Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:36 AM - 601HD cruise expectations (Darin McLEAN)
2. 04:42 AM - Re: 601HD cruise expectations (Trevor Page)
3. 06:03 AM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS (JAPhillipsGA@aol.com)
4. 07:37 AM - Re: 601 xl aluminim sheet (Dino Bortolin)
5. 07:40 AM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
6. 07:43 AM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
7. 07:48 AM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
8. 08:12 AM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
9. 09:27 AM - Re: Compass -- what's working? (Leo Corbalis)
10. 09:33 AM - Re: 601HD cruise expectations (JOHN STARN)
11. 09:35 AM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS (royt.or@netzero.com)
12. 09:53 AM - Flat tires (Keystone Engineering LLC)
13. 09:56 AM - Re: Compass -- what's working? (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
14. 10:43 AM - First SLSA 601XL Has Been Certified by the FAA (jim)
15. 10:59 AM - Re: Flat tires (doug kandle)
16. 11:39 AM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS (Gary Gower)
17. 11:47 AM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... (Gary Gower)
18. 11:52 AM - Re: Flat tires (Bill Denton)
19. 12:09 PM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... (Bill Denton)
20. 12:14 PM - Re: Compass -- what's working? (Gary Gower)
21. 01:33 PM - Re: Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
22. 02:38 PM - Re: Flat tires (Gary Gower)
23. 02:43 PM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... (Gary Gower)
24. 02:46 PM - Re: Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS (Larry McFarland)
25. 02:47 PM - Re: Flat tires (Edward Moody II)
26. 02:55 PM - Re: Flat tires (Edward Moody II)
27. 02:57 PM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... (Edward Moody II)
28. 02:58 PM - Re: Re: 601 xl aluminim sheet (Zodie Rocket)
29. 03:32 PM - Re: Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
30. 03:40 PM - Re: Flat tires (JOHN STARN)
31. 04:38 PM - Re: Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS (Larry McFarland)
32. 05:21 PM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... (royt.or@netzero.com)
33. 05:22 PM - Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... (Bryan Martin)
34. 09:13 PM - Old 701 New Windshield (Dave and Pam Fisher)
35. 09:13 PM - 701 with A65 Continental (Dave and Pam Fisher)
36. 09:42 PM - Re: Old 701 New Windshield (Steve Hulland)
Message 1
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| Subject: | 601HD cruise expectations |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Darin McLEAN" <darin@dm-electronics.com.au>
I'm looking at buying a 601HD.
I'll definately be using a 80hp Jabiru 2200 engine.
Is it too much to expect 110mph (95 knots) cruise (sustainable for cross country)
in a HD with 80hp?
I intend to build as aerodynamic as possible (meaning wheel pants and poly-urethane
paint job etc..) and whatever else will help attain max cruise speed.
If you have a HD that cruises around the 95 knot mark please let me know.
Is this acheivable with 80hp or am I dreaming?
I certainly hear a few owners with HD cruise figures of 80 to 90 knots that have
80hp Rotax engines.
Is anyone using a Jabiru 3300 in a 601HD...I'd love to know your cruise performance
too!
ALSO...I currently visited an airshow at Temora here in Australia where there are
a few warbirds.
See the video I made here at my website: http://www.recreationalflying.net/web/uploads/forums/Temora_final.wmv
Cheers
Darin McLEAN
Building the INTRO rudder kit 25%. AUSTRALIA
www.recreationalflying.net
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: 601HD cruise expectations |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Trevor Page <webmaster@upac.ca>
Darin, you can expect an honest 100Mph with a stock HD, no wheel
pants or other "cleanup" items from 80HP. It's pretty hard to get an
HD do do more than that without running the engine full-tilt all the
time with that big fat wing and all. I'm perfectly happy to cruise @
100IAS on my 80HP 912 at 75% power.
IF I was to chose an aircraft engine other than a Rotax it would be
the Jab 3300, not the 2200. More power, slightly less money and
simpler than a 912s.
I'm probably going to tinker with a Corvair engine over the winter
since I just had one given to me :)
Trev Page
C-IDUS 601HD R912
On Oct 5, 2005, at 6:34 AM, Darin McLEAN wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Darin McLEAN" <darin@dm-
> electronics.com.au>
>
> I'm looking at buying a 601HD.
> I'll definately be using a 80hp Jabiru 2200 engine.
> Is it too much to expect 110mph (95 knots) cruise (sustainable for
> cross country) in a HD with 80hp?
> I intend to build as aerodynamic as possible (meaning wheel pants
> and poly-urethane paint job etc..) and whatever else will help
> attain max cruise speed.
> If you have a HD that cruises around the 95 knot mark please let me
> know.
> Is this acheivable with 80hp or am I dreaming?
>
> I certainly hear a few owners with HD cruise figures of 80 to 90
> knots that have 80hp Rotax engines.
> Is anyone using a Jabiru 3300 in a 601HD...I'd love to know your
> cruise performance too!
>
> ALSO...I currently visited an airshow at Temora here in Australia
> where there are a few warbirds.
> See the video I made here at my website: http://
> www.recreationalflying.net/web/uploads/forums/Temora_final.wmv
>
> Cheers
> Darin McLEAN
> Building the INTRO rudder kit 25%. AUSTRALIA
> www.recreationalflying.net
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: JAPhillipsGA@aol.com
Jim, we are all happy you and yours are safe and uninjured. Must have been a
really close thing, Best Regards, Bill
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: 601 xl aluminim sheet |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Dino Bortolin <dbortol@yahoo.ca>
Mark,
I have updated the cutting layouts to the April version of the plans. I went through
the plans piece by piece and verified each one on the layout. Hopefully
I didn't miss any parts that were added, deleted, or changed in size or thickness.
I need to do a little bit more cleanup before I send them out. I should be
done by this weekend. I grouped all the remaining 0.016 skins, except for the
ailerons, in the layout because I plan to use 0.020. This of course is optional
and any builder that wants to can stick with 0.016.
Dino
Time: 12:08:44 PM PST US
From: "Zodie Rocket"
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 601 xl aluminim sheet
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Zodie Rocket"
Mark, the layouts can be printed off and the changes in the new plans
can be marked on the cutting layout. I hope that someday a new builder
will update the layouts for the www.ch601.org website.
Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario
Zodiac 601XL , Osprey 2 serial # 751
President: Kitchener/Waterloo RAA Chapter
www.ch601.org / www.ch701.com / www.Osprey2.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of AltEng
Subject: Zenith-List: 601 xl aluminim sheet
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "AltEng"
I have ordered the plans for the 601xl but Zenith says it well be a few
weeks before the plans ship because I believe the latest version is
anticipated out soon.
While waiting, I have looked at one site ch601.org and found cut out
sheets
for the 6061-t6 sheets but also to a reference where Zenith is now
shipping
.025 for skins.
My questions:
1: did all .016 get replaced by .025?
2: assuming that .016 is still used for a lot of the parts, does anyone
have
new layout sheets for the .025 and .016 aluminum?
Mark Simmons
---------------------------------
Message 5
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| Subject: | Landing accident tonight 601HDS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
And hen exactly is ZAC going to write to all of its customers offering
free replacement parts before somebody gets killed I wonder?
