Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-le
April 15, 2012 - May 06, 2012
| From: | owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com |
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kringle
Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2012 12:10 PM
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
Here's where I am. I could get the temp compression stud out after mounting
the wing tip with a saw if I had to. Jack, thanks for the info on
tammeling. I assume it is imperative that the points you pick on the front
and rear spars must line up from fore to aft exactly to get everything
square.
--------
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
Gary is correct. Trammel it before the LE and TE are attached.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Boothe
Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2012 1:40 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wing Tip Bows
Additional thought, John...I think it was Skip Gadd who talked about
trammeling at least 3 times, during each phase of the construct. Seems like
it would be a mistake to trammel the first time after the leading and
trailing edges are on.
Gary from Cool
NX308MB
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kringle
Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2012 9:10 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wing Tip Bows
Here's where I am. I could get the temp compression stud out after mounting
the wing tip with a saw if I had to. Jack, thanks for the info on
tammeling. I assume it is imperative that the points you pick on the front
and rear spars must line up from fore to aft exactly to get everything
square.
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370866#370866
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/tram4_192.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/tram3_849.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/tram2_154.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/tram1_203.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris" <catdesigns(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
John
I made my wing tips out of poplar. Looks like I used 7 layers. It doesn't
matter how many you use. I made them thin enough so they did not need
soaking to bend. To form the tip I traced a wing rib on the back of my wing
rib jig. I also marked where the end of the tapered end of the spars are.
I then measured and drew a center line down the traced wing rib. I measured
half inch above and below to draw the outer lines of the wing tip. Make sure
you adjust the line so it coincides with the wing spars. I covered the
board with plastic wrap, then hammered in 10 or 15 nails along the outer
lines. Trial fit the sticks. After I had it all set up, I quickly glued
each stick with T-88, stacked them together, covered them with plastic wrap
and clamped with 1-inch binder clips. After they dried I sanded off the
excess glue and rounded off the outer edges with my router but a plane or
sand paper would work too.
Some pictures
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/IMG_5056.JPG
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/IMG_5058.JPG
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/IMG_6043.JPG
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/IMG_6044.JPG
Installed
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/IMG_5559.JPG
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/IMG_5560.JPG
Chris
Sacramento, Ca
Westcoastpiet.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kringle
Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2012 8:27 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wing Tip Bows
Gary,
My plan shows 4 pieces of 1/4" laminated together. Did you soak and bend
the plywood to shape? Did you then glue them together, clamp, and sand to
the finished piece?
John
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370860#370860
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris" <catdesigns(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | 8-32 Machine Screws |
John,
If you talking about the leading edge of the wing, I have no screws or
bolts. I clamped it on.
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/IMG_5045.JPG
Chris
Sacramento, Ca
Westcoastpiet.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kringle
Sent: Saturday, April 14, 2012 12:30 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: 8-32 Machine Screws
Can I use standard hardware screws to attach the leading edge or is this
screw required to be aircraft grade? If so I can't find them in the ACS
catalog.
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370787#370787
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
Without the wing tip bow in place we could still trammel the inner bay, correct?
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370896#370896
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
Yes.
Gary Boothe
NX308MB
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kringle
Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2012 2:53 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wing Tip Bows
Without the wing tip bow in place we could still trammel the inner bay,
correct?
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370896#370896
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Traveling to DFW area |
| From: | Ken Bickers <bickers.ken(at)gmail.com> |
If anyone on the list in the Dallas/Fort Worth metroplex would welcome
a visit next Saturday afternoon, April 21, I'll be flying into DFW
and will have a rental car and a bit of free time on my hands. I'd be
delighted to spend an hour or two talking Pietenpols or lending a
hand. Let me know off-list. Cheers, Ken
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
| From: | "dwilson" <marwilson(at)charter.net> |
During Oshkosh 2004 we covered Mr. Pietenpol's 1966 Aircamper. It is the plane
that is on display in the Pietenpol Hanger. Here is how he constructed the one
piece wing in 1966.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370912#370912
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/wingtip_compression_strut_214.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
| From: | "dwilson" <marwilson(at)charter.net> |
Sorry, This should look better than the previous... The compression strut was
3/4 X 3/4.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370913#370913
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/wingtip_compression_strut_209.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Dangerous Dave's Piet |
Someone asked about the status of Dangerous Dave's "quick-build" Piet.
I emailed him a few months ago since we haven't heard much after the first
flight, and he didn't say a lot. Sounds like it hasn't flown much, that
he's been very busy and the plane has moved airports. I too got the
impression that he was disappointed with it's performance, but I think it
was a pretty high runway.
That's about all I Know. Dave, if you're still following the list, we'd
sure be interested in a flight report.
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "skipgadd(at)earthlink.net" <skipgadd(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
You are right Gary, had to look in the archives to recall what I said, Aug
8 2009. I agree with you, it is a good idea to measure corner to corner
both ways frequently while assembling the wing, so the wing is as close as
possible to square before you do the actual trammeling with turnbuckles.
Skip
> [Original Message]
> From: Gary Boothe <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
> To:
> Date: 4/15/2012 1:47:41 PM
> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wing Tip Bows
>
>
> Additional thought, John...I think it was Skip Gadd who talked about
> trammeling at least 3 times, during each phase of the construct. Seems
like
> it would be a mistake to trammel the first time after the leading and
> trailing edges are on.
>
> Gary from Cool
> NX308MB
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aileron deflection |
| From: | "899PM" <rockriverrifle(at)hotmail.com> |
Using .040" thick piano hinges for my ailerons and dimpling for 10-32 flatheads(to
set flush), I get 20.6 degrees of down travel before the hinge plates close
tight on each other.
--------
PAPA MIKE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370924#370924
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
That's cool to see. My wing tips look a lot like this one.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | considering a piet build |
| From: | "nightmare" <pauldonahuepilot(at)yahoo.com> |
how does it fly ( climb, handle, stall , ground hanle) compared to a cub. previously
owned a 1940 c85 cub. thinking of building one and teaching my two boys
( now 8 and 12 years) how to fly in it.
also; love the wood struts, and gear, do builders just cover in spar varnish or
fiberglass or just epoxy resin?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370934#370934
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | considering a piet build |
Nightmare?
First, what is your real name and where do you live? We kind of like to
know names so we can put them with faces when we meet at Brodhead.
Second, a Pietenpol flies more like a Cub than anything else I've ever flown
- that's why I built one. I used to own a 1946 J-3 with a Continental 65
and chose to build a Pietenpol because I couldn't afford to buy a Cub at
today's prices.
I will say having flown both types, the Cub style "Improved" Pietenpol gear
is easier to land than the straight axle wire wheel variety. If I were
building one with an eye towards teaching kids to fly in it, I would build
the Cub-Style gear.
As for the wood struts, I have laminated spruce landing gear struts on mine
and simply coated them with 4 coats of epoxy varnish, and they've held up
very well in nearly 8 years of flying. For wooden lift struts and cabane
struts I expect epoxy varnish would do even better (the landing gear takes
more abuse from tall grass, rocks, etc.).
Good Luck!
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of nightmare
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 9:47 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: considering a piet build
how does it fly ( climb, handle, stall , ground hanle) compared to a cub.
previously owned a 1940 c85 cub. thinking of building one and teaching my
two boys ( now 8 and 12 years) how to fly in it.
also; love the wood struts, and gear, do builders just cover in spar
varnish or fiberglass or just epoxy resin?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370934#370934
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Wing Hinge Strap |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
Since the center section wing straps go on the inside of the wing straps I am assuming
the plywood on the wing must be cut out for clearance? Looks like I missed
this on the plans :(
John
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370941#370941
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/ws1_700.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
| From: | "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net> |
I'll be darn... the plans don't show it that way! The only braces I have are the
ones shown in the plans (in red), but the plans also show a spruce wing tip
bow, where I made mine from white pine. Perhaps I should look at adding the
compression strut and additional braces that the 66 model have.
--------
Mark Chouinard
Wings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on Fuselage
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370945#370945
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/wing_braces_147.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Wing Hinge Strap |
One of those little areas in the plans that simply can't be built as drawn.
Vi Kapler put those in just to see if you were paying attention.
The straps are .090" thick, or nearly the same as a piece of 3/32" plywood.
You'll have to figure out how to arrange the doublers so the straps can
overlap each other. I chose to just put the plywood doublers on the wing
spars and omit them on the centersection spars, allowing the wing straps to
just slip over the centersection straps as shown in the photo below:
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kringle
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 10:36 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wing Hinge Strap
Since the center section wing straps go on the inside of the wing straps I
am assuming the plywood on the wing must be cut out for clearance? Looks
like I missed this on the plans :(
John
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370941#370941
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/ws1_700.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Hinge Strap |
| From: | "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net> |
You are right John, but it isn't really pointed out in the plans.
--------
Mark Chouinard
Wings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on Fuselage
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370946#370946
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Hinge Strap |
If it is not too late John, you can add another piece of plywood under your CS
straps to make room for the wing strap.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
Nightmare, welcome.
I can't answer any flying characteristic questions as my plane is still being built.
However, on the wood...a varnish or some sort of wood protectant is needed.
I use spar varnish on mine.
Personally, I am fine with call signs.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Hinge Strap |
| From: | "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net> |
Or you can just remove your wing straps and Dremel/file/sand the material you need
removed for clearance.
--------
Mark Chouinard
Wings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on Fuselage
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370950#370950
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Hofmann <jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
As an owner of both I have to concur with what Jack stated. The Piet is
very similar to the Cub in lot of ways. A few observations below:
The Piet is a bit faster. My Cub is slow and 502rocket is pretty quick.
I cruise easily at 75-77 and my Cub cruises at about 72.
The sight lines are similar. Backseat solo gives the same lack of
visibility that at Cub gives, especially on the ground. It is easier to
lean your head out of the Piet to see around.
Major flight numbers are about the same for both. Climb and final speeds
the same. The Piet does have a much worse glide ratio than a Cub. Just
plan accordingly.
Stall is sharper than a Cub. Nothing bad but it drops quickly and is
easily picked up with proper technique. Te be fair I have vortex
generators on the Cub so it does not really stall at all. It just kind
of mushes and nods its head.
The Cub is much easier to load/unload and is more capable of giving the
fat guy a ride. It does have seven more feet of wing and is more
tolerant of CG and gross weight issues.
The Cub has brakes for both occupants, a must for instruction. I have
not seen a Piet that had brakes in the front but I bet it has been done
with weight penalties and seldom use.
The Cub rides turbulence better. When in bumps in a Cub one seems to
instinctively be able to predict the airplane's response. In the
Pietenpol it is "wahoo" we are along for the ride. I just pull the
shoulder strap a little tighter. My daughter loves it because "it is
like being in a roller coaster."
Cub has a door that closes and some semblance of cabin heat, however,
nothing is quite like the feeling of open cockpit.
That is about all I can think of for now.
-john-
John Hofmann
Vice-President, Information Technology
The Rees Group, Inc.
2424 American Lane
Madison, WI 53704
Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150
Fax: 608.443.2474
Email: jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com
On Apr 16, 2012, at 10:18 AM, Michael Perez wrote:
> Nightmare, welcome.
>
> I can't answer any flying characteristic questions as my plane is
still being built. However, on the wood...a varnish or some sort of wood
protectant is needed. I use spar varnish on mine.
>
> Personally, I am fine with call signs.
>
> Michael Perez
> Pietenpol HINT Videos
> Karetaker Aero
> www.karetakeraero.com
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
| From: | "pineymb" <airltd(at)mts.net> |
Another wing tip bow example with a built up last rib and capping for additional
strength. Not sure how much difference this makes when in compression but probably
can't hurt.
--------
Adrian M
Winnipeg, MB
Canada
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370951#370951
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc00400_132.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc00375_149.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Need some help....off topic... |
Jim, I rebuilt a Piper PA22 a few years back and when I got ready to fly it,
I took the spark plugs out and turned the engine over with the starter until
the oil pressure built up. I then reinstalled the plugs, put fuel in the
tanks, and started the engine normally. The engine ran fine until I sold it
a couple of years later. A little MMO in the oil also helped a lot. It
frees the rings and gives much better compression. Chuck
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 14, 2012 7:13 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Need some help....off topic...
>
>
> A pilot friend passed on about a year (or two) ago and his Champ has just
> been sitting...his daughter owns it now....it's on a grass strip about a
> mile from us.
>
> I've recommended to her that we at least pull it out of the hangar and
> start it from time to time. And she's fine with me taking it up if I
> want. (Of course I'm fine with that!). Mainly I hate to see it waste
> away...and it will if we don't do something.
>
> So do we just start propping to get it started or is there some process we
> need to follow for an aircraft that's been sitting for so long?
>
> Sorry for such an "off topic" request but....well....maybe this could lead
> to me getting some tailwheel time (yes, I know, ONLY after getting some
> tailwheel training...) but that might make me a better Piet pilot, right?
> :-)
>
> If someone has experience with such and could tell me what to watch for
> and give some pointers it would be appreciated.
>
> Offlist please.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim in Pryor (where the storms might pass us by this time....)
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Hinge Strap |
| From: | "Catdesigns" <Catdesigns(at)att.net> |
As it typical when building a Pietenpol, if you look closely, its on the plans.
Take note of the wood grain on the drawings then you will notice there is 3/32-inch
plywood under the straps on the wing side and a triangle piece of 3/32-inch
ply that is below (below not under) the strap on the center section side.
Center section side
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/IMG_1978.JPG
Wing Side
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/Center_Fitting_Back_Side.JPG
--------
Chris
Sacramento, CA
WestCoastPiet.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370967#370967
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Need some help....off topic... |
| From: | "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net> |
Jim, I know the guy who did some of the maintenance and quite possibly the last
annual on that airplane. Shot you a text.
--------
Mark Chouinard
Wings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on Fuselage
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370968#370968
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Hinge Strap |
| From: | "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net> |
I think what John is talking about is the area in red. It looks pretty obvious,
but isn't really called out as needing clearance.
--------
Mark Chouinard
Wings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on Fuselage
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370975#370975
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/wing_attach_171.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Bows |
| From: | "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> |
When I read some of the replies, mentioning how the wingtip bow is actually a compression
strut, I thought "that can't be right", since it is curved, and it
sits out on the ends of the spars (fastened with brackets and screws). But then
I took another look at the plans, and saw that it actually would act as a compression
strut. Not really an ideal design , since all of the compressive forces
are actually acting on the screws, rather than on the strut itself. While
the 1966 BHP wing shown in Dan's photo does add a little bit of weight, it does
seem to be a better design (in terms of providing a proper compression strut
at the wing tip). When the time comes, I think I'll build mine like that (or
similarly).
Bill C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370976#370976
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob edson" <robertse(at)centurytel.net> |
Update with tail on and wheels on. some more pictures, Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Hinge Strap |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
Mark is correct but with the right tool (laminate trimmer) the job was easy. Thanks
to all for the help. I love this list!
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370979#370979
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/strap4_532.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/strap3_130.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/strap2_658.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
| From: | "nightmare" <pauldonahuepilot(at)yahoo.com> |
Wow , you guys are great. thanks for all the quick responses. My name is Paul Donahue
and i live in royal palm beach florida (5 miles west of west palm beach
int'l). If you don't mind , here is a couple of more questions for you.
1.Has any one built a stretch wing Piet? (i know, stick to the plans)
2. Do builders use AN hardware or is the grade 8 nuts and bolts at the hardware
store sufficient? (i believe it is same grade steel, usually courser threading
though at hardware store)
3. I saw Keri Anns webpage, beautiful bird. any nonbias opinions on the removable
wing option ? would love to have option of removing or even folding the
wings to bring home.
4. are there any piet builders / owners near me?
5. how about opinions on building out of poplar?
Thanks again; seems like a tight knit group
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370982#370982
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
| From: | gboothe5(at)comcast.net |
Paul,
I can only answer one of those: Mine is almost all Poplar (not yet flying); but
when it does fly, it won't be the only Poplar Piet.
Oh...stay away from that non-A/C hardware stuff!
Welcome!
Gary from Cool
------Original Message------
From: nightmare
Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
ReplyTo: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: considering a piet build
Sent: Apr 16, 2012 1:02 PM
Wow , you guys are great. thanks for all the quick responses. My name is Paul Donahue
and i live in royal palm beach florida (5 miles west of west palm beach
int'l). If you don't mind , here is a couple of more questions for you.
1.Has any one built a stretch wing Piet? (i know, stick to the plans)
2. Do builders use AN hardware or is the grade 8 nuts and bolts at the hardware
store sufficient? (i believe it is same grade steel, usually courser threading
though at hardware store)
3. I saw Keri Anns webpage, beautiful bird. any nonbias opinions on the removable
wing option ? would love to have option of removing or even folding the
wings to bring home.
4. are there any piet builders / owners near me?
5. how about opinions on building out of poplar?
Thanks again; seems like a tight knit group
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370982#370982
Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Charvet <bencharvet(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
1. I know of at least one "stretched wing" Piet that was up in the
Jacksonville area (Pat Green's)
2. You can't easily buy Grade 8 bolts in 3/16 size, and judging by my
trip to the hardware store yesterday, I'm not sure they dould be any
cheaper. In Florida you can get anything from Aircraft Spruce out of
Atlanta in 2 days.
4, I'm located in Titusville, just 150 miles north of you.
5. I built my Pietenpol out of Douglas Fir that I bought locally, and
used Okoume plywood that I bought in Palm Beach County.
This really is a good group and they were all a great help during my build.
Ben Charvet
Titusville, Fl
NX866BC, 125 hrs so far
On 4/16/2012 4:02 PM, nightmare wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "nightmare"
>
> Wow , you guys are great. thanks for all the quick responses. My name is Paul
Donahue and i live in royal palm beach florida (5 miles west of west palm beach
int'l). If you don't mind , here is a couple of more questions for you.
> 1.Has any one built a stretch wing Piet? (i know, stick to the plans)
> 2. Do builders use AN hardware or is the grade 8 nuts and bolts at the hardware
store sufficient? (i believe it is same grade steel, usually courser threading
though at hardware store)
> 3. I saw Keri Anns webpage, beautiful bird. any nonbias opinions on the
removable wing option ? would love to have option of removing or even folding
the wings to bring home.
> 4. are there any piet builders / owners near me?
> 5. how about opinions on building out of poplar?
>
> Thanks again; seems like a tight knit group
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370982#370982
>
>
--
Ben Charvet, PharmD
Staff Pharmacist
Parrish Medical center
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
Paul,
Bill Rewey was always talking about building a "Super Pietenpol" with a
longer wing, to approximate the wing loading of a Cub. I don't know if any
have ever been built. Mine has a 6" longer than normal wingspan, but that
was done to increase the volume in the centersection to give more fuel
capacity. I will say that making such a change has dramatic ripple effects
running through the entire airplane. The best flying Pietenpols seem to be
the ones that were built closest to the plans.
As Gary said - use aircraft hardware. It is not that much more expensive
(maybe less than Grade 8 hardware), and the fine threads will be much more
effective for getting accurate torques and for preventing loosening due to
vibration. Besides, when you are getting bounced around by turbulence, it
is reassuring to not have to wonder if your hardware is going to fail.
Opinions on folding wings for a Piet? While that is always an attractive
option for people thinking of building an airplane, I've never seen it done
in practice. With a Pietenpol, I think it would be a pain due to having to
tighten and safety wire the turnbuckles on the bracing wires between the
struts every time you wanted to go flying. Also, many Pietenpols use simple
bronze bushings on their axles, and while that is more than adequate for the
amount of taxiing done at an airport, I wouldn't take any bets on how long a
bushing would last being towed at highway speeds. Of course you could load
it on a trailer, but that too is expensive. Weight is critical with these
airplanes, and any wing folding mechanism is going to add weight that you
can ill afford to add. As Walt evans used to say on this list "Simplicate
and add Lightness". A wing folding mechanism does neither.
There are severl Pietenpol builders/flyers in Florida. I'll leave it to
them to contact you.
As Gary said, there have been several Piets built of poplar. It is a good
light wood. Not as light as spruce (Poplar is 16% heavier than sitka
spruce), but somewhat stronger (Poplar's numbers generally run about 20%
higher than spruce), so it has about the same strength to weight ratio. It
works easily (nearly as easy as spruce, and much better than Douglas Fir,
the other common choiceof non-aircraft grade woods). So all in all it is
not a bad choice, particularly if you have a lot of experience in grading
and selecting wood. Bear in mind that if you are choosing a wood other than
aircraft grade spruce just to save money, the cost of the wood in a
Pietenpol is something around 10% of the total price of the airplane, using
aircraft spruce. You will spend so much more money on other things
(primarily the engine) that the cost of wood is insignificant.
Good luck with all your choices.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of nightmare
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 4:03 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: considering a piet build
Wow , you guys are great. thanks for all the quick responses. My name is
Paul Donahue and i live in royal palm beach florida (5 miles west of west
palm beach int'l). If you don't mind , here is a couple of more questions
for you.
1.Has any one built a stretch wing Piet? (i know, stick to the plans)
2. Do builders use AN hardware or is the grade 8 nuts and bolts at the
hardware store sufficient? (i believe it is same grade steel, usually
courser threading though at hardware store)
3. I saw Keri Anns webpage, beautiful bird. any nonbias opinions on the
removable wing option ? would love to have option of removing or even
folding the wings to bring home.
4. are there any piet builders / owners near me?
5. how about opinions on building out of poplar?
Thanks again; seems like a tight knit group
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370982#370982
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
| From: | "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> |
Hi Paul - Welcome. This group is a family, and like all families you'll find some
dysfunction. Spend some time here and you'll figure out whose advice you
really want. There are a lot of smart, talented people in the group. I personally
seek guidance from builders who have completed a plane and fly it a lot.
There's something about "flight proven" that you just can't beat. You'll get
a lot of advice from fellows who haven't finished their planes and who don't
have their pilot's license. They're not necessarily wrong, but they're strictly
theoretical.
Your questions:
1) Jack Phillips built a stretch wing and says he regrets it.
2) AN Hardware.
3) If you need removable/folding wings you may want to consider another design.
4) There are builders in FL.
5) Gary Boothe has built an entire airplane from poplar. His workmanship is superb.
I'm flying wooden wing struts Gary built for me. Anyway, it's up to you.
Spruce is the standard, and the spruce from Aircraft Spruce & Specialty has
been graded. In the grand scheme of things there's not that much price advantage.
My comments:
1) Get familiar with searching the list archives.
2) Get the 4 Tony Bingelis books from EAA. EAA's wood and welding books are also
good. Finally, the FAA AC 43-13...whatever is the bible.
3) Plan on attending Brodhead.
Again, welcome.
--------
Kevin "Axel" Purtee
NX899KP
Austin/San Marcos, TX
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370988#370988
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
| From: | "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net> |
Just wanted to say welcome, Paul! I'm still building, so can't offer a lot of
practical advice.
As Jack said, "Good luck with your choices"... there are plenty to consider.
--------
Mark Chouinard
Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370989#370989
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | For Our New Friends - Who Builds and Flies |
| From: | "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> |
I encourage our new members to pay particular attention to people on the list who
have built their own airplanes and who fly them a lot. Please add names of
active builder/flyers to the list so they know who I'm talking about. I did
not include people I have not seen on the list.
List members who built their planes and actively fly: Mike Cuy, Jack Phillips,
Larry Williams, Don Emch, Shad & Gary Bell, Randy Bush, Ben Charvet, Greg Cardinal,
Lowell Frank, Dan Helsper, Hans van der Voort, Tim Mickel, PF Beck, Kevin
Purtee.
Cuy, Phillips, Williams, Emch, the Bells, Bush and Purtee fly several hundred mile
cross-country flights.
Please feel free to add on. I know I didn't get everyone.
--------
Kevin "Axel" Purtee
NX899KP
Austin/San Marcos, TX
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370992#370992
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: For Our New Friends - Who Builds and Flies |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
Kevin,
As a relatively new member, I am aware of these people and seek them out when I
travel to Brodhead. Many on this list, including you, have met me but just don't
remember it. Although I greatly appreciate everyones suggestions and comments,
those builders and flyers you've named carry more weight when I make my
decisions. Thanks to all for your help.
John
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370994#370994
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
| From: | "nightmare" <pauldonahuepilot(at)yahoo.com> |
thank you for all the info. i'll search previous entries and order some books to
verify this is the plane for me. thanks; Paul Donahue
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370998#370998
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Wing Hinge Strap |
Another option (if not mentioned earlier) that many airplane designs do is
use 1/4 inch plates (doublers)-on the c/s spars, and 1/8 inch plates on t
he outboard wing spars.- this way the outboard -wing spar fittings fit
inside the c/s spar fittings.- The plywood spar doublers act to prevent t
he spars from splitting.- As you can see there are many ways to skin-th
is cat.
-
Shad-
-
From: Jack Phillips <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Wing Hinge Strap
Date: Monday, April 16, 2012, 10:52 AM
One of those little areas in the plans that simply can't be built as drawn.
-Vi Kapler put those in just to see if you were paying attention.
-
The straps are .090" thick, or nearly the same as a piece of 3/32" plywood.
