Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:32 AM - Re: Brake master cylinders (Belue, Kevin)
2. 06:25 AM - RV-10 Tow Bar (JSMcGrew@AOL.COM)
3. 06:26 AM - Re: Retractable (David Maib)
4. 06:36 AM - Re: RV-10 Tow Bar (Condrey, Bob (US SSA))
5. 06:53 AM - Re: RV-10 Tow Bar (JSMcGrew@AOL.COM)
6. 07:00 AM - Horizontal Stabilizer Riveting (Bruce Case)
7. 07:04 AM - Re: RV-10 Tow Bar (linn Walters)
8. 07:07 AM - Re: RV-10 Tow Bar (Doerr, Ray R [NTK])
9. 07:27 AM - Mangled messages? (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
10. 07:27 AM - Re: RV-10 Tow Bar (Doerr, Ray R [NTK])
11. 07:29 AM - Re: RV-10 Tow Bar (pilotdds@aol.com)
12. 07:30 AM - Re: RV-10 Tow Bar (pilotdds@aol.com)
13. 07:36 AM - Re: RV-10 Tow Bar (Tim Olson)
14. 07:52 AM - Re: RV-10 Tow Bar (Mark Ritter)
15. 08:01 AM - Re: RV10-List Digest: 40 Msgs - 05/23/06 (Bill Gates)
16. 09:15 AM - Re: RV-10 Tow Bar (Rob Kermanj)
17. 09:29 AM - Re: Mangled messages? ()
18. 09:31 AM - Re: Mangled messages? (James Hein)
19. 09:37 AM - Re: Mangled messages? (Condrey, Bob (US SSA))
20. 09:53 AM - Re: Mangled messages? (Phillips, Jack)
21. 09:56 AM - Re: Mangled messages? (Matt Dralle)
22. 10:10 AM - Re: Mangled messages? (Rick)
23. 11:37 AM - Re: Retractable (Jesse Saint)
24. 12:26 PM - Re: Retractable (Tim Olson)
25. 01:38 PM - Re: Retractable (RobHickman@aol.com)
26. 02:27 PM - Re: Retractable (Bruce Case)
27. 05:13 PM - Re: Horizontal Stabilizer Riveting (LIKE2LOOP@aol.com)
28. 05:53 PM - Re: N519RV (40250) just received it's airworthiness today. (Michael Lefever)
29. 07:13 PM - avionics panel offer (GenGrumpy@aol.com)
30. 08:28 PM - Re: Retractable (John Lenhardt)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Brake master cylinders |
When I finished my RV-6A, I noticed a lot of times that it was harder to
push it in the hangar than it should be. One day when it was fairly hard to
move, I pulled back on the tops of the brake pedals and then it moved much
easier. After more experimentation, I found that a lot of times the master
cylinders were not returning completing, causing the brakes to drag. I took
the canopy release spring that I didn't use when building the plane and cut
it in half, stretched it some, and put one on the shaft outside of each
master cylinder. That fixed the brake dragging and it has been easy to move
since then. I've made this modification to other RVs with similar results.
I'm not flying my RV-10 yet so I haven't tried it there, but the brakes are
essentially the same as the RV-6A, so I would expect similar results.
Kevin D. Belue
RV-6A flying
RV-10 canopy top
_____
From: Jack Sargeant [mailto:k5wiv@amsat.org]
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 8:20 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders
All disc brakes depend on the minute wobble in the rotors to push the pucks
back when released. I've never seen any with return springs, and I don't
think that springs on the master cylinders would help either.
Jack & Cecilia Sargeant
1127 Patricia St.
Wichita, KS 67208-2642
316/682-5268
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of LIKE2LOOP@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 4:30 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders
In a message dated 5/23/2006 1:51:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, pilotdds
@aol.com writes:
The brakes on my C-170 are the same, they don' t spring open, and will
touch ever so slightly against the disks..... but in the air, the wheels are
not turning! As the pads wear, the contact of ten lightens up when the
brakes are NOT applied. Not a major issue.
Steve
Stephen G. Blank,DDS
RV-10 #40499 &n bsp; Finishing the HS
Cessna 170b Flyer
Port St Lucie, FL
772-475-5556 cell
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>When I finished my RV-6A, I
noticed a lot
of times that it was harder to push it in the hangar than it should be.
One day
when it was fairly hard to move, I pulled back on the tops of the brake
pedals
and then it moved much easier. After more experimentation, I found that
a lot
of times the master cylinders were not returning completing, causing
the brakes
to drag. I took the canopy release spring that I didn't use when
building
the plane and cut it in half, stretched it some, and put one on the
shaft
outside of each master cylinder. That fixed the brake dragging and it
has been
easy to move since then. I've made this modification to other RVs with
similar results. I'm not flying my RV-10 yet so I haven't tried it
there, but the brakes are essentially the same as the RV-6A, so I would
expect
similar results.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><strong><b><i><font size=3 color=navy
face="Bookman Old Style"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Bookman Old Style";
color:navy;font-style:italic'>Kevin D.
Belue<o:p></o:p></span></font></i></b></strong></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><strong><b><i><font size=3 color=navy
face="Bookman Old Style"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Bookman Old Style";
color:navy;font-style:italic'>RV-6A
flying<o:p></o:p></span></font></i></b></strong></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><strong><b><i><font size=3 color=navy
face="Bookman Old Style"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Bookman Old Style";
color:navy;font-style:italic'>RV-10 canopy
top<o:p></o:p></span></font></i></b></strong></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=navy face="Times New
Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p
>
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0in 4.0pt'>
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style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Bookman Old Style";
color:navy;font-style:italic'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></i></b></s
trong></p>
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size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> Jack
Sargeant
[mailto:k5wiv@amsat.org] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, May 23,
2006 8:20
PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">rv10-list@matronics.com</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: RV10-List:
Brake
master cylinders</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=blue face=Arial><span
style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>All disc brakes depend on the
minute
wobble in the rotors to push the pucks back when released. I've
never
seen any with return springs, and I don't think that springs on the
master
cylinders would help either.</span></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><!-- Converted from
text/rtf format -->Jack
& Cecilia Sargeant</span></font> <br>
<st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on"><font size=2
face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>1127 Patricia
St</span></font></st1:address></st1:Street><font
size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>.</span></font>
<br>
<st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on"><font size=2
face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Wichita</span></font></st1:
place></st1:City><font
size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>, KS
67208-2642</span></font> <br>
<font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>316/682-5268</span></font>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote
style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original
Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b>
owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com]<b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On
Behalf Of </span></b>LIKE2LOOP@aol.com<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, May 23,
2006 4:30
PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">rv10-list@matronics.com</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: RV10-List:
Brake
master cylinders</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:
12.0pt'>In a message dated 5/23/2006 1:51:35 PM Eastern Standard Time,
pilotdds
@aol.com writes:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=rdana FONT towing.< when
dragging some
notice shafts.I actuating the around spring return external of sort be
should
there seems><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:rdana'>
The brakes on my C-170 are the same, they don' t spring open, and will
touch
ever so slightly against the disks..... but in the air, the wheels are
not
turning! As the pads wear, the contact of ten lightens up when
the brakes
are NOT applied. Not a major issue.</D IV>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=rdana><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:rdana'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=rdana><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:rdana'>Steve<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=rdana><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:rdana'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=rdana lang?ce=ial
PTSIZE="0""><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:rdana'>Stephen G. Blank,DDS <br>
RV-10 #40499 &n bsp;
Finishing the HS<br>
Cessna 170b <st1:address w:st="on"><st1:Street w:st="on">Flyer <br>
<br>
Port St</st1:Street> <st1:City w:st="on">Lucie</st1:City>,
<st1:State w:st="on">FL</st1:State></st1:address>
<br>
772-475-5556 cell<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</body>
</html>
Message 2
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My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone can
point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing mentioned
in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa and a couple
general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce. Does anyone have a
specific part number of one that works?
The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT work.
I'm sending it back and going to try again...
-Jim McGrew
40134
Message 3
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--> RV10-List message posted by: David Maib <dmaib@mac.com>
I really agree with Tim Olson on this one. Having owned a used
Bonanza for a few years, I am really looking forward to annual
inspections with no retractable gear worries. Expensive, heavy,
complex, and you always have a moment of "will it, or won't it come
down" when you lower the gear for landing. Don't get me wrong, the
Bonanza is an awesome airplane, but less complexity and similar
performance are very attractive to me now. The building experience is
icing on the cake.
David Maib
do not archive
Message 4
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Bogert has one specifically made for the RV-10 that seems to work fine.
For some reason Spruce doesn't list it though
http://www.bogert-av.com/bogi-bars.php
model #4-RV10; $84
Bob #40105
_____
My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca
n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing
mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa
and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce.
Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that works?
The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo
rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again...
-Jim McGrew
40134
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: RV-10 Tow Bar |
Thank you!
Do not archive
In a message dated 5/24/2006 7:39:52 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time,
bob.condrey@baesystems.com writes:
Bogert has one specifically made for the RV-10 that seems to work fine. Fo
r
some reason Spruce doesn=99t list it though
_http://www.bogert-av.com/ bogi-bars.php_
(http://www.bogert-av.com/bogi-bars.php)
model #4-RV10; $84
Bob #40105
____________________________________
My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca n
point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing
mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa and
a couple
general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce. Does anyo ne ha
ve
a specific part number of one that works?
The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo rk.
I'm sending it back and going to try again...
-Jim McGrew
40134
Jim "Scooter" McGrew
jsmcgrew@aol.com
Message 6
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| Subject: | Horizontal Stabilizer Riveting |
When I cleco the horizontal stabilizer together with just the leading
edge ribs and the plywood form blocks there is a lot of stress on the
ribs to the point where the HS is somewhat distorted. Has anyone done
anything additional before putting in the rivets on the leading edge
ribs? I am concerned about the airfoil shape. I was thinking of
pro-sealing the leading edge ribs in place with the the main spar
clecoed in and then going back and riveting in the leading edge ribs
after the pro-seal has dried and I can remove the main spar.