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michel
Therrien
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Landing accident tonight 601HDS
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Michel Therrien <mtherr@yahoo.com>
OH... it is at least the third occurence of this problem that I ear or
read of... not fun at all!
Glad you are in good shape!
Michel
do not archive
--- PHFD400@aol.com wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: PHFD400@aol.com
>
> My wife Bonnie and I were out enjoying the mountains and leave changes
> here in North Carolina tonight. Came back to Andrews/Murphy airport
> (RHP) made a normal landing, when all of a sudden, my side of the
> aircraft shifted down.
> The aircraft was uncontrollable, skidded down the center, then
> started going off to the left. Left the runway into tall grass and
> started sliding
> sideways. What a ride!!!! Lucky, we both got out
> OK, but still shaking..... Our
> left main landing gear broke clean off at the tube weld where it
> attached to the wheel fork.
>
> When the weld broke, the tire and wheel pant supported the wing down
> the runway until we slide off into the grass. The wheel left under
> the wing and flew back and hit the horz stabilizer and put a big dent
> in that. Not sure how much damage under left wing.
>
> Now we have to move the aircraft out of the grass
> tomorrow morning. Not
> sure how we are going to lift it up or how we are going to move it.
>
> Glad it happened when and where it did. Could have been a lot worse
> at some other airports I can think of... And of course you cannot get
> hold of any Insurance companies after hours.. (AOPA)
>
> Got to be thankful no injuries.
>
> Jim & Bonnie Olson
> CH601HDS N56BJ 288 hours
> http://hometown.aol.com/phfd400/index.html
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
>
>
>
>
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
__________________________________
Message 6
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| Subject: | Landing accident tonight 601HDS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Oh and of course I'm very glad your OK!
Frank
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
PHFD400@aol.com
Subject: Zenith-List: Landing accident tonight 601HDS
--> Zenith-List message posted by: PHFD400@aol.com
My wife Bonnie and I were out enjoying the mountains and leave changes
here in North Carolina tonight. Came back to Andrews/Murphy airport
(RHP) made a normal landing, when all of a sudden, my side of the
aircraft shifted down.
The aircraft was uncontrollable, skidded down the center, then started
going off to the left. Left the runway into tall grass and started
sliding
sideways. What a ride!!!! Lucky, we both got out OK, but still
shaking..... Our
left main landing gear broke clean off at the tube weld where it
attached to the wheel fork.
When the weld broke, the tire and wheel pant supported the wing down the
runway until we slide off into the grass. The wheel left under the wing
and flew back and hit the horz stabilizer and put a big dent in that.
Not sure how much damage under left wing.
Now we have to move the aircraft out of the grass tomorrow morning.
Not
sure how we are going to lift it up or how we are going to move it.
Glad it happened when and where it did. Could have been a lot worse at
some other airports I can think of... And of course you cannot get hold
of any Insurance companies after hours.. (AOPA)
Got to be thankful no injuries.
Jim & Bonnie Olson
CH601HDS N56BJ 288 hours
http://hometown.aol.com/phfd400/index.html
Message 7
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| Subject: | Landing accident tonight 601HDS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Note I have forwarded this to ZAC with a suggestion to start alerting
the builders.
Frank
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
PHFD400@aol.com
Subject: Zenith-List: Landing accident tonight 601HDS
--> Zenith-List message posted by: PHFD400@aol.com
My wife Bonnie and I were out enjoying the mountains and leave changes
here in North Carolina tonight. Came back to Andrews/Murphy airport
(RHP) made a normal landing, when all of a sudden, my side of the
aircraft shifted down.
The aircraft was uncontrollable, skidded down the center, then started
going off to the left. Left the runway into tall grass and started
sliding
sideways. What a ride!!!! Lucky, we both got out OK, but still
shaking..... Our
left main landing gear broke clean off at the tube weld where it
attached to the wheel fork.
When the weld broke, the tire and wheel pant supported the wing down the
runway until we slide off into the grass. The wheel left under the wing
and flew back and hit the horz stabilizer and put a big dent in that.
Not sure how much damage under left wing.
Now we have to move the aircraft out of the grass tomorrow morning.
Not
sure how we are going to lift it up or how we are going to move it.
Glad it happened when and where it did. Could have been a lot worse at
some other airports I can think of... And of course you cannot get hold
of any Insurance companies after hours.. (AOPA)
Got to be thankful no injuries.
Jim & Bonnie Olson
CH601HDS N56BJ 288 hours
http://hometown.aol.com/phfd400/index.html
Message 8
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| Subject: | Landing accident tonight 601HDS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
While we're on the subject (my wheel pants have been off and the new
crack detection kit sitting in the corner of the hangar for 3 months)
what was the solution that ZAC suggested.
I wonder Roy if you could tell us what you did to make sure this problem
would not happen again??
If it means welding on a thicker plate I'm wondering if it might be a
good precaution regardless of cracks developing in the 1/8th plate or
not/
Frank
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Compass -- what's working? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Leo Corbalis" <leocorbalis@sbcglobal.net>
AFTER THE SMOKE CLEARS !!!
Leo Corbalis
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Compass -- what's working?
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
> <frank.hinde@hp.com>
>
> I understand (not that I have one) the Airpath whisky compass works
> pretty good, even though it looks pretty dumb.
>
> For the RV I was going to get a 2.5" panel mount version which I can
> mount in a little homemade bracket if it proves to be too close to the
> avionics.
>
> Mind you like you say, even for an IFR platform I have an EFIS, GPS,
> compass and Autopilot....With 4 separate instruments capable of telling
> which way is North when in the world am I ever going to look at the
> stupid compass?
>
> Frank 601 HDS soon to be RV7A
>
> Do not archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Grant
> Corriveau
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Zenith-List: Compass -- what's working?
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Grant Corriveau <grantc@ca.inter.net>
>
> Hi all,
>
> I originally bought the cheap chinese version of the vertical card
> compass.
> I should have saved my money because it couldn't stand up to the
> vibrations and the internal gears slipped. I repaired that, but now I
> find that the thing still doesn't work properly. I've been testing it in
> my car for a while now and the readings make no particular sense and the
> compensator magnets don't help much. Maybe it got magnetized from the
> vibes?
>
> At any rate, I'm not keen to reinstall it and have the gears slip again.
>
> So -- I'm looking for what others are using that actually give good
> readings (not that anyone looks at these any more with GPS! ;-)... And
> where are you mounting them to get good readings and hopefully less
> vibration?
>
> Does anyone have any comments on the electronic compassses such as sold
> in the Aircraft spruce catalog? (i.e. the ones that say "not for
> aircraft use")...
>
> I also wonder if anyone in Canada knows how T.C. is currently applying
> the regulation regarding direction finding systems required on board an
> amateur-built. With my GPS (and back up gps), is the compass rendered
> obsolete? The complication here is that the gps only gives track rather
> than heading (with a few exceptions of course like the Garmin etrek)...
>
> Any words of experience and wisdom gratefully recieved before I blow
> more bucks on useless junk.
>
> Thanks!
> --
> Grant Corriveau
> C-GHTF / HDS / CAM100
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: 601HD cruise expectations |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn@verizon.net>
Great video, if you guys didn't give it a look-see ya missed out the first
time around. KABONG HRII (601XL or RV-12 ? ? ? )
----- Original Message -----
From: "Darin McLEAN" <darin@dm-electronics.com.au>
Subject: Zenith-List: 601HD cruise expectations
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Darin McLEAN"
> <darin@dm-electronics.com.au>
>
> Is anyone using a Jabiru 3300 in a 601HD...I'd love to know your cruise
> performance too!