- You'll have to figure out how to arrange the doublers so the straps can
overlap each other.- I chose to just put the plywood doublers on the win
g spars and omit them on the centersection spars, allowing the wing straps
to just slip over the centersection straps as shown in the photo below:
-
-
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
t-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kringle
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 10:36 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wing Hinge Strap
-
-
Since the center section wing straps go on the inside of the wing straps I
am assuming the plywood on the wing must be cut out for clearance?- Looks
like I missed this on the plans- :(
-
John
-
--------
John
-
-
-
-
Read this topic online here:
-
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370941#370941
-
-
-
-
Attachments:
-
http://forums.matronics.com//files/ws1_700.jpg
-
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aileron deflection |
| From: | "Mild Bill" <whfrank(at)charter.net> |
Bill Church wrote:
> Ralph,
>
> The plans don't list deflections for any of the control surfaces, but in the
UK, the LAA has documented the recommended travels, and shows typical aileron
deflection to be 15 Up and 20 Down (that translates to about 3" up and 3 1/2"
down.
> http://www.lightaircraftassociation.co.uk/engineering/TADs/047%20PIETENPOL%20AIRCAMPER.pdf
>
> Bill C.
If there is going to be any aileron differential at all, wouldn't a sane person
want more Up than Down?
--------
Bill Frank
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371004#371004
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
| From: | "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson(at)centurylink.net> |
Welcome to the group Paul. I live about 50 miles east of Pensacola,Fl. I extended
the wingspan on my 1 piece wing. It is 32' 6". The reason I did is my runway
is only 1300 feet long and hope to shorten the take off run some and maybe climb
a little bit better. I have not flown it yet but hope to have it ready in
a couple of months. As to the AN bolts and washers they are cheaper at Aircraft
Spruce than my local Lowes.
--------
Jerry Dotson
59 Daniel Johnson Rd
Baker, FL 32531
Started building NX510JD July, 2009
now covering and painting
21" wheels
Lycoming O-235 C2C
Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371005#371005
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Cardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: For Our New Friends - Who Builds and Flies |
Add Dick Navratil and Bob Poore. Lots of good, relevant experience.
Greg Cardinal
----- Original Message -----
From: "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil>
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 4:54 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: For Our New Friends - Who Builds and Flies
>
>
> I encourage our new members to pay particular attention to people on the
> list who have built their own airplanes and who fly them a lot. Please
> add names of active builder/flyers to the list so they know who I'm
> talking about. I did not include people I have not seen on the list.
>
> List members who built their planes and actively fly: Mike Cuy, Jack
> Phillips, Larry Williams, Don Emch, Shad & Gary Bell, Randy Bush, Ben
> Charvet, Greg Cardinal, Lowell Frank, Dan Helsper, Hans van der Voort, Tim
> Mickel, PF Beck, Kevin Purtee.
>
> Cuy, Phillips, Williams, Emch, the Bells, Bush and Purtee fly several
> hundred mile cross-country flights.
>
> Please feel free to add on. I know I didn't get everyone.
>
> --------
> Kevin "Axel" Purtee
> NX899KP
> Austin/San Marcos, TX
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370992#370992
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB" <steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil> |
| Subject: | OT The other end of the performance envelope. 787 |
>From the Beech list. Thot y'all might like the other perspective:
>From a friend of my friend the retired AA Captain
Pete.
_____
Hi All,
I just completed the first pilot training class on the 787 at United
Airlines, an airplane which is destined to replace the 767 and live for many
years after I retire. Here's what I've learned in 787 training so far. By
the way, last night we passed our MV (maneuvers validation) check ride, with
emergency after emergency, and the FAA observing. Tonight was our LOE
(line-oriented evaluation), again with FAA - this time 2 FAA observers. It's
0200 and I just got back to the hotel and poured a well-earned glass of wine
to celebrate. I now have a type rating in the 787. Phew. I'm pretty
confident this will be the last one for me.
I've summarized some of the major differences and unique features of the 787
versus more traditional "old school" airplanes like the 777 (not kidding) -
from the pilot's viewpoint. Our "Differences" course takes 11 days to gain
an FAA type rating, which is a "common" type rating with the 777. The course
has been like drinking from a fire hose, but has finally come together. Some
of our pilots attended Boeing's 5-day differences course, and deemed it
unacceptable. The FAA approved the Boeing 5-day course, but our guys decided
it lacked too much information. FAA is observing our checkrides now, and
taking our course as well, to certify the training. We're just the guinea
pigs.
A computer nerd would describe the 787 as 17 computer servers packaged in a
kevlar frame. The central brains is the Common Core System (CCS). Two Common
Computing Resources (CCRs) coordinate the communications of all the computer
systems, isolating faults and covering failed systems with working systems.
When battery power is first applied to the airplane in the morning, it takes
about 50 seconds for the L CCR to boot up. After this, a few displays light
up and you can start the APU. If there is a major loss of cockpit displays,
this may require a CCR reboot, which would take about a minute. Here are a
few of the major features and differences from the 777.
Electrics - Though a smaller plane, the 787 has 4 times the electric
generating power of the 777 - 1.4 gigawatts. Generators produce 235 VAC for
the big power users. Other systems use the traditional 115 VAC and 28 VDC.
There are 17 scattered Remote Power Distribution Units which power about 900
loads throughout the plane. The big power distribution system is in the aft
belly, along with a Power Electronics Cooling System (PECS). This is a
liquid cooling system for the large motor power distribution system. There's
also an Integrated Cooling System (ICS), which provides refrigerated air for
the galley carts and cabin air, and a Miscellaneous Equipment Cooling System
for Inflight Entertainment Equipment.
If 3 of the 4 engine generators fail, the APU starts itself. The APU drives
two generators, and can be operated up to the airplane's max altitude of
43,000 feet. If you lose all 4 engine generators, the RAT (ram air turbine)
drops out (like a windmill), powering essential buses. (It also provides
hydraulic power to flight controls if needed).
If you lose all 4 engine generators and the two APU generators (a really bad
day), you are down to Standby Power. The RAT will drop out and provide
power, but even if it fails, you still have the autopilot and captain's
flight director and instruments, FMC, 2 IRSs, VHF radios, etc. If you're
down to batteries only, with no RAT, you'd better get it on the ground, as
battery time is limited. Brakes and antiskid are electric - 28V - so you
don't lose brakes or antiskid even when you're down to just standby power.
Normal flight controls are hydraulic with a couple exceptions. Engine driven
and electric hydraulic pumps operate at 5000 psi (versus normal 3000 psi) to
allow for smaller tubing sizes and actuators, thus saving weight. If you
lose all 3 hydraulic systems (another bad day), you still have two spoiler
panels on each wing which are electrically powered all the time, as is the
stabilizer trim. You can still fly the airplane (no flaps, though). If
you're having an even worse day and you lose all hydraulics and all
generators, flight control power is still coming from separate Permanent
Magnet Generators (PMGs) which produce power even if both engines quit and
are windmilling. If the PMGs fail, too, your flight controls will be powered
by the 28 V standby bus.
If you lose all 3 pitot/static systems or air data computers, the airplane
reverts to angle of attack speed (converts AOA to IAS), and this is
displayed on the normal PFDs (primary flight displays) airspeed indicator
tapes. GPS altitude is substituted for air data altitude and displayed on
the PFD altimeter tapes. Very convenient.
If you lose both Attitude and Heading Reference Units (AHRUs), it reverts to
the standby instrument built-in attitude & heading gyro, but displays this
on both pilot's PFDs for convenience.
If you lose both Inertial Reference Units, it will substitute GPS position,
and nothing is lost.
If someone turns one or both IRSs off in flight (I hate it when they do
that), you can realign them - as long as one of the GPSs is working!
There is no pneumatic system. The only engine bleed is used for that
engine's anti-ice. Wing anti-ice is electric. Each of two air conditioning
packs control two CACs, which are electric cabin air compressors. The four
CACs share two air inlets on the belly. Each pack controller controls two
CACs, but if a pack controller fails, the remaining pack controller takes
over control of all 4 CACs.
There are no circuit breakers in the cockpit. To check on them, or if you
get a message that one has opened (more likely), you select the CBIC
(circuit breaker indication and control) display on one of the MFDs (multi
function displays). There you can reset the virtual C/B if it is an
"electronic" circuit breaker. You can't reset a popped "thermal" circuit
breaker.
If you have an APU fire on the ground or inflight, the fire extinguishing
bottle is automatically discharged. If there is a cargo fire, the first two
of seven bottles will automatically discharge also.
There's a Nitrogen Generation System which provides automatic full-time
flammability protection by displacing fuel vapors in the fuel tanks with
nitrogen (Remember TWA 800?).
Like the 767 and 777, the 787 also has full CPDLC capability
(controller-to-pilot datalink communications). In addition, its full FANS
capability includes ADS-B in & out. The controller can uplink speed,
heading, and altitude changes to the airplane. These show up on a second
line right under the speed, heading and altitude displays on the mode
control panel. If you pilot wants to use them, he can press a XFR button
next to each window. The controller can even uplink a conditional clearance,
like - After passing point XYZ, climb to FL390. If you accept this, it will
do it automatically.
Fuel system - like the 777, the 787 has a fuel dump system which
automatically dumps down to your maximum landing weight, if that is what you
want. In addition, it has a Fuel Balance switch which automatically balances
your L & R main tanks for you. No more opening crossfeed valves and turning
off fuel pumps in flight. No more forgetting to turn them back on, either.
Flight Controls - An "Autodrag" function operates when the airplane is high
on approach and landing flaps have been selected. It extends the ailerons
and two most outboard spoilers, while maintaining airspeed, to assist in
glidepath capture from above, if you are high on the glideslope. The feature
removes itself below 500 feet.
Cruise flaps is an automated function when level at cruise. It symmetrically
moves the flaps, ailerons, flaperons, and spoilers based on weight, airspeed
and altitude to optimize cruise performance by varying the wing camber, thus
reducing drag.
Gust suppression - Vertical gust suppression enhances ride quality when in
vertical gusts and turbulence. It uses symmetric deflection of flaperons and
elevators to smooth the bumps. This should result in fewer whitecaps in
passengers' coffee and cocktails. Lateral gust suppression improves the ride
when on approach by making yaw commands in response to lateral gusts and
turbulence.
Instrument Approaches - The airplane is actually approved for autoland based
not only on ILS but on GLS approaches - GPS with Ground based augmentation
system, which corrects the GPS signals. GLS minimums are the same as CAT I
ILSs - 200' and 1/2 mile visibility. Our airline is not yet approved for GLS
autolandings yet, though we will be doing GLS approaches.
Special Cat I & II HUD approaches - These allow lower than normal minimums
when the Heads Up Devices are used at certain approved airports (HUDs). The
HUDs include runway centerline guidance which helps you stay on the
centerline on takeoff when visibility is greatly reduced. It uses either ILS
or GLS for this.
Cabin - Pressurization differential pressure maximum is 9.4 psid, so the
cabin altitude is only 6000 feet when at the max cruising altitude of 43,000
feet. There is a cockpit humidifier switch, and cabin air humidification is
fully automatic. Cabin windows are larger than other airplanes, and window
shading is electronic. The passenger can select 5 levels of shading, from
clear to black. The flight attendants can control the cabin lighting
temperature - mood lighting - to aid in dealing with changing time zones
(evening light after dinner, morning light to wake up, etc.).
Much of the cockpit seems like it was designed by Apple. The Control Display
Units (CDUs) are virtual, so you can move them from one MFD to another. In
fact, you can configure the displays in 48 different ways, I think, though
we have found a few favorites we will use to keep it simple. To move the
cursor from one MFD to another, you can either use a button, or you can
"flick" your finger across the trackpad (Cursor Control Device) to fling the
cursor from one screen to the next - much like an iPad.
I'm going home this morning, and will return for a 777 simulator ride before
I go back to work. They want to make sure we've still got the old-fashioned
legacy airplane in our brain before we fly the 777 again, even though it
shares a "common type rating". We won't get the first 787 until October, and
begin operations in November or December. At that time I'll return for at
least 4 days refresher training before beginning IOE - initial operating
experience in the airplane - with passengers.
What a ride. It may be "fuel efficient", but I'm glad someone else is paying
for the gas.
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick N" <horzpool(at)goldengate.net> |
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
Hi Paul
I completely agree with Jack and I built my last Piet with a center swction
a foot wider than plans to accomidate larger fuel tanks, then I built the
wings to plans. I notice the difference and have flight tested this plane
to 1300 lbs.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 3:56 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: considering a piet build
>
>
> Paul,
>
> Bill Rewey was always talking about building a "Super Pietenpol" with a
> longer wing, to approximate the wing loading of a Cub. I don't know if
> any
> have ever been built. Mine has a 6" longer than normal wingspan, but that
> was done to increase the volume in the centersection to give more fuel
> capacity. I will say that making such a change has dramatic ripple
> effects
> running through the entire airplane. The best flying Pietenpols seem to
> be
> the ones that were built closest to the plans.
>
> As Gary said - use aircraft hardware. It is not that much more expensive
> (maybe less than Grade 8 hardware), and the fine threads will be much more
> effective for getting accurate torques and for preventing loosening due to
> vibration. Besides, when you are getting bounced around by turbulence, it
> is reassuring to not have to wonder if your hardware is going to fail.
>
> Opinions on folding wings for a Piet? While that is always an attractive
> option for people thinking of building an airplane, I've never seen it
> done
> in practice. With a Pietenpol, I think it would be a pain due to having
> to
> tighten and safety wire the turnbuckles on the bracing wires between the
> struts every time you wanted to go flying. Also, many Pietenpols use
> simple
> bronze bushings on their axles, and while that is more than adequate for
> the
> amount of taxiing done at an airport, I wouldn't take any bets on how long
> a
> bushing would last being towed at highway speeds. Of course you could
> load
> it on a trailer, but that too is expensive. Weight is critical with these
> airplanes, and any wing folding mechanism is going to add weight that you
> can ill afford to add. As Walt evans used to say on this list "Simplicate
> and add Lightness". A wing folding mechanism does neither.
>
> There are severl Pietenpol builders/flyers in Florida. I'll leave it to
> them to contact you.
>
> As Gary said, there have been several Piets built of poplar. It is a good
> light wood. Not as light as spruce (Poplar is 16% heavier than sitka
> spruce), but somewhat stronger (Poplar's numbers generally run about 20%
> higher than spruce), so it has about the same strength to weight ratio.
> It
> works easily (nearly as easy as spruce, and much better than Douglas Fir,
> the other common choiceof non-aircraft grade woods). So all in all it is
> not a bad choice, particularly if you have a lot of experience in grading
> and selecting wood. Bear in mind that if you are choosing a wood other
> than
> aircraft grade spruce just to save money, the cost of the wood in a
> Pietenpol is something around 10% of the total price of the airplane,
> using
> aircraft spruce. You will spend so much more money on other things
> (primarily the engine) that the cost of wood is insignificant.
>
> Good luck with all your choices.
>
> Jack Phillips
> NX899JP
> Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of nightmare
> Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 4:03 PM
> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: considering a piet build
>
>
>
> Wow , you guys are great. thanks for all the quick responses. My name is
> Paul Donahue and i live in royal palm beach florida (5 miles west of west
> palm beach int'l). If you don't mind , here is a couple of more questions
> for you.
> 1.Has any one built a stretch wing Piet? (i know, stick to the plans)
> 2. Do builders use AN hardware or is the grade 8 nuts and bolts at the
> hardware store sufficient? (i believe it is same grade steel, usually
> courser threading though at hardware store)
> 3. I saw Keri Anns webpage, beautiful bird. any nonbias opinions on the
> removable wing option ? would love to have option of removing or even
> folding the wings to bring home.
> 4. are there any piet builders / owners near me?
> 5. how about opinions on building out of poplar?
>
> Thanks again; seems like a tight knit group
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370982#370982
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
Jerry, my wife and I are driving down to Destin on the 27th and I would like to
come up to see you sometime that weekend. What is your phone number.? Gardiner
----- Original Message ----
From: Jerry Dotson <jdotson(at)centurylink.net>
Sent: Mon, April 16, 2012 8:35:19 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: considering a piet build
Welcome to the group Paul. I live about 50 miles east of Pensacola,Fl. I
extended the wingspan on my 1 piece wing. It is 32' 6". The reason I did is my
runway is only 1300 feet long and hope to shorten the take off run some and
maybe climb a little bit better. I have not flown it yet but hope to have it
ready in a couple of months. As to the AN bolts and washers they are cheaper at
Aircraft Spruce than my local Lowes.
--------
Jerry Dotson
59 Daniel Johnson Rd
Baker, FL 32531
Started building NX510JD July, 2009
now covering and painting
21" wheels
Lycoming O-235 C2C
Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371005#371005
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cost of inspections |
| From: | "ldmill" <lorin.miller(at)emerson.com> |
Hi Malcom,
I do all the maintenance myself on the one I bought. My A&P charges me $225 to
do the annual condition inspection. He likes to supervise me pull the plugs and
clean/rotate them (Cont A-75), checks timing on both mags, checks the oil screen,
checks fuel screens, and then eyeballs everything really good. Before the
inspection I pull all the cowling, observation pannels and the seat backs,
lube all bearings and pulleys, pull the wheel pants and lube wheel bearings. Then
just take my time going over every nut and bolt. My personal pre-inspection
takes me about 3 or 4 hours. The A&P portion takes about 2 - 2.5 hours. This
year he wants to pull my metal prop and just make sure all is okay.
Lesson learned - you don't save money on annuals by building a plane like I thought
you would. I just doesn't cost that much in comparison to the rest of the
years expenses (mostly fuel).
Lorin
--------
Lorin Miller
Waiex N81YX
GN-1 N30PP
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371037#371037
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Inspection rings |
| From: | "giacummo" <mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com> |
Hello,
I am not putting any ring by the moment, I just want to understand, or know better
about the inspection rings.
As I saw in lots of pictures and drawings there are 2 kinds of them, ones have
an aluminium (I think Al) hatch to close them, and others have just a rounf piece
of fabric over the a plastic ring.
The procedure to inspect with the ones with the fabric cover ( I want to understand
) is: cut the fabric inside the hole, inpect, and put a nuew piece of fabric...
isn't it?
thank you
--------
Mario Giacummo
http://vgmk1.blogspot.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371041#371041
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Inspection rings |
Those rings hold the aluminum insp covers.
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Inspection rings
> From: mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com
> Date: Tue=2C 17 Apr 2012 06:48:54 -0700
> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>
m>
>
> Hello=2C
>
> I am not putting any ring by the moment=2C I just want to understand=2C o
r know better about the inspection rings.
> As I saw in lots of pictures and drawings there are 2 kinds of them=2C on
es have an aluminium (I think Al) hatch to close them=2C and others have ju
st a rounf piece of fabric over the a plastic ring.
> The procedure to inspect with the ones with the fabric cover ( I want to
understand ) is: cut the fabric inside the hole=2C inpect=2C and put a nuew
piece of fabric... isn't it?
>
> thank you
>
> --------
> Mario Giacummo
> http://vgmk1.blogspot.com
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371041#371041
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mario Giacummo <mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Inspection rings |
Understand.
thanks
Mario Giacummo
... .. .-.. .- .- ...- . -. - ..- .-. .- . ... .--. . .-.. .. --. .-.
--- ... .- --..-- .--. .-. --- -... .- .-.. .- .-. ..- - .. -. .- --..--
. ... -- --- .-. - .- .-.. !!!!!
2012/4/17 Doug Dever
> Those rings hold the aluminum insp covers.
>
> Doug Dever
> In beautiful Stow Ohio
>
>
> > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Inspection rings
> > From: mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com
> > Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2012 06:48:54 -0700
> > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> >
> mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com>
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > I am not putting any ring by the moment, I just want to understand, or
> know better about the inspection rings.
> > As I saw in lots of pictures and drawings there are 2 kinds of them,
> ones have an aluminium (I think Al) hatch to close them, and others have
> just a rounf piece of fabric over the a plastic ring.
> > The procedure to inspect with the ones with the fabric cover ( I want to
> understand ) is: cut the fabric inside the hole, inpect, and put a nuew
> piece of fabric... isn't it?
> >
> > thank you
> >
> > --------
> > Mario Giacummo
> > http://vgmk1.blogspot.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371041#371041
> >
> >======================
> &g======
> >
> >
> >
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
| From: | "nightmare" <pauldonahuepilot(at)yahoo.com> |
" I really
think that 110 hp made a difference but the longer wing also made a
difference. "
---
when you say " made a difference" , i assume in a good way, right?
also , is there much of a weight difference between a corvair 100 hp and a c-65
, c-85. thanks; Paul
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371064#371064
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Inspection rings |
| From: | helspersew(at)aol.com |
Mario,
The plastic rings are initially captured in the covering process. These the
n remain in that state until the first inspection, at which time they are c
ut inside the ring and then covered with the aluminum cap. I think that is
what your question is.
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
-----Original Message-----
From: giacummo <mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Tue, Apr 17, 2012 8:49 am
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Inspection rings
Hello,
I am not putting any ring by the moment, I just want to understand, or know
etter about the inspection rings.
s I saw in lots of pictures and drawings there are 2 kinds of them, ones ha
ve
n aluminium (I think Al) hatch to close them, and others have just a rounf
iece of fabric over the a plastic ring.
he procedure to inspect with the ones with the fabric cover ( I want to
nderstand ) is: cut the fabric inside the hole, inpect, and put a nuew piec
e of
abric... isn't it?
thank you
--------
ario Giacummo
ttp://vgmk1.blogspot.com
ead this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371041#371041
-= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum -
-= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse
-= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription,
-= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,
-= Photoshare, and much much more:
-
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-
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-= Same great content also available via the Web Forums!
-
-= --> http://forums.matronics.com
-
-========================
-= - List Contribution Web Site -
-= Thank you for your generous support!
-= -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
-= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-========================
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 787 differences training |
| From: | "aerocarjake" <flight.jake(at)gmail.com> |
I have been working on the 787 since it was a product development study in 1994
and I STILL would not post a story like that on the Pietenpol site. This site
is an escape from that complex world...!
Sometimes I tell people that during the day I work at the "world's largest airplane
factory" and at night I work at "the world's smallest airplane factory" -
my one car condo garage. Don't get me wrong, I love my job, yet find the Pietenpol
to be extremely personally gratifying...
--------
Jake Schultz - curator,
Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371071#371071
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
| From: | "Catdesigns" <Catdesigns(at)att.net> |
"My whole perspective has changed a bit since my trip home from Brodhead last
year where I had 2 near misses on disaster, too much for one trip.
Dick N"
I was curious about this statement so with a little internet snooping found this.
http://www.eaa25.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/eaa251108.pdf
--------
Chris
Sacramento, CA
WestCoastPiet.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371072#371072
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 787 differences training |
| From: | "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> |
Right now, 47 views on the aviation related post, 35 views on the rant... I guess
even some Piet folks find it interesting.
Why not just prohibit off topic posting?
Tools, wondering if that would make this post illegal as well...
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371073#371073
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Inspection rings |
| From: | "giacummo" <mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com> |
Yes, that was what i try the understand... and now another one.... how is the aluminium
cover attached to the ring?.. do not worry, something is going to come
to my mind.....
Thank you very much Dan.
Regards.
--------
Mario Giacummo
http://vgmk1.blogspot.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371074#371074
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Hofmann <jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Inspection rings |
Mario,
They are made to fit the inspection ring and are held by spring
pressure. The round ones are a standard size.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/cspages/de-nonslipcovers.php
-john-
John Hofmann
Vice-President, Information Technology
The Rees Group, Inc.
2424 American Lane
Madison, WI 53704
Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150
Fax: 608.443.2474
Email: jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com
On Apr 17, 2012, at 1:24 PM, giacummo wrote:
>
> Yes, that was what i try the understand... and now another one.... how
is the aluminium cover attached to the ring?.. do not worry, something
is going to come to my mind.....
>
> Thank you very much Dan.
>
> Regards.
>
> --------
> Mario Giacummo
> http://vgmk1.blogspot.com
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371074#371074
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: OT The other end of the performance envelope. 787 |
| From: | "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> |
I did the type of checkride he mentions in an Airbus A330 on the SAME DAY I soloed
a Pietenpol for the first time, which was also my first solo in a taildragger
and the first time I soloed a light civil airplane since 1983... That definitely
highlighted the differences.
Probably not surprisingly, I found the Piet solo to be a lot more challenging.
All the important decisions are left up to to your own lonesome self in the light
civil arena. No load control to help make sure it's legal, no dispatch checking
the weather, route, etc., no maintenance control and monster technical
operations center to help you decide if the plane is ready or not.
I even had to decide for myself if I was ready to fly it! No battery of instructors,
check airmen and feds making that decision for me.
Interesting reading. As incredible as it sounds (and is), that arena STILL doesn't
have all the resources available to a Piet pilot and a well equipped iPad...
Havn't been able to find the picture to save my soul, but my favorite Pietenpol
pic of all times was a picture of a classic Piet next to a B2 bomber. The caption
read something like: "next to the Piet I built my son, is the B2 my son
built..." I guess he was an engineer on the project and they managed to set
up the photo op when he delivered it to him. Again, both ends of the spectrum
sitting right next to each other.
Tools
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371078#371078
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Inspection rings |
| From: | "giacummo" <mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com> |
I thought they where different things..... thank you.