Bruce Case #40446
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: RV-10 Tow Bar |
JSMcGrew@aol.com wrote:
> My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone
> ca n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only
> thing mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South
> Africa and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and
> Aircraft Spruce. Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that
> works?
>
> The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT
> wo rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again...
>
> -Jim McGrew
> 40134
>
If it were me (and I plan on being there!), I'd look at the ACS tow bar,
and since you know WHY it won't work ..... modify it! C'mon now, you've
built a whole airplane! How hard can it be to change a tow bar????
Linn
do not archive.
Message 8
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This is the one I use for my RV-9 and RV-10. Works great on
both planes. It's from Aircraft Spruce.
4-RVA
RVA Style with Nose Wheel
13-01811
$78.75
Thank You
Ray Doerr
CDNI Principal Engineer
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
JSMcGrew@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 8:24 AM
Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar
Message 9
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| Subject: | Mangled messages? |
Anyone else seeing problems with HTML emails coming from the Matronics
list remailer? The HTML based list emails I have been getting have
malformed URL links, blank emails, and missing sentences. It's all
normal when you look at the forum site, but they are messed up in email.
This is only happening to HTML emails. Sent samples to Matt yesterday
but haven't heard anything, just want to know if other people are seeing
this also. An example is the link below that is missing the "h" and has
an extra quote at the end.
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Condrey, Bob
(US SSA)
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 8:35 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar
Bogert has one specifically made for the RV-10 that seems to work fine.
For some reason Spruce doesn't list it though
http://www.bogert-av.com/ bogi-bars.php
<ttp://www.bogert-av.com/bogi-bars.php">
model #4-RV10; $84
Bob #40105
________________________________
My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca
n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing
mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa
and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce.
Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that works?
The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo
rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again...
-Jim McGrew
40134
Message 10
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This is the one I use for my RV-9 and RV-10. Works great on both
planes. It's from Aircraft Spruce part # 13-01811 (RVA Style with Nose
Wheel)
Thank You
Ray Doerr
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
JSMcGrew@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 8:24 AM
Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: RV-10 Tow Bar |
I have been using a tow bar from a c-210.Works great
-----Original Message-----
From: JSMcGrew@aol.com
Sent: Wed, 24 May 2006 09:24:02 EDT
Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar
My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca n point
me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing mentioned in
the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa and a couple general
references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce. Does anyo ne have a specific
part number of one that works?
The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo rk. I'm
sending it back and going to try again...
-Jim McGrew
40134
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: RV-10 Tow Bar |
I will get part number this weekend.
-----Original Message-----
From: JSMcGrew@aol.com
Sent: Wed, 24 May 2006 09:24:02 EDT
Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar
My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca n point
me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing mentioned in
the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa and a couple general
references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce. Does anyo ne have a specific
part number of one that works?
The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo rk. I'm
sending it back and going to try again...
-Jim McGrew
40134
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: RV-10 Tow Bar |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Here's some new Towbar comments:
(Old) The RVA towbar from Aircraft Spruce does indeed work fine
on the RV-10. I have one. When you first buy it, you can use
it on the 10 nosewheel on the axle area. After you add wheel fairings,
you'll cut 3/4" off the towbar pinchers and use it on some other
capscrews. But, it works just fine. I see they now offer an RV-10
version, but I'm sure there's not a lot different...it's probably
just pre-cut. You should ask them.
(New) In search of a nice rudder gust lock, I created one that
works really well. I spoke with Bogerts about it to see if
they'd be interested in making it a product of theirs that
would save builders having to build one. The RV-10 does
definitely need a rudder gust lock. This progressed into
a bit larger project, where we are trying to come up with
a Towbar/Gust-Lock that will do everything you would ever
want...it would be a towbar, and with a couple of attachments
it would also serve as a rudder, AND aileron/elevator gust lock.
I don't have a timeline for when you could see a finished product.
I do have some photos of my rudder gust-lock only that I made.
It works really great, but means I have to have 2 things
hauled in the tail on long trips.
More to come...
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
Condrey, Bob (US SSA) wrote:
> Bogert has one specifically made for the RV-10 that seems to work fine.
> For some reason Spruce doesnt list it though
>
> http://www.bogert-av.com/ bogi-bars.php
> <http://www.bogert-av.com/bogi-bars.php>
>
> model #4-RV10; $84
> Bob #40105
>
>
> My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca
> n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing
> mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa
> and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce.
> Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that works?
>
> The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo
> rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again...
>
> -Jim McGrew
>
> 40134
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: RV-10 Tow Bar |
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Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: RV10-List Digest: 40 Msgs - 05/23/06 |
Just some musings from a recent IFR Student perspective:
Instrument Flying....4th Edition....Richard Taylor
"Each pilot in command shall, before beginning a flight, familiarize himself with
ALL AVAILABLE INFORMATION concerning that flight." FAR 91.103
As far as the legal side goes: "...THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR BLUNDERING INTO A THUNDERSTORM."
"...IFR pilots cannot depend on ATC for weather information"
ATC radar is designed for aircraft separation, not weather detection. Their first
priority is aircraft separation, and issuance of radar safety advisories.
Second priority is to provide other services that are required. Third priority
is to provide additional services to the extent possible given the current
workload. THE PILOT is responsible for the safe conclusion of the flight and
NOT ATC.
Calling Flight Watch on 122.0, listening to other Pilot Communications, listening
to HIWAS VOR's for SIGMETS and hazardous weather would have all been available
to this pilot to AVOID the near mid-air airframe break up described in the
post.
Recently, just near here in northeast Geogia, Scott Crossfield..first Mach 2 and
3 pilot...at age 85, died in just this same scenario when his P210 had the wings
sheared off trying to use his on-board radar to penetrate a 'light spot'
in a line of thunderstorms at night...and flew directly into severe Clear Air
Turbulence...invisible on radar. His P210 turned into a large lawn dart penetrating
the rocky ground and creating a smoking 4 foot deep hole without disturbing
the tree foilage above!
Chuck Yeager commented that Crossfield was always pushing the weather limits.
So he WAS ONE OLD BOLD PILOT with the habit of trying to penetrate a line of
thunderstorms that finally caught up with him. Since I am NO Crossfield, Yeager
or even a very good IFR Pilot and pretty unlucky, I know that I am not going
to double the cost of my 10 with onboard radar, strike finder, WX MFD Color
Weather, and satellite isobar printouts ($120,000.00) because like Van told me
at a RV Reunion in Aurora one day....the RV-10 was designed as a VFR family plane....and
as Richard Taylor writes "There is ALWAYS a better way to get someplace
in an airplane other than through a thunderstorm. The risk is never worth
the price that might have to be paid." "Wise pilots AVOID threatening weather,
there is no weather-turbulence detection equipment developed yet that can
safely guide you through a squall line or a thinderstorm."
Someone else once prayed: "Please Lord, don't let me look foolish on the NTSB report!"
....and you JUST KNOW that the FAA would have determined that had that flight in
So Cal ended badly it would have been 'Pilot Error' in deciding to continue
the flight into IMC that led to an 'airframe break-up in mid-air' and everyone's
demise!
...guess whose insurance company would be liable and would they refuse to pay based
on Pilot Error?
As per the Retractable Gear discussion:
I sure had my bubble burst, as I have been toying with all of these ideas since
seeing a homebuilt retractable at a RV Fly-In once. But I did think of a few
more additions to all the great ideas above: 'a gear-up warning sound' when you
power back for the approach and forgot to lower it and an emergency 'extendable
gear lowering handle' between the seats, and a pullable fuse....so your
CFII can simulate a 'gear down and lock failure' while you are on the glide slope
while simulataneaously cutting the power to simulate a dead stick emergency
landing.....don't ask me how I know they can do that!
I did take the CIRRUS Transition Training Course in anticipation of flying the
comparable RV-10 and I must admit that I really think a better expenditure than
all that weather detection gear would be a Ballistic Parachute System for the
10.
....just my 2 cents....
Paul
----- Original Message ----
From: RV10-List Digest Server <rv10-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 2:57:44 AM
Subject: RV10-List Digest: 40 Msgs - 05/23/06
*
================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
================================================
Today's complete RV10-List Digest can also be found in either of the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the RV10-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
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==============================================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
==============================================
RV10-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Tue 05/23/06: 40
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:23 AM - Retractable (Paul Walter)
2. 03:44 AM - New Service Letter for -10 (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
3. 03:44 AM - Re: Engine limts (Rob Kermanj)
4. 04:11 AM - Re: Retractable (Tim Olson)
5. 04:36 AM - Re: Retractable (Tim Dawson-Townsend)
6. 04:54 AM - Re: Retractable (GRANSCOTT@AOL.COM)
7. 05:53 AM - Re: Retractable (David McNeill)
8. 06:11 AM - Re: Retractable (Indran Chelvanayagam)
9. 06:40 AM - Re: Retractable (Tim Olson)
10. 06:56 AM - Re: Retractable (Deems Davis)
11. 07:13 AM - Re: Retractable (Tim Dawson-Townsend)
12. 07:47 AM - Re: Retractable (Chris W)
13. 09:05 AM - Re: Retractable (Indran Chelvanayagam)
14. 09:29 AM - Weather capabilities and severe turblance (Jon Reining)
15. 09:34 AM - Re: Re: Retractable ()
16. 10:07 AM - Re: Re: Retractable (Tim Dawson-Townsend)
17. 10:32 AM - Re: Retractable (Tim Olson)
18. 10:38 AM - Re: Re: Retractable (John Jessen)
19. 10:49 AM - Brake master cylinders (pilotdds@aol.com)
20. 10:54 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (John Jessen)
21. 11:00 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (RV Builder (Michael
Sausen))
22. 11:04 AM - Re: Retractable (Lloyd, Daniel R.)
