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Four Seater

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pillar(at)paradise.net.nz
Guest

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2007 1:24 am Post subject: Four Seater

Hi  

I know it is early and exiting days of the Lightning but is there any intention to develop a four seater with the same performance characteristics, good looks and economical operation of the lightning?  

   

Ian  

        [quote][b]

lightningaustralia(at)big
Guest

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2007 3:44 am Post subject: Four Seater

N1BZRich(at)AOL.COM
Guest

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2007 6:02 pm Post subject: Four Seater

AOL now offers free email to everyone.  Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. 

  [quote][b]

N1BZRich(at)AOL.COM
Guest

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2007 6:37 pm Post subject: Four Seater

Lightning news release scheduled for 1 April 2007.

     The Secret Highly Intelligent Technical -  Hybrid Operational Team Lightning design group plans to announce  several new designs on 1 April this year.  This design group relies on  each member's input and only meets after a long days work when cans of beer  are available for inspiration.  The most recent meeting was two weeks  ago.  

     Now, to answer your question, yes, they have come  up with a four seat, twin engine Lightning that will look much like the  F-82 Twin Mustang.  Imagine two Lightning fuselages joined together with a  stub wing and stabilizer/elevator between them, and then standard wings on the  outboard side of each fuselage.  Each fuselage will carry two and each will  have stick and rudders.  So with twin fuselages, imagine the crew  coordination as to which of the four people will be flying the airplane at any  one time.  

     Another new concept will be the road-able Lightning  which will be a two seat sports car with foldable wings and also floats for  maritime operations to use when you are too drunk to fly or drive. 

     And for the R-44 guys in Wisconsin, there will  definitely be a vertical takeoff version of the Lightning.  It will be a  200 HP Jabiru powered craft.  An 80 HP engine in the nose to go forward and  a 120 HP engine in the baggage compartment to power the rotors.  Yes, it  will be tail heavy, but helicopter guys can fly it because they are use to  having a stick in each hand.  

     And finally, there will be a stealth version with  a totally operational Klingon cloaking device.  Imagine the fun you  could have making high speed passes down the runway or orbiting over the nearest  nudist colony with out being seen.  The LSA version of this one will use  vortex generators so you can go really slow over the nudist  colony.  

     That's the latest news from the SHIT HOT Lightning  design group.  

 Buz



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  [quote][b]

Rick

Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 113
Location: Colonial Beach, Virginia

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2007 6:51 pm Post subject: Four Seater

LOL,

Maybe some beer drinking  taking place at a design meeting today  in 

Williamsburg...eh Buz??



8^)



Rick



 	  Quote: 	
		  From: N1BZRich(at)aol.com

Reply-To: lightning-list(at)matronics.com

To: lightning-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: Four Seater

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 21:36:56 EST



Lightning news release scheduled for 1 April 2007.

     The Secret Highly Intelligent Technical -  Hybrid Operational Team

Lightning design group plans to announce  several new designs on 1 April 

this year.

This design group relies on  each member's input and only meets after a 

long

days work when cans of beer  are available for inspiration.  The most 

recent

meeting was two weeks  ago.

     Now, to answer your question, yes, they have come  up with a four 

seat,

twin engine Lightning that will look much like the  F-82 Twin Mustang.  

Imagine

two Lightning fuselages joined together with a  stub wing and

stabilizer/elevator between them, and then standard wings on the  outboard 

side of each

fuselage.  Each fuselage will carry two and each will  have stick and 

rudders.  So

with twin fuselages, imagine the crew  coordination as to which of the four

people will be flying the airplane at any  one time.

     Another new concept will be the road-able Lightning  which will be a 

two

seat sports car with foldable wings and also floats for  maritime 

operations

to use when you are too drunk to fly or drive.

     And for the R-44 guys in Wisconsin, there will  definitely be a 

vertical

takeoff version of the Lightning.  It will be a  200 HP Jabiru powered 

craft.

An 80 HP engine in the nose to go forward and  a 120 HP engine in the 

baggage

compartment to power the rotors.  Yes, it  will be tail heavy, but 

helicopter

guys can fly it because they are use to  having a stick in each hand.

     And finally, there will be a stealth version with  a totally 

operational

Klingon cloaking device.  Imagine the fun you  could have making high speed

passes down the runway or orbiting over the nearest  nudist colony with out

being seen.  The LSA version of this one will use  vortex generators so you 

can go

really slow over the nudist  colony.

     That's the latest news from the SHIT HOT Lightning  design group.

Buz

<BR><BR><BR>**************************************<BR> AOL now offers free

email to everyone.  Find out more about what's free from AOL at

http://www.aol.com.


	


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lozhoffman(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2007 8:01 pm Post subject: Four Seater

Buz, 

There I was on the edge of my seat drinking in every

word of your post and visualising your amazing array

of LFDs (Lightning Flying Divergents). Think it was

about the point of the 'Klingon Cloaking device' that

I began to suspect that you may not have been totally

serious!

Laurie



--- N1BZRich(at)aol.com wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   Lightning news release scheduled for 1 April 2007.

     The Secret Highly Intelligent Technical - 

 Hybrid Operational Team 

 Lightning design group plans to announce  several

 new designs on 1 April this year.  

 This design group relies on  each member's input and

 only meets after a long 

 days work when cans of beer  are available for

 inspiration.  The most recent 

 meeting was two weeks  ago.  