--------
Mario Giacummo
http://vgmk1.blogspot.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371081#371081
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Temperature Gauges W/O Electrical System |
| From: | "DaveG601XL" <david.m.gallagher(at)ge.com> |
Guys,
I am trying to figure out which temperature gauges (CHT & Oil) I can use that do
not require electricity to operate since I am using an A-65F without an electrical
system. I see a VDO CHT gauge advertised in Aircraft Spruce that says
it does not need electricity unless you want the unit lighted. I do not see a
similar note under any of the oil temp gauges. They all just say that they need
12VDC. The VDO web site did not help any since it seems to indicate that
all their gauges need voltage to operate.
Any recommendations on particular gauges or brands that have worked well?
Thanks,
--------
David Gallagher
Zodiac 601 XL-B: flying, 200+ hours now
Next project under construction: Aircamper
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371082#371082
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Temperature Gauges W/O Electrical System |
David
I have a non electric A75-8. The Oil Temperature is some form of capillary to Oil
Pressure mount at rear of engine. Works well.
Gerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Temperature Gauges W/O Electrical System |
| From: | Dave Nielsen <sentuchows(at)aol.com> |
I have gauges from AS on my A-65. I think they are Mitchell. Look closely a
t the AS cataloge. You will find a page or two of thier guages. But only tw
o are for none electric
Dave
Dave Nielsen
sentuchows(at)aol.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Gerry Holland <gholland@content-stream.co.uk>
Sent: Tue, Apr 17, 2012 2:57 pm
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Temperature Gauges W/O Electrical System
m.co.uk>
David
have a non electric A75-8. The Oil Temperature is some form of capillary t
o
il Pressure mount at rear of engine. Works well.
erry
-= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum -
-= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse
-= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription,
-= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,
-= Photoshare, and much much more:
-
-= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
-
-========================
-= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
-= Same great content also available via the Web Forums!
-
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-
-========================
-= - List Contribution Web Site -
-= Thank you for your generous support!
-= -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
-= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-========================
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Temperature Gauges W/O Electrical System |
David
I think I have this Oil Pressure Gauge.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/inpages/oilpress3.php
You need to ensure it comes with capillary tube and bulb to fit into rear of engine.
Gerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Temperature Gauges W/O Electrical System |
| From: | "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> |
I just faced this problem on the 1920'ish Standard J1 biplane I'm helping to restore
in Oshkosh. It runs an old water cooled V8 without an electrical system,
a Hisso I think.
Anyway, was was installed during a 1970's restore was a old Stewart Warner oil
temp gage that had that capillary tube arrangement. I see them in A/C Spruce.
While it says oil temp, it will work and the temp range is about correct.
However, years ago I found a company in Albuquerque NM called MoMa. They restore
ALL SORTS of gages and know about everything about them. If you want them
to fix a tach gage, they want the tach cable sent along so it can be properly
fit, etc. Also, their prices were about half of everywhere else.
So I called them up about this water temp gage. The owner of the company usually
answers the phone, a very nice lady Ms. Lucas. I explained what we wanted
and she found a perfect vintage Stewart Warner WATER temp gage and fit the length
of capillary tube to it we needed for the J1. Did this in under a week.
If you have ANY gage stuff you need done, they are clearly worth checking with.
The weirder the problem (like fixing a neat old auto speedometer to make a airplane
tach), the better they will sound. They'll even do custom silkscreening
of the gage face if you want.
Just google MoMa and Albuquerque and you'll find them.
Tools
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371089#371089
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Stitch question... |
Would it be generally accepted as "ok" to go ahead and stitch around the diagonal
in the attached? And leave the cord laying against the diagonal? This is
one of the middle ribs on the horiz stab. And it doesn't move like a cable would.
Shouldn't be any movement between the diagonal brace and the cord. So can
I get by with just running the waxed cord around it and tightening up?
There's just not much clearance in that area but I can just stich around the rib
if needed....
(Hope this makes sense....)
Jim in Pryor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Thank you....: Need some help....off topic... |
Wow, I got a HUGE response (mostly offline, thank you!) from my request.
Not sure if this is actually going to happen or not but I sure do appreciate all
the great feedback. I am in a MUCH better position know how to proceed and
some important things to watch out for. And all this time I was thinking I could
just "prop it and go fly"!! (just kidding)
I've tried to respond directly to all the offers of help but probably forgot someone....so
THANK you all!
Jim in Pryor....
-----Forwarded Message-----
>From: Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
>Sent: Apr 14, 2012 6:13 PM
>To: Pietenpol List
>Subject: Need some help....off topic...
>
>A pilot friend passed on about a year (or two) ago and his Champ has just been
sitting...his daughter owns it now....it's on a grass strip about a mile from
us.
>
>I've recommended to her that we at least pull it out of the hangar and start it
from time to time. And she's fine with me taking it up if I want. (Of course
I'm fine with that!). Mainly I hate to see it waste away...and it will if
we don't do something.
>
>So do we just start propping to get it started or is there some process we need
to follow for an aircraft that's been sitting for so long?
>
>Sorry for such an "off topic" request but....well....maybe this could lead to
me getting some tailwheel time (yes, I know, ONLY after getting some tailwheel
training...) but that might make me a better Piet pilot, right? :-)
>
>If someone has experience with such and could tell me what to watch for and give
some pointers it would be appreciated.
>
>Offlist please.
>
>Thanks,
>Jim in Pryor (where the storms might pass us by this time....)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | never mind.... Stitch question... |
Just answered my own question. Went out to the shop and bent/hammered/drilled
a small curved needle.
Worked just fine. And didn't have to lay the cord up against the diagonal brace...didn't
want to do that anyway.
(And yes, I know, the holes don't line up with the lines...those were the original
lines and somehow they didn't line up with each other, I'm still not sure
why. So I made a template and punched the holes from the template...all in line
with each other.)
Next time I'll think about it some more before firing off an email...(no, I probably
won't).
JM
-----Original Message-----
>From: Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
>Sent: Apr 17, 2012 2:37 PM
>To: Pietenpol List
>Subject: Stitch question...
>
>Would it be generally accepted as "ok" to go ahead and stitch around the diagonal
in the attached? And leave the cord laying against the diagonal? This is
one of the middle ribs on the horiz stab. And it doesn't move like a cable would.
Shouldn't be any movement between the diagonal brace and the cord. So
can I get by with just running the waxed cord around it and tightening up?
>
>There's just not much clearance in that area but I can just stich around the rib
if needed....
>
>(Hope this makes sense....)
>
>Jim in Pryor
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Temperature Gauges W/O Electrical System |
| From: | Dave Nielsen <sentuchows(at)aol.com> |
The Mitchell mechanical gauge is part # 10-02706 A.S. catalogue. Westach GH
T part# is 2A1. part number for the sender is 712-5W AHHHH I think.
Dave
Dave Nielsen
sentuchows(at)aol.com
-----Original Message-----
From: DaveG601XL <david.m.gallagher(at)ge.com>
Sent: Tue, Apr 17, 2012 2:49 pm
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Temperature Gauges W/O Electrical System
m>
Guys,
I am trying to figure out which temperature gauges (CHT & Oil) I can use th
at do
ot require electricity to operate since I am using an A-65F without an
lectrical system. I see a VDO CHT gauge advertised in Aircraft Spruce that
ays it does not need electricity unless you want the unit lighted. I do no
t
ee a similar note under any of the oil temp gauges. They all just say that
hey need 12VDC. The VDO web site did not help any since it seems to indica
te
hat all their gauges need voltage to operate.
Any recommendations on particular gauges or brands that have worked well?
Thanks,
--------
avid Gallagher
odiac 601 XL-B: flying, 200+ hours now
ext project under construction: Aircamper
ead this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371082#371082
-= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum -
-= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse
-= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription,
-= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,
-= Photoshare, and much much more:
-
-= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
-
-========================
-= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
-= Same great content also available via the Web Forums!
-
-= --> http://forums.matronics.com
-
-========================
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Temperature Gauges W/O Electrical System |
| From: | "pineymb" <airltd(at)mts.net> |
Oil temp gauge as follows:
Aircraft Spruce # 10-00954
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/inpages/scottoiltemp.php
--------
Adrian M
Winnipeg, MB
Canada
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371105#371105
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/oil_temp_sensor_145.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
Off topic, but has anyone done spins in the pietenpol? Just in case I get
caught in an overcast.. Who knows. I might go into rolls and
loops. I haven't heard of any G limits for the bernie planes. Gardiner Mason
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: to post or not to post....that is the question |
| From: | "Kyle85" <boschkyle(at)hotmail.com> |
Thumbs up! That is all
Kyle
--------
Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete the
flight.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371111#371111
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Horizontal stab end pieces |
| From: | "Kyle85" <boschkyle(at)hotmail.com> |
Hey guys, I will try to keep this short. Trying to determine if the plans are telling
me to put main beam or leading edge on the horizontal stab end pieces.
I am probably over thinking this. Just wondering what others did.
Thanks
Kyle
--------
Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete the
flight.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371112#371112
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Horizontal stab end pieces |
| From: | gboothe5(at)comcast.net |
Kyle,
I used the leading edge dimensions on the ends, but downsized toward the trailing
edge, for a smooth transition.
Gary from Cool
Happy building!
------Original Message------
From: Kyle85
Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
ReplyTo: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Horizontal stab end pieces
Sent: Apr 17, 2012 7:34 PM
Hey guys, I will try to keep this short. Trying to determine if the plans are telling
me to put main beam or leading edge on the horizontal stab end pieces.
I am probably over thinking this. Just wondering what others did.
Thanks
Kyle
--------
Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete the
flight.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371112#371112
Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris" <catdesigns(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Horizontal stab end pieces |
This is what I used
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/Tail_Wood_Piece_Locatio
n.jpg
But what the heck do I know, my plane is not finished
Chris
Sacramento, Ca
Westcoastpiet.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kyle85
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2012 7:35 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Horizontal stab end pieces
Hey guys, I will try to keep this short. Trying to determine if the plans
are telling me to put main beam or leading edge on the horizontal stab end
pieces. I am probably over thinking this. Just wondering what others did.
Thanks
Kyle
--------
Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete
the flight.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371112#371112
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oscar Zuniga <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | considering a piet build |
I don't really have much to add in the Cub-vs-Air Camper thread
except to slightly modify what someone (Jack-?) said about the
"glide". I consider this to be a plus for the Piet. I always
found that my most tense moments flying the Cub (and Super Cub)
were those last few seconds (felt like hours) waiting for the
mains to touch, riding the float down the runway, endlessly. I
know, I know- it's all about airspeed control and that meant I
was carrying a little too much airspeed- but still, I like the
fact that I can bring the Piet down on a straight-line final all
the way to the numbers and then plunk it down with minimal float.
It's a nice short field performer, in my book. I also agree that
adding wingspan also adds weight... not a good thing for Piets.
Closing comment: pay no attention to posts from one "Kevin Purtee",
a questionable guy that we put up with here out of kindness. He says
his family is dysfunctional, but he's referring to himself, not
his better half or any of us. And he belittles those of us who
did not build our own Piets, but who fly them anyway. I think of
Scout (my Air Camper) as an adopted child, one that I love by
choice. "Fat Bottom Girl", Kevin's airplane by birth and upbringing,
has no choice but to live in a dysfunctional household.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
Flying Squirrel N2069Z "Rocket"
Medford/Ashland, OR
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Temperature Gauges W/O Electrical System |
| From: | "DaveG601XL" <david.m.gallagher(at)ge.com> |
Thanks guys, this is exactly what I was looking for.
--------
David Gallagher
Zodiac 601 XL-B: flying, 200+ hours now
Next project under construction: Aircamper
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371136#371136
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net> |
Always use Marvel Mystery Oil before you attempt to spin your Pietenpol, and
make sure your handheld has enough range to clear the area by using a proper
ground plane.
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "womenfly2" <Love2Fly.KAP(at)gmail.com> |
DO NOT spin a Pietenpol, even if you have a parachute (by-the-way would not fit
in the cockpit with a pilot anyway). If you have a catastrophic failure, you
could not get out of the plane if you had to.
--------
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371139#371139
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
| From: | "womenfly2" <Love2Fly.KAP(at)gmail.com> |
Why would you want a Pietenpol if you have a Cub? Fly the Cub!
--------
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371140#371140
________________________________________________________________________________
I think spinning a Pietenpol or on that matter any of the early
homebuilts needs VERY careful consideration.
My Corben Junior is 50+ years old and with a 4130 fuselage frame should
be ok. The wings are still wood though!
When I learnt to fly in the 60's spinning was an important part of the
mid point syllabus and had to be demonstrated left and right during
flight test.
It gained an air of trepidation but in fact once mastered and
demonstrated on test felt very worthwhile.
Spinning for the sake of it.... no thanks. Knowing how to respond in
such a flight condition is worth it.
The one point to make though is that many who knew how to recover still
came to grief because when it happened for real they were often to low,
probably on that base leg section or steep climb out.
Go spin in something aerobatic!
Regards
Gerry
do no archive
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: considering a piet build |
| From: | "nightmare" <pauldonahuepilot(at)yahoo.com> |
had a cub, sold it 10 years ago when lost previous flying job. actually won it
in the usaerobatic foundation raffle. flew it from oshkosh to south florida. your
gonna make me cry now.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371162#371162
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nightmare" <pauldonahuepilot(at)yahoo.com> |
just looking for maybe a link for a bunch of piet pics in one place. or maybe whoever
reads this can include their Piet pic. thanks; Paul
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371164#371164
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
The West Coast Piet. website has a ton of pictures.
For my personal in work photos, see the link below. I can send pictures of specific
part/components if interested.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack(at)textors.com" <jack(at)textors.com> |
http://textors.com/PietProject.html
Jack Textor
Sent from my iPad
On Apr 18, 2012, at 11:39 AM, "nightmare" wrote:
>
> just looking for maybe a link for a bunch of piet pics in one place. or maybe
whoever reads this can include their Piet pic. thanks; Paul
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371164#371164
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AMsafetyC(at)aol.com |
If you wait till July you can get all the pics you want of any and every
part you want in any power configuration you want. All you need to do is go
to the Brodhead fly in. A field filled with Piets, Piet builders, wanna be
fliers and liars. A veritable morgishgoard of Piets and Piets peoples
Do not achieve this big secret
This is flying weather, I can see by the number of people here today I'm
gonna need lots of gas! Who would like a free ride?
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sanders, Andrew P" <andrew.p.sanders(at)boeing.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: 2. 04:23 AM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 46 Msgs - |
04/16/12 (Sutton, Mark)
To paraphrase Dennis Farina in "Big Trouble":
With all due respect, I ask in the nicest possible way, PLEASE don't reply and
send the entire digest back to the digest!
Thanks,
Andrew
________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________
From: "Sutton, Mark" <msutton(at)unitedwayatlanta.org>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 46 Msgs - 04/16/12
Sent from my Verizon Wireless Phone
----- Reply message -----
From: "Pietenpol-List Digest Server" <pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List Digest: 46 Msgs - 04/16/12
*
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nightmare" <pauldonahuepilot(at)yahoo.com> |
thanks jack, paul
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371198#371198
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> |
Terry,
I think Ryan's comment was in regards to sand bag testing a wing rib to the point
of destruction, as opposed to the discussion about spins.
There was a lively and fairly entertaining discussion about this same topic (rib
testing) a few years ago - that's where the reference to tractor weights comes
from. There may have also been an elephant involved.
The Pietenpol wing rib is a robust little structure. I don't think anyone has to
worry about the ribs failing (if properly constructed).
I'm not sure what knowledge would be gained from testing a rib to the point of
destruction.
Bill C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371199#371199
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> |
Terry,
If you just want to confirm the soundness of your construction abilities, why don't
you just glue up a simple "T" made up of 2 pieces of 1/4" x 1/2" Sitka (or
whatever wood you are building with), and gussets the same as you will use on
your ribs. Allow the glue to fully cure, and then do a destructive test on that.
Put it in a vise, and squeeze until it cracks. If the wood fails, you're
"good to go". If the glue joints fail, you have reason to be concerned, since
it's either your methods, or the adhesive that would be the reason for the glue
joint to be the cause of failure.
It's just that there's quite a bit of work involved in building an actual rib,
and then you'd have to devise some sort of apparatus to hold and support the rib,
and a method to distribute the weight, and acquire a bunch of sandbags, and
on and on... so that, in the end, you'll be able to say that your rib supported
"X" pounds (under the specific conditions that you tested it) before failing.
Bill C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371207#371207
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ryan M <aircamperace(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Cub Style Wheel Option |
What are the options to the Cub style wheels? I can find wheels but the-e
xpander-tubes and master cyls are hard to come by and the Grove conversio
n is very expensive. - I like the "balloon" look of the Cubs 10x4's, what
are my other options?=0A=0ARyan M
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ryan M <aircamperace(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cub Style Wheel Option |
8x4=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0A From: Ryan M <aircamperace@
yahoo.com>=0ATo: "pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com" =0ASent: Wednesday, April 18, 2012 6:31 PM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: C
ub Style Wheel Option=0A =0A=0AWhat are the options to the Cub style wheels
? I can find wheels but the-expander-tubes and master cyls are hard to
come by and the Grove conversion is very expensive. - I like the "balloon
==============
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Stitch question... |
Jim,
I know you resolved this, but, you know that you are allowed to move the stitch
to avoid framing members...right?
Gary from Cool
NX308MB
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Markle
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2012 12:38 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Stitch question...
Would it be generally accepted as "ok" to go ahead and stitch around the diagonal
in the attached? And leave the cord laying against the diagonal? This is
one of the middle ribs on the horiz stab. And it doesn't move like a cable would.
Shouldn't be any movement between the diagonal brace and the cord. So can
I get by with just running the waxed cord around it and tightening up?
There's just not much clearance in that area but I can just stich around the rib
if needed....
(Hope this makes sense....)
Jim in Pryor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ryan M <aircamperace(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cub Style Wheel Option |
Has any one tried the8 x 6 carlisle turf glide experimental?=0A=0Ahttp://ww
w.desser.com/store/products/800%252d6-4-PLY-CARLISLE-TURF-GLIDE-EXPERIMENTA
L-TIRE-.html-=0A=0A=0ARyan M=0A=0A________________________________=0A Fro
m: Ryan M =0ATo: "pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com" =0ASent: Wednesday, April 18, 2012 6:31 PM=0ASu
bject: Pietenpol-List: Cub Style Wheel Option=0A =0A=0AWhat are the options
to the Cub style wheels? I can find wheels but the-expander-tubes and
master cyls are hard to come by and the Grove conversion is very expensive.
- I like the "balloon" look of the Cubs 10x4's, what are my other option
======================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob edson" <robertse(at)centurytel.net> |
| Subject: | adhesive question |
I connected the cables to the rudder and elevators and all works good. I
cut leather pieces to cover the openings in the fabric where the cables
exit and now what adhesive is best for this attachment.Thanks for any
information. Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: adhesive question |
Barge cement in a tube from Ace hardware
________________________________
From: Bob edson <robertse(at)centurytel.net>
Sent: Wed, April 18, 2012 7:18:06 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: adhesive question
I connected the cables to the rudder and elevators and all works good. I cut
leather pieces to cover the openings in the fabric where the cables exit and
now what adhesive is best for this attachment.Thanks for any information.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | adhesive question |
I used PolyTak. I used the Poly Fiber system fro my fabric work and PolyTak
is their standard fabric adheasive.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob edson
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2012 7:18 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: adhesive question
I connected the cables to the rudder and elevators and all works good. I cut
leather pieces to cover the openings in the fabric where the cables exit and
now what adhesive is best for this attachment.Thanks for any information.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
Since I am rebuilding my piet after the tornado damage do I have to get another
FAA inspection? Gardiner
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "j_dunavin" <j_dunavin(at)hotmail.com> |
I like it! :D
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371220#371220
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "j_dunavin" <j_dunavin(at)hotmail.com> |
I like it, i think it looks awesome! :D
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371221#371221
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Stitch question... |
Yeah, I figure if I can maintain minimum spacing I can probably move the stitches.
Got it resolved thanks.
That stitch has been smoothed over and 20 more made! :-)
This evening my oldest son and my youngest son sat with me on the couch taking
turns rib stitching. The oldest is an A&P at American Airlines and hadn't done
a rib stitch in 15 or so years....so Ben (the 12 year old) helped him. It was
one of my best Pietenpol experiences yet (and to think this project ALMOST
ended up disappering from my shop a couple years ago!)....
JM
-----Original Message-----
>From: Gary Boothe <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
>Sent: Apr 18, 2012 5:48 PM
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Stitch question...
>
>
>Jim,
>
>I know you resolved this, but, you know that you are allowed to move the stitch
to avoid framing members...right?
>
>Gary from Cool
>NX308MB
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Markle
>Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2012 12:38 PM
>To: Pietenpol List
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Stitch question...
>
>Would it be generally accepted as "ok" to go ahead and stitch around the diagonal
in the attached? And leave the cord laying against the diagonal? This is
one of the middle ribs on the horiz stab. And it doesn't move like a cable would.
Shouldn't be any movement between the diagonal brace and the cord. So
can I get by with just running the waxed cord around it and tightening up?
>
>There's just not much clearance in that area but I can just stich around the rib
if needed....
>
>(Hope this makes sense....)
>
>Jim in Pryor
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> |
Gardiner,
Getting back to your original question... The answer is YES, someone (not me) has
spun a Pietenpol. I recall reading a story in Chet Peek's book "The Pietenpol
Story" about a flight that BHP took, that was very nearly his last. As I
recall, BHP was in the front seat, and a larger gentleman was in the pilot's seat,
and the guy wanted to see how the plane would spin, so BHP threw it into
a spin, but found that the extra weight in the rear wouldn't allow him to exit
the spin. The stick travel was limited by hitting the panel, and BHP eventually
ended up forcing the stick far to one side to get under the panel, in order
to get the additional forward travel, and managed to exit the spin, just in
the nick of time.
If I have the time, I'll see if I can find the story.
While it isn't recommended, from what I've read, I believe that spinning and looping
occurred fairly frequently in the "old days". But then, so did crashes.
Bill C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371232#371232
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
Thanks Bill, A while back I visited Pat Green in Hilliard Fl, and he said that
he let his friend take his Piet up for some acro. He got into a spin at about
4500 ft and did not get out of it untill 700 ft. It seems that his friend was
very tall and his upper body blocked all airflow to the rudder. Pat then
redesigned his rudder and added 10 inches to the height. I think he is still
flying his Piet which he built about 30 years ago. He also added more wingspan
to get over the pine trees at his field. He is a very nice man to talk to but I
don't know his phone. Talk to him. Gardiner Mason
----- Original Message ----
From: Bill Church <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Sent: Wed, April 18, 2012 9:16:13 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: spins
Gardiner,
Getting back to your original question... The answer is YES, someone (not me)
has spun a Pietenpol. I recall reading a story in Chet Peek's book "The
Pietenpol Story" about a flight that BHP took, that was very nearly his last.
As I recall, BHP was in the front seat, and a larger gentleman was in the
pilot's seat, and the guy wanted to see how the plane would spin, so BHP threw
it into a spin, but found that the extra weight in the rear wouldn't allow him
to exit the spin. The stick travel was limited by hitting the panel, and BHP
eventually ended up forcing the stick far to one side to get under the panel, in
order to get the additional forward travel, and managed to exit the spin, just
in the nick of time.
If I have the time, I'll see if I can find the story.
While it isn't recommended, from what I've read, I believe that spinning and
looping occurred fairly frequently in the "old days". But then, so did crashes.
Bill C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371232#371232
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Horizontal stab end pieces |
| From: | "Kyle85" <boschkyle(at)hotmail.com> |
Thanks guys, got the peace of mind I was looking for!
- Kyle
--------
Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete the
flight.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371239#371239
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
No, not unless you make substantial changes (different engine, different
prop, etc.).
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of airlion
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2012 7:56 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Don't know
Since I am rebuilding my piet after the tornado damage do I have to get
another
FAA inspection? Gardiner
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "taildrags" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
See, now that's what I love about this group! A very practical, responsible answer.
If this were the "V-Tail Bonanza Group" or the "Mooney Owners Association"
list, you'd be getting post after post about which FAA, NTSB, EAA, AOPA, GSA,
TSA, or FCC form or license or fee you should be dealing with.
You bend your Piet, you fix it. When it's fixed, you dust yourself off and you
go fly it again. This is why we love these old airplanes! Ask me how I know
;o)
PS- Gardiner, that little truck you babysat for me brought me 2500 miles from TX
to OR towing a UHaul trailer in the heat of summer and mostly in 3rd gear, and
it never missed a beat. Temp gauge never moved off the peg. Thanks again
to you and Susan for treating me and my little Ranger like family, and I hope
to do the same for you some day. Oh, and I'll buy you coffee and a piece of Georgia
peach pie.
--------
Oscar Zuniga
Medford, OR
Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
A75 power
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371243#371243
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Clif Dawson" <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
Well, for what it's worth mine is here;
http://www.clifdawson.ca/Homepage4-10-06/Pietenpol.html
If that doesn't work;
http://www.clifdawson.ca/
Clif
A mile of road will take you a mile, but a mile
of runway will take you anywhere
> just looking for maybe a link for a bunch of piet pics in one place. or
> maybe whoever reads this can include their Piet pic. thanks; Paul
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371164#371164
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DaveG601XL" <david.m.gallagher(at)ge.com> |
I asked this same question to my FSDO Inspector a few years ago. He said to use
the paragraph in my flight limitations that deals with major changes as a guideline
for returning to flight. He said it was not necessary to contact him,
but recommended that you essentially place yourself back into "phase I" and fly
off 5 hours in your flight test area and afterwards write the same statement
in the logbook that you wrote after your initial Phase I was complete "I certify
that the prescribed flight test hours have been completed and the aircraft
is controllable throughout its normal range of.... yada yada yada."