23. 11:17 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence (Tim Dawson-Townsend)
24. 11:23 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (Dj Merrill)
25. 11:27 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence (Albert Gardner)
26. 11:39 AM - Re: Retractable (Mark Grieve)
27. 11:44 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence (RV Builder
(Michael Sausen))
28. 11:49 AM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (Deems Davis)
29. 12:09 PM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence (Tim Dawson-Townsend)
30. 12:38 PM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (Tim Olson)
31. 12:40 PM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (Tim Olson)
32. 12:47 PM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance (David McNeill)
33. 01:00 PM - Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance - pilot account
(Eric Panning)
34. 01:36 PM - Re: Brake master cylinders (linn Walters)
35. 02:00 PM - Re: Brake master cylinders (Chris , Susie Darcy)
36. 02:10 PM - Re: Re: Retractable ()
37. 02:11 PM - test (Chris , Susie Darcy)
38. 02:30 PM - Re: Brake master cylinders (LIKE2LOOP@aol.com)
39. 03:01 PM - Re: Retractable (Kelly McMullen)
40. 06:24 PM - Re: Brake master cylinders (Jack Sargeant)
________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________
Time: 12:23:07 AM PST US
From: "Paul Walter" <pdwalter@bigpond.net.au>
Subject: RV10-List: Retractable
In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to adapt
a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure how far
into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he should be
able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any thoughts ?. As
for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
Paul Walter
________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________
Time: 03:44:44 AM PST US
Subject: RV10-List: New Service Letter for -10
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder@sausen.net>
Any one notice this? http://www.vansaircraft.com/pdf/rv10_spur_gear.pdf
Not really a SL, just another oops/fyi.
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
Recent RV-10 Build Activity
<http://www.mykitlog.com/display_project.php?project_id=22>
________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________
Time: 03:44:44 AM PST US
From: "Rob Kermanj" <flysrv10@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Engine limts
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Rob Kermanj" <flysrv10@gmail.com>
Thank you Robert. This will do fine.
Do not archive.
On 5/23/06, Robert G. Wright <armywrights@adelphia.net> wrote:
>
>
> From http://rvimg.com/tcds/ lycoming-io-540.pdf:
>
>
> Oil:------------ - --------------------Maximum -----Minimum
>
> Normal operation ---------------------95 p.s.i. ---55 p.s.i.
>
> Idling ------------------------- --------# ---------25 p.s.i.
>
> Starting, warm-up, Taxi and Take off: 115 p.s.i. -----#
>
> "#" indicates does not apply
>
>
> IO-540-D4A5--- p.s.i. at inlet to fuel injector ----Max. Injector
>
> ----------- Maximum ---Minimum --Minimum Idle----- -in Idle cutoff
>
>
> ------------- 45 ---------14 ---------12 ----------------55
>
>
> II. MODELS: IO-540-
>
> IO-540
>
> -D4A5,
>
>
> -
>
> -D4B5,
>
>
> -
>
> -D4C5,
>
> -N1A5,
>
>
> -
>
> -R1A5,
>
>
> -
>
> -D4A5
>
>
> -
>
> -
>
> AEIO-540-
>
>
> -
>
> -D4A5,
>
>
> -
>
> -D4B5,
>
>
> -
>
> -D4C5
>
>
> -
>
> -D4D5
>
>
> Type
>
> - -
>
>
> Rating
>
> 260-2700
>
>
> Takeoff and maximum continuous
>
>
> hp., rpm, full throttle at:
>
>
> sea level pressure altitude
>
>
> NOTE 1. Temperature Limits (Maximum permissible):
>
> Cylinder head (well type thermocouple) 500F
>
> Cylinder base 325F Cylinder base temperature limits are not applicable to
> engine models which
>
> incorporate internal piston cooling oil jets.
>
> Oil inlet 245F
>
>
> NOTE 9. For all models - ignition and center of gravity:
>
>
> C.G. location (dry with starter and generator installed)
>
>
> Models
>
> ------------------ Ignition, dual* +
>
> From front face of
>
> propeller mounting
>
> flange (in.)
>
> Off prop. shaft C.L. (in.)
>
> Vertical----------- -Lateral
>
>
> IO-540
>
>
> -D4A5
>
> TCM S6LN-200, S6LN-204
>
> -------------------- ----- 18.16
>
> 1.15 below
>
> 0.21 left
>
>
> I couldn't find a good source for a parallel valve engine, but Lycoming
> shows that for a K series (300 HP) motor, oil temps should be between 165F
> and 220F, whatever the Celsius equivalent is.
>
>
> Hopefully that will get you started.
>
>
> Rob Wright
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Rob Kermanj
> Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 5:35 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Engine limts
>
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Rob Kermanj" <flysrv10@gmail.com>
>
>
> Good catch Robert!- I want the recommended D4A5 data.- I really appreciate
> it.
>
>
> Do not archive.
>
>
> On 5/21/06, Robert G. Wright <armywrights@adelphia.net> wrote:
>
> > --> RV10-List message posted by: "Robert G. Wright"
> <armywrights@adelphia.net>
>
> >
>
> > Before I go digging, want to make sure you want the A4D5, not the
>
> > recommended D4A5.
>
> >
>
> > Rob Wright
>
> >
>
> > -----Original Message-----
>
> > From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>
> > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf
> Of Rob Kermanj
>
> > Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 6:37 PM
>
> > To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>
> > Subject: RV10-List: Engine limts
>
> >
>
> > --> RV10-List message posted by: "Rob Kermanj" <flysrv10@gmail.com>
>
> >
>
> > I wonder if someone could send me the engine operating limits (RPM,
>
> > Oil Press, Temp, etc.) for for an IO540 A4D5?- Thanks.
>
> >
>
> > Do not archive
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
>
> -
>
> -
>
> -
>
>
________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________
Time: 04:11:46 AM PST US
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
building time that could be spent either flying or with the family
or both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10
is that you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many
maintenance hassles that can come up with a retract system that
will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason.
If someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building
a retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used
Bonanza, which would be an awesome plane
But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the ability to
do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Paul Walter wrote:
> In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to adapt
> a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure how far
> into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he should be
> able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any thoughts ?. As
> for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
>
> Paul Walter
________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________
Time: 04:36:54 AM PST US
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Retractable
From: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@avidyne.com>
If retractable gear is so great, how come all Cirrus airplanes and all
Columbias (no slouches in performance) are fixed gear?
TDT
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Tim Olson
Sent: Tue 5/23/2006 7:10 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
building time that could be spent either flying or with the family
or both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10
is that you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many
maintenance hassles that can come up with a retract system that
will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason.
If someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building
a retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used
Bonanza, which would be an awesome plane
But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the ability to
do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Paul Walter wrote:
> In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to
adapt
> a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure how
far
> into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he should be
> able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any thoughts ?. As
> for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
>
> Paul Walter
======================
=======
======================
=======
======================
=======
======================
=======
________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________
Time: 04:54:55 AM PST US
From: GRANSCOTT@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
In a message dated 5/23/06 7:14:06 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
Tim@MyRV10.com writes:
If someone wants a retract,
Tim,
If one wanted to do this in the US, I think one might want to touch base
with an insurance agent to get an idea how much a jury rigged undercarriage
would increase your insurance cost...bet it would come close to doubling or more
rate increase over your normal rate with fixed gear.
Certainly the Bo, Commander, Mooney are good choices in single fan retract
GA area but if one wants a retract kit rather than jury rig an RV, it seems to
make more sense to buy a retract experimental with some experience...Lance,
(Wheeler) Express or the Raven kit. The Raven while a home built is based on
a former production aircraft (Piper Comanche); so it has some similarity to
a production product, this may or may not make any difference in your rates,
though.
Patrick
do not archive
________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________
Time: 05:53:59 AM PST US
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007@cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: "David McNeill" <dlm46007@cox.net>
Having owned a Cardinal RG for 28 years and 2500 hours I agree with Tim.
Never landed gear up but did have several XCs home with the gear left down
so maintenance could be done at home. Retractable gear benefits are a wash
for the increased maintenance and insurance costs and my gear version was
the final engineering level for the aircraft. A far more beneficial (again
with tradeoffs) was the turbonormalization. Fortunately the 10 is so over
powered by FAR standards that it will not be needed.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@avidyne.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 4:34 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Retractable
If retractable gear is so great, how come all Cirrus airplanes and all
Columbias (no slouches in performance) are fixed gear?
TDT
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of Tim Olson
Sent: Tue 5/23/2006 7:10 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
building time that could be spent either flying or with the family
or both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10
is that you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many
maintenance hassles that can come up with a retract system that
will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason.
If someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building
a retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used
Bonanza, which would be an awesome plane
But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the ability to
do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Paul Walter wrote:
> In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to
adapt
> a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure how
far
> into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he should be
> able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any thoughts ?. As
> for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
>
> Paul Walter
========================================
________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________
Time: 06:11:34 AM PST US
From: "Indran Chelvanayagam" <ichelva@netspace.net.au>
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Retractable
Paul, do you have the website of the alleged Western Australian RV-10 RG
builder? I'm only aware of 5 kits (with one flying) in this state.
Indran Chelvanayagam
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Walter
Sent: Tuesday, 23 May 2006 3:22 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Retractable
________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________
Time: 06:40:17 AM PST US
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Yeah, I didn't even mention the insurance, but it's significant.
When the rates got jacked up about 6 years ago, I remember
retracts were an extreme amount higher than fixed gear.
My guess is you'd be facing at least $2000-3000/year more
in our market if it was retractable.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
GRANSCOTT@aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 5/23/06 7:14:06 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
> Tim@MyRV10.com writes:
>
> < FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" face=Arial
> color=#000000 size =2>If someone wants a retract,
>
> Tim,
>
> If one wanted to do this in the US, I think one might want to touch base
> with an insurance agent to get an idea how much a jury rigge d
> undercarriage would increase your insurance cost...bet it would come
> close t o doubling or more rate increase over your normal rate with
> fixed gear.