>
> ALSO...I currently visited an airshow at Temora here in Australia where
> there are a few warbirds.
> See the video I made here at my website:
> http://www.recreationalflying.net/web/uploads/forums/Temora_final.wmv
>
> Cheers
> Darin McLEAN
> Building the INTRO rudder kit 25%. AUSTRALIA
> www.recreationalflying.net
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | RE: Landing accident tonight 601HDS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "royt.or@netzero.com" <royt.or@netzero.com>
Frank wrote "I wonder Roy if you could tell us what you did to make sure this problem
would not happen again??
If it means welding on a thicker plate I'm wondering if it might be a
good precaution regardless of cracks developing in the 1/8th plate or
not?"
I installed three new gear legs with thicker bottom plates and reinforcing tubes
on the main gear legs. Zenith changed the thickness of the 2"x2" plate at the
end of the gear leg in version
4 of the 601HD/601HDS plans. The new plate is 3/16" thick. My original
plates were 1/8" thick. A friend (who builds Titanium frame bicycles) brazed a
pair of 3/8" (?) steel tubes between the front and rear of the plate and the gear
leg tube.
Search the archives for "N601RT & defective" to see more history.
Regards,
Roy
N601RT: CH601HDS, nose gear, Rotax 912ULS, All electric, IFR equipped,
476hrs, 576 landings
Frank wrote "I wonder Roy if you could tell us what you did to make sure this problem
would not happen again??
If it means welding on a thicker plate I'm wondering if it might be a
good precaution regardless of cracks developing in the 1/8th plate or
not?"
I installed three new gear legs with thicker bottom plates and reinforcing tubes
on the main gear legs. Zenith changed the thickness of the 2"x2" plate at the
end of the gear leg in version
4 of the 601HD/601HDS plans. The new plate is 3/16" thick. My original
plates were 1/8" thick. A friend (who builds Titanium frame bicycles) brazed a
pair of 3/8" (?) steel tubes between the front and rear of the plate and the gear
leg tube.
Search the archives for "N601RT defective" to see more history.
Regards,
Roy
N601RT: CH601HDS, nose gear, Rotax 912ULS, All electric, IFR equipped,
476hrs, 576 landings
Message 12
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Keystone Engineering LLC <keystone@gci.net>
Hi
I have had 3 flat tires on my 801. One taxing into the hanger when I was taking
Dr C for a ride to inspire him to continue working on his 801. The next one
was taxiing at Merrill Field in Anchorage with my sister and brother in law.
The last one was at Hell's Hole. Don't laugh it was named by the boaters for
what it is to a boater when the tide goes out. I could not find a map in google
but it is at the head of Port Gravina in Prince William Sound.
The first two were while taxing and were just a pain to fix. The one at Hell's
hole, I was landing on a 700' gravel bar. It was a smooth landing, well as smooth
as you can get landing on rocks the size of your fist. I could not keep
directional control and I skidded into the river. We tied all sorts of things
onto the wing with the good tire to lessen the load on the blown tire. I shoved
drift wood under all of the tires to get the plane to roll easer. It took
every thing I, the O-360 and my daughter could do to get the 801 out of the
water before the tide came in. The tidal range there is about 15'. I would have
lost the plane!
A friend flew a new tube and a compressor out the next morning. We changed the
tube, pumped it up and we flew home. To change a tire where there is no jack,
hang heavy stuff from the wing with the good tire and have someone lift the
wing at the lift struts to raise the flat tire off the ground. It gets easer
as the fuel flows into the low tank and then on to the ground. Don't laugh it
works.
It really scared the H___ out of my daughter. When I visit her at WWU, I get asked
if the story is true. She must tell it when they ask what is the craziest
thing you have ever done. Talk about a Friday night adventure!
I had upsized the tires from 8.00 to 8.50's. I was still using the funky tubes
with a 90 degree stem with extensions. To eliminate the problem I drilled holes
in the rims and installed regular 8.50 tubes and have had no more flats since
them. I'm old school and use tubes.
Bill Wilcox
Valdez Alaska
N801BW
220 hrs
Full Lotus floats are on the way!!!
> > I repeat, never to date I had a flat tire in a plane, but several,
> > with one incident with a ditch in cars, I think that danger is
> > similar if plane is in the fast part of landing or just ready to
> > take off... Any experienced pilots opinion?
>
>
> One inexperienced pilot's opinion:
>
> Ideally, the transition from flying to rolling (or vice versa) is a
> gradual event. The faster a plane is going the more control
> authority the flight controls have. It seems to me that a high speed
> tire blowout would also be accompanied by good control possibility by
> the pilot. This assumes the pilot is wide awake and prepared to
> provide firm control inputs when this happens.
>
> On the other hand, it would take a lack of pilot smoothness to crush
> the tire so hard in the first place. That suggests a less than adept
> pilot or really extreme weather conditions.
>
> Paul
> XL wings
> do not archive
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Compass -- what's working? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Oh...You mean the smoke might come out?...Didn't think of that...:)
Frank
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Leo
Corbalis
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Compass -- what's working?
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Leo Corbalis"
--> <leocorbalis@sbcglobal.net>
AFTER THE SMOKE CLEARS !!!
Leo Corbalis
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Compass -- what's working?
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
> <frank.hinde@hp.com>
>
> I understand (not that I have one) the Airpath whisky compass works
> pretty good, even though it looks pretty dumb.
>
> For the RV I was going to get a 2.5" panel mount version which I can
> mount in a little homemade bracket if it proves to be too close to the
> avionics.
>
> Mind you like you say, even for an IFR platform I have an EFIS, GPS,
> compass and Autopilot....With 4 separate instruments capable of
telling
> which way is North when in the world am I ever going to look at the
> stupid compass?
>
> Frank 601 HDS soon to be RV7A
>
> Do not archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Grant
> Corriveau
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Zenith-List: Compass -- what's working?
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Grant Corriveau
<grantc@ca.inter.net>
>
> Hi all,
>
> I originally bought the cheap chinese version of the vertical card
> compass.
> I should have saved my money because it couldn't stand up to the
> vibrations and the internal gears slipped. I repaired that, but now I
> find that the thing still doesn't work properly. I've been testing it
in
> my car for a while now and the readings make no particular sense and
the
> compensator magnets don't help much. Maybe it got magnetized from the
> vibes?
>
> At any rate, I'm not keen to reinstall it and have the gears slip
again.
>
> So -- I'm looking for what others are using that actually give good
> readings (not that anyone looks at these any more with GPS! ;-)...
And
> where are you mounting them to get good readings and hopefully less
> vibration?
>
> Does anyone have any comments on the electronic compassses such as
sold
> in the Aircraft spruce catalog? (i.e. the ones that say "not for
> aircraft use")...
>
> I also wonder if anyone in Canada knows how T.C. is currently applying
> the regulation regarding direction finding systems required on board
an
> amateur-built. With my GPS (and back up gps), is the compass rendered
> obsolete? The complication here is that the gps only gives track
rather
> than heading (with a few exceptions of course like the Garmin
etrek)...
