit higher than the trailing edge of the wing, and it causes some washout. However, if the ball is in the middle, the Pietenpol wing just doesn't have any tip stall conditions, and washout just reduces the total lift. Chuck G. NX770CG




    Other Matronics Email List Services

  • Post A New Message
  •   pietenpol-list@matronics.com
  • UN/SUBSCRIBE
  •   http://www.matronics.com/subscription
  • List FAQ
  •   http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
  • Full Archive Search Engine
  •   http://www.matronics.com/search
  • 7-Day List Browse
  •   http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list
  • Browse Pietenpol-List Digests
  •   http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list
  • Browse Other Lists
  •   http://www.matronics.com/browse
  • Live Online Chat!
  •   http://www.matronics.com/chat
  • Archive Downloading
  •   http://www.matronics.com/archives
  • Photo Share
  •   http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
  • Other Email Lists
  •   http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
  • Contributions
  •   http://www.matronics.com/contributions

    These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.

    -- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --