Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 10:49 AM - Re: Re: XDP4000X-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 02/01/05 (Roland M)
2. 10:54 AM - Re: C90's Digital output really analog at heart? (Roland M)
3. 11:04 AM - Re: 210EQ D/A info, link to... (Roland M)
4. 11:07 AM - Re: Re: XDP4000X-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 02/01/05 (Roland M)
5. 11:12 AM - Re: XDP-210EQ schematics (Roland M)
6. 11:30 AM - Re: Various hackery (XDP-210EQ) (Roland M)
7. 11:44 AM - Re: unilink (Roland M)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: XDP4000X-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 02/01/05 |
--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: "Roland M" <mdx400@hotmail.com>
>--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: Ethan <telmnstr@757.org>
>
>
> > the DAC on the 4k is wayyyyyy better than the 210.
>
>Are they pin compatible with each other?
>
Pin compatible? Meaning can you swap out an 210EQ for a 4k? Yes. Any unit
that can control the 210EQ (any UniLink master that has "DSP Control"
essentially) can also control the 4000x. There are some exceptions but that
would mainly pertain to the very early UniLink masters which were designed
to go with the U50D only. (For instance my MDX-400, if I were using it as a
master with it's pre-amp box cannot properly control the 210EQ and it would
follow that it can't control the 4000X, but it can control the U50D
properly).
Roland M.
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | C90's Digital output really analog at heart? |
--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: "Roland M" <mdx400@hotmail.com>
>From: Ethan <telmnstr@757.org>
>Reply-To: xdp4000x-list@matronics.com
>To: xdp4000x-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RE: XDP4000X-List: C90's Digital output really analog at heart?
>Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:01:59 -0500 (EST)
>
>--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: Ethan <telmnstr@757.org>
>
>
> > Really? The DAC's in the C90 are better than the 4000x? That's a
>revelation
> > ... not that I even went to that extent for my set up.
>
>I just ran across this while looking for info on the serial port on the
>XDP-210EQ:
>
>U50D - Has a 1-bit DAC
>210EQ - Has tri 20-bit burr brown DACs
>4000x - Has quad 24-bit Crystal DACs
>C910 - Has dual 20-bit burr brown DACs
>C90 - Has dual 20-Bit burr brown DACs
>
>I think the top one is sarcasm?
>
Some of the info rhat has floated around the internet about the D/As in this
unit are incorrect. I believe the main D/As in the U50D were 18-bit and
incorporated something called SCORE to achieve the DSP soundfields (SCORE
stood for Subliminal COREellation, IIRC).
The 210EQ does NOT have 20-bit Burr-Brown D/As. I did research on the
actual chips inside before and posted what they were--if you look in the
list archives you should find my post. It uses two, 20-bit (I think it was
20-bit) AK D/As (AK is a Japanese company I can't remember what AK stood for
but it is in my post about it from before). These two D/As run the Front
and Rear outputs, one per L/R pair.
The third D/A was a Texas Instruments I think, can't remember 100% but again
the CORRECT info is in that post I made, and it is 16-bit. This D/A is used
for the Subwoofer outputs.
The AK D/As use Delta-Sigma modulation, the TI one does not.
Roland M.
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | 210EQ D/A info, link to... |
--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: "Roland M" <mdx400@hotmail.com>
>--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: "Roland M" <mdx400@hotmail.com>
> >
> >--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: Ethan <telmnstr@757.org>
> >
> >
> >I just ran across this while looking for info on the serial port on the
> >XDP-210EQ:
> >
> >210EQ - Has tri 20-bit burr brown DACs
> >
>
>The 210EQ does NOT have 20-bit Burr-Brown D/As. I did research on the
>actual chips inside before and posted what they were--if you look in the
>list archives you should find my post. Roland M.