>
> Any words of experience and wisdom gratefully recieved before I blow
> more bucks on useless junk.
>
> Thanks!
> --
> Grant Corriveau
> C-GHTF / HDS / CAM100
>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | First SLSA 601XL Has Been Certified by the FAA |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "jim" <jim@pellien.com>
All,
I was just informed that the FAA has issued a Special Light Sport Aircraft (SLSA)
airworthiness certificate for my new 601XL. This is the first SLSA airworthiness
certificate for this aircraft model. It will be added to the EAA's list
of certified SLSA. This aircraft was produced by the Czech Aircraft Works in
the Czech Republic and is distributed by SportsPlanes.com and Mid-Atlantic Sports
Planes. It will be employed by Mid-Atlantic Sports Planes in its 1-week
Immersive Sport Pilot School at the Bryce Mountain Resort in Virginia. For more
information on this aircraft please go to the following two websites:
www.MASPL.com this is my mid-atlantic region website
www.SportsPlanes.com this is our national corporate website
For those who want to see this aircraft in person, it will be at the Sky Bryce
airport this coming weekend on Saturday October 8th. Stop by the Mid-Atlantic
Sports Planes office and we'll show you the airplane. It will also be available
for Charity Flights at the Sky Bryce Fly-in Breakfast on Sunday October 9th.
As soon as I have pictures and performance information, I'll send it on to the
group.
Jim
Jim Pellien
Mid-Atlantic Sports Planes
www.MASPL.com
703-313-4818
jim@sportsplanes.com
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn@verizon.net>
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn@verizon.net>
>
>Great video, if you guys didn't give it a look-see ya missed out the first
>time around. KABONG HRII (601XL or RV-12 ? ? ? )
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Darin McLEAN" <darin@dm-electronics.com.au>
>To: <zenith-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Zenith-List: 601HD cruise expectations
>
>
>> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Darin McLEAN"
>> <darin@dm-electronics.com.au>
>>
>> Is anyone using a Jabiru 3300 in a 601HD...I'd love to know your cruise
>> performance too!
>>
>> ALSO...I currently visited an airshow at Temora here in Australia where
>> there are a few warbirds.
>> See the video I made here at my website:
>> http://www.recreationalflying.net/web/uploads/forums/Temora_final.wmv
>>
>> Cheers
>> Darin McLEAN
>> Building the INTRO rudder kit 25%. AUSTRALIA
>> www.recreationalflying.net
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Sent via the WebMail system at Engage IT
Message 15
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: doug kandle <d_kandle@velocitus.net>
You say "to eliminate the problem...". Was the problem that the
valve stem sheared off when the tire slipped on the rim? (thus you
put the holes in the rims in order to put small screws into the tire bead)
At 10:38 AM 10/5/2005, you wrote:
>I had upsized the tires from 8.00 to 8.50's. I was still using the
>funky tubes with a 90 degree stem with extensions. To eliminate the
>problem I drilled holes in the rims and installed regular 8.50 tubes
>and have had no more flats since them. I'm old school and use tubes.
do not archive
Doug Kandle
CH701
Boise ID
Rudder & Horiz. Stab. done
From complete kit
Message 16
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| Subject: | Landing accident tonight 601HDS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
A good look to some photos of the incident (when available) could lead to design
some lightened gussets to be welded, this to make the landing gear more strong
but not more heavy...
A serious documented incidents (in the 601 and 701 pages....) could be of great
help for Mr Heintz to think of improvement and advise solutions in advance.
In fact I think that the new 701 and the XL landing gear is a great improvement
in the 601 and 701 design... Lets remember that will all this years in the
market surely is give better kits for all of us,
Saludos
Gary Gower.
"Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
While we're on the subject (my wheel pants have been off and the new
crack detection kit sitting in the corner of the hangar for 3 months)
what was the solution that ZAC suggested.
I wonder Roy if you could tell us what you did to make sure this problem
would not happen again??
If it means welding on a thicker plate I'm wondering if it might be a
good precaution regardless of cracks developing in the 1/8th plate or
not/
Frank
---------------------------------
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
Message 17
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| Subject: | Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Just curious: Is there a writen diference betwen an incident and an accident?
Where is the diference "line" betwen the two?
Not looking for "I think that this is", so the list will not get full, but a
well FAA documented diference...
If not available, no problem, just I will like to name things by its name...
Saludos
Gary Gower
---------------------------------
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
Message 18
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Denton" <bdenton@bdenton.com>
I realize that there are differences between aircraft and automobiles, but I
know that with automobiles, you are not supposed to put inner tubes in
tubeless tires.
You cannot initially FULLY inflate an inner tube in a tire (tube or
tubeless). There are always pockets of air trapped between the outside of
the tube and the inside of the tire. The tire and rim intended for tubeless
use do not fully seal (by design), so these pockets of air gradually work
there way out of the unit.
But with a tubeless tire and rim, they do fully seal, so these pockets of
air will remain trapped between the tire and the tube.
This can lead to a variety of problems.
I'm just guessing, but since I've seen the trick used before on automobile
rims that wouldn't seal with a tubeless tire, I think the OP may be drilling
the holes in the rims to allow the air trapped between the tire and tube to
escape.
Keep in mind, one of the big problems with tires of all types is heat. While
this is not as large a factor with an aircraft tire, which typically is not
operated for extended periods at high speeds, putting a tube in a tubeless
tire will alter the heat dissipation characteristics of the assembly.
Hope this is of some use...
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of doug kandle
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flat tires
--> Zenith-List message posted by: doug kandle <d_kandle@velocitus.net>
You say "to eliminate the problem...". Was the problem that the
valve stem sheared off when the tire slipped on the rim? (thus you
put the holes in the rims in order to put small screws into the tire bead)
At 10:38 AM 10/5/2005, you wrote:
>I had upsized the tires from 8.00 to 8.50's. I was still using the
>funky tubes with a 90 degree stem with extensions. To eliminate the
>problem I drilled holes in the rims and installed regular 8.50 tubes
>and have had no more flats since them. I'm old school and use tubes.
do not archive
Doug Kandle
CH701
Boise ID
Rudder & Horiz. Stab. done
From complete kit
Message 19
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| Subject: | Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Denton" <bdenton@bdenton.com>
Don't know specifically how the FAA looks at it, but this is really a matter
of plain English.
An incident is an occurrence, no matter what the circumstances.
An accident is an occurrence where there was no deliberate intent for the
incident to occur.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Gary Gower
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident...
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Just curious: Is there a writen diference betwen an incident and an
accident? Where is the diference "line" betwen the two?
Not looking for "I think that this is", so the list will not get full, but
a well FAA documented diference...
If not available, no problem, just I will like to name things by its
name...
Saludos
Gary Gower
---------------------------------
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | Compass -- what's working? |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
I dont know why the Scientists invented to put smoke inside the electronic devises...
Once the smoke comes out, is impossible to get it back in, and the part
is trash!!!
Saludos
Gary Gower
do not archive.
"Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
Oh...You mean the smoke might come out?...Didn't think of that...:)
Frank
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Leo
Corbalis
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Compass -- what's working?
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Leo Corbalis"
-->
AFTER THE SMOKE CLEARS !!!
Leo Corbalis
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Compass -- what's working?