     Now, to answer your question, yes, they have

 come  up with a four seat, 

 twin engine Lightning that will look much like the 

 F-82 Twin Mustang.  Imagine 

 two Lightning fuselages joined together with a  stub

 wing and 

 stabilizer/elevator between them, and then standard

 wings on the  outboard side of each 

 fuselage.  Each fuselage will carry two and each

 will  have stick and rudders.  So 

 with twin fuselages, imagine the crew  coordination

 as to which of the four 

 people will be flying the airplane at any  one time.

  

     Another new concept will be the road-able

 Lightning  which will be a two 

 seat sports car with foldable wings and also floats

 for  maritime operations 

 to use when you are too drunk to fly or drive. 

     And for the R-44 guys in Wisconsin, there will 

 definitely be a vertical 

 takeoff version of the Lightning.  It will be a  200

 HP Jabiru powered craft.  

 An 80 HP engine in the nose to go forward and  a 120

 HP engine in the baggage 

 compartment to power the rotors.  Yes, it  will be

 tail heavy, but helicopter 

 guys can fly it because they are use to  having a

 stick in each hand.  

     And finally, there will be a stealth version

 with  a totally operational 

 Klingon cloaking device.  Imagine the fun you  could

 have making high speed 

 passes down the runway or orbiting over the nearest 

 nudist colony with out 

 being seen.  The LSA version of this one will use 

 vortex generators so you can go 

 really slow over the nudist  colony.  

     That's the latest news from the SHIT HOT

 Lightning  design group.  

 Buz



<BR><BR><BR>**************************************<BR>
	


 	  Quote: 	
		   AOL now offers free 

 email to everyone.  Find out more about what's free

 from AOL at 

 http://www.aol.com.

 


	


 

8:00? 8:25? 8:40? Find a flick in no time 

with the Yahoo! Search movie showtime shortcut.

http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#news

Kayberg(at)AOL.COM
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 4:55 am Post subject: Four Seater

For some reason I am feeling thoughtful this morning, however the 5th cup  of coffee is still in my cup.

  

 To me the clearest truth about the Lightning is that it optimises the 3300  Jabiru engine with the lightest, most aerodynamic airframe in the simpleist  build manner on the market today.  

  

 If you consider going to a 4 seater, you have to redo all of that statement  for a limited market.  You need a different engine that will still be  lighter than any alternitives, be well proven and affordable.  There isnt  one. Yes, I know about the 8 cyl Jabiru, rotaries, blah, blah, blah.    But the only proven engines in the 150- 250 hp range are Lycoming or  Continental.  And they are too damn heavy.  Yes I know about the  Subaru based ones.  Too expensive and too heavy.... not to mention too  complicated.  And the big Jab is unproven.

  

 If you want to revise the airframe, you start by adding a longer nose and a  longer tail and heavier everything else.  Bigger wings,  bigger  tail,  bigger gear and bigger tanks.   That means heavier and  more expensive.  Much more expensive.  The Lightning costs about $75 a  pound completely built.  I would expect a 4 seater to weigh at least 250  lbs more, or $18,750.  Realistically,  I would think a 4 seat  Lightning would cost just under $100,000.   For less than half that  amount, you could get a used Mooney M20-C and have the same performance in a  prooven aircraft.

  

 The real clincher is mission profile.   When is the last time you  saw a 4 or more seat airplane depart your favorite strip with a full  load?   Or looking at it another way,  dont most airplanes flying  during afternoons and weekends only have one person in them ...unless they are  training?   Most of us are not Buz Rich.  We dont have the  mission profile  that allows us to put 200 hours on a homebuilt airframe in  less than a year AND fly the damn thing in head-bangin weather with a better  instrument panel than he had when flying F-4s.   I know, I know, we  dream about it.

  

 But at some point, we have to face reality.   The market for a  homebuilt airplane with four seats is only slightly better than the market for  flying cars.  And the design requirements are only slightly easier.   

  

 But if someone went to Nick, Pete, et al, with a check for 5 million  dollars that they would be happy to never see again, then at least the first 1  or 2 could be built.   Any takers?

  

 Doug Koenigsberg

  

  



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  [quote][b]

N1BZRich(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 10:11 am Post subject: Four Seater

In a message dated 3/11/2007 8:58:04 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  Kayberg(at)aol.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  the    clearest truth about the Lightning is that it optimises the 3300 Jabiru engine    with the lightest, most aerodynamic airframe in the simpleist build manner on    the market today. 	


 

 Well said, Doug.  And that is the secret to the success of the  Lightning design and performance capability.  That, plus the builder's  assist program that allows people who are either very busy, or who don't trust  their own building abilities to complete and fly a homebuilt airplane.  The  Lightning team (and that includes you guys at Green "Acres") truly are making  dreams come true.  

 Keep up the excellent work!

 Buz



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  [quote][b]

ultralight.flyer(at)gmail
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 1:08 pm Post subject: Four Seater

4 seater... see, J400 series, or even MCR 4... In Portugal "we" bilt more than 100 MCR's per year for entire Europe. Dyn Aero is very interested in J3300 engine, so they can start with new and improoved airplanes. Now, i think that a "Lightning" with 4 seats (Lets call it "Thunter") could be an exelent oportunity for the big 4 seater market... at least in Europe. Thunder would be certainly the best choice for PPA's (PPL's). I'll be waiting. Wanna drafts from "Lightning" with 4 seats? Lets work... 

 



-- 

Miguel Maia de Loureiro

Ultralight Pilot Suport Services

Cel.: +351 91 419 21 04

e-Mail: ultralight.flyer(at)gmail.com (ultralight.flyer(at)gmail.com)   [quote][b]

pdukor1(at)tampabay.rr.co
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 4:48 pm Post subject: Four Seater

See what you have started! I'll wait for S & F to see the prototype 4.



Paul 

Sarasota, Florida



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