>
> Certainly the Bo, Commander, Mooney are good choices in single
> fan retract GA area but if one wants a retract kit rather than jury rig
> an RV, it seems to make more sense to buy a retract experimental with
> some experience...Lance, (Wheeler) Express or the Raven kit. The Raven
> while a home built is based on a former production aircraft (Piper
> Comanche) ; so it has some similarity to a production product, this may
> or may not make any difference in your rates, though.
>
> Patrick
>
> do not archive
________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________
Time: 06:56:12 AM PST US
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
I'm suspicious of this rumor. The Lancair IV landing gear is a huge box
structure that would not fit into the RV10 fuse (unless you built on an
additional drag producing box-like structure on the bottom of the fuse
to house it (what's the point?) The 360/Legend gear would require being
mounted into the wing structure with several ribs removed/reengineered.
Then there's the mater of the nose gear, where would you stow it? Not to
mention the significant change that this would produce in the locations
of the wheels and the rotation moments for landing/takeoff and the
almost total rework of the engine mount, exhaust, and induction. There
are better solutions for an RG than the -10.
Deems Davis # 406
Fuse
http://deemsrv10.com/
________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________
Time: 07:13:08 AM PST US
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Retractable
From: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@avidyne.com>
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
Taildragger retract . . .
TDT
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 9:53 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
I'm suspicious of this rumor. The Lancair IV landing gear is a huge box
structure that would not fit into the RV10 fuse (unless you built on an
additional drag producing box-like structure on the bottom of the fuse
to house it (what's the point?) The 360/Legend gear would require being
mounted into the wing structure with several ribs removed/reengineered.
Then there's the mater of the nose gear, where would you stow it? Not to
mention the significant change that this would produce in the locations
of the wheels and the rotation moments for landing/takeoff and the
almost total rework of the engine mount, exhaust, and induction. There
are better solutions for an RG than the -10.
Deems Davis # 406
Fuse
http://deemsrv10.com/
________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________
Time: 07:47:10 AM PST US
From: Chris W <3edcft6@cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Chris W <3edcft6@cox.net>
It's my understanding that in a 200 mph airplane, if you can do retracts
with out adding too much weight, the best you are going to see is 15
knots. From what I have heard, you are very lucky to get that. It
seems until you have a plane that files closer to 300 mph, retracts
aren't worth the trouble.
--
Chris W
KE5GIX
Gift Giving Made Easy
Get the gifts you want &
give the gifts they want
One stop wish list for any gift,
from anywhere, for any occasion!
http://thewishzone.com
________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________
Time: 09:05:52 AM PST US
From: "Indran Chelvanayagam" <ichelva@netspace.net.au>
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Indran Chelvanayagam" <ichelva@netspace.net.au>
Paul - any chance of pointing us to the website you mentioned? As far as I'm
aware, there are only 5 RV10 kits (one flying) in Western Australia. Would
be good to contact another builder, especially if he's making serious mods.
Might also be able to post some photos on the list!
Indran Chelvanayagam
Paul Walter wrote:
> In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to
> adapt a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure
> how far into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he
> should be able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any
> thoughts ?. As for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
>
> Paul Walter
________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________
Time: 09:29:08 AM PST US
Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
From: "Jon Reining" <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining" <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his Cherokee
180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the beach at Alfonsina's
to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is just south of San Felipe
on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt strip paralleling the beach, great
relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our weather briefing.
It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay Area, and we'd probably
have to file on the way home depending on how it looked. About 75-80 miles
out, we could see buildup over the hills, called up flight service and got a
weather briefing, didn't look all too bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so
we filed IFR, received our pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon
in IMC, no big deal, pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm
and encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then quickly
snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was probably 60 degrees
at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all over the place. This
lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us clearance to descend to 4000' and
maneuver to the north. My friend, CFI/CFII, did a great job and instinctively
reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was only +2C outside and raining but
no sign of icing), and did a great job getting us out of there. It was a really
tough spot, one that I hope to never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced
that the weather capabilities of his radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the capabilities
of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In other words, if ATC
can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is available to us so that
we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant on air traffic control's weather
radar? Would we still get weather in the cockpit if their's is out? Since
there was no lightning that I could see or hear, would a strike finder have
detected that? Short of an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were
planning on going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would
be nice to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like.
Can XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just showed up
(and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36025#36025
________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________
Time: 09:34:47 AM PST US
From: <jim@CombsFive.Com>
Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a gear handle
on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the lights indicate gear
position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend they are up (or down).
Jim Combs
Do Not Archive
========================================================
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time over the
life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and building time that could
be spent either flying or with the family or both? Not for me. Also, one
of the nicest things about the -10 is that you can own it and fly reasonably fast
without the many maintenance hassles that can come up with a retract system
that will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If someone wants
a retract, they should consider actually building a retractible kit that was
designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza, which would be an awesome plane.
But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the ability to do things that
make little sense for numerous reasons, but make sense for only a couple....and
yet he's still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________
Time: 10:07:37 AM PST US
Subject: RE: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
From: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@avidyne.com>
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the
audio system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and the
rush of disturbed air . . .
TDT
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
jim@combsfive.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a
gear handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the
lights indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend
they are up (or down).
Jim Combs
Do Not Archive
=======================================================
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
building time that could be spent either flying or with the family or
both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is that
you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many maintenance
hassles that can come up with a retract system that will only cost you
MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If
someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building a
retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza,
which would be an awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of
homebuilding? He has the ability to do things that make little sense
for numerous reasons, but make sense for only a couple....and yet he's
still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________
Time: 10:32:01 AM PST US
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
If you can add engine noises, it could be something you
sell to current non-flying builders. They they won't
wear out their lips making the engine noises themselves
when they sit in their half-built planes. Then,
add a small vibrator from an old reclining chair...
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Tim Dawson-Townsend wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
>
>
> That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the
> audio system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and the
> rush of disturbed air . . .
>
> TDT
> Do not archive
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> jim@combsfive.com
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
>
> Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a
> gear handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the
> lights indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend
> they are up (or down).
>
> Jim Combs
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> ======================================================
> From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> Date: 2006/05/23 Tue AM 07:10:59 EDT
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> Thoughts as requested...
> Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
> over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
> building time that could be spent either flying or with the family or
> both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is that
> you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many maintenance
> hassles that can come up with a retract system that will only cost you
> MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
> not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
>
> I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If
> someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building a
> retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza,
> which would be an awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of
> homebuilding? He has the ability to do things that make little sense
> for numerous reasons, but make sense for only a couple....and yet he's
> still fine to do it.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________
Time: 10:38:24 AM PST US
From: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
Subject: RE: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
Tim, could you also add an intermittent, random failure of one of the
indicator lights, just for yucks! Would appreciate it. I miss suspense of
seeing 3-green.
John J
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim
Dawson-Townsend
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 10:05 AM
Subject: RE: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend"
--> <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the audio
system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and the rush of
disturbed air . . .
TDT
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jim@combsfive.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a gear
handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the lights
indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend they are up
(or down).
Jim Combs
Do Not Archive
======================================================
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time over
the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and building time
that could be spent either flying or with the family or both? Not for me.
Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is that you can own it and fly
reasonably fast without the many maintenance hassles that can come up with a
retract system that will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along
the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If someone
wants a retract, they should consider actually building a retractible kit
that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza, which would be an
awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the
ability to do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________
Time: 10:49:45 AM PST US
From: pilotdds@aol.com
Subject: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders
Is anyone willing to comment on the master cylinders.It seems there should be
some sort of external return spring around the actuating shafts.I notice some
dragging when towing.
________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________
Time: 10:54:53 AM PST US
From: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
My oh my oh my! Thank you for sharing this and thank goodness you got down
and safely so. I, too, am ready to spend whatever big bucks is required for
at least XM weather and some form of traffic / terrain. Am going to be very
interested in this thread.
John J
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 9:28 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
--> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the beach at
Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is just south of
San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt strip paralleling the
beach, great relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our weather
briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay Area, and we'd
probably have to file on the way home depending on how it looked. About
75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills, called up flight
service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too bad, but we couldn't
make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our pop-up, and were headed in at
8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal, pretty easy sailing, when all of
a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and encountered severe turblance and very
near loss of control of the airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45
degrees to the right, then quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our
maximum bank angle was probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and
altitude were all over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC
gave us clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
CFI/CFII, did a !
great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was only
+2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job getting
us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to never be in
again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather capabilities of his
radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant on
air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in the
cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I could see or
hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of an on-board radar,
what are our options? Also, we were planning on going with the Chelton's
and I can definately see how that would be nice to know, even if its
synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can XM weather be displayed
on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36025#36025
________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________
Time: 11:00:36 AM PST US
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder@sausen.net>
Short of onboard radar the two main technologies I can think of to
avoid unidentified/unexpected weather are NEXRAD, through a service like
XM, and also/or a Stormscope. Remember that datalinked weather isn't
real time so it isn't always the best answer but it will give you good
trend and near real time weather. Stormscopes on the other hand will
show you current lightning which is almost always hand in hand with
severe convective activity.
I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS but
it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment to make
sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
--> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the
beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is
just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our
pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal,
pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and
encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then
quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was
probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all
over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us
clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
CFI/CFII, did a !
great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
capabilities of his radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I
could see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of
an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on
going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice
to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can
XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36025#36025
======================
=======
======================
=======
======================
=======
======================
=======
________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________
Time: 11:04:15 AM PST US
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Retractable
From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR@wernerco.com>
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR@wernerco.com>
But for the retract, you would have to have the bass box to simulate the
thump from the door going up and closing!