>
>
Here is the post regarding the CORRECT information for the D/A setup in the
210EQ:
http://www.matronics.com/searching/getmsg_script.cgi?INDEX=3219961?KEYS=210eq?LISTNAME=XDP4000X?HITNUMBER=25?SERIAL=1055363493?SHOWBUTTONS=YES
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: XDP4000X-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 02/01/05 |
--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: "Roland M" <mdx400@hotmail.com>
>--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: "Leo G. Divinagracia III"
><ldivinag@csuhayward.edu>
>
>
>speaking of which, if anyone has a spare XR-C900 head unit, i'll gladly
>take it off your hand.
>
>heck, i'll take a working faceplate off the C900 if you have it.
>
>been ebaying and i missed out on 3 diff ones... GRRRRRRRR
>
Yep I still got mine, its in the closet at home, even have the manuals for
it still too. Excellent condition too. Also have an XR-C9100 that is in
very good condition. (The C9100 doesn't have the copper shielded chassis or
LA tape heads the C900 had but it does have the newer design (that of the
late 90's with the swing shuttle and the source button in the middle of the
rotary encoder); and it has CD-Text support.)
Roland M.
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | XDP-210EQ schematics |
--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: "Roland M" <mdx400@hotmail.com>
>--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: Ethan <telmnstr@757.org>
>
>Also, if anyone has the PDF schematics for this unit, I'd love to see
>them.
>
>I was thinking I ran across them somewhere but didn't save them.
>
>For those interested, here is inside shots of the unit:
>
>http://users.757.org/~ethan/pics/geek/incoming/xdp210eq/
>
>What... is... the EXTRA IO PORT FOR!!!
I've tried to find out if anything useful can come of the "EXTRA I/O" port
before, but it appears there is nothing useful at all... It is for
servicing the unit but the service manual for the 210EQ doesn't even
describe it any further either. The test equipment used to service the unit
must come with its own "secret" documentation only available to Sony
techs/repair facilities.
I think all it does is allow control and tests to be run on the unit without
having a HU. I could be wrong about that, but I think that is all it does.
Even if you could gain access to it, I doubt there is much you can do with
it.
Roland M.
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Various hackery (XDP-210EQ) |
--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: "Roland M" <mdx400@hotmail.com>
>--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: Ethan <telmnstr@757.org>
>
>Hello all.
>
>I have a XDP-210EQ, and am using it with an analog changer. The analog
>Sony changer is too loud, and on loudly mastered CDs the XDP-210EQ makes
>click noises as the channel peaks out. Anyone else experience this?
>
Yep I've noticed that from my CDX-T60 analog changer on some peaks on some
discs. I'm going to (eventually, one day) get a pair of analog RCA
attenuators from Parts Express. They sell them in various dB increments for
fairly low cost. I'm thinking the 1dB ones will do fine as 3dB might be too
much? Anyhow I think a pair of those will cure the problem. For me, what
I've always done is simply stick to my digital changer (CDX-828) for certain
discs where I know the problem will occur. Also in the HU (CDX-7850) it
doesn't seem to happen either, despite the fact that it uses analog output
as well. The signal from the T60 is just a little "hot" I guess.
>Next up. I tried to hook a DVD player into the optical input, just to see
>what would happen. It doesn't seem to go digital unlss the unilink device
>tells the EQ that it's digital.
>
Right, exactly. Every UniLink slave device has an "UniLink Audio" setting
in the code it transmits to/from the Master. On digital changers there is a
switch which allows the unit to output digital and ALSO sets this firmware
"switch" to tell the Master and the DSP that it is in "DIGITAL OUTPUT" mode.
Same goes for the HU, except when you switch to radio from a unit
outputting digital (like the C900 or C90) then it tells the XDP that it is
in ANALOG out mode again.
All analog-only changers and analog-only HUs have their firmware code
permanently set to "ANALOG OUTPUT" mode which means whenever you switch to
one of these sources on the UniLink bus the XDP will "expect" that the
signal will be analog and disable the digital input(s).
>So then I got the schematic for one of the digital ouput equipped unilink
>changers. According to the schematic (828 changer perhaps?) there is a pin
>on one chip that controls analog ro digital mode. There also is the
>standard SPDIF to TOSLINK output conversion.