Straight from the horses mouth.
--------
David Gallagher
Zodiac 601 XL-B: flying, 200+ hours now
Next project under construction: Aircamper
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371256#371256
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | post-rebuild inspection and adhesive question |
Gardiner,
My FAA guy told me I did not have to do another inspection after my rebuild,
EVEN with a new engine, he said just log what I did. You should be fine to
go fly.
On the adhesive question for leather, I love that yellow weatherstrip
adhesive glue you can guy at auto parts stores. Permetax and 3M make them
and they stick like gangbusters and stay flexible over time.
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> |
Okay, I found the story in Chet Peek's great book "The Pietenpol Story", which
can be ordered from Chet here:
http://www.threepeakspub.com/
or you can also get it from Aircraft Spruce:
http://www.aircraftspruce.ca/catalog/bvpages/pietenpolStory.php
Scary stuff.
"Golly", indeed.
Bill C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371259#371259
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/spins_226.pdf
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Here's an idea,
With so many of us sharing, I realized that I'm unfamiliar with what most
people are building (IF they're building.) so.
How 'bout we all send in what we're building (Pietenpol, I know) like what
engine, gear, wood or steel fuse, long or short fuse, how long into it and
maybe how long to go? and additions/changes of note that we might find
interesting and colors would be fun if you're not too secretive about such
vital information.
I'll start.
Short fuselage
Continental C-90 with starter
Two piece wing
Wood struts
Bumped up "tiger moth" type center section tank
"Jenny" gear
"faux" doped/aged translucent linen finish with a beautiful "baby poop"
green trim and "Re-PIET" huge across the wing and down each fuse side.
Aiming to be done in two or three months.
Marvel Mystery Oil in fuel, pre-mixed-sloshed, pre-warmed and perfumed!
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | "899PM" <rockriverrifle(at)hotmail.com> |
Started in 1997 with plans purchase from Don Pietenpol.
Sold in divorce at "on the gear" stage.
Purchased back by V2.0 wife for wedding gift.
Short fuse all Sitka
Western red cedar ribs. Stock airfoil.
Offset "flop" for entry.
lengthened cabanes 2".
26" wide 27" deep in rear pit lofted to "print"at tailpost and firewall.
Model A(60hp)
Sensenich 76-42 wood prop.
3-pc wing(33 1/2' span)
aluminum fuel tank in center section
split gear
21" wheels with Faux "Bendix" style wheel covers.
aluminum struts(to be wrapped and doped)
Ceconite and dope finish.
Wings finished and ready for pre-cover assembly this month.
Goal to have in the air before Christmas.
--------
PAPA MIKE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371263#371263
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: post-rebuild inspection and adhesive question |
| From: | "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> |
Hey Douwe,
Quick question about new engine. New type of engine, or same type, but new?
Tools
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371264#371264
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "TOM STINEMETZE" <TOMS(at)mcpcity.com> |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Good idea Douwe, here's mine:
Long fuselage (spruce)
3-piece wing with fiberglass center section fuel tank (oh the horror)
cub style gear with 19" motorcycle wheels on Ken Perkins hub and die
spring shock struts
Corvair power (100 HP "Airvair") with lots of WW parts and 5th bearing
RAC electric elevator trim (WHAT! How does this guy get off calling
that a Pietenpol)
Ken Perkins steerable tail wheel assembly
Turtledeck and upper formers stretched 1" per Mike Cuy
Cabanes stretched 2 inches per LOTS of suggestions
X-Com radio mounted in panel (the handheld stock prices just crashed)
Reserved N328X in honor of SpaceShipOne (N328KF)
To be named SpaceShip0.1 ( No boring "all about my kids" stories at
this time - Thank You!)
Uncovered fuselage & tail group ready for firewall forward
Complete engine in parts boxes awaiting assembly
All wing parts ready and awaiting assembly
Estimated completion - 2 years - faster if I get fired first or win the
lottery.
Tom Stinemetze
McPherson, KS. (4-19-12)
>>> "Douwe Blumberg" 4/19/2012 8:14 AM
>>>
Heres an idea,
With so many of us sharing, I realized that Im unfamiliar with what
most people are building (IF theyre building) so
How bout we all send in what were building (Pietenpol, I know)
like what engine, gear, wood or steel fuse, long or short fuse, how long
into it and maybe how long to go? and additions/changes of note that we
might find interesting and colors would be fun if youre not too
secretive about such vital information.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
V2.0 Wife seems a good un!
Started in 1997 with plans purchase from Don Pietenpol.
Sold in divorce at "on the gear" stage.
Purchased back by V2.0 wife for wedding gift.
Regards
Gerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | "bender" <jfaith(at)solairusaviation.com> |
1932 F&G manual
wood gear
A engine
21" HD spoke wheels
wings and horizontal creamy tan
fuselage green so dark that it looks black
chainsaw built prop....thanks for the info Dan
jeff faith
NX1929F
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371271#371271
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Stanley" <mmrally(at)nifty.com> |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Hi Douwe,
That sounds like a good idea.
So to encourage anyone who=99s building, like mine, is
=98rather slow=99, I will be the first of the
=98slowbies=99 to post my, errr =98progress.
Started: 2004
Plans form Don Pietenpol
Wing ribs all done =93 made from douglas fir
Fin & rudder woodwork done =93 mixed douglas fir and spruce
Stabilizer & elevators started
Hinges for both (abaove) from Vi Kapler
Hope to finish and fly sometime before I kick the bucket
Mark Stanley
Japan
From: Douwe Blumberg
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2012 10:14 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies!
Here=99s an idea,
With so many of us sharing, I realized that I=99m unfamiliar with
what most people are building (IF they=99re building)
so
How =98bout we all send in what we=99re building (Pietenpol,
I know) like what engine, gear, wood or steel fuse, long or short fuse,
how long into it and maybe how long to go? and additions/changes of note
that we might find interesting and colors would be fun if you=99re
not too secretive about such vital information.
I=99ll start.
Short fuselage
Continental C-90 with starter
Two piece wing
Wood struts
Bumped up =9Ctiger moth=9D type center section tank
=9CJenny=9D gear
=9Cfaux=9D doped/aged translucent linen finish with a
beautiful =9Cbaby poop=9D green trim and
=9CRe-PIET=9D huge across the wing and down each fuse side.
Aiming to be done in two or three months.
Marvel Mystery Oil in fuel, pre-mixed-sloshed, pre-warmed and perfumed!
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
1937 Pietenpol Aircamper, NX308MB
Started March of '08
Will probably fly this summer
Long Fuselage - 3 pc wing
Turtle decks raised 1.5", but cabanes held to plans
Corvair
Mostly Poplar
Wood gear w/21" Harley Sportster wheels and tires, barely functional go-cart
brakes
ALL Hickory struts
"Tiger Moth" 16 gallon fuel tank
Latex paint
Gary Boothe
NX308MB
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Douwe
Blumberg
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2012 6:14 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies!
Here's an idea,
With so many of us sharing, I realized that I'm unfamiliar with what most
people are building (IF they're building.) so.
How 'bout we all send in what we're building (Pietenpol, I know) like what
engine, gear, wood or steel fuse, long or short fuse, how long into it and
maybe how long to go? and additions/changes of note that we might find
interesting and colors would be fun if you're not too secretive about such
vital information.
I'll start.
Short fuselage
Continental C-90 with starter
Two piece wing
Wood struts
Bumped up "tiger moth" type center section tank
"Jenny" gear
"faux" doped/aged translucent linen finish with a beautiful "baby poop"
green trim and "Re-PIET" huge across the wing and down each fuse side.
Aiming to be done in two or three months.
Marvel Mystery Oil in fuel, pre-mixed-sloshed, pre-warmed and perfumed!
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "l.morlock" <l.morlock(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Started in 1993 with a "project" plane - fuselage and wing only
One-piece wing
Douwe's "old" Model A engine
76 x 44 Hegy wood prop
External aileron cables
Jenny gear
18" spoke wheels
Everything all assembled, covered, painted, except:
90% done, 90% to go
Larry Morlock
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Destructive Testing |
| From: | "899PM" <rockriverrifle(at)hotmail.com> |
When I first started building, I was intrigued with Charlie Rubeck's Western Red
Cedar ribs. At Brodhead '98 Charlie convinced me to build one and test it. I
built a test fixture utilizing engineering grade compression springs of known
rate. I pulled the loading spacing out of an old NACA document. I still have
the fixture. If memory serves, I tested a single WRC rib mounted on stub spars
to 267 pounds before I heard a crack somewhere. Never did find the crack. I can
load a rib in the fixture and take a pic if anyone is interested?
If in doubt about the strength of the Piet ribs, start looking at some of the ribs
that certified aircraft have used in the past. I have a Porterfield CP-65
rib that is under 1/4" square stock. It scares me to just look at it.
--------
PAPA MIKE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371285#371285
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Groah <dskogrover(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Ok... here goes...
Pietenpol build by myself, Mike Groah and my dad Vic Groah
Long spruce fuselage with Keri Ann door mod.
Three piece wing
Turtle deck and panels raised one inch
wing raised one inch
Straight axle gear-wire wheels-mechanical drum brakes
Aluminum Fuselage tank
Center section wing storage like Mike Cuy's
Corvair powered- Culver 66-30 prop
Fuselage covered and painted a dark green(polyfiber)
horizontal and wings are cream (one wing and ailerons still need their paint)
Panel crowded with what most would say is too much stuff.
(Garmin Aera and XCOM radio mounted in the panel)
Smoke system (tank in wing center compartment)
need to finish painting the wings and get a hangar to keep this thing in.
Hope to fly this summer.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5hYe_RYzkM&context=C3db22b9ADOEgsToPDskKC6YORoerna4k_SGQfI1lU
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Destructive Testing |
My concern is that this type of conversation will lead to improper test
methods, and useless info. Imagine if a number of NEW builders decided that
there must be some concern about rib strength, just because of these posts,
that causes them to start sand bagging their ribs. Suddenly, numbers start
coming in....the normal reaction is going to be that, if my rib crushes at a
lesser weight than yours, then mine must be substandard; a completely
incorrect conclusion since the testing methods must be correct - and there
are proper testing methods.
Not speaking to you, directly, Mike, but to everyone else: Forget about
testing the rib design! YOU DON'T KNOW HOW! Just follow the previous good
practices, as stated by Ryan M, and others, and test your first glue joints
(if you have never worked with wood before), and trust empirical evidence.
Gary Boothe
NX308MB
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of 899PM
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2012 8:45 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Destructive Testing
-->
When I first started building, I was intrigued with Charlie Rubeck's Western
Red Cedar ribs. At Brodhead '98 Charlie convinced me to build one and test
it. I built a test fixture utilizing engineering grade compression springs
of known rate. I pulled the loading spacing out of an old NACA document. I
still have the fixture. If memory serves, I tested a single WRC rib mounted
on stub spars to 267 pounds before I heard a crack somewhere. Never did find
the crack. I can load a rib in the fixture and take a pic if anyone is
interested?
If in doubt about the strength of the Piet ribs, start looking at some of
the ribs that certified aircraft have used in the past. I have a Porterfield
CP-65 rib that is under 1/4" square stock. It scares me to just look at it.
--------
PAPA MIKE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371285#371285
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | Andrew Eldredge <andrew.eldredge(at)gmail.com> |
NX7229R
Continental A-65
6" exension on Fuselage, Douglas Fir Construction
3pc Wing (Center section wider, 1 extray bay each side, Correspondingly
Shorter Wings)
Split Axle Gear, Matco Wheels and brakes w/ turf-glide lawn tractor tires.
(turf-glide sounds cool, though)
Latex Paint, complete with runs.
About 300hrs TTAF, originally flew Nov. 1997
About to come out of Repairs, I'm spam-canning this weekend Or I'd be
taking it to the airport this Saturday
Andrew Eldredge
On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 9:26 AM, Gary Boothe wrote:
> 1937 Pietenpol Aircamper, NX308MB****
>
> Started March of =9108****
>
> Will probably fly this summer****
>
> ** **
>
> Long Fuselage ' 3 pc wing****
>
> Turtle decks raised 1.5=94, but cabanes held to plans****
>
> Corvair****
>
> Mostly Poplar****
>
> Wood gear w/21=94 Harley Sportster wheels and tires, barely functional
> go-cart brakes****
>
> ALL Hickory struts****
>
> =93Tiger Moth=94 16 gallon fuel tank****
>
> Latex paint****
>
> ****
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> Gary Boothe****
>
> NX308MB****
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Douwe Blumberg
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 19, 2012 6:14 AM
>
> *To:* pietenpolgroup
> *Subject:* Pietenpol-List: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies!*
*
> **
>
> ** **
>
> Here=92s an idea,****
>
> ** **
>
> With so many of us sharing, I realized that I=92m unfamiliar with what mo
st
> people are building (IF they=92re building=85) so=85****
>
> ** **
>
> How =91bout we all send in what we=92re building (Pietenpol, I know) like
what
> engine, gear, wood or steel fuse, long or short fuse, how long into it an
d
> maybe how long to go? and additions/changes of note that we might find
> interesting and colors would be fun if you=92re not too secretive about s
uch
> vital information.****
>
> ** **
>
> I=92ll start.****
>
> ** **
>
> *Short fuselage*
>
> *Continental C-90 with starter*
>
> *Two piece wing*
>
> *Wood struts*
>
> *Bumped up =93tiger moth=94 type center section tank*
>
> *=93Jenny=94 gear*
>
> *=93faux=94 doped/aged translucent linen finish with a beautiful =93baby
poop=94
> green trim and =93Re-PIET=94 huge across the wing and down each fuse side
.*
>
> *Aiming to be done in two or three months.*
>
> *Marvel Mystery Oil in fuel, pre-mixed-sloshed, pre-warmed and perfumed!*
>
> ** **
>
> Douwe****
>
> ** **
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List*
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *http://forums.matronics.com*
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
>
> **
>
> * *
>
>
--
Andrew Eldredge
Provo, UT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC AEROSPACE CORP]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | back to wood basics with Tony Bingelis |
http://members.eaa.org/home/homebuilders/building/wood/4Aircraft%20Woodwork
%20Basics.html
What a great, simple, easy to understand article WITH sketches! Great To
ny B's sketches. Scroll down
to learn a lot in just a few photos. It's pretty entertaining watching p
eople try dancing on the heads of
pins when building an airplane like the Pietenpol.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
I will add to that-.LONG FUSE
CORVAIR ENGINE, TWO PIECE WING WITH 36in wide CENTER SECTION. SPLIT AXLE GE
AR, BRUSHED ON LATEX, POWDER BLUE WITH BURNT ORANGE TRIM. Should be flying
in 3 months with NEW TAIL FEATHERS, TWO NEW WINGS, REPAIR TO THE COWLING,LA
NDING GEAR,AND TAIL CONE. MY PLANE HAD 70 HOURS ON it PLUS 10 seconds in th
e tornado. How about adding an=C2- address to the list in case of travel
to that area. Gardiner Mason, 840 Woodley Dr. Atlanta Ga. 30318=C2- Ph 40
4 367 9453
--- On Thu, 4/19/12, Douwe Blumberg wrote:
From: Douwe Blumberg <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies!
Date: Thursday, April 19, 2012, 9:14 AM
=0A=0A=0A =0A =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AHere=99s an idea, =0A
=0A =C2- =0A=0AWith so many of us sharing, I realized that I=99m un
familiar=0Awith what most people are building (IF they=99re building
) so =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0AHow =98bout we all send in
what we=99re building=0A(Pietenpol, I know) like what engine, gear,
wood or steel fuse, long or short=0Afuse, how long into it and maybe how lo
ng to go? and additions/changes of note=0Athat we might find interesting an
d colors would be fun if you=99re not too=0Asecretive about such vita
l information. =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0AI=99ll start. =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0A
Short fuselage =0A=0AContinental C-90 with starter =0A=0ATwo piece wing =0A
=0AWood struts =0A=0ABumped up =9Ctiger moth=9D type=0Acenter s
ection tank =0A=0A=9CJenny=9D gear =0A=0A=9Cfaux=9D
doped/aged translucent=0Alinen finish with a beautiful =9Cbaby poop
=9D green trim and =9CRe-PIET=9D=0Ahuge across the wing a
nd down each fuse side. =0A=0AAiming to be done in two or three months. =0A
=0AMarvel Mystery Oil in fuel,=0Apre-mixed-sloshed, pre-warmed and perfumed
! =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0ADouwe =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
==================0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | "Kyle85" <boschkyle(at)hotmail.com> |
Bought original plans in 2008 while I was in Iraq to drool over.
Started making parts in 2011. Prospective airplane:
Poplar wing ribs
Douglas fir everything else.
Fuel tank up front, storage up top.
Gear tbd
Engine cont. A65
Long fuse
+2 on cabanes
Going toTry my hand at making a prop via homemade duplicator
Dacron med. weight. Stuart system covering.
Ribs done. Center section done (minus install)
Fittings started. Tail group jigs and beam sections done. All wood bought rough
and milled in my shop. Fuse wood gathered. And other misc. parts (seems like
I should be further along now that a write it down, bummer)
--------
Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete the
flight.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371300#371300
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net> |
Purchased plans in Feb 2009...
Long fuse
3-piece wing
Split gear
21" wire wheels - just got these back from Buchanan's yesterday! Tee Hee!
Mighty Corvair power
Everything is spruce except where otherwise called for.
Planning for fuel up front, storage up top.
+2 on cabanes
Black and Yellow latex... LOL!
--------
Mark Chouinard
Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371301#371301
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
"...put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies!"
(Poker face)
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Destructive Testing |
| From: | "899PM" <rockriverrifle(at)hotmail.com> |
Gary,
I agree.
I am a Mfg Engineer by trade and have as much fun building fixtures as I do the
actual projects. The heated forum discussions of the "inferior" Western Red Cedar
ribs nearly 15 years ago intrigued me enough to build the test fixture to
convince myself that WRC was indeed a perfectly acceptable wood for Piet ribs.
I am sure there are plenty of Charlies rib sets in flying Piets today. The Piet
rib as designed, is built like the proverbial brick sh%$ house. Zero reason
to change it.
Just bought a 500' spool of 7x19 aircraft cable of E-Bay. Was disappointed as hell
to see the big "MADE IN CHINA" label on the spool when it arrived. The engineer
in me again kicked into high gear. I made up 3 nico'd cable assemblies last
night to pull to destruction on certified load cells tomorrow. If it breaks
within 10% of rated load.....I'm ok with it. Done deal.
--------
PAPA MIKE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371303#371303
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> |
Mike Danford, Chickamauga GA (Chattanooga TN area), 423 580 1383.
Bought plans from Mr Pietenpol around 96. Got some supplemental drawings directly
from Orrin Hoopman.
I've not made a lot of progress! Mostly because I was never around any aviation
types (light civil or homebuilders) and could never come to a conclusion on
how to do this or that.
However, that's all getting fixed right now. My intentions are:
All wood, short fuse, wood gear, make my own prop, rebuild a Model A myself, wood
struts all around, probably no brakes or tailwheel, build my own wheel hubs.
Really want a basic plane.
However, I bought Dick Navratil's NX2RN and have come to the conclusion a reliable
A-65 is good. ANYTHING lighter is gooder (considering a steel fuse). A steerable
tailwheel and simple brakes worth the weight.
I'm near Chattanooga TN and have the following available to local builders should
they need it.
Completely equipped wood shop, I can basically turn a tree into dimensioned lumber.
If you have some wood you need milled into wing rib material, spars (dimensioning,
routing) worked on, longeron milling from larger stock, etc, I can
help. Leading edge and trailing edge shaping.
I have a complete machine shop. Several lathes, mills, shapers, grinders (surface,
tool and cutter, run of the mill). All sorts of drilling and boring capability.
My larger lathe has a 1 1/2" headstock bore so I can work on axles.
Lots of welding capability, oxy/acet (std victor torch and a Henrob), MIG and TIG.
I'm JUST finally figuring out how to weld decently... you're mostly on your
own here, but welcome to come use the stuff.
I also have a decent selection of things to lift things with. I can lift wings
onto planes, engines, etc. I'm close enough to several private fields that we
can trailer a mini excavator to one of them to assemble a plane if you need
help with that.
I've got a number of large cast iron workbenches (about 8 ft, dead flat) that are
great for scarfing together spars, laminating struts, ect.
If anyone's willing to travel, you're welcome to come use what you need. Always
a room available as well. Beer and food supplied as needed!
The catch is that I'm not here a lot, but someone usually is.
Tools
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371306#371306
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | "aerocarjake" <flight.jake(at)gmail.com> |
First year was 2008 - "preparation" things like a total overhaul of my shop. (new
workbench, shelves, storage drawers, sawdust vacuum system, new table saw,
etc...)
2008 Bought a "complete" project with all wood parts done (wings fuselage tails)...
Sold the fuselage as I am choosing to build a steel-tube (short fuselage) version...
Building a "modern recreation/interpretation" of Bernard Pietenpol's 1931 Velie
radial-powered Piet. (even though that one was wood fuselage, mine will be steel.)
Most of the primary fuselage structure complete. Many, many, many, many details
to go... having a great time......
Steel-tube 1931 Pietenpol per 1932 F&GM drawings, plans from Don, & two photo of
Bernard's Velie Piet. (two inches wider than plans - short fuselage dimensions
- exactly F&GM dimensions in side view)
Hand built/custom 4130 steel/wicker seats...
Rotec R2800 radial engine...
Wider center section (for larger fuel tank) shape of an S.E.5a center section...
Hatz/cub/split style gear...
Plan on using 16" wire rims and 4" Harley 24" diameter tires...
A few "carefully hidden" electronics such as radio, transponder... (heaven forbid...!)
Red/black paint scheme...
N507N
Three years done - no idea how much left - maybe halfway...?!?!!??
Welder comes tomorrow to do more welding on the flight controls.
Plan to take a "summer off" and fly the Piet around America...
http://www.rotecengines.com/Projects/JakeSchultz.html
--------
Jake Schultz - curator,
Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371310#371310
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dgaldrich" <dgaldrich(at)embarqmail.com> |
Hi All
If anyone is in need of some rib cap strip, tail feathers, or a Model A engine
mount, I have the following douglas fir "kits":
Ribs -- 700 running feet of 1/4 x 1/2 cap strip in 6 ft lengths
Tail Feathers -- all pieces needed. L/E, T/E and main beam formed, 3/16 cap strip,
everything except plywood.
Also have the 3 ash pieces for a model A engine mount.
I will be driving my truck up I 95 from Florida to Maine in May and could deliver
anywhere on the way. Let me know off line if you're interested.
Dave
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371311#371311
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> |
Plans ordered from Don Pietenpol June 2004.
First wood cut November 2005.
Using Sitka Spruce throughout - purchased as rough sawn planks.
Built parts (to date):
Ribs done. Standard Pietenpol FC-10 airfoil.
Empennage done.
Long fuselage 80% done. 1" longer than plans, 1" taller than plans, standard width.
Control horns 90% done.
Continental C-75-12
Intentions (but not built yet):
3-pc wing with UK-style built-up spars
"Jenny" gear + tall skinny wheels + mechanical brakes
Tailwheel
Nosewheel... :)
Paint scheme: yes, it will have one
Goal to have in the air before Christmas. Just not sure which one.
Bill C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371316#371316
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Destructive Testing |
| From: | "womenfly2" <Love2Fly.KAP(at)gmail.com> |
.... like this test:
--------
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371317#371317
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol list Re: Put your cards on the table |
Hello--
Bought plans in 1968 but been bogged down with Army time, finishing my
college degree, jobs, and building homes when I had to move.
So far it's all framed up: long fuselage, standard 3-piece wing w/4'
center section so I can have a cutout for visibility. Ribs Western
Hemlock, all else spruce.
Model A with some of Ken Perkins' stuff and Wico Mag.
Split gear w/springs
Most metal made except landing gear and struts
Instruments in hand, no radio yet
Will use latex paint
Now I'm (finally) building a shop large enough to assemble it all into an
airplane.
--Mac in Oregon
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
I invited my local EAA group up to my place for our monthly meeting. Grilled out
some brats and mets with refreshments. This is a photo of my EAA Technical
Advisor showing the group (and me) the proper way to trammel a wing in my shop.
These are good times and invaluable teaching moments for me. I love building
this Pietenpol!
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371323#371323
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/brianm_167.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Clif Dawson" <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Acquired three "Flying and Glider" manuals in ninety
something. Plans bought 2001.
Built tail parts in winter 99/200,.W. Hemlock.
Short fuse with an extra 6" at the rear, 1" wider.
Seat back tilted back an inch. All Hemlock.
Jenny gear with 19" wheels& 3.90 tires and my own
disk brakes. Oh, Fir legs (Not Douglas).
36" wide center section with 22 gal. Moth style tank.
Cabanes Fir and straight up, not angled.
O-290 up front, zero hrs top end 800hrs bottom,$2500!
Hemlock ribs done, 13' 6" X 1" spar material in rafters.