Dan
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 1:31 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
If you can add engine noises, it could be something you
sell to current non-flying builders. They they won't
wear out their lips making the engine noises themselves
when they sit in their half-built planes. Then,
add a small vibrator from an old reclining chair...
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Tim Dawson-Townsend wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend"
<Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
>
>
> That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the
> audio system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and
the
> rush of disturbed air . . .
>
> TDT
> Do not archive
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> jim@combsfive.com
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
>
> Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a
> gear handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the
> lights indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just
pretend
> they are up (or down).
>
> Jim Combs
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> =====================================================
> From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> Date: 2006/05/23 Tue AM 07:10:59 EDT
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> Thoughts as requested...
> Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
> over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
> building time that could be spent either flying or with the family or
> both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is
that
> you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many maintenance
> hassles that can come up with a retract system that will only cost you
> MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
> not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
>
> I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If
> someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building a
> retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza,
> which would be an awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of
> homebuilding? He has the ability to do things that make little sense
> for numerous reasons, but make sense for only a couple....and yet he's
> still fine to do it.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________
Time: 11:17:11 AM PST US
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence
From: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@avidyne.com>
Y'all didn't hear it from me, but look for a new lightning/convective
activity sensor better than the 1980's-technology WX-500 coming fairly
soon to a dealer near you . . .
TDT
40025
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder
(Michael Sausen)
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 2:00 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS but
it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment to make
sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
st-server@matronics.com <ailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com> ]
On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
--> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the
beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is
just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our
pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal,
pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and
encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then
quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was
probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all
over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us
clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
CFI/CFII, did a !
great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
capabilities of his radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I
could see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of
an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on
going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice
to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can
XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
<ttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025>
http://www.matronic ======== & Matronics
Email List ;
& --> <ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>
http://www.matronics.com/c ==============BR>
<ttp://www.matronics.com/contribution>
________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________
Time: 11:23:10 AM PST US
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
From: Dj Merrill <deej@deej.net>
--> RV10-List message posted by: Dj Merrill <deej@deej.net>
>
>
> In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
> capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel.
> In other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble,
> what is available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather
> dependant on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get
> weather
>
You may consider looking into ADS-B. It does not cover all of the
US yet, but
it will over the next several years. Up front equipment costs, but no
monthly or other
subscription fees for traffic and weather information. The equipment is
really expensive
right now, but I hope it comes down by the time I need to buy to install.
http://www.adsb.gov/
http://www.ads-b.com/
-Dj
________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________
Time: 11:27:07 AM PST US
From: "Albert Gardner" <ibspud@adelphia.net>
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Albert Gardner" <ibspud@adelphia.net>
Although I learned to fly in Idaho where there was weather as well as high
terrain now almost all my flying is in the Southwest except for occasional
trips North. A trip from Reno to Yuma last Wed. afternoon (trying to get
home before the Presidential TFR Thursday) had me dodging much weather. My
Anywhere Map with XM weather worked very well. You can select various
weather displays but Nexrad, TAFS, and winds aloft are very useful in
flight. One very nice feature of ControlVisions's Anywhere Map is that the
cost of monthly updates is much less than most others and it does a good job
of driving my Navaid. The display is small but I mounted it on the side
instead of on the panel. For about $2K it's more than adequate for VFR
flying.
Albert Gardner
40-422
Yuma, AZ
________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________
Time: 11:39:31 AM PST US
From: Mark Grieve <mark@macomb.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Mark Grieve <mark@macomb.com>
I helped Van attach the wings to his sailplane one day and observed a
gear light on the dash. I asked if the flight engineer was supposed to
report "One Green" during the landing checklist.
Tim Dawson-Townsend wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
>
>
> That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the
> audio system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and the
> rush of disturbed air . . .
>
> TDT
> Do not archive
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> jim@combsfive.com
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
>
> Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a
> gear handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the
> lights indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend
> they are up (or down).
>
> Jim Combs
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> ======================================================
> From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> Date: 2006/05/23 Tue AM 07:10:59 EDT
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> Thoughts as requested...
> Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
> over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
> building time that could be spent either flying or with the family or
> both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is that
> you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many maintenance
> hassles that can come up with a retract system that will only cost you
> MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
> not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
>
> I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If
> someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building a
> retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza,
> which would be an awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of
> homebuilding? He has the ability to do things that make little sense
> for numerous reasons, but make sense for only a couple....and yet he's
> still fine to do it.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________
Time: 11:44:37 AM PST US
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder@sausen.net>
(read in your best infomercial voice) And what would be the
approximate cost of such a wonderful new technology?
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
Recent RV-10 Build Activity
<http://www.mykitlog.com/display_project.php?project_id=22>
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim
Dawson-Townsend
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 1:17 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence
Y'all didn't hear it from me, but look for a new lightning/convective
activity sensor better than the 1980's-technology WX-500 coming fairly
soon to a dealer near you . . .
TDT
40025
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder
(Michael Sausen)
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 2:00 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
Short of onboard radar the two main technologies I can think of to avoid
unidentified/unexpected weather are NEXRAD, through a service like XM,
and also/or a Stormscope.? Remember that datalinked weather isn't real
time so it isn't always the best answer but it will give you good trend
and near real time weather.? Stormscopes on the other hand will show you
current lightning which is almost always hand in hand with severe
convective activity.
I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS but
it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment to make
sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
st-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
--> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the
beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is
just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our
pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal,
pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and
encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then
quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was
probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all
over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us
clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
CFI/CFII, did a !
great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
capabilities of his radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I
could see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of
an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on
going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice
to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can
XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
http://www.matronic ===nbsp; & nbsp; & Matronics Email
List ; & amp; --> http://www.matronics.com/c
=====R>
________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________
Time: 11:49:19 AM PST US
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
I flew with a Strikefinder in my B55 Baron's and they were VERY
effective in identifying thunderstorms, and much less expensive. I also
had onboard radar on one of them, and I preferred the Strikefinder data,
(The radar is sometimes dificult to interpret if you don't fly it
regularly (my case).
Deems Davis # 406
Fuse
http://deemsrv10.com/
RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
> Short of onboard radar the two main technologies I can think of to
> avoid unidentified/unexpected weather are NEXRAD, through a service
> like XM, and also/or a Stormscope. Remember that datalinked weather
> isn't real time so it isn't always the best answer but it will give
> you good trend and near real time weather. Stormscopes on the other
> hand will show you current lightning which is almost always hand in
> hand with severe convective activity.
>
> I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS
> but it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment
> to make sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
>
>
> Michael Sausen
> RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
> Do Not Archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
> st-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>]
> On Behalf Of Jon Reining
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
> --> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
>
> I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in
> his Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on
> the beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's
> is just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
> strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
>
> On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
> weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
> Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how
> it looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the
> hills, called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't
> look all too bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR,
> received our pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in
> IMC, no big deal, pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a
> thunderstorm and encountered severe turblance and very near loss of
> control of the airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees
> to the right, then quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our
> maximum bank angle was probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude
> and altitude were all over the place. This lasted for a full two
> minutes. ATC gave us clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to
> the north. My friend, CFI/CFII, did a !
> great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it
> was only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a
> great job getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one
> that I hope to never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced
> that the weather capabilities of his radar were down.
>
> In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
> capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel.
> In other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble,
> what is available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather
> dependant on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get
> weather in the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no
> lightning that I could see or hear, would a strike finder have
> detected that? Short of an on-board radar, what are our options?
> Also, we were planning on going with the Chelton's and I can
> definately see how that would be nice to know, even if its synthetic
> vision, what the ground looks like. Can XM weather be displayed on
> the Chelton?
>
> Jon Reining
> 40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
> showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025>
>
>
> *http://www.matronic ======================== & Matronics
> Email List ; & -->
> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://www.matronics.com/c
> =====================================
>
>
> *
>
>
> * <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>
________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________
Time: 12:09:55 PM PST US
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence
From: "Tim Dawson-Townsend" <Tdawson@avidyne.com>
Heh, heh. That's not my department . . . but I think it will be priced
relatively aggressively for market penetration . . .
TDT
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder
(Michael Sausen)
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 2:44 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence
From:
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
st-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
--> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the
beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is
just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our
pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal,
pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and
encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then
quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was
probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all
over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us
clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
CFI/CFII, did a !
great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
capabilities of his radar were down.
In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I
could see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of
an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on
going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice
to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can
XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
Jon Reining
40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
Read this topic online here:
http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
http://www.matronic =nbsp; & nbsp; & Matronics Email List ;
& amp; amp; --> http://www.matronics.com/c ==>
________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________
Time: 12:38:00 PM PST US
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Jon,
That's quite a story! Glad it all ended well for you.
You should feel comforted.... With the Chelton system,
you can currently get WSI, but I'm guessing a bit
later this year you'd be able to get XM. Both are
satellite based systems that have no ties to ATC.
WSI weather is actually what FSS uses themselves,
from what I've been told. With various packages,
you can have TFR's, lightning strikes, Nexrad,
and all the goodies you're looking for, and they are
very nicely used on the Chelton, because they'll
automatically overlay many functions right on your
main map page, or you can get a larger picture on a
zoom and pan-able page. So I think you'll be very
pleased.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Jon Reining wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
>
> I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in
> his Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on
> the beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's
> is just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500'
> dirt strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
>
> On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
> weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
> Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how
> it looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the
> hills, called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't
> look all too bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR,
> received our pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in
> IMC, no big deal, pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a
> thunderstorm and encountered severe turblance and very near loss of
> control of the airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees
> to the right, then quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our
> maximum bank angle was probably 60 degrees at one point. Our
> attitude and altitude were all over the place. This lasted for a
> full two minutes. ATC gave us clearance to descend to 4000' and
> maneuver to the north. My friend, CFI/CFII, did a ! great job and
> instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was only +2C
> outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
> getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope
> to never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the
> weather capabilities of his radar were down.