>
>So I've been trying to get schematics for teh MDX-757 changer to see if it
>would be possible to retrofit that changer with a digital output.
>
Yeah I see where you are going with this--the CDX-757 is an MX changer,
right? Meaning it can do MP3 playback? It can be done, yes I think so,
particularly because that series of changer (828/838/727/737/etc.) is very
closely related and are almost identical mechanically/physically. However,
the thing I always wondered was about the MP3 support... Because MP3s would
utilise an MP3 decoder/processor that digital information from the MP3s may
never be accessible in S/PDIF PCM format on the board anywhere; furthermore
it might not accompany the regular CD-Audio S/PDIF stream even if it were
accessible meaning you'd only get digital output from CDs and not MP3s.
It's worth a try though, if you have the time and resources because you
might well get it to work.
>By any chance does anyone on here have access to the Sony repair site with
>the schematics? I'd like to see the 757 changer schematics to perhaps
>develop a digital optical output. I'd also like to see the difference
>between the digital source selector and the analog source selector (XA-C30
>and XA-C30D I think ? or is it XA-U30D). Mainly just to see what can be
>done.
>
Yeah you'd just need to buy the 757 service manual and also the service
manual for one of the same family digital out changers (828/838/848X would
do) and you could probably figure it out. Unfortunately I've never seen any
of those manuals online anywhere; so you might have to fork out the $10-$15
each that Sony wants for them.
There was no XA-C30D or XA-U30D... The XA-C30 was a dual purpose
replacement for the XA-U20 and XA-U40 MCAs. The U20 had two UniLink ports
on it (for attaching 2 changers to one HU) and the U40 had 4 (allowing 4
changers). The C30 has three ports on it. The digital unit you are
referring to is the XA-U40D and it is VERY rare and therefore carries a VERY
high value with it if you ever do happen to find one.
Converting a C30 into a digital unit wouldn't really be *that* hard (because
all you'd need to do is access the relays that switch the audio ins and outs
and connect a network of Toslink I/O to it) but it would require a fair bit
of work and would probably be best to make it an external module of somesort
added on to the unit instead of trying to remove all the RCAs on the board.
The hardest part would just be making the Toslink network that is triggered
by the relays in the analog MCA.
>Lastly, the XDP-210EQ has some sort of serial port. Anyone know what this
>is for? What it does? Was there any software to communicate with it like
>the XDP-4000X?
>
See my other reply for info on this. Not really useful--I've searched
around for info to no avail. you might be more lucky though...
Roland M.
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: "Roland M" <mdx400@hotmail.com>
>--> XDP4000X-List message posted by: christopher sphon <sphon721@yahoo.com>
>
>has anyone messed with the internals of the unilink
>cable? i was wondering which wires provided the remote
>turn on.
>
UniLink, is not actually a "simple" CD-changer protocol as is used by some
manufacturers (particularly the older changer protocols used in car
audio)... There are no "wires" which provide remote turn on in UniLink.
Rather it is a "computer-based" protocol which uses bi-directional serial
data to communicate to/from the Master (HU) and Slave (CD/MD Changers,
XDP/DSP units, TV Tuners, etc.) devices.
The simplest way to get remote turn on, of course is via the blue remote
wire on the HU which is used for amps; also if you have an XDP unit it will
have its own remote output that can also be used.
The rest of the protocol, meaning what is actually carried on the cable, is
very loosely/poorly documented apart from what the Sony engineers in Japan
know; and little is available to the public. There are a few UniLink
projects out there on the net and many people have been quite successful in
doing things with the bus. For more information I suggest you do a search
on google or similar search engine and see what you find.
As a side note, the UniLink cable carries 8-pins IIRC. The main two are
power (B+ and ground) and then the others carry various other data. One was
a SIRCS line I think (Sony Infrared Conrol System which is essentially IR
controls transmitted via wire/electrical signal) and one was serial I/O data
I believe. A few others are ground I think--can't remember them all but any
service manual for any UniLink device will quickly reveal what each pin
does.
Roland M.
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|