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
>
>
> I understand (not that I have one) the Airpath whisky compass works
> pretty good, even though it looks pretty dumb.
>
> For the RV I was going to get a 2.5" panel mount version which I can
> mount in a little homemade bracket if it proves to be too close to the
> avionics.
>
> Mind you like you say, even for an IFR platform I have an EFIS, GPS,
> compass and Autopilot....With 4 separate instruments capable of
telling
> which way is North when in the world am I ever going to look at the
> stupid compass?
>
> Frank 601 HDS soon to be RV7A
>
> Do not archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Grant
> Corriveau
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Zenith-List: Compass -- what's working?
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Grant Corriveau
>
> Hi all,
>
> I originally bought the cheap chinese version of the vertical card
> compass.
> I should have saved my money because it couldn't stand up to the
> vibrations and the internal gears slipped. I repaired that, but now I
> find that the thing still doesn't work properly. I've been testing it
in
> my car for a while now and the readings make no particular sense and
the
> compensator magnets don't help much. Maybe it got magnetized from the
> vibes?
>
> At any rate, I'm not keen to reinstall it and have the gears slip
again.
>
> So -- I'm looking for what others are using that actually give good
> readings (not that anyone looks at these any more with GPS! ;-)...
And
> where are you mounting them to get good readings and hopefully less
> vibration?
>
> Does anyone have any comments on the electronic compassses such as
sold
> in the Aircraft spruce catalog? (i.e. the ones that say "not for
> aircraft use")...
>
> I also wonder if anyone in Canada knows how T.C. is currently applying
> the regulation regarding direction finding systems required on board
an
> amateur-built. With my GPS (and back up gps), is the compass rendered
> obsolete? The complication here is that the gps only gives track
rather
> than heading (with a few exceptions of course like the Garmin
etrek)...
>
> Any words of experience and wisdom gratefully recieved before I blow
> more bucks on useless junk.
>
> Thanks!
> --
> Grant Corriveau
> C-GHTF / HDS / CAM100
---------------------------------
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
Message 21
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| Subject: | RE: Landing accident tonight 601HDS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
So presumably no reason not to hack off the 1/8th plates and weld a
3/16th one in its place?
I like the additional strength of the 3/8ths tubes. One could also use a
piece of the 3/16th plate as a fillet front and rear.
Shame about the work but better than the alternative.
I'll keep my wheel pants off and give an occasional looks see to the
welds for now.
Thanks Roy
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
royt.or@netzero.com
Subject: Zenith-List: RE: Landing accident tonight 601HDS
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "royt.or@netzero.com"
--> <royt.or@netzero.com>
Frank wrote "I wonder Roy if you could tell us what you did to make sure
this problem would not happen again??
If it means welding on a thicker plate I'm wondering if it might be a
good precaution regardless of cracks developing in the 1/8th plate or
not?"
I installed three new gear legs with thicker bottom plates and
reinforcing tubes on the main gear legs. Zenith changed the thickness of
the 2"x2" plate at the end of the gear leg in version
4 of the 601HD/601HDS plans. The new plate is 3/16" thick. My original
plates were 1/8" thick. A friend (who builds Titanium frame bicycles)
brazed a pair of 3/8" (?) steel tubes between the front and rear of the
plate and the gear leg tube.
Search the archives for "N601RT & defective" to see more history.
Regards,
Roy
N601RT: CH601HDS, nose gear, Rotax 912ULS, All electric, IFR equipped,
476hrs, 576 landings
Frank wrote "I wonder Roy if you could tell us what you did to make sure
this problem would not happen again??
If it means welding on a thicker plate I'm wondering if it might be a
good precaution regardless of cracks developing in the 1/8th plate or
not?"
I installed three new gear legs with thicker bottom plates and
reinforcing tubes on the main gear legs. Zenith changed the thickness of
the 2"x2" plate at the end of the gear leg in version
4 of the 601HD/601HDS plans. The new plate is 3/16" thick. My original
plates were 1/8" thick. A friend (who builds Titanium frame bicycles)
brazed a pair of 3/8" (?) steel tubes between the front and rear of the
plate and the gear leg tube.
Search the archives for "N601RT defective" to see more history.
Regards,
Roy
N601RT: CH601HDS, nose gear, Rotax 912ULS, All electric, IFR equipped,
476hrs, 576 landings
Message 22
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Another serious problem (in cars and trucks) with inner tubes is that they wrinkle
(sp?) and this bents in the rubber will fail with time and heat... Dont
know if happens in airplane tires, because they have less diameter.
Saludos
Gary Gower.
Bill Denton <bdenton@bdenton.com> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Denton"
I realize that there are differences between aircraft and automobiles, but I
know that with automobiles, you are not supposed to put inner tubes in
tubeless tires.
You cannot initially FULLY inflate an inner tube in a tire (tube or
tubeless). There are always pockets of air trapped between the outside of
the tube and the inside of the tire. The tire and rim intended for tubeless
use do not fully seal (by design), so these pockets of air gradually work
there way out of the unit.
But with a tubeless tire and rim, they do fully seal, so these pockets of
air will remain trapped between the tire and the tube.
This can lead to a variety of problems.
I'm just guessing, but since I've seen the trick used before on automobile
rims that wouldn't seal with a tubeless tire, I think the OP may be drilling
the holes in the rims to allow the air trapped between the tire and tube to
escape.
Keep in mind, one of the big problems with tires of all types is heat. While
this is not as large a factor with an aircraft tire, which typically is not
operated for extended periods at high speeds, putting a tube in a tubeless
tire will alter the heat dissipation characteristics of the assembly.
Hope this is of some use...
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of doug kandle
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flat tires
--> Zenith-List message posted by: doug kandle
You say "to eliminate the problem...". Was the problem that the
valve stem sheared off when the tire slipped on the rim? (thus you
put the holes in the rims in order to put small screws into the tire bead)
At 10:38 AM 10/5/2005, you wrote:
>I had upsized the tires from 8.00 to 8.50's. I was still using the
>funky tubes with a 90 degree stem with extensions. To eliminate the
>problem I drilled holes in the rims and installed regular 8.50 tubes
>and have had no more flats since them. I'm old school and use tubes.
do not archive
Doug Kandle
CH701
Boise ID
Rudder & Horiz. Stab. done
From complete kit
---------------------------------
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
Message 23
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| Subject: | Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
I am sure that here (in Mexico) there is a (ruled) diference, depends in the
amount of damage in the airplane (?)...
Will look for the reference and translate, if I find it... An incident or an
accident have diferent rules problems.
Kind like the good landing rule :-) "If the plane is flyable then is a good
landing..."
Saludos
Gary Gower
Never mind, was just curious.
Do not archive.
Bill Denton <bdenton@bdenton.com> wrote:
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Denton"
Don't know specifically how the FAA looks at it, but this is really a matter
of plain English.
An incident is an occurrence, no matter what the circumstances.
An accident is an occurrence where there was no deliberate intent for the
incident to occur.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Gary Gower
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident...
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower
Just curious: Is there a writen diference betwen an incident and an
accident? Where is the diference "line" betwen the two?
Not looking for "I think that this is", so the list will not get full, but
a well FAA documented diference...
If not available, no problem, just I will like to name things by its
name...