Working on heel brake parts now. A few hrs of detail
work left before beginning wings. I'll make own prop.
Plan on latex-dark red fuse, cream wings, tail & wheels.
Clif.
Vancouver, BC, Canada
http://www.clifdawson.ca/
Here's an idea,
How 'bout we all send in what we're building (Pietenpol, I know) like
what engine, gear, wood or steel fuse, long or short fuse, how long into
it and maybe how long to go?
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | tools' question re Douwe's engine |
Replaced the Ford with a C-90. loved the Ford, but a Colorado move MIGHT be
on our horizon so.
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | a question for "women2 fly" |
Hey Ladies, I've always wondered about the details of your project.
Are you guys building a Piet?
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | "bubbleboy" <scott.dawson3(at)bigpond.com> |
Long fuselage.
Corvair engine.
21" Rims with wooden gear.
Will cover and paint with Stewart Systems.
Riblett 612 Ribs and tail done.
Just ordered Spruce for Fuselage.
Progress at www.scottyspietenpol.com
Tamworth, NSW Australia
Scotty
--------
Tamworth, Australia
Building a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camper
www.scottyspietenpol.com
Rudder, Vert stab, Elevators, Hor Stab and Ribs built...About to start fuselage...Corvair
engine at Roy's Garage waiting to be modified.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371339#371339
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: a question for "women2 fly" |
| From: | "womenfly2" <Love2Fly.KAP(at)gmail.com> |
I have built a Pietenpol, flown it, and sold it. Click on my link below.
Presently building a Wag Aero J3 Cub, with some modification on my own.
Cheers,
Wf2
--------
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371340#371340
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/nov18_08_copy_116.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | "caldwrl" <caldwrl(at)etex.net> |
I'll sneak out of the woodwork and reply on this topic. Mostly I keep my eyes
glued to the goal of "Brodhead in '13".
Plans purchased in 2008
Purchased set of wings from a Sky Scout project
Started gluing in 2009
3-piece wing complete
Fuselage, tailfeathers, - on split axle gear, 6" wheels
3' center section with 15 gal. Al tank mounted on taller cabanes
Corvair run at CC 21
Working on plumbing and wiring
Plan to cover using Stewart System - Latex paint - scheme TBD
I seem to fit the 90 percent rule at this point.
Location: Holly Lake Ranch, TX (northeast TX), planes at 3F9
(hopefully a pic is attached of fuse on wheels outside of hangar)
--------
Robert Caldwell
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371341#371341
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc01334_919.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Donald Lane" <dslane(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Here is mine
All wood short fuse, Model A,self made maple propeller,straight axle
gear, 3 piece wing back 2 in. Blue and Yellow latex,rolled on. No
brakes or tailwheel, but am researching, installing both.
5 hours into phase one testing. Flies great, but is tough to get around
on the ground.
NX110DL
Don Lane
Minnesott Beach NC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Nauerth III" <proplock(at)federatedwildblue.com> |
long story short; have a master brake cylinder,has an =934 an 833
elbow on it, what fittings,hose do I need to match up with 1/8 pipe
thread? Picture taken at Broadhead, on another Piet, I know something
is available, but what? am frustrated at trying to find fittings.
Thanks, Regards, John III
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | "Chris Rusch" <rmdinfo(at)rmdbenders.com> |
Here is what i have:
Started with a fusalage my dad build in 1976
Originally he had a 1928 Chevrolet 4 cylinder.
I Built a custom Mitsubishi engine with a bearing housing for the prop
Harley Davidson starter
Riblett 612 airfoil
3pc wing all spruce, 1" routed spars
Aluminum airfoil tube struts
21" stainless spoke wheels
jenny gear
Fully assembled, all controls hooked up and working
Starting the covering stage, all Stewart Systems
Going to be all Olive Drab.
http://youtu.be/sp24Odus-oU
--------
NX321LR
Fully Assembled less covering
Mistubishi Powered
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371347#371347
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Purchased project plane in 2001 - long fuse, cub gear - fuse &
tailfeathers mostly complete.
Project been too dormant most of the years since then - work, young
family, etc. Just last year bought & now bringing a small farm back
to life ... Time?
Corvair torn down & partially rebuilt
Removed original trurtledeck, rebuilding & raising 2" to accommodate
shoulder straps.
Rib jig built, but thinking about switching to Riblett 612. Lots of
rib gussets cut.
Kip Gardner, NE Ohio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
Try =BC=94 Nylaflow tubing. You can get it and the fittings from ACS.
It=92s
what Vans uses on all the RV=92s. I used it on my master cylinders on
my
Pietenpol. I used regular AeroQuip hoses at the brake calipers.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Nauerth
III
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 8:48 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: hose fittings
long story short; have a master brake cylinder,has an '4 an 833 elbow
on it,
what fittings,hose do I need to match up with 1/8 pipe thread? Picture
taken at Broadhead, on another Piet, I know something is available, but
what? am frustrated at trying to find fittings. Thanks, Regards, John
III
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | johnwoods(at)westnet.com.au |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Bought plans in 2005 and rough cut spruce and douglas fir.
Completed Riblett 612 ribs out of spruce, the remainder of airframe will be douglas
fir.
Working on tail sections with beams cut to section and in process of laying out.
Plan to build long fuse with split undercarriage and spring leaf tail wheel.
Wing will be 3 piece with tank in centre section. The spars will be built up, similar
to UK construction method.
Fabric will be attached with water based adhesive similar to Stewart System but
acquired here in Australia and finished with latex.
Basic steam powered instruments and radio.
Corvair powered as per WW conversion. Have most parts to start engine assembly.
Progress is slow due to work and family, but I keep chipping away....
I live in Perth, Western Australia, so if any of you find yourselves down this
way, drop me a line, you'll always be welcome.
Best regards,
John Woods
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Barry Davis" <bed(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: a question for "women2 fly" |
WOW, always wondered who built this beauty.
Barry
NX973BP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of womenfly2
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 7:25 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: a question for "women2 fly"
-->
I have built a Pietenpol, flown it, and sold it. Click on my link below.
Presently building a Wag Aero J3 Cub, with some modification on my own.
Cheers,
Wf2
--------
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371340#371340
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/nov18_08_copy_116.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Walter Allen <overalles45(at)yahoo.com> |
1. I bought glider manual and plans in the early nineties=0A2. bought and f
inished a Grega project in the 90's=0A3. sold project in 99 lost medical=0A
4. flew powered parachute from 2001 to 2011=0A5. passed medical in 2011.=0A
6. sold powered parachute 2011=0A7. 2011 started building 1928 Model A moto
r, bored 125 over, insert main bearings, new babbitt rod bearings=0A8. rece
ntly bought 172-3/8" longest fuselage about 75% completed-now must make one
of the following decisions:=0A----A. Finish my A motor and hang it
on the longest fuselage=0A----B. Cut down the longest fuselage to
163" and use my A motor=0A----C. Stop building my A motor and look
for a continental motor.=0AAny feedback is appreciated.=0AThanks=0A-Walte
r Allen Owensboro Kentucky
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AMsafetyC(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Builder: John N Recine Lancaster Aeroplane Works
330 Knightsbridge Way
Lititz, Pennsylvania 17543
Cell 215-208-8309
Hangared 5-5 at Lancaster airport, Lancaster , PA
Pronounced locally Amish inflection: Lankester
Airport identifier LNS
Construction: February 21, 2007 to date
Estimated completion: 2 years
Tail number reserved : NX895JR
Tail # origin: Plans number builders initials
Plans Issued by: Don Pietenpol
Date of issuance: 05/22/2006
Long Fuse Pietenpol Air Camper
Powered by: Lycoming 0235 C1 D 108 hp internal combustion Aircraft engine
Engine Statue: Disassembled, inspected and awaiting consumable parts,
paint and assembly
Straight axle Jenny type Landing Gear, laminated white ash & black walnut
Wheels: Spoke Wheels
Cabane struts: laminated white ash and black walnut
Wing struts: laminated white ash and black walnut with embedded steel at
all 3 major attachment points
Instrument boards: white ash and black walnut veneered
Tail wheel: Maule steerable on single spring
Fuse: 172" long and 29" wide to the outside of the longerons
Construction: Poplar
Adhesive: West Systems Epoxy
Wings: 3 piece, major wing panels 15' 7 " roughly
Spars: Routed yellow poplar 1"
Ribs: Spruce, purchased from Jack Textor 2007
Center section: 34" Poplar Spars and spruce ribs
Wingspan overall: 35' estimated tip to tip
Firewall: Stainless over fiberfrax sheeting
Tail Feather: Poplar
Fittings: Stainless and mild steel
Skin: TBD
Paint: TBD
Paint Scheme: TBD
Status: fuse in preparation for varnish coat progressed slowed
significantly due to factors both within and beyond my control. Visitors to the
Lancaster Aeroplane Works are welcome wear work cloths and Bring Beer and Pizza!
all of which will satisfy the Aeroplane Gods
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: What I am doing |
Hello Walter. It seems that your questions really come down to personal preference.
To save some time and money, use what you currently have and see how it flies.
Although I am not familiar with the Model A, so I can't comment on W&B issues with
it and the long fuse...if there are any.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Nauerth III" <proplock(at)federatedwildblue.com> |
| Subject: | Re: hose fittings |
Hi, the problem is; master cylinders are from a wrecked Cessna, the
fitting on the master is a =934, with o ring, so pipe thread
cannot be used on master. I need an aircraft hose with a 37 degree flair
fitting on master end, the outer end needs a male 1/8 pipe fitting, all
1/4 internal hose diameter,12 inches long. Nyla flow fittings are pipe
thread,will screw into Matco brake cylinders. Any thoughts? thanks
From: Jack Phillips
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 8:40 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: hose fittings
Try =C2=BC=9D Nylaflow tubing. You can get it and the fittings
from ACS. It=99s what Vans uses on all the RV=99s. I used
it on my master cylinders on my Pietenpol. I used regular AeroQuip
hoses at the brake calipers.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Nauerth III
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 8:48 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: hose fittings
long story short; have a master brake cylinder,has an =934 an 833
elbow on it, what fittings,hose do I need to match up with 1/8 pipe
thread? Picture taken at Broadhead, on another Piet, I know something
is available, but what? am frustrated at trying to find fittings.
Thanks, Regards, John III
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: calling for a Rick Holland update---come in Rick....do |
you r
| From: | "at7000ft" <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> |
Hey Mikey (and rest of Piet gang)
Yes I am still alive, just haven't been on the forum for a while. As many of you
guys have said you don't make much sawdust sitting in front of a computer.
Anyhow after seven years I had everything done but the paperwork, renting a hanger
and finding a trailer to drag everything to Meadow Lake airport (East of Colorado
Springs). But as you know I have one of those crank snappin Vairs and
I kept thinking about Randy telling me about his crank snapping episode and decided
to pull the engine off and install a Weseman 5th bearing and higher capacity
oil pump, (I can almost hear Jack snickering in the background). Am almost
done with that so I can soon do a final W&B and start looking for that hanger
(and take a couple lessons in a tail dragger of some sort).
rick
--------
Rick Holland
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371375#371375
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: calling for a Rick Holland update---come in Rick....do |
you r
Way to go, Rick! Will we be seeing this one at Brodhead this summer?
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of at7000ft
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 3:27 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: calling for a Rick Holland update---come in
Rick....do you r
Hey Mikey (and rest of Piet gang)
Yes I am still alive, just haven't been on the forum for a while. As many of
you guys have said you don't make much sawdust sitting in front of a
computer.
Anyhow after seven years I had everything done but the paperwork, renting a
hanger and finding a trailer to drag everything to Meadow Lake airport (East
of Colorado Springs). But as you know I have one of those crank snappin
Vairs and I kept thinking about Randy telling me about his crank snapping
episode and decided to pull the engine off and install a Weseman 5th bearing
and higher capacity oil pump, (I can almost hear Jack snickering in the
background). Am almost done with that so I can soon do a final W&B and start
looking for that hanger (and take a couple lessons in a tail dragger of some
sort).
rick
--------
Rick Holland
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371375#371375
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson(at)centurylink.net> |
Started building NX510JD July, 2009
Sitka spruce and certified plywood
Long fuselage
Wingspan 32.5 feet one piece
All control surfaces hinged gap-less with piano hinge
16.5 gallon airfoil shaped wing tank
Covered with 2.7 oz Dacron using Stewart systems adhesive
Painted with Rustoleum oil base Regal Red fuselage, v fin and rudder. The wing,horizontal
stabilizer, and elevators are painted with Rustoleum oil base Safety
Yellow.
now in final assembly
Jenny style gear with Kawasaki dirt bike forged aluminum 21" wheels, mechanical
disc brakes
Lycoming O-235 C2C 115 HP @ 2800 rpm
Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
--------
Jerry Dotson
59 Daniel Johnson Rd
Baker, FL 32531
Started building NX510JD July, 2009
thru covering and painting, now in final assembly
21" wheels
Lycoming O-235 C2C
Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371382#371382
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Inspection rings |
I've never heard of putting on a new piece of fabric. Leave the hole uncut
until you need to look inside where the ring is, cut the fabric out inside
the ring, after inspection replace the cutout piece with an alluminum cover
which is specially made for just that. C
----- Original Message -----
From: "giacummo" <mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2012 9:48 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Inspection rings
>
>
> Hello,
>
> I am not putting any ring by the moment, I just want to understand, or
> know better about the inspection rings.
> As I saw in lots of pictures and drawings there are 2 kinds of them, ones
> have an aluminium (I think Al) hatch to close them, and others have just a
> rounf piece of fabric over the a plastic ring.
> The procedure to inspect with the ones with the fabric cover ( I want to
> understand ) is: cut the fabric inside the hole, inpect, and put a nuew
> piece of fabric... isn't it?
>
> thank you
>
> --------
> Mario Giacummo
> http://vgmk1.blogspot.com
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371041#371041
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
| From: | helspersew(at)aol.com |
John,
Why is your wingspan so huge? Was this this intentional?
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
-----Original Message-----
From: AMsafetyC <AMsafetyC(at)aol.com>
Sent: Fri, Apr 20, 2012 10:28 am
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies!
Builder: John N Recine Lancaster Aeroplane Works
330 Knightsbridge Way
Lititz, Pennsylvania 17543
Cell 215-208-8309
Hangared 5-5 at Lancaster airport, Lancaster , PA
Pronounced locally Amish inflection: Lankester
Airport identifier LNS
Construction: February 21, 2007 to date
Estimated completion: 2 years
Tail number reserved : NX895JR
Tail # origin: Plans number builders initials
Plans Issued by: Don Pietenpol
Date of issuance: 05/22/2006
Long Fuse Pietenpol Air Camper
Powered by: Lycoming 0235 C1 D 108 hp internal combustion Aircraft engine
Engine Statue: Disassembled, inspected and awaiting consumable parts, paint
and assembly
Straight axle Jenny type Landing Gear, laminated white ash & black walnut
Wheels: Spoke Wheels
Cabane struts: laminated white ash and black walnut
Wing struts: laminated white ash and black walnut with embedded steel at al
l 3 major attachment points
Instrument boards: white ash and black walnut veneered
Tail wheel: Maule steerable on single spring
Fuse: 172" long and 29" wide to the outside of the longerons
Construction: Poplar
Adhesive: West Systems Epoxy
Wings: 3 piece, major wing panels 15' 7 " roughly
Spars: Routed yellow poplar 1"
Ribs: Spruce, purchased from Jack Textor 2007
Center section: 34" Poplar Spars and spruce ribs
Wingspan overall: 35' estimated tip to tip
Firewall: Stainless over fiberfrax sheeting
Tail Feather: Poplar
Fittings: Stainless and mild steel
Skin: TBD
Paint: TBD
Paint Scheme: TBD
Status: fuse in preparation for varnish coat progressed slowed significantl
y due to factors both within and beyond my control. Visitors to the Lancast
er Aeroplane Works are welcome wear work cloths and Bring Beer and Pizza! a
ll of which will satisfy the Aeroplane Gods
John
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AMsafetyC(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Dan,
its been a while since I measured the wing panels however I believe the
spars were cut from 16 foot poplar planks to 15
'7" from the joint hinge strap fitting to the bow of the wing tips, as i
recall. Even then I thought more wing the better so I didn't mind the length.
I believe the plans for the 3 piece wing are larger any way.
All of which is speculation at the moment until I get good solid
measurements from the wing panels. If my numbers are incorrect I will correct
them
Ill let ya know
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oscar Zuniga <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | apologies to Axel |
Having not seen any response to my post about Kevin, it occurredto me that I may
have offended him with some of the content. Nosuch effect was intended. Kevin
is the sort that we need more ofhere, and there, and everywhere. I am honored
to be among his aviationcohort, and I am very honored to call him my friend.
>From all that I see and hear about her, is wife is every bit his equal, too.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
Flying Squirrel N2069Z "Rocket"
Medford, OR
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | apologies to Axel |
Oscar,
I know Kevin well enough to know that it would take a lot more than that to
offend him. He's busy learning to fly a new helicopter.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Oscar Zuniga
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 9:16 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: apologies to Axel
Having not seen any response to my post about Kevin, it occurredto me that I
may have offended him with some of the content. Nosuch effect was intended.
Kevin is the sort that we need more ofhere, and there, and everywhere. I
am honored to be among his aviationcohort, and I am very honored to call him
my friend.
>From all that I see and hear about her, is wife is every bit his equal,
too.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
Flying Squirrel N2069Z "Rocket"
Medford, OR
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> |
Hello guys, hope you all are getting some flying in.- I have been busy do
ing house work for the past 4 weeks, and the piet is still tore apart.- I
started the annual about a month ago, and took all the tail hardware, tail
wire fittings to repaint them, and had to replace the carb heat box due to
cracks (didnt feel like taking the time to repair them right now).- Dad
wants to replace all the lift strut hardware for piece of mind, and recoat
the inside of the struts with corrosion prevention compound (AV-30).- No
big items on the annual except lack of time to get it done.- I am putting
in a brick patio that started with tearing out a deck, tearing out a chimn
ey, patching in the vinal siding, patching in the roof,-regrading aroung
the house with 20 tons of stone, and 7 yards of topsoil, and the poor Piet
is sitting out in the hangar with its pants down.- Hopefully I will have
it back up within 3-4 weeks and get some flying in before 100LL hits
$27/gal.- As far as having my fly-in it is still in the planning phase,
not sure when to do it, probably late summer, or early fall.- I am also t
rying to work an angle to get time off work, and permission from "The Boss"
to squeeze in 3 days to go to Brodhead.- If she lets me I will try to fl
y up friday, and come home sunday.- I might need to order 48 feet of vort
alator tape to get the required speed I will need to get there and back-o
n that tight scedule.-
-
Happy flights, and restfull nights to Y'all
-
Shad
-
-
P.S.- I will not be atempting any spins without a pith helmet, or marvel
mys. oil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack" <jack(at)textors.com> |
| Subject: | put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Great idea Douwe!
Plans purchased from Pietenpol family 2003
Hiatus to build RV8
Re-started in 2009 with ribs
Rough cut all wood except capstrips
Currently all wood work finished, empennage and wings varnished
Controls done
Split gear about =BE done, 25 inch wire wheels redoing
C85 -0- time done
To complete=85 engine mount, cover, rigging, instruments, plumbing, etc
NX1929T reserved
Pictures here www.textors.com
Jack Textor
DSM
NX1929T
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Douwe
Blumberg
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2012 8:14 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies!
Here=92s an idea,
With so many of us sharing, I realized that I=92m unfamiliar with what
most
people are building (IF they=92re building=85) so=85
How =91bout we all send in what we=92re building (Pietenpol, I know)
like what
engine, gear, wood or steel fuse, long or short fuse, how long into it
and
maybe how long to go? and additions/changes of note that we might find
interesting and colors would be fun if you=92re not too secretive about
such
vital information.
I=92ll start.
Short fuselage
Continental C-90 with starter
Two piece wing
Wood struts
Bumped up =93tiger moth=94 type center section tank
=93Jenny=94 gear
=93faux=94 doped/aged translucent linen finish with a beautiful =93baby
poop=94
green trim and =93Re-PIET=94 huge across the wing and down each fuse
side.
Aiming to be done in two or three months.
Marvel Mystery Oil in fuel, pre-mixed-sloshed, pre-warmed and perfumed!
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kyle85" <boschkyle(at)hotmail.com> |
I THOUGHT I had my mind made up on this but I have started having doubts on fuse
length. My emp is days from completion and I was planning on starting the fuse
shortly after. I have plans for both the long and the short fuse along with
the materials to build either, so that is not a factor. Here is my scenario;
It is important to me that my dad be able to fly with me. He is about 6'2 and
230 lbs. I am 5'10 180 lbs. My initial thought was long fuse because I was planning
on running a cont. A-65. But then i realized my fuel tank is set up to
be placed in the nose. So, I would think I could go with the short and be fine
with the added fuel weight that far forward. But the problem with that logic
is I will develop an aft CG as my fuel burns. If I do decide to go with the short
will my dad fit with that fuel tank up there? I need some real world guidance
here I know a few of you have built and flown planes close to this configuration.
Any regrets or thoughts you would like to pass along would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Kyle
--------
Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete the
flight.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371455#371455
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Cardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuse question |
Your 6' 2" Dad will not be happy in the front cockpit of a short fuselage
Pietenpol, regardless of fuel tank location.
I am 5' 11" and had a ride in the short fuselage version. It was a tight
fit.
Greg Cardinal
Minneapolis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kyle85" <boschkyle(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 9:59 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuse question
>
> I THOUGHT I had my mind made up on this but I have started having doubts
> on fuse length. My emp is days from completion and I was planning on
> starting the fuse shortly after. I have plans for both the long and the
> short fuse along with the materials to build either, so that is not a
> factor. Here is my scenario; It is important to me that my dad be able to
> fly with me. He is about 6'2 and 230 lbs. I am 5'10 180 lbs. My initial
> thought was long fuse because I was planning on running a cont. A-65. But
> then i realized my fuel tank is set up to be placed in the nose. So, I
> would think I could go with the short and be fine with the added fuel
> weight that far forward. But the problem with that logic is I will develop
> an aft CG as my fuel burns. If I do decide to go with the short will my
> dad fit with that fuel tank up there? I need some real world guidance here
> I know a few of you have built and flown planes close to this
> configuration. Any regrets or thoughts you would like to !
> pass along would be appreciated.
> Thanks,
> Kyle
>
> --------
> Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully
> complete the flight.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371455#371455
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
Kyle,
I'm 6' 2" and about 195 lbs. I have the long fuselage, with the fuel in the
centersection. I can just barely manage to get into the front cockpit (rear
cockpit is fine) and would not want to sit in it for any extended period.
My cabane struts are 2-1/2" longer than plans and even with that it's a bear
to fold myself into the front seat.
If I were you, I'd build the short fuselage (because it's lighter, and
you'll need all the lightness you can get to haul both of you aloft) and put
your Dad on a diet. He'll thank you for it (as will his Doctor), he'll fit
better in the airplane, and the plane will perform better.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Greg
Cardinal
Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 11:31 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuse question
Your 6' 2" Dad will not be happy in the front cockpit of a short fuselage
Pietenpol, regardless of fuel tank location.
I am 5' 11" and had a ride in the short fuselage version. It was a tight
fit.
Greg Cardinal
Minneapolis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kyle85" <boschkyle(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 9:59 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuse question
>
> I THOUGHT I had my mind made up on this but I have started having doubts
> on fuse length. My emp is days from completion and I was planning on
> starting the fuse shortly after. I have plans for both the long and the
> short fuse along with the materials to build either, so that is not a
> factor. Here is my scenario; It is important to me that my dad be able to
> fly with me. He is about 6'2 and 230 lbs. I am 5'10 180 lbs. My initial
> thought was long fuse because I was planning on running a cont. A-65. But
> then i realized my fuel tank is set up to be placed in the nose. So, I
> would think I could go with the short and be fine with the added fuel
> weight that far forward. But the problem with that logic is I will develop
> an aft CG as my fuel burns. If I do decide to go with the short will my
> dad fit with that fuel tank up there? I need some real world guidance here
> I know a few of you have built and flown planes close to this
> configuration. Any regrets or thoughts you would like to !
> pass along would be appreciated.
> Thanks,
> Kyle
>
> --------
> Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully
> complete the flight.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371455#371455
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Pietenpols Unstable? |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
A pilot told me that all the piets she flew were unstable. She said, If you let
go of the stick they would just fall off one way or the other. Say it aint
so!
John
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371466#371466
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuse question |
| From: | "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> |
Kyle - I have a long fuselage, no tank up front and standard length cabanes. Not
your setup but you may still find the information valuable: I've had people
close to your Dad's size up there and, 1) they don't want to stay very long,
2) they tear up the airplane getting in and out - the person and the plane cannot
exist in the same space at the same time. Extended cabanes would alleviate
ingress/egress issues a little but it would still be a tight fit.
--------
Kevin "Axel" Purtee
NX899KP
Austin/San Marcos, TX
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371467#371467
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
| From: | "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> |
Perhaps she meant to say that all Piet pilots are unstable? How many has she flown?
Here's what I know: if the air is calm my airplane will fly hands off for 20-30
seconds. If there are any bumps I have to monitor the airplane much more closely.