>
> In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
> capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel.
> In other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble,
> what is available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather
> dependant on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get
> weather in the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no
> lightning that I could see or hear, would a strike finder have
> detected that? Short of an on-board radar, what are our options?
> Also, we were planning on going with the Chelton's and I can
> definately see how that would be nice to know, even if its synthetic
> vision, what the ground looks like. Can XM weather be displayed on
> the Chelton?
>
> Jon Reining 40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings
> and fuse just showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36025#36025
>
>
________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________
Time: 12:40:33 PM PST US
From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
I forgot to mention.... Jon, if you're not happy enough with
just Nexrad and strikes shown by XM/WSI, the Chelton will
also integrate to the WX-500 stormscope, so you can have that
too, on it's own dedicated page.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
> Short of onboard radar the two main technologies I can think of to
> avoid unidentified/unexpected weather are NEXRAD, through a service like
> XM, and also/or a Stormscope. Remember that datalinked weather isn't
> real time so it isn't always the best answer but it will give you good
> trend and near real time weather. Stormscopes on the other hand will
> show you current lightning which is almost always hand in hand with
> severe convective activity.
>
> I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS but
> it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment to make
> sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
>
>
> Michael Sausen
> RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
> Do Not Archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
> st-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>]
> On Behalf Of Jon Reining
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
> --> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
>
> I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
> Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the
> beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is
> just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt
> strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
>
> On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
> weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay
> Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
> looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
> called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
> bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our
> pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal,
> pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and
> encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the
> airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then
> quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was
> probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all
> over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us
> clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend,
> CFI/CFII, did a !
> great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
> only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
> getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
> never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
> capabilities of his radar were down.
>
> In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
> capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
> other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
> available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
> on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
> the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I
> could see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of
> an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on
> going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice
> to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can
> XM weather be displayed on the Chelton?
>
> Jon Reining
> 40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
> showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025>
>
>
>
> *http://www.matronic ======================== & Matronics
> Email List ; & -->
> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://www.matronics.com/c
> =====================================
>
>
>
>
> *
>
>
>
> * <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>
________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________
Time: 12:47:09 PM PST US
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007@cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
--> RV10-List message posted by: "David McNeill" <dlm46007@cox.net>
Have 15 years using a Strikefinder and found them to be very helpful in
avoiding the bad stuff (turbulence and hail) Came through an area IMC at
5000 near Cross City Florida where there were no strikes and had a smooth
ride with moderate to very heavy rain. The airplane was leaking around the
doors. When I popped into blue sky I looked back and asked myself "Did I
come through that" a cliff of clouds with tops to FL400. At least in my book
the game is stay away from the strikes.
For the 10 I considered the Strikefinder but have delayed purchase and am
now experimenting with XM weather and Truemap software in my Glastar. I will
know more about using XM after the OSH trip and then perhaps can make an
informed decision on Strikefinder (cost $5000) or XM weather (monthly
charges forever).
----- Original Message -----
From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis@cox.net>
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:48 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <deemsdavis@cox.net>
>
> I flew with a Strikefinder in my B55 Baron's and they were VERY effective
> in identifying thunderstorms, and much less expensive. I also had onboard
> radar on one of them, and I preferred the Strikefinder data, (The radar is
> sometimes dificult to interpret if you don't fly it regularly (my case).
>
> Deems Davis # 406
> Fuse
> http://deemsrv10.com/
>
> RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
>
>> Short of onboard radar the two main technologies I can think of to
>> avoid unidentified/unexpected weather are NEXRAD, through a service like
>> XM, and also/or a Stormscope. Remember that datalinked weather isn't
>> real time so it isn't always the best answer but it will give you good
>> trend and near real time weather. Stormscopes on the other hand will
>> show you current lightning which is almost always hand in hand with
>> severe convective activity.
>>
>> I have considered adding a wx-500 to whatever I choose for an EFIS but
>> it really needs to be installed by someone with proper equipment to make
>> sure they don't pickup interference, or worse nothing at all.
>>
>>
>> Michael Sausen
>> RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
>> Do Not Archive
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
>> st-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>] On
>> Behalf Of Jon Reining
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:28 AM
>> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
>>
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Jon Reining"
>> --> <jonathan.w.reining@wellsfargo.com>
>>
>> I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his
>> Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the beach
>> at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is just south
>> of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt strip
>> paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot.
>>
>> On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our
>> weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay Area,
>> and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it
>> looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills,
>> called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too
>> bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our pop-up,
>> and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal, pretty
>> easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and encountered
>> severe turblance and very near loss of control of the airplane. We would
>> be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then quickly snapped to
>> 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was probably 60 degrees at
>> one point. Our attitude and altitude were all over the place. This
>> lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us clearance to descend to 4000'
>> and maneuver to the north. My friend, CFI/CFII, did a !
>> great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was
>> only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job
>> getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to
>> never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather
>> capabilities of his radar were down.
>> In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the
>> capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In
>> other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is
>> available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant
>> on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in
>> the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I could
>> see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of an
>> on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on going
>> with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice to
>> know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can XM
>> weather be displayed on the Chelton?
>>
>> Jon Reining
>> 40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just
>> showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http:/ /forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025
>> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p6025#36025>
>>
>>
>>
>> *http://www.matronic ======================== & Matronics
>> Email List ; & -->
>> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://www.matronics.com/c
>> ====================================
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *
>>
>>
>>
>> * <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>*
>>
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> http://wiki.matronics.com
>
>
>
________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________
Time: 01:00:27 PM PST US
From: Eric Panning <ericmpmail-rv10@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Weather capabilities and severe turblance - pilot account
--> RV10-List message posted by: Eric Panning <ericmpmail-rv10@yahoo.com>
The pilot also had a write up on the Cherokee Chat
board:
"This weekend I flew my plane with a couple of friends
down to Alfonsina's for a batchelor party weekend. We
left OAK Thursday night, overnighted in Calexico and
made it to Alfonsina's by noon on Friday. We spent
that afternoon, and all day Saturday fishing, playing
in the beautiful warm water, eating great food and
consuming mass quantities of ice cold beer.
We were in the air at 8 AM this morning and screamed
back up to the border with the help of a 15-20 Kt
tailwind. After breakfast and a weather brief at
Calexico, we launched into uncertain conditions over
Southern California, the High Desert and the Central
Valley. A late season storm was approaching from the
southwest, very moist and unstable, with winds aloft
from the south at 25-50 Kts. Things were actually
quite doable over Southern California, and I was
enjoying the 30 Kt push towards home. We were able to
punch through a line of showers NW of Bakersfield
while maintaining VFR, but there was another band of
precip that was plopped over the last 100 miles of the
route. FSS advised me that there were multiple layers
from 2000 to FL200, light scattered rain showers and
the freezing level was around 9000 ft. Pilot reports
weren't indicating anything too scary, and most of the
reports were light rime icing at 12000 Ft.
Since I didn't want to scud-run into OAK, I filed in
the air and got direct Panoche VOR, direct OAK at
8000. Easy, straightworward, straight-in to the ILS
for 27R. We went into the goo about 25-30 miles south
of Panoche, and I was enjoying the challenge of
hand-flying my plane in real IFR, with the temps about
2 C. Things were going along just fine until we were
about 20 miles northwest of Panoche on V-301, when it
was as if somebody had turned on a blender and we were
in it! The instrument panel was an incomprehensible
blur. It was the most severe turbulence I've ever been
in, and we were in solid IMC. We must have flown into
an imbedded thunderstorm, and Center didn't have it on
their radar. I could barely control the plane. I
immediately informed Center of the situation and they
gave me a turn to the North and a descent to 6000 ft.
I fought with the plane to maintain control, just to
keep the wings somewhere near level and the airspeed
in the green while descending towards the Central
Valley and lower terrain. I kept telling myself not to
give up... Just fly the plane. It took me about 2 or 3
minutes to get down to 6000, but we were still in IMC,
though the turbulence had eased a bit. We were cleared
to 4000, and began to descend again. At 5500 I was
head down, on the gages when by friend Jon called
ground in sight, and at 4900 we were completely clear
of the base of a very angry-looking black cloud mass.
I told Center we were clear and he immediately issued
an Airmet for severe turbulence in the area, and began
deviating 3 other aircraft that were in-trail around
the area I encountered the turbulence. At that point I
heard him mention something about their weather radar
capability being INOP at the time... So I guess that
made me the canary in the coal mine.
Anyway, we made it into OAK with little fuss after
dodging a couple of showers near Livermore. 3 hours
block time CXL to OAK with a little excitement thrown
in for good measure.
Moral of story? No good deed goes unpunished? S#!t
happens? How about "Do not give up on the airplane!"?
Truly, one of the thoughts that went through my mind
as I was struggling to maintain control of the the
plane was "My wife is gonna kill me if I die now and
ruin our Italian vacation plans!"
I'm very happy to be alive, and to be able to write
this down for your perusal. Stay safe."
The Cherokee Board also discussed the XM weather and
the 396. What wasn't clear was if weather was down
locally for ATC or west coast. I use avwx.net on a
blackberry for ground planning and it's Nexrad service
was down on Sunday in the NW. NWS radar was still up
and running (can also download to blackberry). Lot's
of reasons not to rely on ATC for weather - see
www.avweb.com and ATC columns.
Eric
40150
Working on center section of fuselage
________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________
Time: 01:36:32 PM PST US
From: linn Walters <pitts_pilot@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders
pilotdds@aol.com wrote:
> Is anyone willing to comment on the master cylinders.It seems there
> should be some sort of external return spring around the actuating
> shafts.I notice some dragging when towing.