Saludos
Gary Gower
---------------------------------
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
---------------------------------
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Landing accident tonight 601HDS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Larry McFarland <larrymc@qconline.com>
Frank,
I think it might be easier to cut short 3" pieces of gear strut and weld
a heavier plate to the short tubes, match drill to the gear forks. Then
turn a set of 1/4" wall sleeves that will fit up inside the cutoff
struts. This process would allow for easier access, better welding,
alignment and grinding the welded strut smooth when finished. No total
disassembly needed.
Just an idea that could be done while other options are contemplated.
Larry McFarland at www.macsmachine.com
Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis) wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
>
>So presumably no reason not to hack off the 1/8th plates and weld a
>3/16th one in its place?
>
>I like the additional strength of the 3/8ths tubes. One could also use a
>piece of the 3/16th plate as a fillet front and rear.
>
>Shame about the work but better than the alternative.
>
>I'll keep my wheel pants off and give an occasional looks see to the
>welds for now.
>
>Thanks Roy
>
>Frank
>
>
>
Message 25
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Edward Moody II" <dredmoody@cox.net>
Wait a second here.... what exactly is sealing the air inside the tubeless
tire and rim when the tubeless valve stem has been removed, and the hole
where it was located has been enlarged for the tube's valve stem? Besides
that, if you can inflate the tubeless setup adequately to seat the tubeless
tire on the rim, why can't you do the same with a tube lining the inside the
tire? One last question..... hasn't this thread degenerated into a tempest
in a teapot?
Ed Moody II
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Denton" <bdenton@bdenton.com>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Flat tires
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Denton" <bdenton@bdenton.com>
>
> I realize that there are differences between aircraft and automobiles, but
> I
> know that with automobiles, you are not supposed to put inner tubes in
> tubeless tires.
>
> You cannot initially FULLY inflate an inner tube in a tire (tube or
> tubeless). There are always pockets of air trapped between the outside of
> the tube and the inside of the tire. The tire and rim intended for
> tubeless
> use do not fully seal (by design), so these pockets of air gradually work
> there way out of the unit.
>
> But with a tubeless tire and rim, they do fully seal, so these pockets of
> air will remain trapped between the tire and the tube.
>
> This can lead to a variety of problems.
>
> I'm just guessing, but since I've seen the trick used before on automobile
> rims that wouldn't seal with a tubeless tire, I think the OP may be
> drilling
> the holes in the rims to allow the air trapped between the tire and tube
> to
> escape.
>
> Keep in mind, one of the big problems with tires of all types is heat.
> While
> this is not as large a factor with an aircraft tire, which typically is
> not
> operated for extended periods at high speeds, putting a tube in a tubeless
> tire will alter the heat dissipation characteristics of the assembly.
>
> Hope this is of some use...
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of doug kandle
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flat tires
>
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: doug kandle <d_kandle@velocitus.net>
>
> You say "to eliminate the problem...". Was the problem that the
> valve stem sheared off when the tire slipped on the rim? (thus you
> put the holes in the rims in order to put small screws into the tire bead)
>
>
> At 10:38 AM 10/5/2005, you wrote:
>>I had upsized the tires from 8.00 to 8.50's. I was still using the
>>funky tubes with a 90 degree stem with extensions. To eliminate the
>>problem I drilled holes in the rims and installed regular 8.50 tubes
>>and have had no more flats since them. I'm old school and use tubes.
> do not archive
>
> Doug Kandle
> CH701
> Boise ID
> Rudder & Horiz. Stab. done
> From complete kit
>
>
>
Message 26
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--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Edward Moody II" <dredmoody@cox.net>
Choose the correct size tube to eliminate this problem. The talcum-like
powder on a new tube is intended to allow it to slide into a wrinkle free
position.
Ed Moody II
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Gower" <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Flat tires
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
>
> Another serious problem (in cars and trucks) with inner tubes is that
> they wrinkle (sp?) and this bents in the rubber will fail with time and
> heat... Dont know if happens in airplane tires, because they have less
> diameter.
>
> Saludos
> Gary Gower.
>
> Bill Denton <bdenton@bdenton.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Denton"
>
> I realize that there are differences between aircraft and automobiles, but
> I
> know that with automobiles, you are not supposed to put inner tubes in
> tubeless tires.
>
> You cannot initially FULLY inflate an inner tube in a tire (tube or
> tubeless). There are always pockets of air trapped between the outside of
> the tube and the inside of the tire. The tire and rim intended for
> tubeless
> use do not fully seal (by design), so these pockets of air gradually work
> there way out of the unit.
>
> But with a tubeless tire and rim, they do fully seal, so these pockets of
> air will remain trapped between the tire and the tube.
>
> This can lead to a variety of problems.
>
> I'm just guessing, but since I've seen the trick used before on automobile
> rims that wouldn't seal with a tubeless tire, I think the OP may be
> drilling
> the holes in the rims to allow the air trapped between the tire and tube
> to
> escape.
>
> Keep in mind, one of the big problems with tires of all types is heat.
> While
> this is not as large a factor with an aircraft tire, which typically is
> not
> operated for extended periods at high speeds, putting a tube in a tubeless
> tire will alter the heat dissipation characteristics of the assembly.
>
> Hope this is of some use...
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of doug kandle
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Flat tires
>
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: doug kandle
>
> You say "to eliminate the problem...". Was the problem that the
> valve stem sheared off when the tire slipped on the rim? (thus you
> put the holes in the rims in order to put small screws into the tire bead)
>
>
> At 10:38 AM 10/5/2005, you wrote:
>>I had upsized the tires from 8.00 to 8.50's. I was still using the
>>funky tubes with a 90 degree stem with extensions. To eliminate the
>>problem I drilled holes in the rims and installed regular 8.50 tubes
>>and have had no more flats since them. I'm old school and use tubes.
> do not archive
>
> Doug Kandle
> CH701
> Boise ID
> Rudder & Horiz. Stab. done
> From complete kit
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
>
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Edward Moody II" <dredmoody@cox.net>
The rule is actually: "If you can walk away, it is a good landing. If the
airplane is still flyable, it's a great landing." In the referenced
incident, it is a good landing.
Ed Moody II
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Gower" <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident...
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
>
> I am sure that here (in Mexico) there is a (ruled) diference, depends in
> the amount of damage in the airplane (?)...
>
> Will look for the reference and translate, if I find it... An incident
> or an accident have diferent rules problems.
>
> Kind like the good landing rule :-) "If the plane is flyable then is a
> good landing..."
>
> Saludos
> Gary Gower
> Never mind, was just curious.
> Do not archive.
>
> Bill Denton <bdenton@bdenton.com> wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Denton"
>
> Don't know specifically how the FAA looks at it, but this is really a
> matter
> of plain English.
>
> An incident is an occurrence, no matter what the circumstances.
>
> An accident is an occurrence where there was no deliberate intent for the
> incident to occur.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Gary Gower
> To: zenith-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident...
>
>
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower
>
> Just curious: Is there a writen diference betwen an incident and an
> accident? Where is the diference "line" betwen the two?
>
> Not looking for "I think that this is", so the list will not get full, but
> a well FAA documented diference...
>
> If not available, no problem, just I will like to name things by its
> name...