The nose wants to drop at low speeds, but that has nothing to do with aerodynamics
and everything to do with those big heavy elevators hanging back there being
subject to gravity. I have the East Texas Trim System in the form of a bungee
cord that keeps the nose where it belongs.
Here's what I've been told. I'm darn sure no aerodynamics expert so take it for
what it's worth: if the CG is jacked up, common in a Piet, an airplane can be
unstable. The experts can chime in.
--------
Kevin "Axel" Purtee
NX899KP
Austin/San Marcos, TX
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371469#371469
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Cardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
Only in turbulence. The only time I found it bothersome is when trying to
fold a chart. Then I learned to have my charts pepared prior to takeoff to
minimize folding them in the air.
It is part of the charm.
Greg Cardinal
Minneapolis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2012 7:01 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpols Unstable?
>
> A pilot told me that all the piets she flew were unstable. She said,
> ?oIf you let go of the stick they would just fall off one way or the
> other?. Say it ain?Tt so!
>
> John
>
> --------
> John
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371466#371466
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
| From: | "Jack(at)textors.com" <jack(at)textors.com> |
Has anyone ever built a "flying" tail Piet? In my model years I did so with a couple
of Sig Seniors and it worked well.
Jack Textor
Sent from my iPad
On Apr 22, 2012, at 7:15 AM, "kevinpurtee" wrote:
>
> Perhaps she meant to say that all Piet pilots are unstable? How many has she
flown?
>
> Here's what I know: if the air is calm my airplane will fly hands off for 20-30
seconds. If there are any bumps I have to monitor the airplane much more closely.
>
> The nose wants to drop at low speeds, but that has nothing to do with aerodynamics
and everything to do with those big heavy elevators hanging back there being
subject to gravity. I have the East Texas Trim System in the form of a bungee
cord that keeps the nose where it belongs.
>
> Here's what I've been told. I'm darn sure no aerodynamics expert so take it
for what it's worth: if the CG is jacked up, common in a Piet, an airplane can
be unstable. The experts can chime in.
>
> --------
> Kevin "Axel" Purtee
> NX899KP
> Austin/San Marcos, TX
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371469#371469
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ryan M <aircamperace(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
John,=0A=0ABecause=C2-Piets have no =C2-dihedral and generally have an
aft cg, it will be less stable than a 172 or whatever else she is used to f
lying. That doesn't necessarily make it a bad thing, just has more=C2-cha
racter, but may take a little more skill to fly it.=C2-=0A=0AI am a pilot
but only a Piet builder so take it for what it's worth.=0A=0ARyan Michals
=0A=0AStability=C2-is the tendency of an airplane in flight to remain in
straight, level, upright flight and to return to this attitude, if displace
d, without corrective action by the pilot.=0AStatic stability=C2-is the
=C2-initial=C2-tendency of an airplane, when disturbed, to return to th
e original position.=0ADynamic stability=C2-is the=C2-overall=C2-tend
ency of an airplane to return to its original position, following a series
of damped out oscillations.=0A=0AStability may be (a)=C2-positive,=C2-m
eaning the airplane will develop forces or moments which tend to restore it
to its original position; (b)=C2-neutral,=C2-meaning the restoring for
ces are absent and the airplane will neither return from its disturbed posi
tion, nor move further away; (c)=C2-negative,=C2-meaning it will develo
p forces or moments which tend to move it further away. Negative stability
is, in other words, the condition of=C2-instability.=0AA stable airplane
is one that will fly "hands off" and is pleasant and easy to handle. An exc
eedingly stable airplane, on the other hand, may lack maneuverability.=0AAn
airplane which, following a disturbance, oscillates with increasing up and
down movements until it eventually stalls or enters a dangerous dive would
be said to be unstable, or to have negative dynamic stability.=0AAn airpla
ne that has positive dynamic stability does not automatically have positive
=C2-static=C2-stability. The designers may have elected to build in, fo
r example, negative static stability and positive dynamic stability in orde
r to achieve their objective in maneuverability. In other words, negative a
nd positive dynamic and static stability may be incorporated in any combina
tion in any particular design of airplane.=0AAn airplane may be=C2-inhere
ntly stable,=C2-that is, stable due to features incorporated in the desig
n, but may become=C2-unstable=C2-due to changes in the position of the
center of gravity (caused by consumption of fuel, improper disposition of t
he disposable load, etc.).=0AStability may be (a)=C2-longitudinal,=C2-(
b)=C2-lateral,=C2-or (c)=C2-directional,=C2-depending on whether th
e disturbance has affected the airframe in the (a)=C2-pitching,=C2-(b)
=C2-rolling, or (c)=C2-yawing=C2-plane. copied from :http://www.allst
ar.fiu.edu/aero/axes33.htm=C2-=0A=0A________________________________=0A F
rom: Kringle =0ATo: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com =0ASen
t: Sunday, April 22, 2012 8:01 AM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpols Uns
n.com>=0A=0AA pilot told me that all the piets she flew were unstable.=C2
- She said, =9CIf you let go of the stick they would just fall off
one way or the other=9D.=C2- Say it ain=99t so!=0A=0AJohn=0A
=0A--------=0AJohn=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://f
orums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371466#371466=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
Ill ask her more the next time I see her but it may be several months. She is
a retired FAA inspector and has over 100 hours piloting Pietenpols.
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371477#371477
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
| From: | steve emo <steve.emo58(at)gmail.com> |
Sorry folks but I must say something here... The Piet's design is basically
stable. If the CG is within limits and the plane is well rigged. I have
no adjustable elevator trim on 58TL but I can trim it using the throttle.
Just for grins the other night I took my hands off the stick and using only
the throttle and rudders entered downwind at 45 deg and turned to base.
Banks were 15 deg or so. I was seeing if I might be able to land it
without stick input. My conclusion is with 'luck' and a long
approach/field one could fly it on.
I used to fly a 1978 PA28-181 and wouldn't fly more than 5-10 seconds
without dropping a wing until we FIXED the aileron rigging! Then you could
fly it with the throttle and rudder...
Piet design Inherently unstable? - Simply No
Steve
On Sun, Apr 22, 2012 at 8:01 AM, Kringle wrote:
>
> A pilot told me that all the piets she flew were unstable. She said, =93
If
> you let go of the stick they would just fall off one way or the other=94.
> Say it ain=92t so!
>
> John
>
> --------
> John
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371466#371466
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick N" <horzpool(at)goldengate.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
The stability of the Piet is totally affected by the lack of trim tabs.
That needs to be controlled by engine power instead. Or as BHP said, you
can stick your arm out to one side or the other and make it turn. Dont try
that with a 172.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2012 7:01 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpols Unstable?
>
> A pilot told me that all the piets she flew were unstable. She said,
> ?oIf you let go of the stick they would just fall off one way or the
> other?. Say it ain?Tt so!
>
> John
>
> --------
> John
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371466#371466
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
| From: | "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> |
All flying Piets are stable. What that means is that when disturbed from a steady
state, they tend to return to that state, rather than diverge from it. If
the CG is within limits, it's pretty much guaranteed... (barring weird stuff).
However, probably due to the reasonably small control surfaces, Piets tend to get
better pilot reports when flown in the aft region of acceptable CG limits.
There, the plane is LESS stable, but still stable. When disturbed from a steady
state, it's pretty slow and not aggressive about returning to that state,
also, it takes less force to disturb it.
Stability and maneuverability are the mutually exclusive things here. You can
only have one, and how an airplane flies is a compromise between the two.
The general inability to remain trimmed and simply fly hands off however is probably
what's being discussed, rather than stability. A highly stable airplane
will have the ability to stay trimmed up better than one that is not as stable,
or more maneuverable. As mentioned, many piets don't even have a way to trim
them, so for hands off flight, you find the airspeed the airplane is trimmed
for. Dicks's NX2RN is a classic example. It's hands off at 2K rpm and a pilot
only. Fly at a higher rpm and it needs some rudder input and it climbs (or
needs constant down stick and will therefore fly faster). At 1900 rpm, the
opposite.
So the broad sweeping statement that Piets are unstable really suffers from misuse
of the term stable. For it's class, it's a relatively maneuverable, less
stable airplane. If you want it more stable, move the CG forward. Then, rig
the plane to fly hands off in the regime you'll be flying in the most.
By the way, if the plane was unstable, when it is disturbed from steady state,
that movement would continue until something bad happens, like a ground loop,
but in the air. All taildraggers are unstable while moving on the ground. Directionality
can be achieved by overcoming the unstable force either with sufficient
rudder authority or tailwheel authority, or brakes, or something. But
the configuration is unstable.
The one caveat is unstable airplanes like F-18's, that have computers keeping them
in control. They are maneuvable and have forced stability.
Tools
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371490#371490
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ryan M <aircamperace(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
With 100hrs, her=C2-experience=C2-couldn't have been all that bad, she
got back in one, several times.=0A=0ARyan=0A=0A____________________________
____=0A From: Kringle <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>=0ATo: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.c
om =0ASent: Sunday, April 22, 2012 10:24 AM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: Re:
=0A=0AI=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2ll ask her more the next
time I see her but it may be several months.=C2- She is a retired FAA in
spector and has over 100 hours piloting Pietenpols.=0A=0A--------=0AJohn=0A
=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/v
- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2-
====================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: hose fittings |
John, have you found the hose fittings you need? If not, email me off list and
we'll talk...I believe I can help you out.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Timothy Willis <timwillis01(at)gmail.com> |
Go long. Period.
Piets are still tight fits for many. I have a short Piet fuze hanging
in my garage as unusable by me, and a long fuselage Piet requires
bigger "shin holes" for me in the bulkhead at the passenger seat back
frame. I am just under 6 ft. 2in. Others may well correct me on
this, but I suspect both the pilot and passenger make out with more
room in a long fuze version.
Not only you and your dad, but other passengers and maybe the guy you
sell it to or your kids may appreciate the longer leg room and ease of
entry.
Tim in central TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jeff wilson <jlwilsonnn(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Cards on the Table x 2 |
Hello Fella's=0A=0AI'm involved in two Piet builds. My Piet started in 1992
when I bought the GN-1 plans from John Grega. At that time I didn't even k
now about Bernard, Hoopman and Cherry Grove.- But I was just too busy wit
h Career- and family so the plans sat in my file drawer along with all my
other info packets for other kits and plans for the dream of flight.=0AThe
n in 2010, with my youngest of 3 finally graduated from college, I started
getting the itch again. I looked through all the info packets and plans for
several different aircraft and came across the Grega plans. An EAA member
since 1992, I was not involved in a Chapter so it was time to get to know s
ome guys and get started building. When I went to the Chapter meeting for t
he first time I carried the GN-1 plans with me. I had written GN-1 in large
red letters on the outside of the manilla envelope and as soon as I walked
in the room the chapter president Brian Kissinger, saw it and said "We've
been looking for those". It turns out that about a half a year before the c
hapter had received a Piet that had been crashed nearly 15 years before. It
was a Grega built in the early 70's by a retired airline pilot, Art Hollim
an. The construction was A+. Well done and over built at just over 800 poun
ds. The crash did very little damage to the plane but
unfortunately Art Holliman did not fair so well. He is still with us but a
head injury left him blind. The plane was scavenged for the engine and ins
truments but the rest was in remarkable shape.=0ASo about a dozen chapter 6
4 members are working a few hours a week to rebuild it. About half the tail
feathers have been covered and one wing panel should be done soon. Another
crew is working on the fuse and cowl to enclose the 0-200. Cub style gear
with springs and 6 inch wheels.=0AWe were hoping to make Brodhead this year
but 2013 is more realistic.=0AThis is our Logo (copyrighted)=0A=0ABelow is
the Scrounge Dawg Piet (GN-1) at Historic Hangar 2, built by Curtis Wright
in 1927and used to build the Curtis Robin, at CPS St. Louis Downtown.=0A
=0A=0A=0ANow back to my Piet. I started researching Pietenpol on the intern
et and found the Brodhead Pietenpol Association and this Matronics list. I
sent away for the plans and picked up a project consisting of basic fuse an
d ribs and spars. I already have the Bingellis books, bought way back $45 f
or all 4.=0ASo I'm building to plans, long fuse, using Tony's books as the
construction manual.=0A=0AFuse is mostly done now except for Jenny style ge
ar which won't be put on till I get it in my new (new to me that is) hangar
at H49. Hangar needs a lot of work yet. Hope to be in by June.=0ARibs on s
pars with leading and trailing edges. Have not yet cut out ailerons.=0AI ha
ve a beautiful little A-65 200 hrs SMOH and chrome cylinders and complete e
xhaust, airbox, carb etc.- Engine is ready to mount.=0A=0ARay Hegy 72x42
prop previously flight tested by Oscar Z. on Scout.=0AWith the three piece
wing, the span will be 31 ft. Cross bracing in wings will be hard wire, no
turnbuckles.=0A=0A15 gal tank in center section. No nose tank.=0A19 inch ri
ms will be cross laced to a home made 6inch hub and covered with fabric.
=0A=0ASmall go-cart style strap brakes, heel pedals.=0A=0ABelow pic is not
very current=0A=0A=0AJeff Wilson=0ASt. Louis, MO=0APrivate Pilot
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
Douwe, you have really started something. If all these new builders get their planes
flying then we are going to have a hell of a squadron. Cheers, Gardiner
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: long fuze Piet? |
| From: | "Kyle85" <boschkyle(at)hotmail.com> |
Thanks Tim! Looks like I will be making the long one work for me. Just be building
a class E and G airspace basic VFR airplane with no extra electrical and split
axle landing gear with spoke wheels. The end product hopefully will be light
enough for us.
Kyle
--------
Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete the
flight.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371521#371521
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuse question |
| From: | "Kyle85" <boschkyle(at)hotmail.com> |
Thanks guys! Looks like I am going to build long and as light as I can!
-Kyle
--------
Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete the
flight.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371522#371522
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
Kevin, what do you mean by "jacked up"? C
----- Original Message -----
From: "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil>
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2012 8:15 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpols Unstable?
>
>
> Perhaps she meant to say that all Piet pilots are unstable? How many has
> she flown?
>
> Here's what I know: if the air is calm my airplane will fly hands off for
> 20-30 seconds. If there are any bumps I have to monitor the airplane much
> more closely.
>
> The nose wants to drop at low speeds, but that has nothing to do with
> aerodynamics and everything to do with those big heavy elevators hanging
> back there being subject to gravity. I have the East Texas Trim System in
> the form of a bungee cord that keeps the nose where it belongs.
>
> Here's what I've been told. I'm darn sure no aerodynamics expert so take
> it for what it's worth: if the CG is jacked up, common in a Piet, an
> airplane can be unstable. The experts can chime in.
>
> --------
> Kevin "Axel" Purtee
> NX899KP
> Austin/San Marcos, TX
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371469#371469
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gliderx5(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Latex Paint Forum |
Just an FYI for anyone in the Suffolk , VA area. I will be at the VA Festiv
al of flight this coming weekend presenting a forum on painting your airpla
ne with inexpensive latex paint. The forum is currently scheduled to run fr
om 11:15 to 12:15 on Saturday (maybe Sunday too). I will talk about finishi
ng my Kolb MKII, Titan Tornado, and Pietenpol Aircamper. Weather permitting
I will have the Titan with me. Stop by and say hi if you get the chance. B
elow is a link to the festival=99s web site.
http://virginiaflyin.org/
Malcolm Morrison
http://home.comcast.net/~mmorrison123/Airplanes.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
| From: | "Kyle85" <boschkyle(at)hotmail.com> |
Chuck,
Jacked up is a term that you would hear a lot in the military. It means something
that is not correct or blatantly wrong. You will hear drill instructors tell
someone their uniform is "Jacked Up" if it is wrinkled or items not pinned(or
in today's military velcro) in its place. Sorry to cut in, but I am pretty sure
that is what he was getting at.
Kyle
--------
Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete the
flight.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371540#371540
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpols Unstable? |
| From: | "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> |
Too far aft, Chuck.
--------
Kevin "Axel" Purtee
NX899KP
Austin/San Marcos, TX
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371549#371549
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rod Wooller <rmwo(at)clear.net.nz> |
From: Rod Wooller [mailto:rodwooller(at)gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, 23 April 2012 8:19 PM
Subject: Fwd: Corvair CHT
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Rod Wooller <rodwooller(at)gmail.com>
Date: Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 9:29 PM
Subject: Corvair CHT
Pietenpol-List Digest List
I have a CHT gauge on my Pietenpol with sensors under the rear spark plugs
of each cylinder head.
Can anyone tell me the maximum temperature that the Corvair heads should be
run at ?
Thanks,
Rod Wooller
ZK-PAC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson(at)centurylink.net> |
My book on the Lycoming O-235 C2C says:
Cylinder head Maximum temp 525 F for spark plug thermocouple preferred max 425
F continuous. I would think most engines would have similar maximums. I hope
mine will be in the 375 area for longevity.
--------
Jerry Dotson
59 Daniel Johnson Rd
Baker, FL 32531
Started building NX510JD July, 2009
thru covering and painting, now in final assembly
21" wheels
Lycoming O-235 C2C
Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371572#371572
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Franklin <jbfjr(at)peoplepc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: FW: Corvair CHT |
Rod,there is a good discussion of CHT and cooling issues at the following link:
http://flycorvair.com/pietengineissue.html
Lots of info there...
Regards,
John Franklin
Prairie Aire 4TA0
Needville, TX
GN-1 / Corvair 164CID
I have a CHT gauge on my Pietenpol with sensors under the rear spark plugs of each
cylinder head.
Can anyone tell me the maximum temperature that the Corvair heads should be run
at ?
Thanks,
Rod Wooller
ZK-PAC
________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: FW: Corvair CHT |
WW says, ".....I would try and keep the motor below 450F peak and 400F
cruise......"
----- Original Message -----
From: Rod Wooller
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 4:22 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: FW: Corvair CHT
From: Rod Wooller [mailto:rodwooller(at)gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, 23 April 2012 8:19 PM
To: rmwo(at)clear.net.nz
Subject: Fwd: Corvair CHT
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Rod Wooller <rodwooller(at)gmail.com>
Date: Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 9:29 PM
Subject: Corvair CHT
To: Pietenpol-List Digest Server ,
Pietenpol-List Digest List
I have a CHT gauge on my Pietenpol with sensors under the rear spark
plugs of each cylinder head.
Can anyone tell me the maximum temperature that the Corvair heads
should be run at ?
Thanks,
Rod Wooller
ZK-PAC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hans van der Voort <nx15kv(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: FW: Corvair CHT |
Rod,=0A-=0AThe max is over well 400F, however I see a constant 350 F on b
oth sides on mine even on a hot Texas day.=0A-=0AHans=0A-=0ANX 15KV=0AW
aller, TX=0A =0A=0A________________________________=0A From: Rod Wooller <r
mwo(at)clear.net.nz>=0ATo: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Monday, April
23, 2012 3:22 AM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: FW: Corvair CHT=0A =0A=0A-
=0A-=0AFrom:Rod Wooller [mailto:rodwooller(at)gmail.com] =0ASent: Monday, 23
April 2012 8:19 PM=0ATo: rmwo(at)clear.net.nz=0ASubject: Fwd: Corvair CHT=0A
-=0A-=0A---------- Forwarded message ----------=0AFrom: Rod Wooller <ro
dwooller(at)gmail.com>=0ADate: Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 9:29 PM=0ASubject: Corvair
CHT=0ATo: Pietenpol-List Digest Server , Pie
tenpol-List Digest List =0A=0A=0AI hav
e a CHT gauge on my Pietenpol with sensors under the rear spark plugs of ea
ch cylinder head.=0ACan anyone tell me the maximum temperature that the Cor
vair heads should be run at ?=0A=0AThanks,=0ARod Wooller=0AZK-PAC=0A- =0A
================
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Cards on the table |
| From: | Amsafetyc <amsafetyc(at)aol.com> |
Now since most of us have put our cards on the table to meet the request, is someone
planning to take the information arrange it into a consolidated universally
formatted spread sheet and publish and send it out to all members?
Was there or is there a purpose to all of that information being published?
Having taken the time to participate, what was the purpose?
Thanks
John
Archive at your own risk
Sent from my iPhone
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Woodflier(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Va. Festival of Flight |
I'm flying my Piet down for the Va Festival of Flight. We're planning on
flyin Friday evening and making a weekend of it, along with me, 3 buddies
with a 182, a Piper Colt and a TriPacer. Malcomb, I'll look out for your
talk. I didn't use latex but I did investigate it and gave it serious
consideration. My familiarity with the PolyFiber system, and it's repairability
made
me go that way with my finish.
Matt Paxton
NX629ML
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: FW: Corvair CHT |
| From: | Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com> |
>From the '09 Corvair Flight Ops manual WW sells, Chapter 7 "Operational
Limits" written by Woody Harris:
"The Corvair has a factory limit of 575F. The engine will tolerate this for
very brief periods in automotive applications. For aircraft, the target is
much lower."
"400F should be the upper limit for stock heads. 450F is the limit for
Falcon heads."
A good read if you are going to be operating a Corvair in an aircraft, good
info, interesting writing....
Ryan
On Mon, Apr 23, 2012 at 9:07 AM, Hans van der Voort wrote:
> Rod,
>
> The max is over well 400F, however I see a constant 350 F on both sides on
> mine even on a hot Texas day.
>
> Hans
>
> NX 15KV
> Waller, TX
>
> *From:* Rod Wooller
>
> *To:* pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> *Sent:* Monday, April 23, 2012 3:22 AM
> *Subject:* Pietenpol-List: FW: Corvair CHT
>
>
> *From:* Rod Wooller [mailto:rodwooller(at)gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Monday, 23 April 2012 8:19 PM
> *To:* rmwo(at)clear.net.nz
> *Subject:* Fwd: Corvair CHT
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: *Rod Wooller* <rodwooller(at)gmail.com>
> Date: Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 9:29 PM
> Subject: Corvair CHT
> To: Pietenpol-List Digest Server ,
> Pietenpol-List Digest List
>
>
> I have a CHT gauge on my Pietenpol with sensors under the rear spark plugs
> of each cylinder head.
> Can anyone tell me the maximum temperature that the Corvair heads should
> be run at ?
>
> Thanks,
> Rod Wooller
> ZK-PAC
>
>
> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piete=====================
> *
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Control sticks in position... |
| From: | "aerocarjake" <flight.jake(at)gmail.com> |
Hello good Piet-ple,
My welder (Mike, who's company is "Ready Weld") came over and finished up welding
the control assembly on Friday. I then cleaned up the parts, positioned, drilled,
and temporarily bolted the assembly where it goes in the plane. (Note:
I am using "Home Depot" fasteners until final assembly so don't fret about the
cheap carriage bolts holding it all together until then...!)
Now I can sit in the plane and make airplane noises - while practicing takeoff's
and gradual turns (ha!)
Regards...
--------
Jake Schultz - curator,
Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371635#371635
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/pilot_stick_477.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/passenger_stick_164.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/pandp_control_sticks_170.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Aileron Cable Routing |
| From: | "899PM" <rockriverrifle(at)hotmail.com> |
Have any of you had to run a set of "idler" pulleys to route the aileron control
cables around instruments when moving the cabanes back? I am eyballing the cable
locations with the cabanes still vertical and see interference.
--------
PAPA MIKE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371634#371634
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Charvet <bencharvet(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Cable Routing |
I had to add some on mine. I added a tubular frame to mount the
passenger shoulder harnesses, a design I copied off the British Piet
site. Had to add some idlers to keep cables from rubbing. Something
else to consider is where the cross braces pass through the cowls, as
those move aft also.
Ben
On 4/23/2012 2:28 PM, 899PM wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "899PM"
>
> Have any of you had to run a set of "idler" pulleys to route the aileron control
cables around instruments when moving the cabanes back? I am eyballing the
cable locations with the cabanes still vertical and see interference.
>
> --------
> PAPA MIKE
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371634#371634
>
>
--
Ben Charvet, PharmD
Staff Pharmacist
Parrish Medical center
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Douwe Blumberg <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net> |
Hey all!
Wow, I really enjoyed reading the details of everyone's projects. I too am encouraged
that the design seems alive and well and can't wait for a few years down
the road when they're all up and flying! Sounds like some very interesting
ones coming along.
Am excited to hear from Rick Holland and can't wait to hear a flight report soon.
Keep at it everyone!
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Control sticks in position... |
Looks really nice, Jake. Seems so odd to see a steel tube framework instead
of wood, but very nice workmanship.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of aerocarjake
Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 2:29 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Control sticks in position...
Hello good Piet-ple,
My welder (Mike, who's company is "Ready Weld") came over and finished up
welding the control assembly on Friday. I then cleaned up the parts,
positioned, drilled, and temporarily bolted the assembly where it goes in
the plane. (Note: I am using "Home Depot" fasteners until final assembly so
don't fret about the cheap carriage bolts holding it all together until
then...!)
Now I can sit in the plane and make airplane noises - while practicing
takeoff's and gradual turns (ha!)
Regards...
--------
Jake Schultz - curator,
Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371635#371635
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/pilot_stick_477.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/passenger_stick_164.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/pandp_control_sticks_170.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> |
I've got all 6 instrumented. #3 is typically the warmest and it hasn't gone above
~360. Like Hans, I'm in Texas.
--------
Kevin "Axel" Purtee
NX899KP
Austin/San Marcos, TX
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371683#371683
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Douwe Blumberg <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | progress info thread |
Hey John,
As stated in my initial email that started that thread, I thought it be would be
1. interesting 2. encouraging and 3. educational to hear what everybody is doing.