All disc brakes drag .... just some more than others. As for the
spring, I'd recommend it. It'll surely take off some pressure, and
it'll make bleeding the brakes a lot easier. Doesn't take much piston
travel to shur off the valve.
Linn just my two pennies.
do not archive
________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________
Time: 02:00:02 PM PST US
From: "Chris , Susie Darcy" <VHMUM@bigpond.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders
Not sure what you mean dragging when towing?? There are no external
springs. Check your nut are not to tight on pedal
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: pilotdds@aol.com
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 3:48 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders
Is anyone willing to comment on the master cylinders.It seems there
should be some sort of external return spring around the actuating
shafts.I notice some dragging when towing.
________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________
Time: 02:10:17 PM PST US
From: <jim@CombsFive.Com>
Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
Just think you wouldn't be spending $30+ per hour for fuel either just to land
where you took off from (Most of the time!)
Jim C
Do nOT archive.
..
________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________
Time: 02:11:31 PM PST US
From: "Chris , Susie Darcy" <VHMUM@bigpond.com>
Subject: RV10-List: test
TEST
do not archive
________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________
Time: 02:30:59 PM PST US
From: LIKE2LOOP@aol.com
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders
In a message dated 5/23/2006 1:51:35 PM Eastern Standard Time,
pilotdds@aol.com writes:
It seems there should be some sort of external return spring around the
actuating shafts.I notice some dragging when towing.
The brakes on my C-170 are the same, they don't spring open, and will
touch ever so slightly against the disks..... but in the air, the wheels are not
turning! As the pads wear, the contact often lightens up when the brakes are
NOT applied. Not a major issue.
Steve
Stephen G. Blank,DDS
RV-10 #40499 Finishing the HS
Cessna 170b Flyer
Port St Lucie, FL
772-475-5556 cell
________________________________ Message 39 ____________________________________
Time: 03:01:33 PM PST US
From: Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen <kellym@aviating.com>
Or, you could just buy a 20 yr old Mooney 201, miss all the great
building experience, choice of avionics experience, spend about the
same money, go the same speed, on 2-4gph less(have a 4 cyl engine with
cheaper overhaul) and have real operating gear....oh, and you lose one
cabin door, need ~2000 ft runways instead of 1000 ft and can't climb
as fast..........choices, choices.
Quoting John Jessen <jjessen@rcn.com>:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "John Jessen" <jjessen@rcn.com>
>
> Tim, could you also add an intermittent, random failure of one of the
> indicator lights, just for yucks! Would appreciate it. I miss suspense of
> seeing 3-green.
>
> John J
>
> do not archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim
> Dawson-Townsend
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 10:05 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Tim Dawson-Townsend"
> --> <Tdawson@Avidyne.com>
>
>
> That's brilliant! Maybe I'll put in a noise generator wired into the audio
> system, so when the wheels go down you hear the gear motor and the rush of
> disturbed air . . .
>
> TDT
> Do not archive
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jim@combsfive.com
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 12:34 PM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
>
> Van was asked the same question at Oshkosh. His comment was to put a gear
> handle on the panel with some lights. Move the handle and the lights
> indicate gear position. You can't see them anyway, just pretend they are up
> (or down).
>
> Jim Combs
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> =====================================================
> From: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
> Date: 2006/05/23 Tue AM 07:10:59 EDT
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> Thoughts as requested...
> Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time over
> the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and building time
> that could be spent either flying or with the family or both? Not for me.
> Also, one of the nicest things about the -10 is that you can own it and fly
> reasonably fast without the many maintenance hassles that can come up with a
> retract system that will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along
> the way...
> not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
>
> I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason. If someone
> wants a retract, they should consider actually building a retractible kit
> that was designed for it, or buying a used Bonanza, which would be an
> awesome plane. But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the
> ability to do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
> sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
________________________________ Message 40 ____________________________________
Time: 06:24:08 PM PST US
From: "Jack Sargeant" <k5wiv@amsat.org>
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders
All disc brakes depend on the minute wobble in the rotors to push the pucks
back when released. I've never seen any with return springs, and I don't
think that springs on the master cylinders would help either.
Jack & Cecilia Sargeant
1127 Patricia St.
Wichita, KS 67208-2642
316/682-5268
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of LIKE2LOOP@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 4:30 PM
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders
In a message dated 5/23/2006 1:51:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, pilotdds
@aol.com writes:
The brakes on my C-170 are the same, they don' t spring open, and
will touch ever so slightly against the disks..... but in the air, the
wheels are not turning! As the pads wear, the contact of ten lightens up
when the brakes are NOT applied. Not a major issue.
Steve
Stephen G. Blank,DDS
RV-10 #40499 &n bsp; Finishing the HS
Cessna 170b Flyer
Port St Lucie, FL
772-475-5556 cell
Message 16
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IC0gVGhlIFJWMTAtTGlzdCBFbWFpbCBGb3J1bSAtIF8tPSBVc2UgdGhlIE1hdHJvbmljcyBMaXN0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Message 17
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|
| Subject: | Re: Mangled messages? |
--> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
Yep, I see them too, not consistantly, but often enough.
Jim C
Do not archive
==========================================================
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder@sausen.net>
Subject: RV10-List: Mangled messages?
Anyone else seeing problems with HTML emails coming from the Matronics
list remailer? The HTML based list emails I have been getting have
malformed URL links, blank emails, and missing sentences. It's all
normal when you look at the forum site, but they are messed up in email.
This is only happening to HTML emails. Sent samples to Matt yesterday
but haven't heard anything, just want to know if other people are seeing
this also. An example is the link below that is missing the "h" and has
an extra quote at the end.
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Condrey, Bob
(US SSA)
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 8:35 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar
Bogert has one specifically made for the RV-10 that seems to work fine.
For some reason Spruce doesn't list it though
http://www.bogert-av.com/ bogi-bars.php
<ttp://www.bogert-av.com/bogi-bars.php">
model #4-RV10; $84
Bob #40105
________________________________
My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca
n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing
mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa
and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce.
Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that works?
The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo
rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again...
-Jim McGrew
40134
==========================================================
Message 18
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|
| Subject: | Re: Mangled messages? |
--> RV10-List message posted by: James Hein <n8vim@arrl.net>
They've been fine for myself, using Mozilla 1.7.13
-Jim
RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
> Anyone else seeing problems with HTML emails coming from the Matronics
> list remailer? The HTML based list emails I have been getting have
> malformed URL links, blank emails, and missing sentences. It's all
> normal when you look at the forum site, but they are messed up in
> email. This is only happening to HTML emails. Sent samples to Matt
> yesterday but haven't heard anything, just want to know if other
> people are seeing this also. An example is the link below that is
> missing the "h" and has an extra quote at the end.
>
>
> Michael Sausen
>
> RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
>
> Do Not Archive
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
> st-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>]
> On Behalf Of Condrey, Bob (US SSA)
> Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 8:35 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar
>
>
> Bogert has one specifically made for the RV-10 that seems to work
> fine. For some reason Spruce doesnt list it though
>
>
> http://www.bogert-av.com/ bogi-bars.php
> <ttp://www.bogert-av.com/bogi-bars.php">
>
>
> model #4-RV10; $84
>
>
> Bob #40105
>
> ________________________________
>
> My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone
> ca n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only
> thing mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South
> Africa and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and
> Aircraft Spruce. Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that
> works?
>
>
> The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT
> wo rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again...
>
>
> -Jim McGrew
>
> 40134
>
>
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | Mangled messages? |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey@baesystems.com>
Yes, I've been seeing the problems. Anybody sent an email to Matt to
find out if he "enhanced" the system?
Bob
Do Not Archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Hein
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 11:31 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Mangled messages?
--> RV10-List message posted by: James Hein <n8vim@arrl.net>
They've been fine for myself, using Mozilla 1.7.13
-Jim
RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
> Anyone else seeing problems with HTML emails coming from the Matronics
> list remailer? The HTML based list emails I have been getting have
> malformed URL links, blank emails, and missing sentences. It's all
> normal when you look at the forum site, but they are messed up in
> email. This is only happening to HTML emails. Sent samples to Matt
> yesterday but haven't heard anything, just want to know if other
> people are seeing this also. An example is the link below that is
> missing the "h" and has an extra quote at the end.
>
>
> Michael Sausen
>
> RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
>
> Do Not Archive
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
> st-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>]
> On Behalf Of Condrey, Bob (US SSA)
> Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 8:35 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar
>
>
> Bogert has one specifically made for the RV-10 that seems to work
> fine. For some reason Spruce doesn't list it though
>
>
> http://www.bogert-av.com/ bogi-bars.php
> <ttp://www.bogert-av.com/bogi-bars.php">
>
>
> model #4-RV10; $84
>
>
> Bob #40105
>
> ________________________________
>
> My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone
> ca n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only
> thing mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South
> Africa and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and
> Aircraft Spruce. Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that
> works?
>
>
> The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT
> wo rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again...
>
>
> -Jim McGrew
>
> 40134
>
>
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | Mangled messages? |
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinal.com>
I've seen them on this list, as well as Matronics' Pietenpol List
Jack Phillips
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
jim@CombsFive.Com
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 12:28 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Mangled messages?
--> RV10-List message posted by: <jim@combsfive.com>
Yep, I see them too, not consistantly, but often enough.
Jim C
Do not archive
=========================================================
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder@sausen.net>
Subject: RV10-List: Mangled messages?
Anyone else seeing problems with HTML emails coming from the Matronics
list remailer? The HTML based list emails I have been getting have
malformed URL links, blank emails, and missing sentences. It's all
normal when you look at the forum site, but they are messed up in email.
This is only happening to HTML emails. Sent samples to Matt yesterday
but haven't heard anything, just want to know if other people are seeing
this also. An example is the link below that is missing the "h" and has
an extra quote at the end.
Michael Sausen
RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
Do Not Archive
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Condrey, Bob
(US SSA)
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 8:35 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar
Bogert has one specifically made for the RV-10 that seems to work fine.