>
> Saludos
> Gary Gower
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
>
>
>
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: 601 xl aluminim sheet |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Zodie Rocket" <zodierocket@hsfx.ca>
Thanks Dino, I look forward to your updated version
Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario
Zodiac 601XL , Osprey 2 serial # 751
President: Kitchener/Waterloo RAA Chapter
www.ch601.org / www.ch701.com / www.Osprey2.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dino
Bortolin
Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 601 xl aluminim sheet
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Dino Bortolin <dbortol@yahoo.ca>
Mark,
I have updated the cutting layouts to the April version of the plans. I
went through the plans piece by piece and verified each one on the
layout. Hopefully I didn't miss any parts that were added, deleted, or
changed in size or thickness. I need to do a little bit more cleanup
before I send them out. I should be done by this weekend. I grouped all
the remaining 0.016 skins, except for the ailerons, in the layout
because I plan to use 0.020. This of course is optional and any builder
that wants to can stick with 0.016.
Dino
Time: 12:08:44 PM PST US
From: "Zodie Rocket"
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 601 xl aluminim sheet
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Zodie Rocket"
Mark, the layouts can be printed off and the changes in the new plans
can be marked on the cutting layout. I hope that someday a new builder
will update the layouts for the www.ch601.org website.
Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario
Zodiac 601XL , Osprey 2 serial # 751
President: Kitchener/Waterloo RAA Chapter
www.ch601.org / www.ch701.com / www.Osprey2.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of AltEng
Subject: Zenith-List: 601 xl aluminim sheet
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "AltEng"
I have ordered the plans for the 601xl but Zenith says it well be a few
weeks before the plans ship because I believe the latest version is
anticipated out soon.
While waiting, I have looked at one site ch601.org and found cut out
sheets
for the 6061-t6 sheets but also to a reference where Zenith is now
shipping
.025 for skins.
My questions:
1: did all .016 get replaced by .025?
2: assuming that .016 is still used for a lot of the parts, does anyone
have
new layout sheets for the .025 and .016 aluminum?
Mark Simmons
---------------------------------
--
10/5/2005
--
10/5/2005
Message 29
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| Subject: | RE: Landing accident tonight 601HDS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
I think I see what your getting at Larry...But I would need access to a
lathe to turn the joining pieces. I would also have to source the 4130
tube (not a big deal if AS&S stocks it).
Distant memeory tells me the gear struts come out fairly easily as
well????
More of an issue with either method is how to align the plates to the
gear legs so the wheels are straight.
I'm pretty glad you reminded me of how to gas weld Larry!...I have made
all sorts of steel fuel fittings by cutting an rewelding hydraulic
fittings for the RV...Welding this plate on will be no trouble...:)
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry
McFarland
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: RE: Landing accident tonight 601HDS
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Larry McFarland
--> <larrymc@qconline.com>
Frank,
I think it might be easier to cut short 3" pieces of gear strut and weld
a heavier plate to the short tubes, match drill to the gear forks. Then
turn a set of 1/4" wall sleeves that will fit up inside the cutoff
struts. This process would allow for easier access, better welding,
alignment and grinding the welded strut smooth when finished. No total
disassembly needed.
Just an idea that could be done while other options are contemplated.
Larry McFarland at www.macsmachine.com
Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis) wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
>--> <frank.hinde@hp.com>
>
>So presumably no reason not to hack off the 1/8th plates and weld a
>3/16th one in its place?
>
>I like the additional strength of the 3/8ths tubes. One could also use
>a piece of the 3/16th plate as a fillet front and rear.
>
>Shame about the work but better than the alternative.
>
>I'll keep my wheel pants off and give an occasional looks see to the
>welds for now.
>
>Thanks Roy
>
>Frank
>
>
>
Message 30
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|
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn@verizon.net>
Maybe it is a "tempest" BUT having been on many lists for many years
sometimes it takes a "tempest" to stir up someone on the sidelines that has
"good" information on the subject. If it takes a "tempest" it's usually
worth the wait. Do Not Archive & trimming posts are also good ideas. KABONG
>
> Wait a second here
One last question..... hasn't this thread degenerated into a tempest
> in a teapot?
>
> Ed Moody II
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Landing accident tonight 601HDS |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Larry McFarland <larrymc@qconline.com>
Frank,
I originally aligned my rear forks by passing a long straight tube thru
both sets of holes in the axle forks.
Alignment could be done at the last fitting of the sleeve into the strut.
Larry
Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis) wrote:
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
>
>I think I see what your getting at Larry...But I would need access to a
>lathe to turn the joining pieces. I would also have to source the 4130
>tube (not a big deal if AS&S stocks it).
>
>Distant memeory tells me the gear struts come out fairly easily as
>well????
>
>More of an issue with either method is how to align the plates to the
>gear legs so the wheels are straight.
>
>I'm pretty glad you reminded me of how to gas weld Larry!...I have made
>all sorts of steel fuel fittings by cutting an rewelding hydraulic
>fittings for the RV...Welding this plate on will be no trouble...:)
>
>Frank
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry
>McFarland
>To: zenith-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: RE: Landing accident tonight 601HDS
>
>--> Zenith-List message posted by: Larry McFarland
>--> <larrymc@qconline.com>
>
>Frank,
>I think it might be easier to cut short 3" pieces of gear strut and weld
>a heavier plate to the short tubes, match drill to the gear forks. Then
>turn a set of 1/4" wall sleeves that will fit up inside the cutoff
>struts. This process would allow for easier access, better welding,
>alignment and grinding the welded strut smooth when finished. No total
>disassembly needed.
>Just an idea that could be done while other options are contemplated.
>
>Larry McFarland at www.macsmachine.com
>
>
>Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis) wrote:
>
>
>
>>--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)"
>>--> <frank.hinde@hp.com>
>>
>>So presumably no reason not to hack off the 1/8th plates and weld a
>>3/16th one in its place?
>>
>>I like the additional strength of the 3/8ths tubes. One could also use
>>a piece of the 3/16th plate as a fillet front and rear.
>>
>>Shame about the work but better than the alternative.
>>
>>I'll keep my wheel pants off and give an occasional looks see to the
>>welds for now.
>>
>>Thanks Roy
>>
>>Frank
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: "royt.or@netzero.com" <royt.or@netzero.com>
A few notes from from my files related to my gear failure was at a tower controlled
airport. After my INCIDENT, I talked to the NTSB on the phone and to the
FAA in person. The FAA inspected my logs, license, medical, looked at the plane,
and DID NOT call the landing with the gear failure an accident.
http://www.ntsb.gov/aviation/report.htm
Federal regulations require operators to notify the NTSB immediately of aviation
accidents and certain incidents. An accident is defined as an occurrence associated
with the operation of an aircraft that takes place between the time any
person boards the aircraft with the intention of flight and all such persons
have disembarked, and in which any person suffers death or serious injury, or
in which the aircraft receives substantial damage. An incident is an occurrence
other than an accident that affects or could affect the safety of operations
(49 CFR 830). The report should be filed with the nearest NTSB regional office.
A phone call is sufficient initially, but a written follow-up will be required.
and from http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/waisidx_03/49cfr830_03.html
Substantial damage means damage or failure which adversely affects the structural
strength, performance, or flight characteristics of the aircraft, and which
would normally require major repair or replacement of the affected component.