I had no idea what most of us were building until now and it also gives us an idea
of when some of these new ones might "come on line".
As stated before, it is interesting to see the subtle and not so subtle "nuances"
builders are incorporating.
Douwe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rod Wooller <rmwo(at)clear.net.nz> |
Thanks for all the helpful replies. My cooling eyebrows are as per Hans van
der Voort's design, but I may need to do some work with high temp silicon to
minimise air leakage as my test pilot recorded CHT's of 450F during
climb-out on a 72F day. A flat nose probably doesn't help the airflow
either. Still a lot of testing to do before I get the controls.
Thanks again guys.
Rod Wooller
ZK-PAC
From: Rod Wooller [mailto:rodwooller(at)gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, 23 April 2012 8:19 PM
Subject: Fwd: Corvair CHT
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Rod Wooller <rodwooller(at)gmail.com>
Date: Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 9:29 PM
Subject: Corvair CHT
Pietenpol-List Digest List
I have a CHT gauge on my Pietenpol with sensors under the rear spark plugs
of each cylinder head.
Can anyone tell me the maximum temperature that the Corvair heads should be
run at ?
Thanks,
Rod Wooller
ZK-PAC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
I would like to see pictures of how some of you transitioned the wing tip to the
leading and trailing edge.
Thanks
John
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371737#371737
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Wing Tip Transition |
You can see the corner of the wingtip in the foregroud of this picture
(ignore me sitting in my fuselage making airplane noises). I mixed
microballoons with epoxy to make a thick slurry and globbed it in place,
then sanded it smooth.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kringle
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 7:34 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wing Tip Transition
I would like to see pictures of how some of you transitioned the wing tip to
the leading and trailing edge.
Thanks
John
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371737#371737
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | "giacummo" <mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com> |
May be this help?..
--------
Mario Giacummo
http://vgmk1.blogspot.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371744#371744
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc04443_105.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc04445_837.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
#2. John, as you will notice in some of my pictures, I didn't take the
aileron all the way to the tip. I used what some call an "encapsulated"
aileron. C
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 7:34 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wing Tip Transition
>
> I would like to see pictures of how some of you transitioned the wing tip
> to the leading and trailing edge.
>
> Thanks
> John
>
> --------
> John
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371737#371737
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com> |
do you have the bottom air baffles under the cylinders? also I made some close
fitting plates to fit against the rear of the heads to prevent air escaping at
the back and force it all down through the cylinder/ head fins with the exception
of the oil cooler and tried to close any areas around the outside of that
also.my single temp pickup is under one head bolt nut- when checked on the ground
runs with a good quality heat gun the readings were within 15 to 20 degrees
of the surrounding head surfaces. and mine never climbed over 290 in early
testing.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371746#371746
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris" <catdesigns(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Wing Tip Transition |
John
I made the top of the wing tip bow to be flush with the top of the leading
edge. The bottom of the leading edge was tapered from the last wing rib up
to the bottom of wing tip bow. I also added a filler block behind the joint
so I could radius the corner.
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/IMG_5559.JPG
You didn't ask but you will also need to taper the wing tip bow to the
thickness of the aileron trailing edge. My taper starts just past the rear
spar. I made the top of the bow equal to the top of the trailing edge so
all I had to do was make one cut off the bottom of the bow.
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/images/IMG_5560.JPG
Chris
Sacramento, Ca
Westcoastpiet.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kringle
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 4:34 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wing Tip Transition
I would like to see pictures of how some of you transitioned the wing tip to
the leading and trailing edge.
Thanks
John
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371737#371737
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hans van der Voort <nx15kv(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: FW: Corvair CHT |
Rod,=0A=C2-=0AClean up the heads, remove all casting flashing.=0AThat thi
n film of aluminum left behind by GM on their mass produced heads.=0A=C2-
=0AJust make sure air flows over those fins it makes a BIG difference.=0A
=C2-=0AA simple fix that often gets ignored=0A=C2-=0ARegards=0A=C2-
=0AHans=0A=C2-=0ANX15KV=0AWaller, TX=0A=0AFrom: Rod Wooller <rmwo(at)clear.n
et.nz>=0ATo: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012
4:47 PM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: FW: Corvair CHT=0A=0A=0AThanks for all t
he helpful replies. My cooling eyebrows are as per Hans van der Voort
=99s design, but I may need to do some work with high temp silicon to minim
ise air leakage as my test pilot recorded CHT=99s of 450F during clim
b-out on a 72F day. A flat nose probably doesn=99t help the airflow e
ither. Still a lot of testing to do before I get the controls.=0A=C2-=0AT
hanks again guys.=0ARod Wooller=0AZK-PAC=0A=C2-=0AFrom:Rod Wooller [mailt
o:rodwooller(at)gmail.com] =0ASent: Monday, 23 April 2012 8:19 PM=0ATo: rmwo@c
lear.net.nz=0ASubject: Fwd: Corvair CHT=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A---------- Forw
arded message ----------=0AFrom: Rod Wooller <rodwooller(at)gmail.com>=0ADate:
Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 9:29 PM=0ASubject: Corvair CHT=0ATo: Pietenpol-List D
igest Server , Pietenpol-List Digest List =0A=0A=0AI have a CHT gauge on my Pietenp
ol with sensors under the rear spark plugs of each cylinder head.=0ACan any
one tell me the maximum temperature that the Corvair heads should be run at
========
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack" <jack(at)textors.com> |
| Subject: | Wing Tip Transition |
Some more pics John http://textors.com/8-31-08_012.jpg
Jack Textor
DSM
NX1929T
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kringle
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 6:34 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wing Tip Transition
I would like to see pictures of how some of you transitioned the wing tip to
the leading and trailing edge.
Thanks
John
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371737#371737
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Wing Tip Transition |
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
Thanks all for pictures. Ive saved them to my iPad for future reference.
John
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371770#371770
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> |
Michael,
Perhaps the photo you attached is an older photo, and this has already been addressed,
but it looks like you would need some additional bracing at your wing
tip. There was a recent discussion here on the List that brought up the point
that the wing tip bow actually acts as a compression strut. Your photo appears
to show a wing tip bow that is even slimmer than the "plans" version. The structure
shown in your photo likely will not be stout enough. It would be prudent
to introduce a compression strut similar to those at the wing root and mid-wing.
Bill C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371771#371771
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
Correct Bill, that is an "in work" picture and the most current one I have at this
time.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Engine "Screw, Dowel" |
There are, I believe, three of these "screw, dowel" bolts to hold the engine case
halves together. I could not find these at ACS. If anyone has an idea who might
carry them or what nomenclature I should use to search with, I would appreciate
it.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Engine "Screw, Dowel" |
I assume you are talking about a Continental A65? Try Fresno Airparts (559)
237-4863 email fresnoairparts(at)att.net . They have an ad on the first page
of every Trade-a-Plane and carry every part for the small Continentals.
They list "Crankcase clamping dowel bolt, nut set for $47.50.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael
Perez
Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2012 9:44 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Engine "Screw, Dowel"
There are, I believe, three of these "screw, dowel" bolts to hold the engine
case halves together. I could not find these at ACS. If anyone has an idea
who might carry them or what nomenclature I should use to search with, I
would appreciate it.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
John, the first time I sent some pictures it was rejected by the list for
being too large. Maybe this one will go through. The wing is upside down
in both pictures. I didn't run my aileron all the way to the tip. C
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 7:34 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wing Tip Transition
>
> I would like to see pictures of how some of you transitioned the wing tip
> to the leading and trailing edge.
>
> Thanks
> John
>
> --------
> John
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371737#371737
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Engine "Screw, Dowel" |
Ok Jack. I'll give them a call. Mike C. seems to think that kit is all the
nuts, bolts, etc for the entire engine. (A65)=C2-
Michael Perez
=0APietenpol HINT Videos
=0AKaretaker Aero
=0Awww.karetakeraero.com
--- On Wed, 4/25/12, Jack Phillips wrote:
From: Jack Phillips <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Engine "Screw, Dowel"
Date: Wednesday, April 25, 2012, 10:35 AM
=0A=0A=0A =0A =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AI assume you are talking
about a=0AContinental A65?=C2- Try Fresno Airparts (559) 237-4863=C2- e
mail fresnoairparts(at)att.net .=C2- They=0Ahave an ad on the first page of
every Trade-a-Plane and carry every part for=0Athe small Continentals.=C2
- They list =9CCrankcase clamping dowel bolt,=0Anut set for $47.50.
=0A=0A =C2- =0A=0AJack Phillips =0A=0ANX899JP =0A=0ASmith Mountain Lake,
Virginia =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AFrom: owner-pietenpol
-list-server(at)matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.
com] On Behalf Of Michael Perez
=0ASent: Wednesday, April 25, 2012=0A9:44 AM
=0ATo: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: Engine=0A"Screw, Dowel" =0A=0A=0A=0A =C2- =0A
=0A=0A =0A =0A There are, I believe, three of these "screw,=0A dowel" bo
lts to hold the engine case halves together. I could not find=0A these at
ACS. If anyone has an idea who might carry them or what nomenclature=0A I
should use to search with, I would appreciate it.
=0A
=0A Michael Perez
=0A Pietenpol HINT Videos
=0A Karetaker Aero
=0A www.karetakeraero.com =0A =0A =0A=0A=0A =C2- =C2-http://www.matro
nics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Listhttp://forums.matronics.comhttp://www.matr
-========================
============0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
Thanks Bill, those are the kind of pictures I was looking for.
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371793#371793
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: calling for a Rick Holland update---come in Rick....do |
you r
| From: | "at7000ft" <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> |
I doubt that I will have the 40 hours flown off for Brodhead this year Jack but
hopefully 2013.
Rick
--------
Rick Holland
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371795#371795
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | "giacummo" <mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com> |
I am learning english with you ;o)
--------
Mario Giacummo
http://vgmk1.blogspot.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371797#371797
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
Mario,
Your English is much better than my Spanish!
Do no archive
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371798#371798
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Princell <weprincell(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Bill Princell - Noblesville, IN
Started a complete rebuild and design upgrade of N10837 on 6-05 which had
been severally damaged in a central Texas landing accident.
My project is a Piet/Grega hybrid with an oversize fuselage (plus 2" wide
and 3" deep) and a 44" wide wing center section.
Removed and sold original Subaru EA81 engine - Rebuilt a 1965 Corvair
Engine w/William Wynne conversion parts and a Dan's 5th Bearing. Engine ran
at CC
#20 held in Michigan on weekend of June 3, 2011.
New wings and center section build and completed using Riblett 612 airfoil
with continuous aileron hinges. Made 4 new Cabane struts w/support cables.
New fin/rudder and elevator/stabilizer w/push/pull rod control system and a
continuous (no gap) hinge system. Made 8 new support cables w/turnbuckles.
Cockpit interiors completed. New aluminum instrument panel completed w/new
steam gauges installed. All new electrical system and wiring installed.
New Cub type gear w/6:00x6 wheels and tires and disc type brakes.
New engine mount for Corvair engine built and installed.
All metal surfaces have been powder coated.
Will start fabric covering this fall using Stewart Systems process w/Latex
paint. Using light weight fabric and w/medium weight fabric on upper
surface of wings.
Hope to complete and first flight in 2014.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies! |
Hey Bill, you might want to consider putting a supercharger on that engine. From
what I can see of your photos, Your plane looks great. Cheers, Gardiner
________________________________
From: Bill Princell <weprincell(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Wed, April 25, 2012 1:38:47 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: put your cards on the table Gents and Ladies!
Bill Princell - Noblesville, IN
Started a complete rebuild and design upgrade of N10837 on 6-05 which had been
severally damaged in a central Texas landing accident.
My project is a Piet/Grega hybrid with an oversize fuselage (plus 2" wide and 3"
deep) and a 44" wide wing center section.
Removed and sold original Subaru EA81 engine - Rebuilt a 1965 Corvair Engine
w/William Wynne conversion parts and a Dan's 5th Bearing. Engine ran at CC
#20 held in Michigan on weekend of June 3, 2011.
New wings and center section build and completed using Riblett 612 airfoil with
continuous aileron hinges. Made 4 new Cabane struts w/support cables.
New fin/rudder and elevator/stabilizer w/push/pull rod control system and a
continuous (no gap) hinge system. Made 8 new support cables w/turnbuckles.
Cockpit interiors completed. New aluminum instrument panel completed w/new steam
gauges installed. All new electrical system and wiring installed.
New Cub type gear w/6:00x6 wheels and tires and disc type brakes.
New engine mount for Corvair engine built and installed.
All metal surfaces have been powder coated.
Will start fabric covering this fall using Stewart Systems process w/Latex
paint. Using light weight fabric and w/medium weight fabric on upper surface of
wings.
Hope to complete and first flight in 2014.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Charvet <bencharvet(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine "Screw, Dowel" |
I also replaced all my crankcase bolts on reassembly. May have some old
ones laying around if you are looking to save the $50.
Ben
On 4/25/2012 10:35 AM, Jack Phillips wrote:
>
> I assume you are talking about a Continental A65? Try Fresno Airparts
> (559) 237-4863 email fresnoairparts(at)att.net
> . They have an ad on the first page
> of every Trade-a-Plane and carry every part for the small
> Continentals. They list "Crankcase clamping dowel bolt, nut set for
> $47.50.
>
> Jack Phillips
>
> NX899JP
>
> Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *From:*owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of
> *Michael Perez
> *Sent:* Wednesday, April 25, 2012 9:44 AM
> *To:* pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Pietenpol-List: Engine "Screw, Dowel"
>
> There are, I believe, three of these "screw, dowel" bolts to hold the
> engine case halves together. I could not find these at ACS. If anyone
> has an idea who might carry them or what nomenclature I should use to
> search with, I would appreciate it.
>
> Michael Perez
> Pietenpol HINT Videos
> Karetaker Aero
> www.karetakeraero.com
>
> * *
> * *
> **
> **
> **
> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List*
> **
> **
> *http://forums.matronics.com*
> **
> **
> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
> * *
> *
>
>
> *
--
Ben Charvet, PharmD
Staff Pharmacist
Parrish Medical center
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Engine "Screw, Dowel" |
| From: | Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com> |
But, which ones do you need?
[image: Inline image 1]
[image: Inline image 2]
On Wed, Apr 25, 2012 at 8:44 AM, Michael Perez wrote:
> There are, I believe, three of these "screw, dowel" bolts to hold the
> engine case halves together. I could not find these at ACS. If anyone has
> an idea who might carry them or what nomenclature I should use to search
> with, I would appreciate it.
>
> Michael Perez
> Pietenpol HINT Videos
> Karetaker Aero
> www.karetakeraero.com
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine "Screw, Dowel" |
Thanks Ben, I have all the old bolts, some are not worth keeping.- I figu
re going through the engine like I am, I should buy new bolts.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine "Screw, Dowel" |
In your attached picture, they would be #14A. In mine, they are #22, Screw,
Dowel, (hence the subject line)-part number 24252, quantity 3.-
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Engine "Screw, Dowel" |
| From: | Ben Charvet <bencharvet(at)gmail.com> |
Good plan
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 25, 2012, at 7:19 PM, Michael Perez wrote:
> Thanks Ben, I have all the old bolts, some are not worth keeping. I figur
e going through the engine like I am, I should buy new bolts.
>
> Michael Perez
> Pietenpol HINT Videos
> Karetaker Aero
> www.karetakeraero.com
>
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AMsafetyC(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | dinner w Markle off topic no building relevence just a |
great piet friend visit
Had a great dinner out with Jim Markle tonight, so good to see him. My son
in law cooked and Markle appeared happy. We sent him on his way back to
Harrisburg with left over lasagna from dinner and Gelato from GDB for TV time
at the Harrisburg Hampton Inn be for returning to Tulsa.
I hope he gets a chance to enjoy it all! It was great seeing him again as
we talked about Brodhead in July!, cant wait for that trip.
It was great to see him again we, okay I enjoyed the visit we had a good
time for the short time available.
Safe trip back to the Hotel tonight and Tulsa tomorrow.
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | How much Aluminum? |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
Would one 4 X 8 sheet of .025 2024-T3 be enough to complete the sheet metal requirements
of a Pietenpol?
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371903#371903
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: How much Aluminum? |
I would like to know the same thing! I'm just about to the point of making
the aluminum parts and need to know how much to order -- certainly don't
want to order too much. Chuck
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>
Sent: Friday, April 27, 2012 2:21 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: How much Aluminum?
>
> Would one 4 X 8 sheet of .025 2024-T3 be enough to complete the sheet
> metal requirements of a Pietenpol?
>
> --------
> John
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371903#371903
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob edson" <robertse(at)centurytel.net> |
| Subject: | progress report NX53WE |
Painting completed and starting to reassemble.Here are some pictures.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | progress report NX53WE |
Really looking nice, Bob. Can't wait to see it.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob edson
Sent: Friday, April 27, 2012 3:31 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: progress report NX53WE
Painting completed and starting to reassemble.Here are some pictures. Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hans van der Voort <nx15kv(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: How much Aluminum? |
John,=0A-=0AMore than enough. for cowling and top of fuse.=0A-=0AIf you
order one whole sheet have it shipped rolled.=0AIt saves a lot in shipping
that way.=0A-=0AHans=0A-=0ANX15KV=0AWaller- =0A=0A__________________
______________=0A From: Kringle <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>=0ATo: pietenpol-list@m
atronics.com =0ASent: Friday, April 27, 2012 1:21 PM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-L
le" =0A=0AWould one 4 X 8 sheet of .025 2024-T3 be enou
gh to complete the sheet metal requirements of a Pietenpol?=0A=0A--------
=0AJohn=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matro
=============
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: How much Aluminum? |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
Im also ordering some plywood so the sheet of aluminum should add minimal if any
cost to the shipment.
Thanks
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371924#371924
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
DQogDQoNCkZyb206IEphY2sgUGhpbGxpcHMgW21haWx0bzpwaWV0Zmx5ckBiZWxsc291dGgubmV0
XSANClNlbnQ6IFR1ZXNkYXksIEFwcmlsIDI0LCAyMDEyIDA1OjQ0IFBNDQpUbzogcGlldGVucG9s
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bnBvbC1saXN0QG1hdHJvbmljcy5jb20NClN1YmplY3Q6IFBpZXRlbnBvbC1MaXN0OiBXaW5nIFRp
cCBUcmFuc2l0aW9uDQoNCiANCg0KLS0+IFBpZXRlbnBvbC1MaXN0IG1lc3NhZ2UgcG9zdGVkIGJ5
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c2VlIHBpY3R1cmVzIG9mIGhvdyBzb21lIG9mIHlvdSB0cmFuc2l0aW9uZWQgdGhlIHdpbmcgdGlw
IHRvIHRoZSBsZWFkaW5nIGFuZCB0cmFpbGluZyBlZGdlLg0KDQogDQoNClRoYW5rcw0KDQpKb2hu
DQoNCiANCg0KLS0tLS0tLS0NCg0KSm9obg0KDQogDQoNCiANCg0KIA0KDQogDQoNClJlYWQgdGhp
cyB0b3BpYyBvbmxpbmUgaGVyZToNCg0KIA0KDQpodHRwOi8vZm9ydW1zLm1hdHJvbmljcy5jb20v
dmlld3RvcGljLnBocD9wPTM3MTczNyMzNzE3MzcNCg0KIA0KDQogDQoNCiANCg0KIA0KDQogDQoN
CiANCg0KIA0KDQogDQoNCiANCg0K
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com> |
Chuck and Michael,
Just out of curiosity... why did you decide not to run the ailerons all the way
to the tip? Just curious, that's all...
Don Emch
NX899DE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371983#371983
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | "Kringle" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com> |
Don,
This has always been one of my favorite pictures. I believe it is you and Frank
Pavliga? Could you send me a high res copy so I can get it printed and hung
in my shop?
Thanks,
John
email mrkringles(at)msn.com
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371986#371986
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0288_151.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: dinner w Markle off topic no building relevence just |
a great piet friend visit
| From: | Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
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PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09
Cgo
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com> |
John,
Absolutely! When I get home later I will send some to you. I have others too.
From different angles. It was during the Brodhead Piet Fly-in in '07. The
photographer, if I remember correctly worked for USA Today and flew with Andrew
King in his T-craft. I think he was on his way to Oshkosh and asked if he could
get some aerial shots.
Don Emch
NX899DE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372018#372018
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
Don, I think it was more for asthetics than anything else. I just have
never flown an airplane (and I have flown a bunch of them) where the aileron
went all the way to the wing tip. If I lose any aileron effectiveness by
losing that 5-inches of aileron, then I'll just have to be careful. Do what
you think best. Chuck
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 28, 2012 9:19 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wing Tip Transition
>
> Chuck and Michael,
>
> Just out of curiosity... why did you decide not to run the ailerons all
> the way to the tip? Just curious, that's all...
>
> Don Emch
> NX899DE
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=371983#371983
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: progress report NX53WE |
| From: | "aerocarjake" <flight.jake(at)gmail.com> |
What is the diameter of your wheels, and tires if you don't mind me asking...?
Looks wonderful assembled....!!
--------
Jake Schultz - curator,
Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372030#372030
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nightmare" <pauldonahuepilot(at)yahoo.com> |
thanks cliff; great work and very helpful pics. paul
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372033#372033
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Clif Dawson" <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
You're welcome.
Clif
>
>
> thanks cliff; great work and very helpful pics. paul
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Schreiber <lmforge(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | fabric shrink temperature |
I've just started covering my Piet and I need a consensus of opinion. I
have heard that on a light wooden structure that one needs to be careful
to not over shrink the fabric. What has everyone done? Do I stop at 250
degrees? Go to 300 or even full shrink at 350. At this stage I sure
don't want to warp or break anything.
As a side note, never having covered before I was sweating the process a
little. As everyone has said, its easy, fun and even magical.
Rick Schreiber
Valparaiso IN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | fabric shrink temperature |
I went to 350 on mine. No problem as long as the structure is right.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
Schreiber
Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2012 10:30 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: fabric shrink temperature
I've just started covering my Piet and I need a consensus of opinion. I
have heard that on a light wooden structure that one needs to be careful
to not over shrink the fabric. What has everyone done? Do I stop at 250
degrees? Go to 300 or even full shrink at 350. At this stage I sure
don't want to warp or break anything.
As a side note, never having covered before I was sweating the process a
little. As everyone has said, its easy, fun and even magical.
Rick Schreiber
Valparaiso IN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | fabric shrink temperature |
Rick,
Glad to hear that you are at that stage...my favorite! I used 1.7 oz fabric
and stopped at 300....call me chicken....
Gary Boothe
NX308MB
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
Schreiber
Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2012 7:30 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: fabric shrink temperature
-->
I've just started covering my Piet and I need a consensus of opinion. I have
heard that on a light wooden structure that one needs to be careful to not
over shrink the fabric. What has everyone done? Do I stop at 250 degrees? Go
to 300 or even full shrink at 350. At this stage I sure don't want to warp
or break anything.
As a side note, never having covered before I was sweating the process a
little. As everyone has said, its easy, fun and even magical.
Rick Schreiber
Valparaiso IN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | fabric shrink temperature |
>From the limited fabric work I have done, (aileron, both elevators, vertica
l stab. and rudder) I went to the full temp.- Everything seemed more the
strong enough and I never once heard anything creek, snap or pop!
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
Don,- I had the wing tip shape in mind soon after I started building the
wings. As the process started coming together, things fell into place as yo
u see them in my pictures.- Like Chuck had mentioned, I personally like t
he looks of having the elevators stop short of the tip.
-
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: fabric shrink temperature |
| From: | "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> |
Rick - I went to whatever Polyfiber said to go to. 350? I had one problem with
the fabric on the top of the wing deforming the structure around the fuel tank
hole. Hurt my feelings a little bit but I reinforced the woodwork and drove
on. Jack's right: if the structure is sound you won't have a problem. I thought
the structure around the wing tank was sufficient but it obviously wasn't.
The rest of the shrinking process was trouble-free, and was actually my absolute
favorite part of the build.
The piet's really stout and there should be no problem with tearing up a plans-built
airplane when shrinking the fabric to the manufacturer's standard.
--------
Kevin "Axel" Purtee
NX899KP
Austin/San Marcos, TX
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372080#372080
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com> |
Michael and Chuck,
Personal preference is as good a reason as any I guess. I think the ailerons extending
all the way to the end was more popular in the 20's and early 30's. Later
on as they developed more effective ailerons I think they started to end
them before the end of the wing. Some of the early Travel Airs, Wacos, etc. had
"elephant ears" or ailerons that actually extended past the wingtip. So I
guess it was the thing to do back then.
Don Emch
NX899DE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372092#372092
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
Hey fellow listers. I had a great visit with Jerry Dotson and hie wife Bobbie.
You should listen to him when he talks about how do things. His workmanship is
superb== Metal wise and woodworking. Cabanes and struts are outstanding.. He
has a nice 1300 ft strip way out in the boonies. It is kind of hard to get to
so I spent a half a day going Boonie Hopping. Gardiner
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: fabric shrink temperature |
| From: | helspersew(at)aol.com |
Rick,
I went with 350, BUT make sure you reinforce the end ribs. In my case (one-
piece wing) the rib adjacent to the tank (center) was pulled out of positio
n a little. Not good.