For some reason Spruce doesn't list it though
http://www.bogert-av.com/ bogi-bars.php
<ttp://www.bogert-av.com/bogi-bars.php">
model #4-RV10; $84
Bob #40105
________________________________
My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca
n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing
mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa
and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce.
Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that works?
The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo
rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again...
-Jim McGrew
40134
=========================================================
Cardinal Health -- Working together. For life. (sm)
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged, proprietary,
or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error,
please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use
of the email by you is prohibited.
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - Norsk - Portuguese - Svenska: www.cardinalhealth.com/legal/email
Message 21
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|
| Subject: | Mangled messages? |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Hi RV10'ers,
I'm looking into this weird problem. I haven't really made any "enhancements"
in recent history, so I'm not sure what's causing it.
Has anyone noticed specifically if the problem occurs when the message is *originated*
from the Forums BBS or from an Email directly to the List?
Matt Dralle
List Admin
At 09:36 AM 5/24/2006 Wednesday, you wrote:
>--> RV10-List message posted by: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey@baesystems.com>
>
>Yes, I've been seeing the problems. Anybody sent an email to Matt to
>find out if he "enhanced" the system?
>
>Bob
>
>Do Not Archive
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Hein
>Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 11:31 AM
>To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV10-List: Mangled messages?
>
>--> RV10-List message posted by: James Hein <n8vim@arrl.net>
>
>
>They've been fine for myself, using Mozilla 1.7.13
>
>-Jim
>
>RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
>
>> Anyone else seeing problems with HTML emails coming from the Matronics
>
>> list remailer? The HTML based list emails I have been getting have
>> malformed URL links, blank emails, and missing sentences. It's all
>> normal when you look at the forum site, but they are messed up in
>> email. This is only happening to HTML emails. Sent samples to Matt
>> yesterday but haven't heard anything, just want to know if other
>> people are seeing this also. An example is the link below that is
>> missing the "h" and has an extra quote at the end.
>>
>>
>> Michael Sausen
>>
>> RV-10 #352 Working on Fuselage
>>
>> Do Not Archive
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-li
>> st-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>]
>
>> On Behalf Of Condrey, Bob (US SSA)
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 8:35 AM
>> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: RE: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar
>>
>>
>>
>> Bogert has one specifically made for the RV-10 that seems to work
>> fine. For some reason Spruce doesn't list it though
>>
>>
>>
>> http://www.bogert-av.com/ bogi-bars.php
>> <ttp://www.bogert-av.com/bogi-bars.php">
>>
>>
>>
>> model #4-RV10; $84
>>
>>
>>
>> Bob #40105
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone
>> ca n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only
>> thing mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South
>> Africa and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and
>> Aircraft Spruce. Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that
>> works?
>>
>>
>>
>> The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT
>> wo rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again...
>>
>>
>>
>> -Jim McGrew
>>
>> 40134
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | Mangled messages? |
--> RV10-List message posted by: Rick <ricksked@earthlink.net>
One other builder contacted me direct and said my messages were not coming to him
in HTML, he recieves the messages in digest form and not direct email. He told
me to use plain text....well....I is dumb in that department so if there is
a way for me to do plain text...let me know
Rick S.
40185
Fuse
do not archive
Message 23
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|
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Jesse Saint" <jesse@itecusa.org>
Amen to this! I heard of an RV-6 that was made retractable. It weighted a
lot more, so had less usefull load, cost a TON more to make, took a LOT
longer, and added as much a 6kts to cruise. Go ahead, but don't expect a
lot to follow. Van's has a great design. Oh yeah, and expect the insurance
to be a LOT higher.
Do not archive.
Jesse Saint
I-TEC, Inc.
jesse@itecusa.org
www.itecusa.org
352-465-4545
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 6:11 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
Thoughts as requested...
Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
building time that could be spent either flying or with the family
or both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10
is that you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many
maintenance hassles that can come up with a retract system that
will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason.
If someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building
a retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used
Bonanza, which would be an awesome plane
But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the ability to
do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Paul Walter wrote:
> In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to adapt
> a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure how far
> into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he should be
> able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any thoughts ?. As
> for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
>
> Paul Walter
--
--
Message 24
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|
--> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
I just finished an article in Flying Magazine the other day.
They had some guy who is related to insuring cessnas or
something who stated that the cost of a 182RG versus
an ordinary 182 was something like double the insurance
cost, or maybe it was 4 times the cost. The 182 is
*kind of* comparable to the RV-10. Imagine $6900 insurance
on your new RV-10. Or, if it was 4 times.....$13,800.
Wish I could remember, but since it was about a Cessna
I didn't pay as much attention.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
do not archive
Jesse Saint wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Jesse Saint" <jesse@itecusa.org>
>
> Amen to this! I heard of an RV-6 that was made retractable. It weighted a
> lot more, so had less usefull load, cost a TON more to make, took a LOT
> longer, and added as much a 6kts to cruise. Go ahead, but don't expect a
> lot to follow. Van's has a great design. Oh yeah, and expect the insurance
> to be a LOT higher.
>
> Do not archive.
>
> Jesse Saint
> I-TEC, Inc.
> jesse@itecusa.org
> www.itecusa.org
> 352-465-4545
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 6:11 AM
> To: rv10-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
>
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim@MyRV10.com>
>
> Thoughts as requested...
> Trade a couple of kts of speed which may save you a few hours of time
> over the life of the airplane, for many many hours of design and
> building time that could be spent either flying or with the family
> or both? Not for me. Also, one of the nicest things about the -10
> is that you can own it and fly reasonably fast without the many
> maintenance hassles that can come up with a retract system that
> will only cost you MORE money, and MORE headaches along the way...
> not to mention the occasional possible ger-up landing.
>
> I guess I'm thinking the RV-10 was built as it is for a reason.
> If someone wants a retract, they should consider actually building
> a retractible kit that was designed for it, or buying a used
> Bonanza, which would be an awesome plane
>
> But, isn't that the beauty of homebuilding? He has the ability to
> do things that make little sense for numerous reasons, but make
> sense for only a couple....and yet he's still fine to do it.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> do not archive
>
>
> Paul Walter wrote:
>> In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to adapt
>> a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure how far
>> into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he should be
>> able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any thoughts ?. As
>> for me I'll just keep working on the empenage.
>>
>> Paul Walter
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 25
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|
My neighbor just insured his Cessna 210 with retracts - - $2,400 a year for
$100,000 Hull
He has 800 hours and VFR only
Rob Hickman
Message 26
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--> RV10-List message posted by: "Bruce Case" <pioneer@choiceonemail.com>
I fly both an Archer and Piper Arrow. Annual insurance on the Archer is
$1200, on the Arrow it is $2000.
Bruce Case #40446
Message 27
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|
| Subject: | Re: Horizontal Stabilizer Riveting |
In a message dated 5/24/06 10:02:58 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
pioneer@choiceonemail.com writes:
Has anyone done anything additional before putting in the rivets on the
leading edge ribs?
i held the skins together at the trailing edge with rubber tipped
spring clamps a foot or two away from where i was rivetting. This kept them from
bending wide open and kept the skin in close contact to the tip ribs, be
careful to not crease the metal with hard clamps. I need to rivet the aft spar
to
place and my HS is done!
Steve
Stephen Blank RV-10 Builder #40499 / C-170B flyer
766 SE River Lane
Port St. Lucie, FL 34983
772-475-5556 cell
Message 28
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|
| Subject: | Re: N519RV (40250) just received it's airworthiness today. |
Congrats!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
----- Original Message -----
From: Rob Kermanj<mailto:flysrv10@gmail.com>
To: rv10-list@matronics.com<mailto:rv10-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 2:06 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: N519RV (40250) just received it's
airworthiness today.
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Rob Kermanj"
<flysrv10@gmail.com<mailto:flysrv10@gmail.com>>
Good luck and be careful!
Do not archive
On 5/22/06, Doerr, Ray R [NTK]
<Ray.R.Doerr@sprint.com<mailto:Ray.R.Doerr@sprint.com>> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> N519RV (40250) just received it's airworthiness today
from
> Chuck Morris (DAR). I have a IO-540-D4A5 that was rebuilt by
America's
> Aircraft Engines with the Silver Hawk EX fuel injection. My engine
data
> plate was replace with one from America's Aircraft Engine which says
> Experimental IV, but I still manage to get a 25 hour fly off with
the
> Hartzell blended airfoil prop. The only thing the DAR found was
that when
> the rudder cables are left slack, they tend to rest on the top
surface of
> the 2nd last bulkhead ( the one in which the cables run in the
center of),
> so he suggested that I put a split hose over the top of the bulkhead
so when
> the cables won't rub against the bulkhead. First flight is schedule
for
> Friday May 26th at K34 around 04:00pm.
>
>
>
> Thank You
> Ray Doerr
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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igator?RV10-List>
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Message 29
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| Subject: | avionics panel offer |
For those still thinking about a panel, check this out. I bought the
overhead console Tony showed down at Sun n Fun, and he is making an offer for any
-10
builder. Just wanted to pass this along to the crowd.
grumpy
Tony Sustare
Accuracy Avionics
I realize you've made plans for your panel, but if you know of anyone getting
close please let them know I'm ready to work a deal for anyone willing to
have their panel displayed at Oshkosh. I'd rather build a panel for a customer
than to build one to disassemble! I'll make it worth his while.
Phone: 541-350-2168
Message 30
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This is an interesting thread, but there may be one flaw in the
assumptions.....namely that you could get insurance!
John
#40262
----- Original Message -----
From: Bruce Case
To: rv10-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 5:25 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable
--> RV10-List message posted by: "Bruce Case"
<pioneer@choiceonemail.com>
I fly both an Archer and Piper Arrow. Annual insurance on the Archer
is
$1200, on the Arrow it is $2000.
Bruce Case #40446
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