Engine failure or damage limited to an engine if only one engine fails or is
damaged, bent fairings or cowling, dented skin, small punctured holes in the skin
or fabric, ground damage to rotor or propeller blades, and damage to landing
gear, wheels, tires, flaps, engine accessories, brakes, or wingtips are not
considered substantial damage for the purpose of this part.
Regards,
Roy
N601RT: CH601HDS, nose gear, Rotax 912ULS, All electric, IFR equipped,
476hrs, 576 landings
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Landing accident tonight 601HDS or incident... |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin@comcast.net>
Title 49: Transportation
PART 830NOTIFICATION AND REPORTING OF AIRCRAFT ACCIDENTS OR INCIDENTS AND
OVERDUE AIRCRAFT, AND PRESERVATION OF AIRCRAFT WRECKAGE, MAIL, CARGO, AND
RECORDS
Subpart AGeneral
830.2Definitions.
As used in this part the following words or phrases are defined as follows:
AIRCRAFT ACCIDENT means an occurrence associated with the operation of an
aircraft which takes place between the time any person boards the aircraft
with the intention of flight and all such persons have disembarked, and in
which any person suffers DEATH or SERIOUS INJURY, or in which the aircraft
receives SUBSTANTIAL DAMAGE.
FATAL INJURY means any injury which results in death within 30 days of the
accident.
INCIDENT means an occurrence other than an accident, associated with the
operation of an aircraft, which affects or could affect the safety of
operations.
SERIOUS INJURY means any injury which: (1) Requires hospitalization for more
than 48 hours, commencing within 7 days from the date of the injury was
received; (2) results in a fracture of any bone (except simple fractures of
fingers, toes, or nose); (3) causes severe hemorrhages, nerve, muscle, or
tendon damage; (4) involves any internal organ; or (5) involves second- or
third-degree burns, or any burns affecting more than 5 percent of the body
surface.
SUBSTANTIAL DAMAGE means damage or failure which adversely affects the
structural strength, performance, or flight characteristics of the aircraft,
and which would normally require major repair or replacement of the affected
component. Engine failure or damage limited to an engine if only one engine
fails or is damaged, bent fairings or cowling, dented skin, small punctured
holes in the skin or fabric, ground damage to rotor or propeller blades, and
damage to landing gear, wheels, tires, flaps, engine accessories, brakes, or
wingtips are not considered substantial damage for the purpose of this
part.
[53 FR 36982, Sept. 23, 1988, as amended at 60 FR 40112, Aug. 7, 1995]
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
do not archive.
on 10/5/05 2:44 PM, Gary Gower at ggower_99@yahoo.com wrote:
> --> Zenith-List message posted by: Gary Gower <ggower_99@yahoo.com>
>
> Just curious: Is there a writen diference betwen an incident and an accident?
> Where is the diference "line" betwen the two?
>
> Not looking for "I think that this is", so the list will not get full, but
a
> well FAA documented diference...
>
> If not available, no problem, just I will like to name things by its name...
>
> Saludos
> Gary Gower
>
>
Message 34
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| Subject: | Old 701 New Windshield |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Dave and Pam Fisher <dpfisher@scottsbluff.net>
<From: "Zodie Rocket" <zodierocket@hsfx.ca>
Subject: Zenith-List: Old 701 New Windsheild
Hi Mark and list,
I borrowed a windshield idea from Scott Hunter that may work for you.
I went to Home Depot and bought a 3 ft X 6 ft sheet of flexible acrylic
called DuraPlex, .090 thick. I picked a hot day and cut it to size with a
sabre saw, sanded the edges and strapped it into position with ratchet tie
down straps. I used wood strips to even out the pressure of the straps
along the edges of the doors. My wife and I used a hair dryer while
bending, especially in the upper corners. This stuff is quite flexible but
can still be broken. I ruined my first attempt because I didn't allow a
large enough radius for the cutouts in the upper corners. The cost per
sheet was about $46 and it makes a nice looking windshield. Home Depot
also sells .090 thick Lexan that is even more flexible at a cost of about
$60 for a 3 ft X4 ft piece. I don't know which is best. I've heard that
Plexiglass is more forgiving of fuel spills than Lexan but the Lexan is
tougher - practically indestructible. In any case you can make your
windshield so that it will miss the filler for your header tank. Now if I
could just talk you into the safety advantages of eliminating the header tank!!
Dave, 701 with A80 Continental
Message 35
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| Subject: | 701 with A65 Continental |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Dave and Pam Fisher <dpfisher@scottsbluff.net>
>From: Brad Larson <blarson@meridianhouse.com> .....I was interested in
how you felt on performance, what type of GPH you
>are getting etc...
Hi Brad and list, I sent this message to the list digest and have just
realized that the regular list may not have received it. Sorry about that!
Since I'm not in the air yet I have only thoughts and no hard numbers.
My A80 engine set up weighs around 100 lbs more than the Rotax 582 it
replaced so I'm doing all I can to minimize the weight up front: (light
wood prop, hand propped, engine as close as possible to the firewall,
battery in rear fuselage for balance, ETC.) You might want to double check
your weight and balance to make sure the previous owner got it right.
I once read quotes from the designer of the Kit Fox. As I recall he said
that every pound you add to a 500 lb airplane, ( empty weight), costs you 3
feet per min. of climb, and if you add 100 lbs, you'll need to add 15 to 20
HP to get the same performance. With that in mind, I figured I needed to
convert my A65 to an A80 to equal the climb performance of the 65 HP Rotax
582. Cruise performance of the 80 hp engine should be better than the 65 HP
Rotax even with the extra weight. A rule of thumb I read somewhere suggests
that an aerodynamically dirty airframe like the 701 might cruise at about
one mile per hour per horse power. My field elevation here in western
Nebraska is about 4000 ft. Another rule of thumb says you lose about 4% of
your horse power per 1000 ft so all my horses are shetland ponies! The way
it works out, at 4000 ft my 80 HP engine will develop about 67 horse power.
Your elevation in North Dakota may be lower which will help the performance
of your A65.
I'd say, try the A65 and if the performance isn't what you hoped for, the
80 HP conversion is not difficult. Just get an old original Continental
Parts and Repair manual and the differences are called out. As I recall
the key differences were: higher compression pistons, different valves,
drill a hole in each rod cap for better oiling, and run the engine at a
higher RPM. I also balanced and ported and polished the engine. From
things Archie has said on this list about the 0200, it's possible that
porting and polishing the intake passages may have eliminated some
beneficial turbulence so I'll see how it works. If I were to do it again, I
wouldn't mess with the intake passages. (Right Archie??)
How is the fuel system plumbed, Brad? Do you have wing tanks only, plumbed
directly to the gascolator and then to the carb with no boost pump? That's
how I hope to do it and I'm curious if a Piper Cub style pint sized burp or
header tank or boost pump is advisable.
Dave, 701 with A80 Continental
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: Old 701 New Windshield |
--> Zenith-List message posted by: Steve Hulland <marinegunner@gmail.com>
Dave,
Can you describe how you ran the fuel lines after eliminating the header
tank? I am not going to put a header tank in my 701. Might even attempt to
put in an additional wing tank in each wing. Perhaps 2.5 gallons each.
Steve Hulland
Amado, AZ
701 - slowly progressing
Do not archive.
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