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Schreiber <lmforge(at)earthlink.net>
Sent: Sun, Apr 29, 2012 9:31 am
Subject: Pietenpol-List: fabric shrink temperature
>
I've just started covering my Piet and I need a consensus of opinion. I
ave heard that on a light wooden structure that one needs to be careful
o not over shrink the fabric. What has everyone done? Do I stop at 250
egrees? Go to 300 or even full shrink at 350. At this stage I sure
on't want to warp or break anything.
As a side note, never having covered before I was sweating the process a
ittle. As everyone has said, its easy, fun and even magical.
Rick Schreiber
alparaiso IN
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Clif Dawson" <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
Bellanca tips. :-)
Long and distinquished history.
Clif
To most people the sky is the limit.
To a pilot, the sky is home.
Don, I had the wing tip shape in mind soon after I started
building the wings. Michael Perez
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com> |
Congrats to Bellanca, I don't recall them building Pietenpols..
Ryan
On Sun, Apr 29, 2012 at 10:15 PM, Clif Dawson wrote:
> **
> Bellanca tips. :-)
> Long and distinquished history.
>
> Clif
>
> To most people the sky is the limit.
> To a pilot, the sky is home.
>
>
> Don, I had the wing tip shape in mind soon after I started building
> the wings. Michael Perez
>
> *
> *
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip Transition |
| From: | Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com> |
Pietenpols with wings to the plans.....long and distinguished history
On Sun, Apr 29, 2012 at 10:15 PM, Clif Dawson wrote:
> **
> Bellanca tips. :-)
> Long and distinquished history.
>
> Clif
>
> To most people the sky is the limit.
> To a pilot, the sky is home.
>
>
> Don, I had the wing tip shape in mind soon after I started building
> the wings. Michael Perez
>
> *
> *
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Woodflier(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Right angle tach drive |
It looks like I'm having to replace the right angle drive for the tach on
my Piet, after only about 75 hours of operation. The first drive never
worked well - the needle would jump and the male square drive end from the tach
cable seems to have been loose enough in the female fitting on the drive
that it wallowed out the female end quite a bit. The replacement failed on a
flight back from Suffolk, Va. yesterday. The female recepticle for the
cable was completely rounded out inside, and there is a lot of resistance in
the drive gears. I greased both these drives with white lithium grease before
I installed them. I've also lubricated the cable with a NAPA speedometer
cabe lube which is a light machine oil with graphite in it. Dirty stuff but
good cable lube, I'm told.
Both of these right angle drives were from Aircraft Spruce. Wicks has a
different model drive, a bit more expensive, but if I keep replacing these ACS
drives, I'd rather pay once and be done for a while.
Anyone have experience like this, and anyone using the Wicks angle tach
drive? Any thoughts on lubricating the angle drive itself. I wondered if the
grease is getting too firm at low temperatures. It was in the 50s in flight
yesterday and it failed when I started it up after a fuel stop. I'd been
flying for about 1.7 hours prior to the fuel stop. I'm wondering if I should
try the oil and graphite lube in the angle drive. I notice that the Wicks
angle drive has a zerk fitting to allow it to be greased. Any ideas what
type grease is recommended?
Matt Paxton
NX629ML
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Schreiber <lmforge(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | another covering question |
I'm now starting the cover of my elevators. I have the lower cover on
one side. In order to attach the cover, I made a small slit in the
fabric just long enough to allow the control horn to protrude. I did a
preliminary shrink at 250 degrees, trying to not over shrink near the
horn. I still got some gaping around the horn plus the fabric still has
some looseness in this area. My question is how do I finish this area
off to eliminate the gaps?
I am using the Stewarts system. In their video they only cover minor
fitting protrusions under the fabric, such as lift strut attachments. In
the video, they just covered over the fitting and then slit the fabric
after the first shrink. Next they cut a patch that was glued over the
fitting. After the patch is glued in place, the area of the patch is not
shrunk again.
Attached is a photo of what I have now.
Rick Schreiber
Valparaiso In
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: another covering question |
I had the same issue. (I'm shrinking to 300deg and using the lightweight fabric.)
You can see from the attached pic that the gap (below the patch) had opened up
after shrinking. Then I made that "patch" and just cut one slit for the patch
to fit over the horn. that allowed me to leave a bit of material up onto the
side of the horn to help seal it up.
(And yes, I cleaned it up a bit so it doesn't still look so messy!)
Hope this helps....
Jim in Pryor
NX1929J
-----Original Message-----
>From: Rick Schreiber <lmforge(at)earthlink.net>
>Sent: Apr 30, 2012 1:05 PM
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: another covering question
>
>I'm now starting the cover of my elevators. I have the lower cover on
>one side. In order to attach the cover, I made a small slit in the
>fabric just long enough to allow the control horn to protrude. I did a
>preliminary shrink at 250 degrees, trying to not over shrink near the
>horn. I still got some gaping around the horn plus the fabric still has
>some looseness in this area. My question is how do I finish this area
>off to eliminate the gaps?
>
>I am using the Stewarts system. In their video they only cover minor
>fitting protrusions under the fabric, such as lift strut attachments. In
>the video, they just covered over the fitting and then slit the fabric
>after the first shrink. Next they cut a patch that was glued over the
>fitting. After the patch is glued in place, the area of the patch is not
>shrunk again.
>
>Attached is a photo of what I have now.
>
>Rick Schreiber
>Valparaiso In
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | another covering question |
Rick,
Pre-Shrink the patch material, then cut the patch to the exact cross section
of the control horn at the level of the fabric. Slip it over the horn and
glue it in place. It might still gap a little, but should be a pretty good
fit. See photo below:
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
Schreiber
Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 2:06 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: another covering question
I'm now starting the cover of my elevators. I have the lower cover on
one side. In order to attach the cover, I made a small slit in the
fabric just long enough to allow the control horn to protrude. I did a
preliminary shrink at 250 degrees, trying to not over shrink near the
horn. I still got some gaping around the horn plus the fabric still has
some looseness in this area. My question is how do I finish this area
off to eliminate the gaps?
I am using the Stewarts system. In their video they only cover minor
fitting protrusions under the fabric, such as lift strut attachments. In
the video, they just covered over the fitting and then slit the fabric
after the first shrink. Next they cut a patch that was glued over the
fitting. After the patch is glued in place, the area of the patch is not
shrunk again.
Attached is a photo of what I have now.
Rick Schreiber
Valparaiso In
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: another covering question |
In your picture, where the fabric is still loose near the fitting, make sure you
heat that like the rest of the fabric to shrink it tight prior to putting on
the patch. After my patch was on, I heated it some to make sure the edges laid
nice and the patch had a small amount of shrink/tension on it.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob edson" <robertse(at)centurytel.net> |
Jake Schultz
In answer to your question the wheels are 21 inch stainless steel with
stainless spokes. My son made the hubs 6 inches wide stainless steel
with stainless rotors. The overall diameter of the tires is 27
inches.Things are starting to come together and look like a pietenpol.
It's beem about 20 months since we started. Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Schreiber <lmforge(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: another covering question |
On 4/30/2012 2:21 PM, Michael Perez wrote:
> In your picture, where the fabric is still loose near the fitting,
> make sure you heat that like the rest of the fabric to shrink it tight
> prior to putting on the patch. After my patch was on, I heated it some
> to make sure the edges laid nice and the patch had a small amount of
> shrink/tension on it.
>
> Michael Perez
> Pietenpol HINT Videos
> Karetaker Aero
> www.karetakeraero.com
>
> *
> *
Mike:
I did shrink around the fitting. Part of the problem is my control horns
are made from flat sheet and so have little thickness when compared to
the formed control horns. When I shrunk the cover near the horn it
gapped a fair amount. I was afraid to shrink it till the surface was
perfectly level.
Rick Schreiber
Valparaiso In
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Right angle tach drive |
| From: | "tkreiner" <tkreiner(at)gmail.com> |
IMHO, the best all around grease for an item like the right angle drive is moly.
You can wash all the old lube out with solvent and re pack with moly from any autozone,
etc. If you're concerned about extremely lw temps, you can mix the moly
grease with some 10 wt oil to make a really light wt grease; just make sure
you mix very thoroughly.
I've done this on speedo heads and small mechanisms for years and never had one
seize as yours has.
Just make sure you're wearing old clothes, as moly cannot be removed from anything.
--------
Tom Kreiner
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372175#372175
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: another covering question |
I am in the process of covering my wings now and I glued a small piece of 1/16
in ply around the horn. Now the fabric can be glued down. Cheers, Gardiner Mason
----- Original Message ----
From: Rick Schreiber <lmforge(at)earthlink.net>
Sent: Mon, April 30, 2012 2:05:57 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: another covering question
I'm now starting the cover of my elevators. I have the lower cover on one side.
In order to attach the cover, I made a small slit in the fabric just long enough
to allow the control horn to protrude. I did a preliminary shrink at 250
degrees, trying to not over shrink near the horn. I still got some gaping around
the horn plus the fabric still has some looseness in this area. My question is
how do I finish this area off to eliminate the gaps?
I am using the Stewarts system. In their video they only cover minor fitting
protrusions under the fabric, such as lift strut attachments. In the video, they
just covered over the fitting and then slit the fabric after the first shrink.
Next they cut a patch that was glued over the fitting. After the patch is glued
in place, the area of the patch is not shrunk again.
Attached is a photo of what I have now.
Rick Schreiber
Valparaiso In
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Schreiber <lmforge(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: another covering question |
Jim Markle and Jack Phillips thanks for the response, but I was
wondering did you shrink the fabric until it was flat as Mike Perez has
suggested. I was just afraid if I did it would gap a hideous amount.
Rick Schreiber
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | another covering question |
You can shrink the fabric on the wing as much as you want, and let it gap.
Then glue down the pre-shrunk patch and don't shrink it any further.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
Schreiber
Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 7:04 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: another covering question
Jim Markle and Jack Phillips thanks for the response, but I was
wondering did you shrink the fabric until it was flat as Mike Perez has
suggested. I was just afraid if I did it would gap a hideous amount.
Rick Schreiber
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Schreiber <lmforge(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: another covering question |
On 4/30/2012 6:25 PM, Jack Phillips wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack Phillips"
>
> You can shrink the fabric on the wing as much as you want, and let it gap.
> Then glue down the pre-shrunk patch and don't shrink it any further.
>
> Jack Phillips
> NX899JP
> Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
>
>
That's what I will do, thanks!
Rick Schreiber
Valparaiso, In
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | another covering question |
What Jack said... :-)
Jim in Pryor
NX1929J
-----Original Message-----
>From: Jack Phillips <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
>Sent: Apr 30, 2012 6:25 PM
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: another covering question
>
>
>You can shrink the fabric on the wing as much as you want, and let it gap.
>Then glue down the pre-shrunk patch and don't shrink it any further.
>
>Jack Phillips
>NX899JP
>Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
>Schreiber
>Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 7:04 PM
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: another covering question
>
>
>Jim Markle and Jack Phillips thanks for the response, but I was
>wondering did you shrink the fabric until it was flat as Mike Perez has
>suggested. I was just afraid if I did it would gap a hideous amount.
>
>Rick Schreiber
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "aerocarjake" <flight.jake(at)gmail.com> |
Thanks...... Your bird looks great............
(I am leaning towards a 24" tire based on the 1931 Piet that Bernard built. Your
Piet wheels look a bit bigger than that and I wanted to check.... )
I love the way ANY big/spoked tires look on a Piet....!!!
Great job.....
--------
Jake Schultz - curator,
Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372185#372185
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "899PM" <rockriverrifle(at)hotmail.com> |
For those who have applied latex paint over the Stewart System.....did you prime
after taping? If so, latex primer? Having done a couple Ceconite and dope jobs,
I am sure intrigued with this method and would like to try it.
--------
PAPA MIKE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372209#372209
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: LATEX PRIMER? |
| From: | gboothe5(at)comcast.net |
Primed with latex, but not flight tested.
Gary from Cool
------Original Message------
From: 899PM
Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
ReplyTo: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: LATEX PRIMER?
Sent: May 1, 2012 7:59 AM
For those who have applied latex paint over the Stewart System.....did you prime
after taping? If so, latex primer? Having done a couple Ceconite and dope jobs,
I am sure intrigued with this method and would like to try it.
--------
PAPA MIKE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372209#372209
Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: LATEX PRIMER? |
I did no priming at all. I went straight to the paint.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack(at)textors.com" <jack(at)textors.com> |
About a year ago there was discussion regarding using Fastbond instead of Ecobond.
I believe Jon Coxwell mentioned he was going to do some comparisons. Was
wondering if the Fastbond could be heat activated, anybody try it yet?
Thanks,
Jack Textor
Sent from my iPad
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LATEX PRIMER? |
Dad just used white latex paint for his base coat, it sticks just fine.-
He used warm water and dawn dish soap to wash the fabric before painting.
-
Shad
--- On Tue, 5/1/12, gboothe5(at)comcast.net wrote:
From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: LATEX PRIMER?
Date: Tuesday, May 1, 2012, 11:22 AM
Primed with latex, but not flight tested.
Gary from Cool
------Original Message------
From: 899PM
Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
ReplyTo: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: LATEX PRIMER?
Sent: May 1, 2012 7:59 AM
For those who have applied latex paint over the Stewart System.....did you
prime after taping? If so, latex primer? Having done a couple Ceconite and
dope jobs, I am sure intrigued with this method and would like to try it.
--------
PAPA MIKE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372209#372209
Sent on the Sprint=AE Now Network from my BlackBerry=AE
le, List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gliderx5(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: LATEX PRIMER? |
I used Gliddon grey latex primer, thinned a little with water, applied with a foam
brush, and sanded with 320 grit dry between coats (3 coats). Been flying for
a year and no problems.
Malcolm Morrison
http://home.comcast.net/~mmorrison123/Airplanes.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "899PM" <rockriverrifle(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 1, 2012 10:59:36 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: LATEX PRIMER?
For those who have applied latex paint over the Stewart System.....did you prime
after taping? If so, latex primer? Having done a couple Ceconite and dope jobs,
I am sure intrigued with this method and would like to try it.
--------
PAPA MIKE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372209#372209
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | French Valley Visit EAA 1279 |
| From: | "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org> |
Good morning Lister's,
I had the good fortune of being invited to the French Valley EAA meeting last Sunday
4-29-12. It was a show and tell meeting for the Piets. It was about a
1.5 hour flight each way for me with good weather both ways.
Their piet looks outstanding. They are currently waiting for an FAA inspection
while tying up some loose ends on the plane. I am very impressed. If you remember,
this is the plane they brought to Brodhead a few years ago. Attached
are three pics. I apologize ahead of time if the sizing is incorrect. The Blue
and Silver plane is theirs.
I'll try and keep the list updated as progress moves on.
--------
Scott Liefeld
Flying N11MS since March 1972
Steel Tube
C-85-12
Wire Wheels
Brodhead in 1996
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372264#372264
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/fvpietimg_0422_197.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/fvpietimg_0421_157.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/fvpietimg_0420_113.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dan Yocum <yocum137(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LATEX PRIMER? |
Malcolm,
Your Piet is done and flying? How did the wing pivot mechanism work out?
Dan
On 05/01/2012 07:49 PM, gliderx5(at)comcast.net wrote:
> I used Gliddon grey latex primer, thinned a little with water, applied
> with a foam brush, and sanded with 320 grit dry between coats (3 coats).
> Been flying for a year and no problems.
>
> Malcolm Morrison
> http://home.comcast.net/~mmorrison123/Airplanes.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry V" <larryvangerven(at)hotmail.com> |
Hello
I was wondering about using streamlined aluminum for the wing struts on my pietenpol,
any comments, pros or cons.
Thanks Larry V
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372312#372312
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
| From: | "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> |
Larry,
Many builders have successfully used aluminum struts on their Pietenpols. There's
lots of discussion and info in the archives. The aluminum extrusions are definitely
less expensive than new 4130 streamline tubing, but different attachment
details need to be used, since welding aluminum can greatly reduce it's strength.
Bill C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372326#372326
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
I am using aluminum on mine. I believe there are a few flying Pietenpols th
at use them as well.- The aluminum struts will save you some weight.
Here is where I bought them:
http://carlsonaircraft.com/struts.html
Michael Perez
=0APietenpol HINT Videos
=0AKaretaker Aero
=0Awww.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
Michael Hi.
Regarding Aluminium against 4130 profile and strength.
Is their any rule of thumb about comparative strengths.
I would like to change my round 1/2" 4130 Jury Struts for streamlined and wondered
whether aluminium would be suitable.
Regards
Gerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
| From: | "bradandlinda tds.net" <bradandlinda(at)tds.net> |
The pre war Aeronca Chiefs used alum struts, but they were wider than J-3
struts.
On Thu, May 3, 2012 at 7:38 AM, Gerry Holland <gholland@content-stream.co.uk
> wrote:
> gholland@content-stream.co.uk>
>
> Michael Hi.
> Regarding Aluminium against 4130 profile and strength.
> Is their any rule of thumb about comparative strengths.
> I would like to change my round 1/2" 4130 Jury Struts for streamlined and
> wondered whether aluminium would be suitable.
> Regards
> Gerry
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
Gerry, replacing round with streamline is a good idea. I can't comment on c
omparative strengths, however I will say that my jury struts will be stream
line aluminum.- I don't believe these small struts see much stress, but t
hose that know will chime in.
Michael Perez
=0APietenpol HINT Videos
=0AKaretaker Aero
=0Awww.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick N" <horzpool(at)goldengate.net> |
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
Hi Gerry
I have a set of Aluminum struts and jury struts, I picked them up from
Carlson Aircraft in East Palastine, Ohio. I also picked up aluminum ends
for the struts. I think the total for everything was about $700. It was
worth every penny. They are for my new Piet, under construction at this
point.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gerry Holland" <gholland@content-stream.co.uk>
Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2012 7:38 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: aluminum struts
<gholland@content-stream.co.uk>
Michael Hi.
Regarding Aluminium against 4130 profile and strength.
Is their any rule of thumb about comparative strengths.
I would like to change my round 1/2" 4130 Jury Struts for streamlined and
wondered whether aluminium would be suitable.
Regards
Gerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
| From: | "Larry V" <larryvangerven(at)hotmail.com> |
Thanks everyone for your replies.
Dick I was wondering what size of aluminum struts you would recommend.
Larry V
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372377#372377
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick N" <horzpool(at)goldengate.net> |
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
My struts are 2.44" x 1.00". See them at carlsonaircraft.com .The struts
are actually pretty cheap $63 each, its the fitting that are pretty
expensive. I am going to polish mine and try to make them look like chrome.
Dick N
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry V" <larryvangerven(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2012 8:11 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: aluminum struts
>
>
> Thanks everyone for your replies.
> Dick I was wondering what size of aluminum struts you would recommend.
> Larry V
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372377#372377
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
| From: | helspersew(at)aol.com |
Hi Larry,
Used 4 of these, with 7075 aluminum inserts purchased from Mcmaster-Carr, u
sing two AN4 bolts to hold them in.
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
Polishing aluminum works great.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick N" <horzpool(at)goldengate.net> |
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
Thanks for posting that Michael. I was wondering how they are going to
look.
I should also point out that these lift struts come in 10" lengths
enough to make lift struts and cabanes..
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Perez
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2012 8:33 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: aluminum struts
Polishing aluminum works great.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
| From: | "Larry V" <larryvangerven(at)hotmail.com> |
Dan
Thanks for the images of the struts and inserts,
I am wondering did Mcmaster-Carr have those inserts or did you make those from
their aluminum stock?
Dick
Thanks for the info on the sizes of the struts and price
Larry V
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372426#372426
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
| From: | helspersew(at)aol.com |
Larry,
I bought the aluminum stock, McMaster Carr part number 9055K3 (3/4" x 1").
Just shave off the four corners and it will slide in quite nicely. I can't
recall how log I cut the inserts now (my airplane is in IL.)
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
-----Original Message-----
From: Larry V <larryvangerven(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Fri, May 4, 2012 11:08 pm
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: aluminum struts
>
Dan
hanks for the images of the struts and inserts,
am wondering did Mcmaster-Carr have those inserts or did you make those fr
om
heir aluminum stock?
Dick
hanks for the info on the sizes of the struts and price
arry V
ead this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372426#372426
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
| From: | "aerocarjake" <flight.jake(at)gmail.com> |
Dan,
Did you use the same fittings on both the upper and lower ends....?
Thanks for all the info everyone. it is the way I am planning to go with mine....
Jake
--------
Jake Schultz - curator,
Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372457#372457
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
| From: | helspersew(at)aol.com |
Jake,
Yes, I used the same 7075 insert in both ends. In the bottom you can see it
was drilled and tapped to fit the J-3 forks I bought, then locked in place
with the jam nut. In the top (I have a photo but can't find it at the mome
nt) I rounded the end of the insert and drilled a hole for the (5/16"?) bol
t that holds it to the wing spar fitting. I'll keep looking for it :O)
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
-----Original Message-----
From: aerocarjake <flight.jake(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Sat, May 5, 2012 10:46 am
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: aluminum struts
Dan,
Did you use the same fittings on both the upper and lower ends....?
Thanks for all the info everyone. it is the way I am planning to go with
ine....
Jake
--------
ake Schultz - curator,
ewport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
ead this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372457#372457
-= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum -
-= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse
-= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription,
-= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,
-= Photoshare, and much much more:
-
-= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
-
-========================
-= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
-= Same great content also available via the Web Forums!
-
-= --> http://forums.matronics.com
-
-========================
-= - List Contribution Web Site -
-= Thank you for your generous support!
-= -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
-= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-========================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris" <catdesigns(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
You mean these?
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Dan%20Helsper/images/2-10-09_034.JPG
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Dan%20Helsper/images/2-10-09_034.JPG
Chris
Sacramento, Ca
Westcoastpiet.com
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
helspersew(at)aol.com
Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2012 11:02 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: aluminum struts
Jake,
Yes, I used the same 7075 insert in both ends. In the bottom you can see it
was drilled and tapped to fit the J-3 forks I bought, then locked in place
with the jam nut. In the top (I have a photo but can't find it at the
moment) I rounded the end of the insert and drilled a hole for the (5/16"?)
bolt that holds it to the wing spar fitting. I'll keep looking for it :O)
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
-----Original Message-----
From: aerocarjake <flight.jake(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Sat, May 5, 2012 10:46 am
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: aluminum struts
Dan,
Did you use the same fittings on both the upper and lower ends....?
Thanks for all the info everyone. it is the way I am planning to go with
mine....
Jake
--------
Jake Schultz - curator,
Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372457#372457
" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
p://forums.matronics.com
blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
| From: | helspersew(at)aol.com |
Chris....
Those would be the ones. Thank you for finding those. Please note: There is
a bit of an angle between the strut and the wing spar fitting. This can be
easily accounted for as you see. Don't drill the AN4 holes until the wing
is mounted and everything is all lined-up.
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris <catdesigns(at)att.net>
Sent: Sat, May 5, 2012 3:19 pm
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: aluminum struts
You mean these?
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Dan%20Helsper/images/2-10-09_034.JPG
http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Dan%20Helsper/images/2-10-09_034.JPG
Chris
Sacramento, Ca
Westcoastpiet.com
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
t-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of helspersew(at)aol.com
Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2012 11:02 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: aluminum struts
Jake,
Yes, I used the same 7075 insert in both ends. In the bottom you can see it
was drilled and tapped to fit the J-3 forks I bought, then locked in place
with the jam nut. In the top (I have a photo but can't find it at the mome
nt) I rounded the end of the insert and drilled a hole for the (5/16"?) bol
t that holds it to the wing spar fitting. I'll keep looking for it :O)
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
-----Original Message-----
From: aerocarjake <flight.jake(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Sat, May 5, 2012 10:46 am
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: aluminum struts
Dan,
Did you use the same fittings on both the upper and lower ends....?
Thanks for all the info everyone. it is the way I am planning to go with
ine....
Jake
--------
ake Schultz - curator,
ewport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
ead this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372457#372457
" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
://forums.matronics.com
lank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matro
nics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
ref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
ref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
-= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum -
-= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse
-= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription,
-= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,
-= Photoshare, and much much more:
-
-= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
-
-========================
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-= Same great content also available via the Web Forums!
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-========================
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
| From: | "aerocarjake" <flight.jake(at)gmail.com> |
Awesome, thanks....!!
--------
Jake Schultz - curator,
Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=372483#372483
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
It takes some work, but they do look great polished. I polished all of my wing
and cabane struts at one time and my arms were quite sore the next day or two.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: aluminum struts |
Dan makes a good point about the angle and holes. I drilled the rear most h
ole in the inserts/struts first, (I believe) then once the wings were on an
d adjusted, I marked and drilled the other insert/strut hole(s).
-
There may also be a gap between the strut insert and the wing attach bracke
ts as shown in Dan's pictures. I made a spacer to fill in.- Just some FYI
.
-
I wonder if the wing support cable fitting can be inserted between the inse
rt and wing attach fitting to help take up the gap? Just some FYI.
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
Karetaker Aero
www.karetakeraero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: on beating dead horses...But smaller horses |
Videos like this are great! No stones thrown from me!
Michael Perez
Pietenpol HINT Videos
April 15, 2012 - May 06, 2012
Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-le